PDA

View Full Version : [Deck] Stasis - It's not that bad.....



StasisMan
05-20-2005, 11:26 AM
Okay well, I miss stasis.....They took gush away from me and put me away. I just want to put this out there that stasis really isn't that bad. Here is the list I play with on MWS and it performs well against landstill, though ATS is a problem.

4 Howling Mines
4 Impulse
2 Sylvan Library

4 Stasis
4 Root Maze
2 Chronatog

4 Force of WIll
4 Arcane Denial
4 Counterspell

4 Lotus Petal


4 Forsaken City
4 Flooded Strand
4 Tropical Island
12 Island

SB

4 BEBs
3 Energy Field
3 Chill
3 Stifle
2 Tabernacle at Pendavale

I know the deck isn't great, but It really isn't that bad if you learn how to play it correctly. Just give me a little input and if the topic isn't worth it then oh well,

INPUT PLEASE!!

Alfred
05-20-2005, 01:54 PM
#1. Arcane Denial is terrible. Replace it with a mana leak or something.
#2. As has been discussed in the millions of Stasis lists that have come and gone on this board, if you want to make Stasis playable in a tournament, you need a source of damage. Thumbscrews is a potent way of winning before time is called. Get rid of Chronatog.
#3. If ATS is a problem, find a way to MD Humility.
#5. Why lotus petal? It doesn't work under a Root Maze, and you already have 24 lands.
#6. I think that it would be really cool if this deck were able to support Disrupting Shoal as another way of countering without mana.

Those are just a few ways of improving the deck.

bigredmeanie
05-20-2005, 02:48 PM
Your counter base sucks, run this one.

4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Thwart
3 Disrupting Shaul

-4 Counterspell
-4 Arcane Denial

Howling mine is a horrible card, and should no be played, ever. Sylvan Library is a much better card drawer, don't be affraid keep extra cards.

Chronotog is bad, I like the Thumb Screw idea.

+4 Thumb screw
+1 Sylvan Library
+2 Ivory Tower

-4 Lotus Petal
-4 Howling Mine
-2 Chronotog

Tabernacle is good, get another one and run it Main.

+1 Tabernacle

Alfred
05-21-2005, 02:08 PM
Bigredmeanie, I like your counterbase and other suggestions. Here is what I would run, given the chance:

4x Stasis
4x Root Maze
4x Force of Will
4x Daze
3x Thwart
4x Pithing Needle
4x Thumbscrews
3x Sylvan Library
3x Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4x Ivory Tower
4x Forsaken City
4x Polluted Delta
4x Tropical Island
11x Island

I'm going to go test that on MWS, and I'll tell everyone how it works.

T is for TOOL
05-21-2005, 11:49 PM
4x Daze
3x Thwart
These both have bad synergy with Root Maze. Disrupting Shoal, Misdirection, Stifle, and Chain of Vapor are all possible candidates for replacement.

4x Pithing Needle
You should probably be running 3 cards for this slot, and Cursed Totem is better than Needle.

4x Thumbscrews
You should only be running 2 of these since you don't want to see them until you have the lock.

3x Sylvan Library
Library is a good card, however Howling Mine is a necessary evil for this deck. Aside from this, you have 0 draw spells and 0 tutoring. That means you need a Stasis or you lose.

Howling Mine
- allows you to maintain hand size while City and Stasis are in play
- let's you reach your win condition faster
- has excellent synergy with Root Maze

Unless you are trying a version with Enlightened Tutor (which might still lack the drawing power), you need Mines.

3x Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
This card is amazing, especially against Survival decks. I would probably run 2, but that largely depends on your metagame.

4x Ivory Tower
This card is bad. It doesn't really do anything until you have dropped the lock, at which point you should be winning (especially if you are winning through damage). I'd replace it with either Tangle Wire for control/combo, or Energy Field for aggro.

4x Polluted Delta
Again another card that has terrible synergy with Root Maze. Yavimaya Coast is better.

To summarize, I'd start testing with the following changes:

-4 Daze
-4 Thwart
+4 Stifle/Chain of Vapor
+4 Impulse

-4 Pithing Needle
+3 Cursed Totem

-2 Thumbscrews
-1 Sylvan Library
-1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
-4 Ivory Tower
+3 Howling Mine
+3 Tangle Wire/Energy Field/Mana Short
+3 Misdirection

-4 Polluted Delta
+3 Yavimaya Coast
+1 Island

Alfred
05-22-2005, 04:08 AM
Well, I like how you removed a bunch of chaff from the deck, and most of it I agree with, except for three things:

#1. You probably want 3 Thumbscrews, because you will want to get them, seeing as it takes 20 turns to kill them under the lock. You do NOT want to run out of time.

#2. Perhaps both Daze and Thwart are a bit extreme, but I think that even with the dissynergy between them and root maze, they give the deck more stopping power. I agree no thwart, but I think 4 Daze should still be in the deck, as an early game counter as well as one that is effective under a stasis. Plus, Stifle + needle/totem is redundant in a bad way.

#3. If we are going to cursed totem, why not go the Whole 9 Yards and include Damping Matrix? I wouldn't discard Pithing Needle just yet, because it's cost comes in at an extremely economical 1 mana, compared to the 2cc Totem and the 3cc Damping Matrix. These can be deployed throughout the game (even under a stasis, usually) and can shut down troublesome permanents such as wasteland (protecting your forsaken city), survival, mindslaver, welder etc. This usually requires knowing the metagame a bit better, but it's still really effective.

I do like most of your suggestions. so here is the list I propose:

4x Stasis
4x Root Maze
4x Force of Will
4x Daze
4x Impulse
4x Pithing Needle
3x Thumbscrews
3x Howling Mine
3x Tangle Wire
3x Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4x Forsaken City
4x Yavimaya Coast
4x Tropical Island
12x Island

millerwc
05-22-2005, 09:03 PM
I've been lurking around the forums for a while, but when people start talking about my beloved Stasis, I always have to open my mouth (and shove my foot in)

Well, now that we're looking at stuff from saviors how about an alternate kill condition

Ebony Owl Netsuke
Casting cost: 2
Card text: At the beginning of each opponent's upkeep, if that player has seven or more cards in hand, Ebony Owl Netsuke deals 4 damage to him or her.

If you're going to run the Howling Mines, you're opponents going to have 7 cards in hand. Pre-lock, thumbscrews could be more useful, but a 5 turn clock vs a 20 turn clock isn't much of a contest. I've played stasis in tournaments, and I have to say that going better than 1-0-1 is extremely difficult- people usaully play the game out and hope for the draw if they don't think they can win.

Also, on the subject of 2cc artifacts, there is Time Vault, which should definatly be included in almost any stasis build. If you draw the 2nd stasis, it allows you to sac the first during your upkeep, and then take an extra turn. It also has some great synergy with Tangle Wire. It doesn't have such great synergy with Thumbscrews, but I think those need to go anyway.

Crop Rotation- I've always wanted to try this out is a stasis build, it allows you to tutor for forsaken city, or, more importantly, Tabernacle of Pendrell Vale. Not a clue as to whether it's worth it, but certainly worth exploring.

T is for TOOL
05-22-2005, 10:46 PM
Ebony Owl Netsuke is definitely better than Thumbscrews. In fact, this might actually make the deck playable again.



Also, on the subject of 2cc artifacts, there is Time Vault, which should definatly be included in almost any stasis build
I removed Time Vault from the list because it favors a decking strategy even though it has great synergy with the deck. Although I haven't tested it, I don't think the inclusion of Vault is necessary. I'd probably try Chain of Vapor first.


#3. If we are going to cursed totem, why not go the Whole 9 Yards and include Damping Matrix? I wouldn't discard Pithing Needle just yet, because it's cost comes in at an extremely economical 1 mana, compared to the 2cc Totem and the 3cc Damping Matrix. These can be deployed throughout the game (even under a stasis, usually) and can shut down troublesome permanents such as wasteland (protecting your forsaken city), survival, mindslaver, welder etc. This usually requires knowing the metagame a bit better, but it's still really effective.Damping Matrix is worse than Cursed Totem because it cost 3, and it doesn't stop mana sources. Pithing Needle is worse because it only stops one threat. I would much rather drop Cursed Totem on turn 2, stopping Birds of Paradise, Quirion Ranger, Wall of Roots, Tradewind Rider, Rofellos, Welder, Mongrel, etc. than drop the Needle turn 1 and name one card.

bigredmeanie
05-23-2005, 10:20 AM
Daze is going to be good throughout the entirety of they game, simply because of Stasis.

I agree that Totem is better than Pithing Needle in this deck.

Ebony Owl Netsuke is a better win condition than either.

You know what's funny. We are actually trying to make Stasis a viable deck. I think it's working.

cartman34
05-23-2005, 11:06 AM
I think that Morphling is a quite good win condition in Stasis and you should probably run at least some sort of bounce because you can bounce stasis eot.

StasisMan
05-23-2005, 11:48 AM
All great ideas! Okay well My counterbase was pretty bad but the reason I ran the arcane denials is that is allowed me to draw a card and since I was running a decking strat I let him draw 2(not many people pass that up). Okay so I have made a lot of changes. Ebony Owl is working out well...Daze is a godsend, CURSED TOTEM is by far the best entry and I am keeping my howlers. Ebony Owl+Howlers= one dead dude. I only have to keep him locked for 4 turns it is amazing! Energy Field is also amazing, Stalling for sooooooo long. My mana base still hasn't changed except for 3 main board tabernacles. Thwart Sucks really bad, I am only running 4 Daze and 4 FoW's.

My current List

4x Stasis
4x Root Maze
4x Force of Will
4x Daze
4x Impulse
3x Energy Field
3x Ebony Owl
4x Howling Mine
3x Cursed Totem
3x Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4x Forsaken City
4x Polluted Delta
4x Tropical Island
12x Island

bobo
05-23-2005, 09:06 PM
heres a list i have come up with, now i havent played it because i dont have all the cards, but it looks real good on paper :)

Root Chrono Stasis:

creatures
4 chronatog
4 elvish spirit guide

spells
4 stasis
4 root maze
4 kismet
4 enlightened tutor
1 worldly tutor
4 force of will
4 counterspell
4 boomerang

artifact
1 iron maiden
1 tormod's crypt

non basic land
4 forsaken city

dual land
1 tundra
1 tropical island
1 savannah

fetch land
2 flooded strand
2 windswept heath

regular land
4 island
4 plain
2 forest

The main idea is to deck opp, but the maiden serves as alt win.

T is for TOOL
05-23-2005, 11:11 PM
Root Chrono Stasis:

creatures
4 chronatog
4 elvish spirit guide

spells
4 stasis
4 root maze
4 kismet
4 enlightened tutor
1 worldly tutor
4 force of will
4 counterspell
4 boomerang

artifact
1 iron maiden
1 tormod's crypt

non basic land
4 forsaken city

dual land
1 tundra
1 tropical island
1 savannah

fetch land
2 flooded strand
2 windswept heath

regular land
4 island
4 plain
2 forest

The main idea is to deck opp, but the maiden serves as alt win.
It's nice to see that there is some interest in the deck, since I thought that everyone hated it. However, the most promising direction that the deck seems to be taking is winning through damage, not decking. Additionally, the deck needs to remain creatureless and take as much virtual card advantage as it can get.

I won't address your card choices individually, but I think it would be worthwhile if you reread the thread from the beginning, as several card choices have already been brought up. The general conclusion that I came to after running Stasis in tournaments, is that decking is not a competitive strategy. To this extent, Ebony Owl Netsuke is currently the best win condition and a deck built around it is optimal.

Using the list posted by StasisMan as the most up to date version, I am wondering how it fares against control. Back when I was running U/G, I relied on Tangle Wire and Sylvan Library to combat control. Tangle Wire was much better when decking was the win condition, but probably isn't the best option here. This current version looks like it may have some issues with control and something like Enchantress. If anyone could playtest and post some results, we could make more accurate changes. For now, I think there should be room for Sylvan Library. In addition, I think the deck can benefit from some sort of Tangle Wire effect, possibly Mana Short?

-1 Howling Mine
-1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
-4 Polluted Delta

+3 Yavimaya Coast
+3 Sylvan Library

StasisMan
05-25-2005, 09:45 AM
TOOL YOU ARE THE MAN!!! Okay well I add the sylvan libs and coasts took out the polluted Deltas a howler and a tabernacle, and its feeling pretty sexy Ive been playing it against my U/W Landstill (Pre and Post SB) as well as with my Hulk Smash (Pre and Post SB) The match up against landstill seems to be great and hulk smash seems to be just as well. The only deck I find trouble with still is Solidarity, but that is going to be forever because I can't really stop it......But the Libs have always been a choice against control and in stasis they are no different just 4923402840234820 X More important! :laugh:

cupajoe
05-28-2005, 10:49 AM
I'm just wondering if anyone ever thought of putting creatures in the sideboard and then boarding them in for a nice surprise, after your opponent presumably boards all his creature control out after the first game.....

Assuming they're taking out their creature control, your creatures don't even have to be optimal, just lowest casting cost

I am thinking of
+ 4 Zephyr Falcon
+ 2 Bay Falcon

and then removing
- 3 Ebony Owl Netsuke and
-3 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale

I wouldn't do this every match, because word would get out at the tourney, especially in the later rounds....But that's good too, because then just side in something else and they would keep in their dead creature control cards.....

It could speed up the tourney play and avoid draws

Just my .02

T is for TOOL
06-05-2005, 09:00 PM
I'm just wondering if anyone ever thought of putting creatures in the sideboard and then boarding them in for a nice surprise, after your opponent presumably boards all his creature control out after the first game.....
I'm going to assume that this statement refers to opposing control decks. An important strength of Stasis is that its lack of creatures creates dead cards in the opposing deck. Most players won't side out all of their creature removal simply because they have too much. Even if they did, you are bringing in slower more vulnerable win conditions when Owl has much better synergy with the deck, not to mention that playing good SB cards is probably optimal.

Lego
06-07-2005, 06:00 PM
I'm thinking Isochron Scepter, on which you can imprint Counter Spell (or if you splash white, Orim's Chant... always good on a Scepter :-P) Then when you drop the lock, you can imprint Boomerang on a Scepter. You get an Untap step, they don't. Vedalken Mastermind works for this as well, but I like the Boomerang/Scepter much better :) Both are useful outside of the lock, and turn 2 Scepter/Counterspell is Hella Good

T is for TOOL
06-07-2005, 06:48 PM
I'm thinking Isochron Scepter, on which you can imprint Counter Spell (or if you splash white, Orim's Chant... always good on a Scepter :-P) Then when you drop the lock, you can imprint Boomerang on a Scepter. You get an Untap step, they don't. Vedalken Mastermind works for this as well, but I like the Boomerang/Scepter much better :) Both are useful outside of the lock, and turn 2 Scepter/Counterspell is Hella Good
The most updated list runs neither Counterspell nor Boomerang, and does not splash white. Even if those cards were in the deck, Isochron Scepter requires more than one or two targets to make it playable, especially since it takes 4 slots itself. Also, if the deck were splashing White, Enlightened Tutor looks more appealing than Chant. Adding creatures in a deck that runs 2-3 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale main is like adding Kiwi Shoe Polish to Vodka: bad bad times.

xenoq
06-08-2005, 01:52 AM
I didn't feel like reading all your posts, but I do feel the need to step on some caps.

To those who say Arcane Denial sucks, you obviously don't know your ass from your elbow. This is the only deck on the face of the planet where having your opponent drawing cards is a good thing. The card replacement is goods.

Secondly, this is problem one of the only two decks that exist that Howling Mine is good in. The other is that shitpile with Underworld Dump and Tefari's Puzzlebox. Yeah, having them draw cards = playing for your team.

Thwart is good. Chain of Vapor is good.

T is for TOOL
06-08-2005, 06:48 PM
To those who say Arcane Denial sucks, you obviously don't know your ass from your elbow.
Where did you pick up that colloquialism? Either you have just insulted a majority of the people on this site, or you have a very enthusiastic gay lover.



This is the only deck on the face of the planet where having your opponent drawing cards is a good thing. The card replacement is goods.

Assuming you're actually serious, you should realize that Arcane Denial, is a terrible card and does not belong in this deck. There's a big distinction to be made when saying that an opponent drawing cards is a 'good' thing:

If they are gaining card advantage at a rate greater than the rate of your virtual card advantage, i.e. no lock in place, then it is not a good thing at all. In fact, it is a very bad thing. Your rate of virtual card advantage must be equal to or greater than their rate of card advantage i.e. an Owl and a Stasis hard (or occasionally soft) lock on the board, before it is 'good' for them to draw more cards.

Once the hard lock is down, ideally your opponent can't play anymore spells, and you have reached the point when your virtual card advantage has reached the same rate of increase as your opponent's actual card drawing. Both rates, are now the same, and we have attained equilbrium (i.e. Stasis). In fact, with the versatility of Forsaken City, the Stasis player will eventually surpass the opponent's draw potential, although the game should be over by that point.

Using this principle as a guideline, it is easy to see why Arcane Denial is a mediocre spell in this deck (and in general).

1. It gives the opponent unnecessary card advantage.
2. It is a counterspell that requires mana in a deck that strongly favors 'free' counters.
3. It gives the opponent unnecessary card advantage.



Thwart is good.
I would suggest reading the thread and possibly testing the decklist before making comments like this. Thwart is cumbersome and has terrible synergy with Root Maze.



Chain of Vapor is good.
Quite possibly the only accurate statement in your post, and it contributes nothing to the discussion. Are you suggesting that the deck should run Chain of Vapor? If so, what does it replace. Why do you think Chain of Vapor is good? From what I've seen, it doesn't let the opponent draw cards, so how can it be good? Maybe the fact that it can give your opponent significant card advantage if you time it right? By all means, please feel the need to step on some more caps.

GRAH
06-08-2005, 07:52 PM
Is Ebony Owl really that good? It seems like playing lands negates its efficiency. For it, you really need Howling Mine. Is it that reliable to get it AND Mine AND Stasis AND Root Maze AND Forbidden City?

StasisMan's build seems like the best current version to me. However, FoWs seem to kill you, as do other early counterspells. I think you need some way of accelerating mana (Chrome Mox? Lotus Petal?) so you can get Stasis out before they draw into an FoW/get enough mana for a Leak or CSpell.

This deck is hit or miss. You either get the combo out, or you die hard.

T is for TOOL
06-08-2005, 08:35 PM
Is Ebony Owl really that good?
Yes.


It seems like playing lands negates its efficiency.
If you're talking about your opponent laying lands, they must drop a land a turn to keep a constant hand size. This is assuming that Howling Mine isn't in play. The Owl only needs to successfully trigger 4 or 5 times.

The deck doesn't draw all of the cards you mentioned at once. Ideally, it lays an early Root Maze, and a Sylvan Library or Howling Mine. Against aggro, Energy Field helps out tremendously, and a 'Wrath of God' effect of The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale + Stasis is sometimes an option. I haven't playtested this new version much, but I agree that it doesn't look like it's very strong against control. The issue isn't resolving an early Stasis necessarily, but being able to drop one at the optimal time. Mana Short, Tangle Wire, and cards with similar effects can help with this problem, and are possbile considerations for the deck. In addition, I'd like to fit Chain of Vapor in somewhere, as I found myself missing it in the few games I did playtest.

The deck has a hit/miss mentality in that you need to draw Stasis or you lose, but it is designed to stall until you do draw Stasis. Additionally, you aren't required to drop Stasis as soon as you can. It's usually better to wait for an opportune time. Also, I'd consider the deck to be a lock and not a combo. :p

syssc9
06-12-2005, 01:17 PM
This thread really interests me. During the Alliances era I ran a creature-less LD deck that used 3 Tabernacles to good affect and that peaks my interest here. Unfortunately, I now own only 2 Tabernacles, and that poses a bit of a problem, since I completely agree that 3 is the correct number. I toyed with the idea of using Living Wish and putting 1 Tabernacle and perhaps a Chronatog in the sideboard (turning it into a wish-board), but I wonder if the 3cc of the Wish isn’t too much in this deck. Millerwc mentioned the possibility of using Crop Rotation and that sounds like my best bet. In some of the lists I see both Ebony Owl and Howling Mine reduced to 3 each, ostensibly to fit in 2 Sylvan Library. I have not built or tested any of the versions listed above, but I’m working on it. I wonder if anyone would care to comment on the following list:

4 Stasis
4 Root Maze (or perhaps some # of Orb of Dreams?)
4 Ebony Owl
4 Howling Mine
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
4 Impulse/Brainstorm (unsure which is best in this deck)
4 Crop Rotation
4 Energy Field
2 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale

Notice the lack of Libraries. Do they really help that much? Especially as a 2-of, do you really draw them often enough to make a significant difference? I am hoping the 4 Howlers will do the job in the absence of Sylvan Library. I also wonder if Orb of dreams is a good choice. The 3cc bothers me… My mana base would be similar to others listed above and I would probably run things like Damping Matrix/Cursed Totem and the aforementioned Libraries in the side board.

Does this look viable? I am in the process of putting it together (gotta pick up a couple more Corp Rotation and Energy Field tonight) and will report on how it goldfishes, at least, when it is complete.

Thanx for any input.

T is for TOOL
06-12-2005, 05:03 PM
I toyed with the idea of using Living Wish and putting 1 Tabernacle and perhaps a Chronatog in the sideboard (turning it into a wish-board), but I wonder if the 3cc of the Wish isn’t too much in this deck.
Living Wish only costs 2, but Chronatog isn't a very good SB option, so that would leave you with The Tabernacle. If that's the only target, then there's really no point in running Wish in this deck.


I also wonder if Orb of dreams is a good choice. The 3cc bothers me…
I'd stick with 4 Root Maze because of its low mana cost, it makes it easier to drop all of the lock pieces at once. Additionally, it can give you a big advantage against decks that run a lot of Fetches.


Notice the lack of Libraries. Do they really help that much? Especially as a 2-of, do you really draw them often enough to make a significant difference? I am hoping the 4 Howlers will do the job in the absence of Sylvan Library.
The reason most of the lists are running 3 Owls/ 3 Mines is that you don't necessarily want to see them in the opening hand. Owl doesn't do a whole lot early on, and Howling Mine is more solid when a Root Maze is on the board. Think of it from the standpoint of dropping a second turn Mine vs. second turn Owl vs. second turn Library. Library will be the best choice in a majority of the situations. Specifically, it's most helpful against control, where the card advantage it generates is huge.


4 Impulse/Brainstorm (unsure which is best in this deck)
Impulse is superior to Brainstorm in this deck, for two major reasons.

1. Lack of shuffle effects diminishes Brainstorm's effectiveness.
2. Impulse digs deeper, and works better with Sylvan Library and/or Howling Mine.


Millerwc mentioned the possibility of using Crop Rotation and that sounds like my best bet.
Crop Rotation takes up unnecessary slots in the deck. Keep in mind that The Tabernacle is only really effective against aggro and the opponent doesn't lose when The Tabernacle hits the board; it just slows them down. Using Crop Rotation not only costs you a mana source, but a card from your hand. This slot is better used to help you battle control/aggro/combo, depending on your metagame.

syssc9
06-19-2005, 09:18 AM
Thanks for the input. I added the 2 Libraries and dropped 1 Owl , 1 Energy Field and 2 Crop Rotation. I still only have 2 Tabernacles so I have retained 2 Crop Rotation. The libraries do help a bunch, even as a 2-of. One thing: this deck is really order-dependent. That is, you must play the cards in a certain order for it to work. I hate that, but it seems to be the nature of the beast. For example: Howling Mine is one of the few cards that shuts off when tapped, so you MUST have the Howler down before the Root Maze/Stasis hits the board. This may seem a quibble, but it annoys me no end.

I have been gold-fishing it like a billion times, but it seems to be one of those decks that are hard to judge that way. I played it against my wife and her Angel Stumpy with Jittes and had no trouble beating her. She hated it, BTW!

Here’s my current list:

4 Forsaken City
4 Tropical Island
4 Yavimaya Coast
12 Island

4 Stasis
4 Root Maze
3 Ebony Owl
4 Howling Mine
2 Sylvan Library
2 Crop Rotation
2 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
4 Impulse
3 Energy Field

I would love to hear some tips on play strategy and match-ups. Unfortunately, there are no 1.5 tourneys here in Omaha - at least none that I am aware of... :(

T is for TOOL
06-19-2005, 07:58 PM
Although I've only played the deck at one tournament since the September bannings, I can list a few matchups that I've played off the top of my head.

Landstill

I typically faced 2-3 different landstill builds, UR, URW, and UB. The most difficult of these was UR, as the MD burn and SB Blasts sometimes posed a problem. The current favorite at the moment seems to be UW. This is good for the Stasis player, since white was added primarily to deal with creatures, so the deck has dead cards not found in the UR version. My old list, however, had several cards that gave me an even greater advantage against Landstill, namely Tsabo's Web and Tangle Wire. As for the actual matches, one of the most effective ways to slow them down is Root Maze on the first turn. Other than that, You just need to be able to force a Stasis through at an opportune time. This will be much harder given your build, because you have no method to force them to tap their lands. This matchup is going to require extensive playtesting, but I am sure that you need some method to disrupt their mana to even the odds. Also, I found 4 Back to Basics to be the best SB option against them.

ATS

Right now, this is a horrible matchup for you. If they resolve a Tradewind Rider, it's game over. Even if they don't, you have Quirion Ranger to worry about, not to mention the Counterspells, and SB Choke. My old build managed to get a slightly favorable matchup out of this, but I was running 3 Cursed Totem main, and Chain of Vapor as well. You need something to deal with utility creatures, and my best suggestion would be Cursed Totem. This card shuts down a good portion of their deck. Also, due to its mana-intensive nature, you shouldn't have problems finding opportunities to drop a Stasis on them. I found Tabernacle and Totem to be the best cards in this matchup, and sometimes I added a Drop of Honey or two from the SB.

Solidarity

This is also looking pretty ugly for you right now. With no way to disrupt their combo aside from Root Maze, they can pretty much ignore what you do, and dig at the end of your turn, without worrying about Stasis too much. At the moment, they have no pressure on them, so they don't have to try and force anything. Root Maze is very good, especially since the new builds are running so many Fetches. My only suggestion would be something like Tangle Wire or possibly Mana Short. Other than that, you can always just put 4 Blessings in the SB. :p

Burn/Goblins

Energy Field = Good Times. Post SB bring in Chill.

Pox

This was an interesting matchup. Howling Mine and Sylvan Library become the key cards in this match. The ability to draw more cards a turn negates the advantage that Pox tries to create, not to mention it limits the effectiveness of the builds using The Rack. I never really had any SB slots for this match because it wasn't a very popular deck, however, Spreading Algae would be good if you felt you needed something.

Enchantress

This match was usually a coin toss, depending on the quality of the hand and the draws, etc. Basically I would counter their disenchant effects, and occasionally a Sterling Grove. Root Maze slows them down considerably, and hopefully they will be generous with their Fetching and Library uses, so you will only need one or two Owl activations. I also favored Chain of Vapor in this match, as it can be used to bounce the Disenchant targets, Presences, and of course, an early Stasis.

Madness

Cursed Totem is MVP in this match. Following at a close second is Energy Field. When I played this matchup, I sometimes drew into Time Vault followed by Energy Field, and it was all over. Other times, turn 1 Root Maze gave me plenty of time to draw into what I needed. Currently, the matchup isn't going to be nearly as favorably, but the key cards still remain the same.

Random Aggro

These matches are made easier by Energy Field and Tabernacle. Cursed Totem is also handy in some situations, and depending on your meta, you can allocate the appropriate number of SB slots for this.

Volley This!
06-24-2005, 09:16 AM
Ok not to rain on anybodys parade here but I saw one guy say dump chronotog from a stasis deck. I couldn't imagine playing stasis without him. Play turbo stasis, is way fun and it has a hard lock when it wins.

Stasis+Kismet+Chronotog= You get 3 points for the round
:) for those who can't see the broken combo.

Stasis says nothing uptaps, Kistmet says stuff comes into play taped, chronotog says i'll get slightly bigger by skipping my next turn but I can only do this once per turn. However it doesn't say only on your turn may you use the ability(insert evil smile)

Lets say its the end of your opponents turn, and all his permanents are tapped, activate the mighty chrontog there by skipping your next turn, opponent starts turn by drawing a card, nothing untaps because of stasis, he may drop a land but it comes into play tapped because of kismet, he says end turn, but wait what if you activate the mighty chronotog again? Why he'd be forced to do it all over again drawing 1 card each turn, and ultimately decking himself, that is if you were to continually activate the mighty chronotog.

GRAH
06-24-2005, 11:52 AM
Volley This, we get how the Chronatog version works. It isn't as reliable, or as good. Also, it's not necessarily a hard lock. No Stasis lock is a hard lock.

XxCoffinxX
06-24-2005, 01:59 PM
i remember waay back in the day i used to play stasis...mine was hella ghetto tho...i ran serra angel and meddling mage...i agree that chronatog is bad but what about meddling mage in the deck? its definetly better than pithing needle and cursed totem. i understand it not a great choice because its a creature and can get picked off...but pithing needle and totem can also get picked off your also going to need something to untap lands or bounce the stasis i understand you said boomerrang but what about capsize? it has a buyback ability. also how about seal of removal? im not saying add all of them...but maybe a couple of them

T is for TOOL
06-24-2005, 05:56 PM
Stasis likes cheap spells. The only bounce spell that should be run in the MD is Chain of Vapor. It's cheap, efficient, and can target your opponent's permanents too.

Cursed Totem is almost strictly better than Meddling Mage in this deck. It is much harder to get rid of, deals with many threats at the same time, doesn't have white in the mana cost, and it doesn't die to The Tabernacle. Also, a spell that picks off Cursed Totem is one that isn't hitting another artifact or enchantment.

@Volley This! Please read through the thread before you post. The version that wins with Time Vault or Chronatog (strictly worse than Time Vault), was already discussed earlier. The decking strategy is too slow to work in a tournament setting.

Volley This!
06-24-2005, 07:33 PM
How is it too slow? you have your opponents never untapping, anything they do play comes into play tapped, and they draw a card every turn, without you having another turn.

They should realise you have put them into an infinte lock and conceed, and can you please explain to me how this is not a hard lock? Because if I played against someone who did that to me I'd call that the masterlock because its impossible to break, and its only 3 cards.

GRAH
06-24-2005, 07:47 PM
If they already have lands untapped, as with all Stasis decks, it's not a lock.

Chronatog is specifically weak because it dies to ANY spot-burn and any creature removal under the sun.

Volley This!
06-24-2005, 09:46 PM
Why would you drop stasis when your opponent has more than 1 untapped land?? and when you drop chronotog you make sure you got some protection in hand whethere it be daze force of will or whatever your playing so you make sure he stays on deck.

Slay
06-24-2005, 10:35 PM
So... your plan is to pray they tap out, and that you have all three pieces of the lock, and that you have coutnerspell backup in your hand. And that they have no way of getting out of the lock.

Have you any idea how stupid a game plan is when it dies to an opponent not doing something, especially considering you can't drop the lock all on one turn?
-Slay

T is for TOOL
06-24-2005, 11:42 PM
How is it too slow? you have your opponents never untapping, anything they do play comes into play tapped, and they draw a card every turn, without you having another turn.
Getting the lock out isn't necessarily slow, winning the game is slow. I have played this version at serious tournaments before, and the problem is that your opponent won't concede if they think they can stall the round out. They are allotted a minimum amount of time (30 seconds, I believe) during each phase of their turn before they can be called for stalling. If they think they can wait until time in the round runs out, they will try. This will leave you with either a draw or a loss, not to mention it ruins what is supposed to be a fun event.


can you please explain to me how this is not a hard lock?
Abolish
ESG into Naturalize/other enchantment hate
Darksteel Colossus MD
Quirion Ranger
Reverent Silence
Carpet of Flowers
ANY free creature removal like Snuff Out, Contagion, Spinning Darkness, Sickening Shoal, Pyrokinesis, and Fireblast to name just a few reasons.

If you just run Time Vault over Chronatog, you don't need to worry about the creature removal. In fact, you can play Time Vault whenever you want, not just the turn that the lock comes down. Also, Tangle Wire allows you to drop the lock even when they have several lands untapped.


So... your plan is to pray they tap out, and that you have all three pieces of the lock, and that you have coutnerspell backup in your hand. And that they have no way of getting out of the lock.
Keep in mind that this version also runs Tangle Wire so that you can take a proactive role in getting them to tap out. I don't disagree that decking is a poor gameplan, but that version of the deck is built to do it as effectively as possible.

Let me stress again that Ebony Owl Netsuke is currently the best win condition for Stasis. If you are going to try and build a competitive deck, then look to this card as your win condition.

Volley This!
06-25-2005, 08:18 AM
OK I never said that the version I was running was the be all and end all, but I just wanted an extra option to be open.

Now to "slay" you don't try to drop all the pieces in 1 turn. You play kismet to slow down and just pi$$ off the aggro deck alot, then you play the deck as any standard blue control, bide your time and wait for your opponent to over comitte in a turn, counter 1 thing, so he plays another counter that, and hopefully he plays another card so you can counter that, that he should be or is nearly tapped out with anywhere up to 4 less card in his hand because of what he tried to do in his turn then drop the stasis and watch his face drop. You may have chorontog in hand then, if he has bugger all cards in hand or if you have some protection in hand play the chronotog, if not bide your time again until you feel secure in that he's gonna stay in play.

Now I know time vault is way better, but unfortunately I don't have any so thats why I'm playing the tog version of the deck which is slightly less good admitedly, but should not be seen as a reason not to play stasis this way.

Now so that I don't cop so much heat, I'll post my turbo stasis deck by wednesday so that you can call it crap then.

Until then, stay classy

Slay
06-25-2005, 09:54 AM
So...your goal is to play a 4cc enchantment that does nearly nothing to their clock, and wait until they tap out?

What happens if they just keep attacking you with mana open? If you don't play your pieces all in one turn then any opponent worth a crap will know you're playing Stasis. And then they'll never tap out, because if they do, you win.
-Slay

GRAH
06-25-2005, 10:57 AM
Ebony Owl Netsuke is the better win condition than Chronatog for two reasons.

1. There is more creature hate than artifact hate in the metagame. Go ahead and look at all of the DTBs and Open forum decks. See how many have MD creature hate versus how many have MD artifact hate.

2. Forbidden City still allows you to draw cards (see: counterspells.).

Also, Kismet is significantly worse than Root Maze in this deck.

AnwarA101
06-25-2005, 12:06 PM
I was wondering how much E. Tutor has been discussed in this deck. I know that you can't really afford to run fetchs with Root Maze, but it seems amazing that you can always find the combo piece that you need at the cost of 1 white. But the mana base could become really unstable with the addition of another color. Is this the main reason for it not being included? If so I understand.

Slay
06-25-2005, 01:10 PM
The main reason for not including E Tutor is the card disadvantage, s I see it. In a deck where every card is precious, getting a Enlightened is pitch material. You need a simewhat large hand to win with Stasis. Enlightened is bad in that regard.
-Slay

T is for TOOL
06-25-2005, 03:53 PM
Now I know time vault is way better, but unfortunately I don't have any so thats why I'm playing the tog version of the deck which is slightly less good admitedly, but should not be seen as a reason not to play stasis this way.
The reason not to play stasis this way is because decking your opponent is not a competitive strategy.



I was wondering how much E. Tutor has been discussed in this deck. I know that you can't really afford to run fetchs with Root Maze, but it seems amazing that you can always find the combo piece that you need at the cost of 1 white. But the mana base could become really unstable with the addition of another color. Is this the main reason for it not being included? If so I understand.
If Enlightened Tutor is included, then you want to drop green altogether from the deck because the mana base cannot reliably support 3 colors. The reason I don't like U/W is that you now have an even weaker game against control. Your Howling Mines will now always suck, you've lost Library, and the only replacements for Root Maze are the sub-optimal Kismet and Orb of Dreams, not to mention that Enlightened Tutor is card disadvantage. On the other hand, it is now much easier to find what you need when you need it. Things like Tangle Wire, Humility, and Ebony Owl can be run as 1 or 2 of's, etc. I personally prefer the disruptive capabilites of Root Maze, but a U/W version of the deck is definitely a possibility.

xenoq
06-25-2005, 06:00 PM
The reason not to play stasis this way is because decking your opponent is not a competitive strategy.


Fuck Solidarity and the old Dragon. Fuck em in the ass. They're not legit.

Sarcasm is cute and all, but it's not difficult to infer what Tool meant by his statement, and this post can easily be misread as pointlessly inflammatory. Keep it in check. -Zilla

Slay
06-25-2005, 06:55 PM
The reason not to play stasis this way is because decking your opponent is not a competitive strategy.


Fuck Solidarity and the old Dragon. Fuck em in the ass. They're not legit.
I really hope you're kidding. But I know that Volley is going to see this and be self-righteous, so I'll clarify.

Forcing your deck to win the game on turn 45-50 is NOT a competitive strategy.
-Slay

T is for TOOL
06-25-2005, 07:10 PM
Fuck Solidarity and the old Dragon. Fuck em in the ass. They're not legit.
Thank you for this post xenoq. As always, your thoughts contribute to the thread and facilitate discussion.

For those of you unaware of the ploy at work, xenoq was being sarcastic. After his nescient post encouraging the use of Arcane Denial and my subsequent rebuttal, it seems he felt the need to one-up me. Well, you are correct xenoq. Both Solidarity and the old Dragon win games by decking the opponent, +1 for you.

I apologize to those who did not infer from my post, but I was trying to say that decking your opponent with a Stasis deck is not a competitive strategy. Both the inclusion of the word 'Stasis' at the beginning of the sentence, as well as my previous posts on the same topic lead me to believe that someone reading the post could tell that my statement was in the context of Stasis decks, but apparently I was wrong.

Note: I began writing before Slay posted. Read his post for a good clarification.



Edited By T is for TOOL on 1124916500

Volley This!
06-26-2005, 08:47 AM
Ok my train of thought isn't how quickly I can uncomptetively deck my opponent, but how quickly I can put the combo together on the table that will cause my opponent to come into a near infinte combo that will result him to become decked, there is a difference.

What's not competitve about trying to belt out a, you win the game combo, before your opponent can either overrun you with random dorks, or disrupt you just that little bit too much before you win? I always thought that was the point and fun of playing combo decks, feel free to correct me though as I'm sure someone will.

midnightAce
06-26-2005, 04:06 PM
To treat this deck like a combo deck is a bit misleading. The majority of combo decks, once the peices are in place, simply wins. They often win with an active spell, (Brainfreeze, Tendrils), to have a reactive winning condition, (decking) is not reliable in competitive tournments due to the time constraints.


but how quickly I can put the combo together on the table that will cause my opponent to come into a near infinte combo that will result him to become decked, there is a difference.

If you ever played against Life.dec, then you would know that even after opponent gains 9999999999xxx life, you would often still play it out. Sure, there is no way you could kill the guy, but as long as he hasn't found his Test of Endurance or whatever other kill condition he's running, there is still a chance to be tied. The same applies to Statis decks that win by decking. Even AFTER you assmebled all the peices on the table, it is by no means an auto win. In this case, time is not your friend at all. Let me break it down to you even further:


Ok my train of thought isn't how quickly I can uncomptetively deck my opponent, but how quickly I can put the combo together on the table that will cause my opponent to come into a near infinte combo that will result him to become decked, there is a difference.


Let's say you are going against a deck with a clock of infinite turns. There are 40 cards left in his library. This is currently turn 13, you assembled your peices down now, you'll win on turn 54. Compare this to:
Let's say you are going against a deck with a clock of infinite turns. There are 20 cards left in his library. This is currently turn 33, you assembled your peices down now, you'll win on turn 54.

Of course, this is a really bad example, as opposing deck will be smashing face in the main time, but the point still remains the same, as long as you are winning by decking, your "turn of win" is fixed. If you are looking to slow your opponent down to stay alive, then Rootmaze would seem to be a better option then Kismet. I'm afraid I conclude with the majority here that Ebony Owl Netsuke is currently one of the best kill conditions avilible to the deck.

Volley This!
06-26-2005, 05:52 PM
So to clarify my deck is so unplayable that it could never function/win in a "proper" tournament?

The Stasis I was building I wouldn't call straigt up control anyway, its more Control/Combo deck, as whenever I have pulled the combo out and got the lock to stick my opponents have conceeded out of sportsmenship because I put the combo together, and they realise they can't beat it, and they just want to get to the next game so they can beat me then.

T is for TOOL
06-26-2005, 08:31 PM
So to clarify my deck is so unplayable that it could never function/win in a "proper" tournament?
I haven't seen your decklist, but if your only win condtion is making your opponent run out of cards to draw, then it will not win in a competitive tournament. Your version can place well at a local tournament or any other tournament where there is a casual atmosphere. I played the Time Vaut variant at local tournaments many times, made it to top 8 several times, and occasionally won. Contrast that to Big Arse, where I ended up getting three or four draws by the end of the day, which was about half of my matches. However, the next day, at the smaller local store tournament, I made T8.

The goal of this thread should be to build a competitive Stasis deck. Time Vault and Chronatog are not competitive win conditions. It might be possible to form a competitive decklist with Ebony Owl Netsuke as the win condition, so it would be more productive if we concentrate on decklists built around Owl. If you want to go the decking route, that's fine, but don't expect to win any big tournaments with it.

hacksign
07-09-2005, 12:37 PM
what do you think about this list:

Decklist deleted

I am currently testing and found problems with control

Please do not simply post a decklist. We need to see card choices and match ups explained in a well developed post. No one wants to see a thread spammed with unexplained decklists.

Peter_Rotten

martyr
07-10-2005, 05:38 AM
So...why is the Time Vault version not competitive? I don't know who you guys play with, but if I have a Stasis lock and an opponent with no outs, as soon as I play Time Vault, they think for a second and concede. Even people who are dicks and want to crap on your record give up after like 20 turns of drawing straight through their deck, and realizing that they'd better stop so they have a chance at a second or third game. Sure, some of your matches might be draws, but that's the gamble you take with Stasis.

However, I'm not discouraging innovation. By all means, try to find a faster win condition. However, all the win conditions I've seen so far take up at least 7 slots (3x Ebony Owl, 4x Howling Mine, or something like that). Time Vault is 1 slot. One single slot. 1 card. This means you lock them faster and they get less of an opportunity to disrupt you because you're playing actively instead of drawing them extra cards and playing artifacts that require you to be winning to be any good.

BTW: There are only a few viable ways to draw or break through a locked Time Vault game. Darksteel Colossus with 8 cards in hand is one, Abolish is another, maybe that enchantment from Prophecy that lets you sac lands to kill enchantments, Kami of Ancient Law...? I got nothing else, and only one of these cards actually sees play, and the last three are all solid against ANY version of Stasis.

@Xenoq: LOL.

T is for TOOL
07-12-2005, 03:53 PM
Sure, some of your matches might be draws, but that's the gamble you take with Stasis.
The idea of this thread is to create a legitimately competitive Stasis decklist. If you are gambling that every one of your matches could be a draw, you have already failed.

The Ebony Owl win condition is also only one card: Ebon Owl Netsuke. Similar to Time Vault, you can only win with either card if the lock is in place. Time Vault doesn't really lock them any faster, and it takes a lot more time to win once the lock has been established. In addition, against many decks, Time Vault is also only good once you are already winning. The benefits of running Time Vault, however, are that it has much better synergy with the deck, whereas the Owl is almost always dead until you have the complete lock on the board.

The following is the current decklist I'm looking at:

4x Stasis
4x Root Maze
3x Ebony Owl Netsuke
2x Sylvan Library
3x Howling Mine
3x Impulse
4x Force of Will
3x Daze
2x Chain of Vapor
2x Cursed Totem
3x Energy Field
3x Tangle Wire
2x The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4x Forsaken City
12x Island
4x Tropical Island
3x Yavimaya Coast

The inclusion of a card like Tangle Wire is required if you want to form any kind of pressure on your opponent. Also, Chain adds enough versatility to warrant some space in the list. Once again, depending on your meta, the ratio of card choices will change, but I feel this list would probably be best if you were entering an unknown meta. The addition of Tangle Wire most notably improves the Landstill and Solidarity matchups.

Landstill
Tangle Wire is important in this match for several reasons. Most notably, a mid-game Stasis drop is now a very real threat. The ability to tap down their resources makes some decisions much harder. Also, Daze becomes much stronger. :) In fact, if you want to win by decking them, this is one of the few times where you can just drop a Stasis with a City and a Maze on the board, and let them draw their library. That usually only happens game 1 however, and only if you drop it fairly early in the match.

Solidarity
Tangle Wire and Root Maze are pretty much the only things Solidarity cares about. Tangle Wire can buy you some time, since it taps them out on their turn, making an early Stasis drop a possibility. I haven't been able to playtest, but this matchup is still probably not in your favor.

Vial Goblins
With Survival in decline and Vial Goblins on the rise, I turned a Totem into an Energy Field. Field is a great stall tactic throughout the match, and is an excellent second turn response to Lackey. Tangle Wire can be good here, since this deck seems more mana intensive than most red decks. First turn Root Maze is always strong, as it shuts down acceleration via Mox. As for tips, Wrath of God with Tabernacle and Stasis is always good. Additionally, you will find youself with an Energy Field on the board, and a non-basic. The Vial Goblins player will drop a Wasteland (although a Root Maze on the board buys you a turn to prepare), and Waste the Trop/City/Tabernacle. If you can get your hands on a Chain of Vapor, remember to Chain the Field, sac the land and retarget a goblin (obviously not Ringleader, Matron, or Piledriver), then drop the Field again on your turn.

If your meta consists of a lot of these DTB's, then I would suggest replacing the Impulses with Tsabo's Webs. This is especially effective with Root Maze as you shut off Fetchlands, Wastelands, Factories, Conclaves, and Ports.

amightyhippy
08-24-2005, 06:41 AM
Hi all,

I've played Stasis for a couple of years now. Any opponant worth his salt is not going to concede. All they need to do is take their time and force you to deck them in time. More often than not you're going to have to force the lock through their disruption, meaning it's probably mid to late game before you lock them up. At that point all they need to is play slowly. Sure you call a judge and he picks up play till they go. Decking is a viable option if you can do it all in a single turn (i.e solidarity), but it doesn't cut it in stasis. What Stasis deck has won a Legacy tourney, or old 1.5 in the last 2 years? It might be viable but the decking option plain isn't.

cupajoe
08-25-2005, 11:14 AM
Has anyone played this deck in a tournament? (the Ebony Owl version)

I'm curious to hear if it's done anything....Even a decent showing 4-2 or whatever would be encouraging.....

T is for TOOL
08-25-2005, 11:37 AM
The last version I did well with was pretty much the latest decklist I posted, except I was running Timevault in place of Owls. However, this was at a local tournament where my opponents conceded once the lock was established. As it stands right now, the deck just isn't very good. However, with the addition of Muddle Up the Mix and possibly other Ravnica cards, I think the deck has potential.

slylie
08-15-2006, 01:14 AM
Anyone still working on this? or at least have an optimal decklist for an aggro heavy meta?

Poron
08-15-2006, 04:53 AM
my input is: Orb of Dreams + Forsaken City + Stasis.

i played this deck with 4 chrome mox and with a little luck I often had a second turn Orb + a third turn: Forsaken + Stasis. And you win 100% because neither Wasteland can beat you (entering tapped..).

To own totally you'd need a Chronatog really..

DieMyDarling
08-30-2006, 12:04 PM
Ok,i have played a few games last days on MWS because i like the stasis deck from former times...
Firt my list:

4x Stasis
4x Root Maze
2x Ebony Owl Netsuke
3x Howling Mine
3x Tsabo's Web
4x Force of Will
3x Daze
2x Chain of Vapor
1x Cursed Totem
1x echoing truth
3x Muddle The Mixture
2x Energy Field
3x Tangle Wire
2x The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
4x Forsaken City
8x Island
4x Tropical Island
3x Breeding Pool


The tsabos Web with the rootmaze is really very good. Fetchlands dont work any more which is the same for wastelands ( energy field ) .
I havenet played against many topdecks on mws just vs 1 grow and 1 goblins
I won the goblins thx to energy field ( he draw the wasteland when i had stasis root maze and city...) I also won vs the grow thx 2 1st turn maze and 2 turn web...

The Muddle the mixtures really work great as a tutor or a counterspell , also sometimes theyre a lil bit slow though they are sorcery speed tutor...
The ESG help to be fast when u throw out an early root maze.

I am not that sure if the deck has that much potential but it is fun to play and i am going te keep on testeng.

Grim
08-30-2006, 02:36 PM
Has anyone tried Stasis with Squandered Resources? Or is it unnecessary since by the time you get Stasis out you've practically won? Not trying to topic hijack, just curious since we are on the subject of Stasis variants.

Bane of the Living
08-30-2006, 08:07 PM
Is Chronatog normally used still? Theres the new Chronatog Totem coming out. Would it be played with it or in place of it?? You can play it safe from STP till your ready to not take turns.

Mad Bomber
08-31-2006, 01:17 AM
Ok,i have played a few games last days on MWS because i like the stasis deck from former times...
Firt my list:

4x Stasis
4x Root Maze
2x Ebony Owl Netsuke
3x Howling Mine
3x Tsabo's Web
4x Force of Will
3x Daze
2x Chain of Vapor
1x Cursed Totem
1x echoing truth
3x Muddle The Mixture
2x Energy Field
3x Tangle Wire
2x The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
4x Forsaken City
8x Island
4x Tropical Island
3x Breeding Pool


The tsabos Web with the rootmaze is really very good. Fetchlands dont work any more which is the same for wastelands ( energy field ) .
I havenet played against many topdecks on mws just vs 1 grow and 1 goblins
I won the goblins thx to energy field ( he draw the wasteland when i had stasis root maze and city...) I also won vs the grow thx 2 1st turn maze and 2 turn web...

The Muddle the mixtures really work great as a tutor or a counterspell , also sometimes theyre a lil bit slow though they are sorcery speed tutor...
The ESG help to be fast when u throw out an early root maze.

I am not that sure if the deck has that much potential but it is fun to play and i am going te keep on testeng.

Ok just a few thoughts...

Is the deck leaning towards just giving Solidarity an auto win? I mean i know solidarity has a pretty good matchup against everything...but this deck seems like it just has NO chance...with the weak countermagic and no threats...and PS tanglewire and rootmaze dont stop reset!!

BUT on an upside rootmaze stasis does work well :)

And whoever before mentioned 4 blessings..i think it was Tool..you guys should know that trick doesn't work...atleast not in a deck that doesn't apply any pressure!!

Also..energy field and tangle wire arn't exactly great together

But i do like the deck a lot..would be nice if it becomes a viable option again

DieMyDarling
09-05-2006, 10:14 AM
Is Chronatog normally used still? Theres the new Chronatog Totem coming out. Would it be played with it or in place of it?? You can play it safe from STP till your ready to not take turns.

Im not sure about his wording atm, but u have to pay allways to make him a chronatog? that wouldn't work then


@ tangle wire
of course its not that good with the field , but tangle wire is really good in this deck, and if u have both on the board u can still bounce ur field...

Complete_Jank
09-05-2006, 02:23 PM
I found a decent match up against Solidarity with my current Stasis build, however I have other problems to work out still.

My Stasis Deck is a 4 color build that has multiple lock possibilities, that way I don't need Forsaken City. It wins with out decking, but it can have issues with that, because I was trying to play with out the Owl, as I do not use Mines either.

Matter of fact the build is so much different from anything you guys have with the exception of Stasis, Force of Will, Daze, Forsaken City, and a few Islands, that I wouldn't call what I have a stasis deck.

I'll post more on this later. I'm not looking to release the deck list quite yet, but when I do, you'll be the first to know.

DieMyDarling
09-09-2006, 09:06 AM
At the moment i am testing Crop Rotation, which is very good to find your city or to find the tabernacle vs aggro decks...
I have cuttet 1 tabernacle for this but for the 2nd i dunno what to cut, some 1 has an idea?

The Rack
09-09-2006, 12:54 PM
Somebody need to post the most up to date decklist so we are all on the same page. I will post a very rough build here soon.

DieMyDarling
09-09-2006, 06:52 PM
Somebody need to post the most up to date decklist so we are all on the same page. I will post a very rough build here soon.

the problem is that there is no real "up to tade list". I have tested a bit since the older days of the thread (:P) , but noone else has postet any list since then...

SillyMetalGAT
09-10-2006, 11:57 AM
Has anyone thought of playing Mana Short in this deck? It used to be automatic I thought.

The Rack
09-10-2006, 12:58 PM
Used to be. Upkeep Mana Short can still be deadly so I think testing is needed for it. I'll post a list when I have some time.

DieMyDarling
09-10-2006, 04:55 PM
Ok
this is the list i am testing atm:




4x Stasis
4x Root Maze
2x Ebony Owl Netsuke
3x Howling Mine
3x Tsabo's Web
4x Force of Will
3x Daze
2x Chain of Vapor
1x echoing truth
3x Muddle The Mixture
2x Energy Field
2x Crop Rotation
3x Gigadrowse
1x The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale


4x Elvish Spirit Guide
4x Forsaken City
7x Island
4x Tropical Island
4x Breeding Pool

My Last changes were that i have cuttet the totem and the tangle wire as 1 tabernacle to add crop rotation
and gigadrowse. Gigadrwose works really well in this deck, you can tap all lands of control eot , or tap all the nasty goblins and u can decide when it is out into graveyard ( energy field)

Complete_Jank
09-12-2006, 11:48 PM
Ok, I have worked on the deck long enough and found that it is about the same level as any other build of Stasis, and not viable with out much more work that I don't have time to spend on.


I tried a Black/Blue/White/Green version of Stasis.

I was running Dark Confident, Quirian Ranger, and Court Hussar as creatures.

I ran Gigadrowse, Remand, Stifle, Force of Will, Daze, and Chain of Vapor.

I also used Brainstorm with fetch lands.

Court Hussar was nice at being able to dig, not to mention vigilance.


The deck was ok, but with out the root maze, the lock was not there and it became a delay stategy with hopes of beat down, but all it took was one untapped creature with untarget or pro blue like Goblin Piledriver, and there was a problem. The deck did win against Solidarity though because Gigadrowse, Stifle, Daze, and the mettling mages side board.

Goblins was a problem once they knew what you were playing, they were able to play around a Stasis drop/Gigadrowse, but the board brings in Plague.

Threshold with the Dazes and Mettling Mages was a little annoying, but about 50/50. It comes down to superior SB. If you win the first game, you're almost 100% to win the match, but if you lose game one it isn't that bad.

The funny thing is, I played a type one deck that took top 8 at gencon and won against it with my build, but the deck isn't that great against creature decks that are quick and know you are going to drop a stasis.

DieMyDarling
09-13-2006, 11:22 AM
Could you post the sideboard?
My problem in testing is that no root maze = loss, so i am thinking about adding 1-2 orb of dreams

Complete_Jank
09-13-2006, 05:42 PM
Plague's, Leylines's, Mage's, Cabal Therapy/Duress

Root Maze doesn't work well when you are using Ranger to pay for Stasis, as it also untaps itself and dark confident for beats.

Poron
09-15-2006, 11:16 AM
dark confidant? or you have a way to sacrifice it without mana or when you get the hardlock online you're going to suicide with it.

Imho another good idea is to play 65 cards (or little more then 60) and to have a fast "hardlock" composed by: Stasis, Root Maze, Forsaken City. So, even without damage dealers you can win easily by decking counting on your +5 cards.

which is not bad because you can have this hardlock on turn 2 with 1 Elvish Spirit Guide.

And this "occasional" way for winning can also let you to have the primary strategy which is the howl+owl one. But the fast hardlock+decking is not that bad.

Shadow1798
09-15-2006, 12:09 PM
dark confidant? or you have a way to sacrifice it without mana or when you get the hardlock online you're going to suicide with it.

Imho another good idea is to play 65 cards (or little more then 60) and to have a fast "hardlock" composed by: Stasis, Root Maze, Forsaken City. So, even without damage dealers you can win easily by decking counting on your +5 cards.

which is not bad because you can have this hardlock on turn 2 with 1 Elvish Spirit Guide.

And this "occasional" way for winning can also let you to have the primary strategy which is the howl+owl one. But the fast hardlock+decking is not that bad.

Read the thread. Specifically, this part.



Getting the lock out isn't necessarily slow, winning the game is slow. I have played this version at serious tournaments before, and the problem is that your opponent won't concede if they think they can stall the round out. They are allotted a minimum amount of time (30 seconds, I believe) during each phase of their turn before they can be called for stalling. If they think they can wait until time in the round runs out, they will try. This will leave you with either a draw or a loss, not to mention it ruins what is supposed to be a fun event.

You're never going to actually deck anybody outside of your kitchen table. They will stall for time, and you'll be going home.

Complete_Jank
09-15-2006, 12:37 PM
dark confidant? or you have a way to sacrifice it without mana or when you get the hardlock online you're going to suicide with it.

Imho another good idea is to play 65 cards (or little more then 60) and to have a fast "hardlock" composed by: Stasis, Root Maze, Forsaken City. So, even without damage dealers you can win easily by decking counting on your +5 cards.

which is not bad because you can have this hardlock on turn 2 with 1 Elvish Spirit Guide.

And this "occasional" way for winning can also let you to have the primary strategy which is the howl+owl one. But the fast hardlock+decking is not that bad.

Dark Confident can be bounced when needed. I cast Chain of Vapor targeting Stasis at end of Turn, and sac a land and target Dark Confident.

It is pretty good, the average cast of my deck was 1.13, so it wasn't that bad, matter of fact, I hit 2 force of wills once and still won.

syssc9
09-18-2006, 10:27 AM
@ Shadow1798 - Judging must be way different in your neck of the woods. And maybe I need to download the latest Comp and Floor rules. A while back (when this very issue was raised in a previous Stasis thread here on TS) I consulted 2 different Level 2 judges, and both told me they would consider that kind of stalling as delay of game. One even went so far as to call it "the definition of delay of game."

Perhaps it might be wise to clarify what position you local judges take on this issue at the beginning of any tourney you enter with a Stasis deck. If you don’t get the answer you want, you could always request they push it upstairs. Or maybe we can get one of the judges who hang out on this board to give us a definitive word…

The Rack
09-18-2006, 08:02 PM
Can't a judge call the match because it is a solid lock and the opponent has no way of winning? I thought that's how (or it should be) they dealt with stasis locks?

Goblin Snowman
09-18-2006, 08:41 PM
No, and the same applies for Stax of all kinds, sadly. I have gone 1-0-0 or 0-1-0 every time I play Stax at a tourney, since they can drag out the game in amazing ways that don't break the rules.

Lam_Ang
09-18-2006, 11:34 PM
I've tried to really really try to make a good deck around stasis and still try to figure how to make it competitive. I tried to think about Iron Maiden as the kill condition and give thought of the Ebony Owl Netsuke but "incompletely" dismissed that two cards because of a new deck mostly composed of lands (by the way, the deck doesn't have a sideboard yet).

Most of the time I end up in a ridiculous lock (Stasis, Root Maze and Forsaken City only). After that, then I'm completely dependent on the opponent giving up or waiting for his kill condition if he has (Fireblast for example) or if there's a way he can discard my hand so that I can't remove a card from the game to untap the Forsaken City (remember I'm not drawing extra cards because Howling Mine isn't out yet).

I don't know if a discard is possible when the opponent plays either Overgrown Tomb, Godless Shrine or Watery Grave then pay 2 life so it comes into play untapped then cast a Dark Ritual and a discard spel. Well, if that's possible then definitely I'll be running out of cards at some point unless all the said lands are already out. I've noticed that it's either you play a kill card (w/c is very hard to do) or be content with decking the opponent.

My deck is running 62 cards so that if the ridiculous lock is out then the opponent would deck out first but I really really would like to cut it down to 60.

*Better give Arcane Denial a second thought because a stasis deck has a nature of decking the opponent as well aside from reducing the life total to 0.

The Rack
09-18-2006, 11:42 PM
I asked the starcity judge and he says that shocklnads come into play no matter what, if they pay he 2 or not it is still in play tapped.

Lam_Ang
09-18-2006, 11:55 PM
Thanks for the clarification ------> The Rack

:smile:

mr pink
09-19-2006, 01:08 PM
I used to play stasis alot on a descent tounament level a couple of years ago, the key to locking your opponent really quick is being able to drop (and pay upkeep for) stasis early game. Therefore you need Squandered Resources. I know this will make it a very expensive deck (revised duals and no fetch to replace them) but really cool and fun to play. You should playtest it before you turn down the idea. Include 2 crucible of worlds, gemstone mines and you are ready.

Before squandred rescouces exsisted I played a UW version with trade caravan from homelands (bet you will have to look that one up)... but Root maze is infinitly better than kismet, if you drop it turn 1 you actually stand a chance against gobbo's and burn

Complete_Jank
09-19-2006, 04:45 PM
Can't a judge call the match because it is a solid lock and the opponent has no way of winning? I thought that's how (or it should be) they dealt with stasis locks?

Unfortunately no, but that has worked in my favor before.

In Vintage, I was playing against a Mud/Stax deck and in Game two he Jester's Cap'ed me on turn two for all of my win conditions. He asked me to conceed to him, so we could go to game three. I told him that he would not win the game, and I would not conceede. I mentioned that I would draw the game, and thus win the match.

40 minutes later time was called, and he still had nothing more than lands on the table. I was running combo with 7 artifact board bounce spells main and Recursion so that I could not deck myself. The game was a draw, and there was no stalling except for the fact that I could not win the game, but I could win the match by drawing.


A good player will asess the situation and determin if conceeding or wasting the time is the right decision.

Lam_Ang
09-24-2006, 02:19 PM
Would that work if the deck that has been locked out has no way to avoid decking? I think the deck list can be seen by the judge during or after the match if the opponent has no way of winning or doesn't have the capability to avoid decking himself/herself if he/she decks out first.

fallen_angel_poet2000
09-27-2006, 11:23 PM
This is Robert I just joined here. been playing magic for years and I still play Stasis in my local 1.5 events and I have always made atleast top 4! I run a very strange deck that probably requires some explanation. So here I go. :confused:

1) The lair lands (Dromar's Cavern and Treva's Ruins) bounces a land you have in play back to your hand and they can tap for one of three colors of mana.:cool:

2) Equipoise. This is how I win against most creature based decks. I just remove my opponent's creatures from the game drop Stasis and they never come back into play again. With the Lair lands bouncing my lands I can also remove whatever land I choose to from the game as well. and this goes for every turn during the game. :eek:

3) Free counters. Stasis hates to pay for anything. This version runs 12 "free" counter spells for early, mid, and late game. The number of times I have Dazed an opponent on turn 15 and it was a hard counter is atleast in the low to mid twenties. :laugh:

4) Chronatog is great, until you get that asshole that takes 5 minutes to decide which of the five mountains in his hand to play! :mad: Ebony Owl Netsuke is a better win condition. Hands down. It is a five turn clock. the only other five turn clock was Serra Angel and it costs 5 mana to play! :rolleyes: Stick with Ebony Owl Netsuke.

5) Besides Howling Mine Lim-Dul's Vault is about an 80% I win card if you resolve it through my personal experience. Yours may very. What deck wouldn't mind to stack the top five cards of their deck in exchange for a few points of life. :wink:


4 Daze
4 Foil
4 Force of Will
4 Lim-Dul's Vault
4 Memory Lapse
4 Equipoise
3 Kismet
4 Stasis
2 Ebony Owl Netsuke
3 Howling Mine
4 Dromar's Cavern
4 Forsaken City
12 Island
4 Treva's Ruins


Sideboard
4 Ensnare
4 Chill
4 Submerge
3 Pithing Needle

The sideboard is for my personal metagame. Submerge for Thres, Ensnare for Goblins mostly but it has proven worthwhile against Affinity. Chill for that one person playing straight burn. And Pithing Needle for a catch all card.

I do understand that some people may not understand this style of Stasis but it has worked for me better then any other build in legacy. Flame away please.

Edit: Most Stasis decks work on dropping Kismet then Stasis. Or Stais then after bouncing it playing Kismet and replaying Stasis. This deck works by playing Equipoise, then Stasis, after a few turns you play Ebony Owl Netsuke and if, IF the game goes long enough you drop Kismet. Most players scoop after that!

Mirrislegend
09-27-2006, 11:57 PM
Wow. Equipoise is hot. Really hot. For any control deck running white. It's a Wrath for 1 less mana (tho it comes online the same turn), except it keeps wrathing! fallen_angel_poet2000, for bringing that up, you become my new favorite person. Congrajy. ::runs off to make U/W control viable in legacy::

fallen_angel_poet2000
09-28-2006, 12:25 AM
By the way we should remember that Equipoise does not target. Pro-White creatures can be removed from the game as well.

A brief description of Equipoise works.

Player one: I phase out all your creatures excess lands and artifacts from the game.
Player two: What is that?
Player one: They are removed from the game until your untap step.
Player two: So I get them back?
Player one: As long as you untap.
Player two: O.K.
Player one: I play Stasis. We now skip our untap step.
Player two: That only works once right?
Player one: No. It works every turn.
Player two: Dang it! :mad: :mad:

Complete_Jank
09-28-2006, 08:46 PM
Let me shead a little more light on why Equipoise works and keeps all their stuff out, and keeps removing stuff. Not everyone on here is familure with the deep knowledge of rules in the comprehensive rules.

Your untap step is divided into different sub-steps. (And you thought you just untapped.)

Phasing's sub-step actually takes place before the untap sub-step.

To make it simple, during this sub-step permanents that have phasing, phase out or in. (There are other reasons why things will or will not phase in or out, but I'm not going to get into that..)


It is possible for things to not untap, and things to phase back in. However, Stasis says Players skip their untap step, and Phasing is part of that muti-layered step. For this reason, Phasing is not planned to be brought back any time soon, as it was deemed by the powers that be as to confusing for most players. (That's wizards calling their player base stupid.)

Just figured I'd add

Poron
09-29-2006, 05:39 AM
just a noob question. when a creatures phases IN (i mean, it returns into play) it can attack or it has summoning sickness?

Complete_Jank
09-29-2006, 01:53 PM
just a noob question. when a creatures phases IN (i mean, it returns into play) it can attack or it has summoning sickness?

Creatures that phase in are not affected by summoning sickness.

fallen_angel_poet2000
10-09-2006, 06:52 PM
Anyone bring a Stasis deck to the Duel for Duels over the weekend?

socia02
11-17-2006, 06:03 PM
I find that you don't neccessarily need a "hard lock" for this deck. I've been testing the following list to much effectiveness:

Land (26):
20 islands
3 forsaken City
3 dromar's cavern

Draw/Tutor (13):
4 brainstorm
4 howling mine
2 Kami of the Crescent moon
3 lim-dul's Vault

Counter (10):
4 Force of will
4 daze
2 thwart

Kill (11):
3 ebony owl Netsuke
4 stasis
4 chain of vapor

Lim-dul's vault is AMAZING, it gets you the final piece of the puzzle in order to lock your opponent, and after you have the lock with stasis and ebony owl, you should have 3 0r 4 free counters in hand, plus howling mine in play to draw.

I'm working on a sideboard, which will consist of Meddling mage, Ensnare, Morphling, Feldon's cane, stifle and Chill. This deck beat the piss out of threshold believe it or not. More testing is definitely needed. I'll keep you posted as i develop this more.

DieMyDarling
01-09-2007, 12:57 PM
I have played 2 Tourneys with different lists in the last time.
At first i played the u/g hardlock list i have posted before. I was really unsatisfied with the result and came to the conclusion that a hardlock stasis is not competetive in Legacy at the moment.
Then i saw a list somewhere that plays the quirion and scryb ranger to pay the upkeep cost and kept on working on this idea. I played a tourney last week with the following list:


Lands:
4 Wasteland
4 Tropical Island
2 Flooded Strand
3 Windsweapt Heath
4 Island
2 Forest

Lock:
4 Stasis
2 Back 2 Basics


Creatures:
4 VineLeasher Kudzu
4 Scryb Ranger
4 Quirion Ranger
4 Birds of Paradise
2 Serendib Efreet


Spells
4 Force Of Will
3 Daze
3 Gigadrowse
4 Brainstorm
3 Exploration


Sideboard:
4 Krosan Grip
4 Blue Elemental Blast
1 Back to Basics
3 Umezawas Jitte
3 Tormods crypt

It was 54 players 7 round swiss and played 4:3, winning vs 1 vial goblin, 1 b/w weenie, 1 angelstompy and 1 landstill.
I lost vs 1 grow, 1 vial goblin and 1 bgw survival.
The loss vs grow was kinda sad, because i didnt draw 1 back 2 basics or stasis in all games.
After that Tourney i would make the following changes:

- 3 Gigadrowse
- 2 Serendib Efreet
+ 2 Sword Of FIre and ice
+ 2 Mana Leak
+ 1 Polluted Delta

In this tourney i was sometimes screwed so i decided to put in 1 more Land.
Another problem was that i couldnt handle things like Piledriver once they hit the table. I am going to test it with this changes. Do you have any other ideas?

Poron
01-09-2007, 01:53 PM
some inputs:

Crop rotation (to have another way to pay stasis upkeep)
Ensnare
Maze of Roots (this particularly, why the hell don't you play it??)

DieMyDarling
01-09-2007, 02:02 PM
some inputs:

Crop rotation (to have another way to pay stasis upkeep)
Ensnare
Maze of Roots (this particularly, why the hell don't you play it??)

1.Crop Rotation as a tutor for what?
2. Ensnare is quite nice, but i had no place for it
3.You mean root maze?
Because my lands come into play tapped and i cant pay stasis upkeep cost?

Cait_Sith
01-14-2007, 04:23 PM
It has come to my attention that Kismet is now blue. Discuss.

Poron
01-14-2007, 04:35 PM
root maze to hardlock your opponent and you pay your stasis upkeep with Quirion Ranger+Bird of Paradise or Scryb Ranger+Bop?

Crop Rotation to get Forsaken City? so you can pay upkeep and deal damage with "untapping-creatures"?

and: winning condition? obviously Vinelasher kadzu, time isn't a problem once hardk-locked and in 4-5 turns you can swing to victory.

DieMyDarling
01-16-2007, 02:21 PM
root maze to hardlock your opponent and you pay your stasis upkeep with Quirion Ranger+Bird of Paradise or Scryb Ranger+Bop?

Crop Rotation to get Forsaken City? so you can pay upkeep and deal damage with "untapping-creatures"?

and: winning condition? obviously Vinelasher kadzu, time isn't a problem once hardk-locked and in 4-5 turns you can swing to victory.


The rootmaze is just not any good in this deck. If u play hardlock stasis you need it, but believe me its just not good enough.
In My deck if u have root maze you need a bird of paradise + a ranger to keep on paying the mana. In addition to that u need a second ranger if you want to keep on attacking ( plus the exploration). Root Maze would be just wasted slots...

Poron
01-16-2007, 03:16 PM
imho you don't realize how much Forsaken City could help you. It frees you from needing BoP and with RootMaze, Stasis is a hardlock on its own, indeed.

Crop Rotation + Forsaken to have a second way to pay Stasis is the way for your deck imho, you should test it.

DieMyDarling
01-16-2007, 04:26 PM
I already wrote that hardlock stasis is just too slow for current Legacy...
Of course the forsaken city coukd help to pay for upkeep, but 8 cards are enough though u dont want to draw a forsaken city if u already have a way to pay stasis or dont have the stasis...

dude 666
01-26-2007, 06:30 PM
Hi, im new to this forum, and this is my first post

I was intially intrigued by the idea of reviving the stasis deck when i was browsing through old type 2 decks. i based my first stasis deck on the original, and went on to tinker with it for a long time. I eventually ended up at the same win condition as you all have, ebony owl, except my version was U/W. I was doing alot of testing, and I became increasingly displeased at the speed of the deck, so I started looking for other possible win conditions. It hit me one day to try opalescence, since most of my lock peices were enchantments. As i was tinkering with it more and more, I included enduring ideal, which would act as lock down and tutoring.

This is my deck (its still not finished, im throwing around alot of ideas):

Land/Mana:
4 flooded strand
4 dimir aqueduct
4 forsaken city
4 azorius chancery
4 underground sea
4 tundra
2 azorius signet
2 dimir signet

Enchantments:
1 stasis
1 equipoise
1 opalesence
1 mind over matter
1 zombie infestation
1 seal of cleansing
1 seal of removal
1 priveleged position
1 worship
1 serra's blessing

Other Spells:
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Impulse
2 Intuition
4 Duress
4 Enduring Ideal

Sideboard:
none really, havent done enough testing yet

This is just an idea that needs to be playtested, im sure you guys could make it alot better.

Card Choices:
Enduring Ideal- if i manage to play this, then its pretty much game, also, i can use this to find my silver bullet enchantments
bouncelands/signets- i try to get enduring ideal out as fast as possible, so i use manna accel
stasis- locks them out of the game
serra's blessing- this is what makes opalescence work (i got this idea from one of the first stasis decks which played serra)
equipoise- really really good with stasis, it was explained pretty well already
opalescence- enduring ideal now searches for creatures
mind over matter- helps lock the opponent down, makes all my lands forsaken cities
zombie infestation- alternate win
seal of cleansing- kill problematic artifacts, and gets rid of enchantment creatures
seal of removal- creature removal
privileged position- protects all my enchantments
worship- makes it so that i dont die
impulse/intuition- find enduring ideal
duress/fow-protect enduring ideal

there are alot of good enchantments that i was also considering, namely: kismet, ivory mask, rule of law, energy flux, form of the dragon, ground seal, island sanctuary, energy field, overgrown estate, pyrostatic pillar, sylvan library, but i couldnt find any room for them.

ok, you can tell me what you think, and whether or not this is viable.

Cait_Sith
01-26-2007, 07:04 PM
Ravnica Bouncelands are too slow. Enduring Ideal is too expensive. Privileged Position is too expensive. Mind over Matter is banned. You need Stasis as a 4-of. Serra's Blessing is iffy (especially as a 1-of) Moxen > Signets.

Your draw quite is almost perfect, except you need 4-of to really make Intuition good.

Welcome to the Source.

Poron
01-26-2007, 07:22 PM
Hi, im new to this forum, and this is my first post

I was intially intrigued by the idea of reviving the stasis deck when i was browsing through old type 2 decks. i based my first stasis deck on the original, and went on to tinker with it for a long time. I eventually ended up at the same win condition as you all have, ebony owl, except my version was U/W. I was doing alot of testing, and I became increasingly displeased at the speed of the deck, so I started looking for other possible win conditions. It hit me one day to try opalescence, since most of my lock peices were enchantments. As i was tinkering with it more and more, I included enduring ideal, which would act as lock down and tutoring.

This is my deck (its still not finished, im throwing around alot of ideas):

Land/Mana:
4 flooded strand
4 dimir aqueduct
4 forsaken city
4 azorius chancery
4 underground sea
4 tundra
2 azorius signet
2 dimir signet

Enchantments:
1 stasis
1 equipoise
1 opalesence
1 mind over matter
1 zombie infestation
1 seal of cleansing
1 seal of removal
1 priveleged position
1 worship
1 serra's blessing

Other Spells:
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Impulse
2 Intuition
4 Duress
4 Enduring Ideal

Sideboard:
none really, havent done enough testing yet

This is just an idea that needs to be playtested, im sure you guys could make it alot better.

Card Choices:
Enduring Ideal- if i manage to play this, then its pretty much game, also, i can use this to find my silver bullet enchantments
bouncelands/signets- i try to get enduring ideal out as fast as possible, so i use manna accel
stasis- locks them out of the game
serra's blessing- this is what makes opalescence work (i got this idea from one of the first stasis decks which played serra)
equipoise- really really good with stasis, it was explained pretty well already
opalescence- enduring ideal now searches for creatures
mind over matter- helps lock the opponent down, makes all my lands forsaken cities
zombie infestation- alternate win
seal of cleansing- kill problematic artifacts, and gets rid of enchantment creatures
seal of removal- creature removal
privileged position- protects all my enchantments
worship- makes it so that i dont die
impulse/intuition- find enduring ideal
duress/fow-protect enduring ideal

there are alot of good enchantments that i was also considering, namely: kismet, ivory mask, rule of law, energy flux, form of the dragon, ground seal, island sanctuary, energy field, overgrown estate, pyrostatic pillar, sylvan library, but i couldnt find any room for them.

ok, you can tell me what you think, and whether or not this is viable.

oh ok... well.. I dont know where to start really...

no Enlightned Tutors with all those 1x Enchantments seems quite brainless..
Mind over Matter? In Legacy? It's Banned man...

And more: Zur? Enginereed Plague? Sterlin Grove? Sylvan Library?

Anyway: your decklist CAN be the start of a nice idea, but surely not of a Stasis Deck.

Returning In Thread what about the new blue Kismet? imho it's the way to keep Stasis decks Mono/U dropping green for Root and Rotations and similars..

some Chrome Mox to make the Kismet drop faster and a Stasis to hardlock the game... then in a few turns you can draw a WC. it's easy to handle a match with Kismet and Stasis together in game..

dude 666
01-26-2007, 08:27 PM
ok, thanks everybody for the feedback

sry about the mind over matter, honestly i hadn't checked to see whether or not it was banned (why is it banned by the way)

i think you misunderstood the purpose of my deck, poron.
there are no enlightened tutors, because i dont want the enchantments in my hand, rather, i want them in my library so i can bring them out with enduring ideal. I agree with Cait sith about the moxen, for some reason i was in a type 2 state of mind when i wrote the decklist.
And if i were to replace the signets with moxen, could i replace the bouncelands? I was just trying to get the ideal out as fast as possible.
Privileged position is not too expensive, because i do not plan on hardcasting it, but by bringing it out with ideal, also the reason why no groves were included, privileged position does a better job.
I figure that if i get ideal out between turns 3-4, the game should be very easy to win.
i like the idea of engineered plague, especilly against gobbos.

Cait_Sith
01-26-2007, 08:36 PM
Problem: If you don't get Enduring Ideal then you are screwed. You probably are screwed if you DO get it. 7 Mana epic spells do not a victory make.

Poron
01-26-2007, 08:42 PM
but you really want to play a such idiot deck?

Enduring Ideal as WC?
At the beinning of my upkeep I copy...
Counterspell

oh.. ok next turn..
Arcane Denial
Remand
Force of Will

with Enduring Ideal as WC is pointless...

dude 666
01-26-2007, 09:04 PM
ok, thanks everybody for the feedback

sry about the mind over matter, honestly i hadn't checked to see whether or not it was banned (why is it banned by the way)

i think you misunderstood the purpose of my deck, poron.
there are no enlightened tutors, because i dont want the enchantments in my hand, rather, i want them in my library so i can bring them out with enduring ideal. I agree with Cait sith about the moxen, for some reason i was in a type 2 state of mind when i wrote the decklist.
And if i were to replace the signets with moxen, could i replace the bouncelands? I was just trying to get the ideal out as fast as possible.
Privileged position is not too expensive, because i do not plan on hardcasting it, but by bringing it out with ideal, also the reason why no groves were included, privileged position does a better job.
I figure that if i get ideal out between turns 3-4, the game should be very easy to win.
i like the idea of engineered plague, especilly against gobbos.

dude 666
01-26-2007, 09:05 PM
sry about the double post, internet got screwed up

and thanks for all the negative feedback :)

ill go play some common legacy decks now

Cait_Sith
01-26-2007, 09:08 PM
First, you don't need to play a common deck for it to be good and fun. Try a Proteus staff deck. Hard to play? Yes. Fun stacking your ENTIRE library? Yes!

Poron
01-26-2007, 09:18 PM
Sorry for my rudeness dude666. Your idea is cool, but with a total different idea of the deck.

I try explaining:
1x Enginereed Plague
1x Arcane Laboratory

What do they mean? if you have a way to get them you'll have an easy match vs Solidarity and vs Goblin.

1x Circle of Protection:Red
1x Sylvan Library
1x Words of Worship
1x Words of War

some brainstorm to make it funnier >D etc. etc.

The idea CAN be good, but surely not with Enduring Ideal as WC

run Zur the Inchanter to get every Ench you need MB. :)

dude 666
01-26-2007, 10:43 PM
wow thanks alot
that sounds alot better, 4 mana guy is easier to get out than 7 mana spell (although he is subject to spot removal)
i think thats exactly what was needed to make the deck work.
ill go remake my old deck with zur and put in those enchantments
but as i understand it, you're not making a stasis build, right?

Poron
01-27-2007, 03:51 AM
then what should I say? you have the best decklist I have ever seen! GG

ps: play Sterling Grove and Enlightned Tutor as Tutors and play cheap Enchantments so you don't need Zurs.

No_Life_No_Future
01-27-2007, 07:07 PM
I have mentioned this in a prior stasis thread somewhere... but what about sleeper agent! It seems like a quick enough win condition and it only costs 1 mana.

dude 666
01-28-2007, 01:12 PM
ive been testing out the suggestions, and sleeper agent is not very viable.
owl is alot better, its speeds up your clock 2 times.
also, any stasis deck without howling mine simply will not work. There is too much card disadvantage from the forsaken city. if there are any other cards other than howling mine that would allow for some card advantage, i really think they should be considered, because while youre sitting there with 1 card in hand, waiting for the city to take it out, the opponent can wreak whatever havoc they want.

Poron
01-28-2007, 03:20 PM
the future of stasis (if stasis has a future...) is Mono-U with mox as accelerators and blue Kismet.

PLZ WIZARD GIVE ME GUSH!!!

DieMyDarling
01-28-2007, 04:36 PM
the future of stasis (if stasis has a future...) is Mono-U with mox as accelerators and blue Kismet.



Thats absolutely not right. Why is a kismet better than a Root Maze? Root Maze is dropped turn 1 stasis turn 3-4. Play an early root maze ist just amazing vs fetchlands etc and gives u time to go 4 the lock. In addition to that, a hardlock stasis wont be any good anymore. The future is for sure no Hardlock deck.

Poron
01-28-2007, 05:24 PM
I disagree.

An early Stasis + a 3-4 turn Chain of Vapor + Kismet, is absoutly better then the Rootmaze one.

Why? because my version isn't totally conditioned on Forsaken city. Rootmaze version, instead, is totally based on Forsaken City and if opponent plays a Wasteland turn 1 living it untapped, you lose maaaany turns.

I really don't think Stasis will ever be a Tier 1 deck in Legacy.. not with this cards and with Gush banned..

dude 666
01-28-2007, 06:14 PM
poron, your solution is also not satifactory
chain of vapor is very good, but at most it will buy you a few turns, then you are once again dependent on forsaken city, and then you're pretty much stuck. why is mind over matter banned again?

Poron
01-28-2007, 06:51 PM
no, the question is different.

If you play Rootmaze your lands come into play tapped so you can't use them to pay for Stasis. With Kismet just opponent's lands come into play tapped, so you can pay yours with the lands you drop.

so: Play Lair's Lands such as Dromar's Cavern and similar! they mean: "get back a tapped island so you can mantein Stasis for 2 more turns: 1 paied by the Lair, the second payed by the Island".

etc. etc. I would 100% stay MonoU

dude 666
01-28-2007, 11:33 PM
the problem with that, poron, is that it is so easily disrupted, a simple wasteland or force of will will screw you up, assuming of course that you do actually draw all of your peices. the question is not whether or not to play root maze or kismet, it all depends upon your draw engine, assuming that you do have one. i used to think of stasis as being U/W, but im starting to think it might be a better idea to play green instead of white (or mono blue, for that matter).
green offers you: root maze, sylvan library, crop rotation, living wish (don't know why you would need it....), quirion ranger (!!!!very nice!!!), elvish spirit guide, scryb ranger, birds, and of course green dudes to beat down.

and has anyone played with the idea of sylvan library + dark confidant?
i think that seems really cool, also tangle wire.
im gonna have to test all this out

Poron
01-29-2007, 04:51 AM
telling the truth mine is the most solid idea/build... the green one is based on creatures (and everyone in legacy has answears to a 0/1 "combo" creature) and Forsaken City.

In my deck I would surely run 3 Forsaken City to help me, but they won't be my only way to pay stasis. With Kismet only opponent's lands come into play tapped so you can pay with new lands you drop.. have you ever played a stasis deck before Planeshift? When Forsaken City didn't exist? That's the idea. Blue Kismet to keep it MonoU and many bounce to untap. (Old School bounces such as Boomerang and Chain of Vapor)

dude 666
01-29-2007, 05:47 PM
i dont think your deck will be very successful, but i know mine has been.
this is the decklist:

Lands:
4 windswept heath
4 yavimaya coast
4 tropical island
4 bayou

Creatures:
4 birds of paradise
3 quirion ranger
3 scryb ranger
3 vinelasher kudzu

Countermagic:
4 force of will
4 misdirection
4 daze

Other:
3 energy field
4 impulse
4 brainstorm
4 lim dul's vault

Stasis:
4 stasis!

i got alot of the ideas from previous posts, namely diemydarling's decklist.

this deck plays its green dudes turns 1-2, then goes looking for stasis. this is very easy, since there is lim dul's vault, impulse, and brainstorm.
also, all of the counters in the deck are free, which is a must for any stasis deck
i also included energy field, because it owns burn and aggro (not really burn though, since they can easily kill one of my dudes, but it buys me some turns anyway)
the manabase is pretty selfexplanatory, heaths are there for manafixing and to speed up kudzu

Cavius The Great
01-30-2007, 04:10 AM
i dont think your deck will be very successful, but i know mine has been.
this is the decklist:

Lands:
4 windswept heath
4 yavimaya coast
4 tropical island
4 bayou

Creatures:
4 birds of paradise
3 quirion ranger
3 scryb ranger
3 vinelasher kudzu

Countermagic:
4 force of will
4 misdirection
4 daze

Other:
3 energy field
4 impulse
4 brainstorm
4 lim dul's vault

Stasis:
4 stasis!

i got alot of the ideas from previous posts, namely diemydarling's decklist.

this deck plays its green dudes turns 1-2, then goes looking for stasis. this is very easy, since there is lim dul's vault, impulse, and brainstorm.
also, all of the counters in the deck are free, which is a must for any stasis deck
i also included energy field, because it owns burn and aggro (not really burn though, since they can easily kill one of my dudes, but it buys me some turns anyway)
the manabase is pretty selfexplanatory, heaths are there for manafixing and to speed up kudzu

Your build looks solid. The only issue I have is the Yavimaya Coast. Painlands suck in Legacy, take it from me. I would probably replace them with 4 fetches. With more fetches you can get all the duals you need and feed the Kudzu at the same time. You might also want to consider Breeding Pool as a 1 or 2-of if you think that additional blue mana is needed.

DieMyDarling
01-30-2007, 09:43 AM
The main different between your and my decklist, is that u go straight for stasis. I have won many games without dropping a stasis. You should definately replace the coasts with fetchies. Fetchies just rule with kudzu so as the rangers do. I run additionaly the exploration that help me to act like there is no stasis for me with multiple ranger. What i dont like in your list is the energy field. I have tested them too, but they just suck. You cant fetch / counter / do anything without destroying them.
Here is my current decklist:


Lands (20)
4 Wasteland
4 Tropical Island
2 fetch blue
3 fetch green
4 Island
3 Forest


Lock (6)
4 Stasis
2 Back 2 Basics


Creatures(17)
4 VineLeasher Kudzu
4 Scryb Ranger
4 Quirion Ranger
2 Serendib Efreet / Sea Drake / Iwamori of the open fist ( still testin this slot)
3 Birds of Paradise


Spells(18)
4 Force Of Will
3 Daze
2 Umezawas JItte
4 Brainstorm
3 Exploration
2 Stifle


@ Poron:
Though you say i would run that and that u guess you have never played stasis in any tournament yet. But you keep saying your decklist would be the best but ours is not. Maybe you should think about that fact?

Poron
01-30-2007, 11:32 AM
I fell your decklist sucks because a StP on Kudzu would definitly break your plans as a 1/1 regenerating creature would do too..

The only way your deck can beat a NORMAL (not a good one..) deck with a normal player is to play Stasis very soon with Exploration and a Ranger
And that lock isn't bad, at all, with Kismet or Rootmaze if becomes a very good hardlock, but without Stasis i really can't see how you can win vs a normal/good deck... your only threath is Vinelasher that can be burnt as 1/1 (lihtning bolt, fire ice, stp, etc. etc.) when comes into play.. and some random Sea Drake/Iwamori (obiously in a Stasis deck you can't play Serendib.. 1 damage x turn is too bad here..).

Anyway: i'm not saying that my list (which list anyway..?) is better than yours I just say that the best HARDLOCK you can find with Stasis nowadays is MonoU and plays 3 BlueKismet MD with mana accelerators to drop it soon...

Yours isn't a Hardlock version so.. if you feel you can win many matchups with that list: good for you! and good luck!

IMHO: I really can't see how you can win vs Goblin and Solidarity really.. not to mention Threshold decks.. but these are just opinions.

dude 666
01-30-2007, 02:31 PM
@ cavius- i agree with you, fetchlands are better, i was just afraid of burn and too much life loss. and about breeding pools, i tried those out, and they suck so much, they have 0 synergy with my untappers, so i replaced them with painlands, but ill fix it up.

@diemydarling- that is the reason i like my build, stasis is dropped very early, even if i dont have kudzu in play. After stasis is dropped, i just wait it out, fill my hand with countermagic, draw a kudzu, and gg. energy field was just a test slot, but it has worked out pretty well. i play against alot of gobbos, sometimes enchantress, and other aggro decks, so it buys me alot of turns, and when i have to let one go, ill have already drawn another one by then. i think this is really the metagame slot. (if worst comes to worst, i can always use the energy fields to pitch for fow and mis'd.)

@poron- since this deck plays out like aggro at the beginning, no one ever throws their creature removal at kudzu. Once you drop stasis though, they realize theyre in deep shit, but by that time you have many counters in your hand. also, you can simply not play kudzu, or let it get killed, it doesnt matter to you, you have more in your deck anyway, and youve got all the time in the world. and, i believe some said this earlier, there is no such thing as a hardlock, so stop preaching about your holy mono blue hardlock. (btw, regeneration makes them tap)

Poron
01-30-2007, 02:54 PM
(regeneration makes them tap)--> then you surely need a Stasis not to get owned by a simple 1/1 regenerating..

Actually I like your list, really. It seems very funny to play with all those untapping effects combinated with Stasis, but I would add something to make me safer when getting the control: play Rootmaze -___-

Anyway: this is my idea if you feel you don't need it, np you're probably right I haven't tested your list..

DieMyDarling
01-30-2007, 06:09 PM
The only way your deck can beat a NORMAL (not a good one..) deck with a normal player is to play Stasis very soon with Exploration and a Ranger


And that is exactly not right. I win many games without dropping a stasis. I won several games in the last tourney vs VG and 4c Landstill without playing a stasis. It is right that the VG matchup was quite bad preboard. But if you have the blasts and jitte its is not that bad anymore. I played 2:1 and 1:2 last tourney vs VG. I would kile to have good critics on the list, but not if its untested...

Complete_Jank
01-30-2007, 06:43 PM
And that is exactly not right. I win many games without dropping a stasis. I won several games in the last tourney vs VG and 4c Landstill without playing a stasis. It is right that the VG matchup was quite bad preboard. But if you have the blasts and jitte its is not that bad anymore. I played 2:1 and 1:2 last tourney vs VG. I would kile to have good critics on the list, but not if its untested...

I am guessing that wasn't the BHWC version of 4c Landstill.

6 months ago I spent a few months working on Stasis decks with many different types and builds.

Almost 50% of the practice matches came down to resolving a Stasis at an oportune time, and the overall match-up is horrible.

DieMyDarling
01-31-2007, 10:48 AM
I am guessing that wasn't the BHWC version of 4c Landstill.

6 months ago I spent a few months working on Stasis decks with many different types and builds.

Almost 50% of the practice matches came down to resolving a Stasis at an oportune time, and the overall match-up is horrible.

I am not sure about the landstill version as i havent worked on any landstill build yet. its was ugbw with deed and wog main.
The point is, that i run 2 back to basics in the Mainboard and 1 more in ths db which really help here.

Poron
01-31-2007, 10:51 AM
Landstill is totally the most easy matchup you can find.. 4x Back to Basic..