[EDH] Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed (MBC) [Archive]

Blitzbold

01-10-2010, 05:04 AM

When I first stumbled across Xiahou Dun while browsing some decklists I immediately fell in love with this guy. I played MBC during Odyssey-time Standard (for those who have been around) and liked the archetype since then.

In my opinion, Xhiaou Dun is a great general for this kind of deck. Not only is he a recursion engine all of his own, he also makes for a formidable attacker for dealing 21. The basic strategy is to control the early game while slowly generating CA. Xiahou himself helps here by recurring removal or card draw. Later on Xiahou gets back the big spells which will end the game quickly when resolving unmolested. For example, in the last game I played I shot one player with a Mirari-copied Corrupt.

The list I'll present to you is not new, since I already used the deck for quite some games. So most of the choices survived my first attempts to improve the deck. However, I'd really like to hear your suggestions for further improvements.

Please note that this is a deck for multiplayer. Like my build of Rofellos I want it to be strong, but not overly powerful. Because of this I already removed some cards which were included in my first version and which I'll list at the end of this post

Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed

Instants (5)
Corpse Dance
Rend Flesh
Shred Memory
Tendrils of Corruption
Vampiric Tutor

Sorceries (21)
Barter in Blood
Beacon of Unrest
Beseech the Queen
Brainspoil
Chainer's Edict
Consume Spirit
Corrupt
Damnation
Decree of Pain
Demonic Tutor
Dimir Machinations
Drain Life
Dregs of Sorrow
Grim Discovery
Mind Sludge
Mutilate
Night's Whisper
Profane Command
Promise of Power
Sign in Blood
Syphon Mind

enchantments (6)
Dawn of the Dead
Necromancy
Necropotence
Phyrexian Arena
Polluted Bonds
The Abyss

creatures (14)
Avatar of Woe
Big Game Hunter
Dimir House Guard
Endless Cockroaches
Fleshbag Marauder
Helldozer
Herald of Leshrac
Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Magus of the Abyss
Nezumi Graverobber
Shriekmaw
Stronghold Overseer
Undead Gladiator
Visara the Dreadful

planeswalker (2)
Liliana Vess
Sorin Markov

artifacts (12)
Crucible of Worlds
Expedition Map
Mirari
Nevinyrral's Disk
Oblivion Stone
Sensei's Divining Top
Sol Ring
Sun Droplet
Lightning Greaves
Skullclamp

Duplicant
Solemn Simulacrum

lands (39)
Barren Moors
Cabal Coffers
Dust Bowl
High Market
Maze of Ith
Phyrexian Tower
Polluted Mire
Swamp x30
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Volrath's Stronghold

statistics: http://deckstats.net/deck-14277-b6efe925bed78f1696d586eeafb063f4-de.html

There you are, 100 cards of nearly all-black evilness. Obvious synergies are Xiahou + Dawn of the Dead, which gets quite stupid with Skullclamp thrown into the mix. Corpse Dance + Fleshbag Marauder is mana-intensive, but also very good. There are some cards, though, which I don't quite like, but which I left in the deck for now to see which suggestions I'll get from you all.

Some cards which I included in the first draft, but dismissed for one or another reason (reason stated in brackets):

Cremate (seems too weak)
Grim Tutor (too powerful; white bordered)
Imperial Seal (too powerful; white bordered)
Innocent Blood (borderline weak, isn't it?)
Myojin of Night's Reach (annoying, antisocial, creates a big crosshairon his controller)
Skeletal Scrying (doesn't fit with Xiahou, does it?)
Slaughter Pact (too narrow (?))
Sudden Death (too narrow (?))

Here are some cards I'd really like to fit into the deck, but -as always- don't know what to cut:

Hero's Demise
Slaughter - too narrow?

Bitter Ordeal - Sadistic Sacrament or Nightmare Incursion might be better
Ancient Craving - replacement for Necropotence?
Phthisis - strong, but quite expensive

Contamination - seems like douchbaggery, doesn't it?
Enslave - would be great
Gate to Phyrexia
Gravestorm
Haunted Crossroads - needed?

Bane of the Living
Dread
Magus of the Coffers
Plaguebearer
Reiver Demon
Thrashing Wumpus

Mind's Eye - needed?
Paradise Plume
Phyrexian Totem
Sword of Light and Shadow
Sword of Fire and Ice

The most recent changes was cutting Leechridden Swamp plus a basic Swamp for adding the two cycling lands, as I missed some kind of 'flow' when playing the deck. Though there are still quite some tutors, I missed drawing extra cards. Also, having multiple 'tap to destroy'-creatures (Avatar, Visara) seems to be redundant

Now I'd like to hear your comments and suggestions. Your input is highly appreciated!

badjuju

01-14-2010, 06:35 PM

I play Xiahou Dun right now, and he is quite amazing. I used to run Maga, but made the switch recently and the recursion is borderline ridiculous. Basically, if they don't take you out quickly or hinder your progress in a serious way (I'm talking Armageddon), you have inevitability on your side.

The core cards in your deck are very similar to mine, so let me go over a few of what I think work and don't work in this deck. Also note that I play this deck in both duels and multiplayer (it's actually pretty good in duels, except vs super tier 1 decks).

Graveyard Recursion

The key to Xiahou Dun that I've realized is landing a graveyard recursion engine. From then on, you'll have all the removal in the world to deal with any threats coming your way.

Corpse Dance
Phyrexian Reclamation
Haunted Crossroads

Grim Discovery
Profane Command

Corpse Dance is one of the best cards in this deck (for obvious reasons). The other two are enchantments (and not many people run dedicated slots for enchantment removal in EDH) that work well with almost every other creature in black for their powerful CIP effects. Grim Discovery doubles as a way to return Cabal Coffers and Profane Command turns into an infinite burn combo with Xiahou Dun (play command, return xiahou dun, sac xiahou dun, get command back, do it again next turn). Dawn of the Dead is not bad either, but I'm hard pressed for slots in my deck right now.

Removal

The balance between spot removal, sacrifice effects, and sweepers is something to keep in mind. For me, I have a lot more sacrifice and spot removal for generals because I don't play against very many creature-heavy decks. Do not overlook the power of cheap spot removal because of the ability to handle big threats early game before the shit hits the fan (note Zur and the likes).

Innocent Blood
Hero's Demise
Chainer's Edict
Barter in Blood
Tendrils of Corruption
Altar of Shadows
The Abyss

Fleshbag Marauder
Gatekeeper of Malakir

Fleshbag Marauder is an MVP in this deck for its nasty recursive ability with the graveyard abusing cards. The Abyss is absolutely amazing, although it draws a lot of hate lol. Altar of Shadows may seem weak but it's actually been something that my opponents have become quite scared of. It's just there forever and a huge threat. I'm not a big fan of Avatar of Woe / Visara, maybe just because I've never felt the need for them. I also try to run as few creatures that will get me into deep trouble if people around the table are sporting Bribery.

Sweepers

One of the main reasons to be playing black. I hear a lot of moaning and groaning whenever I kill stuff - what the hell else do you want my color to do? lol

Damnation
Mutilate
Decree of Pain
Plague Wind (Overwhelming Forces)
Dregs of Sorrow

Nevinyrral's Disk
Oblivion Stone

Crypt Rats
Kagemaro, First to Suffer
Reiver Demon

The sweepers above are pretty staple (imo). Nev's Disk and Stone are there for problematic enchantments. The creature sweepers are all preference.

Drains

These are how I usually win. I sorta just keep recurring burn spells and shoot people down, and they can't deal with it lol. They also double as removal in a pinch, so I see absolutely no downside on trying to max out the number of these.

Corrupt
Drain Life
Consume Spirit
Soul Burn
Profane Command (already listed)

I personally do not feel like Maga is needed, as he can't be returned with Xiahou Dun (and he doesn't give you any life back). You could definitely run him in place of Soul Burn if you felt like it though.

Discard

The other reason to be playing black. A single resolved twist will take a player out of the game and allow you to do whatever you want to him.

Mind Twist
Mind Shatter
Mind Sludge

If you play more multiplayer, Syphon Mind is fine, as is Cabal Conditioning. I haven't run any Sadistic Sacrament or Nightmare Incursion, but if your meta has a lot of combo I'd definitely consider it.

Card Draw

I tried to max out on these as well.

Sign in Blood
Night's Whisper
Ambition's Cost
Ancient Craving
Promise of Power

Phyrexian Arena
Necropotence

Necro is always in debate, but I've had a good time with the card, so I'm not cutting it yet.

Tutors

Vampiric Tutor
Demonic Tutor
Diabolic Tutor
Beseech The Queen

If I had Grim Tutor or Imperial Seal, I'd probably run them. They're really too awesome to pass up.

Mana Ramp

I am heavily debating running brown mana to keep up with the ridiculous speed of the decks I play against. It was either this, or running more cheap removal, of which I chose the latter. Brown mana doesn't help with the heavy amount of skulls in our casting costs.

Sol Ring
Journeyer's Kite
Extraplanar Lens
Gauntlet of Power
Doubling Cube

Cabal Coffers
Petrified Field
Vesuva

Expedition Map

Ideally you'd like to get a coffers into play and go nuts, but that won't happen reliably till later in the game. Petrified Field and Vesuva come in if you really need to have a nasty turn and take out multiple players by resetting/copying coffers. Expedition Map helps you find these, Strip/Waste, or Boseiju against u-based decks.

Walkers

Do they even need an introduction?

Liliana Vess
Sorin Markov

Creatures

Of those not already listed, here are the utility creatures I have around.

Withered Wretch
Graveborn Muse
Solemn Simulacrum
Myojin of Night's Reach
Magus of the Coffers

Of these cards, Graveborn Muse and Magus of the Coffers are both highly cuttable. Anything that doesn't have immediate board impact I tend to value a lot less in this deck, especially with the amount of symmetrical removal and graveyard abuse around. Coffers, as much as people swear by him, I've find pretty underwhelming. He never untaps lol. I'm only playing them because I have foils of them, but otherwise they'd probably be slots for more removal/discard. As for your list, I don't really like Endless Cockroaches or Magus of the Abyss. Shriekmaw, Nezumi Graverobber, and Undead Gladiator are fine though (I'd almost consider playing them, along with Nekrataal).

And of course the rest of the deck, Swamps, Mirari, Top and other misc lands. I also have Hatred in the deck, which is a great tutor target post-twisting to finish the game on the spot.

Looking at your suggested cards ...

-Skeletal Scrying I cut because of the reason you stated.
-Slaughter Pact is good. Really good, actually.
-Hero's Demise and Ancient Craving I'm already running.
-Pthisis never did it for me. Too expensive and the effect is almost irrelevant here.
-Contamination is real douchebaggery. Not going there lol.
-Enslave is solid.
-Gate to Phyrexia - good catch, but I'm afraid we value our creatures too much to just throw them away.
-Bane of the Living I'd totally run over Magus of the Coffers.
-Not impressed by Dread of Korlash.
-Thrashing Wumpus - meh. Crypt Rats does this, and so does Pestilence.
-I run Mind's Eye in multiplayer. I'm not impressed by it in this deck. Call me crazy, but with the amount of draw I already have I'm doing more important things with my mana every turn.
-Equipment - not a fan. We just don't need to win via beats. We slam the opponent hard with powerful black spells over and over again till they can't afford to keep playing their general and we strip their hands clean. From then on you can do whatever you want to win.

For now I'm probably going to cut Mind's Eye and Magus of the Coffers for a Slaughter Pact and a Grim Tutor and possibly Vesuva for another Swamp.

This is based on my experiences and playstyle, so take what you will. I'm always looking for new suggestions for the deck though.

dahcmai

01-14-2010, 07:29 PM

badjuju

01-19-2010, 04:11 PM

Here's one for you. It's terrible in normal play, but in EDH it's stupid good and happens to fit your theme amazingly well. It's one of the best cards I have found for black if you play multiplayer EDH.

Planeswalker's Scorn (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=25888)

It's not bad, but I'm running out of room for stuff. The only slot I could think of replacing is Altar of Shadows. Altar has its purpose, but that purpose is really only for a way to deal with Iona. It's still good on its own, but my god is it slow.

Also, this is copied from the Maga thread:

A lot of the time I always think about tutoring for a cool combo, but then I just tutor for Sorin or Twist and end the game lolool. They can't counter Xiahou Dun forever!!! Tutoring for a recursion effect is just as good, but only in mutliplayer where you have time to continuously sac him to re-tutor for other things. That said, I should probably be running Grim Tutor. Not as big a fan of Imperial Seal or Cruel Tutor though.

Against bad decks you can just tutor for Hatred and win the next turn.

EDIT:

I totally started typing this at work and turned off my computer without publishing it. I just wanted to mention some cards that I felt were overall just lackluster in the deck. Black is a color of business. Every spell has a high impact on the gamestate. I don't think we should bother playing some of the weaker ramp spells and/or over-costed, redundant spells and instead playing business spells (ie. more removal and discard)

With that said, I think these cards are up for review (after extensive play):

-Solemn Simulacrum (great with recursion effects, but his role is minimal at best)
-Kagemaro, First to Suffer (not bad, but still on the expensive side)
-Altar of Shadows (too expensive)
-Magus of the Coffers (slow and clunky - if you hit 5 mana you're already in pretty good shape to do whatever you want)
-Sol Ring (unnecessary ramp - also a lot of our black spells require only B or have heavy B requirements in their casting costs)
-Dregs of Sorrow (expensive)

Feel free the counter these arguments. They're not bad cards, in all honesty, and you'd actually be hard pressed to find cards that will replace them. I'm just stating what I find as somewhat underwhelming.

Koby

01-21-2010, 04:19 AM

badjuju

01-22-2010, 01:57 AM

I play using French lists which bans Sol Ring/Mana Crypt as it is. However, in circles that allow it, Sol Ring can't be beat. There are still a ton of artifacts that can be accelerated with the aid of Sol Ring.

Solemn Simulacrum is also important in the ramping function, and he draws a card when you sac him. I've used "Jens" + Dimir House Guard to help the mana engine go infinite with Corpse Dance (ya ya i know 3 card combo, really only 2 since you can use DHG to tutor up Jens, then go nuts).

Resounding "meh" on that combo. If I were running Dimir House Guard I'd rather just play Grim Tutor instead. And even if I was running Dimir House Guard, fetching out Jens is probably not what I'll be doing most the time (The Abyss comes to mind). But don't get me wrong, it's good, but that kind of card advantage isn't what I feel like the deck needs.

Sol Ring is probably fine, it's just such a bad topdeck that I don't want to run it. This deck doesn't really have early power plays - it builds up steadily and uses big ramp spells to finish the game. To support this, I lowered my curve and run a bunch of cheap removal spells so that I can deal with fast generals early in the game. I've been running Mind Stone again, which is hardly a proper substitute but at least it cycles.

Here is my current list. I made a few changes, including the removal of Wasteland (there's just not that much stuff I need to destroy - I'd rather just tutor for my Strip Mine if I ever need it) and Petrified Field (what does Xiahou Dun do again?).

Changes I'm considering:

-Plague Wind
-Kagemaro, First to Suffer
-Magus of the Coffers
-Mind Stone
-Solemn Simulacrum
-Altar of Shadows

+Overwhelming Forces
+Grim Tutor
+Necrologia
+Sol Ring
+Twisted Abomination / Undead Gladiator
+Call to the Grave / Kuon, Ogre Descendant

People usually don't play creature-heavy decks, so those sacrifice effects are brutal, although Call to the Grave and Kuon both require a setup. Thawing Glaciers could probably replace Vesuva - that land is awful half the time I draw it and overkill the other half. Necrologia might make its cut somewhere too...maybe. Yawgmoth's Will is probably overkill too, but I've never been sad to draw it. And Lastly, Helldozer actually tickles my fancy.

// Lands
30 [CS] Snow-Covered Swamp
1 [PLC] Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 [TSP] Vesuva
1 [OD] Deserted Temple
1 [FNM] Cabal Coffers
1 [4E] Strip Mine
1 [CNF] Reliquary Tower
1 [SH] Volrath's Stronghold
1 [CHK] Boseiju, Who Shelters All

// Creatures
1 [LRW] Liliana Vess
1 [PLC] Magus of the Coffers
1 [VI] Crypt Rats
1 [FNM] Withered Wretch
1 [ZEN] Gatekeeper of Malakir
1 [MR] Reiver Demon
1 [CHK] Myojin of Night's Reach
1 [ALA] Fleshbag Marauder
1 [LE] Graveborn Muse
1 [SOK] Kagemaro, First to Suffer
1 [MR] Solemn Simulacrum

// Spells
1 [SHM] Beseech the Queen
1 [OV] Necropotence
1 [8E] Phyrexian Arena
1 [8E] Plague Wind
1 [SC] Decree of Pain
1 [US] Corrupt
1 [MR] Promise of Power
1 [TO] Mind Sludge
1 [PLC] Damnation
1 [TO] Mutilate
1 [MR] Barter in Blood
1 [8E] Diabolic Tutor
1 [ON] Syphon Mind
1 [ZEN] Sorin Markov
1 [TSP] Gauntlet of Power
1 [TSB] Mirari
1 [A] Nevinyrral's Disk
1 [MR] Oblivion Stone
1 [FD] Crucible of Worlds
1 [FD] Doubling Cube
1 [CHK] Journeyer's Kite
1 [ZEN] Expedition Map
1 [P2] Ancient Craving
1 [FNM] Chainer's Edict
1 [P3] Ambition's Cost
1 [9E] Consume Spirit
1 [LRW] Profane Command
1 [OV] Drain Life
1 [MOR] Mind Shatter
1 [FD] Night's Whisper
1 [A] Demonic Tutor
1 [ZEN] Grim Discovery
1 [4E] Mind Twist
1 [OD] Innocent Blood
1 [TSP] Tendrils of Corruption
1 [VI] Vampiric Tutor
1 [7E] Dregs of Sorrow
1 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
1 [M10] Sign in Blood
1 [MR] Extraplanar Lens
1 [US] Yawgmoth's Will
1 [EX] Hatred
1 [MM] Haunted Crossroads
1 [WL] Mind Stone
1 [TE] Corpse Dance
1 [UL] Phyrexian Reclamation
1 [IN] Soul Burn
1 [BOK] Hero's Demise
1 [MR] Altar of Shadows
1 [LG] The Abyss

// Sideboard
SB: 1 [P3] Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed

Nightmare

01-22-2010, 12:26 PM

FYI - before you play Overwhelming Forces, please read the Oracle text.

Blitzbold

01-22-2010, 12:52 PM

Overhelming Forces' Oracle text is the reason it's not in my list.

badjuju

01-22-2010, 01:36 PM

FYI - before you play Overwhelming Forces, please read the Oracle text.

Oh holy shit that is BAD.
Okay it's still alright, but it just went down so many notches in my book that I don't think I want to play it anymore.

As it is now though, I don't even know how badly I want to keep Plague Wind in. My deck doesn't really care about its creatures at all, and I guess I run enough removal/sweep effects to go without it.

I also decided Necrologia wasn't worth the slot, so changes would probably more resemble:

-Plague Wind
-Magus of the Coffers
-Mind Stone
-Solemn Simulacrum

+Grim Tutor
+Twisted Abomination
+Call to the Grave
+Thawing Glaciers

Still debating the Sol Ring and Mana Crypt slots. I'll update after I've played a bunch more games.

Nightmare

01-22-2010, 01:55 PM

Oh holy shit that is BAD.
Okay it's still alright, but it just went down so many notches in my book that I don't think I want to play it anymore.

That's generally the response people have when they read it. There's a reason you don't see it in many lists.

badjuju

01-24-2010, 06:33 AM

Super minor update - played a handful of games vs my friend's Jenara deck today. Not the most broken of decks, but it's everything you'd expect out of a 3-color control deck with a pretty fast clock at that.

My MVPs were The Abyss and Call to the Grave. Sacrifice effects are absolutely brutal (Call to the Grave), and laugh at the sight of Lightning Greaves. Thawing Glaciers would have been awesome post-Armageddon, so I'll be sure to have that in there for next time. I thought Deserted Temple would be better than Petrified Field (to combo with Coffers), but that just doesn't happen with all the Strips/Wastes going around. Crucible never sticks around long either. I also feel like I'm capped at card drawing spells - I really have too many of them haha. I would still like to add a Grim Tutor, as tutors are absolutely insane with Xiahou Dun.

That said, some NEW underwhelming cards -

> Myojin of Night's Reach (costly - by the time it happens opponents usually have an empty hand)
> Crypt Rats (only situationally useful)
> Hatred (never wanted to go all in, though I suppose it should stay)
> Altar of Shadows (again - so freaking expensive. If you can cast and activate this in the same turn, you probably already won. Sacrifice effects are just much stronger imo)

So yea, if there are any other enchantments around that are powerful for creature removal, I'd like to hear about them as a proper replacement for Altar of Shadows. Even as an out to Iona (which can also be answered by the plethora of sacrifice effects in my deck), it's fairly over-costed. I want to put Kuon in here but I don't seem him flipping that easily. Gonna try out Death Cloud and see how well it goes, mainly as another amazing sacrifice effect.

Otherwise, I'm fairly happy with the deck as it is. It's just being nitpicky about cards #95-99 at this point - I'm sold with the rest of the list.

badjuju

01-25-2010, 04:28 AM

Another update! Xiahou Dun takes a 4-player free-for-all tonight!

My friend was piloting the deck but I was sitting behind him the whole time. The opposing generals were: Sliver Legion, Brion Stoutarm, and Ascendant Evincar.

The game started out pretty mellow - Slivers played Survival, we tutored and played Necropotence, and Acendant Evincar acting as a political douchebag trying to get the Brion player to destroy our Necro instead of his Extraplanar Lens (which he eventually did) even though our SC-Swamps weren't affected by his regular Swamps. We start sweeping the board over and over again, which doesn't really let anyone develop. We get Mind Shattered (while Necro was still in play), RFGing our recently tutored Cabal Coffers (ouch). Luckily Xiahou Dun is amazing and we keep bringing him back with Haunted Crossroads and re-using Demonic Tutor to fetch up mana-ramping spells like Gauntlet of Power and Extraplanar Lens. The Evincar player was just all about trying to get us killed, so we decided to end that treat quickly. An attack from Korlash and Nekrataal sent us to 10, but he was dead as soon as we untapped. We played Doubling Cube, made tons of mana (38 I think, even w/o Coffers!), tutored for Sorin, played Sorin, took him down to 10, played Xiahou Dun, got back tutor, then tutored for Corrupt to kill him. Eventually we had enough mana to Sludge one guy and Mind Twist the other, followed by a tutor for Mirari, played and sacrificed Xiahou Dun for Sorin, played Sorin to send one guy down to 10 life, then returned Xiahou Dun again with Corpse Dance (only to get back tutor for Consume Spirit), which we then played and copied with Mirari to kill both remaining players.

Awesome? I think yes.

We all agreed that these were pretty unimpressive cards: Journeyer's Kite, Altar of Shadows, Crypt Rats, Hatred. What to replace them with? Not sure yet, but definitely not more draw. More tutors would be good (because tutors are just THAT insane with Xiahou Dun), but that's all I can really think of for now. I guess I could also use a few more strong utility creatures - stuff like Twisted Abomination turned out to be golden, and I think I might want to run Undead Gladiator now (since he's so great to cycle through your deck and at the same time keep Call to the Grave up). If I find anything else worthwhile, expect me to update this post.

Cards of Consideration (4 new slots available) -

- Helldozer (okay this guy might be mean, but he can randomly be amazing in several matchups)
- Korlash, Heir to Blackblade (fatty with regenerate - weakest of the bunch)
- Coffin Queen (make use of the stuff you kill)
- Grim Tutor (anyone that has played this deck will attest that a tutor in the yard means you'll be re-using that thing at least 10 more times with Xiahou Dun :P)
- Undead Gladiator (insanely good utility for helping you develop in the early game)
- Plaguebearer (XX might be a bit much to pay - still not sure if this is better than Crypt Rats / Altar of Shadows)
- Death Cloud (brutal card when played at the correct time - pretty strong tutor target if you ask me)

Of this list, it looks like Undead Gladiator and Grim Tutor are the only things for sure, with Helldozer and Death Cloud as runner ups (not sure if I want to part with Journeyer's Kite yet - it's useful for getting back out of an Armageddon). The rest are either just cute or not necessary. I'd like to hear what you guys think.

Kevinandhobbes

01-25-2010, 07:10 AM

badjuju

01-25-2010, 01:55 PM

I was the slivers player in this game and I have to say that both Undead Gladiator and Grim Tutor would be really really good. And since it appeared to me that your deck was pretty pimped, in the best of worlds you could also add in an Imperial Seal. Since you're also bringing back Grim tutor I figure that your aforementioned hesitance due to power reasons is fading. Also, I think that both Death Cloud and Helldozer would be viable and that both are nuts. Death Cloud is probably more fair, but Helldozer is targeted, so... either one will really do. Also why don't you think about running Insidious Dreams, Phyrexian Etchings, and I think we mentioned this during the game, but Temporal Extortion might not be bad with all of the drain life esque stuff you play. And the Ascendant Evincar guy was a dick.

EDIT: And Word of Command.

Hey thanks for your response!
I'm sorry you had to go against two MBC decks as Slivers. Kept getting hit by collateral damage the entire game :(

As for the card suggestions:

- I don't play Insidious Dreams or Imperial Seal because they put on top and not in hand. When you're trying to go nuts with Xiahou Dun, that just doesn't cut it. Cruel Tutor falls into this same category. Not saying that these cards wouldn't be good on their own, but I just feel like adding in one more tutor would give the deck the right amount. I'll think about adding in Imperial Seal for pimpness - when I get one lol.

- The only reason Helldozer isn't in the deck yet is cause I do play against a few mono-colored decks in my group where he just doesn't do as much. That isn't to say that he can't get rid of annoying stuff like Riptide Laboratory or Kor Haven without the need to recur Strip Mine, so maybe he might make the cut. He is also a zombie for Call to the Grave!

- Death Cloud is one of those cards that can be absolutely brutal or absolutely garbage. If I'm ahead on mana (aka Coffers/Gauntlet/Lens), then the symmetry of Cloud is disgustingly in my favor. That said, it's those kinds of reset buttons that make EDH a fun format to play in (although I hate Armageddon, fuck that card. It has made too many a sad face).

- Phyrexian Etchings is cool, almost like a less insane Necro. I don't think I need it in the deck though, cause I'm at a drawing cap. It was fine while playing Maga, but with Xiahou Dun I really don't need to sift through my deck so much as find an answer and use his recursive nature to play the card over and over again.

So far the changes are like so:

- Crypt Rats
- Hatred
+ Undead Gladiator
+ Grim Tutor

After some thought, I'm still a bit afraid of Iona. Altar seems like a weak choice, but at least it's a third out to an otherwise unbeatable card. I'd also like to know what people think of Journeyer's Kite. It's a bit clunky. I don't run Sol Ring because I like to play all business and no dead draws, but I suppose he could replace Kite if it comes to that.

Nightmare

01-25-2010, 02:14 PM

If you're only worried about Iona as a reason to run Altar of Shadows, you could run Predator, Flagship instead.

HEY WE HAVE CARD TAGS NOW!

badjuju

01-25-2010, 02:20 PM

If you're only worried about Iona as a reason to run Altar of Shadows, you could run Predator, Flagship instead.

HEY WE HAVE CARD TAGS NOW!

HOYL CRAP CAR D TAKGS!!!!11!

Holdon I'm still freaking out right now.
But yes thank you Nightmare! Predator, Flagship seems like an awesome solution! Plus it'll look awesome in foil ^_^
I wouldn't usually be afraid of Iona, but this dude has Iona as his GENERAL. Good effin luck with that :(

badjuju

02-04-2010, 02:45 AM

Hey guys. I posted this in the pimp thread, but I'm so proud of it I wanna share it here too ^_^

Took me a few months to assemble this awesomeness. Everything that can be foil is foil (except for my FBB Demonic Tutor).
Just got my general altered last week and am about finished. The last things I might do are alter a few more cards, OD foil Coffers, TO foil Chainer's Edict, and possibly add in a Grim Tutor. Hope you guys like it XD

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h253/Milabrega6666/XD%20EDH/XiahouDunEDH.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h253/Milabrega6666/XD%20EDH/XDCreatures.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h253/Milabrega6666/XD%20EDH/XDBombs.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h253/Milabrega6666/XD%20EDH/XDRamp.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h253/Milabrega6666/XD%20EDH/XDLands.jpg

The last image is kinda blurry. The cards are (from top left to bottom right): Phyrexian Reclamation, Haunted Crossroads, Corpse Dance, Grim Discovery, Petrified Field, Urborg, Reliquary Tower, Volrath's Stronghold, Vesuva, Strip Mine (FTVE), Thawing Glaciers, and Boseiju. Then Coffers and 30x foil Snow-Covereds :D

BEAT THAT KOBE.

Koby

02-04-2010, 02:47 PM

English Xiahuo > chinese.
Korean Pimpness > foil pimpness. More rare :D

Done!

badjuju

02-04-2010, 05:55 PM

English Xiahuo > chinese.
Korean Pimpness > foil pimpness. More rare :D

Done!

Pfft. I got the Chinese one on purpose. It is waaay more awesome.

And if your whole deck is Korean, then I'll hand my throne over to you.

PS when you gonna be back in town? We should multiplayer it up. I've been working on a Garza Zol list (UBR good stuff) and it looks like it'll be fun.

Tychoides

02-18-2010, 03:25 PM

Chinese Xiahou Dun > any other version. It just makes way, more sense. I'd have gone with Traditional Chinese though, more old school. Love the altered art version you have though!

I was in the process of putting my foil Japanese Korlash to use for MBC, but man, I think you've inspired me to go with Xiahou Dun!

badjuju

02-22-2010, 03:06 PM

Even though I've been building a lot of other EDH decks, this one is still probably my favorite in terms of playstyle. You've got all the tools you need to win any matchup. I still have a lot of problems versus enchantments though. This one mono-white deck I played against help me at bay with Luminarch Ascension for about 15 turns while I continually bought back Corpse Dance w/ Kagemaro. Eventually I was so stocked on Coffers mana that I just triple drained him by bringing back Soul Burn with Xiahou Dun, but it was still annoying.

Oh yes, I must mention that Altar of Shadows actually saved me against Iona that very same game. Also thinking of adding in Sadistic Sacrament and Pithing Needle somewhere, but that's the only real change - the rest of the deck has been amazing for me.

Tychoides

02-24-2010, 06:36 PM

Yesmilord, since you seem to be very proficient with this deck, do you happen to have a more up-to-date list handy to share? :)

Bryant Cook

02-25-2010, 11:49 AM

Oh yes, I must mention that Altar of Shadows actually saved me against Iona that very same game. Also thinking of adding in Sadistic Sacrament and Pithing Needle somewhere, but that's the only real change - the rest of the deck has been amazing for me.

Sacrement and Altar have done me wonders in Maga, however, Pithing Needle? For what? Planeswalkers? It seems kinda weak.

badjuju

02-25-2010, 05:07 PM

Sacrement and Altar have done me wonders in Maga, however, Pithing Needle? For what? Planeswalkers? It seems kinda weak.

Pithing Needle for annoying shit like Jitte, Legacy Weapon, Luminarch Ascension etc etc. Everyone in my playgroup runs it and it can be surprisingly annoying (and useful). It might not make the cut, but I don't think it's weak at all.

Yesmilord, since you seem to be very proficient with this deck, do you happen to have a more up-to-date list handy to share? :)

Sure thing. The list is mostly set in stone, as I've said before. I only ever change a few things - and even those are purely preference slots. We're lucky that black has a rich host of spells that can adapt to any metagame. I play in one with a lot of high-powered generals, hence I might have more spot removal than most lists. I'll put in parenthesis next to cards that I'm thinking about replacing in the near future.

Xiahou Dun, The One-Eyed

Liliana Vess
Sorin Markhov

Graveborn Muse
Myojin of Night's Reach
Reiver Demon
Kagemaro, First to Suffer
Fleshbag Marauder
Gatekeeper of Malakir
Twisted Abomination
Withered Wretch
Undead Gladiator

Vampiric Tutor
Demonic Tutor
Diabolic Tutor
Beseech the Queen
Yawgmoth's Will
Necropotence

The Abyss
Call to the Grave
Damnation
Mutilate
Decree of Pain
Plague Wind
Death Cloud
Dregs of Sorrow
Nevinyrral's Disk
Oblivion Stone

Innocent Blood
Barter in Blood
Hero's Demise
Chainer's Edict
Tendrils of Corruption
Corrupt
Altar of Shadows

Mind Twist
Mind Shatter
Mind Sludge
Syphon Mind (Sadistic Sacrament)

Night's Whisper
Sign in Blood
Ancient Craving
Ambition's Cost
Phyrexian Arena
Promise of Power
(Grim Tutor somewhere in here - the deck actually doesn't need to draw that many cards since everything is wrapped around in card advantage)

Drain Life
Consume Spirit
Soul Burn
Profane Command

Mirari
Sensei's Divining Top
Expedition Map
Journeyer's Kite
Crucible of Worlds
Doubling Cube
Extraplanar Lens
Gauntlet of Power

Phyrexian Reclamation
Haunted Crossroads
Corpse Dance
Grim Discovery

Petrified Field
Urborg, Tom of Yawgmoth
Reliquary Tower
Volrath's Stronghold
Vesuva
Strip Mine
Thawing Glaciers
Boseiju, Who Shelters All
Cabal Coffers
30x Snow-Covered Swamp

Tychoides

02-25-2010, 06:27 PM

badjuju

02-26-2010, 12:28 AM

Thank you for sharing the latest! I'm actually running something pretty close now thanks to your suggestions/experiences, but I'm considering dropping the discard since it is definitely something that draws some hate. I'm also running Korlash, but only because I have a Japanese foil and I want an excuse to use him. :) I know you mentioned Helldozer before, I'm running him as well since my group seems to have a lot of annoying non-basics and with the insane mana this deck generates, it's easy to clear it out in a hurry. I haven't unleashed the updated version yet, but I think it'll be really successful if I don't get ganged up on! :)

The best part about black is that you can really slow roll with it, and when you need to handle shit, you always have answers (unless it's vs problematic artifacts / enchantments - you're boned in that sector). Helldozer I just can't find room for, although he would be a perfect fit. I could probably cut Hero's Demise in multiplayer.

badjuju

03-12-2010, 06:36 AM

Played this deck some more recently.

Cards that I once thought were amazing have now started to pop up again as just "average". Here's what I'm thinking has been weaker within the last half dozen games I've played with this deck:

-Twisted Abomination (Synergizes with Call to the Grave but is very lackluster otherwise)
-Plague Wind (I have actually NEVER casted this card. Ever.)
-Hero's Demise (Good, but not good enough anymore.)
-Soul Burn (Too expensive to be "flexible" removal and finisher spell.)
-Haunted Crossroads (Ontop of library kills so much tempo.)

What has also been giving me a bit of difficulty is my opponents' ability to deal with my very important enchantments/artifacts. Unfortunately we can't really do anything about that. GY hate has also been a slight bit of problem, hence the redundancy in my lists.

Here are cards that I think need to go in:

+Sadistic Sacrament (How to stop the GY hate and enchantment removal before it happens.)
+Demonic Collusion (I can't afford a Grim Tutor right now, so this will have to do.)
+Shriekmaw / Phthsis / Sudden Death (It's one or the other. I'd like to replace demise with a good black removal spell.)

Honestly, Soul Burn and Haunted Crossroads could stay. The rest have been extremely underwhelming. That's my update for this month - I've been having fun toying with Ghost Council of Orzhova and other decks.

Tychoides

03-12-2010, 09:03 AM

Plague Wind has actually really come in handy for me as I've found it pretty easy to cast with Cabal Coffers and Doubling Cube out, I personally wouldn't cut it. But I play in a metagame with Slivers, Elves, etc. so mass removal when they go crazy is basically a must-have for me.

I think cutting Twisted Abomination is a good move, though. I actually use Helldozer in that spot to keep the "zombie count" up for Call to the Grave and Graveborn Muse and I find that targeted, reusable land destruction on a 6/5 body is pretty handy.

I'm also not sure I'd cut Haunted Crossroads because I feel like there needs to be more reusable graveyard recursion for XD to make it more likely to get going. I'd kinda like to use Strands of Night instead, but the cost is pretty high unless you have Crucible of Worlds out.

badjuju

03-12-2010, 06:49 PM

I don't always have that luxury. I play in a very high-threat metagame and Plague Wind is just really, really slow. It's not bad, but I could be doing more broken things with 9 mana. I am effectively replacing Plague Wind with Demonic Collusion (or Grim Tutor), cause for the same amount of mana I could just tutor for a Damnation or Mutilate and call it a day. Also, Doubling Cube doesn't become effective till you have at least 7 mana >.<

Yea I decided not to cut Haunted Crossroads, but I feel like I want a few more creatures to really abuse it with. I think I will be replacing Hero's Demise with Shriekmaw for that very reason.

I was also thinking about Soul Burn last night. It has done its job a fair share of the games, so I will keep it in. Having more drains is NEVER a bad thing with Xiahou Dun. I also want to find more room for cards like Nightmare Incursion, cause that's really black's only way to deal with annoying GY hate and land destruction.

badjuju

03-16-2010, 12:17 PM

Update again.

Played the deck a few more times and am really trying to filter out the lackluster cards.
I find myself tutoring for Call to the Grave less and less. It really only shines in 1v1 where you can continually keep their threats off the board. In multiplayer, it's so hit and miss, and then you need to tutor for a zombie to really make it work (and the zombie will usually die anyways). It's okay, but maybe I was overvaluing it. That said, Undead Gladiator has been seriously under-performing. Kagemaro has also been slightly lackluster, but I am reluctant to cut him because he is situationally amazing with Corpse Dance. Death Cloud is another card that I haven't always been pleased to see; building your mana is the key to this deck, and losing lands is devastating. However, it is still a powerful haymaker card and I probably shouldn't cut it quite yet, as it has reset the board for me in dire situations. I've also replaced Hero's Demise with Shriekmaw - not sure if this is the right move, but at least I can abuse him with all my GY recursion effects. I think Duplicant might make the cut as well.

People have also been aiming their anti-GY cards at me, and it has been sucking very much. That's why I've been aiming for redundancy in my lists, cause having an important spell RFG'd is backbreaking.

So in conclusion, I think I am going to shoot for a few more spells that will help me nullify my opponents' strategies:

-Call to the Grave
-Undead Gladiator
-Soul Burn
+Nightmare Incursion (the best way to pre-emptively deal with problematic cards - might be redundant with Sadistic Sacrament though)
+Duplicant
+Helldozer (he's just too awesome not to run)

I also want Bojuka Bog and Terrain Generator in here. Still looking for things to cut.
I want to know if anyone else has been playing with Call to the Grave and vouch for its awesomeness. Maybe it's just a few situations I've been in that have put me off from the card, cause I have certainly seen it perform well in the past. For sure I want to cut Soul Burn now, cause it really is just over-costed for what it does. Helldozer gets the nod over Duplicant if I keep Call to the Grave.

Tychoides

03-16-2010, 01:23 PM

badjuju

03-16-2010, 02:12 PM

Only problem I see with Duplicant is that you can't recur him with Ol' One-Eye, but I do like Nightmare Incursion as that is really, really nasty and I think my meta is going to be packing more GY hate because of me and another guy abusing Genesis, LOL.

Yea, I was more thinking along the lines of Phyrexian Reclamation, Haunted Crossroads, and Corpse Dance, but for the most part Duplicant is largely unneeded. I still think Haunted Crossroads could probably go - every time it's in my hand I sorta just say "meh", wishing it were the other two main recursion spells. If you want a flexible GY hate card, Shred Memory is great. It also fetches out stuff like Mind Shatter, Chainer's Edict, Drain Life / Consume Spirit, Grim Discovery and Doubling Cube. Pretty much an answer for almost any situation. And yea, I think I have to find room for it now too >.<

Bryant Cook

03-16-2010, 07:25 PM

badjuju

03-16-2010, 08:56 PM

A couple posts ago you mentioned phythsys. I won a game solely based off of that card yesterday hitting my own general for 36 damage. It was incredible. Zach stole Maga after I drained for 18. I then Phythsys for the W. Situations like that are why I'm never going to cut it. It's a drain life a lot of the time for 10, sometimes 36.

For sure. I'll give it a try again. The last time I was running it, it was the CMC that put me off.

As for changes, I'm probably going to try out something like this instead:

-Call to the Grave
-Undead Gladiator
-Soul Burn
+Nightmare Incursion
+Phthisis
+Helldozer

More bombs, less chaff.

DracosTheBlack

03-17-2010, 12:03 PM

recursion! :mad::mad::mad: hate hate hate hate hate....HATE!

Thats why I will be running tons of graveyard hate in my mono black deck...tormod's crypt, Leyline of the Void stuff like that.

badjuju

03-24-2010, 01:56 PM

Just another update, I've given this list a major face lift. After conversing with a few friends and running the deck through more games, I've come to some clearer conclusions as to what is actually good, and what isn't. Mono Black is rich with cards, and many are good but most are overrated. Black has this weird ability to look awesome on paper, but then actually suck in play. I've streamlined the list with more potent and tempo spells over cards that ended up just being mild in testing.

Anyways, I'm in class so I'll comment more when I update this post with the new list. There are probably over ~10 changes, so I consider this a fairly significant overhaul.

freakish777

03-28-2010, 05:04 PM

Staff of Domination?

Also, if you could turn Magistrate's Scepter into a creature, that would be GG (but 3 card combo in EDH that requires something like 20 mana seems poor).

HAVE HEART

03-28-2010, 06:02 PM

Staff of Domination?

Also, if you could turn Magistrate's Scepter into a creature, that would be GG (but 3 card combo in EDH that requires something like 20 mana seems poor).

Seven swamps in play, Magus of the Coffers, and Staff of Domination produces infinite mana, which allows the player to draw his/her deck. If the player cannot win from there, then their deck is awful.

badjuju

03-29-2010, 04:47 PM

Where I play, we go by the Salvation EDH ban list, which includes staff. The primary reason is like the one you've mentioned - one card that, combined with a mana producer, can enable an instant win.

Anyways, I've made massive changes to the list and I feel like I should share them and receive feedback from a fresh set of eyes. I've really tried to whittle down on cards that I think have become chaff. Another driving factor for these changes is the run in against massive amounts of artifact destruction. I've been playing against a lot more red and green decks recently that are stocked mile-high with removal, which really hinders the deck's ability to generate large amounts of mana without slow-rolling mana doublers. What I've done to sort of band-aid this issue was add in a mix of threats that were not reliant on arbitrarily large amounts of mana to win. More than half the time, you'll have a good majority of your mana doublers blown up, but that shouldn't stop you from winning.

Before I dive into the list, I want to go over the philosophy of this archetype.

This deck is a control-combo deck.

Where its strength and weakness lies is in the Swamps. Because of this fact, reliance on artifact accelerants is often not the correct way to build the deck. All of your game-ending spells, especially your drains, require the use of pure black mana, and almost all of your mana doublers rely on the use of Swamps. That said, it's better to focus on stalling the early game with removal and hand disruption, allowing yourself to ease into the mid and late games where you can dominate. The reason that Xiahou Dun is such a great general is because he becomes the glue where the deck begins to fall apart and the ladder for you to climb to where you need to be. Use him liberally, that's what he's there for. When I watch other players use this deck, they spend too much time worrying about amassing mana for a quick kill. It's better to slow the game down, neutralize opponents, and THEN go for the throat. Black is a powerful color for stripping opponents' of their options - please abuse it; and with X-D, over and over again.

Now that I've established that, here is the OLD LIST, followed by the new changes:

Liliana Vess
Sorin Markhov

Graveborn Muse
Myojin of Night's Reach
Reiver Demon
Kagemaro, First to Suffer
Fleshbag Marauder
Gatekeeper of Malakir
Twisted Abomination
Withered Wretch
Undead Gladiator

Vampiric Tutor
Demonic Tutor
Diabolic Tutor
Beseech the Queen
Yawgmoth's Will
Necropotence

The Abyss
Call to the Grave
Damnation
Mutilate
Decree of Pain
Plague Wind
Death Cloud
Dregs of Sorrow
Nevinyrral's Disk
Oblivion Stone

Innocent Blood
Barter in Blood
Hero's Demise
Chainer's Edict
Tendrils of Corruption
Corrupt
Altar of Shadows

Mind Twist
Mind Shatter
Mind Sludge
Syphon Mind

Night's Whisper
Sign in Blood
Ancient Craving
Ambition's Cost
Phyrexian Arena
Promise of Power

Drain Life
Consume Spirit
Soul Burn
Profane Command

Mirari
Sensei's Divining Top
Expedition Map
Journeyer's Kite
Crucible of Worlds
Doubling Cube
Extraplanar Lens
Gauntlet of Power

Phyrexian Reclamation
Haunted Crossroads
Corpse Dance
Grim Discovery

Petrified Field
Urborg, Tom of Yawgmoth
Reliquary Tower
Volrath's Stronghold
Vesuva
Strip Mine
Thawing Glaciers
Boseiju, Who Shelters All
Cabal Coffers
30x Snow-Covered Swamp

- Graveborn Muse
- Gatekeeper of Malakir
- Reiver Demon
- Twisted Abomination
- Undead Gladiator
+ Shriekmaw
+ Chainer, Dementia Master

While combing through the creatures, I managed to find cards that just weren't pulling their weight. Graveborn Muse is a vulnerable Phyrexian Arena, Gatekeeper could not be abused with Corpse Dance, Reiver Demon was an overpriced wrath with the benefit of a 6/6 body - whatever, Twisted Abomination was never cast as a creature, Undead Gladiator was mana intensive and pretty bad even as a Call to the Grave enabler. What ended up happening was that I wanted a "creature version" of every type of spell so that I could use Phyrexian Reclamation or Corpse Dance in a pinch. Shriekmaw is the compliment to Fleshbag marauder - it allows me to have, now, both sacrifice and target removal as creatures. Chainer is a gem that I totally overlooked. He is the cheapest X-D enabler. At the low cost of BBB, you are able to bring back X-D and sac him over and over again. But the best part is the Chainer also serves as a major threat himself, even without the backbreaking combos that he delivers in unison with the deck's general.

- Call to the Grave
- Plague Wind
- Death Cloud
- Chainer's Edict
- Tendrils of Corruption
+ Arena of the Ancients

I took out a lot of removal here. Oftentimes I found much of it redundant or overcosted (or both). The removal of Death Cloud and Tendrils of Corruption are probably the two cards that readers will put under scrutiny. Death Cloud, to be frank, is detrimental to the deck's gameplan. On one hand you're trying to develop a ramped Swamp mana base, and in the other you're trying to bog the game down and hurting yourself (moreso imo) than your opponents. True it can finish multiple players off, but so can the rest of the deck given enough mana. Tendrils of Corruption I just found as an overcosted and lackluster spell (sometimes you don't even have enough Swamps to deal enough damage). Early game it's too slow, and late game it's just unnecessary. What I've found instead is a true gem - Arena of the Ancients. This card is seriously my MVP - it brings the game back down to your pace! All of those quick generals are put on hold until they can remove this artifact, allowing you a few very much needed turns to build your mana. The best part is that even if Arena sticks, X-D is totally unaffected by it!

- Syphon Mind
- Soul Burn
- Haunted Crossroads
+ Sadistic Sacrament
+ Grim Tutor
+ Shred Memory
+ Phyrexian Processor
+ Sigil of Distinction
+ Scroll Rack

This section right here is what I was talking about - cutting pure chaff. Syphon Mind - unnecessary. Haunted Crossroads - slow and overcosted. Soul Burn - slow and overcosted. See a recurring theme? Sadistic Sacrament on the other hand can stop a player cold in his tracks. Grim Tutor is the greatest addition to my deck (and a card I'm very happy to own). Shred Memory is another important tutor that allows you to fetch building blocks: Scroll Rack, Jet Medallion, Doubling Cube, Hero's Demise, Mind Shatter, Drain Life, Journeyer's Kite. Basically anything at any point in the game - AND THEN it doubles are GY hate that X-D can recur. Speaking of Scroll Rack - HOLY SHIT. How did I ever play without this card? It is decidedly INSANE in this deck.

When talking about hindrance to the deck's mana development and diversifying threats, we come to Phyrexian Processor and Sigil of Distinction as two alternate solutions to win with. Processor is a game-ender if left unchecked, and a powerful tool to have should things go awry with the multi-drain plan. Sigil of Distinction is for traditional horsemanship beats with X-D. It's a tough decision between Sigil and Nightmare Lash, because you can play both X-D and equip lash for the protection, or you could run X-D out there and hope he doesn't randomly die to smaller burn effects. Sigil is in for right now because it is highly possible that you'll be able to produce more mana than you'll have Swamps, allowing for unblockable two-shots (and possibly one-shots).

- Reliquary Tower
- Boseiju, Who Shelter's All
+ Sol Ring
+ Jet Medallion
+ Candelabra of Tawnos
+ Wayfarer's Bauble
+ Terrain Generator
+Bojuka Bog

Lastly, changes to the mana-base. Reliquary Tower is good, but I was hurting on the black sources. Boseiju was okay, but really unnecessary in the end. I've never had any moments where either were "OMG INSANE", so I decided to opt for a more steady solution. Sol Ring is a necessary evil and the best colorless acceleration with the least drawbacks. I owe it to this deck, which is starved of it. Jet Medallion is a great addition for X-D shenanigans. By reducing the cost of all spells, I am able to combo off with much less required mana now. Candelabra of Tawnos wasn't originally included because I wasn't going to buy one, but I've spent so much money on the deck that I had to include it. The ability to use this as a game-ender is backbreaking. Instead of generating 40-50 mana, this thing can pull you up to near a hundred, which makes tutoring for all of your mana pieces and then Mirari-Draining each opponent a cakewalk. Wayfarer's Bauble follows the guidelines of ramping Swamps (as well as Terrain Generator), and Bojuka Bog is additional GY hate that can be fetched via Expedition Map in a pinch.

A few cards that are meta-gameable that didn't make it into my list:
- Helldozer
- Nightmare Incursion
- Reito Lantern

So these are the most recent changes, and I am fairly content with them. I am always open to more critiques, criticisms, and suggestions - I just want to optimize Xiahou Dun!

freakish777

03-29-2010, 05:15 PM

The only cut you made that I think is 100% wrong is Tendrils of Corruption. All too often that cards is basically:

4 mana, kill target creature, gain 8+ life (which in turn fuels your decks ability to shrug off the drawbacks on cards like Ambitions Cost, Nights Whisper, Promise of Power, etc).

porcupinetreeman

03-30-2010, 03:53 PM

badjuju

03-31-2010, 05:28 PM

I have two recommendations:

Ancient Tomb - has been amazing for me, quicker to get jet, bauble, scroll rack and others out.

Gilded Lotus - Amazing mana generator

Also, why do people run snow-covered swamps?

I've tried Ancient Tomb. It's love-hate.
Gilded Lotus is a decent suggestion. It just comes into the game a bit late for a deck that already runs so few accelerants.

Snow-Covered Swamps are so that your Extraplanar Lens doesn't accidentally help out other people running basic Swamps.

@Freakish

You might be right about Tendrils. I've just been so underwhelmed with the card as of late that I just felt like cutting it. I might find room for it again - and for Sudden Death (fucking Teferi).

tdkb

03-31-2010, 06:32 PM

I have been playing this deck on MODO and it is responding nicely. Does any use HATRED?

Tychoides

04-01-2010, 10:25 AM

I don't use Hatred because I feel like there just aren't enough creatures in the deck worth running, much less that will stick around with all the board wiping. Very rarely do I end up swinging with the few creatures I do play.

tdkb

04-01-2010, 03:20 PM

I was thinking of using Hatred on Xiahou to quickly take someone out.

freakish777

04-01-2010, 06:09 PM

Hatred seems absolutely awful in any and all multiplayer formats. "Hey I'm going to kill one person and myself, and killing the other person assumes that person doesn't have an instant speed removal spell, hows that sound to everyone else at the table?"

The point of multiplayer magic isn't to kill the most other players.
The point of multiplayer magic isn't to come in second.
The point of multiplayer magic isn't to show everyone your dumb 17 card combo that doesn't work how you thought it did.
The point of multiplayer magic isn't to decide if one of your opponent's wins or one of your other opponent's wins based on "how they treated you" that game.

The point of multiplayer magic is to WIN!

People are fucking terrible at threat analysis in multiplayer magic and believe that they can reduce their strategy to:

A) Kill 1 opponent by any means necessary.
B) Repeat step A until there are no opponent's left.

This doesn't work (killing opponents by whatever means exhausts your resources and makes you an easy target). In fact, the majority of the time in multiplayer magic, you should have no problem whatsoever letting your opponents kill each other for you, so you have fewer opponents left to take out.

badjuju

04-01-2010, 07:14 PM

porcupinetreeman

04-01-2010, 09:06 PM

I've tried Ancient Tomb. It's love-hate.
Gilded Lotus is a decent suggestion. It just comes into the game a bit late for a deck that already runs so few accelerants.

Snow-Covered Swamps are so that your Extraplanar Lens doesn't accidentally help out other people running basic Swamps.

The list I've been running is pretty similar, but I run these instead.

+ wasteland
+ reliquary tower
+ solemn simulacrum
+ mana crypt
+ mana vault
+ dimir machinations ( I think you should run this card with all the 3 cost stuff in your new list)
+ necrologia
+ 4 fetches ( for crucible + grim discovery)

badjuju

04-02-2010, 07:40 AM

Just wanted to bring up our new friend, Nirkana Revenant. She will be a fine addition to our mana doubling lineup, now in creature form!

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=103734&stc=1&d=1270181773

I have another haul of changes again after grinding through the deck with a friend. Look forward to it.
Also, I don't run Dimir Machinations because the card itself is pretty bad. I'll think about it, but it's not a likely include.

Koby

04-04-2010, 04:53 PM

My favorite cards for this deck (and I showed it to Yesmilord 2 weeks ago) are the taxing enchantments:

Subversion
Polluted Bonds
Bloodchief Ascension (very easy to level up in 4 player games)
etc.

They are subtle enough to fly under the radar, and hard to remove. They also gain you lot of life for Vamp/Grim Tutor shenanigans.

Edit:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=103865&d=1270440395

Yes? No? Too Timmy? I already run Pestilence, this seems just flat out better (and beats face).

Bryant Cook

04-10-2010, 03:54 PM

I don't think it's too Timmy, I plan on playing him in Maga. Along with....

Suffer the Past* xb
Instant Uncommon
Exile X target cards from target player's graveyard. For each card you exiled this way, that player loses 1 life and you gain 1 life.

badjuju

04-11-2010, 05:02 PM

My playgroup has sped up a bit. We're dealing with more potent generals now, so I felt inclined to add the following:

Sol Ring
Coldsteel Heart
Wayfarer's Bauble
Solemn Simulacrum

It's not much, but it at least helps put my foot forward a little bit. They're all good in their own right (Coldsteel Heart has minor synergy with Scrying Sheets), so I'm not running anything completely out of the blue here. Solemn and Bauble are the only two artifacts that actually put basics into play tapped, so they're highly valued imo. I was running Wanderer's Twig and Pilgrim's Eye for a bit, but they just don't cut it. If it only fetches you one basic to HAND, it's probably not worth it, since it doesn't help accelerate either. I've cut Journeyer's Kite for Armillary Sphere though, cause the latter is definitely a better mana investment. Kite is such a bad tempo loss it frustrates me to no end.

I think I'm going to run Emrakul in my new list over Mirari. Why? Because if I'm playing Mirari, that means I'm going to win anyways. Emrakul is just better at that, because it allows me to spend turn 1 building up critical mass with my mana, and then just dropping 15 mana (instead of trying to drain people with what's left) to take another turn. I can then spend the next turn with all my 90 mana and kill everyone instantly. I have never had a game where if I didn't kill everyone, they'd let me untap with all of my mana doublers the next turn. This is going to be an extremely viable work-around.

Not a fan of Pestilence Demon.
Costly for no reason. If you want to run Timmy cards, that's up to you, but just letting you guys know I cut Reiver Demon a long time ago haha. And trust me, it breaks my heart, but all those times where I'm just sitting there staring at it while my opponents are doing insanely more broken things in the earlier turns - I just couldn't take it anymore. I'm still considering running Pestilence again, cause it's a better mana sink to kill multiple people with. It's just becoming hard to grind out games these days, cause our locals have been playing retarded generals.

Suffer the Past looks pretty good. I wonder if I can finally cut Withered Wretch for it, cause I can't actually remember the last time I used a Corpse Dance or Phyrexian Reclamation to bring it back. The life gain is fairly relevant, and the card itself is recurrable via X-D.

Here's my updated list:

X-D (04.11.10)

1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Shriekmaw
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Chainer, Dementia Master
1 Kagemaro, First to Suffer
1 Duplicant
1 Nirkana Revenant
1 Myojin of Night's Reach
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn

1 Rend Flesh
1 Tendrils of Corruption
1 Barter in Blood
1 The Abyss
1 Damnation
1 Mutilate
1 Decree of Pain

1 Arena of the Ancients
1 All is Dust
1 Oblivion Stone

1 Drain Life
1 Consume Spirit
1 Profane Command
1 Corrupt
1 Pestilence

1 Mind Twist
1 Mind Shatter
1 Mind Sludge
1 Sadistic Sacrament
1 Suffer the Past

1 Night's Whisper
1 Sign in Blood
1 Ambition's Cost
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Necropotence

1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Grim Tutor
1 Beseech the Queen
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Shred Memory

1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Scroll Rack
1 Phyrexian Processor
1 Phyrexian Reclamation
1 Corpse Dance
1 Grim Discovery
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Imp's Mischief

1 Liliana Vess
1 Sorin Markov

1 Sol Ring
1 Coldsteel Heart
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Armillary Sphere
1 Expedition Map
1 Doubling Cube
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Candelabra of Tawnos
1 Jet Medallion

1 Cabal Coffers
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Petrified Field
1 Vesuva
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Scrying Sheets
1 Strip Mine
30 Snow-covered Swamp

Also, I know this is blasphemy, but Necro's RFG clause has bitten me in the ass more than once. Nothing like getting twisted for your most important spells. I'm seriously considering cutting it just for another draw spell.
And finally, another hidden gem brought forth by a friend's suggestion:

http://magiccards.info/scans/en/an/5.jpg

This is another awesome way to pass the turn with. I want to know what you guys think of this. It functions a lot like Emrakul - aka buy me a turn so I can build up my mana now and kill you the next! I would probably cut something like Phyrexian Processor for it.

The_Red_Panda

04-12-2010, 03:37 PM

badjuju

04-12-2010, 11:31 PM

Is Deserted Temple win-more? It seems like the coffers effect is in high demand, and it allows for a second activation given you've got the coffers in play already. Plus it has randomly awesome interactions with Dust Bowl/Stronghold/Thawing glaciers. It made my list at least.

EDIT: How do you do card tags again? Deserted Temple is probably random enough to merit one.

It's fine.
I had it in older iterations of this deck, but I had cut it because I had originally been running too many non-Swamp lands. Now that I've cut out a lot of fat (note Boseiju and Reliquary Tower - and possibly Volrath's Stronghold soon), it could probably find its way back in. At that time, I also didn't run Thawing Glaciers, which was the other reason for me to now run Deserted Temple.

Speaking of lands that haven't been that impressive, Bojuka Bog has been kinda sucking. I just never felt the need for it - so I'm thinking this might be able to leave too. And then, as mentioned right above, Volrath's Stronghold has been activated like three times since I've played this deck - and never once for a gamebreaking effect. It might be leaving.

I've goldfished Emrakul, and I absolutely love it. It basically guarantees your next turn kill and is uncounterable! Also, if you're going the Emrakul route, you'll need to run a Pestilence effect. I was originally going to run Pestilence, but now I think that Crypt Rats might be better (solely because it costs 1 less and can play around Teeg). Unless I feel like Pestilence will be useful before I kill everyone, I'm gonna stick with the rats for now.

Koby

04-13-2010, 01:04 AM

Crypt Rats is a fine addition, in place or in conjunction with Pestilence. I understand the argument for Pestilence Demon, but sometimes a big body is better than nothing.

I too feel like Necro is heading out due to it's nature of losing you the game when someone wants to take your turn for you (*coughcough* Sorin, Mindslaver*cough*).

Considering that your meta (and soon to be mine, come August) has a lot of nasty generals, would Hero's Demise be a valuable addition?

badjuju

04-13-2010, 01:22 AM

Hero's Demise has constantly been in and out of my list. I recently replaced it for Rend Flesh, although the two are interchangeable. The only things I really need to kill with spot removal are legendaries anyways. It could honestly replace Shriekmaw, since that's pretty much all Shriekmaw does anyways. There's always all this awesome talk about using Phyrexian Reclamation or Corpse Dance or Volrath's Stronhold with Shriekmaw, but that honestly has never happened for me lol. I am always using my reanimation spells to do more broken things or to set myself up. We'll see. Regardless, Arena of the Ancients has been my ace in the hole for completely hosing down the early game.

I understand your want to include Pestilence Demon, but for me that body has always been irrelevant (and costly). I used to run both Pestilence and Crypt Rats, but I cut them because there weren't any token decks around. Recently though, if I win through combo, it's usually best to just drain one guy to be up on life, and the Pestilence the the rest of the table (assuming there is another person left).

And yea, Necro is pretty whatever. I haven't been Slavered or Sorin'd yet, but I've had it Needled (which is arguably just as bad). With no way to remove it other than via O-Stone or All is Dust, you're pretty much boned lol. I've also had my hand twisted (full of goodies), only to see them all RFG'd. Bad times when your general is basically a black Eternal Witness. I'd probably just toss Ancient Craving or Promise of Power back in.

I see all these people with lists over on MTG Sally, and I can tell right away they haven't ever played the deck before. There is so much stuff the looks "staple" or "good on paper", but end up being clunky or just awful in practice. Necro is one of these cards, and although it can be amazing in the right situation, it's more often than not the worse option.

Mr.C

04-13-2010, 01:32 AM

I was thinking of using Hatred on Xiahou to quickly take someone out.

I do that for 1v1. Makes people really afraid.

The_Red_Panda

04-20-2010, 06:24 PM

badjuju

04-23-2010, 07:00 AM

Would anyone know a place where I could buy a Xiahou Dun, if I were in the market for one? The only store I've found listing one has him at 75USD, which seems high, and Ebay doesn't have any listed right now.

Also, if you couldn't get your hands on a Xiahou Dun, the obvious next best choice seems to be Maga, Traitor to Mortals. Is that right, or are there any other choices worth considering?

I bought mine of StarCity, though I doubt they have any left.
Maga is probably the next best general for multiplayer, and possibly Kagemaro with him.
Drana isn't looking half bad herself, though she's a lot more fragile.
And then if you want to get really competitive for 1v1, Braids, Cabal Minion or Iname, Death Aspect are different routes to take the deck.

Sims

04-23-2010, 07:58 AM

Though, if you're sticking with the "official" banned list, Braids is banned as a general as she's absolutely bonkers as a general (even in multiplayer) and can lock players out of the game starting turn 2 with good hands.

The_Red_Panda

04-27-2010, 08:32 PM

I've got a foily Drana, but I also managed to find a Xiahou Dun for <40$, so I'll probably just buy it. This deck looks too fun to be real.

Blitzbold

05-09-2010, 03:20 AM

Not much love for this deck since about 3 months. I am currently reworking nearly all of my decks, so there's a very good chance I'll post an updated list soon. There's quite some saucy stuff for MBC in ROTE.

Carabas

05-09-2010, 05:25 AM

Drana is ridiculous in the main. Being able to recur it with Phyrexian Reclamation when they manage to kill it feels downright unfair v. many general-dependent decks.

Koby

06-03-2010, 01:44 PM

I've recently got to play with Rings of Brighthearth and have been very very impressed with the results. I also swapped out 6 Swamps for 6 fetchlands (Terramorphic, Evolving, 4 "pay 1 life").

Rings + Thawing Glaciers is awesome.
Rings + Thawing + Deserted Temple is bonkers.

Rings + Xiahuo Dun = over the top! (it works according to Oracle rulestext on Xiahuo Dun)

Bryant Cook

06-04-2010, 11:14 AM

Sims

07-22-2010, 04:59 PM

So with the recent axing of Staff, I'm now looking for a replacement in my list.

I normally don't ask for handouts, but does anyone have suggestions? Right now since i had a foil crystal ball i just threw that in there but it doesn't seem like it'll prove to be strong enough. Thoughts?

Bryant Cook

07-22-2010, 05:01 PM

badjuju

07-23-2010, 05:08 PM

I never played with staff caused it was already banned in my group D:

Also, is anyone running Grave Titan?

Sims

08-05-2010, 05:16 PM

I don't think he'll simply do enough. Titan will give you 10 power for 6 mana, then cry to one of the many wrath or spot removal effects, including your own. We could sweep then play him same turn, but doing that seems weak compared to dropping something bomby afterwards like Nirkana Revenant. All titan does is attack or block, and while he makes hordes of little guys, i don't think a fat creature that does nothing but turn sideways cuts it in this deck. I want my creatures to pull their weight and i just can't see Titan doing enough.

badjuju

08-06-2010, 11:32 AM

I should post my updated list sometime. It has changed drastically.

I also added in a bunch more soft lock and hard lock cards as well as the infinite mana combo. The deck is pretty deadly now and it's getting to the point where if people at my table don't gang up on me, I'll lock the board down and kill everyone a few turns later lol. The main lock I go for now is Chains of Mephistopheles / Anvil of Bogardan, followed by Infernal Darkness. It's pretty unfun for the rest of the table, but now that everyone has become so cutthroat I really don't have a choice but to follow suit!

Bryant Cook

08-06-2010, 01:16 PM

Sims

08-06-2010, 03:50 PM

Bryant Cook

08-06-2010, 04:04 PM

Just out of curiosity, Bryant, do you run Maga because you don't have a XD? Or simply because you prfer the potential blowout effect of having your general be a fireball when you cast him, and be able to deal 21 general damage fairly quickly if unchecked?

I don't like the idea of running crappy cards (Phyrexian Reclamation, Crossroads, ect.) to make your general better. That and I usually win by using X spells and infinite mana.

Sims

08-06-2010, 05:13 PM

Fair enough. I used to play Maga before I was able to find the XD, and to me the decks weren't radically different. Slightly different choices here and there based on the abilities of the general (Reclamation/Crossroads vs. running lands that can be sac outlets incase you need to maga multiple times on multiple players).

To be honest, I don't even think the bring critter back enchantments are actually necessary. I rarely use them, and when i do it's also rarely on XD himself. It's usually bringing back a Solemn for more ramp or a Revenant that got iced to shut off some of my mana production. Last night I won a 5 man game and didn't cast a single one of those enchantments despite having multiple opportunities to tutor and play them, so they're sitting on my "maybe out" list. I like Corpse Dance as I've used it a few times with XD to rediciulous ends, and even with Solemn as suprise chump blockers with benefits, but I'm not sure how useful that guy is either.

TL;DR: I see what you're saying, and can get behind it. I guess i've just done too many broken things with recurring Demonic Tutors and reclaiming lands/coffers after strips and LD by looping XD with Grim Discovery to recover from situations that i shouldn't to not run him.

badjuju

08-07-2010, 09:24 AM

I'll post the list up later today, as I am so freaking tired right now from a 6 hour SC2 run.

I actually cut all the enchantment recursion in my deck (and subsequently a lot of sub-par CIP effect creatures), allowing more room for neck-snapping spells. Corpse Dance is your "go-to" recursion spell when you're ready to combo off, but there's several other backup cards such as Grim Discovery, Profane Command, and even Chainer. However, if you run XD long enough people will catch wind and try very hard to get rid of your Corpse Dance, which is why Phyrexian Reclamation might still be an okay metagame call.

I also agree with Sims' point of view on XD. I used to run Maga and after playing XD you realize how insane mono black can be. Winning with infinite mana is pretty much a norm with the deck now, and XD speeds that process up by about a gagillion turns as opposed to Maga, which is a traditional MBC list. And even if your combo doesn't really work, you can fetch out your 1-2 card locks and keep using XD to recur your tutors and play threat after threat. Even if they counter or blow something up, you can just bring it back with XD and keep shoving it in their face till it sticks. It's really a nightmare for my opponents; I know for a fact that I wouldn't want to be sitting across from an XD deck. Even using him to bring back a Mind Twist can seal the game for you.

All that said, Maga is still an excellent choice if you prefer to play the route of attrition. The way my meta has been shaping up, that style of play just isn't that effective anymore thanks to all of the shenanigans and combo running around. I mean, the deck still shares the same 90 core cards, but it's those 10 extra slots that Maga spends on redundancy that XD can spend on threat diversity instead, since XD becomes the card advantage engine of the list. I will tell all of you right now that when I post my list, there will be many cries of disapproval. I promise you though that I have played this list enough to warrant my very terse decisions.

badjuju

08-09-2010, 10:06 PM

Here's the promised list.

Creatures
1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Crypt Rats
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Chainer, Dementia Master
1 Kagemaro, First to Suffer
1 Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief
1 Nirkana Revenant
1 Myojin of Night's Reach

Removal & Sweepers
1 Chainer's Edict
1 Rend Flesh
1 Barter in Blood
1 Damnation
1 Mutilate
1 Decree of Pain

1 All is Dust
1 Oblivion Stone

Drains
1 Consume Spirit
1 Profane Command

Neutralization & Locks
1 Mind Twist
1 Mind Shatter
1 Mind Sludge
1 Nightmare Void
1 Sadistic Sacrament
1 Suffer the Past

1 Arena of the Ancients
1 The Abyss
1 Infernal Darkness
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Anvil of Bogardan

Draw & Manipulation
1 Night's Whisper
1 Sign in Blood
1 Skeletal Scrying
1 Phyrexian Arena

1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Scroll Rack
1 Crystal Ball

Tutors
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Grim Tutor
1 Beseech the Queen
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Shred Memory

Utility & Recursion
1 Corpse Dance
1 Phyrexian Reclamation
1 Grim Discovery
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Imp's Mischief
1 Rings of Brighthearth

1 Liliana Vess
1 Sorin Markov

Artifact Mana
1 Mana Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Armillary Sphere
1 Expedition Map
1 Doubling Cube
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Candelabra of Tawnos
1 Jet Medallion

Lands
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Petrified Field
1 Vesuva
1 Deserted Temple
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Strip Mine
31 Snow-covered Swamp

The slots I'm thinking about changing (and my slots are always switching around / meta calls) include:

Phyrexian Reclamation -> Nightmare Incursion
Nightmare Void -> Guardian Beast
Vesuva -> Imperial Seal
Barter in Blood -> Innocent Blood (has there ever been a situation where Barter was better for you? Not for me lol)
Crystal Ball and Jens are also on my watchlist.

I think in the most recent changelog (on MTG Sally) I removed a bunch of drains, such as Corrupt and Drain Life. While playing the deck, I realized I never really wanted to see those in my hand ever. It wasn't till I was ready to win (or about to die) that I really wanted to see them. The mana is much better spent playing setup spells, proactive disruption, or removal. Unlike Maga, I have my own recursive drain, so I only ever need one to take someone out instead of filling up my deck with more redundant slots. Next I cut a lot of draw. The more I played this deck the more I realized how much extra draw there was in here. Since this deck's curve used to be so high, your early turns were always extremely cumbersome, loaded with extremely expensive spells, lands, and card draw. Unfortunately for you, card drawing while you have a full hand is pretty much useless, which is why I've opted to cut cards like Promise of Power, Ambition's Cost, and Ancient Craving - they're just overkill and are too high on the curve to help out your earlier turns. Now I wouldn't recommend doing this in Maga, cause you need that kind of card advantage, but I make my own card advantage with X-D, so those slots are better used as different spells. I also cut Necropotence cause it was getting me into trouble (needle, slaver, twist) - it just happened too often. Yes I still think it's a solid card, but it is definitely an unnecessary risk in EDH. Next up is also another large step I took in order to speed the deck up - adding Sol Ring and Mana Crypt. It's just two cards, but they help out a crap ton. In the end I just wasn't satisfied with running Coldsteel Heart and other slower artifact accell.

So I have all these extra slots right? What's so "amazing" about these extra slots? Well, I get to run a bunch of proactive disruption that forces my opponents to choose between getting out of locks or stopping me from nuking the entire board. Over the course of playing this deck, I've scoured the internets in search of ways to improve this deck and make it much more brutally efficient, especially in the face of its more difficult matchups. These are the cards that set my list apart from the rest:

- Arena of the Ancients
- Infernal Darkness
- Chains of Mephistopheles
- Anvil of Bogardan

I've said it once, but I'll say it again - Arena of the Ancients is a one-of-a-kind way to halt generally strategies completely at the beginning of the game. It must be answered, or too many general-necessary strategies will just fall apart. Of course my meta has now grown accustomed to this and will run anywhere from 5 to 6 artifact/enchantment removal spells, discounting tutors. This leads me up to the next card that has literally been winning me all my games: Infernal Darkness. This is a one card Contamination with a very minor drawback that allows me to combo with confidence. The best part is that even if this is countered, I can always keep getting it back with X-D and forcing it down their throats till it sticks. It's a very disgusting and sad practice, but it works. (Veering off a bit, one time I returned Nightmare Incursion 6 times in one game and ripped out all the relevant cards from everyones' decks - power to X-D). Ok so yea, douchey card? Yes. It shuts down the entire table and they can't even answer it because they can't produce colored mana to remove it - it has to be done with cards like Oblivion Stone and whatnot. And even then, you better RFG my GY quickly or I'll just get it back with X-D.

So while playing this deck, my real only enemy that I have a hard time with is blue-based decks that run way too many counters (I'm looking at you, Thraximundar players). They just won't let me resolve anything relevant and then keep breaking my artifacts with their red spells. When the table targets me, it's really hard to get moving. Luckily the deck still carries the shade of an MBC shell, so I can still survive although it will take me much longer to sweep the table. To combat blue (or any color, really), I've opted to include one of the douche-iest combos in Magic: Chains of Mephistopheles and Anvil of Bogardan. I usually play Anvil first, since it's a group hug card, but as soon as I can get Chains to resolve with it, nobody will ever draw another card again. In fact, they will just mill two every turn and if they try to draw a card with a spell they're forced to discard it due to Chains. The kicker is that my deck runs off the graveyard, so the milling becomes an advantage for me while other players are forced to win with what they have or die trying. It really is a disgusting combo, since I am virtually playing uninterrupted (much like after resolving Infernal Darkness) while abusing my graveyard with tutors and X-D to fetch out infinite mana and then killing everyone. The other card that really makes a big difference in the blue matchup is Nightmare Void. That card is seriously awesome, since I'm a combo deck. I just need to make sure they aren't meddling with my stuff and I can fetch out all the stuff I need without being worried.

For anyone who hasn't played the deck, the game starts out with me going for mana, then either black Myojin, Infernal Darkness, Chains/Anvil while blocking the game off with Mind Twists and removal. Once I have a tutor, I find up Corpse Dance (or any other recursion spell) and then combo with X-D to find the infinite mana combo (or if something happened to that, just a bunch of mana cards like Doubling Cube). I then dump everyone's hand with black Myojin, tutor for a drain, drain one guy to be up on life, then tutor for Crypt Rats, then Crypt Rats the rest of the table.

So yea, what are the weaknesses? The same ones everyone has. Lose your Coffers, lose your artifact mana, annoying enchantments, etc. The deck isn't infallible - I don't win all my games, especially when there's collateral land/artifact damage. A properly timed counter on my Corpse Dance is also a great way to stop my shenanigans for a short while. I feel like after a certain point though, this deck accumulates critical mass and just cannot be stopped. There's too much mana and too much recursion to keep playing your threats over and over again. Against Jester's Cap cards, there's always the man-plan that can be adopted (which is the cheesy Drana, Chainer, Sorin, and Nirkana Revenant setup - shoot for Rings of Brighthearth to amplify the power of the former three). GY hate is also always a worry, but really all you need in your GY is a tutor before you can go bonkers. You're not supposed to "go off" till you've neutralized the other players' options anyways.

This deck is a million times more scary than when I first built it. Experience has taught me to cut a lot of chaff and really just go for the throat. That's why I'm trying to find room for Imperial Seal and Nightmare Incursion again, cause I can literally silver bullet almost anything that is thrown at me. The flexibility and dominance that X-D provides is unparalleled in a mono-colored deck - I love it.