[Deck] Zombies

[4eak]

So, I was listening to The Cranberries and started a list with 4 Phage the Untouchable and 4 Scathe Zombie...jk. :tongue: This is a legitimate attempt to make a relevant Modern deck.

I actually think Zombies are pretty powerful in Modern. They can stack lords and they have disruption -- it seems worth trying. Black probably has the best tempo disruption in Modern (it may be the only color with reliable turn 1 disruption against almost any deck).

Here is a list (without a complete sideboard for now):

// Lands - 20
3 Swamp
1 Plains
2 Blood Crypt
2 Godless Shrine
4 Marsh Flats
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Mutavault

// Zombies - 20
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Adaptive Automaton
4 Lord of the Undead
4 Death Baron
4 Cemetery Reaper

// Tempo - 20
4 AEther Vial
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Path to Exile
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Thoughtseize

// Sideboard
SB: 4 Anathemancer
SB: ??

I've actually gone in a weird direction with the deck (I think), splashing 2 more colors. The manabase is greedy, but it runs primarily 1cc disruption and Vial, which is affordable. Splashing provides additional tempo and solid sideboard options that mono black decks can lack.

I think Anathemancer can be a pretty decent card against a lot of decks - he comes out of no where. That said, if I dropped a color, I think I'd drop red first.

Other cards I'm trying out:

Phylactery Lich
Phyrexian Crusader
Stillmoon Cavalier
Graveborn Muse
Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
Undead Warchief
Dark Confidant

Some raw CA (outside of what some of the lords provide) would be nice.


peace,
4eak

[Prkchpsndwiches]

Phyrexian Crusader seems to good to keep off the main list. Pro bolt and path. First Strike and Infect! I think Automan gets the cut for it easily.
Phyrexian Arena can be some good card advantage.

You could probably cut bolt for dismember and go two colors.

[Lusian]

What about nameless inversion? Together with lord of the undead it can remove all the same creatures as bolt, but multiple times.

[TsumiBand]

No Blightning? :(

[OurSerratedDust]

It seems like you might want a few more 2-drop zombies somehow.

[4eak]

Phyrexian Crusader is okay. The pro's are amazing. He's very hard to remove. I am not a fan of running Infect creatures alongside regular creatures. It is like attacking two completely different types of wincons (poison counters totals and life totals) -- I'd rather concentrate on one or the other. I think Crusader is best in a control deck (oddly enough), where they want to ride one card to victory. Crusader has that "standalone" threat value. I wish he synergized better with the rest of the zombies (generally a good principle in constructing Tribal decks).

I completely forgot about nameless inversion. It's pretty cool. The recursion would not be common, but it is a neat feature. It isn't like Bolt in that I can't use it turn 1, it isn't as mana efficient, and it can't be thrown at my opponent's face (Cheney style). It relaxes the mana-coloring, but puts more pressure on the generic mana production of the deck. Also, I completely forgot Terminate - that card seems pretty amazing.

I am not in love with Blightning. You really want discard as early as possible. Turn 3 can be pretty late. At 3cc, I prefer to be dropping Lords. It is mana efficient though. If the cards were at random or I could target the burn damage, then I'd probably think it would be worth running. Vial decks want their disruption to be very cheap, in my experience, and Blightning doesn't seem to fit.

As for more 2-drops zombies, I looked. Mostly Junk (http://magiccards.info/query?q=t%3A%22zombie%22+cmc%3D2+f%3Amodern&v=card&s=cmc). Putrid Leech is decent, imho, but it is off color. Stromgald Crusader looks like the best available. But, it is really mana intensive and doesn't syerngize nicely with the rest. What would you take out for it?



peace,
4eak

[Mr. Safety]

You're looking at ticking up your Vials to 3 counters...that's going to take a little while. I'm glad to see Sculler in there...Castigate may be another option rather than the life-loss of Thoughtsieze. Not to mention if you exile Emmy, he ain't comin' back.

I think a blue splash makes the most sense...it gives you Lich Lord of Unx, Esper Charm for instant speed discard or draw, it gives you Ponder, and it gives you some permission availability like Mana Leak or Rune Snag. The most exciting reason for a blue splash is probably Squelch and Trickbind to use for mana-denial. Now you're essentially playing Deadguy Ale with Stifle...

Don't forget about Ghost Council of Orzhova either.

[mishrazz]

Creatures-

4 Cemetery Reaper
4 Death Baron
4 Lord of the undead
4 Undead Warchief
3 Withered Wretch
3 Stromgald Cruesader
4 Festering Goblin

Spells-

4 Aether Vial
4 Smallpox
2 Nameless Inversion
2 Sudden Spoiling
2 Tendrils of Corruption

Lands-

16 Swamp
3 Mutavault
1 Bojuka Bog

SB-

3 Duress
3 Inqisition of Kozilek
2 Damnation
2 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Sword of war and peace
1 Sword of Body and Mind
1 Pithing Needle
2 Chalice of the Void

[Bignasty197]

Thoughtseize needs to be in here somewhere.

[4eak]

Zombie threads merged.

-4eak

[Kanti]

Slavering Nulls seems good. 2/1 Hypnotic Specter thats in color.

[GGoober]

Creatures-

4 Cemetery Reaper
4 Death Baron
4 Lord of the undead
4 Undead Warchief
3 Withered Wretch
3 Stromgald Cruesader
4 Festering Goblin

Spells-

4 Aether Vial
4 Smallpox
2 Nameless Inversion
2 Sudden Spoiling
2 Tendrils of Corruption

Lands-

16 Swamp
3 Mutavault
1 Bojuka Bog

SB-

3 Duress
3 Inqisition of Kozilek
2 Damnation
2 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Sword of war and peace
1 Sword of Body and Mind
1 Pithing Needle
2 Chalice of the Void

This makes me all warm and fuzzy inside. My casual 28 lord Zombie deck is sitting in my casual decks,. Here's the list:

28 Lords:
4 Cemetery Reaper
4 Death Baron
4 Lord of the undead
4 Undead Warchief
4 Bad Moon
4 Door of Destinies
4 Automaton (the M12 lord ZOMGBIE!)

4 Removal:
4 Fleshbag Marauder

8 Accelerant:
4 Aether Vial
4 Dark Ritual

Lands 20
14 Swamp
3 Mutavault
3 Unholy Grotto

Not having access to Unholy Grotto/Dark Ritual will be missed. Unholy Grotto is GG with a vial@3 when you have Fleshbag out.

I think zombie has a chance to be decent as a tier 2 deck in Modern but you need to run Fleshbag and possibly Metamorphs in the MD. Vial strategy works best in the Zombie shell in Modern than anything else.

[mishrazz]

Zombie threads merged.

-4eak

Thanks!

[Pltnmngl]

Edited this for being stupid.

[Amber VII]

With the release of Innistrad, might we not have a few good zombies?

Diregraf Ghoul :b:
Creature – Zombie
Diregraf Ghoul enters the battlefield tapped
2/2

The Ghoul reminds me of Carnophage and Sacromancy back during the Tempest-era days of Suicide Black.

I feel this card gives us the potential to be more aggressive, though not quite suicidal.

Creatures (24)

4 Diregraf Ghoul
4 Putrid Leech
4 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Withered Wretch
2 Cemetery Reaper
4 Death Baron
4 Lord of the Undead

Spells (12)

4 Dismember
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Thoughtseize

Lands (23)

3 Godless Shrine
4 Marsh Flats
4 Mutavault
3 Overgrown Tomb
5 Swamp
4 Verdant Catacombs

This deck is basically meant to go all-in. Tidehollow Sculler is the MVP of the deck. You can't argue with Distress on legs. Beyond that I found the 2-drop zombies to be lacking. I actually splashed green for Putrid Leech, which is an undercosted beater. It does stretch the mana base a little thin. Stromglad Crusader is another option to consider, though I went with Withered Wretch due to the added utility.

Death Baron is your best friend. It allows your creatures to at worst trade with your opponents. Lord of the Undead and Cemetery Reaper come in to recover your lost creatures and exile your opponents.

[4eak]

You splashed white but you don't have Path to Exile in the list? Dismember is a great card, but it isn't even close to as good as Path to Exile. Dismember is also much weaker against Zoo (a match we should be worried about).



peace,
4eak

[Amon Amarth]

Stromgald Crusader is a decent mana sink and pro-white is relevant with PTE being the best removal spell in the format.

[metalhead]

Any consideration for yixlid jailer? Not the bombest of creatures, but fits the curve and stops punishing fire, loam, and vengivine recursion.

[Amber VII]

@ 4eak

My list is rough. Path may be the better choice, but I don't think the gap between Path and Dismember in a black deck is as wide as you think it is. When I drafted the list I wanted it to be as aggressive and suicidal as possible. :smile: So much so that I originally had Dark Confidant as well.

@ Amon Amarth

Stromgald Crusader is also the only zombie with evasion. I original had 2 but cut them for Withered Wretch and Cemetery Reaper. I guess I'm prejudice because Nantuko Shade is a better card and still doesn't see play in this format.

@ metalhead

I like Yixlid Jailer. Punishing Fires is pretty punishing against this deck. It competes with Witered Wretch for the slot.

----
Also, I can't state this enough: Tidehollow Sculler is the reason for playing this deck. Every Zombie deck should start 4 of them. This card has proven its worth time and time again.

[mishrazz]

5 Swamp
1 Plains
2 Godless Shrine
4 Marsh Flats
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Mutavault

// Zombies - 22
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Diregraf Ghoul
4 Lord of the Undead
4 Death Baron
2 Cemetery Reaper
2 Withering Wretch
2 Stromgald Cruesader

// Tempo - 18
4 AEther Vial
4 Path to Exile
2 Nameless Inversion
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Thoughtseize

// Sideboard
3 Deathmark
2 Damnation
2 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Sword of war and peace
1 Sword of Body and Mind
2 Pithing Needle
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Sudden spoiling

[mishrazz]

With the release of Innistrad, might we not have a few good zombies?

How about this one?

Skaab Ruinator
Creature - Zombie Horror
As an additional cost to cast Skaab Ruinator, exile 3 creature cards from your graveyard.
Flying
You may cast Skaab Ruinator from your graveyard. 5/6

Card say additional cost, when you cast. But nothing about put into play with aether vial.
Anther reason to splash blue?

[Amber VII]

I think you forgot to include the creature's casting cost... if there is one. The drawback seems pretty steep, on the level Myr Superion, which see's no play. Tombstalker this ain't.

[mishrazz]

Casting cost is Blue Blue Colorless. Point is to Aether vial it into play on round 3. without getting the nasty drawback. But with no vial in sight, this can be a pretty dead card in hand, unless you splash blue and have a bunch of dudes in the yard.

[Amber VII]

Seems rather lackluster in that case. The Zombie deck is not lacking for 3-drops. The real problem is at the 2-drop position. Beyond Tidehollow Sculler I feel that we need one more great zombie at this position to take the deck home. Also, I don't think Zombies needs Aether Vial.

[Zupponn]

Just messing around with Gravecrawler.

4x Stromgald Crusader
4x Skinrender
4x Putrid Cyclops
4x Death Baron
4x Lord of the Undead
4x Diregraf Ghoul
4x Gravecrawler

4x Nameless Inversion
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Ghoulcaller's Chant

20x Swamp

Tested a little against Domain Zoo with some success. Gravecrawler, Skinrender, Ghoulcaller's Chant, and Stromgald Crusader turned out to be exceptional in the matchup. Putrid Cyclops is an odd choice, but I felt that his scry 1 ability might be useful and wanted to test him out. He was okay, but I don't think he was good enough. Stillmoon Cavalier, Korlash, Heir to Blackblade, or Fleshbag Marauder could be good replacements. Other than the cyclops, I really like the card advantage generated between the Ghoulcaller's Chants and the Lord of the Undeads. Recurring Skinrenders and Nameless Inversions is rough for opponenets.

[Mr. Safety]

Deck wants Gravecrawler in a pretty bad way.

EDIT: Too late, Zupponn beat me to it.

[Zupponn]

Yes, Gravecrawler is awesome. From my previous post, Fleshbag Marauder works amazingly with it, so I swapped the cyclops for it.

EDIT: A red splash seems like the best choice for artifact removal to help the awful Affinity matchup and gives access to Rain of Gore for the tough martyr matchup.

[Mr. Safety]

How is Rain of Gore better than Everlasting Torment I suppose it's cheaper, which is relivant, but I like Torment a lot more.

With such an aggressive clock, I think Dash Hopes, Blightning, and good old Lightning Bolt should be used in this setup, maybe even Bump in the Night

[Zupponn]

I'm feeling that against decks like Zoo and Affinity, Zombies is the control. I'm not sure how many burn spells Zombies can afford to have, if any.

Blightning is a very good card, but the 3-drop spot contains the 2 lords and the Fleshbag Marauder. If by turn 3 a deck like Affinity can have their hand empty, which it can, all of those 3 would be more useful than Blightning.

Also, the Everlasting Torment seems bad against Martyr since all of a sudden their 1/1 creatures no longer completely lose to your 2/2 and bigger creatures. Rain of Gore seems better as their life gain can become deadly to them. The Torment does negate damage prevention, so if that ability is relevant, then I could see an argument for it, although Stromgald Crusader would be less good against white. I was also thinking about cutting the Rain of Gores altogether for Sulfur Elemental, which might be even better against Martyr.

Please correct me if my thinking is wrong anywhere here, but those are my thoughts.

Updated Decklist with tenative sideboard and hastily thrown together manabase:

4x Stromgald Crusader
4x Skinrender
4x Fleshbag Marauder
4x Death Baron
4x Lord of the Undead
4x Diregraf Ghoul
4x Gravecrawler

4x Nameless Inversion
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Ghoulcaller's Chant

8x Swamp
4x Lavaclaw Reaches
4x Blackcleave Cliffs
4x Dragonskull Summit

Sideboard:
4x Relic of Progenitus / Nihil Spellbomb / Leyline of the Void / Withered Wretch
4x Shattering Spree
4x Rain of Gore / Sulfur Elemental / Everlasting Torment
3x Combust / Torpor Orb

[sillyandrew]

nameless inversion turns off your own lord effects. is that worth it?

also, you're mana curve seems way too high.

[Zupponn]

Mana curve might be too high. I'm not sure yet, although I haven't had too many issues so far.
(16@1cc, 8@2cc, 12@3cc, 4@4cc, and 20 lands. Maybe the CIPT lands could be trouble, but the number of lands seems ok.)

Nameless Inversion on the other hand, is only used as removal. Never will I want to target my own creatures.

[The Pharmacist]

I really fell there needs to be a few Phyrexian Arena in this deck.

[Mr. Safety]

I think you could swap out 2x Ghoulcaller's Chant for 2 Phyrexian Arena. Your ability to land multiple threats a turn will be what pushes you ahead of other aggro decks.

I think that Blightning is worth the slots, maybe with another land or 2 to feed the upward creeping mana curve. If you can crap out 2-3 one-drops in the first two turns a turn 3 Blightning can be an incredible way to provide pressure and disruption.

I can't help but think that red opens up Anathemancer, which just happens to be a zombie. I like it better than Skinrender for providing a faster clock and bringing the mana-curve back down to a top-out of 3.

I like this setup slightly better:

4x Gravecrawler
4x Diregraf Ghoul
4x Stromgald Crusader
4x Lord of the Undead
4x Cemetery Reaper
4x Anathemancer

4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Blightning
4x Lightning Bolt
2x Phyrexian Arena
1x Ghoulcaller's Chant

4x Arid Mesa
4x Marsh Flats
2x Blood Crypt
4x Dragonskull Summit
4x Swamp
1x Mountain


It's aggressive with disruption, relying on tribal synergy and some ways of creating card advantage. Anathemancer punishes greedy mana-bases and Lightning Bolt provides reach. The only card that isn't in there that probably SHOULD be there is Terminate. I'm not sure how often you'll need something bigger than Lightning Bolt, but there are 15 open slots in the sideboard to allow for some flexibility.

[Zupponn]

I think the question we should be asking is if we want to be aggro or midrange. My list feels more like a midrange deck while yours feels more like an aggro deck. (Your list also only has 58 cards).

Phyrexian Arena does need to be tested, as its a way to replace the recursion abilities.

Also, I'm not sure I agree with putting in Cemetary Reaper over Death Baron. Is there a reason for this?

[The Pharmacist]

I'm thinking this deck needs something for the control match. I dropped Liliana Vess a few times in a modern tournament last weekend and she was just a beast! Not sure if her home is in the md or sb but she should be in there.

[Zupponn]

So far I've only tested my decklist against Zoo, which is a pretty even matchup, and Affinity, which is a very tough matchup preboard and even to good postboarding in Shattering Sprees.

I've done some testing with Mr. Safety's decklist versus Zoo, finding it to be a very tough matchup.

So, I have yet to test against control. I think I'll try out the UW Tron matchup when I get the time, unless there's a different one that seems like it might be popular.

[Mr. Safety]

I think the question we should be asking is if we want to be aggro or midrange. My list feels more like a midrange deck while yours feels more like an aggro deck. (Your list also only has 58 cards).

Phyrexian Arena does need to be tested, as its a way to replace the recursion abilities.

Also, I'm not sure I agree with putting in Cemetary Reaper over Death Baron. Is there a reason for this?

I goofed on the land count...it should have 21 lands rather than 19. Depending on the metagame, I think Tectonic Edge could be good for keeping control decks off of their 4th land for a short time, possibly buying you an extra turn. The other option is to just put in a few more basics. With the deck curving out at 3 mana, 21 lands feels right.

Cemetary Reaper over Death Baron = token producer + graveyard hate over deathtouch

I'm not sure how many times games will go long, but an unanswered Cemetery Reaper in the late game can clog up the board pretty good. He will be punching out a 3/3 zombie each turn while Death Baron is dependant on other dudes to be truly useful.

Yeah, the zoo matchup would be rough. They play your game but better. Liliana of the Veil could help out somewhat, as could some heavy-duty equipment like Sword of Fire and Ice. I might even go so far as to include Basilisk Collar and Grim Lavamancer in the sideboard for the aggro matchups. Zoo has always been good at preying on tribal decks (namely merfolk, elves aggro, and goblins in legacy) so it doesn't surprise me that it's a tough matchup in modern for tribal zombies.

If I were to sideboard Liliana Vess (which I probably wouldn't do) it would be alongside something like Firespout. LV would break the symmetry of wiping all the creatures off the board. A greater emphasis on Ghoulcaller's Chant would be neccessary as well. I like the new Liliana better for attacking zoo/aggro decks.

Here is another short list of options for ways of approaching the zoo matchup (essentially by putting in mid-range options):

Bituminous Blast
Lavaclaw Reaches
Goblin Ruinblaster
Slavering Nulls
Grixis Grimblade
Quest for the Gravelord
Shambling Remains


Of all of those options, I like Lavaclaw Reaches and Slavering Nulls the best. Quest for the gravelord has some interesting potential if you get the removal count a little higher. Zoo will be ripping your dudes off the table, feeding Quest nicely and giving you a somewhat out of reach 5/5 zombie to work with. Path deals with it but the only other option for them is to double up with burn/blockers.

[Zupponn]

I've repeatedly found Lavaclaw Reaches useful. I think it's worth it.

Slavering Nulls sounds really awesome, especially vs control decks.

[Mr. Safety]

Lavaclaw Reaches allows you to play wipers like Firespout and still kick ass. This isn't a fast-aggro approach but rather a mid-range approach...which is exactly what can mess up zoo (hopefullly!)

[4eak]

New card:

Diregraf Captain - 1UB
Creature - Zombie Soldier
Deathtouch
Other Zombie creatures you control get +1/+1.
Whenever another Zombie you control dies, target opponent loses 1 life.
2/2

So many Lords to choose from.


peace,
4eak

[The Pharmacist]

I've been testing Goyf out because we really need a 2 drop in this deck. I understand he's not a zombie but he's really working out well for me.

Also by adding green we get Maelstrom Pulse and that's been good also.

[264505]

New card:

Diregraf Captain - 1UB
Creature - Zombie Soldier
Deathtouch
Other Zombie creatures you control get +1/+1.
Whenever another Zombie you control dies, target opponent loses 1 life.
2/2

So many Lords to choose from.


peace,
4eak

There is also a decent 2 drop if you wanted to go into the self mill style for Skaabs.

Screeching Skaab

Creature - Zombie
When Screeching Skaab enters the battlefield, put the top two cards of your library into your graveyard.

2/1

There's also the reverse Kitchen Finks and a slightly better Ravenous Rats that could find slots in the deck depending on how you want it to play out. The reverse Finks is still competing with all the lords as a 3 drop though.

[Zupponn]

I've been thinking that the only way for a zombie deck to beat Affinity is to splash red for Shattering Spree.

[Heresia]

And Phylactery Lich? A 5/5 zombie for 3 indestructible in a mono black zombies.