[Deck] Turbofog

[4eak]

I've had a blast (most fun playing magic in quite a while) playing Turbofog in Legacy. Legacy, obviously, has fog spells with more bells'n'whistles, but the deck also has more to worry about in that format (thus, it needs those buffed fog effects more). Porting over, the deck maintains a solid draw engine and Leyline (a damn fine card) - defensively it isn't as powerful, but still decent.

Here is a list:

// Lands - 22
4 Sunpetal Grove
2 Wooded Bastion
5 Forest
11 Plains

// Draw Engine - 15
4 Howling Mine
4 Rites of Flourishing
4 Temple Bell
3 Font of Mythos

// Defense - 23
4 Ethereal Haze
3 Fog
4 Holy Day
4 Dawn Charm
4 Pollen Lullaby
4 Leyline of Sanctity

// Sideboard
SB: 3 Krosan Grip
SB: 3 Torpor Orb
SB: 3 Luminarch Ascension
SB: 3 Elixir of Immortality
SB: 3 Peace of Mind

The general gameplan is to play draw pieces, fog when necessary, and snowball into more fog effects, draw artifacts, and lands. Rinse and repeat (for the most part). You win by decking your opponent out. The deck looks slow, but it isn't (it can certainly win 2 of 3 in 50 minutes). Once the snowball gets rolling, you win very quickly.

As I've said before, the draw engine is cool in that it kills your opponent before it kills you, which is obviously the hilarious way to turn the major drawback of these cards (that your opponent draws first) into a benefit (namely, a win con).

The deck folds to plenty of combo decks. It happens to have a pretty decent matchup against decks which win with creatures (be they aggro, aggro-control, or even dedicated control). Admittedly, the Zoo/RDW matchups are not a cakewalk - I'd like to improve these.

From reading comments in the respective Legacy thread, it is obvious that most people haven't a clue about how to play or build the deck. I'm guessing the same will be true for the Modern forum here. I warn you now: this deck does not play magic as usual (it is norm-breaking like Dredge, in my opinion). You should probably take the deck for a spin before making suggestions.

As to immediate changes I'm working on: 1 Dual/4 Fetch is not out of the question. You want to minimize effects which decrease your library size (be they fetch, draw, opposing Goblin Guides, etc.) because you need to make sure your opponent draws out before you do. Also, I'd like a Privileged Position-type effect. I may just go with Greater Auramancy to protect Leyline (when I really need that card), but I'd like something which protects my artifacts as well.


peace,
4eak

[The Treefolk Master]

Have you considered Reliquary Tower? It would allow you to keep all those fog effects in your hand.

[4eak]

When you play the deck, you'll find that if you have 8 or more cards in hand, then you already have the ball rolling. You have at least 2 if not 3 draw engines in play by the time you start having that many cards in hand. Tower is almost always win-more at that point. I can see 1, but even then, you will likely prefer the color consistency instead.

I think the trick is to finding cards that help us get the balling rolling.


peace,
4eak

[MGC_player]

I used to be an avid player of Turbofog back during the std of TS/Lor and Lor/Ala. I haven't updated the deck in a while, although I can probably at least pitch around ideas until I update it for Modern.

If I was to update the list, it would probably look like this

Lands: 22
4 B/W dual - most likely Godless Shrine for Modern
3 Swamp
3 Ghost Quarter
2 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
10 Plains

Creatures: 4
4 Martyr of Sands

Draw: 11
4 Howling Mine
4 Temple Bell
3 Spiteful Visions

Defense: 23
4 Pollen Lullaby
4 Dawn Charm
4 Batwing Brume
3 Chronomantic Escape
3 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Runed Halo
2 Sunscour

Sideboard: 15
1 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Peace of Mind
3 Elixir of Immortality
3 Torpor Orb
3 Thoughtseize
3 Leyline of the Void

It has a very similar playstyle but it also can kill with damage. I've actually been able to finish a game in under 10 minutes with this configuration. While losing green makes me lose K. Grip, I now have proactive protection. It's also wonderful to let someone build up an army, then kill them on their attack step with Batwing Brume (Once caused a player to lose 21 life on the attack and he didn't see it coming).

The use of Martyr was actually very good for me in that era due to instantly giving me loads of life, allowing me to gain loads of time to get the Chronomantic Escape lock online.

The old version of the deck had issues with reactive control decks like Fae with Bitterblossom, but it played pretty well against the field. It also had Oblivion Ring to deal with problematic permanents and Idyllic Tutor to find enchantments like Story Circle, and other hoser enchantments.

[randomly.anonymous]

Will the deck benefit from running blue?

Perhaps it would be possible to cut green, as white already has strong fog effects (Pollen Lullaby, Ethereal Haze, Angelsong, Holy Day, or even Blessed Reversal). One could run Jaces (both could be viable), Snapcasters, and possibly Cryptic Command (the tap all mode is a fog effect).

Jace draws as many cards as rites of flourishing, may be a bit harder to cast due to UU, and doesn't allow additional landdrops (but also doesn't allow this for your opponents). It does die to creatures/removal (if you don't have leyline out), but its ultimate can be used four turns after it comes down and would likely cause them to lose on their next draw-step, it can also win the game on your turn (highly trivial, but worth noting, I suppose :tongue:).

I think it would be stronger than straight-up blue mill because of the fog effects and possibly better than GW because blue is so much stronger. Really the only effect you lose is Krosan Grip, but I can't think of any artifacts/enchantements that would be game breaking in a way that Wipe-away or Disenchant can't fix. Cryptic Command also adds more utility, and drawing 2/3 cards a turn should make it pretty easy to fulfill its UUU cost.

Perhaps something like this:

UW turbofog

4x Glacial Fortress
4x Mystic Gate
8x Island
6x Plains

4x Jace Beleren
4x Howling Mine
4x Temple Bell
3x Font of Mythos

4x Holy Day
4x Ethereal Haze
4x Pollen Lullaby
4x Dawn Charm
3x Cryptic Command

4x Leyline of Sanctity

[Maagler]

I personally love turbofog, Ive played it a bunch online for modern and I think in the right metagame it could do well. I have found that it does not do well against artifact or enchantment destruction, because of this I would highly suggest using either Apostle's Blessing, or Rebuff the Wicked in the side.

[NokoKonozko]

Wow. I didn't know you started this thread for modern! I have been testing turbofog out in modern as well after how much i have loved playing this deck in legacy.

I dropped green because I felt like it didn't have enough to offer in modern. My list is U/W and plays Jace as a draw engine (if played early enough his ultimate can speed things up to get on to G2) and Magosi, the Waterveil/Chronomantic Escape. Also I picked up Scepter just because it has proven itself well in this format given that the fog effects aren't quite as strong as in legacy and they never work for more than 1 turn (other than the occasional Pollen Lullaby).

I'll post my list sometime tomorrow, but it's late and I need sleep now.

[4eak]

The format is still pretty wild, which is not great for this deck. I've not been as impressed by this deck in Modern as I have been in Legacy either. I agree with Scepter for Modern. The risks are necessary.

// Lands - 21
21 Plains

// Draw/CA - 16
4 Howling Mine
4 Temple Bell
4 Font of Mythos
4 Isochron Scepter

// Defense - 23
4 Ethereal Haze
4 Holy Day
4 Dawn Charm
4 Pollen Lullaby
3 Angelsong
4 Leyline of Sanctity

Still trying out Chronomantic Escape.


peace,
4eak

[Caralord]

Hi,

I do like your mono white list 4eak and I came up with a very similar one. But wouldn't it be worth running some Silence?

What about Angel's Grace, Nevermore, Runed Halo for the sideboard?

I'd like to get into Modern but I don't really know the format right know. This deck looks cool but with that gameplan you are 100% sure the opponent will find his hate, that can be really bad. And the Eldrazi just kill the deck and are popular, aren't they?

Do you think this deck is really viable?

[Maëlig]

Needs a way to deal with eldrazis. Any ideas?

[MGC_player]

The W/b version can deal with decks that have reshuffle effects because its not as dependent on the mill aspect. It is one of the reasons I liked the W/b variant back in TS/Lor standard. You can mill them out or kill them with damage. I had to deal a similar problem some time ago in my meta (ramp decks running multiples of Primal Command) since there were two of us running different variants of Turbofog (the other guy was running W/G). The W/b version can also end three games in under 50 minutes with the fastest only lasting 10 minutes. In addition, if you really need permanent grave hate Leyline of the Void is open to you as you can also hardcast it if necessary.

[Dsch]

I prefer Wb route too. This is the list I would start toying around:

// Lands
6 [10E] Plains (1)
4 [10E] Swamp (3)
4 [ISD] Isolated Chapel
4 [ZEN] Kabira Crossroads
4 [GP] Godless Shrine

// Spells
2 [ALA] Angelsong
4 [PLC] Extirpate
4 [M11] Leyline of Sanctity
4 [10E] Howling Mine
4 [LRW] Pollen Lullaby
4 [CHK] Ethereal Haze
4 [TSB] Darkness
4 [10E] Holy Day
4 [CFX] Font of Mythos
4 [M11] Temple Bell

// Sideboard
SB: 3 [9E] Peace of Mind
SB: 4 [LRW] Thoughtseize
SB: 4 [M11] Silence
SB: 4 [PLC] Rebuff the Wicked

[Maëlig]

Even if you take care of the mill problem, the thing is that fogs doesn't stop annihilator. I don't think there's any easy solution to that though, so we might just have to live with it.

[MGC_player]

For dealing with Annihilator, there aren't really many options. Ensnaring Bridge and Chronomantic Escape are pretty much the only cards I saw that get rid of the attack step, which would be another + of using Chronomantic Escape besides the lock it can do. Another solution would be to just deal with them when they land in that really narrow window with Oblivion Ring or wrath effects. Permanents that tap creatures are another thing as well (this is my least favorite option). I don't recall many decks that can put one into play at end of turn besides Summoning Trap so unless Emrakul is hardcast it shouldn't be as much of a problem.

[Mr. Safety]

Both of these are viable options against eldrazis that are less narrow than Ensnaring Bridge:


Trip Noose
Tumble Magnet

[optml]

A couple more cards to consider, keeping with the mono-white deck, that can deal with Eldrazi:

condemn
devouring light
dispense justice
dispatch
path to exile

I think I'll take a version of this to a mordern tournament next week, so if there's anything of value to mention, I'll write it up.

[Mr. Safety]

A couple more cards to consider, keeping with the mono-white deck, that can deal with Eldrazi:

condemn
devouring light
dispense justice
dispatch
path to exile

I think I'll take a version of this to a mordern tournament next week, so if there's anything of value to mention, I'll write it up.

Just a quick disclaimer: none of those deal with Emrakul fyi...

[optml]

Yes, you're right. I always forget Emrakul's caveat: "Protection from colored spells".

What a seriously mental creature.

Well, the spells deal with the other Eldrazi that might turn up; Emmy is still a problem.

[bokwinkle]

Runed Halo and Oblivion ring are 2 of the best answers to Eldrazi. There are some other off-beat choices, but those are the ones that are most versatile - and viable imho. They definitely have a weakness to K-grip though...

A couple of cards I would look at include the following:

Gideon Jura
Intervention Pact
Dawnglow Infusion
Elixir of Immortality
Perimeter Captain
Wall of Omens
Elspeth, Knight-Errant
Auriok Champion
Day of Judgment

In the board there are few great cards too, including:

Divine Offering
Oust
Nature's Claim

Honestly - I think any list that I would build would start with Day and Path. Path delays the game AND gives them another card out of their deck - it juts makes sense. Day is simply the best reset card available.

Of the cards in my considering list I'd have to run a couple of Gideon's - they fog, kill dudes, and offer an alternate win-con, and a one-of elixir seems to make a lot of sense. Personally I'd at least try blue/white build with walls and 'Walkers (and cryptic command - maybe sleep - definitely snapcaster)...but that's without any sort of testing or real understanding of the meta.

Has any thought been given to the old Open the Vaults/Fog build? I rocked standard with that deck once upon a time. It's definitely a different deck (since it doesn't win via mill that often) - but it plays a lot of the same cards and is more resilient to hate - and gives another option to winning when an eldrazi keeps you from milling.

[Admiral_Arzar]

Note that Runed Halo doesn't actually protect you from Annihilator, as Eldrazi can still attack you (even though they won't deal damage as long as Halo is in play). I also think blue is awful here because you don't want to draw more cards than your opponent.

[Jenni]

So I've been toying around with a G/W turbofog-ish modern deck recently, I don't play modern much, but it's done fairly well against most of my friend's decks. worst matchup is vs eldrazi thanks to annihilator. I have Oblivion rings in the sideboard to handle Emrakul and his ilk, since I honestly can't think of much else to do about them.

Anyway, how important has all the extra draw power been for this deck to people who play it more?
I know it speeds things up a bit, but at the moment I only have 7 of the "Each draws one" effects, coupled with a few millstones, and it's worked for me pretty well. It's a lot slower, and I get to a low life total before I start to stabilize by taking early hits, but once I'm drawing 2-3 cards a turn it tends to not matter too much.

I found room for 2 Stirring Wildwoods in the deck as a "Plan B", in case the mill plan won't work for whatever reason, Or just as an x/4 blocker to save fog effects from time to time. Haven't had a chance to really test them, but the games go so long that it could potentially be relevant.

[MGC_player]

While I play the W/b version. I find that the extra draw power is important as it helps you stabilize faster, but if you have too much you don't have enough space for additional answers you might need in an unknown meta. I wouldn't go lower than 10 drawing sources as I find that the deck really starts losing consistency when you have less than 10. I personally didn't see much of a difference between 10-12 draw effects so I typically use 11-12 draw effects. I have gone with higher numbers of draw, and it was effective; however, those were times when I scouted my meta and knew what to expect along with there not being a lot of variation at that time. Granted, in some of my other variants, I did use Idyllic Tutor to help me find the draw cards (like Rites of Flourishing and Spiteful Visions) and the silver bullets (Runed Halo, Oblivion Ring, Teferi's Moat, etc...) so that could be a potential route to explore as well.