WotC Card Previews

[Pinder]

I didn't see a thread for this yet, so I figured I'd start one. Mods, feel free to merge/delete this if there's already something like it.

The first two Time Spiral previews on Wizards.com are up (they're on mtgsalvation too):

Sedge Sliver 2R
Creature - Sliver (R)
All Slivers have "This creature gets +1/+1 as long as you control a swamp" and "B: Regenerate this creature"
2/2

Not really that spectacular or splashy, but hey, it's a Sliver (Yay)!

The second card is much more splashy:

Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir 2UUU
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard (R)
Flash (You may play this spell any time you may play an instant)
Creature cards you own that aren't in play have Flash.
Each opponent can play spells only at any time they may play a sorcery.
3/4

I imagine that quicksilver is shitting his pants about now. Sure, he's a hefty 5 mana, but he's instant, and he totally hoses Solidarity to the face.

Discuss.

[Eldariel]

Well, if there are other Slivers of that powerlevel, they could certainly be a force to reckon with, even in 5 colors, since playing with 20 Muscle Slivers is just dirty. Oh yea, it gives Regeneration too. And then there's Crystalline and Winged aka. Major Headache.

Teferi seems fun, but unless you can abuse his ability (like casting spells, then responding with a Balance-like effect), I don't see him doing too much. Blue isn't short in measures to stop Solidarity to start with...

[Bane of the Living]

Wow EOT Tefri for the win? He's should be played in ATS if that deck still exists.

[Evil Roopey]

I'm just going to make this where we discuss spoiler cards.

Creature - Elf Shaman 3G
All Saprolings get +1/+1.
Morph- 3GG (You may play this face down as a 2/2 creature for . Turn it face up any time for its morph cost.)
When Thelonite Hermit is turned face up, put four 1/1 green Saproling tokens into play.
Illus. Chippy
1/1


Giggety.

[Pinder]

I like the new hermit, but no Squirrels? It should be squirrels. The only problem I really see with him is that he only makes tokens when he flips (for 5), meaning that overall you have to pay 8 mana over 2 turns (or over 1 turn I suppose, but really now) in order to make this guy useful. I guess if you wanted to keep Hermit Druid around, you'd have to pay 10 over 2 turns, but I'm still not sure how I feel about him having to to flip in order to get your dudes.

As for the sliver, all he does is turn all slivers into Sedge Trolls (http://ww2.wizards.com/gatherer/CardDetails.aspx?&id=220). I guess that's why he's called Sedge Sliver. I suppose I can see him alongside Muscle Sliver making all the Slivers huge, but I hope they've got some better Slivers in the works here.

As for Teferi, Eldariel is right. He has some gee-whiz factor when you look at him, but overall he's too expensive to do anything terribly broken with him. He's a decent clock in Mono-U Control if it decided to make a comeback, though. Then it would have MD tech against the mirror :laugh:!

EDIT: Looks like we've got a couple more.

Amrou Scout 1W
Creature - Kithkin Scout Rebel (C)
4,T : Search your library for a Rebel card with converted mana cost 3 or less and put that card into play. Then shuffle your library.
2/1

and

Mindstab 5B
Sorcery
Target player discards 3 cards.
Suspend 4 — B (Rather than play this card from your hand, pay and remove it from the game with four time counters on it. At the beginning of your upkeep, remove a time counter. When you remove the last, play it without paying its mana cost.)

The scout is a decent 2/1 for 2, but we won't know his (her?) true potential till we see more TS cards. I'm definitely aiming for Rebel tribal during prerelease, though :laugh:.

Mindstab is just plain dumb. Sure, you can suspend it on first turn, then watch it resolve on 5th turn. Ooh! What are the odds that you opponent will even have 3 cards by then? And they can see it coming from about 5 turns away, so any smart player will be able to play around it like a pro.

I guess we know what this art (http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=27950&d=1155342676) is for now, though.

[Drkdstryer]

There are decks that run Sedge Troll still right? I mean I don't know if Red Death (still?) does, but this is just strictly better - yes, it actually is strictly better. So any decks I see with Sedge Troll in them should instantly replace them with Sedge Sliver.

[Alfred]

I hope they do a "Sliver Ringleader". It might even make Slivers a playable deck in Legacy!

[troopatroop]

Teferi makes an ATS style deck seem pretty crazy. Turning any creature into an instant in a survival deck is like... retarded. I can't even begin to think of all the possibilities for combat tricks. UUU makes Diablos cry tho :(

[MasterBlaster]

Teferi makes an ATS style deck seem pretty crazy. Turning any creature into an instant in a survival deck is like... retarded. I can't even begin to think of all the possibilities for combat tricks. UUU makes Diablos cry tho :(

Teferi also makes keeping your opponent under froglock easier as their STP/burn is all sorcery speed.

[troopatroop]

It basically means that they can't surprise you at all, and with enough outs, Survival is GG. Honestly, that card is nuts.

[M.Maddox]

Except for the fact that it costs 5 mana, 3 of it UUU.

[scrumdogg]

1 Sedge Troll is OK, making everything a Sedge Troll for free? That's awesome, especially in a deck that can combine 37 other flavors of ridiculous free abilities. And the fact that you can now play 4 Muscle & 4 Sedge and they curve well? Time to work on 5c Sliver Survival...which leads to the next card. Teferi is an assbeating on stick. Forget the goddamn mana cost already, you're playing SotF which means you have accelerators and fixers, dammit. Any competent SotF player will have the ability cast this against any combo except IGGy, which doesn't care about it....as High Tide also makes your blue sources double.... But expand your minds for a moment and let the delicious possibilities wash over you. FEB just got a boost as Volrath's Shapeshifter becomes a must counter for blue based decks...on Turn 2 probably.... Show & Tell is another possibility, or Gamekeeper somehow, there are ways to cheat this guy into play. Or you are playing blue...you might have access to counter magic...or you could combo with black as this plus discard is a good 1-2 punch. Or you could Reanimate him, not a huge beater, but with an awesome ability. Good call on Frog Lock combining with Teferi, btw, although you almost want a way to protect him when he comes in vs aggro/aggro-control, Sorcery Speed STP or Goblin anything still shanks Teferi.... Don't be negative, don't lock down the possibilities, this is the time to get creative & have fun!

[Pinder]

There are decks that run Sedge Troll still right? I mean I don't know if Red Death (still?) does, but this is just strictly better - yes, it actually is strictly better. So any decks I see with Sedge Troll in them should instantly replace them with Sedge Sliver.

True. It's pretty much a Sedge Troll that happens to get really fucking awesome in the sliver matchup. Of course, it would make their Slivers better too. But only if they were running black, right?


I hope they do a "Sliver Ringleader". It might even make Slivers a playable deck in Legacy!

That would be fantastic. A few of my friends and I are tuning a Sliver deck as we speak (we should have a list up by later today), and it has pretty decent matchups already. A ringleader would push it over the top into viable-ville.

And I agree that ATS is probably the best home for Teferi. As a player who lost to ATS many a time back during its heyday, I think this dude might be able to push it back into decent viability.

[Drkdstryer]

Well, since the sliver match up in non-existant (probably), I was thinking of how when you had 2 Sedge Slivers out they gave each other the bonus, so they become 4/4's. That alone makes the sliver better than the troll.

[TheDarkshineKnight]

I didn't see a thread for this yet, so I figured I'd start one. Mods, feel free to merge/delete this if there's already something like it.

The first two Time Spiral previews on Wizards.com are up (they're on mtgsalvation too):

Sedge Sliver 2R
Creature - Sliver (R)
All Slivers have "This creature gets +1/+1 as long as you control a swamp" and "B: Regenerate this creature"
2/2

Not really that spectacular or splashy, but hey, it's a Sliver (Yay)!

The second card is much more splashy:

Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir 2UUU
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard (R)
Flash (You may play this spell any time you may play an instant)
Creature cards you own that aren't in play have Flash.
Each opponent can play spells only at any time they may play a sorcery.
3/4

I imagine that quicksilver is shitting his pants about now. Sure, he's a hefty 5 mana, but he's instant, and he totally hoses Solidarity to the face.

Discuss.

Teferi makes me horny. Survival just got a positive matchup against Solidarity.

[iOWN]

Teferi makes me horny. Survival just got a positive matchup against Solidarity.

Well, if Survival was splashing blue, couldn't it just run Countermagic?

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Sure, but since Solidarity runs an assload of permission, this makes it even better!

[pooispoois]

I don't understand all this fuss about Teferi. You pay 5 mana, 3 of it blue, to have an average body and an ability that isn't game-winning by any stretch of the imagination (well, perhaps against blue control, but what blue control player is going to let a 5-mana dude come into play?). Sedge Sliver is much more exciting than it. I doubt it will see play in Type 2, much less in Legacy. Chalice for 2 is much stronger than this guy, and it doesn't require all that blue mana (not to mention Chalice itself is much more proactive and flexible).
Even Arcanis is stronger than Teferi.

[MattH]

Trinket Mage for Chalice is a better play than Teferi. Or any number of black things.

[JeremM]

Evangelize probably won't see much Legacy play. Only Angel Stompy can support its mana cost, and it's rather limited - your opponent will hand over their Lackey, Cloud of Faeries, or some other utility creature than their Serendibs and Angels.

In somewhat related news, looking at those sketches in the Arcana, that one with the Mayan temples is almost certainly a reference to everyone's favorite old memory - who's up for a suspending Draw3? Might be saucy in Faerie Stompy, if the price is right (2U with suspend < 4), by gassing back up after an opponent's thrown their disruption at your first creatures/equipment.

[Pinder]

We've got a new one from this article (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/daily/aa244):

Evangelize 4W
Sorcery (R)
Buyback 2WW
Gain control of target creature of an opponent's choice that he or she controls.

Wow, that's bad.

What I'm more interested in though, is the second to last line of the article:



Well, here's the deal. I've already written all about it. But you can't see it for another four turns…which translates into, oh, about a week. Then the article (and the card) will come into play.


I honestly skimmed, so I have no idea. Any thoughts?

[Drathro]

We've got a new preview card (and a half [not a half card, just an incomplete preview]) at Wizards today, which people will probably talk about.

What i got from the preview is that Suspend just got better - it seems you can suspend stuff at any time you have priority:

A card with suspend gives you the following ability: As a special action - which means this can only be done when you have priority but doesn't use the stack - you may remove a card with suspend from the game. Because the special action doesn't use the stack, it cannot be responded to. This means it cannot be countered or manipulated in any way. Also note that targets aren't chosen yet. You then pay the suspend cost and add the appropriate number of time counters. At the beginning of each of your upkeeps, you'll remove a time counter. When the last counter comes off, you must play it, although you do not pay the mana cost. It is at this time that targets for the spell are chosen and that the opponent has a chance to respond to it. This is the point where you are allowed to counter it or manipulate it in some way. If the spell was a creature, it gains haste when played, meaning it can attack the turn it comes into play.
This means that you can suspend cards during your opponent's turn. This makes the new Lotus Watchamacallit just a smidge better for sure, and means that suspend might actually be useful in control decks (EOT suspend).

[Ewokslayer]

We've got a new preview card (and a half [not a half card, just an incomplete preview]) at Wizards today, which people will probably talk about.

What i got from the preview is that Suspend just got better - it seems you can suspend stuff at any time you have priority:

This means that you can suspend cards during your opponent's turn. This makes the new Lotus Watchamacallit just a smidge better for sure, and means that suspend might actually be useful in control decks (EOT suspend).

That is not correct.
From the official rules at the bottom of the page
502.59. Suspend

502.59a Suspend is a keyword that represents three abilities. The first is a static ability that functions while the card with suspend is in a player's hand. The second and third are triggered abilities that function in the removed-from-the-game zone. "Suspend N--[cost]" means "If you could play this card from your hand, you may pay [cost] and remove it from the game with N time counters on it. This action doesn't use the stack," and "At the beginning of your upkeep, if this card is suspended, remove a time counter from it," and "When the last time counter is removed from this card, if it's removed from the game, play it without paying its mana cost if able. If you can't, it remains removed from the game. If you play it this way and it's a creature, it gains haste until you lose control of it."

* The phrase "if you could play this card from your hand" checks only for timing restrictions and permissions. This includes both what's inherent in the card's type (for example, if the card with suspend is a creature, it must be your main phase and the stack must be empty) and what's imposed by other abilities, such as flash or Meddling Mage's ability. Whether you could actually follow all steps in playing the card is irrelevant. If the card is impossible to play due to a lack of legal targets or an unpayable mana cost, for example, it may still be removed from the game with suspend.

[Drathro]

That is not correct.
From the official rules at the bottom of the page
502.59. Suspend

502.59a Suspend is a keyword that represents three abilities. The first is a static ability that functions while the card with suspend is in a player's hand. The second and third are triggered abilities that function in the removed-from-the-game zone. "Suspend N--[cost]" means "If you could play this card from your hand, you may pay [cost] and remove it from the game with N time counters on it. This action doesn't use the stack," and "At the beginning of your upkeep, if this card is suspended, remove a time counter from it," and "When the last time counter is removed from this card, if it's removed from the game, play it without paying its mana cost if able. If you can't, it remains removed from the game. If you play it this way and it's a creature, it gains haste until you lose control of it."

This is what I originally thought, but I didn't realize there were official rules hiding at the end of the article. In that case, Rosewater just did a crappy job of introducing Suspend, and I read half an article, when I should have read the fine print.

[quicksilver]

As for today's puzzle card. I'm pretty sure I got the main part of the card. I didn't bother with most of it but I'm pretty sure it is a legendary creature with converted mana cost 7 or greater that has "Whenever you play a creature spell, put X 1/1 Thrulls into play where x is that creatures converted mana cost. When there are 7 or more thrulls in play sacrifice him." Doesn't seem very good since he costs a fortune and requires you to cast other creatures, making him sub par in reanimator even.

[Alfred]

As for today's puzzle card. I'm pretty sure I got the main part of the card. I didn't bother with most of it but I'm pretty sure it is a legendary creature with converted mana cost 7 or greater that has "Whenever you play a creature spell, put X 1/1 Thrulls into play where x is that creatures converted mana cost. When there are 7 or more thrulls in play sacrifice him." Doesn't seem very good since he costs a fortune and requires you to cast other creatures, making him sub par in reanimator even.

I think he costs 4 mana, and he's legendary, which is why he dies. 2BB if I'm not mistaken with the ability you described.

Also, he's a 2/2.

[quicksilver]

I think he costs 4 mana, and he's legendary, which is why he dies. 2BB if I'm not mistaken with the ability you described.

Also, he's a 2/2.

Oh yeah he doesn't have to be 7 mana. I was thinking he does because he dies if you play another one, thinking that the tokens will kill him but the legendary part kills him.

[tivadar]

Currently there are two cards I'm looking at, and thinking they could actually be good, and they're both red:

Word of Seizing
Instant R
Split second (As long as this spell is on the stack, players can't play spells or activated abilities that aren't mana abilities)
Untap target permanent and gain control of it until end of turn. It gains haste until end of turn.

Nothing startling, but to sieze anything your opponent has without giving them a chance to do anything just seems like it could be good.

Ignite Memories
Sorcery U
Target player reveals a card at random from his or her hand. Ignite memories deals damage to that player equal to that card's converted mana cost.
Storm (When you play this spell, copy it for each spell played before it this turn. You may choose new targets for the copies.)

An interesting potential storm combo card. Not awesome, but a lot better than tendrils, as it's mono-red, and can potentially do a lot more than tendrils can per storm count. Against decks that run high cc cards (rock and truffle shuffle), it seems like a better choice (especially with seething song and the like).

[Aggro_zombies]

An interesting potential storm combo card. Not awesome, but a lot better than tendrils, as it's mono-red, and can potentially do a lot more than tendrils can per storm count. Against decks that run high cc cards (rock and truffle shuffle), it seems like a better choice (especially with seething song and the like).
The question is, is there a red storm combo deck out there? The advantage of Tendrils is you can go black/blue and have all the same things red and blue would have in terms of draw, but the mana acceleration is cheaper and therefore better.

The card I'm interested in is Phyrexian Totem:

Phyrexian Totem (U)
3
Artifact
Tap: add B to your mana pool.
2B: ~ becomes a 5/5 black Horror artifact creature with trample until end of turn. Whenever ~ is dealt damage, if it's a creature, sacrifice that mana permanents.

I really like it for Pox as a nice clock and a compliment to Nether Spirit and Chimeric Idol. Getting mana out of it is hawt too, but I really like the "5/5 trample" bit because it's a really fast clock post-Pox. Of course, Negator drawback and 2B to activate hurt it...a lot...

[Bane of the Living]

The question is, is there a red storm combo deck out there? The advantage of Tendrils is you can go black/blue and have all the same things red and blue would have in terms of draw, but the mana acceleration is cheaper and therefore better.

The card I'm interested in is Phyrexian Totem:

Phyrexian Totem (U)
3
Artifact
Tap: add B to your mana pool.
2B: ~ becomes a 5/5 black Horror artifact creature with trample until end of turn. Whenever ~ is dealt damage, if it's a creature, sacrifice that mana permanents.

I really like it for Pox as a nice clock and a compliment to Nether Spirit and Chimeric Idol. Getting mana out of it is hawt too, but I really like the "5/5 trample" bit because it's a really fast clock post-Pox. Of course, Negator drawback and 2B to activate hurt it...a lot...

This card may be a good replacement for Negator in alot of cases. Especially in Pox! He'll be cast safely out of your hand if your opponent taps out but he wont be a target for swords. You have time to peel the removal from your opponents grasp. This card will probably be huge with Mutilate or even Deed under 3. I cant wait to see the red, white, and green totems.

[Tacosnape]

I think he costs 4 mana, and he's legendary, which is why he dies. 2BB if I'm not mistaken with the ability you described.

Also, he's a 2/2.

He could also be 3B, if you count Parallax Dementia as a permanent bonus.

Anyway, his name is Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder. He's on the quote of Derelor. I 'think' his art is #16.

[Di]

Withering Dark 4B
Instant
Destroy target nonblack creature.
Madness B


What is this? Cheap removal for madness maybe?

[Canook]

Withering Dark 4B
Instant
Destroy target nonblack creature.
Madness B


What is this? Cheap removal for madness maybe?

Tog!

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Wow, Tog is a happy camper.

[Drkdstryer]

He could also be 3B, if you count Parallax Dementia as a permanent bonus.

Anyway, his name is Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder. He's on the quote of Derelor. I 'think' his art is #16.

No, a solution has been found for 4B. I think that kinda stops his usefulness :\

EDIT: Actually a method has just been found for 5BBB... there are just too many options (the 5BBB is pretty far-fetched, it involves Mycosynth Golem and 11 0cc artifacts). It all depends on what Jeff Till decided to use really. I don't think a definitive mana cost will be shown until Wednesday.

[troopatroop]

B/u/g MadnessLoamAggroTog got a nice tool.

[Aggro_zombies]

Today's card: Wheel of Fate. Suspend 4 - 1R (no actual casting cost), each player discards their hand and draws seven. So...it's a great way for burn to refill its hand late game to go for that final push, but beyond that, I don't see it having much use. A lot of decks that could play this card kinda want to, you know, do something on turn two. Like, something other than play a spell that won't actually be useful for another four turns. That said, will this see any play in Legacy? It's a great effect...


Especially in Pox! He'll be cast safely out of your hand if your opponent taps out but he wont be a target for swords. You have time to peel the removal from your opponents grasp.
Yeah, that's my reaction too. It's too bad I won't be able to play it this weekend when I take Pox to my local Legacy tournament...which reminds me, someone should bump that Pox thread.

[Anarky87]

Yeah, that's my reaction too. It's too bad I won't be able to play it this weekend when I take Pox to my local Legacy tournament...which reminds me, someone should bump that Pox thread.

Is your recent list on there? You could bump with your list update.

Edit: Or PM your list, I enjoy Pox updates. That way it's not really unneccesarilly bumping it.

[TheDarkshineKnight]

I'll say it: Suspend fucking blows. Sure, it'll be interesting in Standard Constructed, but, in formats with larger card pools like Legacy and Vintage, there's so much mana generation that trading tempo so as to spend less mana is a death wish.

[quicksilver]

I'll say it: Suspend fucking blows. Sure, it'll be interesting in Standard Constructed, but, in formats with larger card pools like Legacy and Vintage, there's so much mana generation that trading tempo so as to spend less mana is a death wish.

Agreed, suspened is not a Legacy mechanic at all and probably will not show up in any competitive legacy decks. It's not for us, let's just ignore it instead of complaining about it. However abilities like split second are for us, we just need them to put it on a good card.

[scrumdogg]

You mean like the red one that steals one of your Solidarity opponents islands? That seems pretty cool with any sort of mana accel. As for suspend, it seems to suck serious ass, but someone will put together a combo-control deck that sets up and does seriously anti-social things on Turn 6-7, watch & see.

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Agreed, suspened is not a Legacy mechanic at all and probably will not show up in any competitive legacy decks. It's not for us, let's just ignore it instead of complaining about it. However abilities like split second are for us, we just need them to put it on a good card.

Split Second AND Flash.

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Okay, so we knew about Magus of the Jar and Magus of the Mirror from over at MTGSalvation, but Wizards decided to drop this guy on us:

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/daily/mf111

Magus of the Disk
2WW
Creature - Human Wizard
Magus of the Disk comes into play tapped.
1, Tap: Destroy all artifacts, creatures, and enchantments.
2/4

The fact that this guy is going to be in Standard as Loxodon Heirarch is rediculous. O_o

Anyhoo, it's Nevinyrral's Disk turned into a creature.

[Ophidian]

Okay, so we knew about Magus of the Jar and Magus of the Mirror from over at MTGSalvation, but Wizards decided to drop this guy on us:

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/daily/mf111

Magus of the Disk
2WW
Creature - Human Wizard
Magus of the Disk comes into play tapped.
1, Tap: Destroy all artifacts, creatures, and enchantments.
2/4

The fact that this guy is going to be in Standard as Loxodon Heirarch is rediculous. O_o

Anyhoo, it's Nevinyrral's Disk turned into a creature.


Okay, so we're going to have a set of creatures that sacrifice to mimic an artfact ability

Blue = Memory Jar
Black = Mirror Universe
White = Nevinyrral's Disk
Green = ??? Sword of the Ages maybe? I would think Coat of Arms, but it doesn't sacrifice, and wouldn't have a permanent effect. SOTA is the only thing I could think of that is Green'ish
Red = ?? Wow, I have no idea...

It looks like the same thing for the Suspend cards with no casting cost:

Red = Wheel of Fortune
Artifact = Black Lotus
Blue = ?? Although there is a pic floating around that looks a lot like Ancestral
White = ?? Perhaps Balance? I mean.. Balance would't be AS broke if you saw it coming.. not the same as windmilling if off the top of your deck to stop the horde of creatures staring you down next turn.
Black = ?? Demonic Tutor (drools), Mind Twist, perhaps?
Green = ?? Perhaps Fastbond or Channel?

[atv]

Okay, so we're going to have a set of creatures that sacrifice to mimic an artfact ability

Blue = Memory Jar
Black = Mirror Universe
White = Nevinyrral's Disk

Green = ??? Sword of the Ages maybe? I would think Coat of Arms, but it doesn't sacrifice, and wouldn't have a permanent effect. SOTA is the only thing I could think of that is Green'ish


My educated guess is Candelabra of Tawnos.



Red = ?? Wow, I have no idea...


Cursed Scroll?

[Alfred]

Magus of the Disk is incredibly good. I don't know if it can be accomodated in this format, but it is not only a threat, it's also a resiliant blocker that makes an opponent overcommit by itself. Man, what a great card.

[Ophidian]

My educated guess is Candelabra of Tawnos.



Cursed Scroll?



I had considered Scroll (Candy never crossed my mind) But the vibe I got from the cards is that they all require a sacrifice---At least so far, all of the Magus' (Magi?) do.

[atv]

But the vibe I got from the cards is that they all require a sacrifice---At least so far, all of the Magus' (Magi?) do.

You don't actually have to sacrifice Magus of the Disk. Like the card it's modeled after, it only dies because of the wrath effect. So it's possible to bounce it back to hand or regenerate it.

[Aggro_zombies]

I had considered Scroll (Candy never crossed my mind) But the vibe I got from the cards is that they all require a sacrifice---At least so far, all of the Magus' (Magi?) do.
We also know from one of the wallpaper puzzles on the Time Spiral minisite that there's a Magus of the Scroll, with a heavy red background. Also, the blue and black magi are modeled after artifacts that also required themselves to be sacrificed as part of their cost. Therefore, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cursed Sroll-esque magus didn't require a sacrifice.

As for Magus of the Disk, finally I have a use for That Which Was Taken in casual!

[quicksilver]

As for Magus of the Disk, finally I have a use for That Which Was Taken in casual!

Not really a combo. The magus will destory the "That which was taken", and without it, the divinity counter does not make it indestructible. Better to have the origional disk and that artifact that makes all artifacts indestructible.

[Aggro_zombies]

Not really a combo. The magus will destory the "That which was taken", and without it, the divinity counter does not make it indestructible. Better to have the origional disk and that artifact that makes all artifacts indestructible.
>.>

<.<

Oops. I forgot That Which Was Taken can't put counters on itself. Yeah, you're right. Okay, I still haven't found a use for that pile in casual. Way to ruin my day, thanks. :rolleyes:

[Watcher487]

>.>

<.<

Oops. I forgot That Which Was Taken can't put counters on itself. Yeah, you're right. Okay, I still haven't found a use for that pile in casual. Way to ruin my day, thanks. :rolleyes:

Well if you had a March of the Machines and 2 Opalesences it would work after you put counters on all of them (5 total) But your better off putting a Vanishing on him and with the effect on the stack Phase him out. (AKA the old Disk trick)

[Pinder]

Am I the only one that's pretty excited about Paradox Haze?

Paradox Haze 2U
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant Player
At the beginning of enchanted player's first upkeep each turn, that player gets an additional upkeep after this step.

Just from looking at it, it seems like this card is begging to have a Stax deck build around it (like we need another one :laugh:). Or something abusing Tangle Wire. You tap 8, I tap 3, you tap 6, I tap 2.....it can get pretty sick.

[Evil Roopey]

Am I the only one that's pretty excited about Paradox Haze?

Paradox Haze 2U
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant Player
At the beginning of enchanted player's first upkeep each turn, that player gets an additional upkeep after this step.

Just from looking at it, it seems like this card is begging to have a Stax deck build around it (like we need another one :laugh:). Or something abusing Tangle Wire. You tap 8, I tap 3, you tap 6, I tap 2.....it can get pretty sick.

Why not a Stax list running Stax, Wire, and a bunch of other good shit, Braids?

[Nightmare]

This card is the very definition of win-more in Stax. It literally only helps when you're already winning.

[Evil Roopey]

Or it might give Stax the speed it has been longing for.

[Nightmare]

Or it might give Stax the speed it has been longing for.
Speed has never been the issue. Consistency and adapatability have been. Stax is incredible at beating either Control and Combo, or beating Aggro. But never at the same time. This doesn't help either case, and is only good when you have a loaded Wire or a ramped Stack on the table. If you do, you're generally in a good position anyway. If you don't, it just sits there and wastes three mana.

[Ewokslayer]

Speed has never been the issue. Consistency and adapatability have been. Stax is incredible at beating either Control and Combo, or beating Aggro. But never at the same time. This doesn't help either case, and is only good when you have a loaded Wire or a ramped Stack on the table. If you do, you're generally in a good position anyway. If you don't, it just sits there and wastes three mana.

Plus it gets completely hosed by Eon Hub.

[troopatroop]

Eon Hub wrecks it.

[JeremM]

I'm a bit of a fan of Quinton Hoover's old art, but the art for Vesuvian Shapeshifter isn't in his old style at all. I understand that artists change style over the years, but Hoover's new look feels far more generic than stuff like the old Doppleganger and such.

(EDIT) I know it's not fully kosher, but can anyone post what the SCG Premium preview card does? I'm curious as hell what the suspend cost of a Draw3 for U is, and what its hardcast cost is.

[Bastian]

It's basically a watered down Ancestral Recall. It's a blue sorcery spell with suspend - 4. The suspend cost is U and allows target player to draw 3 cards.

Ancestral Vision
Ancestral Vision is blue.
Suspend 4 - U
Target player draws three cards.

It has no casting cost, hence you can't cast it unless you suspend it.
It's also rare, duh. Quite likely to become one of the high-end chase cards of the set.

[NoGameShow]

I'm a bit of a fan of Quinton Hoover's old art, but the art for Vesuvian Shapeshifter isn't in his old style at all. I understand that artists change style over the years, but Hoover's new look feels far more generic than stuff like the old Doppleganger and such.

(EDIT) I know it's not fully kosher, but can anyone post what the SCG Premium preview card does? I'm curious as hell what the suspend cost of a Draw3 for U is, and what its hardcast cost is.



uhhhh..That card preview isn't premium. Its has no casting cost just suspend.

[JeremM]

Eh, seems hardly playable. They're probably making a cycle of such cards, with one for each color; we've already seen red (Wheel of Fate), blue (Ancestral Vision), and artifact (Lotus Bloom), so white/green/black/(land?) are on the way. Quite frankly, I'm expecting Necropotence or YawgWill for black, Balance for white, and possibly Regrowth for green.


uhhhh..That card preview isn't premium. Its has no casting cost just suspend.

Whoops. Chalk that one up to my choice of beverage for the night.

[Bastian]

These suspend remakes of the power cards are usually one-shot. A fully functional Necropotence, even if with suspend with be broken beyond measure unless it took a bucketload of turns to come into play.

And even then... Most likely the black suspend spell is the one already announced, a Living Death with suspend 3 and a cost of 2BB. It also doesn't have a casting cost so it can't be cast without being through suspend.

So what we have so far:

White - ???
Blue - Ancestral Recall
Black - Living Death
Red - Wheel of Fortune
Green - ???
Artifact - Black Lotus

White is likely Balance. There's also rumours about green's suspend card being Eureka, which would make a lot more sense than an effect like Regrowth, of which we already have so many. Having a Regrowth on suspend would be... well... not very smart.

[atv]

Quite frankly, I'm expecting Necropotence or YawgWill for black, Balance for white, and possibly Regrowth for green.


There's already Recollect (Ravnica)... wouldn't suspended Regrowth be quite pointless?

Like others have suggested, Eureka is a possibility.

[scrumdogg]

Eureka would be fantastic, giving you X turns to set up & to try & screw your opponent setting up :) That would be a fun match and it would be nice to get a playset of 'Eureka' without dropping $80-100. This card will still be just fine, as cards are always welcome (if you're still alive to get them...but killing dedicated blue mages is akin to stamping out cockroaches, a long messy involved process....). It also pitches to FoW, gets imprinted on Chrome Mox, and.....how does Isochron Scepter & a Suspend card work, btw?

[troopatroop]

The blue suspend card seems amazing. I would play it in a heartbeat.

[michael_noah]

Re: Isochron Scepter.

203.3a The converted mana cost of an object with no mana cost is 0

Unless they change the comprehensive rules, you'll be able to imprint them - if they ever make any that are instants.

[Eldariel]

Re: Isochron Scepter.

203.3a The converted mana cost of an object with no mana cost is 0

Unless they change the comprehensive rules, you'll be able to imprint them - if they ever make any that are instants.

Yea, you could imprint it, whoop-e-doo. You still can't play cards without manacost and Scepter just makes a copy you could play. Since it ain't in your hand, you can't suspend it either. In short, sure, you can put in on the Scepter (if it were an Instant), but you still couldn't play it (you could get it on the Scepter with Panoptic Mirror-Mizzium Transreliquant/Animate Artifact+copy-effects, but you still couldn't play it if it were an Instant)

[michael_noah]

Well, besides the fact that it is obviously possible to play spells without a mana cost now (otherwise you wouldn't be able to play some of the suspend cards at all), one wizards article recently said this:

"There are other, more minor rules bits you may be interested in – for example, the rules about playing objects with no mana costs are changing so that suspend is possible. It's technical stuff and 90 percent of players probably will never need to worry about it. But take a gander at the more specific rules documents, if you want to know more."

The actual rules documents don't look like they've been updated yet, so we'll have to see exactly how they changed the rule.

[Nightmare]

Well, besides the fact that it is obviously possible to play spells without a mana cost now (otherwise you wouldn't be able to play some of the suspend cards at all), one wizards article recently said this:

"There are other, more minor rules bits you may be interested in – for example, the rules about playing objects with no mana costs are changing so that suspend is possible. It's technical stuff and 90 percent of players probably will never need to worry about it. But take a gander at the more specific rules documents, if you want to know more."

The actual rules documents don't look like they've been updated yet, so we'll have to see exactly how they changed the rule.This is currently being discussed in like 3 other threads. Pick one.

In short, my speculation (which is based in historical information on similar situations) is that you will only be able to play these cards (any with no mana cost) if they have been suspended. In other words, not with Scepter, Desire, etc.

[Lego]

In short, my speculation (which is based in historical information on similar situations) is that you will only be able to play these cards (any with no mana cost) if they have been suspended. In other words, not with Scepter, Desire, etc.

How would you ever get this card on a Scepter anyway?

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Apparently, there's a rumor going around about a Stifle with Split Second for 1U. Hmmmmm...

[Pinder]

That would be nice. But check out the beauty that just hit mtgsalvation:

Cancel 1UU
Instant (U)
Counter target spell.

That's right, it's a counterspell that's strictly worse than Counterspell!:laugh:. Hell, it's strictly worse than Dissipate.

I'm sure a hard counter is making the Standard players drool, though. Just more proof that Wizards doesn't give two shits about Legacy.

[JeremM]

Just more proof that Wizards doesn't give two shits about Legacy.

Life from the Loam disagrees.

[Lego]

Life from the Loam disagrees.

Obviously an accident. They built it for T2, and it happened to matter over here. Won't happen again :wink:

[Hoojo]

One or two cards a set is all you can expect for the eternal formats. That's just the nature of the biz.

[atv]

Maybe there are more than just one or two cards a set that could be good for Legacy but since the best players and deckbuilders concentrate on Standard, Extended and Limited these card go unnoticed.

[Lego]

the best players and deckbuilders concentrate on Standard, Extended and Limited

I contest this point. I would say that Legacy and Vintage deckbuilders have just as much, and oft times much more skill than your average rotating format players. There simply aren't as many of us. An infinite number of monkeys with an infinite number of typewriters will reproduce the entire works of Shakespeare eventually. Standard just has more monkeys with typewriters.

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Well, here's something beyond awesome.

Looter il-Kor
1U
Creature - Kor Rogue
Shadow
Whenever Looter il-Kor deals damage to an opponent, draw a card, then discard a card.
1/1

I likey.

Also, here's something fun:

Sudden Death
1BB
Instant
Split second
Target creature get's -4/-4 until the end of turn.

Uncounterable creature removal? Awesome.

[AngryTroll]

Well, the first is Merfolk Looter, except a little better and a little worse. You can't rip Circular Logic off the top, but Merfolk Looter is, basically, a 0/1.

The second makes me drool, just for the sake of Frogboy and his Tog deck running Tog, Morphling, AND Masticore. I am going to side 4 just for his deck. I don't care if I do not use them in any other game. The look on his face when they hit play will be simply Amazing.

[on1y0ne]

That would be nice. But check out the beauty that just hit mtgsalvation:

Cancel 1UU
Instant (U)
Counter target spell.

That's right, it's a counterspell that's strictly worse than Counterspell!:laugh:. Hell, it's strictly worse than Dissipate.

I'm sure a hard counter is making the Standard players drool, though. Just more proof that Wizards doesn't give two shits about Legacy.

I hope that this card is incomplete on the spoiler....

[Drkdstryer]

It's probably not. The card is a godsend for Standard, replacing Hinder very effectively. A Counterspell costing 1UU has been a long time in coming - ever since 8th was printed I've been expecting it. How about the Stifle with Split Second? That's FAR more interesting. Also that -4/-4 with SS: say goodbye Tog - and it's a perfect size for screwing Baloths as well.

[Pinder]

I'll admit that Sudden Death is a nice addition to the Legacy card pool. It kills Psychatog without so much as a second thought, and there are tons of creatures with sac abilities and the like that I can see this being useful against. Even against creatures without sac abilities, it still gives -4/-4, which means that it will effectively kill anything, and you opponent can't even respond to, much less counter it.

So maybe Wizards gives a shit about Legacy. I still wouldn't be expecting them to throw another our way anytime soon.

EDIT: Oh, and according to this article (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/feature/361), you can imprint and play spells without mana costs:



The rules primer also has some rule reversals that are worth taking note of. If I am not mistaken, the rules change on cards with no printed casting cost means that I can now imprint Evermind on Isochron Scepter as Armageddon on a stick with a Celestial Kirin in play.

If he's right (which I can assume he is), this means that if you scepter Ancestral Visions, you can draw 3 cards instant speed for 2 mana. Every turn. Am I the only one who thinks this might be a little broken?

And what about Panoptic Mirror? Sure, it costs 5, but a free tap after you drop it and you're drawing 3 cards during your upkeep, netting 4 cards a turn. Seems like a dream come true for blue control, no?

EDIT SOME MORE: Except that it's a sorcery. Silly me. Panoptic Mirror still works, though.

[on1y0ne]

How about Spellweaver Helix, Ancestral Visions, Burning Wish? Keep a Wish in the board, and Wish for a Wish, and Draw 3 cards for 1R...

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Here are some fun legendaries that just came to my attention on MTGSalvation:

Lim-Dul, the Necromancer
5BB
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard
Whenever a creature is put into a graveyard from play, you may pay , if you do, return that creature to play under your control. It is a Zombie in addition to its creature types.
: Regenerate target Zombie.
4/4

Tivadar of Thorn
1WW
Legendary Creature - Human Knight
First Stike, Protection from Red.
When Tivadar of Thorn comes into play, Destroy target Goblin.
2/2

Dralnu, Lich Lord
3UB
Legendary Creature - Zombie Wizard
: Instant and Sorcery cards in your graveyard have Flashback costs equal to their converted mana costs until end of turn.
Whenever Dralnu is dealt damage, sacrifice that many permanents.
3/3

Mangara of Corondor
1WW
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard
; Remove Mangara of Corondor from the game: Destroy target permanent.
1/1

Kaervek of Bogardan
5BR
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard
Whenever an opponent plays a spell, Kaervek deals damage equal to the converted mana cost of that spell to its controller.
5/4

Fun stuff. Tivadar rapes Goblins and is a great card in general. Lim-Dul could be fun, and Mangara is Vindicate turned into a creature. And there's gotta be something that can be broken by Dralnu.

[JeremM]

Tivadar is basically StP and Silver Knight rolled into one, against Goblins; while probably not needed, StP/SK 5-x can't hurt at all.

Dralnu could be neat, but the requirement of tapping negates his use in sick Storm turns. Then again, having YawgWill on a stick can't possibly be a bad thing (unless he ends up clearing your board - Thanks, Bolt!), and could be awesome in a U/B control deck (Intuition becomes a tutor for 4 copies of a card!) Mangara could be fantastic in a number of decks; from being Vindicate 5-x in Truffle Shuffle to being Vindicate 1-x in Angel Stompy, Mangara's nothing short of fantastic.

[Alfred]

Tivadar is basically StP and Silver Knight rolled into one, against Goblins; while probably not needed, StP/SK 5-x can't hurt at all.

Dralnu could be neat, but the requirement of tapping negates his use in sick Storm turns. Then again, having YawgWill on a stick can't possibly be a bad thing (unless he ends up clearing your board - Thanks, Bolt!), and could be awesome in a U/B control deck (Intuition becomes a tutor for 4 copies of a card!) Mangara could be fantastic in a number of decks; from being Vindicate 5-x in Truffle Shuffle to being Vindicate 1-x in Angel Stompy, Mangara's nothing short of fantastic.

The best use for Mangara would probably be in a splash white Survival deck that can find, and use his ability immediately with Anger. Dralnu is 'meh', and Tivadar is absolutely hilarious! As if you thought Silver Knight was good against Goblins!

[Pinder]

How about Spellweaver Helix, Ancestral Visions, Burning Wish? Keep a Wish in the board, and Wish for a Wish, and Draw 3 cards for 1R...

That's awesome. And you could abuse the Helix with another Helix, namely Lightning Helix on a Scepter. Deal 3 damage, draw 3 cards, gain 3 life? That's just fantastic. How much does Spellweaver Helix cost?

EDIT: Wait, nevermind, it's only two sorceries. I need to read cards before I post :laugh:

[JeremM]

Stuffy Doll seems like it might be alright, on merit of it being a reusable Mogg Maniac. It'll probably be a blast for casual decks with Furnance of Rath, but nothing for Legacy.

[TheDarkshineKnight]

For those who don't know, the preview cards today are as follows:

Stuffy Doll
5
Artifact Creature - Construct
As Stuffy Doll comes into play, choose a player.
Stuffy Doll is indestructable.
Whenever damage is dealt to Stuffy Doll, it deals that much damage to the chosen player.
Tap: Stuffy Doll deals 1 damage to itself.

Amrou Seekers
2W
Creature - Kithkin Rebel
Amrou Seekers can't be blocked except by artifact creatures and/or white creatures.
2/2

[Vardaman]

Stuffy Doll will be annoying to play around in limited.

Great with Pestilence and all kinds of stuff for multiplayer, obv.

[MasterBlaster]

What do people think of Juzam Sliver? Horrible in sliver decks obviously, but do you think it would have potential in anything? I'm having trouble thinking of a deck that really wants it.

[Zilla]

I disagree that it's horrible in Sliver decks. Obviously you wouldn't want it in a deck with like 20 other slivers, but a few of just the right kind could be worth the tradeoff, and you could easily offset the lifeloss with Jitte or even Essence Sliver.

[Eldariel]

Ib Halfheart, Goblin Tactician. Interesting, can make random Goblins out of your mountains and makes all your Goblins very capable of attacking into Werebears or Mongeese, and costs 4 as opposed to the 5 of most tiebreakers. Dunno, but it does seem interesting.

[Whit3 Ghost]

Ib Halfheart, Goblin Tactician. Interesting, can make random Goblins out of your mountains and makes all your Goblins very capable of attacking into Werebears or Mongeese, and costs 4 as opposed to the 5 of most tiebreakers. Dunno, but it does seem interesting.That seems really, really good. I'd run at least 2.

[Evil Roopey]

That seems really, really good. I'd run at least 2.

Probably 1 like Kiki, but it will definatly only make the deck better.

[Alfred]

This is probably one of the most powerful sets I have seen in a really long time. This is going to be a rediculous T2 season, seeing as how this, Coldsnap and Ravnica block are all going to be legal.

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Meh, so far, it's an awesome set, but its not even close to the brokenness that was Mirrodin.

[Lukas Preuss]

Not sure if anybody already mentioned it, but these cards are supposed to be reprinted:

Weiss:
Akroma, Angel of Wrath
Consecrate Land
Disenchant
Icatian Javelineers
Sacred Mesa
Soltari Priest
Spectral Lynx


Blau:
Dandân
Flying Men
Giant Oyster
Ovinomancer
Psionic Blast
Voidmage Prodigy
Whispers of the Muse


Schwarz:
Avatar of Woe
Evil Eye of Orms-by-Gore
Sengir Autocrat
Stupor
Undertaker
Witch Hunter
Withered Wretch


Red:
Avalanche Riders
Browbeat
Fire Whip
Fiery Temper
Kobold Taskmaster
Uthden Troll


Grün:
Call of the Herd
Gaea's Blessing
Gaea's Liege
Hunting Moa
Wall of Roots


Gold:
Jasmine Boreal
Merieke Ri Berit
Lightning Angel
Mystic Enforcer
Mystic Snake
Nicol Bolas
Shadowmage Infiltrator
Stormbind
Sol'kanar the Swamp King
Void


Split:
Assault // Battery


Artefakt:
Feldon's Cane
Grinning Totem
Mindless Automaton
Tormod's Crypt
The Rack


Land:
Desert
Gemstone Mine
Pendelhaven
Safe Haven


I got this from a German site, but there should be a English source for it on the net, as well.

[Parcher]

I just saw this one, interesting potiential.

Academy Ruins
Legendary Land
Tap: Add U to your mana pool
1U, tap: put target artifact card in your graveyard on top of your library.
269/301
Rare.

Maybe in IGGy, or Affinity?

[quicksilver]

Yeah it's at the bottom of mtgsalvation's spoiler list. Apaprently they are reprints of old cards, with a purple expansion symbol, have the old card boarder and art, and are going to be taking up one common slot in each time spiral booster pack. Also they are going to be legal in all sets time spiral is legal in.

[Lukas Preuss]

The Academy could actually make Mizzium Vault viable... just Gifts Ungiven for Time Vault, Mizzium Transreliquant, Academy Ruins and Reconstruction...

[Alfred]

The Academy could actually make Mizzium Vault viable... just Gifts Ungiven for Time Vault, Mizzium Transreliquant, Academy Ruins and Reconstruction...

Great pick-up! That's definately a strong combination, and makes your win condition far more resiliant to non-Pithing Needle hate.

[Parcher]

Literally kicking David Gearhart in the crotch with Brain Freeze on the stack.

Ask and ye shall recieve:

Trickbind
Instant
Split second (As long as this spell is on the stack, players can't play spells or activated abilities that aren't mana abilities.)
Counter target activated or triggered ability.
Activated or triggered abilities cannot be played by that card until end of turn.

Mill you for 3 FTW?

[Lego]

Ask and ye shall recieve:

Trickbind
Instant
Split second (As long as this spell is on the stack, players can't play spells or activated abilities that aren't mana abilities.)
Counter target activated or triggered ability.
Activated or triggered abilities cannot be played by that card until end of turn.

Mill you for 3 FTW?

Granted, they can still Stroke you for the win, but this seems quite good nonetheless :smile:

[jrp]

Remand > Trickbind

Remember that Trickbind only counters the storm trigger on Brain Freeze, and that Brain Freeze's controller will get priority back before the original Brain Freeze resolves. You can then Remand the Freeze and play it again. In all honesty, I am more worried about my fetchlands getting Trickbinded than my Brain Freeze!!!

[Parcher]

Remand > Trickbind

Remember that Trickbind only counters the storm trigger on Brain Freeze, and that Brain Freeze's controller will get priority back before the original Brain Freeze resolves. You can then Remand the Freeze and play it again. In all honesty, I am more worried about my fetchlands getting Trickbinded than my Brain Freeze!!!

True on all points. This card does, however, give control decks a fair shot against Brain Freeze. As they can easily stop Remand, and not the former.
And it really crushes Tendrils, as the double-Tendrils-against-control plan goes all to hell with this.

And it can potentially give extra turns against board based combos, such as Salvagers.

[Ewokslayer]

And it really crushes Tendrils, as the double-Tendrils-against-control plan goes all to hell with this.
And Stifle didn't do this?
I don't recall a Tendrils deck that can counter spells or respond in any meaningful way to a Stifle.

[MasterBlaster]

Stonebrow 3RG
Legendary Creature - Centaur Warrior
Trample
Whenever a creature you control with trample attacks, it gets +2/+2 until the end turn.
4/4

Probably good in ZillaStompy.

Lightning Axe R
Instant
As an additional cost to play this, discard a card or pay 5.
This deals 5 damage to target creature.

I think Lightning Axe would be good in burn(maybe even making it viable). Burn really wouldn't mind discarding a land for 5 damage.
EDIT: It only burns creatures, I can't read.

EDIT: Also the "Juzam" Sliver is called Plague Sliver.

[Parcher]

Of course Stifle does this. Not the point at all really. There is no reason to run Stifle as an Anti-Storm Combo measure against Tendrils when it has little relavancy against Solidarity. Control decks are rarely able to take advantage of the tempo gained by turning it into a Wasteland.

This card can be run in sideboards as a foil to all three of the major Combo decks. Forcing Solidarity to have multiple counterspells after going off, Allowing Tendrils to do only a minimum of damage, and giving at least and extra turn or two to remove a Salvagers if it hits play.To me, raising it's viability in seeing actual play.

[Jander78]

I just saw this one, interesting potiential.

Academy Ruins
Legendary Land
Tap: Add U to your mana pool
1U, tap: put target artifact card in your graveyard on top of your library.
269/301
Rare.

Maybe in IGGy, or Affinity?

Mindslaver ?!? Only 12 mana a turn. bah.

[Ewokslayer]

Of course Stifle does this. Not the point at all really. There is no reason to run Stifle as an Anti-Storm Combo measure against Tendrils when it has little relavancy against Solidarity. Control decks are rarely able to take advantage of the tempo gained by turning it into a Wasteland.

This card can be run in sideboards as a foil to all three of the major Combo decks. Forcing Solidarity to have multiple counterspells after going off, Allowing Tendrils to do only a minimum of damage, and giving at least and extra turn or two to remove a Salvagers if it hits play.To me, raising it's viability in seeing actual play.

But it isn't actually good against Solidarity.
Stifle is best when used against Solidarity's Fetchlands. This costs to much to really be able to do that effectively. When SS is used on Brain Freeze it doesn't stop the Solidarity player from either
1) Remanding the original Brain Freeze and playing it again
2) Playing another Brain Freeze
3) Playing Cunning Wish for Stroke
4) Continuing the combo until you find either Brain Freeze, Remand, or Cunning Wish

Also, Why wouldn't you counter the Gamekeeper Trigger and save yourself the hassle of having to kill the Salvager before they can combo with it the next turn?

[Parcher]

But it isn't actually good against Solidarity.
Stifle is best when used against Solidarity's Fetchlands. This costs to much to really be able to do that effectively. When SS is used on Brain Freeze it doesn't stop the Solidarity player from either
1) Remanding the original Brain Freeze and playing it again
2) Playing another Brain Freeze
3) Playing Cunning Wish for Stroke
4) Continuing the combo until you find either Brain Freeze, Remand, or Cunning Wish

Also, Why wouldn't you counter the Gamekeeper Trigger and save yourself the hassle of having to kill the Salvager before they can combo with it the next turn?


Last point first.

Duh. I've never used Stifle against this deck, and it shows.

As to the first part, the you are right, it does none of these things. However, It is much easier for a typical control deck to sculpt it's hand with countermagic while waiting for the Solidarity player to go off. You don't give them the opportunity for infinite mana, and/or cards by countering either Reset and/or Meditate. Being able to take advantage of High Tide allows equal mana production, and usually the control player has much more available countermagic. The issue always being, that this only ups the Storm count for Brain Freeze.

The inability to stop a two mana card after fighting back all of Solidarity's enablers is the reason Control decks historically lose to Storm Combo. You force the combo deck to burn all of it's resources to continue the combo, and then presumably use the Stifle effect to stop the win condition. It is considerably more difficult to Stroke out someone, or Wish into another Brain Freeze when the Control player correctly attacks untap and card drawing effects, knowing that the Solidarity player can easily fizzle if you deny them the proper resource.

Solidarity does not always have every answer at it's fingertips.It takes greatly educated guesses to know what they might need, but the ability to stop the kill card after draining the combo player of as much mana and card selection as possible is what makes this attractive.

[midnightAce]

The problem with that Axe is that it does not follow a golden rule of Burn decks: You want to try to fit as much burn as possible that can aim for the dome, not the creatures.

However, it would be nice to run in some varienty of RG madness. Turn 1 answer to Lackey that can drop a Basking Rootwalla seems pretty good.

[Ewokslayer]

Last point first.

Duh. I've never used Stilfe against this deck, and it shows.

As to the first part, the you are right, it does none of these things. However, It is much easier for a typical control deck to sculpt it's hand with countermagic while waiting for the Solidarity player to go off. You don't give them the opportunity for infinite mana, and/or cards by countering either Reset and/or Meditate. Being able to take advantage of High Tide allows equal mana production, and usually the control player has much more available countermagic. The issue always being, that this only ups the Storm count for Brain Freeze.

The inability to stop a two mana card after fighting back all of Solidarity's enablers is the reason Control decks historically lose to Storm Combo. You force the combo deck to burn all of it's resources to continue the combo, and then presumably use the Stifle effect to stop the win condition. It is considerably more difficult to Stroke out someone, or Wish into another Brain Freeze when the Control player correctly attacks untap and card drawing effects, knowing that the Solidarity player can easily fizzle if you deny them the proper resource.

Solidarity does not always have every answer at it's fingertips.It takes greatly educated guesses to know what they might need, but the ability to stop the kill card after draining the combo player of as much mana and card selection as possible is what makes this attractive.

That is generally the way to go if you have a clock. The problem is that Landstill doesn't, nor do most control decks. While you have spent your hand countering there spells in order to get them into a position where they have to throw out a brain freeze as they fizzle, the Solidarity player is usually able to go off again the next turn. I don't really see this card changing that dynamic.
Whether an aggro-control like Threshold or Madness chooses to run it over Stifle I don't see that choice making a difference in those matchups either, at least for Solidarity, and assuming the Solidarity player doesn't suck and just assume they lost when it is played. It costs more, which while not usually important when going against Solidarity due to High Tide, can make a difference against Iggy Pop or Salvagers, especially if either deck plays a Defense Grid.

[Parcher]

That is generally the way to go if you have a clock. The problem is that Landstill doesn't, nor do most control decks. While you have spent your hand countering there spells in order to get them into a position where they have to throw out a brain freeze as they fizzle, the Solidarity player is usually able to go off again the next turn. I don't really see this card changing that dynamic.
Whether an aggro-control like Threshold or Madness chooses to run it over Stifle I don't see that choice making a difference in those matchups either, at least for Solidarity, and assuming the Solidarity player doesn't suck and just assume they lost when it is played. It costs more, which while not usually important when going against Solidarity due to High Tide, can make a difference against Iggy Pop or Salvagers, especially if either deck plays a Defense Grid.

Once again, my lack of a broad testing base shows. It is Threshold on which I have based my theories, as that is the only control-like deck with which I have a great deal of experience playing against Solidarity. I can see the lack of a clock being a determining factor. It allows the "fizzle" to happen without fear of reprisal.

Well put. Thanks.

[jamest]

Trickbind looks strong against combo at first glance, but I wonder if it'll see play. First, it's a more expensive version of Stifle which is seldom used. The uncounterability is interesting, but I doubt counterability was the main issue with Stifle. The problem was more that it is narrow and requires you to leave mana open.

Looking at specific combo decks:
1) Gamekeeper runs Duress and Cabal Therapy, which are fine solutions to Trickbind.
2) Ill Gotten Gains uses disruption that already addresses Trickbind i.e. Defense Grid, Xantid Swarm, Leyline IGG Mind Twist.
3) High Tide can be bothered by Trickbind, but not stopped. They can still answer with Remand or combo with Stroke.

We'll see if Trickbind makes the cut, but it's far from obvious at this point.

[MasterBlaster]

The problem with that Axe is that it does not follow a golden rule of Burn decks: You want to try to fit as much burn as possible that can aim for the dome, not the creatures.

However, it would be nice to run in some varienty of RG madness. Turn 1 answer to Lackey tthat can drop a Basking Rootwalla seems pretty good.

Ah crap. I should RTFC. I thought it was creatures and players. I was getting all geeked up for nothing.

[midnightAce]

While Trickbind's usefulness is debatable, the ability of Split Second shouldn't be overlooked. I actually like Krosan Grip a lot. The ability to destory everything from Deed to Disk to Vial without giving opponent any chance to respond is quite good.

Same holds true for Sudden Death mentioned somewhere before in this thread, the ability to kill Togs and Wearbears, while completely ignoring counters is just really sexy.

[MasterBlaster]

Nether Traitor BB
Creature - Spirit
Haste, shadow
Whenever another creature is put into your graveyard from play, you may pay B. If you do, return Nether Traitor from your graveyard to play.
1/1

I have a friend that plays KrovikanHorror/Squee/DeathSpark/AshenGhoul/NetherShadow.dec, and I think he will be really happy when he sees this.

EDIT: 300th post

[Firebrothers]

Man im glad that ya'll aren't freaking out about this new set like the type 2 community is over on salvation, they are thinking that their 'perfectly balanced'
format is falling. Im glad that they are making some chase rares like psionic blast,and Flying Men are going to be available.

Whoever opens the first foil tormods crypt is a bad ass!!

[MasterBlaster]

Whoever acquires the first foil tormods crypt playset is a bad ass!!

Edited for truth.

[on1y0ne]

I would have to say a foil Psi Blast will also be kinda hot...

[AngryTroll]

Sudden Death might be the second or third best removal spell in the format, following Swords and Bolt. And maybe Magma Jet. But seriously, uncounterable, and Tog can't suddenly get huge, Baloth does not provide life, Werebear does not provide mana, etc. Seems nutty.

[Ewokslayer]

Sudden Death might be the second or third best removal spell in the format, following Swords and Bolt. And maybe Magma Jet. But seriously, uncounterable, and Tog can't suddenly get huge, Baloth does not provide life, Werebear does not provide mana, etc. Seems nutty.

Werebear can still provide mana.
Mana Abilities > All
Except Null Rod and Cursed Totem

[on1y0ne]

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=magic/timespiral2/creative4

Does anyone else seem to think that the artwork in the Fourth picture seems to resemble Mana Drain? Are they actually going to print a Mana Drain variant...?

[deadlock]

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x...ral2/creative4

Does anyone else seem to think that the artwork in the Fourth picture seems to resemble Mana Drain? Are they actually going to print a Mana Drain variant...?

Indeed:

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=31342&d=1158184572

You better understand German :cool:
or else go to the TS Spoiler on mtgs.

I really like the idea of this card: A huge 'Wellhornschnecke' drains itself into the game. :laugh:

Though not really playable in Legacy. :rolleyes:

[Peter_Rotten]

Is no one excited about the new overpowered br0k3n Thallids? WTF?

Thalid Germinator 2GG
Creature - Fungus
At the beginning of your upkeep, but a Spore counter on each Fungus you control.
Remove 3 Spore counters from Thalid Germinator: Put a 1/1 green saproling token creature into play.
4/4

Thallid Shell-Dweller 1G
Creature - Fungus
Defender
At the beginning of your upkeep, put a spore counter on Thallid Shell-Dweller
Remove 3 Spore counters from Thallid Shell-Dweller: put a 1/1 green saproling creature token into play.
0/5

Thelon of Havenwood GG
Legendary Creature - Elf Druid
Each Fungus gets +1/+1 for each spore counter on it. ROAR!
GB, Remove a Fungus card in your graveyard from the game: Put a spore counter on each Fungus you control.
2/2

[Vardaman]

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=magic/timespiral2/creative4

Does anyone else seem to think that the artwork in the Fourth picture seems to resemble Mana Drain? Are they actually going to print a Mana Drain variant...?

It's probably Draining Whelk.

It's something like a 1/1 flier for 5 or 6 that has flash, counters a spell CIP and gets +1/+1 counters = countered spell's CMC. (deadlock said this but I'm giving an english recap so you don't have to go to mtgsal)

@peter rotten: If you like the FE stuff, there's an artifact card called Sarpadian Empires vol VII.

[quicksilver]

It's probably Draining Whelk.

It's something like a 1/1 flier for 5 or 6 that has flash, counters a spell CIP and gets +1/+1 counters = countered spell's CMC. (deadlock said this but I'm giving an english recap so you don't have to go to mtgsal)


It is, they have pictures of the card.

[Vardaman]

It is, they have pictures of the card.

Ok

Could we get a mod to take the extra "i" out of "Prieviews" in the thread title? :(
All set man. -J

[Alfred]

BB
Small Pox
Sorcery

Each player sacrifices a creature, discards a card, sacrifices a land and loses 1 life.

Rare

Uhh... Holy shit? Isn't this like better than the original Pox? It basically does the same thing as Pox, except you lose less life, and discard 1 card instead of two most of the time, and it costs less. This is a fucking crazy card.

[Aggro_zombies]

BB
Small Pox
Sorcery

Each player sacrifices a creature, discards a card, sacrifices a land and loses 1 life.

Rare

Uhh... Holy shit? Isn't this like better than the original Pox? It basically does the same thing as Pox, except you lose less life, and discard 1 card instead of two most of the time, and it costs less. This is a fucking crazy card.
Yeah...but the original Pox is devastating and this isn't. Against combo, they lose less life (giving them more time to combo off on you), they discard fewer cards (usually...again, putting them in a better position to combo off), and Pox already has Sinkhole, Wasteland, and Pox to deal with lands. Not only is this redundant, but it's not as useful. Against aggro, Innocent Blood is better because it can answer turn one Lackey on the play or the draw.

That said, it may be an interesting addtion to Pox...maybe 3 Pox, 2 of this.

[Alfred]

Guys, I'm about to cry tears of joy. I fucking loved Fallen Empires, and check it out, an artifact in this set is called Sarpadian Empires, Vol. VII. This is honestly the coolest name for a card ever created, and I'm going to take a dump in my pants if it's any good at all.

Also, Smallpox is a better card in control than the shitty aggro pox lists we have right now, because a) You lose less life, b) You don't have to discard very many cards, c) it costs less, and therefor is better as creature removal.

[Jander78]

BB
Small Pox
Sorcery

Each player sacrifices a creature, discards a card, sacrifices a land and loses 1 life.

Rare

Uhh... Holy shit? Isn't this like better than the original Pox? It basically does the same thing as Pox, except you lose less life, and discard 1 card instead of two most of the time, and it costs less. This is a fucking crazy card.

A Tremble, Innocent Blood, and parts of Funeral Charm/Ebony Charm all rolled into one. This card is quite efficient. I like it.

[Peter_Rotten]

A Tremble, Innocent Blood, and parts of Funeral Charm/Ebony Charm all rolled into one. This card is quite efficient. I like it.

But what about the Thallids, you jerk? What about the THALLIDS!

[Alfred]

But what about the Thallids, you jerk? What about the THALLIDS!

Here is to hoping that the original Thallid is a purple card so I can use them again.

[Whit3 Ghost]

BB
Small Pox
Sorcery

Each player sacrifices a creature, discards a card, sacrifices a land and loses 1 life.

Rare

Uhh... Holy shit? Isn't this like better than the original Pox? It basically does the same thing as Pox, except you lose less life, and discard 1 card instead of two most of the time, and it costs less. This is a fucking crazy card.
Hooomg!

Favorite card of the set so far.

[Bane of the Living]

This set is ridiculous. There are so many good cards...

look at those Thallids!

EDIT
Quick Mishra question.. If hes out and your suspend lotus comes into play via suspend do you get to dig another one into play? If so thats pretty supreme. Like, taco supreme!

[quicksilver]

Quick Mishra question.. If hes out and your suspend lotus comes into play via suspend do you get to dig another one into play? If so thats pretty supreme. Like, taco supreme!

Yes, when suspened wears off you play the cards. And mishra triggers on you playing cards.

[quicksilver]

Flagstones of Trokair
Legendary Land
T: Add W to your mana pool.
When Flagstones of Trokair is put into a graveyard from play, you may search your library for a plains card and put it into play tapped. If you do, shuffle your library afterwards.

Intersting card. Essentailly unwastelandable, like a basic plains. However unlike a basic plains also pretty imune to land destruction like sink hole. Unlike basic plains more vulnerable to cards like back to basics and blood moon. Also unlike basic plains, if you get two of them, you can search out dual lands if you want.

Seems like it could be good, the only draw back i see is cards like Back to basics, blood moon, and price of progress. However it has the potential to fix your colors as early as turn 2 while still being immune to wasteland and resistant to stifle. And stifle and wasteland combined can stop it but you still two for one them with that.

Oh wait holy crap, angel stax will love this card, tap it under the tanglewire, then sack it to smoke stack then get another plains untapped! Also some nice synergy with crucible and zuran orb.

[Alfred]

Flagstones of Trokair
Legendary Land
T: Add W to your mana pool.
When Flagstones of Trokair is put into a graveyard from play, you may search your library for a plains card and put it into play tapped. If you do, shuffle your library afterwards.

Intersting card. Essentailly unwastelandable, like a basic plains. However unlike a basic plains also pretty imune to land destruction like sink hole. Unlike basic plains more vulnerable to cards like back to basics and blood moon. Also unlike basic plains, if you get two of them, you can search out dual lands if you want.

Seems like it could be good, the only draw back i see is cards like Back to basics, blood moon, and price of progress. However it has the potential to fix your colors as early as turn 2 while still being immune to wasteland and resistant to stifle. And stifle and wasteland combined can stop it but you still two for one them with that.

Oh wait holy crap, angel stax will love this card, tap it under the tanglewire, then sack it to smoke stack then get another plains untapped! Also some nice synergy with crucible and zuran orb.


It's also good with Smallpox (and regular Pox).

[xsockmonkeyx]

Here is to hoping that the original Thallid is a purple card so I can use them again.

It is. :)

[SillyMetalGAT]

It's also good with Smallpox (and regular Pox).

What is this Smallpox you speak of?

[Kimpa]

Originally Posted by quicksilver View Post
Flagstones of Trokair
Legendary Land
T: Add W to your mana pool.
When Flagstones of Trokair is put into a graveyard from play,
you may search your library for a plains card and put it into
play tapped. If you do, shuffle your library afterwards.

What about crop rotation, this would be the nuts.
Turn one forest, turn two this card + crop rotation, turn three 4 land.
Well this did suck, three turns and just play lands.....mana elves and bop are better.

[Complete_Jank]

Flagstones of Trokair
Legendary Land
T: Add W to your mana pool.
When Flagstones of Trokair is put into a graveyard from play, you may search your library for a plains card and put it into play tapped. If you do, shuffle your library afterwards.

Intersting card. Essentailly unwastelandable, like a basic plains. However unlike a basic plains also pretty imune to land destruction like sink hole. Unlike basic plains more vulnerable to cards like back to basics and blood moon. Also unlike basic plains, if you get two of them, you can search out dual lands if you want.

Seems like it could be good, the only draw back i see is cards like Back to basics, blood moon, and price of progress. However it has the potential to fix your colors as early as turn 2 while still being immune to wasteland and resistant to stifle. And stifle and wasteland combined can stop it but you still two for one them with that.

Oh wait holy crap, angel stax will love this card, tap it under the tanglewire, then sack it to smoke stack then get another plains untapped! Also some nice synergy with crucible and zuran orb.


Last statement is incorrect, as it comes into play tapped. It is good for some decks, but I don't forsee it being played in more than one or two decks.

[Parcher]

Vesuva Land R
As Vesuva comes into play, you may choose a land in play. If you do, this comes into play tapped as a copy of the chosen land.
#281/301


Possible uses? Mana fixing, destroying a Legendary Land(?), adding an extra Basic land against Hate, additional Wastelands, additional Man-lands, copying an opponent's useful land of some sort?

[Bane of the Living]

8 Mishras Factories ftw? Theres that new guy for 3 mana that taps gives assembly workers +1/+1 and is also one himself. Coolness.

[Angel of Despair]

Whoever opens the first foil tormods crypt is a bad ass!!

Yeah, thats gonna be me!
AoD

[MasterBlaster]

I'm sure Vesuva Land(is that the official name?) will be wicked hot in Legacy. Another card for me to find on e-bay when this set releases.

[quicksilver]

Kaervek the Merciless 5BR
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard
Whenever an opponent plays a spell, Kaervek the Merciless deals damage equal to the converted mana cost of that spell to its controller.
5/4

This seems like an excellent one of to play in reanimator as a burried alive target. It seems excellent against storm based combos. Not only is it a significant clock and they have to remove it to go off, but they take damage in the process of removing it, making them have to remove it about a turn earlier.



Swarmyard
Land
T: Add 1 to your mana pool.
T: Regenerate target Goblin, Rat, Saproling, or Sliver.
Do you think this might see some play in goblins? Makes your goblins very hard to kill. Probably no better than the alternative lands that produce colorless as well.

Edit: Swarmyard has just been errated to say insect instead of goblin, which of course makes it unplayable in legacy.


Cavalry Master 2WW
Creature - Human Knight
Flanking
Other creatures you control with flanking have flanking. (Each instance of flanking triggers seprately.)
2/2
This card is just worded really funny. Also there is a flood of new cards hitting the salvation spoiler at the moment.

[mikekelley]

Those who are preordering, where are you doing it from?

[on1y0ne]

I just read a message on the Judge-L that says that foils will now only be in the common slot, as opposed to replacing whichever rarity of the card. This means that if you have a foil Uncommon, you will still have three uncommons in your pack that are not foil. Also, if there is a foil rare in the pack, there will also be a non-foil rare in the pack! Woot! Woot! News about this set is getting better and better. Imagine a Sealed Deck where a TS pack has a bomb rare, a foil bomb rare, and a bomb purple card! Oh, the possibilities...

Here is the message, btw...



From: "Heckt, Andy" <Andy.Heckt@WIZARDS.COM>
Subject: Possible additional rares in TSP boosters
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

FYI -

Due to a collation change I wanted you all to be aware that TSP boosters
can contain more than one "rare".
For instance: foils now replace commons, so a rare foil could replace a
common.

Don't be shocked, remember in limited, what you open is legal.

Andy

[AngryTroll]

Hmm...Gush on a creature? Odd.

Fathom Seer 1U
Morph: Return two islands you control to their owner's hand.
When Fathom Seer is turned face up, draw two cards.
1/3

And I was always a fan of Spiketail Hatchling, so I like this guy:

Spiketail Drakeling 1UU
Creature-Drake
Flying
Sacrifice Spiketail Drakeling: Counter target spell unless its controller pays 2.
2/2

Edit: Wow, I might buy a box of this set...I have never bought one before, but this set looks absolutely awesome!

[quicksilver]

Hmm...Gush on a creature? Odd.

Well a big theme of this set is reprinting old cards with a twist, like the power with suspend, old big creatures that are totems, and that card.

Unfortunatly in almost all cases the reprints are worse. Esspecialy with that card since it is gush, but you still have to pay mana for it.

[AngryTroll]

Unfortunatly in almost all cases the reprints are worse. Esspecialy with that card since it is gush, but you still have to pay mana for it.

Right, but when I play a morph on turn two, who is going to expect my turn three Tog to get huge that fast!11!! oh...except its bad. Oh well. Really cool feel, though.

[Zilla]

Tasty:

Aspect of the Mongoose - 1G
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant Creature
Enchanted creature can't be the target of spells or abilities.
When Aspect of the Mongoose is put into a graveyard from play, return it to its owner's hand.

Not only can you make any creature into a Nimble Mongoose, but it's got Rancor's return to hand ability for maximum efficiency. Pretty damned nice. Could be okay on... say... a Psychatog? Seems decent.

[NoGameShow]

Tasty:

Aspect of the Mongoose - 1G
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant Creature
Enchanted creature can't be the target of spells or abilities.
When Aspect of the Mongoose is put into a graveyard from play, return it to its owner's hand.

Not only can you make any creature into a Nimble Mongoose, but it's got Rancor's return to hand ability for maximum efficiency. Pretty damned nice. Could be okay on... say... a Psychatog? Seems decent.



I wish it was Form of the Mongoose now that would be sweet.

[xsockmonkeyx]

Scryb Ranger 1G

Creature - Human Fairy
Flash
Flying, protection from blue
Return a Forest you control to its owner's hand: untap target creature. Use this ability only once each turn.
Illus. Rebecca Guay
1/1

Awesome! Insant quirion ranger with flying and pro blue.

EDIT:

Also:

Greenseeker

Creature - Elf Spellshaper G
G,Tap, Discard a card: Search your library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into your hand. Then shuffle your library.
Illus. Rebecca Guay
1/1

[Di]

Scryb Ranger 1G

Creature - Human Fairy
Flash
Flying, protection from blue
Return a Forest you control to its owner's hand: untap target creature. Use this ability only once each turn.
Illus. Rebecca Guay
1/1

Awesome! Insant quirion ranger with flying and pro blue.

Holy shit that is awesome. Instant-speed Q Ranger that blockes Sea Drakes all day long. That's quite wierd they printed a card that could go in ATS, considering that's what I've been working on the most lately.

/foreshadowing.

EDIT: Also note that Rey of Revalation is also in artifact removal form. That is fucking insanely awesome for Loam-based decks. Insanely awesome.

[Zilla]

Yeah, I noticed that card and thought the exact same things. If I cared at all about ATS I would have posted about it myself. :tongue:

[mikekelley]

Scryb Ranger 1G

Creature - Human Fairy
Flash
Flying, protection from blue
Return a Forest you control to its owner's hand: untap target creature. Use this ability only once each turn.
Illus. Rebecca Guay
1/1

Awesome! Insant quirion ranger with flying and pro blue.


Fuck that card. :mad:

Rebecca Guay drew it.

And Sea Drakes are going to hate it.

And Rebecca Dray drew the sea drake.

That's mean.

[MasterBlaster]

Sangrophage BB
Creature - Zombie
At the beginning of your upkeep, tap Sangrophage unless you pay 2 life.
The living is all it eats.
Illus. Pete Venters
3/3

They just made Carnophage's big brother.

[AngryTroll]

Well, a bunch of people got their wish!

Angel's Grace W
Instant
Split Second
You can't lose the game this turn, and your opponents can't win the game this turn. Until end of turn, damage that would reduce your life total to less then one reduces it to one instead.


This does not stop Tendrils (damage instead of loss of life), but it means Solidarity has to be very, very careful about how much damage is on the table. No longer can they win with lethal attacking against any deck running white (even if they do not have it sideboarded, they might!) Oh, wait...what color does Goblins splash most often? And Angel Stompy? What is already the most (or tied for most) often splashed color?

[on1y0ne]

Well, a bunch of people got their wish!

Angel's Grace W
Instant
Split Second
You can't lose the game this turn, and your opponents can't win the game this turn. Until end of turn, damage that would reduce your life total to less then one reduces it to one instead.


This does not stop Tendrils (damage instead of loss of life)....etc.


It does stop Tendrils, however it might not do you much good. The clause that says "You Can't Lose" stops Tendrils that turn. Granted, you will lose on your turn due to not having a life total, but still....

In Limited, this card is a bomb! Holy God! It is the best Fog ever printed.

[Bane of the Living]

Wow, I can put that on a scepter huh? Sweet.

[MattH]

It's hardly better than Chant, innit?

They can still counter it...

[Nightmare]

It's hardly better than Chant, innit?

They can still counter it...No, they can't. Split Second, remember? No spells can be played with it on the stack.

[herbig]

Grace plus Blessing spells game for Solidarity...

[Eldariel]

Mmm, Solidarity needs to go off multiple times to win through this :/ What the heck is the point behind this card, I just wonder... Why couldn't it also prevent targeting or lifeloss? That seems just retarded

[herbig]

Mmm, Solidarity needs to go off multiple times to win through this

Not really, this in response to Stroke is game over if they have Blessings on the stack. And Solidarity can't do anything to prevent it short of Stroking for the entire library without Brainfreeze.

[Ewokslayer]

Not really, this in response to Stroke is game over if they have Blessings on the stack. And Solidarity can't do anything to prevent it short of Stroking for the entire library without Brainfreeze.

That is requiring them to board a whole bunch of cards that suck against every other combo deck. By itself Grace won't really do anything since the solidarity player should be able to tap the opponents creatures for the turn that the card buys them.

[quicksilver]

That is requiring them to board a whole bunch of cards that suck against every other combo deck. By itself Grace won't really do anything since the solidarity player should be able to tap the opponents creatures for the turn that the card buys them.

If they have blessing too that means they have to stroke you for you entire library. In which case you have three more of these babies in your hand and you can play one each turn, that at least buys you three extra turns.

[Ewokslayer]

If they have blessing too that means they have to stroke you for you entire library. In which case you have three more of these babies in your hand and you can play one each turn, that at least buys you three extra turns.

Unless of course you make them draw a card in your turn when they are tapped out.

Why are we even talking about such a bad sideboarding strategy?

Show me a deck that is going to realistically bring in 2-3 blessings and 4 of these and I will show you a deck that will lose in the first round to Iggy Pop.

[quicksilver]

Unless of course you make them draw a card in your turn when they are tapped out.

Why are we even talking about such a bad sideboarding strategy?

Show me a deck that is going to realistically bring in 2-3 blessings and 4 of these and I will show you a deck that will lose in the first round to Iggy Pop.

Ok, you only need one blessing. And sure, I guess you can make them draw a card on your turn if you can go off stoking their whole deck without casting a single meditate, or did you forget how solidarity works.

And we are talking about it since I don't think it is that bad, it might be useful, you only need to side in 5 cards, which is better than most stratagies. You are just bitter as a solidarity player haveing to play against something you can't respond to.

And this card may be useful other places, it should at least buy you an extra turn against almost any deck. I don't know if this card is any good at all, but I don't think it is helpful to try and imediatly stife any conversation about a card the second it comes out, it hasn't even been tested or anything yet.

And if your argument is that this card is useless against iggy pop, then show me a deck that consistantly beats every deck in the format, and then we can drop the discussion. You can't use the argument that certain side board cards are bad against certain decks to show a card is bad. Every deck loses to something.

[Ewokslayer]

Ok, you only need one blessing. And sure, I guess you can make them draw a card on your turn if you can go off stoking their whole deck without casting a single meditate, or did you forget how solidarity works.

With only one blessing, you are pretty much reducing your stalling to those four Angel's Graces as getting around one blessing isn't hard. So, you could still fizzle the Solidarity player with your Angel's Grace and single Blessing, only to loss the next turn when the Solidarity player combos off again. It isn't like Solidarity is incapable of comboing more than once. Or worse you could draw the stupid blessing.



And this card may be useful other places, it should at least buy you an extra turn against almost any deck.

So does Fog.



And if your argument is that this card is useless against iggy pop, then show me a deck that consistantly beats every deck in the format, and then we can drop the discussion. You can't use the argument that certain side board cards are bad against certain decks to show a card is bad. Every deck loses to something.
Generally you want your sideboard to have cards that are usefull against more than one specific deck in an archetype.
Like how Meddling Mage, Rule of Law, and Chalice are good against pretty much every single combo deck.
Having to have a sideboard that is filled with anti Solidarity hate that is completely useless against every other combo deck seems like a poor plan.

[tivadar]

Having to have a sideboard that is filled with anti Solidarity hate that is completely useless against every other combo deck seems like a poor plan.

I have to agree here, I just don't think Angel's is good enough to make it an SB in most decks. It's mediocre in the solidarity matchup by itself, and pretty bad in most other matchups. I mean, go with orim's chant or abeyance or glowrider, but angel's just doesn't seem right.

[Alfred]

Ok, you only need one blessing. And sure, I guess you can make them draw a card on your turn if you can go off stoking their whole deck without casting a single meditate, or did you forget how solidarity works.

And we are talking about it since I don't think it is that bad, it might be useful, you only need to side in 5 cards, which is better than most stratagies. You are just bitter as a solidarity player haveing to play against something you can't respond to.

And this card may be useful other places, it should at least buy you an extra turn against almost any deck. I don't know if this card is any good at all, but I don't think it is helpful to try and imediatly stife any conversation about a card the second it comes out, it hasn't even been tested or anything yet.

And if your argument is that this card is useless against iggy pop, then show me a deck that consistantly beats every deck in the format, and then we can drop the discussion. You can't use the argument that certain side board cards are bad against certain decks to show a card is bad. Every deck loses to something.

I agree with most of this, and I would like to add that the point of a sideboard is to answer specific matchups. 5 cards to shore up a horrible Solidarity matchup seems like it could be a fantastic if it actually works. It could actually make white board control strategies more viable against a more complete section of the metagame.

[Ewokslayer]

I agree with most of this, and I would like to add that the point of a sideboard is to answer specific matchups. 5 cards to shore up a horrible Solidarity matchup seems like it could be a fantastic if it actually works. It could actually make white board control strategies more viable against a more complete section of the metagame.

The problem with White Board Control Strategies isn't its horrible Solidarity matchup, it is its horrible combo matchup. (Among other problems with those decks)
Angel's Grace is only a solution when combined with Blessing but Blessing is the one hate card that is horrible when drawn so really to improve your Solidarity matchup you either have to mulligan into Angel's Grace or hope to draw it while at the same time mulliganing hands that have blessing (especially if you only have 1).
Plus you still need a clock otherwise Solidarity won't give a shit what your hate is.

[Alfred]

The problem with White Board Control Strategies isn't its horrible Solidarity matchup, it is its horrible combo matchup. (Among other problems with those decks)
Angel's Grace is only a solution when combined with Blessing but Blessing is the one hate card that is horrible when drawn so really to improve your Solidarity matchup you either have to mulligan into Angel's Grace or hope to draw it while at the same time mulliganing hands that have blessing (especially if you only have 1).
Plus you still need a clock otherwise Solidarity won't give a shit what your hate is.

Jotun Grunt seems like a fun hate card that is good against a lot of decks in the format. Could this be this clock you are talking about?

[Zilla]

Show me a deck that is going to realistically bring in 2-3 blessings and 4 of these and I will show you a deck that will lose in the first round to Iggy Pop.
Speaking of 1cc white anti-combo cards that don't suck against IGG...

Children of Korlis - W
Creature - Human Rebel Cleric
Sacrifice Children of Korlis: You gain life equal to the life you've lost this turn. (Damage causes life loss.)
1/1

...is pretty nuts against them.

[quicksilver]

Speaking of 1cc white anti-combo cards that don't suck against IGG...

Children of Korlis - W
Creature - Human Rebel Cleric
Sacrifice Children of Korlis: You gain life equal to the life you've lost this turn. (Damage causes life loss.)
1/1

...is pretty nuts against them.

Unless they set up the loop, in which case they can probably do like 40, and the korlis shild could only stop the first 18. Unless you got 2 of them, in which case Iggy pop probably can tutor for an echoing truth to play eot.

[mikekelley]

Those who are preordering, where are you doing it from?

ehem:wink:

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

Unless they set up the loop, in which case they can probably do like 40, and the korlis shild could only stop the first 18. Unless you got 2 of them, in which case Iggy pop probably can tutor for an echoing truth to play eot.



Why don't you just marry Iggy Pop?

[quicksilver]

Why don't you just marry Iggy Pop?

What are you 5? God people who use lame kid jokes like that are so friggin lame.

[Zilla]

Unless they set up the loop, in which case they can probably do like 40, and the korlis shild could only stop the first 18. Unless you got 2 of them, in which case Iggy pop probably can tutor for an echoing truth to play eot.

Why don't you just marry Iggy Pop?
Yeah if you love it so much why don't you go make babies with it? I mean seriously, if Iggy tries to Echoing Truth my 2 children of Korliseses I'll just Vial in Mother of Runes in response, use my Boros Guildmage to give it haste, give my Children of Korlis protection from blue and all of a sudden Echoing Truth fizzles and where's your precious combo now?! Stupidface.

[AnwarA101]

Yeah if you love it so much why don't you go make babies with it? I mean seriously, if Iggy tries to Echoing Truth my 2 children of Korliseses I'll just Vial in Mother of Runes in response, use my Boros Guildmage to give it haste, give my Children of Korlis protection from blue and all of a sudden Echoing Truth fizzles and where's your precious combo now?! Stupidface.

Don't pay attention to Zilla much. He builds decks that autolose to combo. He suggests that when playing against combo "pray to a God if you believe in him". That's an awesome strategy, isn't it?

[Zilla]

Don't pay attention to Zilla much. He builds decks that autolose to combo. He suggests that when playing against combo "pray to a God if you believe in him". That's an awesome strategy, isn't it?
Typical rhetoric from someone who only builds decks that autolose to aggro. Get back to work, proletariat scum.

[FakeSpam]

Yeah if you love it so much why don't you go make babies with it? I mean seriously, if Iggy tries to Echoing Truth my 2 children of Korliseses I'll just Vial in Mother of Runes in response, use my Boros Guildmage to give it haste, give my Children of Korlis protection from blue and all of a sudden Echoing Truth fizzles and where's your precious combo now?! Stupidface.

....or you could just sac the one being targeted. The the echoing truth would be countered upon resolution.

Nah. I like your way better.

[Complete_Jank]

Running 3-4 Angel's Grace and two Blessing's is best, that way you can Blessing loop yourself to prevent decking, and after you are forced to draw your deck, you will have other Angel's Grace cards in your hand, so it is like Solidarity tutors them into your hand, how nice!

[xsockmonkeyx]

Those who are preordering, where are you doing it from?

ebay (http://stores.ebay.com/Merlins-Games_W0QQsspagenameZL2QQtZkm)