[Deck] Quick Death

[roan_48435]

This isn't my deck, but this is pretty good and can kill on the first turn.

4 Lions Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak
4 Land Grant
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Diabolic Intent
4 Ornithopter
4 Pheyxian Walker
4 Infernal Contract
4 Cruel Bargain
4 Tendrils of Agony
2 Ill-Gotten Gains
2 Bayou

It is very fast and can combo you out on the first turn.
What to you guys think?

More shift key. More card choice explaination. Less spam with lists. ~Nightmare

[Anarky87]

Isn't this that Draw4 deck? Seems fast, but looks like any well placed disruption (Duress, Hymn, Therapy) or control (Thresh) could put you in a bad position. Have you ever had any problems like that? Or is your gameplan just to win fast enough?

[Nightmare]

Hello roan, and Welcome to The Source!

Please read the Forum Rules (http://mtgthesource.com/forums/announcement.php?f=24) and FAQ for New Members (http://mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3468) before you continue posting. There are strict guidelines on grammar and posting of decklists on this site, please familiarize yourself with them.

That said, you need to offer card explainations and some idea of what your game plan is when posting a list. The Shift Key is also manditory. I recommend you look at this thread (http://mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3042&highlight=infernal+bargain), which had some mild success a few months ago, but has proven to be too fragile in today's metagame.

[Cavius The Great]

This isn't my deck, but this is pretty good and can kill on the first turn.

4 lions eye diamond
4 lotus petal
4 Chrome mox
4 dark ritual
4 cabal ritual
4 culling the weak
4 land grant
4 infernal tutor
4 diabolic intent
4 ornithopter
4 pheyxian walker
4 infernal contract
4 cruel bargain
4 tendrils of agony
2 ill-gotton gains
2 bayou

it is very fast and can combo you out on the first turn.
what to you guys think?


I actually bought 3 Cruel Bargains to play this very deck (I need a fourth). I haven't tested it at all but from the looks of the deck it's not at all resilient to other decks that pack massive amounts of disruption. Correct me if I'm wrong because I have no current experience playing the deck, I'm just judging from the decklist.

[Warmonger]

Looks like Draw4 with more combo pieces in place of lands which we don't need in large amount. It may work, but not sure if it's reliable.

[Goblin Snowman]

Not sure I like the lack of Blue. I built this, except with Three Wishes, Meditates, Chrome Sphere, 2 Mox Diamonds and Disrupts. It can go off T1, but I found that unless you're against Solidarity, Thres, or anything that plays disruption, you're better to wait a few turns. Also, have you experimented with Death Wish? I autolost to Burn becaue of 1/2ing my life like 4 times, but it gives a great tutor engine and doesn't force you go to Red for Bwish.

[emidln]

He can't explain the deck because it isn't his. It's called Spanish Inquisition, or, more descriptively, Contract Tendrils. It's an old build that my team has abandoned, but I think Vroman's team still runs. If you run blue, it's for boarding bounce and Meditate. The idea is that you can win on turn 1 and absurd amount of time, but it requires amazing hands to win turn 1 through disruption. It can stall aggro decks with infy 0cc creatures that live through blocking and you get to combo off at your leisure. Without a lot of work on the list, explanation about synergies, some study of the statistics behind the deck, and a lot of goldfishing it's a bad deck. With all of that, I wouldn't put it above average. There are at least two threads about it on TMD which you can find under the name Contract Tendrils.

Also, if you play the stats correctly, it is very reliable. I've taken this deck to both undefeated records and 0-2 drops in Chicago, depending on the metagame at the time. You only need to force turn 1 against Thresh before boarding, possibly against stuff like Iggy Pop or Sui where they can severely disrupt you or combo off just as fast.

Edit: I also noticed that you cut 4x Creatures for 4x Infernal Tutor. Cut Ornithopter for Shield SPhere. Shield Sphere is the best creature for the deck. While Infernal Tutor is definite correct, you need to trim DIs and add at least 2 more Ornithopters. You need about 10 creatures to support 4x culling the weak, 1-2x DI.

[Rastadon]

You play green and a ton of free creatures. Play Glimpse of Nature!

[emidln]

You play green and a ton of free creatures. Play Glimpse of Nature!

Why would you do something like this? You don't actually play green. Green is simply a questionable by-product of playing Land Grant. This is a black deck, splash for blue in most circumstances. It's debateable whether or not you want fetchlands over land grants anyway. This deck only runs the bare minimum creatures to support 4x Culling the Weak and a couple Diabolic Intent. Any more are wasted slots that cause you fizzle mid-combo. Leave the Glimpse of Natures to the Kobold decks.

[Rastadon]

So the creatures are just there as extra storm count? I'm not seeing too much synergy with your creatures and comboing, aside from Culling. It just makes a boatload of sense that you incorporate the creatures into your deck. You'd be a creature combo deck, not just a black combo deck that plays filler. You might as well utilize the fact that they're creatures.

[emidln]

So the creatures are just there as extra storm count? I'm not seeing too much synergy with your creatures and comboing, aside from Culling. It just makes a boatload of sense that you incorporate the creatures into your deck. You'd be a creature combo deck, not just a black combo deck that plays filler. You might as well utilize the fact that they're creatures.

Creatures block until you go off, sac to Culling the Weak and Diabolic Intent, and add to Storm count. That is all you need them to do. If you're looking for more, you should look elsewhere as playing this list like that will cause losses.

[Cavius The Great]

@Emidln - I plan on building this deck bro. What are some tips on playing the deck, you seem fairly experienced. Do you always go for the first turn kill or do you wait in certain situations? What are the most common plays? Thanx ahead of time. :smile:

[emidln]

I'd recommend going up to 10 draw4s. Meditate is the best possible draw4 in Legacy, but it costs blue mana. If you want to be able to combo rapidly, blue mana is really hard to come by. A list that I really like right now is this:

// 09132006 uLSI (blue-splash, land-grant-based Spanish Inquisition)
// 16 Black Accel
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak
4 Lion's Eye Diamond

// 10 Creatures
4 Shield Sphere
4 Phyrexian Walker
2 Ornithopter

// 20 Business
4 Infernal Tutor
1-2 Diabolic Intent
3-4 Cruel Bargain
4 Infernal Contract
2 Ill-Gotten Gains
1-3 Meditate
2-4 Tendrils of Agony

// 14 Mana Sources
4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
4 Land Grant
2 Bayou

// Sideboard
4 Xantid Swarm
2 Rebuild
1 Tropical Island
4 Oxidize
4 Massacre

Alternately, I'm experimenting with

// The Man Plan
4 Tomb of Urami
4 Avatar of Discord
4 Flesh Reaver
3 Phrexian Negator or Cabal Therapy

Since my team doesn't have a specific list (each player plays something mildly different), we have a sort of code set up for variations of this archetype. This is a blue-splash version that runs Land Grants over fetchlands.

As far as play tips, goldfish the deck a lot. Look for hands with a mix of Accel and Business. Remember that very few decks can hurt you early, and most aggro can't hurt you at all, so you can sit behind your blockers to draw extra cards and optimize your hand for several turns. However, this deck can easily goldfish (even play through disruption) turn 1 on the play, so against decks packing Rit/Duress/Hymn, Daze, Stifle or Orim's Chants you might want to go for it early.

Against counterspells, don't be afraid to bait counters with draw4s. Remember, when you actually are going off, you need to float some sort of mana into your draw as you normally won't be able to hit mana + rituals + business off the four cards. Resolving Chrome Mox is really important here, because it gives you the chance to play a lot of business while sitting behind your walls waiting or a chance to go off.

You might try Goblin Charbelcher somewhere in your board. It's not that bad, but Tomb of Urami is probably better in the matchups that matter. As a game 2 plan, most people will board out Needles, though you may hit random Null Rods so watch out.

This deck needs to avoid Chalice. You can play through it if you go first and get some blocks down, but Chalice needs to be dealt with very quickly. Good luck, and please let me know your experiences with it.

[Cavius The Great]

Thanx for the tips bro, I'll keep everything you said in mind. I appreciate it. :smile:

[Iranon]

I apologise in advance for the vile thread necromancy...

I like this deck very much for the simplicity and elegance of its construction. Given that it sports a large degree of redundancy, has someone more experienced attempted to fit in two Diminishing Returns with an adjusted mana base (going to fetch lands would be a start but probably not enough) or is the double blue simply too much of a liability?

[Cavius The Great]

Yea this deck is awesome. I finally got my 4th Cruel Bargain in a trade at TML Open 2. I'm definitely going to build this deck once I get the rest of the cards I need for it.

[Radley]

OMG, someone ripped off my idea. Goddamn.

[sammiel]

OMG, someone ripped off my idea. Goddamn.

This deck concept has been around since long before you started polluting these boards with your inane babbling.

[Radley]

This deck concept has been around since long before you started polluting these boards with your inane babbling.

instead of posting that long senseless message of yours, you could just make it shorter instead of babbling.

Sorry i never knew that deck existed before. But putting 0 casting creatures with no use whatsoever other than just to be sacrificed never works. I't prone to cheap removal spells.

[Goblin Snowman]

instead of posting that long senseless message of yours, you could just make it shorter instead of babbling.

Sorry i never knew that deck existed before. But putting 0 casting creatures with no use whatsoever other than just to be sacrificed never works. I't prone to cheap removal spells.

For the record, if the other player wastes Tempo removing your creatures you should be fine. They happen to be excellent at blocking Lackey as well as generating storm and allowing CtW to work. I'm not saying this is optimal, yet your comment is stupid. If CtW didn't have "sacrifice" as a cost maybe not, but it does.

[emidln]

If you want to go on pure speed, I'll put SI up against any format-legal deck now or in the past including SX. The current version my team runs is this:

4 Infernal Contract
4 Cruel Bargain
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
2 Null Profusion
3 Tendrils of Agony
1 Goblin Charbelcher
3 Cabal Therapy

4 Shield Sphere
4 Phyrexian Walker

4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak
4 Lion's Eye Diamond

4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
4 Land Grant
2 Bayou

The blue splash looks like this (it's faster, and more consistent, but more prone to hate):

4 Tendrils of Agony
4 Infernal Contract
4 Cruel Bargain
4 Infernal Tutor
3 Meditate
2 Null Profusion
1 Ill-Gotten Gains

4 Shield Sphere
4 Phyrexian Walker

4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak
4 Lion's Eye Diamond

4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
2 Polluted Delta
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Underground Sea

1 Bayou
3 Xantid Swarm
4 Tomb of Urami
3 Chain of Vapor
1 Rebuild
4 Massacre

[vigilante]

How has Null Profusion been working out for you? I've heard it said that Profusion's biggest drawback is the fact that in order to accelerate it into play, you have to burn up a few Ritual effects in the process. That means fewer Ritual effects that you can play post-Profusion (hence you miss out on drawing cards for playing them). Have you found this to be a problem at all (ie. getting Profusion into play, but then running out of steam because you've run out of mana)?

[Cavius The Great]

If you want to go on pure speed, I'll put SI up against any format-legal deck now or in the past including SX. The current version my team runs is this:

4 Infernal Contract
4 Cruel Bargain
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
2 Null Profusion
3 Tendrils of Agony
1 Goblin Charbelcher
3 Cabal Therapy

4 Shield Sphere
4 Phyrexian Walker

4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak
4 Lion's Eye Diamond

4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
4 Land Grant
2 Bayou

The blue splash looks like this (it's faster, and more consistent, but more prone to hate):

4 Tendrils of Agony
4 Infernal Contract
4 Cruel Bargain
4 Infernal Tutor
3 Meditate
2 Null Profusion
1 Ill-Gotten Gains

4 Shield Sphere
4 Phyrexian Walker

4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak
4 Lion's Eye Diamond

4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
2 Polluted Delta
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Underground Sea

1 Bayou
3 Xantid Swarm
4 Tomb of Urami
3 Chain of Vapor
1 Rebuild
4 Massacre

Have you considered Diabolic Intent in place of Infernal Tutor? It seems like Diabolic Intent would help fetch your singleton Belcher if needed.

EDIT: I just realized you can fetch a Belcher with LED and Infernal Tutor. Diabolic Intent may still be an option though.

[emidln]

Diabolic Intent is strictly worse due to requiring 2-3 extra support cards in the form of Ornithopters or other free creatures to do the same job that Infernal Tutor normally does. Additionally, intent cannot arbitrarily increase storm count, is poor at IGG loops, and generally requires 2 cards where Infernal Tutor requires 0. The original versions of this deck ran Diabolic Intent before Infernal Tutor was printed (early 2006), but Intent was immediately discarded for Tutor. One potential application of Intent is in addition to Tutor where you would run 2 Ornithopter, 1-2 Intent in place of 1 Tendrils and 3 Therapy in the Land Grant version. I happen to like Therapy better.

You don't want to be fetching Belcher often. It's available as needed, but there is very little to guarantee that Belcher is lethal since finding the 2nd land is often difficult. Belcher is a backup win condition for when Tendrils is difficult/impossible or the few situations where Belcher is just obvious (creature, culling, land grant, led, belcher, etc).


How has Null Profusion been working out for you? I've heard it said that Profusion's biggest drawback is the fact that in order to accelerate it into play, you have to burn up a few Ritual effects in the process. That means fewer Ritual effects that you can play post-Profusion (hence you miss out on drawing cards for playing them). Have you found this to be a problem at all (ie. getting Profusion into play, but then running out of steam because you've run out of mana)?

In short, no. Most of the time (perhaps 8 out of 10 hands) and early Null Profusion is just imprinted on Chrome Mox. I usually won't cast it unless I have the ability to play 1-3 spells and at least B floating afterwards, but if you have these requirements, the amount of free spells and rituals in the deck (and the face that cruel bargain/infernal contract now draw 5 cards) leads to near instant wins when Profusion hits the table. Profusion is just a really busted card that sometimes wins you the game and other times gives you black mana to start your combo.

[Iranon]

What concerns me is that you usually need the same amount of mana to get use out of Null Profusion as you need to play and activate a Belcher, so this is a win condition in disguise rather than part of the engine... witout giving us outs to hate like a true win condition would.

Have there been any problems with the deck becoming too 'top-heavy'?

p.s.: I understand that Belcher isn't without its problems (unimprintable, random).




[Edit]:

Having doubted some of the more confident claims about the deck's speed, I goldfished this thoroughly and I'm more than impressed with this monster. Out of 100 test games, I had 42 turn 1 kills.

What astonished me even more is the consistency. In only 13 games did I fail to kill before turn 4 (7% total failures and 6% turn 4 kills. The latter are losses in my book given the cavalier approach of the deck towards your health... and damaging you is one of the kinder things an opponent can do). I got a first-turn kill on a 4-card hand. Yikes. The ability to turn failed attempts to go off into a setup for next turn is eerie.


The exact breakdown of the goldfish results (turn 1 to 4 kill, ánything else) was interesting:

On the play: 20/12/12/3/3
On the draw: 22/13/8/3/4

Total: 42/25/20/6/7
Cumulative: 42/67/87/93/100

The numbers suggest there is little difference between having that additional card or not, which is slightly strange (at the least, it's a free mulligan for any hand that isn't stellar). I certainly felt like I had to work much harder on the play.



Here is the list that I used:

4 Land Grant
2 Bayou
4 Chrome Mox
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak

4 Shield Sphere
4 Phyrexian Walker
2 Ornithopter

4 Cruel Bargain
4 Infernal Contract

4 Infernal Tutor
2 Diabolic Intent
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Null Profusion

3 Tendrels of Agony
1 Goblin Charbelcher



Null Profusion is on its way out. It's simply too clunky and has hefty prerequisites in addition to the mana cost. I'm leaning to a second IGG for the momen although Reprocess seems interesting.