[Article] Budget Legacy - White Weenie

[Zach Tartell]

Link (http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/article/14124.html)


White Weenie has had success in many formats, but it varies widely in the specific cards it uses. This deck is most successful against Aggro, and since there are several strong Aggro decks in Legacy, this is an appropriate choice. White Weenie also has some good strategies for beating other decks, and uses a flexible sideboard.

[Happy Gilmore]

Well Done Chris, another solid article. I love Mana Tithe, what a solid sb card vs. combo. It give you 8 1cc spells that can help you get to Glowrider Mana. The only card I miss is Savannah Lions. And how good is Razor Golem really?

[Zach Tartell]

And how good is Razor Golem really?

3/4 Vigalince for 3 = amazing. The only time he'd cost four is if you have a tomb out, but then you'd have the mana anyways.

The only thing I'd like to have in here is like Flagstones x2, and maybe some chrome moxen. The flagstones help accelerate out some mana after a cataclysm, and the moxen would allow a silver knight turn one, a glowrider turn one, or a turn two or three cacyclysm. Pretty good article. Kind of like Chris Romeo for Legacy.

My only complaint is that everyting is "the most underrated card in the format" or "one of the strongest cards in the format." While I appreciate your zeal, Jitte is already pretty awesome, and tomb is so-so. 1-for-one life-for-mana is kind of steep, in my opinion. 'Specially if you're playing a deck without angels or something. Still, a good article.

[Happy Gilmore]

3/4 Vigalince for 3 = amazing. The only time he'd cost four is if you have a tomb out, but then you'd have the mana anyways.

The only thing I'd like to have in here is like Flagstones x2, and maybe some chrome moxen. The flagstones help accelerate out some mana after a cataclysm, and the moxen would allow a silver knight turn one, a glowrider turn one, or a turn two or three cacyclysm. Pretty good article. Kind of like Chris Romeo for Legacy.

My only complaint is that everyting is "the most underrated card in the format" or "one of the strongest cards in the format." While I appreciate your zeal, Jitte is already pretty awesome, and tomb is so-so. 1-for-one life-for-mana is kind of steep, in my opinion. 'Specially if you're playing a deck without angels or something. Still, a good article.

Saying that Razor Golem is amazing then suggesting Flagstones/Mox suggests that you question your own conclusions. With both Mox and Flagstones running Angel would be a superior option. I can't say for sure but I believe the biggest reason Chris suggests using Razor Golem stems from the fact that he was attempting to build on a budget. Giving up Angel for Chant may be justifiable.

It also makes me wonder if it is possible to have 2x Razor Golem in play after the resolution of Cataclysm. If it works the other way Golem is worse than Angel because you cannot have both Golem and equipment in play after the resolution of the spell.

[Zach Tartell]

Saying that Razor Golem is amazing then suggesting Flagstones/Mox suggests that you question your own conclusions. With both Mox and Flagstones running Angel would be a superior option. I can't say for sure but I believe the biggest reason Chris suggests using Razor Golem stems from the fact that he was attempting to build on a budget, giving up Angel for Chant which is justifiable.

It also makes me wonder if it is possible to have 2x Razor Golem in play after the resolution of Cataclysm. If it works the other way Golem is worse than Angel because you cannot have both Golem and equipment in play after the resolution of the spell.

I've been more a fan of the phil Stolze (I butcher that last name everytime I write it) Wub angel stompy. Pretty much different decks. I run the three tombs, no masks, (3 SOFI and 2 Jitte's for equipment), and no moms, switching them for knight of the holy nimbuses. I don't run any cataclysms, rather using duresses (and cabal therapies in the board) for my disruption. I like how it grants me acess to better draw (4 brainstorms and 2 serum visions), better creatures (dark confidant, meddling mage, Exaulted Angel), and more answers to combo (duress, okiba gang shinobi and therapy in teh baord). Cataclysm decks are good, and they pwn shit like goblins and solidarity. But combo (non-solidarity), perhaps the deck's hardest matchup, can really give angel stompy problems. I think the problem is that I was thinking of a different deck entirely. I do, however, really dig the angel of the pale curtain tech. I may have to pick up a set of those, to go in the board for my grunts.

[kabal]

It also makes me wonder if it is possible to have 2x Razor Golem in play after the resolution of Cataclysm. If it works the other way Golem is worse than Angel because you cannot have both Golem and equipment in play after the resolution of the spell.

Yes, you can have two in play after a Catacylsm.

[Happy Gilmore]

Yes, you can have two in play after a Catacylsm.

That makes Golem the better choice IMO.

[Lone Signal]

I'd try the Cataclysm-based WW, but I've yet to run into concrete problems with a Vial-based WW to switch over. Vial is just way too good for this kind of deck not to include, imo, so what's your reasoning for not heading in that direction?

[C.P.]

I'd try the Cataclysm-based WW, but I've yet to run into concrete problems with a Vial-based WW to switch over. Vial is just way too good for this kind of deck not to include, imo, so what's your reasoning for not heading in that direction?

You run too few creatures to make vial good.

[Lone Signal]

You run too few creatures to make vial good.Well I don't.
Two completely different basis on an archetype, I guess.

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

I do think that running Chrome Mox or Flagstones seems silly if you want Razor Golem to be any good. 4 mana 3/4s aren't the way to go (aside from Ancient Tomb).

Aside from that, though, I feel you should've given Godzilla some credit, since obviously his builds of Angel Stompy influenced yours.

Although, I don't think he ever gave me credit for the Razor Golem tech, so meh.

It's a nice format we used to have.

[sammiel]

crusade isn't banned in legacy is it? cause that could protect your WW hose creatures like believer and pale curtain against massacre in the hulk flash matchup.

[Machinus]

My only complaint is that everyting is "the most underrated card in the format" or "one of the strongest cards in the format." While I appreciate your zeal, Jitte is already pretty awesome, and tomb is so-so. 1-for-one life-for-mana is kind of steep, in my opinion. 'Specially if you're playing a deck without angels or something. Still, a good article.

I accept this criticism, but I don't do this about everything. It just so happens that Ancient Tomb and Umezawa's Jitte are two cards that I think are amazing in Legacy, and in my opinion far too few people take advantage of them.


Aside from that, though, I feel you should've given Godzilla some credit, since obviously his builds of Angel Stompy influenced yours.

He deserves most of the credit, and I mentioned him in the thread. I didn't feel comfortable doing it in the article without a tournament performance.

[Nihil Credo]

i'm reading this article about white weenie
i liked the article
even if it is a historical document

:P

[Happy Gilmore]

i'm reading this article about white weenie
i liked the article
even if it is a historical document

:P


Well his curent list is somewhat adapted to the current meta.

I actually Really like the tech of Crusade against massacre.

[scrumdogg]

Crusade has a major problem vs Hulk Flash, however, it requires you to have Turn 1 Chrome Mox + Plains & play some thing relevant (TB, MM, SotPC etc) and have the Crusade in hand to play Turn 2 & hope that Hulk Flash hasn't already A) won the game B) Massacre'd (and won the game) C) have a bounce spell or counter (and then win the game). Ancient Tomb doesn't help with Crusade, neither does Lotus Petal really & what WW would be running Mox Diamond?

[xsockmonkeyx]

He deserves most of the credit, and I mentioned him in the thread. I didn't feel comfortable doing it in the article without a tournament performance.

That seems like a pretty arbitrary requirement to give credit where credit is due. Especially since Zilla is a west coast player.

[Machinus]

That seems like a pretty arbitrary requirement to give credit where credit is due. Especially since Zilla is a west coast player.

It's not arbitrary. I don't feel like explaining it.

[sammiel]

Crusade has a major problem vs Hulk Flash, however, it requires you to have Turn 1 Chrome Mox + Plains & play some thing relevant (TB, MM, SotPC etc) and have the Crusade in hand to play Turn 2 & hope that Hulk Flash hasn't already A) won the game B) Massacre'd (and won the game) C) have a bounce spell or counter (and then win the game). Ancient Tomb doesn't help with Crusade, neither does Lotus Petal really & what WW would be running Mox Diamond?


I didn't say it was a great answer, but it's better than most of your options. I'm just suggesting other budget options to make the deck competitive.

[xsockmonkeyx]

It's not arbitrary. I don't feel like explaining it.

I disagree. Please explain.