[GenCon] Legacy Championship 2007 - August 17 [Archive]

iOWN

05-21-2007, 09:33 PM

Prizes

* First and second places each choose two oversized cards from a pool of ten Legacy Oversized cards.
* Third – Eighth place each choose one oversized card from the remaining card pool
* Top finishers win Vintage Boosters

The one thing that I'm surprised by is the prize support this year. Seriously, Vintage gets their huge Mox trophy and last year the Legacy Champion was awarded a full playset of Revised duals. How does a couple of cards that aren't even legal for any kind of play compare to trophies or staple cards in a format? I guess they'll still be doing something similar to last years distribution of Italian Legends packs (the top 8 got some huge number like two boxes each) so there's still motivation, but it still doesn't seem like a very good way to seperate first place from eighth. Are these cards some kind of valuable collectible, or are they just lame?

bigbear102

05-22-2007, 04:18 PM

OK.... to clarify.... The "Mox trophy" you are talking about was an oversized alternate art Mox, which is probably what the Legacy prize will be, but a legacy staple instead.

ALSO: You are dead wrong about what the prizes were last year. First got 40 duals, 2nd got 10 duals. I'm not sure what 3/4 got, but I came in 7th and got about a box worth of Ravnica Block plus 4 Italian Legends packs. 2 boxes is a huge exaggeration, as I got barely more than a box. I think it was like 14 draft sets of Ravnica and 4 Italian Legends packs. The prizes for this thing are kind of lame, and I think they should stay dual lands. The oversized power nine are actually worth something, oversized legacy staples probably won't be worth shit.

Gekoratel

05-22-2007, 04:22 PM

What is the competition like at this tourny I've never attended World's before but it seems like it would be a lot of fun. I would probably only consider attending if there was a chance that I could make Top 8. A weekend full of Legacy and T1 does sound like good times even if it is a bit of a trip.

The T1 and Legacy events are held on different days right.

bigbear102

05-22-2007, 04:30 PM

Last year there were almost 200 people in the Legacy event. There weren't as many in the Vintage because it is sanctioned, therefore you have to have the actual cards.

The side events have anywhere from 20-40 people normally. It is a good time, although I do wish they would just give duals for the Legacy like last time.

iOWN

05-22-2007, 06:55 PM

ALSO: You are dead wrong about what the prizes were last year. First got 40 duals, 2nd got 10 duals. I'm not sure what 3/4 got, but I came in 7th and got about a box worth of Ravnica Block plus 4 Italian Legends packs. 2 boxes is a huge exaggeration, as I got barely more than a box. I think it was like 14 draft sets of Ravnica and 4 Italian Legends packs. The prizes for this thing are kind of lame, and I think they should stay dual lands. The oversized power nine are actually worth something, oversized legacy staples probably won't be worth shit.

Sorry, I didn't mean two boxes of Italian Legends, I meant boxes of current sets with everybody getting some packs of It. Legends also. Still, over a box of Rav block with 4 packs of Legends is a lot, especially with the decent prize support going to the finalists. Also, the oversized Power Nine have been described as trophies, alternate art (I remember the 2005 Recall was done by Mark Poole), and are framed (and have Vintage Champion engraved/written at the bottom?), where the prizes for this are just called oversized Legacy cards. It doesn't even sound like it's close to the same thing.

Edit: And how is a full playset of Revised Duals any different than 40?

UrDraco

05-23-2007, 05:04 PM

Pinder

05-23-2007, 07:01 PM

So, let's just say that I was batshit crazy enough to fly out to this thing, too.

Would anyone be willing to split room costs (I assume Mav would also be in tow)?

TheAardvark

05-23-2007, 08:44 PM

Is there somewhere you can find a full listing of Magic events? Or do they usually only have the listed Legacy/Vintage tournaments? I am trying to decide if it is worth the time off and plane tickets.

They have tournaments starting pretty much every hour for 4 days, with a lot of drafting, Standard, and Extended tournaments for those who dig those, along with Legacy and Vintage side evnts, as well as variant formats (Peasant, Creature Feature, etc.). Just go to their website (http://www.gencon.com/2007/indy/default.aspx) for event info. I didn't look, actually, so full event schedules may not be up yet. They should be next month sometime if not.

dre4m

05-23-2007, 10:01 PM

So, let's just say that I was batshit crazy enough to fly out to this thing, too.

Would anyone be willing to split room costs (I assume Mav would also be in tow)?

I will be more than willing to split room costs with you. If I go, it will be with my teammate Steve, but as it's not for a while not it's still up in the air. Will you be staying for the whole convention?

Meister_Kai

05-23-2007, 11:24 PM

As long as college doesn't start back up again by the 17th, I will sure as hell be there to dominate the field with Enchantress.

Also, is there any way you guys could get some sort of public SSBM thing going on, because I see you guys talk about it all the time and i'm pretty sure I kick ass at it (I only use one character, but i'm damn good with him).

Pinder

05-24-2007, 12:17 AM

I will be more than willing to split room costs with you. If I go, it will be with my teammate Steve, but as it's not for a while not it's still up in the air. Will you be staying for the whole convention?

It's still up in the air for me too, but I think that if I do go it will likely just be either for the day, or possibly the weekend.

Caboose

05-24-2007, 12:55 AM

It's still up in the air for me too, but I think that if I do go it will likely just be either for the day, or possibly the weekend.

I herd you liek hanging out with Caboose :frown:

TheInfamousBearAssassin

05-24-2007, 01:02 AM

How far away is Columbus from Indianapolis?

Caboose

05-24-2007, 01:12 AM

How far away is Columbus from Indianapolis?

174 mi (about 2 hours 48 mins)

Pinder

05-24-2007, 01:22 AM

I herd you liek hanging out with Caboose :frown:

I'm not so sure about the three hour drive both ways, but it sure as hell would be cheaper than getting a room.

Are you offering your place, or just to split room costs?

Caboose

05-24-2007, 01:24 AM

Are you offering your place, or just to split room costs?

I'm offering that you go to Indianapolis and we will talk about how much we liek 'em.

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i54/Sneepur/Mudkipz-1.jpg

NANTUKO_SHADY

05-24-2007, 02:29 PM

I don't know what the hell these oversized Legacy cards are worth. They sound worse than duals to me, as you can actually only try and sell them for some money. Is this event worth going to?

legacyplayer0

05-24-2007, 02:41 PM

Pinder

05-24-2007, 02:42 PM

I doubt that this tourney will be worth much more than bragging rights, as I'm not sure there are a ton of people out there scrambling for oversize Legacy staples. And what do they mean by 'Vintage boosters'? Do they mean like Alpha and Beta boosters? Because I would play for those....

All in all though, it might not be worth the cash it takes to fly out there.

TheAardvark

05-24-2007, 03:38 PM

I don't know what the hell these oversized Legacy cards are worth. They sound worse than duals to me, as you can actually only try and sell them for some money. Is this event worth going to?

If you're going to only play in the one event, then no, it's not. However, GenCon overall is worth going to for a variety of reasons, especially if you've never been to it before. It's a unique experience that I think every pseudo-serious Magic player (or gamer in general, I guess) should experience at least once.

So, yeah.

UrDraco

05-24-2007, 03:48 PM

And what do they mean by 'Vintage boosters'?

They mean un-searched Italian Legends booster backs. Unsearched because I have seen people open mana drains moats and the like from those prize packs. Like it says above, if you top 8 you usually get something like 4, but they will prolly be thrown in as prizes in the smaller tournaments they have. I have heard of them sometimes giving out revised packs at some places but I feel like that would be worse. It seems like they have a warehouse of Italian legends boosters lying around somewhere.

Watcher487

05-24-2007, 03:58 PM

They mean un-searched Italian Legends booster backs. Unsearched because I have seen people open mana drains moats and the like from those prize packs. Like it says above, if you top 8 you usually get something like 4, but they will prolly be thrown in as prizes in the smaller tournaments they have. I have heard of them sometimes giving out revised packs at some places but I feel like that would be worse. It seems like they have a warehouse of Italian legends boosters lying around somewhere.

They used to be one out in Albany...

Anyway they produced more Italian boosters than English one, I think.

Hummingbird TG

05-25-2007, 09:43 AM

But the Italian cards look far worse. And not to mention, are far less pimp. The border color looks off...

Shriekmaw

05-25-2007, 01:28 PM

I don't know what the hell these oversized Legacy cards are worth. They sound worse than duals to me, as you can actually only try and sell them for some money. Is this event worth going to?

I would probably not go to Legacy World Championship, because I feel it really isn't worth the driving distance we have to go in Central New York. Plus, if Newark continues to have Duel for Duals every month, staying here in Central New York doesn't seem to be a bad idea at all.

dre4m

05-25-2007, 05:52 PM

I would probably not go to Legacy World Championship, because I feel it really isn't worth the driving distance we have to go in Central New York. Plus, if Newark continues to have Duel for Duals every month, staying here in Central New York doesn't seem to be a bad idea at all.

Maybe you wouldn't mind swinging by Detroit and giving me a ride to a D4D then?

revenge_inc

05-27-2007, 12:52 AM

Anarky87

05-27-2007, 02:35 AM

wtf is up with this tourny?. I have never been so I may be too quick to judge it but for a World Championship, it seems kind of lame. Always at the same venue in the same state of the same country? Not very representative of the world. Less so than a GP. Oversized cards as prices?

The only good thing about it, is that it's 48k, no other Legacy event will allow you to loose or gain so much rating. (Fighting over so little)

The location doesn't bother me that much, because it's the only big event that's close to me. I could make the same argument about D4D's being isolated to the East coast. Midwest seems just fine to hold the big show. Though I do agree the prizes completely suck ass hardcore.

UrDraco

05-31-2007, 11:22 AM

Anarky87

05-31-2007, 11:47 AM

I know this isn't about the Legacy event but....

Has anyone that has gone know if in the vintage tournament they check your cards (power mostly) to see if they are real? Or can people just use IE cards with cut corners and crap? Just wondering because I almost never get to use real power and it would suck to get beat by a poser with fake cards.

I don't know if they check them specifically, but you do have to use real power, no proxies. So I imagine if you were iffy about someone's cards, you could ask a judge.

Michael Keller

06-02-2007, 12:22 AM

How exciting. Winning this tournament would be like Ralphie's reaction after decoding Little Orphan Annie's Secret Circle message:

"Be sure to drink your Ovaltine".

http://www.cinematical.com/images/2005/12/ralphie.jpg

"A crummy, oversized Magic card? ...Son of a bitch!..."

06-02-2007, 01:25 AM

It's really sad when a local 15-person tournament has better prize support than World Championships. I don't know if that will turn people away, but if I were planning to go and then noticed the best I can win for an expensive trip down there is a worthless oversize card, I'd be turning my ass around.

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06-02-2007, 08:15 AM

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EDIT: To the folks complaining about the prize support (which does suck), you do realize this is freakin' GenCon and there's a million things to do other than play Magic?

Epheniculles

06-11-2007, 04:33 PM

Well if the rewards are alternate art oversized cards, or new oversized cards, I am all for that. Prizes such as those sell for good cash. I know of art work that has been given as prize and they have sold for good money. My friend was trying to purchase the mox from last year, and the offers had reached over $500 I believe. The market is there, and I would actually be interested in purchasing some of these prizes if these were actually new or alternate art cards.

If these are nothing more than junk oversized cards, expect me to try and provide a Prize for 1st place. I know a few magic artists, so I might be able to pull a few strings, and trophies don't really cost too much if you know the right people.

AnwarA101

06-18-2007, 01:10 AM

Anarky87

06-18-2007, 02:29 AM

I wanted to see how many people on here were planning to attend. I was going to consider trying to take some time off from work and go to this, but the prizes are really a disincentive to make the trip out there. I don't believe the prize is like the Vintage event at all. I believe the Vintage winner gets a framed copy of alternate artwork of Mox Jet. Oversized cards don't really compare to that. I attended in 2005 and the prizes were similar to last year with 40 duals going to first place.

I was planning on attending, but really because this is in my backyard so...And the only big Legacy tournament I get to attend, so you can count on me being there; shitty payout or not. I can understand not wanting to come from that far away.

IndyTerminator

06-18-2007, 08:15 AM

I'm planning on attending. It isn't very often that we have big Legacy tournaments in the midwest.

Kenderleech

06-23-2007, 10:48 PM

I have a limited amount of floor space available about ten miles from the convention center... Crayons have priority, then people I don't hate.

Caboose

06-24-2007, 12:58 AM

I have a limited amount of floor space available about ten miles from the convention center... Crayons have priority, then people I don't hate.

Floor space? You might as well just sleep in the Convention Center. Mike Herbig, Overlord95, and I slept in one of the infy empty rooms at GenCon, and we weren't disturbed. It was actually the best sleep I got all weekend.

Kenderleech

06-24-2007, 07:32 AM

Its floor space because the extra bed and the couch are already reserved. It comes with kitchen space, showering capability, access to alarm clock, the internet, and TV.

APriestOfGix

06-25-2007, 10:19 AM

Anarky87

06-25-2007, 07:45 PM

I'm going to have to agree. Having the WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS in the same place every year is a drag. Yes, mostly Americans and Europeans play Legacy, so i see why they have it in America (cheaper for them). But move it around, put one in Claifornia at the San Diego Gencon, and they would be good.

From what I heard, I thought they cancelled the Gencon in California? I might be wrong, but a guy I play with from San Diego told me they weren't doing Gencons there anymore.

I don't see a problem with the Championships being in the same place. I don't ask that the SCG D4D be moved around the US to compensate players that don't live on the East Coast, or tell Kaddy that he should move his Dual Land Drafts around closer to where I live. D4D's, Mana Leak Opens, GAGG, DLD's, etc. usually all take place on the East Coast, so why doesn't it makes sense that the World Championship be held at the largest gaming convention of year? Seems perfectly fine to me.

APriestOfGix

06-26-2007, 11:05 AM

not really, i makes it so the same group of players always play, yes the largest group, but still the same group.

I would hardly call myself the WORLD champ if the location was the same place every year, and i say my same friends there, and for the MOST part, it was the same every year.

They need to move it around. Thats like saying well MOSTLY americans play T2, so we should have the T2 world Champs in US every year, but what about Japan?

Same thing, Legacy could do well in West Coast, and over in Europe, i KNOW there is a large German/Itilian/French playerbase.

Nightmare

06-26-2007, 11:29 AM

Same thing, Legacy could do well in West Coast, and over in Europe, i KNOW there is a large German/Itilian/French playerbase.And there was a GP in Europe.

For all the bitching about no large events the non-east coast Legacy players do, there sure aren't many people jumping at the chance to hold one.

One thing you have to remember - The east coast states are much, much smaller than the midwest or western states. The distances required to travel to large events are much less, as a byproduct. Virginia Drives through 4 -6 states (depending on what route they take) to get here in 10 hours, while the same 10 hours wouldn't get you from Portland to San Diego through 2 states on the West Coast. It's a lot easier to get a large turnout when you have 5 major Legacy locations within a 5 hour drive (Rochester, Syracuse, NNY, Albany, Worchester). Oh, note that 4 of those are in NY State.

Lukas Preuss

06-26-2007, 12:11 PM

The thing is, it is not even called the "American Championship" but the World Championship and that title is plainly wrong. You're most definitely not the world champion if you win there.

I could easily organize a similar "World Championship" in Germany (I might as well call the annual "German Legacy Championship" "World Championship")... but this would be utterly ridiculous. The "World Champion" title wouldn't be more than a joke. Same goes basically for the American "World Championship".

See, I'm not jealous, because Wizards organizes such a big event for you guys. You damn well deserve it and we have big events all the time in Germany, so it's not like I am missing out on something. But the name of the event is just as misleading as it could be... this event is as far from a "World Championship" as it is from a Pro Tour.

Nightmare

06-26-2007, 12:19 PM

If there is a World Championship, it has to be held somewhere. One place is as good as any other. Wizards has decided to hold it here. Oh wells.

Anarky87

06-26-2007, 12:24 PM

not really, i makes it so the same group of players always play, yes the largest group, but still the same group.What's wrong with the same people playing in the Champs? Ok, so groups of people who want to attend the event and play for the title aren't allowed to if they've already been to it once? Or does that somehow invalidate the results if people close to the event come every year? Or does it somehow stop people from coming a long distance to play? No, it doesn't, that's ridiculous.

Should I say that East Coast events need to be moved around the country because the same group of players attend them and that isn't fair? I'd say not.

I would hardly call myself the WORLD champ if the location was the same place every year, and i say my same friends there, and for the MOST part, it was the same every year.Location doesn't matter. If you win the fucking Champs title, you're the fucking Champ. It doesn't matter if the Champs are in Iceland every year. If you go there and win the whole thing, then you're the Champ. There's no disqualifying clause that says, "If you win, you are the World Champion, but if the World Championships were held in the same state more than once per year, you're not the World Champ." So aside from what you feel about the Champs, whoever wins is still the winner.

And I'd love to see (I'm guessing you meant 'saw' and not 'say') my friends every year at Gencon, regardless if I win or not. They make the trip unique and fun so it's not the same thing every year. The event is not the same from year to year, there is a lot of change.

They need to move it around. Thats like saying well MOSTLY americans play T2, so we should have the T2 world Champs in US every year, but what about Japan?Probably because Worlds for Standard is part of a pro-tour circuit that makes stops all over the 'world' throughout the season and encompasses 6 digit figures and inumerable players. Legacy does not have this. As far as I know, the Legacy World Championship is not part of a pro-tour circuit that travels around the world and brings WOTC absurd amounts of cash. The Champs for Legacy is a fixed location in Indiana at Gencon every year, the largest gaming convention in the US every year. That makes sense to me.

And they do have Legacy Champs in Europe, so apparently you haven't looked there. If you want a Champs on the West Coast, getting talking to people that can do something.

Same thing, Legacy could do well in West Coast, and over in Europe, i KNOW there is a large German/Itilian/French playerbase.And they do hold Champs in Europe for European players. The things is, people don't really want to travel outside of their country in Europe. They tried putting a Gencon there, but it turned out being like, people from France would play, but people from Germany wouldn't come to France. If it was in Germany, Germans would play, but people from France wouldn't travel to it. The metas are pretty isolated it seems to their respected countries.

Again, if you want a Champs in California, start talking to some people. I'm positive you would draw people from all the surrounding and border states and maybe even some people from the Midwest and East Coast. But to me, having it in the Midwest seems resaonable because it's like a midpoint between the coasts. Players from both will have to travel to the center of the US to play in the Champs. It just so happens to be especially nice for Midwest people because it's in our backyard. And we get little to no big events in the Midwest outside of maybe a DLD in Chicago or something in Ohio. That's it. So it seems logical to me.

Lukas Preuss

06-26-2007, 12:37 PM

If there is a World Championship, it has to be held somewhere. One place is as good as any other. Wizards has decided to hold it here. Oh wells.

Yes, of course. There is no problem with that. But you make it sound as if you really believe that the victory in said "World Championship" makes a player the "World Champion" - which means the best player in the world - which is simply not the case.

And they do have Legacy Champs in Europe, so apparently you haven't looked there.

With the only difference, that we don't call the winner of our Champs "World Champion" but "German Champion, "Dutch Champion", "Italian Champion" etc. ... :)

"World Champion" sound way better than "German Champion", don't you think?

So, what's wrong with calling the Gencon event "American Legacy Championship"? ;)

Nightmare

06-26-2007, 12:45 PM

Yes, of course. There is no problem with that. But you make it sound as if you really believe that the victory in said "World Championship" makes a player the "World Champion" - which means the best player in the world - which is simply not the case. By definition, the winner of the event called the World Championship is the "World Champion." The location of the event is irrelevant.

With the only difference, that we don't call the winner of our Champs "World Champion" but "German Champion, "Dutch Champion", "Italian Champion" etc. ... :)You don't call the winner of your event the World Champion, because it isn't the World Championship. This is.

So, what's wrong with calling the Gencon event "American Legacy Championship"? ;)Nothing. But that isn't what it is. It's the World Championship. If you want to be the World Champion, you could, you know, attend the tournament.

Mad Zur

06-26-2007, 03:37 PM

If I won this event, I would not call myself the World Champion.

Because the tournament is not called (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=events/magic/legacychamps) the World Championship.

Nightmare

06-26-2007, 03:46 PM

If I won this event, I would not call myself the World Champion.

Because the tournament is not called (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=events/magic/legacychamps) the World Championship.Research FTW. End of debate.

Caboose

06-29-2007, 06:48 AM

When is this going to be over? My favorite rapper is performing in Indy at 8PM that night, and rap music > Legacy.

EDIT: America > Europe

Not just in Magic, but in general.

alakar

06-29-2007, 09:11 AM

Hey, on a different note, in the link it says REL 4, did they up that from last year? I thought is was lower

zulander

06-29-2007, 09:15 AM

Hrm... I'd love to go, but the prizes just aren't worth it. I'd rather spend the money that would go to the trip on cards from ebay or a local store. I expected more from Wizards :(

URABAHN

06-29-2007, 07:41 PM

Hrm... I'd love to go, but the prizes just aren't worth it. I'd rather spend the money that would go to the trip on cards from ebay or a local store. I expected more from Wizards :(

I think some people are missing the point, which is,

THIS IS FREAKING GENCON and your badge gets you access to stuff other than 1 Magic Tournament.

zulander

08-06-2007, 09:22 AM

Bumpage, who from NOVA's going to this thing?

APriestOfGix

08-06-2007, 10:26 AM

yeah, i'm not going, to costly to fly out there...

Anarky87

08-06-2007, 10:42 AM

I'll be going. Hopefully I'll get to meet some more Source people again. I met a lot of you guys at the GP, which was pretty cool.

IndyTerminator

08-06-2007, 02:56 PM

I will be unable to attend Legacy Champs this year. My last day at my internship is scheduled for the 17th. So I will not be down for that day. I am still planning to be at Gencon on Saturday. I hope to see some of you down there and good luck in the championships.

TheAardvark

08-06-2007, 03:57 PM

Barring something disastrous, I will be there, although I am unsure if I will play in the event itself, since the format is really boring me right now. Depends on if there's anything better to do on Friday, I suppose.

URABAHN

08-06-2007, 06:10 PM

Bumpage, who from NOVA's going to this thing?

Someone should craft me a Nametag to wear to the event. I'm going, but I'm too lazy to make a freakin' nametag like all the EPIC guys have for each other.

Pinder

08-06-2007, 09:36 PM

Someone should craft me a Nametag to wear to the event. I'm going, but I'm too lazy to make a freakin' nametag like all the EPIC guys have for each other.

Meh, I'll see what I can whip up.

Bryant Cook

08-07-2007, 12:04 AM

I would go but... playing for giant cardboard is less appealling than small cardboard.

NANTUKO_SHADY

08-07-2007, 12:39 AM

I would go but... playing for giant cardboard is less appealling than small cardboard.

Agreed... This is def. worth going to if you are into alot more than just playing Magic The Gathering there. Unfortunately, I am not. I'm sure it will be a blast though.

Pinder

08-07-2007, 12:44 AM

Shazam!

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t124/Pindarius/Unicorn%20Nametags/urabahn.jpg

How you turn it into something you can wear is up to you, but it's there.

Shriekmaw

08-07-2007, 12:55 AM

I would go but... playing for giant cardboard is less appealling than small cardboard.

I was just curious, what happened it the cardboard was a big magic card of Tendrils of Agony or Empty The Warrens? Would you be interested then?

Bryant Cook

08-07-2007, 01:13 AM

Nope. They are not asian and not signed by Rob Van Dam, mine are.

Tacosnape

08-07-2007, 01:21 AM

Nope. They are not asian and not signed by Rob Van Dam, mine are.

They're signed by Rob Van Dam? Are you fucking serious? That's awesome.

Bryant Cook

08-07-2007, 01:40 AM

Yes. All my win conditions are.

NANTUKO_SHADY

08-07-2007, 02:02 AM

Yes. All my win conditions are.

Wait.. when he walked into Comix Zone... did you find out if he played Magic?? Or does he just have some random other hobby he's interested in, cuz if he played Magical Cards, that would be fuckin' insane.

Bryant Cook

08-07-2007, 02:08 AM

He walked into Comix Zone and Teeniebopper dared me to ask him to sign something so I pulled out 4 Tendrils 4 ETW and had him sign them. He's a comic book nerd.

Pinder

08-07-2007, 02:43 AM

He walked into Comix Zone and Teeniebopper dared me to ask him to sign something so I pulled out 4 Tendrils 4 ETW and had him sign them. He's a comic book nerd.

This reminds me of a time when my friend tried to get Alan Alda to sign his Force of Wills. Turns out Alan Alda isn't as nice as Rob Van Dam, I guess. Did get to shake his hand, though.

TeenieBopper

08-07-2007, 03:41 AM

He walked into Comix Zone and Teeniebopper dared me to ask him to sign something so I pulled out 4 Tendrils 4 ETW and had him sign them. He's a comic book nerd.

I wish I had remembered that I had Goblins in my car that afternoon. How awesome would it have been to have RVD signed Piledrivers?

TheAardvark

08-10-2007, 03:11 PM

andrew77

08-13-2007, 05:54 AM

Well, the prizes are slightly better than was originally thought. Basically, you get "Vintage boosters", which I took to mean Italian Legends. Well, yes, there's that, but also Italian BB Revised and Japanese P3K.

So, not as bad as I thought, but still...

I'm pretty sure italian legends is more expensive than either of those 2 other boxes. Also i just read that block has better support than legacy so im pretty mad.

Time Spiral, 4 Planar Chaos & 4 Future Sight complete foil sets

I mean just 4 goys, 4 damnations and 4 akroma's are probably worth mroe than the box our winner gets. They should give out better prizes for the eternal championships. Something like a playset of bb duals for legacy winner and a playset of bb power for the vintage winner.

Nightmare

08-13-2007, 07:32 AM

A playset of Beta power huh? Seems like a deal. Nothing like winning 30k at a tournament...

Lets hope you meant a single set.

zulander

08-13-2007, 08:15 AM

I kinda wanna go just to win the block tournament.. too bad work's keeping me from going, stupid server migrations :(

TheAardvark

08-13-2007, 12:14 PM

@andrew77:

I wasn't implying that the other packs are more expensive than Italian Legends; I was explaining that there was more to be given out than IL only.

@zulander:

The Block tourney is one reason I may not play in Legacy hamps; if I make T8 in Block, it'll be at least 2am before I get out of there, and the LC starts at 10am, so...

Nightmare

08-17-2007, 09:35 AM

We'll need up-to-date info on this as it comes in. Be sure to post whatever you hear from people that are there.

SouthAlly

08-17-2007, 10:05 AM

Be a man.
Sleep is for wimps.
You sleep every night your whole life. You can spare one.
:wink:

Tacosnape

08-17-2007, 01:24 PM

Be a man.
Sleep is for wimps.
You sleep every night your whole life. You can spare one.
:wink:

If sleep is for wimps, change my name to Captain Pussywuss McWeaklington.

EDIT: In case any of the mods are feeling bored, this is entirely a joke.:tongue:

jazzykat

08-17-2007, 02:58 PM

Who is winning this thing? Is there any free coverage?

Watcher487

08-17-2007, 03:15 PM

We'll need up-to-date info on this as it comes in. Be sure to post whatever you hear from people that are there.

Yo, just gave Ken a call. Round 4 Hatfields are at Table 38 playing each other, meanwhile Ken has gotten out of his slump and is now at the mason-dixon line (2-2) with Old School Deuce.

aTn

08-17-2007, 03:28 PM

The only free coverage I could find was for D&D, which is kind of frustrating. Did anyone else come to this conclusion ? Does anyone know how many players attended for the Legacy event ?

Bryant Cook

08-17-2007, 03:47 PM

Any updates? Whats at the top tables?

Silverdragon

08-17-2007, 04:06 PM

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=welcome/conventions/gencon07#6
Apparently UG Madness is still good...

o0grandroyal0o

08-17-2007, 05:09 PM

My buddies James King with UGR Thresh is 5-1, Alex G with IGGy Pop is 5-1, and Rhyno Spindler with UR Landstill is 5-1

and Mike Bolmholm is 5-1 I think

EDIT:

Also there is 8 rounds and 170ish players

scrumdogg

08-17-2007, 05:11 PM

Apparently Roland Chang is still good.....he & Fucking Bryan are perhaps the only two players on the planet still having success with UG Madness.

Bryant Cook

08-17-2007, 11:17 PM

Any other updates?

AnwarA101

08-17-2007, 11:20 PM

This news just in -

1. UG Thresh with Wasteland wins the whole thing (no not Madness!)

2. 43 Land

3-4. Cephalid Breakfast (MadZur)
3-4. UGR Thresh

5-8. UGR Thresh
5-8. UGR Thresh
5-8. Ichorid
5-8. BHWC Landstill

Whit3 Ghost

08-17-2007, 11:25 PM

wow, you have any names to go with the results?

TeenieBopper

08-17-2007, 11:29 PM

Cephalid Breakfast (MadZur)

Lastly, some random stupid deck that makes you hate the format will T8, be all the rage for way too long, and then fall off the face fo the planet when ppl slowly realize that the deck is not any good. See Deadguy Ale.

Citrus-God

08-17-2007, 11:38 PM

cwt1220

08-18-2007, 12:01 AM

Im kinda interested in the decklist for UG Thresh if anyone knows what his list is. Im used to seeing it run with white for StP and mystic enforcer.
I really wanted to see Roland Chang w/ U/G madness, cause i run that deck at weekly tournaments, and frequently top 4 with it.

Bardo

08-18-2007, 12:20 AM

I got off the phone with Rich Shay (AtogLord) a little bit ago--who went 5-1-1 with UGWR Threshold and ended up in 10th place, missing the T8 on some shitty tie-breakers (his one loss, in the first round, went on to 0-3...) Rich's draw was unintentional and against Gadiel Szleifer (sp), who he said was a "raging fucking cock-sucker." I may have put those words in his mouth, but if you know Rich, you he's extremely nice and its hard for him to use those words in that order against another person. A couple of judges began to watch the match, but only after Gadiel cooled his shit out--though he nearly got an unsportsmanlike warning, apparently.

Anyway, he said Gadiel was trying to get him concede to him and called Rich a bunch names beginning with "Fucking" and ending with other unkind things. :mad:

Rich's verstion of Thresh was very odd, including only 4x Mongeese/Tarmogoyf in the maindeck, along with 2 Scepters, 3 F/I, 4 StP, AK and some other wonky stuff.

His sideboard, as I remember it:

4 Pyroclasm
4 Meddling Mage
4 REB/Pyroblast
2 Krosan Grip
1 Rough // Tumble

marit

08-18-2007, 12:24 AM

So sad that some known legacy players have to be dicks. I'm surprised no storm combo decks T8ed, but I'm guessing there was a large showing of UGr thresh.

Bovinious

08-18-2007, 12:31 AM

Ichorid representing!!! I dont know how whoever it was didnt make it past top8 with 4 Thresh decks there, he must have got paired vs. Breakfast in top 8 or got really unlucky.

Whit3 Ghost

08-18-2007, 12:31 AM

I'm currently praying to every known God that one of the UGR players is Cappy (Goobafish). He made day 2 at Columbus with it and I know he was making the trek down.

EDIT- I've felt Gadiel was a tool since his GP Colombus interview.

Bryant Cook

08-18-2007, 12:38 AM

How disappointing, 0 storm combo. Eh, ya win some ya lose some. Congrats to Jesse.

bigbear102

08-18-2007, 12:52 AM

I've felt that Gadiel is a dick since GenCon 05 when he was paired against Zvi, and I was at the table next to them. Not knowing who Gadiel was, I asked Zvi if any other pros were there, and he looked around and said he didn't think so... I think that pissed him off. Zvi was also smashing him with Landstill, Gadiel was playing Solidarity with Chrome mox, and Solitary Confinement in the board. He told me to shut up at one point and stop distracting his opponent, who was handily whooping his ass with 2x Mage and an Arcane Lab on the board. I also talked to him at Philly and he was a complete deuchebag there too. I'm just glad he's eating his words about Legacy.

SpatulaOfTheAges

08-18-2007, 12:53 AM

So sad that some known legacy players have to be dicks. I'm surprised no storm combo decks T8ed, but I'm guessing there was a large showing of UGr thresh.

Gadiel isn't a known Legacy player.

Congrats to Jesse.

Whit3 Ghost

08-18-2007, 01:02 AM

Forgot to mention, obvious grats to Jesse.

Way to represent.

outsideangel

08-18-2007, 01:19 AM

Yay Jesse!

Gratz on the big finish!

Carlos El Salvador

08-18-2007, 02:02 AM

Good Job Top 8ers. I hope you get some Italian mana drains from your Italian legends packs to pay for your tournament. My friends called me and said 'some crazy deck that plays this one creature for one mana, then this other creature for two man is like five and 0", I said "Oh Cephilid Breakfast" And he said "No man, Never saw the deck before!" I rolled my eyes, secretly knowing that I could beat Cephilid Breakfast. No storm combo is odd... It's mostly because, well, I wasn't there rocking the TES through a slew of Aggro Control. TES is basically the only viable combo deck in a field like GenCon where you expect over half aggro control. Cephilid Breakfast comes in a close second, mostly because it sounds like it got faster and more consistant.

goobafish

08-18-2007, 02:52 AM

Yeah White_Ghost I came in fourth.

Peter Olszewski won the event with UG *****, I am not going to post lists because I am too tired. The other UGr Thresh was Steve Conway (same list as me) , the 43 land was Ryan Trepanier, Mardy (dunno last name) was playing 4c Landstill. Ontario took 5/8 top 8 slots and we are currently holding 9 of the oversized cards, and trying to get rid of them, because we have no way of getting them home as our van is stuffed :(.

Edit: Here is the top 8 in standings after swiss

Marty Birthelmer (4c Landstill)
Ryan Trepanier (43 Land)
Jesse Hatfield
Peter Olszewski (UG Thresh)
James King
Ernest Turck
Steve Conway (UGR Thrash)
David Caplan (UGR Thrash)

Someone care to fill in the blanks for deck types? I know the other three were UGR Thresh, Ichorid, Cephalid Breakfast, I just don't know who was playing what.

Illissius

08-18-2007, 06:27 AM

No Goblins in the T8. <3
Ryan also made T8 at Columbus. Pretty nice.

Bane of the Living

08-18-2007, 07:43 AM

This is one of the first top eights Ive seen in some time with no Goblins. Its probably from all the Red versions of Thresh.

Breakfast and Ichorid are not a surprise to me at all. These have been decks that were really just waiting for combo superstar Narcomeoba to break into tier one. I am surprised Ichorid didnt make top four with such a healthy top eight to snack on. Thresh is very favorable and Landstill is a bye.

Im very interested in seeing the Thresh list. I wonder what the fillers were. Repeal? Counterbalance + Top?

goobafish

08-18-2007, 08:36 AM

kabal

08-18-2007, 08:40 AM

Rich's verstion of Thresh was very odd, including only 4x Mongeese/Tarmogoyf in the maindeck, along with 2 Scepters, 3 F/I, 4 StP, AK and some other wonky stuff.

My guess is his build looks very similar to one of the builds that made this Top 8 (http://www.planetmtg.de/articles/artikel.html?id=2991)

below is an example of what I'm referring too:

3 Tundra
3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
4 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
2 Island

4 Nimble Mongoose
3 Tarmogoyf
2 Mystic Enforcer

4 Brainstorm
4 Accumulated Knowledge
2 Lightning Bolt
3 Swords to Plowshares
4 Daze
3 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
2 Repeal
2 Isochron Scepter
2 Serum Visions
3 Fire / Ice

goobafish

08-18-2007, 09:13 AM

These were the oversized cards

Force of Will
Polluted Delta
Flooded Strand
Bloodstained Mire
Windswept Heath
Wooded Foothills
Goblin Warchief
Tropical Island
Tundra
Underground Sea
Scrubland
Taiga
Badlands

First pick was force, second was Delta, third Trop fourth Sea.

Nihil Credo

08-18-2007, 09:22 AM

Yay for U/G Threshold! I'm going to update my months-old list now... I guess Goyfs are a tad bit better than Troll Ascetics and Trygon Predators as extra beaters.

Bane of the Living

08-18-2007, 09:48 AM

Trygon is surprisingly good against alot of decks. He breaks the Stax matchup and blows up all kinds of goodies you might've let resolve. He pitches to FoW and he's a three drop for your Counterbalance. Whats not to love?

Citrus-God

08-18-2007, 09:53 AM

hmm... another Vintage Icon (That was DicemanX or something like that) takes down a Legacy Title.... c'mon people, step up a little!

Raider Bob

08-18-2007, 10:57 AM

I like the focus of the top Eight. How do you feel this event is going to have on the playability of 43 Land? Did 43 land never face combo not sure how it beats on combo seems like it would auto lose to that match-up.

This is sweet
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=welcome/conventions/gencon07#2

Looks good when two Hatfields make the top 8 with the same deck in a prelim.

Tacosnape

08-18-2007, 12:10 PM

I like the focus of the top Eight. How do you feel this event is going to have on the playability of 43 Land? Did 43 land never face combo not sure how it beats on combo seems like it would auto lose to that match-up.

My take on 43 Land is the same as my take on Death and Taxes. It's an average deck piloted by a really good player who knows the deck inside out. Seriously? Does anyone in this hemisphere T8 with 43 Land except Ryan Trepanier?

Marty Birthelmer (4c Landstill)
Ryan Trepanier (43 Land)
Jesse Hatfield
Peter Olszewski (UG Thresh)
James King
Ernest Turck
Steve Conway (UGR Thrash)
David Caplan (UGR Thrash)

That's a lot of Threshold.

Anyone know who was playing the 4C Landstill / If he's on forums / what the decklist is? I always go a little giddy inside whenever 4C Landstill does well.

Peter_Rotten

08-18-2007, 12:23 PM

How many ppl played in the Prelim?

Nihil Credo

08-18-2007, 12:43 PM

Vroman's Aggro Loam deck from the prelims is sexy. But Vintage deck designers are almost as frustrating as Japanese deck designers: singleton maindeck Exploration? With LftL and Factories, multiple Explorations are pretty broken, I hear.

Still, that doesn't make Sylvan Library + Children of Korlis (+Genesis) any less cool, though.

kabal

08-18-2007, 01:16 PM

Legacy Top 8 profile (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=welcome/conventions/gencon07#6)

What card is the most powerful in the format?

Islands

QFT

I also love how much prep work was put into this event..."I walked through the door and a friend said how about you play this? ok."

Bardo

08-18-2007, 01:28 PM

In the UG? Lam Phan built it righ before the event. The counterbalance top is in the board. Maindeck Snapback, Portents, Brainstorms, Predict. 12 Creatures for beats. 4 Snares, Stifles, Forces, Dazes ect.

So, just to be clear, did Lam win the whole thing with U/G? The results from the preliminary are making this a little confusing. Anyway, Lam's been playing U/G Threshold decks for like the last 100 years.

kabal

08-18-2007, 01:40 PM

So, just to be clear, did Lam win the whole thing with U/G? The results from the preliminary are making this a little confusing. Anyway, Lam's been playing U/G Threshold decks for like the last 100 years.

See Legacy Top 8 Profile. Just incase you don't click on the link, Peter Olszewski won playing UG Threshold

What deck are you playing and why?

U/G Threshold. It's Lam Phan's creation and he told me to go with it. It seemed to work out well!

Citrus-God

08-18-2007, 01:50 PM

Bird Shit comes to Vintage... yay!

In short, <3 Phan.

Bardo

08-18-2007, 01:54 PM

Cool. :)

I had to read Serum Visions and Mental Note when I played them. : )

Go, go Mental Note. :)

Rastadon

08-18-2007, 03:03 PM

\
EDIT- I've felt Gadiel was a tool since his GP Colombus interview.

Quoted for mother fucking truth. In the interview, they asked him if Flash was unfair. He replied 'Who cares?'.

Mijorre

08-18-2007, 03:58 PM

I like the part about Gabiel playing aggro-loam with exploration.
They do mean a plain 43 lands.dec variant, right?

Citrus-God

08-18-2007, 04:31 PM

That's kinda cool.... Predicts and Portents got first place....

// Peter Olszewski
// Lands 18
4 Wasteland
3 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Tropical Island
1 Breeding Pool
2 Island

// Creatures 12
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Werebear

// Spells 30
4 Brainstorm
4 Portent
4 Predict
4 Daze
4 Stifle
4 Spell Snare
4 Force of Will
1 Rushing River
1 Snapback

// Sideboard 15
4 Counterbalance
3 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Krosan Grip
2 Hail Storm

8 LD Spells.... brutal.

Eldariel

08-18-2007, 04:49 PM

Now that Threshold has enough good, cheap creatures to play aggro, Wasteland is a natural fit. 8 LD-spells means that suddenly, the traditionally poor control-MU took a turn for the better. Sure, they'll win if they get to the midgame, but this version is very adept at making the midgame not to happen.

I'm surprised UGw didn't do better, btw. Tarmogoyf helps with the Goblins-MU and the combo-MU is already good and in the mirror, I find it hard to believe that any red's tools are better than StP. Add to that how Thresh-heavy the field seems to have and it appears like UGw would've been the optimal choice for this tournament. Don't know though.

Bardo

08-18-2007, 04:57 PM

Some Thresh Stats...

Cantrips in T8 Threshold Decks; GenCon 2007

Brainstorm - 16
Serum Visions - 8
Opt - 8
Mental Note - 6
Portent - 4 (winning list, also U/G)
Predict - 4 (winning list, also U/G)

Creature Base of Threshold Decks:

Nimble Mongoose - 16
Tarmogoyf - 16
Werebear - 6
Quirion Dryad - 4

Nothing above 2cc!

Counter-base of Threshold Decks:

Force of Will - 16
Daze - 16
Spell Snare - 12
Stifle - 11
Counterspell - 3

Removal-base of Threshold Decks:

Lightning Bolt - 11
Fire/Ice - 10
Rushing River - 1
Snapback - 1
Swords to Plowshares - 0

Other facts:
18 Land - 3/4 Decks
17 Land - 1/4 Decks

If only I were still writing for SCG: "Legacy Threshold, Part VII: The Lessons of GenCon, 2007." :laugh:

Edit.

Sideboards, all 4 T8 Decks:

Pyroclasm: 10
Engineered Explosives: 7
Krosan Grip: 7
REB/Pyroblast: 6
Umezawa's Jitte: 4
Counterbalance: 4
Sensei's Divining Top: 3
Spell Snare: 3
Tormod's Crypt: 3
Threads of Disloyalty: 3
Pithing Needle: 3
Hail Storm: 2
Naturalize: 2
Counterspell: 1

Edit 2 - Dude, 42 Land.dec almost won first place...

Illissius

08-18-2007, 05:33 PM

Wasteland - 11
Stifle - 11

I've often thought of combining those two in a Threshold deck, but didn't think it could work out with the same number of lands, and was (as usual) too lazy to actually test it. Turns out it does work with only 18 lands. Well done.

It's interesting how Wasteland in Threshold went from unmentioned to three decks in the T8. How many of those guys were on the same team?

revenge_inc

08-18-2007, 07:59 PM

Just checked the results- Canada pwned that tournament. :cool:

Eldariel

08-18-2007, 08:07 PM

"It sure is good to be back home...in Canada!"

Whit3 Ghost

08-18-2007, 09:24 PM

"It sure is good to be back home...in Canada!"
You are my hero for quoting this, abridged FTW!

Parcher

08-18-2007, 11:55 PM

Does anyone know how the hell Jesse lost to Lands?

Bryant Cook

08-19-2007, 12:07 AM

Maze of ith, untaps Sutured Ghoul.

T is for TOOL

08-19-2007, 12:18 AM

He mulled both games. He kept 1 land hands both games, and his opponent lead with wasteland, or land, exploration, wasteland. Maze of Ith is also obnoxious.

C-Aleric

08-19-2007, 01:16 AM

Congrats to the Canadian crew!

Makes me sad someone from Waterloo couldn't head to this tournament, since the Canadians seem to be growing an affinity for Legacy tournaments.

Grats to Lam for making a wonderful Thresh list (and T8 in Vintage). I drooled the first time I saw that list in action (and this was before the current version). Grats to Ryan T. (42land. Honestly?) for making top 8 again *shakes fist*, and grats to everyone else who dominated at that tournament.

goobafish

08-19-2007, 02:33 AM

Grats to Lam for making a wonderful Thresh list (and T8 in Vintage). I drooled the first time I saw that list in action (and this was before the current version).

I played the same list you saw me playing. I have made only like 2 maindeck changes (besides goyfs) since Columbus, and Steve Conway played the exact list you saw me playing with a slightly different board. During my matchup in the top 8 of the legacy prelims (which hit like 80+ players and top 8 only walked away with 12 packs) we realized that Mental Note is terrible in our thresh lists, and Opt is far better in the red lists, and predict is amazing in the UG list with portents and brainstorms.

We are still unsure if our UGR or UG list is stricly better to one another, but they both seem to have advantages. I don't think the new UG is an update, just a different strategy.

mikekelley

08-19-2007, 05:16 AM

So glad to see lands in the top 8. I love that deck. Also it looks like Thresh is the new goblins, Tarmogoyf is the new Lackey.

I can hear the ban cries already.

I'm also intrigued by the two color thresh. Basically, what everyone else said.

One last thing, I think the next major legacy tournament should either be played outside or the grand prize should be a year long supply of tanning lotion.

godryk

08-19-2007, 09:03 AM

C.P.

08-19-2007, 10:35 AM

Congratulations to Peter Olszewski, but I think we must admit who's the real winner of the Tournament: Congratulations 'Goyf!!

http://img460.imageshack.us/img460/1690/tarmogoyf2vs2.th.jpg (http://img460.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tarmogoyf2vs2.jpg)

QFT.

Cheers to Canadian players.

So, is thresh new goblins, or will people stop playing combos and grab some decks that eats thresh?

P.S. Can't believe I got creamed by the UG list like 2 month ago with enchantress and it comes back to win gencon... Go Phan.

EDIT:

The whole Team Waterloo drooled the first time we saw that list in action (and this was before the current version).

Fixed for Truth.

Grats to Ryan T. (42land. Honestly?) for making top 8 again *shakes fist*

I remeber being there when he bought bunch of thins for the deck. But really, is this deck that great of grass canon now? interesting topic.

Tacosnape

08-20-2007, 12:21 AM

If sleep is for wimps, change my name to Captain Pussywuss McWeaklington.

EDIT: In case any of the mods are feeling bored, this is entirely a joke.:tongue:

You are all whores.

Can I have my name back now?:P

Edit: And what the hell, you didn't even make me a Captain.:P

calosso

08-20-2007, 12:26 AM

You are all whores.

Can I have my name back now?:P

LOL

xsockmonkeyx

08-20-2007, 12:32 AM

"

*Points in Taco's general direction* "Haha!!"

Tacosnape

08-20-2007, 12:37 AM

*Points in Taco's general direction* "Haha!!"

See if I ever say anything funny for you to sig again.

xsockmonkeyx

08-20-2007, 12:48 AM

See if I ever say anything funny for you to sig again.

Meh, its gonna be tough to beat "spaghetti kills alligators" anyway :tongue:

Tacosnape

08-20-2007, 01:39 AM

Meh, its gonna be tough to beat "spaghetti kills alligators" anyway :tongue:

Never underestimate me!:cool:

Phya

08-20-2007, 10:00 PM

Hell yeah! Nice to see so many guys from Ontario in the T8, we've always had a pretty strong Eternal scene. I know from first hand experience that all of them are extremely skilled magic players and are really cool guys to play with so grats to them all.

Looks like I may have to try harder than "Goblins Smash!" from now on.

TheAardvark

08-20-2007, 10:37 PM

So, I got to play 3/8 of the Prelim T8 in the main event; hot. I finished 20th overall; expect a report about a ZOMG~! 61 card deck in a day or two.

Versus

08-21-2007, 10:40 AM

So, is thresh new goblins, or will people stop playing combos and grab some decks that eats thresh?

I wanted to expand on this. Maybe you guys with more experience in this can tell me how a deck that garners a big win gets viewed by players afterwards.

Would you say that:

-More people drop their current decks to pick up Thresh.
-They keep their current decks and tune it and the SB to combat Thresh

rureddy31

08-21-2007, 12:52 PM

The thing is, for a deck like threshold, you can't really "hate" it. There are already slots in people's sideboards to combat Thresh. The thing is, going in to this tournament, it was the number one deck, even if it shared that title with Goblins. Now, it is extremely dominant. What you may see now is more decks cropping up that are good against Thresh, but not against a diverse field.

georgjorge

08-21-2007, 03:54 PM

I know myself that after the release of the Goyf, Thresh is really good (I play Ugr), but I'm still puzzled by the first place of the UG version - it runs NO REMOVAL WHATSOEVER in the main, and only removal for small creatures in the side. That means that what gets onto the board, sticks, which could be a problem if that creature is...a Grunt, or a Goyf, or a Dryad, or a Confidant. Sure, two bounce spells, but bouncing and countering seems not like the best option available...

sammiel

08-21-2007, 04:53 PM

who needs removal when your creatures do the most damage?

rureddy31

08-21-2007, 09:41 PM

AnwarA101

08-21-2007, 11:02 PM

I am putting information together from GenCon for the Historical Top8 thread. This is what I have for the Prelim tourney based on information from people I have heard from.

Legacy Prelims Top8

1. UGR Threshold
2. UGR Threshold
3. Vial Goblins with green splash
4. UBW Fish with Counterbalance/Top
5. Aggro Loam
6. Innovator Aluren
7. UR Landstill
8. UGR Thresh

If anyone has contrary information, please post it. Also if you know who was 7th vs. 8th that would be helpful as well.

Here is what i have for the Championships. Please fill information if you have it. Feel free to pm me or post it here.

Legacy Championship 2007

1. UG Threshold
2. 42 Land
3. Cephalid Breakfast
4. UGR Threshold
5. BHWC Landstill
6. UGR Threshold/Gro
7. Almost Mana-less Ichorid
8. UGR Threshold

rureddy31

08-21-2007, 11:11 PM

Lol. Not to be picky or anything, but I was playing 42 Lands in my deck :P

georgjorge

08-22-2007, 05:31 AM

Exactly. Removal is a moot point. As the guy who lost in the finals, I can tell you that removal is unecessary. The UG version is quite amazing, although it probably has a rougher goblins matchup. I can't really say for sure on that.

I can see that it is unnecessary against 42 lands, but...what about the creatures i mentioned, specifically Grunt, Dryad, Goyf ? The first two get bigger then Thresh's creatures fast, and the third one slows you down considerably, since you don't even have evasion creatures...

rureddy31

08-22-2007, 01:38 PM

Grunt is a main concern for the deck, I'm not going to lie. However, with Snares, Dazes and Forces, there are enough answers. Consequently, by trying to deal with a creature that isn't exactly popular, you're weakening your mirror match. That being said, Peter gave up some game against bigger creatures (which are few and far between) in order to beat the mirror, which he did twice in the Top 8.

dicemanx

08-22-2007, 11:08 PM

I can see that it is unnecessary against 42 lands, but...what about the creatures i mentioned, specifically Grunt, Dryad, Goyf ? The first two get bigger then Thresh's creatures fast, and the third one slows you down considerably, since you don't even have evasion creatures...

The irony here is that Lam specifically removed the removal spells to improve the mirror match-up; you believe that it had the opposite effect. While I cannot consider myself an expert on threshhold, I felt like I had the advantage in all of the mirrors that I played (and I played a lot of mirrors in the event) and that my experiences correlated with the intent of the deckbuilder when he trimmed away the third color and the removal.

You're all free to form your own conclusions; as for me, if I play another Legacy event again any time soon, I will use the UG build without much hesitation.

Citrus-God

08-22-2007, 11:20 PM

The irony here is that Lam specifically removed the removal spells to improve the mirror match-up; you believe that it had the opposite effect. While I cannot consider myself an expert on threshhold, I felt like I had the advantage in all of the mirrors that I played (and I played a lot of mirrors in the event) and that my experiences correlated with the intent of the deckbuilder when he trimmed away the third color and the removal.

I'm very curious about you theory about why that may be so. I'm still pondering about this myself.

dicemanx

08-22-2007, 11:38 PM

I'm very curious about you theory about why that may be so. I'm still pondering about this myself.

The UG deck runs Wastelands and can control an opposing color with the assistance of Stifle; it also runs more relevant card drawing/filtering (or countermagic in the form of Spell Snare) than the 4 Lightning Bolts and the slow Fire/Ice cantrips (assuming that Ice would be predominantly used).

As I said, feel free to form your own conclusions. One tourney, even if it's the Legacy Champs, is not enough to establish this build as superior in the mirror, but it does offer some anecdotal evidence to build upon.

Citrus-God

08-22-2007, 11:52 PM

The UG deck runs Wastelands and can control an opposing color with the assistance of Stifle; it also runs more relevant card drawing/filtering (or countermagic in the form of Spell Snare) than the 4 Lightning Bolts and the slow Fire/Ice cantrips (assuming that Ice would be predominantly used).

As I said, feel free to form your own conclusions. One tourney, even if it's the Legacy Champs, is not enough to establish this build as superior in the mirror, but it does offer some anecdotal evidence to build upon.

That seems like a reasonable explantion. Color screwing does seem like a strong tool to use in the mirror. I'm suprised many Thresh lists dropped Needle from the Maindeck. This may be the come back of Needle.

I also want to know your opinions on Portent and Serum Visions, and which one you would much rather use next time you play this deck.