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Lemuria
09-14-2007, 12:06 AM
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1173/1377107240_6a18659133_o.jpg

Looks really broken to me.

What decks do you think you could fit this guy in? If you do, would be main deck or SB?

It can stop many combos by himself, and it can break Force of Will as well.

Discuss.

Jak
09-14-2007, 12:43 AM
I think a cool aggro-control deck could fit him in. Chant, Abeyance, Teeg, SotPC, True Believer is a lot of quality combo hate. Then add some aggro like Isamaru and Silver Knight. Maybe some jittes and Sofis. Could be competitive.

lukatron2
09-14-2007, 01:32 AM
looks like a sweet anti-Engineered explosives card and a good combo-hate card. Personally I think most of the decks that would want to run him (aggro-control decks) wouldn't run him because then force of will couldn't be played. Terrageddon could possibly play him but again that would disable Armageddon.

TrialByFire
09-14-2007, 11:01 AM
I think a cool aggro-control deck could fit him in. Chant, Abeyance, Teeg, SotPC, True Believer is a lot of quality combo hate. Then add some aggro like Isamaru and Silver Knight. Maybe some jittes and Sofis. Could be competitive.

Welcome to Death and Taxes pretty much

DragoFireheart
09-14-2007, 11:09 AM
Welcome to Death and Taxes pretty much

I'm gonna have to agree with you on this. He's begging for a White-weeine style deck to splash him, be it main or side.

Phantom
09-14-2007, 11:25 AM
I don't see why people are so worried about the anti-synergy with Force. You board him in against Storm combo and save your force for if they bounce or kill him. If they don't, you win.

Shugyosha
09-14-2007, 11:35 AM
I don't see why people are so worried about the anti-synergy with Force. You board him in against Storm combo and save your force for if they bounce or kill him. If they don't, you win.

Your opponent will try to kill Gaddock at the last possible moment and then follow up with a storm spell. FOW will be pretty much useless by then.

Phantom
09-14-2007, 12:15 PM
Your opponent will try to kill Gaddock at the last possible moment and then follow up with a storm spell. FOW will be pretty much useless by then.

Or they can Orim's Chant or X. Swarm you. Still, I'm not buying any of these as solid reasons not to run him. Decks that would run him and Force run other counters, and the risk of ramping up your storm count and then bouncing or killing him, only to have that countered is pretty large (well, you lose the game). Also, you can pull tricks like killing your own Gaddock in response to Burning Wish and then countering it (I think this works).

The guy is just nuts against Belcher, who doesn't run the draw to dig for a wish to get rid of him.

Happy Gilmore
09-14-2007, 12:59 PM
The fact that you can't REB him is what makes him so good. I would say he is better than mage against combo right now.

TrialByFire
09-14-2007, 01:21 PM
Haha wow! Pre-sales of this bitch on ebay are upwards of 50 dollars with 3 days left in the auction. Can you say this set's Extirpate?

Lemuria
09-14-2007, 05:41 PM
The fact that you can't REB him is what makes him so good. I would say he is better than mage against combo right now.


Probably.

Also, setting up chalices after him, or run spell snare copies are also a good combination

Wynk
09-14-2007, 05:56 PM
Wouldn't chalices be set before him, as he would prevent chalices from being played?

This card KILLS chalice and EE. No more X spells.

Lemuria
09-14-2007, 06:17 PM
Wouldn't chalices be set before him, as he would prevent chalices from being played?

This card KILLS chalice and EE. No more X spells.


You're right. It was stupid...

Wynk
09-14-2007, 06:38 PM
Naw, don't say that. I had to reread the card several times to understand the ramifications of its text myself.

1. No instants/sorceries/artifacts/enchantments 4CC or over.
2. No X spells barring creature X spells.
3. Applies to all players.

I like Gaddock Teeg a lot. It is probably better than mage against combo except for the fact mage comes in blue and therefore has access to countermagic to protect its ass. Teeg can be played in blue decks as well but its a bit harder to do so. Also, Teeg bans Force of Will. That's a big nono in many blue decks.

Given that I play control I pray that I can cast an EE for 2 before it hits the table or my maindeck EEs become cardboard blanks.

HuK
09-18-2007, 08:31 AM
GW Aggro or RGW Aggro is playable with this guy. You play StoP, Tarmogoyf, Troll Ascetic, Bolt, Kird Ape, Isamaru, Savannah Lions, Jitte, Price of Progress, Bolt etc. Could be a strong Deck.

Cait_Sith
09-18-2007, 11:19 AM
Hint: Playing 3 colors and Price of Progress in the same deck is just begging for a loss.

GW Aggro and Zoo could easily get crazy with this. It WILL be a chase rare in Standard though.

LGD
09-18-2007, 06:53 PM
Hint: Playing 3 colors and Price of Progress in the same deck is just begging for a loss.


This is true in the mainboard, but I've seen some UGr Thresh lists have quite good sucess boarding in some number of Prices for certain matchups. For example it's perfectly alright to take something like 6 to the face vs. landstill when you're smashing them for half their starting life total or more. That is very literally a spell they must counter or die.

Jak
09-18-2007, 08:24 PM
I have been trying to work him into my WW deck. He seems that he can help my combo MU. So here goes the list.

Lands
4 Savannah
4 Temple Garden
8 Plains

Artifacts
4 Chrome Mox
4 Aether Vial
3 Jitte

Creatures
3 Isamaru
4 Silver Knight
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Serra Avenger
3 SotPC
3 Gaddok

Spells
4 Orim's Chant
4 Abeyance
4 Rootmaze

SB
1 SotPC
3 Tormod's Crypt
4 Sandstorm
4 Tivadar's Crusade
3 Krosan Grip

Something like this.

TheDarkshineKnight
09-18-2007, 09:18 PM
Another reason to run white/green. However, can you afford yo have him as a two-drop when you're running Watchwolf...

Brushwagg
09-18-2007, 09:56 PM
Funny no one at all mentioned Survival. Seems like it fits better into Survival since you can search for it and gives Survival a much better Storm combo match and stops silly stuff like EE from wiping the board.

Also you could run Meddling Mage along side this guy to keep the spot removal off the table. Take Landstill for example Teeg here basically chants WOG, EE, FOW, FOF etc.. and Mage would chant STP. That's some serious hurting for Landstill.

I'm going to have to try this guy in Molatov.

Phantom
09-18-2007, 10:00 PM
Another reason to run white/green. However, can you afford yo have him as a two-drop when you're running Watchwolf...

I don't think so. The only time it is a problem is when you are not sure what you are playing by when you hit WG. Otherwise, you simply drop Teeg against combo and Watchwolf against almost everything else. Also, most of these decks are going to be running some combination of Goyf, Silver Knight, Serra Avenger, Grunt, Abeyance, Orim's Chant, etc. so the 2cc slot is going to be packed.

Cane818
09-19-2007, 12:18 AM
I like running him in a deck. With counterbalance and top.
Make the deck with all casting cost 0 to 3. Your pretty much set.

And you get to run meddling mage and trinket mage.

I don't run any force in the deck, but I do run 4 daze, 4 mana leek,
and 4 stifle. (trinket mage is stifles best friend, can u say 12/12 trampler)
Also spell snare keeps getting to be a better and better counter.

Mister Agent
09-23-2007, 07:06 PM
Actually I think Gaddock Teeg would work well in a stax like deck since you can probably shut down a whole lot more spells with Teeg and trinisphere in play. Just a thought though. :)

DragoFireheart
09-23-2007, 07:22 PM
I like running him in a deck. With counterbalance and top.
Make the deck with all casting cost 0 to 3. Your pretty much set.

And you get to run meddling mage and trinket mage.

I don't run any force in the deck, but I do run 4 daze, 4 mana leek,
and 4 stifle. (trinket mage is stifles best friend, can u say 12/12 trampler)
Also spell snare keeps getting to be a better and better counter.

Gaddock + CB/Top = No spells for your opponents.

Anyone else think a U/G/w Thresh deck with Gaddock and a main-decked CB/Top will be the new thresh model?

Cait_Sith
09-23-2007, 07:46 PM
I think it will be UGrw. Goblins has the propensity to grow greatly from Lorwyn, so the red splash is still desperately needed. At the same time white offers so many anti-combo options now that it seems silly not to run it.

ExplosPlankton
09-24-2007, 04:43 PM
Wow, Gaddock Teeg makes counter Top very strong. Its basically a lock with all 3 in play and each of the lock components by themselves are strong anyway.

Sample list:
4x Tarmogoyf
3x Gaddock Teeg
4x Meddling Mage
3x Trinket Mage
1x Phyrexian Dreadnought

3x Counterbalance
2x Sensei's Divining Top
2x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Tormod's Crypt
1x Pithing Needle
4x Brainstorm
4x Swords to Plowshares
3x Daze
4x Mana Leak
3x Stifle

Mordenkain
09-24-2007, 04:53 PM
Anyone else think a U/G/w Thresh deck with Gaddock and a main-decked CB/Top will be the new thresh model?

I do. Goblins are slowly dying and Goyf is still on the rise. I think that white thresh are gonna be superior again. While im no thresh expert (nor even good at it), but something like this seems to me to be the next tech.

4 Gaddock Teeg
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Tarmogoyf

4 Brainstorm
4 Portent
4 Ponder
3 Sensei's Diving Top

4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Counterbalance
4 Swords to Plowshares

4 Tundra
4 Tropical Island
4 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
1 Island
1 Plains

Needle and maybe meddling mages in the sideboard. Engineering Explosives comes to mind as well. Cheers.

Silverdragon
09-24-2007, 06:04 PM
Survival will surely use this guy too.
Maybe a Gwr or Gwb build that simply replaces some utility slots with him. You have to remember that Gaddock only hoses non-creature spells so Baloths and Hierarchs still come through and that might give Threshold serious trouble.

Zilla
09-24-2007, 06:14 PM
Engineering Explosives comes to mind as well.
Engineered Explosives + Gaddock Teeg = not a combo. I suppose you can side them in in place of Teeg for the EtW matchup, but then you're not as likely to shut down Belcher or EtW itself.

Silverdragon
09-24-2007, 06:25 PM
Engineered Explosives + Gaddock Teeg = not a combo. I suppose you can side them in in place of Teeg for the EtW matchup, but then you're not as likely to shut down Belcher or EtW itself.

I suppose you can use EE as another way to handle Aether Vial or opposing Counterbalances in addition to Krosan Grips and Needles. Against opposing Threshold decks Gaddock is essentially dead weight so he'll surely get boarded out there.

Btw another deck that will get a little bit stronger with Gaddock is CAL or whatever you call the decks with Life from the Loam and Solitary Confinement.

Slay
09-24-2007, 06:34 PM
Engineered Explosives + Gaddock Teeg = not a combo. I suppose you can side them in in place of Teeg for the EtW matchup, but then you're not as likely to shut down Belcher or EtW itself.

Who cares? EE + Chalice is even worse of a nonbo but you play both anyways if you want a better combo matchup because they're both devastating cards if they hit play. There's no reason they shouldn't be in the same deck/sideboard together, though probably not in the maindeck together.
-Slay

Zilla
09-24-2007, 07:11 PM
Who cares? EE + Chalice is even worse of a nonbo but you play both anyways if you want a better combo matchup because they're both devastating cards if they hit play.
It's not a worse nonbo. If you have an EE in play you can still play a Chalice if you draw one, and vice versa, depending on where you set Chalice. If you have Gaddock Teeg in play, you can't play EE at all. I guess it's not that big a deal, but seriously, it's not like you're lacking a multitude of other anti-combo options that don't totally suck with Gaddock, you know?

Happy Gilmore
09-24-2007, 07:32 PM
I want to take him in another direction.

4 Gaddock Teeg
3 Isamaru
2 Saffi
4 Skyshroud Elete
2 Savannah Lions
4 Tarmogoyf

4 Root Maze
4 Thorn of Amythyst
4 Swords to plowshares
4 Edge of Autumn
2 Jitte

4 Elvish Spirit Guide

4 Flagstones
4 Horizon Canopy
4 Savannah
1 Temple Garden
2 Forest
2 Plains
2 Karakas

I dont see having swords cost two and jitte at three being enough of a drawback not to run the Thorn. Edge of Autumn aside, the deck looks both powerful and competetive.

Maveric78f
09-25-2007, 09:09 AM
I really like your build. I'm just afraid that EE completely ruins your strategy, even if it's not playable under gaddock teeg, you won't always keep it into play. Thorn of amethyst is completely useless against EE. I am also wondering if you will have enough time to take advantage of the early and win when your opponent is gathering his mana providers.

Gaddock Teeg can also be a nice utility creature that you include in a deck that is not affected by it. See my thread :
http://mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?p=164729#post164729

Sometimes, against tarmhold maybe, you will want to take it of, and it's not a big deal.

Happy Gilmore
09-25-2007, 12:49 PM
I really like your build. I'm just afraid that EE completely ruins your strategy, even if it's not playable under gaddock teeg, you won't always keep it into play. Thorn of amethyst is completely useless against EE. I am also wondering if you will have enough time to take advantage of the early and win when your opponent is gathering his mana providers.

Gaddock Teeg can also be a nice utility creature that you include in a deck that is not affected by it. See my thread :
http://mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?p=164729#post164729

Sometimes, against tarmhold maybe, you will want to take it of, and it's not a big deal.

Contrary to popular belief EE is not the end all answer to everything. More than that Karakas and Saffi to save every creature I need on the board. Sure you can blow it up for two but the savannah lions or isamaru that came into play on turn one are going to rape you. Sweepers tend to be good vs. agro decks, but everyone knows that. It will be very difficult for an opponent to use one when WoG cost 5, deed cost 4 and EE 2-3. As I said, Saffi + Karakas is a nightmare. And if Gaddock is in play God help you.

Peter_Rotten
09-25-2007, 03:46 PM
He's obviously a good card and getting plently of hype. I would jsut like to make sure we don't get too carried away with him. Yes, he stops many dangerous spells, but he may suffer the Dark Confidant syndrome - massive target on his head. Also look at some of the spells he doesn't stop:

StP
Lightning Bolt
Fir/Ice
Magma Jet
Pyroclasm
Diabolic Edict
Spell Snare
Daze
Pernicious Deed
Piledriver
Aether Vial
Mongoose
Werebear
Survival of the Fittest
Standstill
Counter/Top
Oh, and don't swing into that Fanatic. Hell, don't swing into any blocker.

...and, most importantly, he does nothing against Tarmobrokengoyf.

He's a good card but I'm not ready to say he is a great card.

The Rack
09-25-2007, 05:38 PM
I think Teeg is good enough to be put in already good decks, but not good enough to base decks around. He's not a finisher and doesn't stop the game completely either you know. I'll test him in my Funkbrew but other than that I don't see any new broken decks he will create.

Phantom
09-25-2007, 09:30 PM
He's a good card but I'm not ready to say he is a great card.

Fair enough. I'm curious though, do you consider Meddling Mage a great card?

I think naming all the cards he DOESN'T hit is a fairly ridiculous exercise. I mean, Chalice (and Stp, and Spell Snare) misses a lot of cards, but it's the cards it does hit that you should focus on. Also, the "Confidant Lightning Rod" is a poor analogy since Teeg is clearly there for the Combo matchup (where he is often more difficult to get rid of than a single Mage since he shuts down Cave-In and the like). Teeg will see some mainboard duty, but he will also see a lot of sideboard work, so his crappy matchups are less of an issue.

I actually like the fact that he is a lightning rod in the control matchup. Say you are playing Zoo vs. Landstill. Laying your third creature might be an extremely risky move under normal circumstances, but if that third beater is Teeg, you can almost be assured that they will have to waste two removal spells, and probably two turns, to sweep the board (sadly Deed is the huge exception). This seems like a pretty big boon for Zoo imo.

Basically, I can see him being used in some capacity in almost every archetype:
Aggro (Zoo)
Aggro-Control (Thresh)
Control (probably not, but I guess someone might board him somewhere)
Combo-Control (Salvagers)
Whatever the hell D+T is

and being useful against:
Combo (certainly the thing is just nuts against Strorm combo, but I'm wondering how much it hits yard based combo. The fact that he is GW is HUGE, since those two colors have had such a hard time with combo)
Control (see above, but I also think it could give a deck like Thresh a better Landstill/Truffle matchup since they can protect Teeg from the spot removal)
Aggro/Control (hits FoW and Explosives. Not sure if that's enough)
Aggro (only thing I can see is stopping Faerie Stompy's Chalice and Forces)

And, like Meddling Mage, he is never truely dead. G/W grizzly bear FTW.

Peter_Rotten
09-26-2007, 03:05 PM
I think naming all the cards he DOESN'T hit is a fairly ridiculous exercise.

Of course it is, and that is why I didn't name Squire or Wall of Razors. What I did name were often played and relevant cards that look at Teeg as nothing more than a Grizzly Bear with a more restrictive cost.

But, once again, he's a good card - just not great.

Happy Gilmore
09-27-2007, 11:08 PM
I'll tell you something true. I'm really really glad that the two major chase rares in this set are bad in limited. Thats going to make them a lot easier to get at the pre-release drafts. :laugh:

Nihil Credo
09-28-2007, 07:01 AM
Who the fuck doesn't rare-draft Thoughtseize at a bloody pre-release?