Is Ichorid warping Legacy?

[clavio]

Is Ichorid warping the format? I'd say it is at this point. It is much faster than goblins. It can randomly win first turn. While it is somewhat easy to hate the deck, very few decks have what it takes to beat it game one. Additionally, the hate brought in can be played around. Propaganda/Ghostly Prison shut down the deck, but ichorid can kill far before it's opponent hits 3 mana. Leyline of the void throws a wrench in Ichorid's plan, but you only have about a 50% chance of getting it for free. It's basically not worth it if you have to pay for it. Tormod's crypt seems like good hate, but it really isn't. I've seen Ichorid win many times after getting crypted. Once after getting crypted twice. Tabernacle is ok hate, but it's still not a guaranteed win.

So is Ichorid warping the format? It's very strong and very hard to hate.

[Bovinious]

I agree it is very strong and hard to hate, but Ichorid hasnt put up numbers recently, probably because of lack of competent players piloting it at big tournies, and consistency issues. Ichorid's biggest enemy is usually itself, which can cause you to randomly lose games due to bad luck.

[Volt]

Maybe I'm missing something, but Ichorid just doesn't seem all that good to me. It's too inconsistent. It's definitely not warping the format.

[ReAnimated]

I say more people should pick up the deck and give it a try , my team leader (Bovinious) has piloted the deck for about 6 months and has T4'ed many local tourneys with it. If you know how to play around hate, know how to sideboard, and know how to mulligan then soon you too will be putting up the W's.

[outsideangel]

It's very strong, but I don't think Ichorid can ever really dominate Legacy because of it's vulnerability to hate. Yes, you can play through a Crypt, or board in answers to Leyline, but those cards still hurt the deck a lot, and any deck can play them. Add to that the answers specific to each color (Morningtide, Jailer, etc.) and there are a lot of cards out there that can cripple Ichorid.

As long as nobody plays those cards in their sideboard, Ichorid will be strong. But if Ichorid starts hedging out other decks, then sideboard space clears up for those cards that Ichorid hates to see.

[Lemuria]

I think it's a matter of practice. Ichorid can be extremly brutal if played properly, even throught crypt or leyline. Sure, it has his weakness against graveyard hate, but so does Cephalid.

It has many plans. You can go off with Zealot combo, you can play similar to Frigorid, or you can reanimate a Big Bad Golgari Grave Troll

People just need to pay more attention to this deck.

It's not warping the format right now, but sure it has enough potential to become a DTB.

[MattH]

Not around here it sure isn't. Some have tried, but never really succeeded with it.

[Pinder]

Yeah, don't people have to play a deck before it can be a DTB?

It's resilient to the general types of hate people pack, sure, but if people start packing specific hate for it, I'm pretty sure it will fold. It's a lot like Affinity. Great against an unprepared field, but if people know you're coming, you might as well just hang up the deck.

[DragoFireheart]

We need to develop some super tech to really make Ichorid go off.

Something to make it faster, stronger, tougher, smarter...

...

:rolleyes:

What the hell am I ranting about?

[The Rack]

No, Flash warped the format, Ichorid did not.

[Tacosnape]

Ichorid isn't warping the format at all. Ichorid is basically Stax all over again, only sans the whole concept of being doomed if it loses the die roll. In theory, it can have ungodly matchups against half of the format, but the fact that it's incredibly difficult to make the deck consistent without significantly decreasing its power level causes it to randomly give up a matchup here and there.

However, it's worth noting that if you haven't grasped the concept that Graveyard Hate is very good in Legacy, now would be a good time to grasp this fact.

[TheRock]

With Gamble, Ichorid is a whole lot more consistent and faster than people realize.

If anything is definitely preventing Ichorid from winning matches, it's the players that have MAINDECK answers to this deck while we have no maindeck answer to counteract it - Wretch, Prison, Tabernacles, Belcher - etc. Needing to win one out of two games when you get to throw Therapy turn 1 during the 3rd game is devastating. On the contrast, needing to win games two and three is extremely difficult.

[SouthAlly]

So now there is A LEGACY METAGAME? I doubt it. I spoke to a guy from Ohio last week. He said they were facing Affinity and RG aggro a lot. Those decks are drasically different from what I have been seeing locally.

Here Ichorid is everywhere. So naturally GY hate is common. That means that the decks that are better equipped for that are winning a lot. Yixlid Jailor is showing up maindecked in a green and black aggressive deck called the Bubonic Plague, and some White Weenie deck called Death and Taxes wins a lot with plenty of hate.

These decks are not going to beat something like Affinity. All the hate is wrong. So, yeah, Ichorid is warping. But clearly not everywhere.

[BreathWeapon]

I don't think it's Ichorid's fault alone, Cephalid Illusionist has also turned the discard pile into a tremendous target. I started to run Affinity (4 MD Tormod's Crypt) just because discard pile combo and Threshold pushed storm combo out of the format and it has a good game against both, and while I'm sure I'm a minority, MD discard pile hate is certainly justifiable these days.

[Bryant Cook]

I don't think so, it's pretty easy to hate out. Not to mention you can win before Ichorid does. Ichorid on average wins about turn 3-4. It can win on turn one yes, but more than likely it is later. A single Tormod's crypt can often be Time Stretch times five. The deck is good don't get me wrong but by no means is it warping.

[Di]

I don't understand how a thread like this could be conceived considering the deck has barely put up numbers, let alone much of an attendance at all. It gets crippled by splash damage in hating Cephalid Breakfast, Threshold, and other graveyard strategies that are more popular, and just sucks it up. On top of that, the deck is inconsistent. You can either go nuts within the first couple of turns, or you can't and lose.

So if by "warping the format" you are referring to people running hate for graveyard-based decks that are not Ichorid, then sure, it's warping the format.

[thefreakaccident]

No, Flash warped the format, Ichorid did not.

AGREED!

[Brehn]

Is everybody playing Ichorid or decks hating Ichorid? No? Well...

[Nightmare]

The answer is no.