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Really want to somehow make a non-serious list called "All the Spice". Five colors, Grinding Station, Sluice, Veil, Thought Seize, Fow, Infernal Tutor, Gamble, Tome Scour, Thought Scour, T3feri, just...

Well lets see - suppose you go off around turn 3 that means you have 50 cards in the deck. You've cast Breach + Grinding Station + 0 mana artifact. That's 3 storm right there. Each loop adds another...

You're not trying to generate a lot of storm with Grinding Station, you're using Grinding Station to dig for BF or Tomescour (which in turn digs for BF). Also you need very little storm to win with...

That's why I argue that the win con should be Burning Wish. You then run 3-4 Wishes and the solution to COTV is FOW or Wish->non 1 CMC enchantment hate.

I feel you can use Shock-Lands fine, I mean it won't be optimal and your win percentage against aggro and tempo decks (including dredge) will decrease (i have no clue how much). Those decks can,...

Funnily enough, Breach in vintage is apparently in Oath Decks of all things.

Ahh, poo - ignore everything I say then :tongue:

Random Thought:

Argivian Find.

Thinking behind this card:

1) It can act like Hall of Heliod's Generosity for cheap (W instead of 1WC), but is not a land
2) Can work with LED
3) Works with...

Getting breach is the bottleneck - your clock really depends on how quickly you can get breach into your hand. The quicker you get it into your hand the less time your opponent has in getting enough...

Formatting just took a long time of lists within lists. Don't bother, your's is easier to quote and copy. Also yours looks more correct. Just want to note that in Grixis it's probably incorrect to...

Lots of stuff in flux, but just wanted to get a master list of all possible choices that I've seen in one place. Still not even sure this is complete. :eek:


40-60 UR Shell

14-19 Mana...

To those playing with Hall of Heliod's Generosity, how good are you finding it? I tried it out and find it's way to mana intensive as a "saving mechanism". If my Breach gets put in a grave I would...

A possible outline?

[Intro]

[Discussion of Main Combo]

[Why play Escape Brain Freeze]

[Versions of Combo]

Yeah - but it's not like the deck needs anything other than 1 win con MD? The only reason we run multiple BW is that they are useful even when drawn and running less than one could lead to one being...

Any reason you're running Oracle and Wish?

:eek: Hahaha, yes!

My results (Context: played against a friend with Delver for each game):

URW version with Tutor: started with or drew tutor in 6 out of ten games. Out of those 6 games started with Breach in Hand...

I think I'll test my build from this post against a friend for about ten games vs. same list with E-Tutor replaced by 2 Tome Scour and 2 Thought Scour (and mana base edited since I don't need white)...

Pretend that Veil of summer is blue for a moment, I'm wondering is what are the chances you would rather have an enlightened tutor over thought scour? The basis of your build and my last build are...

Ah, my bad. Haven't tested Thought Scour at all - Feel like it might take cantrip spots?

@ Jblinder: Congrats on the trophy! A couple questions:

1) How did you mulligan given that you were not running Tutor - how often did you have to rely on a breachless hand and how did you get...

I agree that their are multiple ways to do it - each with pros and cons. I guess my argument is two fold:

First is that we should be running a full set of wishes. I think that math that shows...

I was using it the turn before so that my combo turn was:

Cast LED
1B - Cast IT to search for Breach
Crack LED in response for RRR
Cast Breach (R floating)
Exile 3 cards in graveyard - Cast...

@ Lemon; you're not wrong, but I think at this stage we should be trying to narrow down the list more. My argument is (a) enlightened tutor is necessary four of and (b) apparently that Burning Wish >...

I've tested for a while over the long weekend to supplement my amateur math posts and have the following design note:

1) I found that I couldn't support Opal with any degree of reliability with...