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Thread: [Deck] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)

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    [Deck] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)

    Tempo Threshold Primer
    by Shugyosha




    Prelude

    Threshold decks in the current metagame are rarely distinguished by color alone due to a growing number of card combinations that are usually more defining for the deck than the splash color one adds to the basic UG shell.

    The card combination Stifle / Wasteland is the key feature of the so called Tempo Threshold archetype designed by Lam Phan. Stifle's primary use during the first few turns of the game is to counter fetchland activations while Wastelands take care of played non-basic lands to effectively deny your opponent to participate in the game. As you won't always have all the tools to disrupt your opponent's landbase reliably, incoming spells are met by a very powerful suite of counterspells that can be played while using Wastelands due to the low costs: Daze, Spell Snare and Force of Will. Depending on variant and splash color there are also several other ways to deal with spells that will be discussed in detail below. After you wreaked havoc in the earlygame your creatures hit the board (or the Mongoose dropped early will finally have threshold) and make short work of the weakened opponent.


    Well, so much for the gameplan. As you might know, plans rarely survive first contact with an enemy and same holds true for the strategy of Tempo Threshold. Cards like Counterbalance, Humility, Solitary Confinement, Moat, creatures of similar or higher powerlevel or simply a very solid manabase can push this archetype into a defensive role quickly. That's the reason why Tempo Threshold usually dedicates several slots to flexible answers to such problems. Within the archetype Tempo Threshold can be easily distinguished by those slots that lead to different mid- to lategame plans (although you don't want to get into the lategame).

    This Primer will give you a basic overview of the established variants, their advantages and disadvantages compared to each other and some insight how to use certain key cards. Sideboards and when to play which variant will also be discussed in a more general way at the end of the article. Please keep in mind that the following text is addressed mostly to readers that are not as familiar with Tempo Threshold as longtime players of the deck.


    Basic list

    Tempo Threshold first surfaced at Gencon in 2007 without a splashcolor:

    1 Breeding Pool
    4 Tropical Island
    2 Island
    2 Wooded Foothills
    3 Flooded Strand
    2 Polluted Delta (later lists added a Forest for a Fetch)
    4 Wasteland

    4 Nimble Mongoose
    4 Tarmogoyf
    4 Werebear

    4 Brainstorm
    4 Portent (became Ponder, see below)
    4 Predict
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Spell Snare
    4 Stifle
    1 Rushing River
    1 Snapback (became Wipe Away pretty quick)

    The UG list shuns removal in order to play 12 creatures and drawspells which lead to a very aggressive and straightforward playstyle. Creatures that hit the board have to be raced. The two bouncespells are your only way to deal with any resolved problem encountered and should be used with great care. Just bouncing a permanent to “gain tempo” without the possibility to counter it, destroying the lands needed to replay it or deal a deadly blow in its absence is something you should avoid. Even bouncing your own creature in face of removal is usually a bad idea as you play enough replacements but loose one of your two most flexible outs. Therefore decks with a high permanent density like beatdown (with many low cost creatures and burn as removal) can give UG a headache. If the aggressive gameplan doesn't come together quickly it is often difficult for the deck to get the last points of damage through a stalled board.
    A potent way to combat fast decks (with their low manacurve) is Counterbalance/Top which is therefore often played in the sideboard. So UG can simply switches roles and becomes the control deck after sideboarding. The problem of resolved permanents remain though.


    A word about Portent: It has been replaced in every Threshold deck since Ponder has been printed. Although you can draw a beater or a Wasteland directly in your turn with Ponder, there are still unique advantages to run Portent. Looking at the top cards of your opponents library when he desperately needs a land can win you the game alone as you sometimes simply timewalk for one blue mana. Used in conjunction with Predict you can even mill his best card away which seems like a “danger of cool things” situation but actually happens more often than one might expect. The key is to play your drawspells only when you can maximize their effect (or when you are in trouble of course). Especially Predict shouldn't be played blindly.

    My teammate and I made the test once and ran UG with Ponder (him) and Portent (me). After the seven rounds of the tournament neither seemed better or worse.


    Red variant a.k.a. Canadian Threshold

    The reason for red seems evident when you read about the weaknesses of UG Tempo Threshold. It gives you access to Burn which not only acts as removal but can deal the last points of damage if the board is stalled or looks bad:

    4 Tropical Island
    4 Volcanic Island
    3 Flooded Strand
    3 Polluted Delta
    4 Wasteland

    4 Nimble Mongoose
    4 Tarmogoyf

    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Spell Snare
    4 Stifle
    1 Rushing River
    1 Wipe Away
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Fire / Ice

    As you can see eight burnspells replaced four creatures/drawspells which leaves us with a slightly less aggressive list after the initial disrupting strategy because you drop less creatures. Therefore we get more flexible cards to end the game and deal with creature heavy decks. In addition to burn the Ice side of Fire / Ice can support the early disruption strategy by tapping lands without card disadvantage as well as tap attackers and dig for answers on the defense or tap blockers to deal more damage. The two bouncespells are still included for the multitude of cards that burn cannot deal with.

    But as brutal as Canadian Threshold is there are still some serious issues to address. First of all compare the landbase of UG and UGR. You will see that the red variant's manabase is very easy to attack too. Although you have Spell Snares (Sinkhole, Life from the Loam -> Wasteland), Stifle (Wasteland) and Fetchlands to delay attacks on your own manabase the core of the problem is that you are defending your manabase instead of disrupting your opponent's manabase as you have no basic lands to fall back to.
    The following (tested) manabase could be played in certain LD heavy metagames:


    3 Tropical Island
    3 Volcanic Island
    1 Island
    1 Forest
    3 Flooded Strand/Polluted Delta
    3 Wooded Foothills
    4 Wasteland

    Another problem is the low creature count. As you can't always mulligan to get a creature there can be agonizing games where you left only ruins of your opponent's earlygame attempts but have no creature to take advantage of the situation. Problems got worse with the increased number of removal people seem to play nowadays (Path to Exile as 5th-6th Swords comes to mind). The Shroud ability of your Geese helps to circumvent removal a bit but Mongoose is easily trumped by today's creatures.
    I've cut one Fire / Ice to add a Vendilion Clique which seems marginal at first but adds a lot of flexibility. Flash helps you to keep your mana open for countermagic during your opponent's turn and seeing the hand of your opponent is one of the most underrated aspects of many cards (be it discard, Tidehollow Sculler or Clique). Snatching a dredged Loam or another key card out of your opponent's hand is priceless, too. Last but not least a three power flyer can get a lot of damage through in Legacy, where small flyers are rare and flying finishers are hard to cast against a manadenial-deck. Similar reasons and the frailty against a resolved Counterbalance lead some people to add two copies of Trygon Predator main which were rarely good in my testing. Three mana for a creature without Flash often seems too much and Predator still has to live a turn before he has an impact on the board. The same reasoning holds true for Lorescale Coatl by the way which is too expensive for a mostly slow growing threat. Clique in comparison can take care of removal (Sorcery speed or against bad players) and has done something even if it hits the yard before it attacks.

    Other possible Creatures that have been used within my Team to some success are Terravore and Werebear. Vore is sadly too hard to cast in a build splashing a third color however but is nice in UG (Relic hurts you anyways). Cutting some Fire / Ice for Werebear gives you the best of both worlds as your manabase becomes indirectly more stable, you have all the creatures you need to be aggressive and you keep some removal/reach (Bolts). All these changes depend on certain metagames to unfold their full potential with Clique being the Joker for unknown metagames.



    Black variant

    The dark version of Tempo Threshold is usually played because of three reasons. First of all you don't need to run four Werebears and four Predicts each when you can run Dark Confidant instead. The invitational wizard adds a great deal of power to the deck by providing you with more cards for lifepoints which is usually the most expendable resource of an aggressive deck and by being a small beater. The second reason is the addition of hard removal spells like Smother, Diabolic Edict and Ghastly Demise. The final, third reason is the large amount of cards available to adjust your list to the metagame: Discard against control decks (including CounterTop), Engineered Plague as a permanent solution for tribal strategies and Extirpates/Jailers against graveyard-dependant decks.

    All of these elements can be splitted between maindeck and sideboard as you see fit. Especially discard and Extirpate are well paired with the aggressive nature of the deck by snatching draw spells to deny manafixing or removing a playset of duals. Again, looking at the hand of your opponent gives you a good idea at which direction your game is heading.

    The following list is one I would play in an unknown meta if I had decided to play UGb:


    3 Tropical Island
    3 Underground Sea
    1 Bayou
    1 Island
    2 Flooded Strand
    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Wasteland

    4 Nimble Mongoose
    4 Tarmogoyf
    4 Dark Confidant

    4 Brainstorm
    3 Ponder
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    3 Spell Snare
    4 Stifle
    4 Smother
    3 Thoughtseize
    1 Rushing River

    The disadvantages of the black variant arise from the aforementioned cards mostly. Lifeloss from Confidant/Thoughtseize together with less and slower removal (in comparison to UGr) weakens the aggromatchup again. Confidant, Thoughtseize and also Duress can be bad topdecks.

    The changed color priority can also lead to problems: Although the underlying structure of the manabase is basically the same as with Canadian Threshold you will need black earlier than red which can lead to difficult Fetchland decisions and dead green/black cards in your hand. Cutting off Canadian Threshold from red means cutting it off from four cards and four options (Fire / Ice) which are all removal/reach. With black Threshold your splashcolor has draw, creatures, discard and removal.


    Team America

    Another deck which can be more or less defined as Tempo Threshold is the following list by Dave Gearhart (Deep6er) and Dan Signorini (Nitewolf9):

    1 Bayou
    2 Tropical Island
    4 Underground Sea
    2 Bloodstained Mire
    3 Flooded Strand
    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Wasteland

    4 Tarmogoyf
    4 Tombstalker

    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Stifle
    4 Sinkhole
    4 Thoughtseize
    4 Snuff Out

    Not playing Confidant opens another route with Tombstalker and Snuff Out. The new two mana drop instead of Confidant is Sinkhole which further intensifies the manadenial strategy but also (together with Stalker) shifts the deck's focus more on disruption as the usual spotremoval can now hit all your creatures.

    Overall Team America has or should have a more explosive opening game and can keep up the tempo/disruption aspect quite well due to Discard, Sinkhole and Snuff Out as another “free” spell. In addition to that Stalker and Snuff Out don't care about Counterbalance further strengthening the matchups against the control part of the metagame. As with the aforementioned UG and UGb lists Team America also has problems with aggro decks due to few creautures and lifeloss. For more information see the Team America thread.


    White variant

    Until today no UGw Tempo Threshold list has been consistently good in tournament play. White hasn't much to offer for Tempo Threshold compared to the other colors as its removal works against your gameplan. Knight of the Reliquary is too expensive and clumsy for the Wasteland tutor effect, Jotun Grunt is slow and shrinks the own creatures. The only creature worthwhile seems to be Qasali Pridemage as the guy is seriously undercosted for its effect, solves Goyfstalls and kills annoying cards like Counterbalance (sometimes) and Chalice @ 1. Still the question remains why one shouldn't just add CounterTop to the mix and play in a more controllish fashion.
    Last edited by Nihil Credo; 12-16-2009 at 12:22 PM.
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    (Borrowing your post for more room, sorry Mossivo)


    Sideboards

    As sideboards should always be tailored to your metagame needs I will only discuss the usual cards that are included in Tempo Threshold Sideboards and why.


    Artifact/Enchantment removal: Around three outs for Artifacts/Enchantments, especially for resolved Balances should be in your board. Krosan Grip is the no brainer decision here but splitting between Grip, Engineered Explosive and Ancient Grudge can be of advantage. Explosives is especially good in Canadian Threshold as it gives you hard removal against the creatures that are usually out of burn range (Goyf, Terravore, Dreadnought, Crusher). Trygon Predator can be found in some sideboards, too but as I said he is a bit clumsy. In a metagame with some Enchantress and Affinity decks running around he is solid though.

    Aggro / Tribals: Blue Blasts should always be in your board as the most efficient low cost spell against red. Three are sufficient for Canadian Threshold but the other variants may even want to play six (Hydroblast). Massremoval options usually are Pyroclasm and Engineered Plague. Especially Black has trouble keeping up with Tribal Decks and Plague although expensive is still the best sideboard card for this problem. You can also board them against other decks too. Against Affinity for example I usually board a Plague against Cleric (Disciple of the Vault) or even Blinkmoth (Nexus with Plating hurts!) as efficient pre-emptive removal.

    Submerge has been reintroduced to Threshold lists some month ago and helps UG and UGr to deal with creatures in an elegant way (Black has hard removal). If the opponent fetches Submerge (in response) is upgraded to a pretty broken hard removal. Creature stealing effects like Threads of Disloyalty or Mind Harness have also been played to exploit the fact that your opponents usually don't board enchantment removal but most people favor Submerge nowadays and with Qasali Pridemage there is another good reason for it. Submerge can also mess up with Counterbalance occasionally. In the end it comes down to your metagame as all three cards are limited to specific colors/creatures.

    Control / Combo: Disrupts can be used to make your earlygame (against many decks) even stronger but they are very situational cards and miss the flexibility of most sideboard cards. In Canadian Threshold Red Blasts are locked for three to four slots as they not only win counterwars but can prevent Balances from hitting the board at any stage of the game. On top of that they became good against Tendrilscombo, too as ANT plays some blue cards. Black has additional discard and Extirpates at its disposal.

    Graveyard hate: Packing dedicated graveyard hate into your sideboard is usually a futile attempt to deal with occasional Dredge decks. Don't do it unless you know that there will be a lot of decks Crypt/Relic is good against. Extirpate is an exception as it can be good against Control/Combo/Loam, too. But Crypt/Relic/Jailer mostly waste the slots they are sitting in unless of course your metagame is an Oversold Cemetery.

    Other: There are matchups where you would like to have more than four Stifles because they can counter so much more than Fetchland activations. Therefore I usually run two Pithing Needle in my Canadian Threshold board. This gives you more room to use Stifle against Fetchlands while stopping Deed, Explosives, etc. with Needles. Shutting down Sensei's Divining Top is another reason to run Needles as the Artifact is on top of the list “Why are my opponent's draws so ridiculous?”
    Counterbalance/Top in the sideboard has been mentioned already in the UG section and shouldn't be played in splash variants. If you still want to play this minicombo you better hit the back button of your browser and look for the CounterTop Thread.

    Where and why should I play Tempo Threshold


    The reason for Threshold's success in general is its flexibility. Not only can the deck be finetuned for specific metagames but also during matches good players can constantly adjust their position/role to the evolving gamestate. Tempo Threshold is no exception to that and is therefore at home at every metagame. Although UG doesn't seem to do the trick anymore it is still a powerful, somehow elegant deck and cheaper than the splash variants.
    Canadian Threshold is certainly the best deck of the archetype for unknown metagames and also the best deck of the three against beatdown/tribal decks. It is definitely the most difficult of the three although it seems easy on paper. Only eight creatures and the flexibility of Burn often call for difficult decisions:

    Hands without creatures: Happens more often with only eight of them and you have to keep seven cards without one if it has a good mix of manadenial, counters and draw. Going to five for a creature shouldn't be done unless the hand lacks playables anyways. The mulligan decision changes a lot when you know what your opponent plays and when he knows what you play. You have to assess carefully how the hand you are looking at will play out against your opponent, especially when it comes to manadenial. If the opponent is the aggressive deck in the matchup keeping Burn but no creature can actually be better. If the opponent plays a control deck Nimble Mongoose and manadenial is of exceptional high value for a starting hand and no creature hands are problematic.

    How to use Burn: You are not playing Goyfsligh. Don't throw a Bolt at your opponent EOT because you have a red mana open. Don't remove creatures that are trying to race you but are actually weaker than yours (unless his burnspells make the math unpredictable). Instead keep burn for creatures that hinder you from attacking. This way your opponent will learn and sometimes even chooses not to block your Goyf with his own as he fears a Burnspell. Use his fear.
    The Ice side of Fire / Ice should be used in the same manner. Tap creatures that are too big for you. Don't just tap lands in their upkeep if you don't have a creature to make use of the time bought.
    Another difficult part when it comes to burn is boarding: I board out Fire / Ice quite often when there is no creature to kill with it but I rarely board out Bolts. Three points of damage for one mana is still a good finishing spell against most decks and you still need something to kill Goyfs somehow.

    Black Threshold should be played in metagames that feature few red decks. Graveyard dependent strategies such as Loam and even Dredge are things UGb can deal with more efficiently than UG or UGr. Control is an even better matchup than with the other variants as you have discard among other tools.

    - Shugyosha, TS Crew


    Links


    A full Threshold primer written by me in German: http://www.planetmtg.de/articles/artikel.html?id=4496
    David Caplan's (Goobafish) article about Canadian Threshold: http://www.magiceternal.com/legacy/Legacythresh.html
    Last edited by Nihil Credo; 07-02-2009 at 11:32 AM.

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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Because U/G/B Tempo Thresh also sees a significant amount of play.
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    @ mossivo1986

    Im alittle bit confused as to why ugr thresh doesnt cover this.
    It is possible to build UGr Thresh that focuses on the CounterTop lock. Some just splash red for Pyroblast and Pyroclasm; for example, http://www.deckcheck.net/deck.php?id=24306 (which is UGrw, but it is just an example).

    Additionally, you can build Tempo Thresh without red (black splash) .

    The splash itself doesn't dictate (enough of) the role of the deck to be the focus of the thread.




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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Quote Originally Posted by mossivo1986 View Post
    Im alittle bit confused as to why ugr thresh doesnt cover this.
    Because this thread is a lumping together of U/G/x true threshold decks not using CBT. "Tempo Threshold" is more like classic threshold than the new CBT based "Threshold" decks.

    Counterbalance decks have their own thread now, too. This is good, because some of the old "U/G/w CBT Threshold" decks no longer run any graveyard dependent cards. So calling them "threshold" is no longer appropriate.
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    @ Waya

    Because this thread is a lumping together of U/G/x true threshold decks not using CBT...This is good, because some of the old "U/G/w CBT Threshold" decks no longer run any graveyard dependent cards. So calling them "threshold" is no longer appropriate.
    Whether or not this archetype uses the threshold mechanic is not important. Some lists of Tempo Thresh don't run any threshold-mechanic creatures either.

    The only appropriate distinction being made is that one archetype focuses on immediate tempo disruption (generally mana disruption) with early wins while the other one seeks to CounterTop softlock. Both are "true" thresh, they just have very different primary goals.





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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Quote Originally Posted by 4eak View Post
    Whether or not this archetype uses the threshold mechanic is not important. Some lists of Tempo Thresh don't run any threshold-mechanic creatures either.
    It was specifically the mechanic I was talking about, but the idea of graveyard use in general. Most tempo decks (if not all) run goyf. So while there isn't any true threshold, the concept is still there.

    I do agree, the distinction between the two archetypes is made based on one being about soft-lock control and the other being about disruption aggro.

    I actually keep remaking mine and go back and forth between the two. I think I like tempo better. I just keep getting scared that my Confidant in U/G/b is going to pull up a FoW at the wrong time (so I tend to run SDT but no CB).
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    I guess my biggest argument is IF you change the DTB and add in counterbalance whats the real difference between say ugw thresh and ugw counterbalance?

    Though I do understand that ugr can be specialized to not be tempo thresh, does that make it viable enough to still have a catagory in the dtb? Won't this just replace it as the other models don't have nearly the impact that tempo thresh does.

    UGB tempo thresh should probobly get its own thread as well and replace just ugb thresh then right?

    What I mean to say is if were singling out specific models on threshhold, shouldn't they all take the same hit? Other models should probobly be forced into the established deck section.

    I guess the counterbalance thing really scews me. If we make a counterbalance thread then I guess we should really be calling this NLU or nassif's model. Maybe im missing something. Let me know.

    What you're missing is that ALL "Threshold" threads (and the NLU threads in Established) have been closed. ~NC

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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Quote Originally Posted by Nihil Credo View Post
    This thread is open to discussion of any list that satisfies the following criteria:

    1) Plays Tarmogoyf and at least one other threat
    2) Plays Force of Will and more than four cantrips
    3) Does not play maindeck Counterbalance
    4) Plays a significant amount of mana-stunting tools, most commonly Daze, Stifle, and Wasteland
    5) Focuses its game plan on deploying its assets faster than the opponent (also known as "tempo") and trying to kill him before he can stabilize his/her position and execute his/her game plan

    (By the way: yes, Team America is essentially a Tempo Thresh list with a somewhat larger black splash.)


    This is a temporary opening post; I am currently accepting submissions via PM for a primer on the archetype (I might write something myself, but it's unlikely).

    I suggest that TA continue to have its own thread since it is significantly different from the "Thresh" lists. I already posted a response in the Counterbalance thread suggesting that threads discussing multiple lists is a bad idea, and condensing is not the right answer for the DTB forum.

    These condensed threads that contain multiple lists in an archetype will pose a serious problem for anyone trying to find the current form of any one deck. I highly suggest creating multiple threads, even though it might require a little more work.
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    @ Nihil Credo

    (By the way: yes, Team America is essentially a Tempo Thresh list with a somewhat larger black splash.)
    Absolutely. Are you going to treat it as such?

    If so, why isn't Team America included as being a part of the Tempo Thresh category in the May update of the DTBF Philosophy & Deck Selection?

    What you're missing is that ALL "Threshold" threads (and the NLU threads in Established) have been closed. ~NC
    Will the TA thread be closed?

    Will the opening post of these new archetype threads be linking back to the threads which have been closed?

    Lastly, for clarification, how should we categorize a deck that plays the full set of CounterTop and staples of Tempo Thresh?

    4 Counterbalance
    4 Top
    4 Storm
    2-4 Ponder

    4 Daze
    4 Stifle
    4 FoW
    4 Wasteland

    4 Goyf
    4 Creature


    Heck, a lot of Dreadstill lists start looking like this as well. In some cases, I can't tell which is the primary goal. These decks might just play the role that was dealt to them in their opening hands and topdecks.

    While you've said decks in this thread should not be running maindeck CBTop, I would hate to overlook decks that are honestly a hybrid of both archetypes.



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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    I am convinced that having seperate threads for the tempo versions and the Counterbalance versions is the way to go instead of having a thread for each color combination. These decks are much more similar than the decks running the same color combination while having a different gameplan.

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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Oki, I am a bit confused. This thread is for Canadian Thresh, right?

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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Quote Originally Posted by Korsakow View Post
    Oki, I am a bit confused. This thread is for Canadian Thresh, right?
    Among others, yes.
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    The opening of this thread has been filled with Shugyosha's freshly updated primer. Check it out!
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    @ Nihil Credo: The primer looks nice, thanks for helping/posting the primer.

    @ Sauce: Does it matter who he is? Well maybe it does. Does it matter who you are? Well maybe it does, but does it matter for the discussion: No.

    I agree that Tempo Threshold is a deck that has about 2 open slots. You can fill them up with Bounce or Clique and Bounce or Predator and Bounce or in our case 2 Force Spike (removing an extra Spell Snare for another Force Spike). It really doesn't matter since the deck itself is already powerful.
    Personally, I'm pretty confidant that I benefit by adding 3 Force Spike and removing 1 Spell Snare and 2 Bounce from the original list. Maybe it's just the way I play the deck. Hoping for a bounce card to bounce a card from which you'll loose or having a Wipeaway/Rushing River in your starting hand is not the way I want to play the deck.
    I'm pretty confidant aswell that you guys should try Force Spike atleast a couple of times to become familiar with our (Team Nijmegen) idea.

    @ DragoFireheart

    Ok, serious. Give arguments why you want to fit in Counterspell. I'm curious why you want to play Counterspell over Force Spike. Just give arguments before even concluding things without testing it. So please, give arguments or start testing my Force Spike's.

    @ Al-ucard

    Well our list has many more outs than just 4 daze and 4 force. By adding 3 Force Spike to the list every one-drop that seems potentially dangerous can be countered by Force Spike's.
    You don't want to put Chain Lightning's in your sideboard. Trust me.
    Team Nijmegen

    Robbert Slavenburg
    DCI: 2069307189

  16. #16
    awesomeness
    Ch@os's Avatar
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Quote Originally Posted by Cenarius View Post
    ... case 2 Force Spike ... for another Force Spike ... by adding 3 Force Spike ... you want to play Counterspell over Force Spike ... start testing my Force Spike's ... adding 3 Force Spike ... can be countered by Force Spike's.
    Oook, i think we get it, i testet Force Spike and i dont like it.
    Plz respect another opinion on the playstyle without "FS", thx.
    Disrupt in the SB = WIN!
    Every DTB forum update is simply shuffling around the same ten decks.

  17. #17
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Ch@os:

    Against what decks did you play?
    How many games did you test with it?
    How long do you play Tempo Threshold?
    Do you know Tempo Threshold well? (May seem a bit harsh but I just want to know)
    What is your current list?

    It was not my intention to flood you guys with FS. However, many of the FS's that are in my post are just quote's by other people or trying to persuade some other guys to test FS's.
    Team Nijmegen

    Robbert Slavenburg
    DCI: 2069307189

  18. #18

    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    force spike - its the stone cold nuts if you have it when you need it, its terrible just like daze if you did not have enough wasteland/stifles early on or are in the late game.
    i think the ratio of 4 daze to 8 mana denial cards (4 waste, 4 stifle) is already correct.
    ive played the list that ran 2 counterspell 1 force spike -3 fire/ice and i think goobafish's list is better.

  19. #19
    Brazilians go nuts!
    Charlatan's Avatar
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Hey guys.

    Always when i am in a bad situation, I usualy want to topdeck a bounce spell, don't you?

    I think that our big concern are about clique or even another creatures...

    TempoThresh with red is my favourite deck at the moment...

    and a SB that splashes UGR is unfair. We can handle a lot of things.

    We shouldn't argue about a fixed list, but around which cards we could switch in several metas. So i think that FS could have a little space. But that's it.

    So, we should nominate some cards to players choose what they think best...

    Ty
    Battle doesn't need a purpose; the battle is its own purpose. You don't ask why a plague spreads or a field burns. Don't ask why I fight.
    Black Knight

  20. #20
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    Re: [DTB] Tempo Thresh

    Quote Originally Posted by Ch@os View Post
    Disrupt in the SB = WIN!
    Better than Divert?

    What do you SB Disrupt against?

    What do you take out?

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