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Thread: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

  1. #1

    [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    With all the hulabaloo about Lotus Cobra, Pyromancer Ascension seems to have slipped by people despite being a card with a potentially very powerful ability. If it gets on the table and active, then all of the cantrip cards - many of which are already popular - get very strong.

    There are two fundamental questions to consider:
    1. What's the most efficient way to activate it?
    Intuition - which is clearly a strong card in its own right looks like a great fit since it's likely to put one copy of a card into your hand, and two into the graveyard.
    Quiet Speculation - not necessarily the best card in the game, but putting 3x Deep Analysis into the discard seems pretty solid. If you can commit to comboing out, sacking mountains for Lava Dart is pretty efficient. There's also Think Twice and Volcanic Spray.
    Brainstorm - If you're playing blue, this card is probably a good inclusion...
    Ponder - Another superb blue card
    Ideas Unbound / Thirst for Knowledge...
    Entomb - Pretty simple; stick a copy of the card you're about to play into the discard.
    Infernal Tutor - If you want two of a card...
    Tome Scour, Brainfreeze....
    Glimpse the unthinkable -
    Gamble - Not necessarily the best card in the world, but a nice enabler in other ways as well...
    Book Burning - Clearly inferior to Glimpse, but in-color for ascension.

    2. How can it be abused for the win?
    Burnout - Pyromancer Acension + 3.3 bolt effects = 20 damage
    Grindout - Cards like Tome Scour, Glimpse the Unthinkable, and Brainfreeze can work both ways for you. Archive Trap for 26 cards, Glimpse for 20 cards, Tome Scour for 10 cards.
    Storm Out - Brainfreeze or Tendrils...

  2. #2
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    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    Honestly, it takes too much work for just not that much effect.

    You might as well just play another copy of whatever you want to copy/tutor for it. It's just way too slow to wait for a card in your graveyard, and then wait for another copy of that same instant or sorcery to show up, then have that happen again before you even start getting any effect. I just can't see this being good in anything in our format.
    Playing Punishing Regular Miracles.

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  3. #3
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    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    There was this deck in Extended. It was really good and anybody trying to do something with Pyromancer Ascension should take a look into it.

    Maybe a combination of Swath and Ascension could make you the ultimate Pyromancer (no, I don't think it's competitive).

  4. #4
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    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    This card reads like:

    UR
    Blue Mage's Ascension
    Abuse me with blue cardadvantage/-quality/-manipulation.

    Did they really expected this to be played in burn decks ?

    As much as I want this card to be good I sadly have to agree with
    Valtrix. I think the best place for it would be in a Thresh/Landstill shell.
    But then you have to add Ascensions and cards like Gifts Ungiven/Intuition
    to these shells to use Pyromancers Ascension to its full potential and I think
    at this point you have to cut more im portant cards to make some space.
    It's simply not worth it.

    But I really would like to see this card in some good nonblue deck.

  5. #5
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    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    Quote Originally Posted by Mnemon View Post
    But I really would like to see this card in some good nonblue deck.
    Maybe Life from the Loam could make it happen... It isn't rare to have multiple copies in the graveyard and/or is easy to achieve if it is a stake.
    Burning Wish for Cabal Therapy + flashback also seems feasable with a Therapy in the graveyard.


    Question is : the full effect sure looks powerful but isn't it overkill ? Hence, is it worth the effort ?

  6. #6
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    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    would like to necro this thread!

    i really like the idea of casting dark petition (with spell mastery) and having pyromancer ascension (active).

    generate BBBBBB, get lotus petal and burning wish. cast both, get dark petition and past in flames. should be lethal at this point. there's a lot of combinations here that can do that, but just interested if anyone has an interest in brewing this kind of deck.

    -rob
    -rob

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    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    I always thought it would pair well with Punishing/Groves. Also, Loam/flame jab/ravens crime. It becomes a value engine in both cases, not an "I win now" combo.
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  8. #8

    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    Well this is one hell of a necro.

    I wonder if this card has legs in Ruby Storm?

    On the other hand, I think the biggest problem with the card is just how win-more it is. You need to weigh the power of an active Ascension versus the work it takes to get there, plus taking into account the games were Ascension was a dead draw and how much that affects your win rate.

    My suspicion is that Brainstorm and Ponder already do what Ascension does: give you a lot of redundancy to grind out the last few spells in a Storm chain.

  9. #9
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    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    i had already tried it in ruby storm. i just liked the idea that you don't really need to play a combo deck in terms of all the mana cards. you might have to run just a few, but it should be enough.

    the main issue here is that pyromancer is the only card that has this kind of effect at a reasonable cost. i like that idea of having a deterministic line of play for a combo deck.

    it's a bit too fragile now, but was hoping someone could think of something. :)
    -rob

  10. #10

    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    The effect is necessarily comboish, though. Most fair decks aren't running cards that scale well (or at all) when doubled, or they're not particularly interested in having to jump through hoops to get their engine card to even start doing anything.

    A deck like Jund or Mardu would fall firmly into the first camp, I think, while Loam decks are in the latter. Even in Loam decks, the best thing to do with six lands for two mana is to lob them all at your opponent with Assault, so you're basically looking at a combo finish anyway.

  11. #11

    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    I've always thought it could be pretty good in a Jund Depths type of deck. Loam/Smallpox/Entomb to fill the yard with redundant spells. Punishing Fire or Loam to turn on Ascension. Then you get pay off cards to double up on in Crop Rotation, Smallpox, Entomb, Innocent Blood, Punishing Fire of course.

    I think Ascension would be a win-more card in the shell, but you could look at Ascension as a way for a Loam deck to regain card advantage after burning its own hand on Pox, Mox Diamonds, etc and close out the game.

    Edit: Collective Brutality also plays well with Pyromancer Ascension, as escalated spells will be copied entirely by an active Ascension, and escalating Brutality can help turn it on.
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  12. #12

    Re: [SCD]Pyromancer Ascension

    I have been testing a bit with this recently in Storm as a proactive and non-Green/Abrupt Decay way to deal with Miracles/Counterbalance, and potentially Chalice of the Void decks as well.
    With tons of cantrips plus Infernal Tutor, it is not difficult to get and cast multiple copies of one spell in the grindier matchups (Miracles, etc.).
    Testing is limited so far, but results are positive to date.

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