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Thread: [Deck] New Horizons

  1. #1
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    [Deck] New Horizons

    So I really liked the card Horizon Canopy so I decided I wanted to build a deck around abusing it. The final result:

    New Horizons:

    4 Wasteland
    4 Horizon Canopy
    3 Tropical Island
    2 Tundra
    1 Savannah
    3 Windswept Heath
    3 Flooded Strand
    2 Misty Rainforest
    3 Mox Diamond
    4 Ponder
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    4 Daze
    4 Tarmogoyf
    4 Terravore
    4 Knight of the Reliquary
    3 Crucible of Worlds
    4 Force of Will

    SB:
    4 Krosan Grip
    4 Engineered Explosives
    4 Tormod’s Crypt
    2 Life from the Loam
    1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale


    How the deck plays:
    The deck plays fairly similar to decks like Tempo Thresh and Team America. Although it doesn’t focus as much on land destruction it can put out a fairly fast clock, often gold fishing by turn 5.

    Creatures:
    This deck uses a creature suite of Tarmogoyf, Terravore, and Knight of the Reliquary.

    Tarmogoyf can easily fill the roll of an attacker or a defender. His large size and cheap mana cost gives you much needed defensive capabilities against aggressive decks.

    Knight of the Reliquary is generally the second creature to drop. Often 1 or 2 points bigger than Terravore when dropped early in the game, this card is a power house at blocking, able to block most creatures, while at the same time pumping it’s self, other creatures you control, and drawing you cards or destroying your opponent’s land. He is the first three drop the deck wants to play and often comes down around turn 3 at around a 4/4, but can come out earlier and bigger.

    Terravore, although can often be good on defense, is the main offensive creature. Having trample and usually being huge can end games quickly. Some times he can come down small on turn 3 as only a 2/2, but he is usually at least up to a 5/5 around turn 5.

    Spells:

    The spells are all pretty standard spells, most of which require no explanation.

    Mox Diamond, although sometimes very swingy, gives the deck the much needed speed boost in some match ups. Sometimes it is sub optimal but can be shuffled back with a brainstorm or just played without pitching a land to pump Tarmogoyf in a pinch.

    Crucible of Worlds gives the deck a late game engine. It can lock out your opponent with wasteland or draw an additional card a turn with horizon canopy.

    Side Board:

    Like all side boards it can vary.

    Currently I am playing Krosan Grip for counterbalance and it is of course useful in several other matches.

    The explosives are there mainly for the agro matches. The side board strategy is difficult for those since I do not have too much to take out and I really need to board in an answer to Relic of Progenitus. Explosives allows me to destroy the relic if dropped early before it can do any real damage, sometimes taking out another creature with it. It is also useful if they just draw an agro hand and not a relic (or if they don’t even play relic, it’s hard to know for certain).

    The crypt is for Ichorid, which always knocks me out if I am not playing crypt. It can also be useful in other random matches, such as 43 land.

    Life from the Loam can come in against decks that: are vulnerable to waste lock; may be destroying my crucible; or want to destroy my lands. The more of these criteria the deck meets, the better Life from the Loam is. Decks such as Team America or Tempo thresh can meet all of these criteria and Life from the Loam can be absolutely devastating against them. I found two to be a good number since you do not want to get flooded with this type of effect since multiples are probably going to be useless.

    The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale is there mostly for Ichorid. If I can a knight to stick around for a turn it can fetch this up, leaving Ichorid only with Ichorid’s as its win condition. Knight can then fetch up an wastelands to ensure Ichorid can’t reanimate a fatty.

    Matchups:

    Some of the best matchups this deck has are against land destruction decks such as Team America, Tempo Thresh, Eva Green, Merfolk, and similar decks. The high land count of 22 lands when the curve stops at 3, plus counter magic to protect the lands if needed or cantrips to dig for more lands if needed plus mox diamond give it much resiliency to land destruction. Not to mention that once the creatures start coming down, they are going to be huge fast since the land destruction pumps them up.

    Match ups with no removal for large creatures such as Tempo Thresh, Merfolk, Elves and others are favorable. They often have no way to get by large blockers and can only hope to chump attackers. These decks have no answer to Terravore, which often kills them in 2-3 hits.

    In testing counter top has often proven to be a good matchup. They can occasionally steal game 1 with counter balance if they can keep a 3 on top, but post board Krosan Grips can nullify their only out. Since your creatures are almost always going to be bigger, it is hard for them to beat you in the creature war. They are also generally pretty vulnerable to waste lock.

    Storm combo is an okay match. You have counter magic and wasteland can often slow them down. A clock that can often kill on turn 5 can put some significant pressure making wasteland and daze all the stronger.

    Control decks such as landstill seem to be a rather poor matchup, like most thresh like decks. The amount of removal they have makes it extremely difficult to keep creatures on the board. If they are not playing a ton of basics wasteland lock is probably the best way to beat them.

    Zoo is an ok match up and probably the one I have most extensively tested. I would say perhaps about 55-45 to 60-40 in the zoo player’s favor. If they bring in Relic of Progenitus then that could make it more difficult. The big killer in this match up is Path to Exile and Swords to plowshares. The deck invests a lot in its creatures and those creatures are extremely powerful in this match, so cheap removal is a huge tempo loss. In this match I try to save force of will for the paths and forcing on can greatly swing the game into your favor. Fortunately a lot of their removal is burn related and is rather bad against the creatures in this deck. You can often two for one their burn since it will often take another card along with the burn to kill it, and late game the burn can’t even do that. Grim Lavamancer is very powerful in zoo against you since it can often shrink your guys and deal two damage to them which can put them into burn range.

    I have not played against goblins since the deck doesn’t seem very popular at the moment. I imagine this match would swing a lot if they ran Warren Weirding or not.

    Merfolk is a very favorable matchup. The resiliency this deck has to land destruction combined with merfolk’s lack of removal (Jitte is to slow and weak in this match) make it very strong. Merfolk has little answer to Terravore. The main goal is to keep them off Lord of Atlantis and to a lesser extent Merrow Regery (their ways to stop me from blocking). If you can keep them off those not much left in the deck is a threat.

    In summary the cards that are best against this deck are path to exile, swords to plowshares, and Relic of Progenitus. Some of the cards it is strongest against are burn spells and land destruction.


    The deck has been performing well for me. I have taken it two three major tournaments. The first I was not playing any graveyard hate and was knocked out by Ichorid. The second was Star City Game’s 5k in North Carolina where I was again knocked out by Ichorid because I played no graveyard hate. This past 5k I did play the graveyard hate I listed above and did not get paired against Ichorid. I was instead lost to 43 land (he drew way better than me) and then to landstill (which is admittedly a bad match, but there were only 2 landstill out of about 150 people). All in all I was pleased with how I did and hope to get some better matchups in the future so I can post some real results. I just felt I needed to post this now since I don’t think I will be playing in another major tournament till next year :(.

    So let me know what you people think.

    Also if you are wondering about the name New Horizons, it’s based off the key card in this deck (Horizon Canopy). Also it’s named after the New Horizons space craft going to Pluto developed at where I used to work (although I did not work on that project) because Pluto’s just bad assed. Also some sort of metaphor for taking the agro control archetype down a new (land based) path.
    Last edited by quicksilver; 10-26-2009 at 01:05 PM.

  2. #2

    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    With recursion and horizon canopy I don't see the need for so many catnips I would recommend -2 ponder +1 Kor Haven and +1 mox diamond

  3. #3
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    I would recommend spell check. Other than that, this just seems a little lacking in the creature department. Maybe you could splash Blue for Coatl, since you want to abuse your : Draw a card.
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  4. #4
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    I only have to say that I believe there should be at least 1 life from the loam in the main, and some cycling lands.
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    You're playing 16 blue cards in a FoW deck, and this counting FoW itself.

    You're trying to support Mox Diamonds playing just 22 lands.

    Your deck plays an Aggro Loam's heavy creature base, but it have no Loam engine to fuel the strategy. And you're playing 8 creatures that rely on lands in graveyard alongside with CoW and Daze. So, if after a dozen turns you had cracked three fetches and wastelanded a dual, your 1GG Terravores will still be less than any ordinary 1G Goyf or BB Tombstalker (that probably hit play 4 turns earlier).

    Your deck's playing a partial CounterTop/TA control suite, but it have no CounterTop lock nor Stifle/Sinkhole tempo cards, so you're not likely to stick one of your eight 3 mana creatures and protect it the time needed to either put an engine going, or to win in the meantime.

    It's right in the middle of the road, but it don't even know which direction it wants to take. You can't build a deck around a support card, but you can adjust a deck to support it. What you did here was adjust an existing deck (or two decks in the case) to pretend it's another one, but it didn't lead the deck anywhere.
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  6. #6
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    -Crucible
    +Intution/Loam

    My opinion, anyway.

    Honestly:

    U/G/b Aggro/Control Loam

    // Lands
    4 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
    4 [ON] Polluted Delta
    2 [U] Tropical Island
    2 [A] Underground Sea
    1 [B] Bayou
    2 [MR] Island (1)
    1 [5E] Forest (1)
    1 [4E] Swamp (3)
    1 [PLC] Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    1 [TE] Wasteland
    3 [ON] Lonely Sandbar

    // Creatures
    4 [FUT] Tarmogoyf
    4 [OD] Terravore
    3 [LRW] Shriekmaw
    1 [ON] Gigapede
    1 [JU] Genesis

    // Spells
    4 [BD] Brainstorm
    4 [LRW] Ponder
    4 [TE] Intuition
    1 [RAV] Life from the Loam
    4 [DD2] Daze
    4 [AL] Force of Will
    1 [EVE] Raven's Crime
    3 [AP] Pernicious Deed

    // Sideboard
    SB: 1 [AP] Pernicious Deed
    SB: 4 [ARB] Maelstrom Pulse
    SB: 2 [TSP] Krosan Grip
    SB: 4 [A] Blue Elemental Blast
    SB: 4 [DDC] Duress

    Just a shell to work from. Splash white, probably drop black. Cut a few things here and there, fit some Knights in, if you're deadset on Horizon's, somehow fit those in there. Minus this, plus that, yea. Just giving you an overall shell to take ideas from.

  7. #7

    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    Another option would be to get rid of blue entirely, since it doesn't really seem to do much for you, and opt for G/W exclusively. This might yield a deck akin to the GW Terrarium deck we were discussing a few months ago.

    GW Terrarium

    4 Wasteland
    4 Savannah
    3 Windswept Heath
    3 Tranquil Thicket
    2 Secluded Steppe
    2 Forest
    2 Plains
    2 Nantuko Monastery
    1 Glacial Chasm
    1 Maze of Ith
    1 Treetop Village
    1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale


    4 Knight of the Reliquary
    4 Terravore
    3 Anurid Brushhopper
    3 Exalted Angel
    3 Qasali Pridemage

    4 Mox Diamond
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    4 Life from the Loam
    3 Cataclysm
    3 Solitary Confinement


    SB:
    4 Gaddock Teeg
    4 Ghostly Prison
    3 Chalice of the Void
    2 Krosan Grip
    1 Volrath's Stronghold
    1 Gaea's Blessing

  8. #8
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    (Cephalid Coliseum)

    I had the thought of using Knight of the Reliquary plus Krosan Verges plus Emeria, but even I think that's terrible.
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    SummenSaugen: then I flip it over and crush my opponent

  9. #9
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    Quote Originally Posted by Pastorofmuppets View Post
    I would recommend spell check. Other than that, this just seems a little lacking in the creature department. Maybe you could splash Blue for Coatl, since you want to abuse your : Draw a card.
    i agree you should run coatle he gives you ways to abuse your late game package.

  10. #10

    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    what about Trade Routes? and why not cycle lands then...

  11. #11
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    In France, we have a local Tier 1 archetype that we call Bant Loam which is quite close to this.

    Here is a commonly agreed list :

    Lands: 25
    1 Forest
    1 Maze of Ith
    1 Mishra's Factory
    1 Plains
    1 Savannah
    1 Secluded Steppe
    1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
    2 Tropical Island
    2 Tundra
    3 Flooded Strand
    3 Tranquil Thicket
    4 Wasteland
    4 Windswept Heath

    Acceleration: 6
    3 Mox Diamond
    3 Noble Hierarch

    Beaters: 15
    4 Knight of the Reliquary (the main card of the deck, you are supposed to be able to play it on turn 2)
    4 Qasali Pridemage (can really be aggro and it's also a very good solution provider)
    4 Tarmogoyf (because it's everywhere, probably the weakest beater though)
    3 Elspeth, Knight-Errant (evasion provider, wins under humility, aggro/control, army knife)

    Tempo: 7
    3 Stifle (completes the mana denial package, randomly very good in some MUs)
    4 Swords to Plowshares

    Long term plans: 8
    1 Eternal Witness (tutor)
    1 Crop Rotation (tutor)
    2 Intuition (tutor)
    1 Cenn's Enlistment (preferred over Worm Harvest because it's not grave dependant, less colour requiring and it can be played 1 turn earlier)
    3 Life from the Loam

    SB: 1 Mox Diamond (against combo to help having a turn 1 MM or Gaddock or Canonist)
    SB: 1 Stifle (floating slot)
    SB: 3 Meddling Mage (against combo and control)
    SB: 2 Jötun Grunt (for the mirror, I told you it was Tier1, ichorid to a lesser extent)
    SB: 2 Burrenton Forge-Tender (gob, burn and aggro loam, ichorid)
    SB: 1 Ethersworn Canonist (combo of course)
    SB: 1 Circle of Protection: Red (gob, burn)
    SB: 1 Tormod's Crypt (mirror, aggro loam, Ichorid)
    SB: 1 Engineered Explosives (toolbox)
    SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg (alternative to MM, even if it prevents you from playing Cenn's Enlistment and Elspeth, you enter it in MUs like landstill or tendrils combo where they are a bigger pain to the opponent)
    SB: 1 Enlightened Tutor (duplicates a lot of SB slots
    One of the biggest mistakes when siding against this deck is to SB graveyard hate that is not relic, because :
    1/ the deck plays well without graveyard thanks to exaltation and Elspeth.
    2/ the deck can remove graveyard hate if needed quite efficiently with Qasali
    3/ Stifle is another protection to grave hate.

    The weaknesses of the deck: no disruption except for stifle and meedling mage. Tendrils is too fast and too resilient. Aggro loam usually does not care and its creatures grow faster. Survival has a better CA engine.

    It has positive MUs against almost everything but Tendrils combo decks (very rare in France), aggro loam (not that rare) and survival decks (quite rare). Natural order can also be an issue but usually we can disrupt quite efficently the mana base (except against elves/survival) and meddling mage and teeg are also good protections. Gobs, burn, elfball and merfolks are even to positive depending on the builds. The rest is from positive to very positive.

  12. #12
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    I played this in the blacksburg tournament the other weekend and came in third with a 3-1 record.

    First round: Eva Green
    Game 1: He started off just laying basic swamps and played no theats or land destruction. He killed my first few guys so I was thinking he was playing mono black control. He eventually dropped a couple guys. I swords/countered a few and played a few more creatures which were able to easily get there.
    Game 2: Still think he not playing eva green. I don't think I had anyhting to bring in. He starts this game with some land destruction, so I only get up to three mana, which I use to play a few creatures. He smothers them and get's me pretty low with a goyf. I finally swords the goyf and get a few creature's to stick which wins me the game.

    1-0

    Round 2: Tendril's combo
    Game 1: I draw a few wastelands, and waste his first few land drops. I then drop a terravore which can kill him in 3 hits. Combined with daze and the game ends quickly.
    Game 2: I waste his first land drop and drop mox diamond. I play a knight 2 turns later. The knight fetches out 3 more wastelands to keep him off mana, then kills him in two hits.

    2-0

    Round 3: Zoo
    Game 1: My opening hand is fine, but then I draw 2 daze's and 2 crucible's, all of which are completely dead. He draws plenty of path to exile's and I run out of playable cards.
    Game 2: I mull into 2x horizon canopy, 2x force, 2x goyf. I draw a sub optimal mox diamond for my second turn and play a goyf. I draw a completely dead mox diamond the turn after that. He has too much removal for me to handle as well as a fast clock and I lose.

    2-1

    Round 4: Tempo thresh
    Game 1: I resolve huge creatures, his deck has no answer.
    Game 2: I resolve huge creatures, his deck has no answer. Although this one was funnier. The end of the game he is sitting on 4 spell snare. I had two goyfs in my hand the whole game which he saw with Vendilion Clique, but I never needed to cast them. He spent two or three turns icing a Knight which of course allowed me to just use his ability instead and I soon played a second night. At this point they were both 13/13's and was was just playing out goyfs and geese to chump block. I made fun of how tiny they were and we both had a good laugh over it.

    The tournament was only 12 players and we didn't do playoffs so I ended up in third place.











    I also played at the Dream Wizards tournament this past weekend. There were 24 players and I made top 8.

    Round 1: Merfolk
    Game 1: This game starts out really good for me, I get a second turn knight, followed by 2 terravore's and a swords for his lord of atlantis. I am going to kill him next turn, then he echoing truth's my two terravores and plays two marrow rejery, taking out my ability to block. The tempo loss is too much and he wins.
    Game 2: I prevent him from getting much out and I drop a knight. He then drops back to basics. I am able to play a goyf next turn and I start swinging in. I get him to 6 with a 6/7 goyf and knight that was at least 6 power. He swings with his whole team putting me to one and then vials in a marrow rejery. I take my turn and swing. He sits there feeling stupid that he didn't leave back an additional blocker.
    Game 3: He starts of fairly mana screwed. He has out a vial and a curse catcher. I try engineered explosives at 1 which get's stifled. I then drop a 5/5 terravore. He has two lands and casts a mind harness on my terravore. I am a little mana flooded and I only have lands in hand so this looks like it could be bad for me. I rip an engineered explosives and wipe his board and get back my terravore. Next turn I rip brainstorm, brainstorm in gas and shuffle back two lands.

    1-0

    Round 2: Belcher
    Game 1: His first turn consists of draw go with no land drop. I'm like "wow that's terrible you better be playing belcher or something". Second turn he drops a LED's figuring I already know what he is playing. I think about dazing it but I decide not to, which was great for me because he drops a second led right after. I get out a third turn knight that puts a good clock on him. Two turns before he dies he draws a belcher. He plays chrome mox, ritual, which I daze and he pitches ESG. I didn't see a force that game so belcher resolves and activates and hits a land third card down. Unfortunately for me know he is in the rare situation where the second LED is good. There is nothing in my deck that can stop him at this point and I die next turn.
    Game 2: I keep a hand with no force but a lot of cantrips so I have a good chance of finding on. I first turn ponder into two forces.
    Game 3: Same as game 2 but I also have a engineered explosives in case he tries to empty the warrens.

    2-0
    Round 3: Natural Order Thresh (I don't actually see natural order, counterbalance or top any game)
    Game 1: I decide not to daze his first turn noble hierarch since I have force and no other blue card and i would prefer to save the daze for force. Turns out bad for me, he plays a goyf turn 2,3,4, and 5. And a dazes my first three spells. Turns out he didn't even have a second land so daze didn't set him back in the slightest. Just too much counters and fat for me to handle.
    Game 2: Things go fairly even, he get's out a knight and starts wasting me. I get out a knight a couple turns after. His is a 10/10 mine is a 6/6. He swings me down to 3. Next turn i am trying desperately to find a swords. He swings with an exalted 11/11 knight next turn. I block and get a horizon canopy looking for swords which I don't find leaving me with just 1 land, but my knight is also an 11/11 and they trade. I messed up here, if i had got wasteland instead of canopy I could have wasted my last land, making my knight a 12/12 and surviving, giving him 2 turns to find a swords. Instead the knights trade leaving him with a pridemage while I am at three. I ponder on my turn and find the swords but I only have 1 land out so I can't cast it.

    2-1

    Round 4: Fairies
    Game 1: I am on the play and drop a second turn crucible. He is pretty scared. I quickly get him down to 1 swamp and he has gotten a bitterblossom out and I have a knight out. I then draw a terravore which he is not able to stop.
    Game 2: I get a goyf out. He plays bitterblossom which I force bringing my goyf to a 6/7. He cannot handle the goyf and I win.

    3-1

    Round 5: I ID into top 8.

    Top 8: Entomb Hulk
    Game 1: I know what he is playing I start off with first turn mox diamond ponder waste his land. I play another cantrip next turn and waste his land. I cast two more cantrips next turn and do lot's of shuffling looking for a daze, force, or swords. I play a terravore next turn. Next turn I swing for 10 and can kill him the following turn. I play more cantrips. I end up playing all 4 ponders, all 4 brainstorms, and shuffle many times. I see zero froces, zero swords, and zero dazes. Next turn right before I kill him he rips his third land he needs to win and wins. He is absolutely shocked I haven't drawn anything to stop him, but I did draw about 7 knight of the reliquaries that game.
    Game 2: He thoughtsiezes me which I misdirect back to him. He forces my misdirection and takes my swords to plowshares leaving me with just a goyf on the table and two horizon canopies in hand. He then plays needle on canopy. I draw a daze and more land. He goes off, I daze, but he has pact of negation. My draws the match were just really unlucky.

    Top 8 didn't matter since we had split the prize before hand.

    All in all my deck has been preforming well for me. I have been testing some tweeks since. I tried cutting the crucibles because although they are great, they are generally too slow for the current meta. I am replacing two crucible's with engineered explosives. The third crucible, a daze, and a terravore, with 3 misdirection. These changes give it a much better aggro match up without hurting other matches significantly.

  13. #13
    Legacy Inept

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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    I don't want to pollute your thread Quicksilver but as the (french) Bant Loam archetype does not exist on the source, I keep putting its results in your thread. Just tell me if you think it's too far away from the concept you were looking after and I'll start a new thread in the established decks sections.

    Established yes, because after winning a 100+ people event in Bourgoin Jallieu (+another in the top8 and +me 9th with a black splash version of this deck too), it has just won this WE the legacy side-event at GP Paris (162 people). After doing 6 wins, 1 loss, it IDed to the top8 which it won. This deck is really popular in the french (almost) Ad Nauseam-less metagame. Ad Nauseam is barely the single bad MU of this deck (with Reanimator and to a lesser extent survival decks).

  14. #14
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    I think you could safely make your own thread. The decks are different enough. You run a very light blue splash, where my deck is blue based.

  15. #15

    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    Last friday I tried this deck with my friends. It is quite good, and has big creatures that are dificult to get rid of with some decks.

    May be I will give it a try in a tournament next weekend but with some changes. This is what I felt about it:

    1- moxes are not very good, specially as a top deck. I'm thinking in cutting them and maybe upping 1 land.

    2- crucible are good but 3 are too much because they are very slow as you said.

    3- I tried 2 explosives main and they are great.

    With this in mind, I would try:

    -3 moxes
    -2 crucible
    +1 enlightened tutor
    +2 engeneered explosives
    +1 academy ruins
    + 1 Oblivion ring

    and +1 dueling grounds in the sideboard

    What do you think about this?

  16. #16
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    The moxes are a very swingy card. Sometimes they are amazing. Fast matchups like agro and combo, they are almsot a nececity, turning a loss into a win. Other matchups they can be pretty terrible. They are very swingy in their power level.

    I had tested academy ruins at one point, but it is very slow. Since the deck generally doesn't get aout a lot of mana, it can be quite mana intensive to academy ruins back a explosives.

    I'm not a fan of enlightened tutor because of the inherent card disadvantage. I don't think the cards we can get are powerful enough to warrent that.

    I also think Oblivion ring is a weak card in general.

    Dueling grounds could be interesting, let me know how it turns out.

  17. #17

    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    Quote Originally Posted by quicksilver View Post
    The moxes are a very swingy card. Sometimes they are amazing. Fast matchups like agro and combo, they are almsot a nececity, turning a loss into a win. Other matchups they can be pretty terrible. They are very swingy in their power level.

    I had tested academy ruins at one point, but it is very slow. Since the deck generally doesn't get aout a lot of mana, it can be quite mana intensive to academy ruins back a explosives.

    I'm not a fan of enlightened tutor because of the inherent card disadvantage. I don't think the cards we can get are powerful enough to warrent that.

    I also think Oblivion ring is a weak card in general.

    Dueling grounds could be interesting, let me know how it turns out.
    Quoted for true in general. academy ruins is too slow and sitational, and enlightened tutor, although it can be good for some utility, is card disadvantage. Then without enlightened tutor, oblivion is unnecesary as a 1of.

    Maybe i'll try with 2 crucible and 2 explosives main, and upping 1 basic land and without the moxen. Then in sideboard the other 2 explosives and 3 dueling grounds. Just testing.

  18. #18
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    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    If you wanted to cut the mox diamonds, you could try one of each basic land. You could also try noble hierarch although I just hate the idea of opening the deck up to burn being removal.

  19. #19

    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    Congrats on the finish.

    Why not run Armageddon as a 2 of? This deck seems to ask for that option.

  20. #20

    Re: [Deck] New Horizons

    I was the bant player that you ran into at the dream wizards legacy (my name is Paul, and you gave Phil and I a ride to the Philly 5k recently, thanks btw). I wasn't actually playing counterbalance thresh, I was playing a slightly modified ugw tempo thresh http://www.starcitygames.com/magic/l...empo_Bant.html , with a modified sideboard, and rhox war monks in place of vendilion cliques as I was afraid of zoo (as it turned out there was only one zoo player, my friend DoC whom I lent my zoo deck to, and I was paired against him first round, so the switch was perfect).

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