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Thread: Counter-Rebel Still

  1. #161
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    the combo plan is getting Mirror Entity (mostly EOT) out and swing with 3-X Rebels for alot of damage thanks to Training Grounds & Gaea's Cradle making the Mirror Entity activation much cheaper.
    The good thing about rebels is that they are very resilient, they replace themselves, recruit good surprising stuff, backed up by counters. The creatures get cheated into play like Aether Vial does, but rebels tutor any card you want.
    You can get control of the battlefield pretty fast.

  2. #162
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Thanks for the explanation Alexeezay.
    I'm going to give the deck a spin, since i own most of the stuff and i really like the concept. the only thing is that i don't currently own any gaea's cradle and don't intend to acquire it at his current price.

    How's the merfolk matchup ?

  3. #163
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Ive never really tested against Merfolk but I would imagine that we can take them by surprise via Mirror Entity (if they have a Lord of Atlantis online, our rebels also get the +1/+1 and islandwalk bonus under an activated Mirror Entity)
    I am convinced that WotC is "dumbing" the game because of all the stupid posts they come across on MTG-related forums
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
    13NoVa plays Force of Will from his hand.
    Finglonger plays Spell Pierce from his hand.
    [10:22:43]  13NoVa: lol
    sure
    Finglonger points from his Dack Fayden to 13NoVa's Sol Ring.
    [10:23:04]  13NoVa: lol dumb ******; nice draws with retard.dec
    stupid cocksucker
    You have been kicked out of the game.

  4. #164
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    @claudio.r : The vs Merfolk is actually quite even and it is VERY dependent on your opening 7 . I will admit that the builds running a black splash for Engineered Plague are a bit harder to beat . Their two biggest threats are AEther Vial and a resolved Lord of Atlantis (and the aforementioned EPlague) . Fortunately if you look at most of the rebel builds on here we all run multiple Ramosian Lieutenants to help combat this . As for fighting the Lord of Atlantis . Rebels can instantly turn the tide if we search for an EOT Mirror Entity and make all our Rebels into Changelings (granting everything we have +1/+1 and Islandwalk as mentioned by above) tho I will admit that in testing keeping Lord off the table is probably a better idea so we can set up good blocks + recruits .

    Another thing about Merfolk is that it benefits you to actually run Childrens of Korlis MD to gain life . As Merfolk runs 0 removal maindeck and around 1-2 Umezawa's Jitte in the SB .

    The Merfolk builds that are mono Blue are a bit better as some of those run Standstill . A card that is useless unless they can land it before we land one of our dozen + recruiters .

    Lastly , if you are having problems with Merfolk I have found that packing the SB cards COP:Blue & Meekstone to be most awesome when you start playing games 2/3 .

    Good luck with the deck , and let us know of your experiences with Counter-Rebels .

    Collective knowledge is a good thing .

    EDIT : Although there is great hilarity in the first time you use their own Lord of Atlantis to just kill them dead .

    EDIT 2 : UBER GREAT HILARITY .

  5. #165
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    This is not exactly Counterrebels but i found this list in a recent tournament. It made it into the top 8 in a 114 player tournament.



    1 Children of Korlis
    1 Defiant Falcon
    1 Dryad Arbor
    1 Gaddock Teeg
    1 Mirror Entity
    1 Ramosian Lieutenant
    1 Whipcorder
    2 Fauna Shaman
    2 Qasali Pridemage
    2 Scryb Ranger
    2 Stoneforge Mystic
    3 Mother of Runes
    3 Weathered Wayfarer
    4 Birds of Paradise
    4 Ramosian Sergeant

    2 Crop Rotation
    4 Swords to Plowshares

    1 Sword of Fire and Ice
    1 Sword of Light and Shadow
    1 Umezawa's Jitte
    4 Aether Vial

    1 Bojuka Bog
    1 Forest
    1 Gaea's Cradle
    1 Karakas
    1 Plains
    1 Treetop Village
    2 Horizon Canopy
    3 Savannah
    3 Wasteland
    4 Windswept Heath



    For the latest posts:
    @Alexeezay : I think Bound in Silence and BGH are close. Both have some good situations where they shine. I picked BGH becaurse i think it helps the more scary matchups more than bound.

    For the merfolk matchup i think it's slightly better than 50/50. Sure they can kill you really quickly if they draw nuts but if they don't it's pretty easy to kill them. It depends as mentioned by Vago on their list though. I tested alot against merfolk and i think the more control elements they use, the easier it is to beat them. If they put a LoA into play they should be finishing you with it or else you have a high chance of winning via mirror entity (especially with cradle).

  6. #166
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    ye you're right preddi, I just wanted to post something useless :D

    I think Rebels in Maverick is interesting. It's got a suprise factor because of its many options & no one sees a Mirror Entity combo win coming out of Maverick :)

  7. #167
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Has anyone tried Meddling Mage in the SB as a 2-4 of ?

  8. #168
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    I think Ethersworn Canonist,Aura of Silence and Pithing Needle do the same job and are tutorable.
    well you can't stop show and tell or Natural Order unfortunately :/ if you see this kind of decks in your meta I would try Meddling Mage.
    I'm thinking about MMs myself as I got a playset laying around
    Last edited by Alexeezay; 03-02-2011 at 01:57 PM.

  9. #169
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    Re: In the money with Counter Rebels at SCG Indy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Indykid Vago View Post

    Round 5 vs Mike Antrim playing GW Aggro with hate bears .

    Great opponent , great games and I don't think that I could have done anything else to win this one . Both of us are very happy with out play and if I ever see this guy again it's going to be with a smile on my face . Very very GGS .
    Hey, thats me!

    Had a great time reading your report, and glad you were able to win out like I did! It was a pleasure playing you! :)

  10. #170
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Hey,

    i was playing my rebels again and i think the deck works relatively good so far, but i'm looking for a second win condition to fight pithing needle. Anyone a good idea to solve this problem?

  11. #171
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Usually for those, I try to save my permission. That said, both Pithing Needle and Humility is really debilitating to the deck. Not to mention that Phyrexian Revokers are showing up everywhere.

    The meta has slowed down again, and zoo is at it's all time low, I think this deck could stand a chance.

    Speaking of meta slowing down, has anyone tried using Standstill again?
    I am convinced that WotC is "dumbing" the game because of all the stupid posts they come across on MTG-related forums
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
    13NoVa plays Force of Will from his hand.
    Finglonger plays Spell Pierce from his hand.
    [10:22:43]  13NoVa: lol
    sure
    Finglonger points from his Dack Fayden to 13NoVa's Sol Ring.
    [10:23:04]  13NoVa: lol dumb ******; nice draws with retard.dec
    stupid cocksucker
    You have been kicked out of the game.

  12. #172
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Quote Originally Posted by 1mpulse View Post
    Hey, thats me!

    Had a great time reading your report, and glad you were able to win out like I did! It was a pleasure playing you! :)
    ^ uber ggs man . uber ggs .

    Quote Originally Posted by preddi View Post
    Hey,

    i was playing my rebels again and i think the deck works relatively good so far, but i'm looking for a second win condition to fight pithing needle. Anyone a good idea to solve this problem?
    So far as vs decks that run 3-4 SB Pithing Needle , here is the thing .

    If that first Pithing Needle is on your already resolved but nono active searcher than your plan is to draw or Brainstorm into another searcher (or Plow , if we are talking about their Revoker ) . If you see heavy Needles in the area it may be a good idea to run a single Amrou Scout in the main as an additional type of 2cc rebel searcher . Doing this will weaken your deck to E Plague .

    If they drop an early Needle naming Mirror Entity you have to hold counters and stop any attempts to board wipe , while literally just pushing through with your Defiant Falcons while using Plowshares to keep the skies clear .

    Or , you could just try to deck them while recurring Childrens of Korlis to prevent damage . Aven Riftwatcher also helps with both the aerial combat and the life gain while being 2/3 ) .

    Quote Originally Posted by (nameless one) View Post
    Usually for those, I try to save my permission. That said, both Pithing Needle and Humility is really debilitating to the deck. Not to mention that Phyrexian Revokers are showing up everywhere.

    The meta has slowed down again, and zoo is at it's all time low, I think this deck could stand a chance.

    Speaking of meta slowing down, has anyone tried using Standstill again?
    Yeah man , the printing on Revoker has absolutely added another challenge we have to face , my best answer so far is running the Etutor Sb into Serenity ( which I will one day have altered to match the space ship from Firefly ) .

    I've tested MD Standstills and have kind of come to the conclusion that it's only really good vs decks that do not run instant speed removal , decks we were not behind against to begin with , or decks that don't run AEther Vial . Granted my idea's on this are from the Survival era so it may be an out of date theory .


    On another note , is anyone actually beating High Tide ? Seems like a worst match-up than Zoo was :|

  13. #173
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Dunno about high tide. It seems slightly slower than storm. I would imagine that if he combos with brain freeze you can tutor up Linn sivvi and put rebels back in the library. But if he goes for blue sun's zenith that won't do. This deck seems to do very well at the recent tournaments. Dunno what other decks can do to stop that (Spell pierce, daze and FoW seems the best possible permission package you could run).
    The recent rise of Cephalid Breakfast is also a threat.

    Maybe reconsider the sideboard options? High Tide has nice removal package in the sb for cunning wish. Maybe something like Last Word, but this seems not that great. Any other good suggestions?

  14. #174

    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Hello all,

    I read Indykid Vago report and was quite impressed with this deck.
    I missed out playing Rebels back in the day and I am really interested in playing this deck for my local area.


    My question is how to tweak the deck for a stirring meta game, as my area has just started to get into Legacy.
    All I know is that people are going to be playing lots of combo and aggro decks, (no zoo)


    Love the fact I can order all the cards I need foil on SCG: $20-$40

    :D

  15. #175
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Hey,

    against aggro decks i suggest running
    Swords to plowshares
    Knight of the holy Nimbus
    Children of Korlis
    Big Game Hunter
    Aven Riftwatcher.
    If you have problems with the slots Aven Riftwatcher is the first i would cut. Children enables a Softlock against aggro decks and can suprise combo decks like storm and is also great against dredge. As mentioned above there seems to be a problem with the new Spiral Tide decks. I run 4 Spell pierce in my version, which has been great so far, but they are not that good against aggro decks.
    In the sideboard i suggest 1 Bound in Silence.

  16. #176
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Quote Originally Posted by Tree View Post
    Hello all,

    I read Indykid Vago report and was quite impressed with this deck.
    I missed out playing Rebels back in the day and I am really interested in playing this deck for my local area.


    My question is how to tweak the deck for a stirring meta game, as my area has just started to get into Legacy.
    All I know is that people are going to be playing lots of combo and aggro decks, (no zoo)


    Love the fact I can order all the cards I need foil on SCG: $20-$40

    :D
    I was planning on actually foiling out the creature base but a very good player told me that if all I had in my deck that was foil were all creatures then there would be a good chance that if I get deckchecked i'll get in trouble for cheating ? Long story short I chickened out on that idea after that .

    Beating aggro is more of a way you need to play your deck . If your up against something that is MDing 6 or more MD removal spells than it may be better to cast 2 searchers in one turn ; otherwise I would recommend holding as many cards as possible and using only those rebels that you need to drag the game to the state that you have enough mana to just alpha strike with Entity .

    Generally the more aggressive a deck is the harder it will be for a Rebel player to answer . Rebels can answer almost anything in the format given time . Its that last word that'll get you . Use your counters to live into the 4th turn . If you aren't able to search by that time you probably should have mulled that one .

    About your question regarding vs combo : personally I've found running a good Etutor SB package to be the best bet . Cards like Aura of Silence , Null Rod and Ethersworn Canonist do a great job . You could also add more copies of Childrens of Korlis to specifically fight ANT variations if you know they are plentiful in your meta .

    GL and let us know what happens .

    ---

    On another note , I started SBing out the 2nd Entity vs decks not running either Plow and/or Path in their list . I was wondering what everyone's Entity and Sivvi count was in their decks .

    I run 2 Sivvi & 1 Entity MD and an extra Entity in the board now , and added a MD Jitte since it's the card I was having the most problems with lately .

  17. #177
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    I run 2 Sivvi & 1 Entity MD and an extra Entity in the board now , and added a MD Jitte since it's the card I was having the most problems with lately .
    Funny! I run 2 Entity and 1 Sivvi MD and 1 extra Sivvi in the sideboard against removal heavy decks.
    The reason for this setup is that i want to make sure, that i can tutor entity up. It sucks if you have entity in your hand with no brainstorm. I'd like a second sivvi md too, but there is nothing i would put out for it :/.

    I want to play rebels at saturday again at our tournament. I'm looking forward to it!
    After many changes i made to my deck with the help of this thread i think it is quiet strong right now, but I'm still looking for a way to fight pithing needle. One other improvement i can think of is to increase the speed of the rebel engine without TG by one turn. I tried Chrome Mox. It's okay i guess, but i figured that the card disadvantage is sometimes really bad. So I'm not sure if this is right or not.

    What do you guys think about this?

  18. #178
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    I run 2 Entity and 2 Sivvi Main so I got a better Game 1 (not only G1) against aggro decks/decks with removal/Swords. We can't really win without Entity while facing a fast clock. (okay a few times via Aven Riftwatcher/Whipcorder/Children Of Korlis but takes time to set up)

    I have played the deck on the last 2 tournaments & my biggest problem was Team America/Junk decks with Pernicious Deed,E.Plague and such.
    Especially Team America was hard because they can counter your measures against such cards...besides heavy discard like junk has, too.
    Also Goblins is nearly unbeatable except you got a nice hand and they don't look for gempalm incinerators.

    question: Have you been in trouble pitching a blue card for Force Of Will? The blue count is not that high in our deck, I already thought about replacing my Forces with other Counters,Chrome Mox or Reverent Mantra...

    what do you think about a mana denial strategy with Stifle & Wasteland? Weathered Wayfarer should be a Rebel for real :DD

  19. #179
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    Pitching to FoW is hard i agree, but with the recent rise of combo decks i refuse to play a deck without FoW or a decent disruption. I run 19 blue cards. I'd like to run more, but finding room is the problem here.
    Interestingly i haven't had much problems with goblins, but it depends on their draw and if they can get a warchief in play.
    Pernicious Deed is a real threat, even E-Plague is usually game i think. I tried a Changeling Hero in my sideboard to bring back a searcher after sweeper effects and for beatdown, but i never used it.
    With the recent metagame shift, maybe it's time to reconsider Counterbalance/Top for the rebels again?

  20. #180
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    Re: Counter-Rebel Still

    ye I totally agree with you, my meta got infested with various combo decks,too.
    Changeling Hero seems decent with Lin Sivvi.
    yea! the next time I play Rebels again I probably won't leave home without CB/Top.

    Let's see! ;)

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