Is this Cycle of Cards broken?

[(nameless one)]

Alright guys...

For each month, my group's cube draft would replace a real card with a card that we made. One of the cards that we included was already asked for balance here. (Bloodline Cutter). Usually, it takes us a couple of test before we figure out if the card we designed is broken, playable or chaff.

Currently its my turn to provide a new card(s) and I have been assigned to create a cycle. I kinda stole the colourless idea from ROE. Anyways, heres my 'cycle'. I call them the "Answers":

'White' Answer (X)

Instant

Spend only white mana on X.

Put X 2/2 white Angel creature tokens with flying onto the battlefield. Exile them at the beginning of the next cleanup step.

'Blue' Answer (X)

Instant

Spend only blue mana on X.

Counter target spell unless its controller pays for each mana spent on ~.

'Black' Answer (X)

Instant

Spend only black mana on X.

Target creature gets -X/-X until the end of turn. You gain X life.

'Red' Answer (X)

Instant

Spend only red mana on X

~ deals X damage to each creature without flying and each player.

'Green' Answer (X)

Instant

Spend only green mana on X.

Search your library for a creature card with converted mana cost X or less and put that card onto the battlefield. Then shuffle your library.

Updated for the 3rd time. Just to let y'all know, I did intend for them to be 'colorless'.

Due to confusion and all those related shenanigans, instead of trying to 'fix' all or them at the same time, I will just work on White Answer. So please, we will move on once a final White Answer has been established.

Once again, thank you very much.

[lordofthepit]

Blue and black are too good, if I'm reading the black one correctly.

Blue is simply a more flexible Spell Pierce that hits everything. Reminds me too much of the original boons in that blue and black got the best part of the pie.

[rufus]

White, Red & Green ones are fine (the white one is weak). Blue one is OP, black one is gross.

[pi4meterftw]

The blue one just restricted to X=1 is already strictly better than force spike and spell pierce. It's most definitely better than spell snare, since spell pierce is better than spell snare. But then on top of already being strictly better, it's not even dead late game. The black one actually is only about 1 mana over-powered. For 1B, you better be able to destroy target creature, and for 1BB you should be able to punish people for overextending. For 1BBB you should be able to cast WOG. Each of these is slightly underpowered, but having choices probably would make it a balanced card.

If you're really afraid of it being OP, you could make it B extra instead of 1 extra. Another possibility is to keep the same cost and make up to X target creatures get -X/-X. This is probably a bit underpowered, but 2X would be OP, so you could probably do like -(X+1)/-(X+1)

[(nameless one)]

I have actually put the most thought on White, Blue and Black before I had these.

Originally, White redirected X damage. Would this be better or far too broken?

I am aware that the Blue one is essentially a free permission if the opponent taps out. If its too overpowered, would X=1 be better? Is it the 'free' clause thats making it overpowered?

On Black, it was originially supposed to be target player discards X cards. I thought that would be pretty broken (even if only black mana were to spend on it). Do you guys have any suggestions on what the 'Black Answer' should be? the casting cost has to be X and I wanna keep it as simple as possible.

[jrsthethird]

I have actually put the most thought on White, Blue and Black before I had these.

Originally, White redirected X damage. Would this be better or far too broken?

I am aware that the Blue one is essentially a free permission if the opponent taps out. If its too overpowered, would X=1 be better? Is it the 'free' clause thats making it overpowered?

On Black, it was originially supposed to be target player discards X cards. I thought that would be pretty broken (even if only black mana were to spend on it). Do you guys have any suggestions on what the 'Black Answer' should be? the casting cost has to be X and I wanna keep it as simple as possible.

Black could be a drain effect, -X/-X to a creature and gain X life. Like Consume Spirit but without the ability to hit players.

Blue at 1 for each mana spent on X seems weak. At 1, same as Force Spike, at 2, inferior Rune Snag, at 3, inferior Mana Leak, etc. At large X it's not even as good as Power Sink because it doesn't drain the rest of their mana for the turn. I would go with a Lethargy Trap effect: Creatures target player controls get -X/-0 until end of turn. That might be too weak for your purposes but it's a fair card. Either that or bounce target nonland permanent with CMC X.

White doing a Harm's Way/Refraction Trap seems good as long as you restrict it to only one source.

Green is weak, maybe a pump spell? Target creature gets +X/+X until end of turn? Dramatic Entrance is nice because you can cheat Progenitus or something, but if you have the mana to pay the mana cost, why waste a card to flash it in?

Red is fine.

[DukeDemonKn1ght]

The black one is busted and better than any removal black has ever gotten ever, the blue one is pretty overpowered (I'd put it at about as good as Mana Drain honestly), the red one is ok (I might play it but I wouldn't build around it), the white one is pretty frackin' weak (maybe be able to redirect X damage from any one source or gain X life? (maybe 2X life?)), and the green one is just completely terrible Timmy fodder (maybe search for a (green?) creature with CMC X or less and put it into play?)

[puppektion]

The black one is busted and better than any removal black has ever gotten ever

Actually, it very well could be *the* best removal ever. It would even trump swords to plowshares unless Indestructible becomes huge.
The blue one might be more fair at 1 for each blue, or if you can find a way to word it so its incremental (1 for the first [force spike], add 2 for the second [mana leak], add 3 for the third [cancel?], etc).

Green... well, I think to something like Thrive, only divided as you'd like.

[DukeDemonKn1ght]

Actually, it very well could be *the* best removal ever. It would even trump swords to plowshares unless Indestructible becomes huge.
The blue one might be more fair at 1 for each blue, or if you can find a way to word it so its incremental (1 for the first [force spike], add 2 for the second [mana leak], add 3 for the third [cancel?], etc).

Green... well, I think to something like Thrive, only divided as you'd like.

I agree with all this, except the blue one would suck ass at for each blue. I sort of gather that the whole vibe they're going for with these cards is pretty over-powered, since they want to use them for a Cube...

[(nameless one)]

The original White Answer was:

Spend only white mana on X.

The next X damage that a source of your choice would deal to you and/or permanents you control this turn is dealt to target creature or player instead.

Would this be okay for white?

Some say Blue Answer is weak at 1=1 so I will keep it at 1=2. After all, Spell Pierce was common and I am intending this cycle to be rare. I think the power of it lies at X=0. I am aware that it is essentially a free counterspell under the right circumstances. But I do see how it is overpowered as any deck can actually play it.

Originally, the Green Answer was:

Spend only green mana on X.

Search your library for a creature card with converted mana cost equal to X. Put that creature onto the battlefield. Then shuffle your library.

I was thinking that this would be overpowered, especially with Goyfs around.

I am still undecided with Black Answer. I was contemplating on random discard but it looks like it would be more powerful than Mind Twist. I actually like the Life Drain version since White will go back as redirecting damage. I was also considering tutor for card with X CC/lose X life.

[jrsthethird]

Some say Blue Answer is weak at 1=1 so I will keep it at 1=2. After all, Spell Pierce was common and I am intending this cycle to be rare. I think the power of it lies at X=0. I am aware that it is essentially a free counterspell under the right circumstances. But I do see how it is overpowered as any deck can actually play it.

X=0 does nothing. Your opponent always has the choice to pay 0 mana.

[(nameless one)]

LOL crap... you're right. I guess the Blue Answer is pretty balanced at 1=2 after all.

I am still thnking about the Black Answer.

Should I go:

'Black' Answer 2.1 (X)

Instant

Spend only black mana on X.

Target creature gets -X/-X until the end of turn. You gain X life.

'Black' Answer 2.2 (X)

Instant

Spend only black mana on X.

Each player lose X life and sacrifices X creatures.

or

'Black' Answer 2.3 (X)

Instant

Spend only black mana on X.

Target player discards X cards.

I wanna keep all answers as good as possible but not too broken. Also, I am trying to make so its 'Legacy' balanced.

EDIT: The White Answer on the OP has been updated.

[jrsthethird]

I like #2. The "balanced" effect is nice, has a build-around-me kind of feel. Innocent Blood at 1 mana, at 2 mana seems a lot better than Barter in Blood, but at 3 or more mana it's hard to abuse and is effectively Damnation.

[Penguinizer]

I also prefer the #2 version. #3 feels too strong for me though.

[Forbiddian]

Hmm, I like this cycle idea. X allows so much flexibility for the spell. In color with that is the kicker possibility.


White is pretty weak right now. Nobody plays the W, redirect 2 damage, I can't imagine it'd be much better if you had to pay WWW to get better.

Or perhaps a reference to Waylay/Crusade:

X, kicker W: put X 1/1 white human soldier creature tokens into play. Exile them at the beginning of the next end step.
If you paid the kicker cost, put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control.

For a pretty manageable WWWW, you can get the Waylay effect, but you can also put out blockers for cheaper and it provides a lot of flexible combat tricks, including a "crusade" for all creatures in play currently for just W.


Black:

#1 is too weak, and #s 2 and 3 are way too strong. #2 is a HUGE improvement on WoG, since your opponent can destroy all of your creatures for B each and he doesn't have to overpay (like sometimes you're stuck playing WoG against just one creature, or sometimes you're stuck with WoG in hand and you can't afford to play it as you get beat down). It's just incredibly flexible and difficult to play around.

It also leads to a boring turtle style of play. If you're playing limited, you want to use the red zone. Sitting on a guaranteed 2 or 3:1 with tempo provided that you don't do anything at all is just not a fun way to play the game.

XB Sorcery, Pay X life: Destroy X target creatures, spend only B mana on X.

Again, very strong, but it doesn't completely shut the game down with its flexibility and power. Depending on how your play group plays, it might need another condition (like remove X cards in your graveyard from the game).

For BB, it's basically a sorcery speed doom blade that hits black creatures. For BBB it becomes a very strong double removal spell. BBBB is quite hard to get, but can one-sided WoG your opponent at the cost of some life.



Blue: Way too broken at 2 mana per X.

At 1, it's a strictly better Force Spike and Spell Pierce that also turns into a hard Counterspell. Or another way of looking at it, it's a Counterspell that you can also play on turn 1.

If you're really set on countermagic, it could be balanced as:

X
Kicker 1
If you paid the kicker cost, opponent must pay 3X.

Then it becomes Force Spike, Mana Leak, then basically a hard counter for 1UU. Not the best countermagic at each tier, but very flexible as you can play it to counter early bombs AND it doesn't become dead lategame.



Red seems a little weak, when was the last time somebody played Fireball? It's also very hard to ramp to RRR or RRRR.

X instant, spend only red on X: Deal X damage to target creature. If you played it any time you could play a sorcery, deal X damage to target player.

This allows a bit more flexibility and power. It makes it really hurt if you can ramp to 4+. It gives red a fairly flexible removal spell and a big combination finisher.



Green:
X, instant, spend only green on X. Put X +1/+1 counters distributed any way you choose on creatures you control.

[Anusien]

They're not all the same power level. Fix that first. A good baseline is to look at them and figure out how many of them go into decks or compare them to existing cards at similar effects or mana costs.

It also helps to gauge them in a monocolored deck, because they don't have any drawbacks there.

[(nameless one)]

Cool. Thanks for the suggestions Forbiddian. I like some of your ideas but I would also like to keep the X cost. Just X, nothing more and nothing less.

I like your take on White Answer. Getting X 1/1 Weenies ala Waylay. As much as I like your design though, I did not wanna add the Kicker.

My main purpose with the blue one is essentially a flexible Counterspell. I am aware that in ways it is a better Spell Pierce. The whole cycle is Rare in rarity. That would be my justification on why this should be better than Spell Pierce.

I would like to keep the cycle as almost the same as possible. This is why I want to keep the Black Answer to be instant. I have been contemplating and since all other circumstances were way too powerful, I will keep the. Black one as:

Only spend black mana on X.

Target creature gets -X/-X until the end of turn. You gain X life.

I'll have to admit, the black one is really hard to design and I only have until next Friday for this 'Project'.

As you guys mentioned, Red Answer does feel weak. I was contemplating a new version at work. It looks like this:

Only spend red mana on X

~ deals X damage to each non-flying creatures and each player.

at , it rivals th common from Zendikar. At , it rivals Volcanic Fallout. At , it rivals Flamebreak. But is it too broken or just right for a rare?

Like the Blue Answer, I am also fine with the Green one. Originally though, it read like this:

Only spend green mana on X.

Search your library for a creature with converted mana cost of X or less. You may put that creature from your library into play then shuffle your library.

Basically, I wanted the idea of Flashing the creature into play but I think this version was too powerful. Would you ever consider this version?

Thank you guys for the help and ideas.

[Malchar]

You need to keep in mind how much card advantage you would get from playing each of these. For example, black gives you X-1 card advantage, whereas green gives you -1 card advantage.

White: This one is probably fine. If you wanted to pump it up a little bit, you could allow the damage to be divided among any number of targets.
Blue: Certainly fine as-is. At most, you only break even on card advantage. At X=2, it's strictly worse than Counterspell. At X=3, it's almost strictly worse than Cancel. It shines at X=1, but that's the amount which is easiest for your opponents to overcome.
Black: Much too powerful as is. You always at least break even on card advantage, plus you gain advantage for each X more than 1. If you pay 2, you get card advantage of 1, if you pay 3, you get 2, etc. It's much too powerful. A good compromise would be the "each player sacrifices X creatures".
Red: Probably fine, similar to the blue one where you can never make card advantage, but the effect seems strong enough.
Green: Easily the worst since it does basically nothing. Why would you use a card that just lets you play creatures when you can already do that on your own. Think of it this way, if you pay 5 and put in a creature that cost 5, all you did was throw away one card advantage from using the useless X spell. To be fair, it does turn green mana into mana of any color, but you can never play a creature that costs more than the amount of green mana you have. Even still, it's never worth 1 card advantage just to change the color of mana you already have. If you want to keep this kind of effect, give the card a self-cantrip and maybe just have it add X of any color, so you can combine it with other mana that you have available and play something bigger.

[(nameless one)]

I have updated White, Black and Green Answers.

How does it look now?

[Malchar]

They seem better now.
Technically, the blue one could say "Counter target spell unless its controller pays XX."
The red one seems a little underwhelming now, but I think it's within acceptable limits.