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Thread: [Deck] Elves Combo

  1. #2321
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Hi there. I've bought an Elfball deck recently, and tested it with some great results. I'd like to hear some opinion from experts in this archtype and maybe some advices.

    My list:

    Lands [17]
    14 Forest
    2 Gaea's Cradle
    1 Dryad Arbor

    Spells [8]
    4 Green Sun's Zenith
    4 Glimpse of Nature

    Dudes [35]
    4 Quirion Ranger
    4 Wirewood Symbiote
    4 Heritage Druid
    4 Nettle Sentinel
    4 Elvish Visionary
    4 Vengevine
    4 Fauna Shaman
    2 Fyndhorn Elves
    2 Llanowar Elves
    1 Regal Force
    1 Viridian Shaman
    1 Ezuri, Renegade Leader

    Sideboard [15]
    4 Thorn of Amethyst
    3 Choke
    3 Faerie Macabre
    2 Krosan Grip
    1 Scavenging Ooze
    1 Gaddock Teeg
    1 Phyrexian Metamorph

    Some explanations:
    -No Emrakul maindeck: This is a dead slot when you cannot combo, and Vengevines always get there.
    -Viridian Shaman over Viridian Zealot: ETB ability, which can be abused with Symbiote.
    -4 Vengevine and 4 Fauna Shaman maindeck: If Fauna Shaman lives until she can tap, you'll see that angry plants are coming with anger.
    -No Natural Order/Progenitus sideboard: not really necessary in this metagame.
    -Faerie Macabre/Gaddock Teeg/Phyrexian Metamorph: all fetchable with Fauna Shaman.
    -Only 2 Gaea's Cradle maindeck: I've tested from 0-4 in numbers, 0 sucks, and 4 your mulligans are very common. So I've settled in 2, which seems to be a good number.
    Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return

  2. #2322

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    I don't recall the last time Emrakul was a dead slot when I couldn't combo--in fact, with the list I'm using now it's either: a) combo and win, b) don't combo and aggro out, c) don't combo, produce 15 mana anyways and play him from my hand / produce 18 mana and pact for empath then play him / produce 19 mana and GSZ for empath and play him.

    The last tournament I went to I tied for second going 3-1, only losing to flashless hulk combo (we meet every tournament, he was super prepared for me, I had shitty draws). The number of times I could just produce 15-20 mana and go off was many. I top decked Emrakul in at least 3 or 4 of the 9 games played and was able to hard cast him every time.

    Fierce Empath is absurdly good.

    In regards to your deck, you should fit Summoner's Pact in there, I suppose it's not quite as useful to you if you aren't trying to find combo pieces to ramp out on mana. However, pacting for a much needed symbiote can be game changing.

  3. #2323
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    What's your list looking like, Kich? I'm wondering.
    Quote Originally Posted by ktkenshinx View Post
    The Reserved List is a) not legally binding, b) antiquated, c) broken, and d) preventative of maximum game enjoyment. Wizards will remove as many cards from that list as possible to increase the fun of their game. Using market research, they can find a balance between printing enough cards to lower a price from $40 to $15-$20, and not utterly ruining their value. This will be both an economically feasible AND sensible move.
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  4. #2324

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by bakofried View Post
    What's your list looking like, Kich? I'm wondering.
    I'll have to look at it again, it's something like this though:

    //Creatures:
    4x Heritage Druid
    4x Nettle Sentinel
    4x Llanowar Elves
    3x Birchlore Rangers
    4x Wirewood Symbiote
    2x Quirion Ranger
    3x Elvish Visionary
    3x Priest of Titania
    1x Elvish Archdruid
    2x Fyndhorn Elves
    1x Fierce Empath
    1x Regal Force
    1x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn

    //Spells:
    4x Glimpse of Nature
    4x Green Sun's Zenith
    4x Summoner's Pact

    //Lands:
    1x Gaea's Cradle
    14x Forest


    mm.. that should be 60, yeah. That's my list atm. I wouldn't mind going G/W for mirror entity, but, so far I don't see a super need to.

  5. #2325
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Vandalize View Post
    Hi there. I've bought an Elfball deck recently, and tested it with some great results. I'd like to hear some opinion.
    Your lists seems to have the ability to fall heavily on the aggro plan when the combo just won't happen, which is quite often in the current metagame.

    I would definitely suggest you to fit in Mirror Entity. Taking in account that he's fetchable through your Faunas and that you are running 4x Vengevines which he can pump, and has the Symbiote infinite loop, he's the best pump you could run.
    You would have to run Fetchlands and Savannah or Birchlore Rangers. If you aren't a Duals fan (with Canadian unleashed all over), I would take out 1Arbor, 1Quirion and 1Visionary or Fauna to make room for 3 Birchlore.

    I must say that I can't see why people run Dryad. When I tested it, I always regretted having spend Zenith on it, becausef the sorcery is such an important piece to set the combo or to find an answer that wasting it on mana acceleration just seems absurd.



    Quote Originally Posted by Kich867 View Post
    I don't recall the last time Emrakul was a dead slot when I couldn't combo.
    Most lists don't have the ease that yours has in producing 15 mana. That's what we always mean by saying that it is a dead card, because if our lists have 15 mana floating in the pool then we've already comboed out anyway. So Emrakul becomes an win-more card, which is dead if we haven't already won.
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  6. #2326

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    I know I'm stating the obvious, but Empath grabs Regal Force, too...that's kind of hawt tech, my friend. I've been fiddling around with a singleton Weird Harvest lately, and this seems like a potential upgrade.
    weird harvest creates awkward siutations where they get snapcaster mage and kill you. just stopping by to mention that.

  7. #2327

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    I'm finally going to be able to play again over this holiday break and I have a quick question. Is regal force optimally a one of now? Some months ago I remember him getting quite a bit of love as a 2 of because there were many times where you needed the second one. Has playtesting shown the costs outweigh the benefits of the second one?

  8. #2328
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by sdefreit8 View Post
    I'm finally going to be able to play again over this holiday break and I have a quick question. Is regal force optimally a one of now? Some months ago I remember him getting quite a bit of love as a 2 of because there were many times where you needed the second one. Has playtesting shown the costs outweigh the benefits of the second one?
    The deck definitely wants at least one, and sometimes wants two. It depends on the specific build. Versions that play more Archdruids and/or Mirror Entity and/or Vengevine maindeck can usually be OK with just one.
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  9. #2329

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by rukcus View Post
    The deck definitely wants at least one, and sometimes wants two. It depends on the specific build. Versions that play more Archdruids and/or Mirror Entity and/or Vengevine maindeck can usually be OK with just one.
    Aww yes that makes sense. Well I'll probably stick with two since I'm running a more pre-VV list.

  10. #2330
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Branches View Post
    weird harvest creates awkward siutations where they get snapcaster mage and kill you. just stopping by to mention that.
    Yeah...testing was abysmal!!

    Is anybody still using a 1-shot of Joraga Warcaller in their MD? I have gotten to the point of having 4 Archdruids and 3 Priest of Titania in the deck (I have already pushed out Birchlore Rangers...they went from 4 down to 3, down to 2, then gone) and I'm running out of space considering I want to keep the 1-mana elves at a premium to make sure Glimpse does its job. The Archdruids/Priests give you an incredible amount of consistency though...I've gotten Emrakul turn 3 many times with no Glimpse.

    Current List:

    4x Heritage Druid
    4x Nettle Sentinel
    4x Llanowar Elves
    3x Fyndhorn Elves
    4x Quirion Ranger
    4x Wirewood Symbiote
    4x Elvish Archdruid
    3x Priest of Titania
    4x Elvish Visionary
    1x Regal Force
    1x Joraga Warcaller
    1x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    4x Glimpse of Nature
    4x Summoner's Pact
    8x Forest
    1x Overgrown Tomb
    4x Verdant Catacombs
    1x Wooded Foothills
    1x Wirewood Lodge

    Sideboard:
    4x Buried Alive
    3x Vengevine
    4x Thorn of Amethyst
    2x Viridan Zealot
    2x Autumn's Veil





    So for discussion's sake, understanding the budget nature of my list, here are my questions:

    1) What is the appropriate number of Quirion Ranger?

    2) Wirewood Symbiote?

    3) Are Birchlore Rangers neccessary?

    4) I will be upgrading the list to add in 3x Green Sun's Zenith. What should I cut to make room?
    Brainstorm Realist

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  11. #2331

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Rangers, I say 2. Symbiotes, 4--this is unavoidable. They are too good. IMO--Birchlore's are necessary. A 3 of is fine. They allow you to squeeze extra mana out of dudes you normally wouldn't. I rarely get turn 2 wins, but I have, and they're amazing.

    Lords I found to feel consistent but in actual practice make the deck highly prone to removal moreso than it already is. Lords are easy to target, they're frequently removed and if you rely on them it's too easy to get wrecked. Aim more for birchlore rangers and heritage druids, it's more tedious, but it's easier to use them than it is a lord for mana.

    I've often had games with only a gaea's cradle and a fistful of elves, pseudo-heritage nettle combo up to about 8 mana, tap cradle and hardcast emrakul from my hand. No mana lords (cradle I guess can be considered one), just tapping and untapping nettles with heritage/birchlore activations.

    The more 1 mana elves you can play that further the purpose of the deck the better. The fewer lords you can play, the better (especially archdruid, he's an enormous mana sink).

  12. #2332
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    I like the Archdruids for the aggro secondary win/con...I think I have to keep them in here. The swap would have to be putting in 3 Birchlores in the Priest of Titania slots. Is that what you're recommending?

    Oh, and what do I cut to make room for GSZ? Summoner's Pact?

    BTW, I'm working on getting the Gaea's Cradles...they can be somewhat hard to trade around for.
    Brainstorm Realist

    I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner

  13. #2333

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    How about Cabal Therapy In This deck?, Sorry If It Was Discussed Before, I used to watch list that included many, but not lately ...

    Do not work as expected?

    (sorry for my google-translate-english)

  14. #2334

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    I like the Archdruids for the aggro secondary win/con...I think I have to keep them in here. The swap would have to be putting in 3 Birchlores in the Priest of Titania slots. Is that what you're recommending?

    Oh, and what do I cut to make room for GSZ? Summoner's Pact?

    BTW, I'm working on getting the Gaea's Cradles...they can be somewhat hard to trade around for.
    Priests of titania >>>>>>>> Archdruid.

    GSZ and Pact are run together, not one or the other. You need to drop something else for them, I posted my list earlier--I've had tremendous success in my meta with it, you can see how I make room for them there.

  15. #2335
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    Yeah...testing was abysmal!!

    Is anybody still using a 1-shot of Joraga Warcaller in their MD? I have gotten to the point of having 4 Archdruids and 3 Priest of Titania in the deck (I have already pushed out Birchlore Rangers...they went from 4 down to 3, down to 2, then gone) and I'm running out of space considering I want to keep the 1-mana elves at a premium to make sure Glimpse does its job. The Archdruids/Priests give you an incredible amount of consistency though...I've gotten Emrakul turn 3 many times with no Glimpse.

    Current List:

    4x Heritage Druid
    4x Nettle Sentinel
    4x Llanowar Elves
    3x Fyndhorn Elves
    4x Quirion Ranger
    4x Wirewood Symbiote
    4x Elvish Archdruid
    3x Priest of Titania
    4x Elvish Visionary
    1x Regal Force
    1x Joraga Warcaller
    1x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    4x Glimpse of Nature
    4x Summoner's Pact
    8x Forest
    1x Overgrown Tomb
    4x Verdant Catacombs
    1x Wooded Foothills
    1x Wirewood Lodge

    Sideboard:
    4x Buried Alive
    3x Vengevine
    4x Thorn of Amethyst
    2x Viridan Zealot
    2x Autumn's Veil





    So for discussion's sake, understanding the budget nature of my list, here are my questions:

    1) What is the appropriate number of Quirion Ranger?

    2) Wirewood Symbiote?

    3) Are Birchlore Rangers neccessary?

    4) I will be upgrading the list to add in 3x Green Sun's Zenith. What should I cut to make room?
    Without Gaea's Cradle is viable the Vengevine plan?

    I use to have 3 Elvish Archdruid and 3 Priest of Titania but they were removal targets in almost games and i decide to cut them off and only left 2 Priest in MD. With Green Sun's Zenith you can search them in turn 2 if you need it. You can try -4 Elvish Archdruid --> +4 Green Sun's Zenith. (I'm from Argentina so sorry for my poor English)

  16. #2336

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    I played the list under at a local 20 man tournament to a 7-1 record(counting 5 rounds + top 8):

    2 Gaea's Cradle
    4 Misty Rainforest
    4 Forest
    1 Dryad Arbor
    1 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Bayou
    2 Wooded Foothills
    1 Windswept Heath

    2 Priest of Titania
    4 Elvish Visionary
    3 Llanowar Elves
    1 Elvish Archdruid
    4 Heritage Druid
    4 Nettle Sentinel
    4 Wirewood Symbiote
    2 Quirion Ranger
    2 Regal Force
    2 Birchlore Rangers
    1 Fyndhorn Elves
    1 Viridian Shaman
    1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn

    4 Glimpse of Nature
    4 Green Sun's Zenith
    4 Summoner's Pact

    Sideboard:
    2 Tormod's Crypt
    2 Krosan Grip
    3 Thorn of Amethyst
    3 Vengevine
    3 Buried Alive
    1 Choke
    1 Mortarpod

    I like the maindeck a lot. Lords do draw spot removal and it might have been correct to go -1 priest of titania +1 quirion ranger, however they did lead to a lot of hardcast emrakulks when i was not able to combo (having my draw spells countered or just drawing emrakul instead). With 2 Regal Forces, Fierce Empath should never be necesarry, but there were loads of cases where Fierce Empath would not have been enough and i was really happy with 2 Regal Forces all day. I would want more chokes in the sb, as it is just so good against such a large porition of the metagame, but not sure what i want to cut. All the sb cards were awesome with mortarpod giving me outs to blazing archon out of dredge(as well as stopping bridges), with it, you are probably a favourite even before counting crypts. Krosan Grip never feels amazing, but there needs to be some outs to stuff like coutnerbalance. I played against dredge, mono black, storm(lost), hivemind, UW stoneforge and in the top 8 4 color counterbalance(with firespout and punishing fire), UR delver and finally storm again. Faeries macabre is probably better than crypt as Reanimator should be a harder matchup than dredge. If storm is to be a good matchup a lot more hate is needed, but that depends on your metagame. The vengevine plan is very good against counterbalance/decks with a lot of removal, but it does take up a lot of space, it is possible just playing more chokes and devoting the space for other cards would be more effecient.

  17. #2337

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Olivier Pamart made 1st @ Magic Bazaar League (Paris) 71 players

    Surprising that he made 1st with such tough MUs in the top4. His SB is definitely interesting... Is NO a game-changer vs Reanimator? Haven't tested yet, but looking forward to!

    Pamart's list: http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=2368

    MD:
    12 Forest
    4 Gaea's Cradle
    1 Dryad Arbor

    4 Heritage Druid
    4 Wirewood Symbiote
    4 Vengevine
    4 Quirion Ranger
    4 Nettle Sentinel
    4 Fauna Shaman
    4 Elvish Visionary
    2 Llanowar Elves
    2 Fyndhorn Elves
    1 Regal Force
    1 Viridian Shaman
    1 Joraga Warcaller

    4 Green Sun's Zenith
    4 Glimpse of Nature


    SB:
    3 Dismember
    1 Progenitus
    3 Scavenging Ooze
    4 Carpet of Flowers
    4 Natural Order

  18. #2338
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Godmode View Post
    Olivier Pamart made 1st @ Magic Bazaar League (Paris) 71 players

    Surprising that he made 1st with such tough MUs in the top4. His SB is definitely interesting... Is NO a game-changer vs Reanimator? Haven't tested yet, but looking forward to!

    Pamart's list: http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=2368

    MD:
    12 Forest
    4 Gaea's Cradle
    1 Dryad Arbor

    4 Heritage Druid
    4 Wirewood Symbiote
    4 Vengevine
    4 Quirion Ranger
    4 Nettle Sentinel
    4 Fauna Shaman
    4 Elvish Visionary
    2 Llanowar Elves
    2 Fyndhorn Elves
    1 Regal Force
    1 Viridian Shaman
    1 Joraga Warcaller

    4 Green Sun's Zenith
    4 Glimpse of Nature


    SB:
    3 Dismember
    1 Progenitus
    3 Scavenging Ooze
    4 Carpet of Flowers
    4 Natural Order
    Four Vengevines and Fauna Shamans main deck is SUCH A BEATING against those tempo decks that are having success today. Vengevine is so good. Hits hard and fast enough.

    I think this approach is better in the new metagame, full of removal and counterspells. The list is far more solid, as it doesn't depend on Glimpse of Nature that much. Casting Emrakul is cute, but Quirion Ranger + Fauna Shaman + Wyrewood Symbiote is so powerful. You guys should give it a try.
    Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return

  19. #2339

    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Carpet of Flowers looks interesting in this Stoneblade meta, NO+Prog is definitely nasty against Punishing Maverick type decks, but 3 Ooze looks little protection vs Reanimator. I mean Elves can go off on turn 3 easily, but Iona/Elesh turn 2 is also too fast for us. Maybe NO+Prog in the Reanimator MU? They can't do shit about it and puts a 2 turn clock and looks like the only way to survive after Elesh hits the board..

  20. #2340
    Stomping blue decks with "dead" decks, as usual.
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    Re: [Deck] Elves Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Godmode View Post
    Carpet of Flowers looks interesting in this Stoneblade meta, NO+Prog is definitely nasty against Punishing Maverick type decks, but 3 Ooze looks little protection vs Reanimator. I mean Elves can go off on turn 3 easily, but Iona/Elesh turn 2 is also too fast for us. Maybe NO+Prog in the Reanimator MU? They can't do shit about it and puts a 2 turn clock and looks like the only way to survive after Elesh hits the board..
    Perhaps, the best hate avaliable for Fauna Shaman builds is Faerie Macabre. Tutorable, and can delay Reanimator for a while.
    Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return

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