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Thread: [Deck] The Rock

  1. #6781
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    These lists play a max of 16 creatures. How do you think this is going to work? In the top 6 cards there'll be an average of roughly 1,5 creature. And I'm not even starting on the opportunity cost.

    Collected Company just isn't a Legacy card.

  2. #6782

    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by Seraphix View Post
    Well yes, I was playing Souls. While I don't have a lot of experience with it in Legacy, it just seems underwhelming in a lot of other matchups. I'd be happy to be wrong about this though.
    Lingering Souls IS underwhelming in many match-ups, but it's so good against Miracles that it can be worth running. If you're not running Teegs and/or GSZ somewhere, Lingering Souls is about the best maindeck hedge card against Miracles.

  3. #6783

    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    It also doesn't seem half bad against a Delver, or at chump blocking a Goyf. And it can make you race with evasive beaters out of nowhere.

  4. #6784
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    I played in a local weekly yesterday, 9 players, and went undefeated. They let anyone enter with any deck so I do run into new kids occasionally.

    R1- mono-red newb deck, 80+ cards no sideboard. I goldfished for 2 wins and under 20 minutes reported in. I tried to bestow a little wisdom about magic, land count, and the legacy format.
    R2- ANT- Game one has me landing a Bob who feeds me scullers and thoughtseizes. It takes a bit but get there with him having only mana available. Game 2 I get pyroclasmed on turn three that wipes out a deathrite and bob. T4 double LED into infernal for pif kills me deader than dead. G3 I mull to 5 and put all hope in a sculler, bob, and 3 lands. He probe/therapies me and takes sculler. Bob draws HOT and feeds me what seems like endless thoughtseizes. I get there on turn 10 or so after he grapeshoots my scooze but liliana lives and wins it for me.
    R3- bant stoneblade- Two grindy games that I can't remember half of, but Library in both games is key. My sideboard is really well suited to beating fair decks. Fun magic, scooze and jitte were mvps.
    R4- CHESTER (rip, helm, energy field deck) its getting late so I don't remember a lot of details, but discard wins game one and matching each rip with a decay g2 was sweet. Both games he lands a true name and I have liliana active. G2 he has one card in hand (helm) and I topdeck liliana from Library. Close shave, but seriously, library is the nuts.

    List:
    Drop a Deuce (2 slot is a bit backed up. ..)
    4x deathrite
    4x dark confidant
    4x tarmogoyf
    3x stoneforge
    3x sculler
    4x thoughtseize
    2x inquisition of kozilek
    4x swords to plowshares
    3x abrupt decay
    1x vindicate
    2x liliana
    1x bskull
    1x jitte
    2x library
    4x verdant
    1x windswept heath
    1x marsh flats
    1x misty rainforest
    2x scrubland
    1x bayou
    1x temple garden
    1x overgrown tomb
    2x swamp
    1x forest
    1x plains
    1x treetop village
    1x volraths stronghold
    3x wasteland

    Sideboard
    2x scavenging ooze
    2x surgical extraction
    2x lingering souls
    2x zealous persecution
    1x pithing needle
    1x pernicious deed
    1x gaddock teeg
    2x choke
    2x kor firewalker

    Not a lot of tier deck action, but the games were interactive and skill testing (beyond r1.) Deck felt strong in a vacuum. I felt that inquisition was lackluster, sculler is a better additional targeted hate. I didn't draw many goyfs but whenever I did I was relieved to have a fast clock to finish games. I liked souls in the board and sculler main, just not sure what to replace it with. For curves sale it should be a one drop or three drop, preferably a 1 drop. Thinking green suns zenith for one of them and maybe a third liliana. Suggestions welcome.

    Not a significant report by any means, but a fun day and I wanted to share. Going undefeated feels good, even if it is like playing basketball with midgets (in some matchups.) Got store credit for the record, nabbed a couple mm15 boosters and got an Iona, a Dark Confidant, and a foil Midnight Banshee (oooooh...)
    Brainstorm Realist

    I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner

  5. #6785
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Awesome!

    I hVe been dabbling with other decks but GBw has always been in my heart. I know that we are never twit 1 so we are allowed to throw out crazy ideas whenever we want, check this out.

    4 deathrite shaman
    4 hypnotic specter
    4 dark confidant
    1 scavenging ooze
    1 gaddock teeg
    1 courser of kruphix
    1 pridemage

    4 thoughtsieze
    4 hymn to tourach
    4 green suns zenith
    4 Lilliana of the veil
    4 abrupt decay
    3 tops

    21 lands

    12 turn 1 plays
    8 turn 2 3 drops that have to be answered no matter what.

    I think hypnotic specter might be good intodays meta, bonus is she blocks delver for days!
    "eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"

  6. #6786
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by lavafrogg View Post
    I think hypnotic specter might be good intodays meta, bonus is she blocks delver for days!
    Hippy blocks Delver once. And dies to Bolt, AD & StP.

  7. #6787
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    In a meta where people race to fill their graves for Dig Through Time I dont see the appeal of Hypnotic Specter.

  8. #6788
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by dsck View Post
    In a meta where people race to fill their graves for Dig Through Time I dont see the appeal of Hypnotic Specter.
    Gaddock teeg is to shut down dig through time, turn 2 hippie is what I will be testing.
    "eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"

  9. #6789
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by dsck View Post
    In a meta where people race to fill their graves for Dig Through Time I dont see the appeal of Hypnotic Specter.
    This has me wondering about maindeck scooze. Deathrite is good, but not a hoser like scooze. I feel that death and taxes along with deadguy ale are well placed by using rip in the board. I agree, hyppie is not the powerhouse it used to be. Lingering souls is much better for three and dig is a big reason why sculler is good now due to the exile effect. I don't think hyppie even sees play in the gate or evagreen anymore.
    Brainstorm Realist

    I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner

  10. #6790
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    This has me wondering about maindeck scooze. Deathrite is good, but not a hoser like scooze. I feel that death and taxes along with deadguy ale are well placed by using rip in the board. I agree, hyppie is not the powerhouse it used to be. Lingering souls is much better for three and dig is a big reason why sculler is good now due to the exile effect. I don't think hyppie even sees play in the gate or evagreen anymore.
    And I don't think The gate or Eva Green are "living" decks anymore.
    I hear they got twisters miles wide in the Midwest.

  11. #6791
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    But has anyone actually cast a specter off of a deathrite shaman?

    BG decks have been struggling with ways to keep pressure on and specters will do that. Early discard into specter/dark confidant with GSZ into teeg or scavenging ooze to lock out the DTT/graveyard engines. I imagine a Liliana or two would also be in the list to toss dead discard and to limit the opponents options.
    "eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"

  12. #6792
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by lavafrogg View Post
    But has anyone actually cast a specter off of a deathrite shaman?

    BG decks have been struggling with ways to keep pressure on and specters will do that. Early discard into specter/dark confidant with GSZ into teeg or scavenging ooze to lock out the DTT/graveyard engines. I imagine a Liliana or two would also be in the list to toss dead discard and to limit the opponents options.
    Try again whilst taking your opponents' plan into account. Your T1 DRS is very much a lightning rod for removal, for instance. That means that you'll drop your Specter T3 (whilst risking a Daze in the face), which means it'll attack no sooner than T4. In the meantime your opponent is setting up the CounterTop-lock or just combos out by the time you make your first swing.

    I reckon you get where I'm going with this?

  13. #6793
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by lavafrogg View Post
    But has anyone actually cast a specter off of a deathrite shaman?

    BG decks have been struggling with ways to keep pressure on and specters will do that. Early discard into specter/dark confidant with GSZ into teeg or scavenging ooze to lock out the DTT/graveyard engines. I imagine a Liliana or two would also be in the list to toss dead discard and to limit the opponents options.
    Ideas seem to only get scrutinized anymore Stray from the path and this forum is not really much help. Give hippie a comeback shot. What's the worst that could happen?

    My 2-cents:
    -I never added it to the deck because it didn't come down fast enough, even when I had diamonds in my list.
    -Liliana was printed when I wanted to contain hand sizes. I knew it was random vs choice but Liliana gave me removal as well.
    -Magical X-mas land does happen. Sometimes Santa comes. Sometimes, Krampus comes. Try not to tint your opinion based on a couple of games.
    -Most things that say destroy, exile, or damage kill creatures. So, don't care about the removal aspect. At least it's terror proof.

    Good luck on your testing. I hope it turns out as well as mine (again own a sapphire).
    Tinkering with some crafting theory. Here

  14. #6794
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by damionblackgear View Post
    Ideas seem to only get scrutinized anymore Stray from the path and this forum is not really much help.
    And responding to every idea with "yeah, that's the most amazing thing ever" is? Contemplate a bit more on why so many ideas are shot down, will you. You're kinda like the guy expecting a standing ovation from all Elves! players when he suggested Elves! should drop Glimpse of Nature and Natural Order for Collected Company and Ezuri. Without making the effort to explain why this would be a wonderful change, mind you.

  15. #6795
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Has anyone else tried different things lately? I seems like everyone's having less than stellar results with the standard builds. Or they're playing other decks almost exclusively. I'm using a modified version of the Mikokoru list I posted a couple pages ago. I'm enjoying the current iteration and have turned out to have pretty good results with it but understand that people don't want to use Mikokoro.

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    And responding to every idea with "yeah, that's the most amazing thing ever" is? Contemplate a bit more on why so many ideas are shot down, will you. You're kinda like the guy expecting a standing ovation from all Elves! players when he suggested Elves! should drop Glimpse of Nature and Natural Order for Collected Company and Ezuri. Without making the effort to explain why this would be a wonderful change, mind you.
    That looks to be intended as an exceptionally hurt response. My inbox has been feeling pretty neglected lately. You're welcome to continue your rant there.

    On a sidenote, it is funny though because I am That Guy you mentioned, except that added part about not explaining things. It's even funnier if you know who I am. You have definitely never read my any posts. I'm big on theory behind my choices.
    Tinkering with some crafting theory. Here

  16. #6796
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    My version was doing pretty well last time I played it, but Legacy has kinda died out around here and I haven't played in over a month.
    I think the biggest thing is the deep seeded emotional understanding that the right play is the right play regardless of outcomes. The ability to make a decision 5 straight times, lose 5 times because of it, and still make it the 6th time if it's the right play. - Jon Finkel

    "Notions of chance and fate are the preoccupation of men engaged in rash undertakings."

  17. #6797

    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by damionblackgear View Post
    Has anyone else tried different things lately?
    Try different things? What are you talking about? That's heresy! Drink the kool-aid, fly under the radar and none of this "thinking outside of the box" nonsense. Suggesting an original idea and asking for constructive criticism is not allowed here.

    ;-)

  18. #6798
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Thanks for the support/comments?

    The logic behind the specter is that we need continuous pressure on multiple fronts to be able to compete with all of the strategies currently in legacy. The core is bob/specter/Liliana to provide CA wity GSZ as support to the core.

    Currently I am trying to decide if I want to abuse Lilliana more than just with top and confidant Lingering souls/loam are options at this point.
    "eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"

  19. #6799
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    I believe the best way to pressure the format is to have disruption on curve (thoughtseize into sculler into liliana) or to disrupt and then start racing. I like hyppie a lot, and I also like vampire nighthawk. And kitchen finks. And knight of the reliquary. However, there is only so much room to include utility creatures that you have to wait on. Some are obviously worth it like deathrite and confidant. Hyppie doesn't provide immediate value like sculler, hymn, or liliana. Long story short (too late I know): if your opponent can't deal with hypnotic specter they likely wouldn't be able to deal with a follow up goyf, souls, sculler, or liliana either.

    Lavafrogg, how do you feel about cutting white and getting more aggressive? I think hyppie lends itself to that approach very well. It makes for a strategy that wants its threats to pull double duty rather than simply being the best at what it does. I think cutting some number of targeted discard or hymns for hyypie is a decent approach, I would think you'd eventually get to evagreen though. You're talking pressure and tempo over strict card advantage or good-stuff value. I hope you'll keep us posted on testing results.

    I am however full aboard the Sylvan Library train. I would rather have focused, immediate value cards and ways to draw more of them or filter into them. Debating a 3rd or even something like Sign in Blood. The ability to hit a critical mass of threats and disruption is what sets it apart from other decks in my humble opinion.
    Brainstorm Realist

    I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner

  20. #6800
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    Re: [Deck] The Rock

    Quote Originally Posted by lavafrogg View Post
    Thanks for the support/comments?

    The logic behind the specter is that we need continuous pressure on multiple fronts to be able to compete with all of the strategies currently in legacy. The core is bob/specter/Liliana to provide CA wity GSZ as support to the core.

    Currently I am trying to decide if I want to abuse Lilliana more than just with top and confidant Lingering souls/loam are options at this point.
    For a little while I was using Exile into Darkness to help make Liliana less symmetrical. Early game it comes back, most times, but it also got eaten by about twice as many Deathrite as it got a chance to take out. I've got it cut right now though. Testing out a singleton Hymn to pair with act as a third to Gerrard's Verdict current in board. It wasn't bad if you saw it in your opener but the combo/control matches were more relevant in my area. I, at max, had two but preferred it to act as Diabolic Edict 3. At it was a extremely over-costed for legacy. It did allow you to use Liliana without hurting your hand after the first recursion.
    Tinkering with some crafting theory. Here

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