Been brewing with new recruiter in this sort of build. It's probably bad. I also want to capitalize on how brutal Thalia is with wasteland
4 Deathrite Shaman
2 Noble Hierarch
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Dark Confidant
2 Shriekmaw
3 Recruiter of the Guard
4 Thoughtseize
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Swords To Plowshares
3 Life from the Loam
2 Reanimate
2 Liliana of the Veil
1 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Bayou
2 Savannah
1 Scrubland
1 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Plains
4 Wasteland
1 Karakas
Originally Posted by Richard Cheese
Looks a cool variant.
Let us know how it goes.
It is brutal against many decks. I played against Death & Texax and he wasted my fetch lands, plus port and vial.... no chances :((((
Honeslty I noticed Death & Texas much more improved with the new cards, and "the Rock" has even fewer chances now to beat it.
I appreciate your new brew because the deck must have new strategies in order to make a difference: as said erlier, other decks are evolving, our is stuck unless we find a new configuration.
Let us know the results!
I tried some new configuration too taking example from Megadeus.
The list is similar to an Aggro Loam without Punishing and red base. I try to play around 4 Chalice and 2 Prelator.
Knight, Lilly and Dark Depths try to make the game.
I am making some tests with some good results and I just updated the side to be more competitve vs Miracle.
4 Wasteland
2 Windswept Heath
1 Swamp
2 Scrubland
2 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
1 Forest
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Plains
3 Bayou
4 Dark Confidant
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Karakas
2 Sylvan Library
3 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Mox Diamond
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Liliana of the Veil
1 Life from the Loam
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Lingering Souls
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Dark Depths
1 Maze of Ith
1 Tranquil Thicket
1 Horizon Canopy
2 Sanctum Prelate
SB: 2 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 2 Toxic Deluge
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1 Abrupt Decay
SB: 1 Zealous Persecution
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage
SB: 1 Chains of Mephistopheles
SB: 3 Leyline of the Void
SB: 1 Thrun, the Last Troll
SB: 1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
SB: 1 Null Rod
What do you think guys?
Null Rod seems bad with your 4 Mox Diamond -- should switch that to Pithing Needle probably
i went 2-3 with this deck, on a legacy side event, Nov 27 Gold rush manila
27 players.
started out well, and just went down hill
MAIN
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Bayou
1 Savannah
2 Scrubland
2 Marsh Flats
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Windswept Heath
1 Karakas
4 Wasteland
3 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Tarmogoyf
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Spirit of the Labyrinth
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
3 Swords to Plowshares
4 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Mirri's Guile
1 Sylvan Library
SIDEBOARD
2 Pithing Needle
1 Choke
1 Krosan Grip
1 Engineered Plague
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Massacre
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Containment Priest
1 Enlightened Tutor
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Gaddock Teeg
2-0
Dredge
went well.
DRS was a star.
2-0
Storm belcher
game 1- inqui T1 was great.
spirit of the lab shined here
game 2- almost died to belcher. taiga just revelaed itself on the 4rth card.
then top decked a pithing needle. then all the hate just started coming out.
teeg, cannonist, spirit
0-2
Eldrazi
Game 1- the power of thought knot...
cant recover from a t2 thought knot
game 2- gambled for a 1 land play since i have a guile at hand
my guile hates me hahaha
0-2
DNT
game 1- prelate killed my removal.
game 2- we both started bad. both mana screwed at the begining.
3 ports no plains, good thing my pithing came out early.
he got the advantage with the jailer. massacred and toxic del him. wasn't able to hit him to get the monarch status...
0-2
Omnitell
nothing much to say here,
wasn't expecting a win hehe
Hey guys,
So i put this together on modo because I wanted to grind and play choke.
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Dark Confidant
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Knight of the Reliquary (could be lingering souls or maybe even siege rhino or goyf)
4 Thoughtseize
3 Hymn to Tourach
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Sylvan Library
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Scrubland
2 Bayou
1 Savannah
1 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Karakas
4 Marsh Flats
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Windswept Heath
3 Wasteland
Sideboard
2 Choke
1 Krosan Grip
2 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Zealous Persecution
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Pithing Needle
1 Garruk Relentless
I tested the list a little bit vs Miracles and the post board games seem quite favorable with 2 Choke, 2 Thalia, 1 Pithing, 1 Garruk, 1 Krosan Grip
(I take out 4 Swords to Plowshares, 2 Thoughtseize, 1 Hymn, or sometimes just 4 Swords 3 Thoughtseize).
The eldrazi matchup has been pretty favorable with SFM + Knight and Swords to Plowshares (one reason I am playing this over Jund). I like Knight better than Goyf right now because of the prevalence of reanimator, where grabbing a karakas is clutch.
I will try a few leagues soon and post my results. Hoping to revive this archetype a bit, I think junk is better than jund right now (but possibly worse than shardless, time will tell).
Your build bends over to gy hate. I actually moved away from junk because of all the RIP I played against. Goyf, DRS, KotR all just suck when one is down. You can play through it, I just got tired of that particular battle. To be honest, this is still my favorite non-dnt, non-blue deck to play. 3 Dark Confi is my max, though. I also think that a 4th decay is better than a 3rd liliana.
Edit: no goyf? That's the first change to make. I understand the allure of tutoring for the Karakas, but that play is horribly slow, especially when the popular version of reanimator is the BR superfast version.
I'm inclined to favor Tarmogoyf over Stoneforge Mystic in Junk builds since it fits more smoothly into the deck. SFM is a beating vs Eldrazi, but Goyf + Knight is still a fantastic team to have in that matchup. I think there is less RIP out there than there used to be-a lot of Miracles lists are cutting it so it's basically just DnT and maybe a random Stoneblade deck running it. People will likely continue to move towards "fast" GY hate to combat the rise in Br Griselbrand as RIP is often too slow there.
I believe Jund generally has a better Miracles matchup than Junk due to having Blasts and Cardadvantage Elf. Junk looks much better against Eldrazi though, and I think the Miracles matchup can be strengthened with the right card choices, so its a good time to give Junk a shot.
So this was definitely the highlight of the first league
My run went like this:
Elves: 1-2
Elves: 2-0 (same dude, mulled to a hand with more action g1)
Eldrazi: 2-1
TES: 2-1
ANT: 1-2
Pretty average start, but I feel like the deck can do some serious work.
To address some of your guys' points:
1) Yes, I do think goyf would be objectively stronger than knight, but I really like the option to tutor up wastelands a couple turns in a row. Knight also gets out of hand in terms of size pretty dang quick, whereas goyf will often be in dismember range (shardless at least can chump with little artifact dudes to put him to 5/6). I feel knight is more in line with what I am trying to do, accrue a long term advantage, where Goyf is more tempoey. Each is fine in their own regard.
2) I like stoneforge more than goyf in this deck because Dark Confidant's life loss is often game losing, especially with the speed of eldrazi and the number of bolt decks around. I like having batterskull/jitte to recover the life loss.
I might try some other configurations later, but this is fine for now.
In my 2nd league:
High Tide: 2-1
Elves: 2-1
D&T: 1-2
Shardless: 1-2
4c Delver: 2-1
The shardless match g3 I mulled a 1 lander to find another 1 lander, scryed nonland to bottom, and didn't draw 2nd land for a turn or two, but it was enough time for him to get too far ahead. What I am experiencing with this deck so far is that vs fair decks, if I get enough lands to cast my spells, I win. Vs unfair, if I can curve t1 TS into t2 hymn or hatebear, I win. This happens maybe 51% of the time lol
http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=13702&f=LESo this was definitely the highlight of the first league
My run went like this:
Elves: 1-2
Elves: 2-0 (same dude, mulled to a hand with more action g1)
Eldrazi: 2-1
TES: 2-1
ANT: 1-2
Pretty average start, but I feel like the deck can do some serious work.
To address some of your guys' points:
1) Yes, I do think goyf would be objectively stronger than knight, but I really like the option to tutor up wastelands a couple turns in a row. Knight also gets out of hand in terms of size pretty dang quick, whereas goyf will often be in dismember range (shardless at least can chump with little artifact dudes to put him to 5/6). I feel knight is more in line with what I am trying to do, accrue a long term advantage, where Goyf is more tempoey. Each is fine in their own regard.
2) I like stoneforge more than goyf in this deck because Dark Confidant's life loss is often game losing, especially with the speed of eldrazi and the number of bolt decks around. I like having batterskull/jitte to recover the life loss.
I might try some other configurations later, but this is fine for now.
In my 2nd league:
High Tide: 2-1
Elves: 2-1
D&T: 1-2
Shardless: 1-2
4c Delver: 2-1
The shardless match g3 I mulled a 1 lander to find another 1 lander, scryed nonland to bottom, and didn't draw 2nd land for a turn or two, but it was enough time for him to get too far ahead. What I am experiencing with this deck so far is that vs fair decks, if I get enough lands to cast my spells, I win. Vs unfair, if I can curve t1 TS into t2 hymn or hatebear, I win. This happens maybe 51% of the time lol
Here's my list I've played a couple leagues with. Goyf definitely is better in the list, kotr is too clunky at times.
I tried this list and was a little clunky but it was when dig through time was still legal
http://sales.starcitygames.com/deckd...p?DeckID=91032
Whelp, just had my first poor run after the 2 3-2s.
BUG Planeswalkers (control style list with multiple LotV, JtMS, Last Hope, ashiok): 1-2
Shardless BUG: 1-2
Miracles: 1-2
Turbodepths: 2-1
BR Reanimator: 0-2
Miracles was almost a win, opp started game 3 with 2 minutes on the clock and nut drew removal for my Pithing Needle and (miraculously) found Entreat the angels as I was attacking for lethal and then cracked back for lethal. Perhaps I should have taken his cantrips with my Thoughtseizes (I took a from the ashes and a spell snare to resolve my bob). I also could have SFM'ed in a batterskull which would have put me out of lethal range sooner, but I got greedy and went with sword of Fire and Ice beats instead.
Not exactly sure what to change. I feel lingering souls would be much better vs control decks than knight, so maybe that's the first step. I remember playing against a dude who had 6 Hymns (with 2 being Gerrard's Verdict), and it was a nightmare for me when I played shardless. I might give something like that a try.
Lingering souls is great, especially since other are playing moat in their miracles sideboard
So I managed a 4-1 after switching Knight to Lingering Souls, adding 2 Disfigures in my sideboard (mostly for shaman mirrors), and -1 Choke +1 Chains of Mephistopheles (only 3 tix!) I found chains to be extremely effective in each match I used it in, and I might just play 2 instead of choke (and I <3 me some choke)
Lands: (timed him out as above ^_^) 0-1
BUG Walkers Nic Fit: 2-0
4c Friedman Delver: 2-0
Elves: 0-2
BUG Delver: 2-0
Crushing delver like there is no tomorrow feels way too good. There is still a little bit of clunk in the deck I am trying to work though (mostly basic forest), but I am feeling close to optimal at this point. SB could probably use some Leyline of the Void for the odd BR deck.
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Dark Confidant
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Tarmogoyf
1 Scavenging Ooze
15
3 Thoughtseize
2 Cabal Therapy
3 Hymn to Tourach
8
3 Swords to Plowshares
4 Abrupt Decay
1 Green Sun's Zenith
8
3 Lingering Souls
2 Sylvan Library
2 Painful Truths
7
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
3
2 Scrubland
3 Bayou
2 Savannah
1 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Marsh Flats
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Windswept Heath
3 Wasteland
1 Dryad Arbor
22
63, Need two cuts :/ (Likely a SFM and the BS)
Sideboard
2 Choke
2 Zealous Persecution
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Swords to Plowshares
2 Gaddock Teeg
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
2 Pithing Needle
1 Garruk Relentless
3 Surgical Extraction
More flex, probably less overtly powerful, but thoughts? Sylvan is too much of a house to go below 2, and Truths is straight gas when you run out of cards.
3-2 in another league:
Miracles: 1-2
Miracles: 2-1
Enchantress: 2-1
Elves: 1-2
Eldrazi: 2-0
Felt strong, just lost to elves because that matchup isn't great (probably 45%, maybe a little better) and he NO'd me pretty easily g1 and 3, and then I lost to a miracles deck playing multiple council's judgment and entreat. The games felt close, but the Miracle pilot was probably cool and collected right up to the 10 seconds he had left to win before timing out. There were definitely multiple lucky wear tears and snapcasters involved. Playing with equipment vs miralces is hard, because you can get blown out so easily. Still not exactly sure what to do with my decklist for that matchup. It used to be common wisdom that they have a hard time answers non-creatures, but between EE, Council's Judgment, and Wear/Tear (two of which have at least "3 more copies" because of snapcaster), it feels hard to get ANYTHING to stick. I am feeling the non-chalice blues for sure, at least that gives you a fighting chance. /endrant
Anyone here ever try really far-reaching stuff like Gloom, Trinisphere, Winter Orb, Tsunami, Armageddon, or anything else I'm not thinking of?
25 Matches, 55% win rate. Definitely improved once Souls hit the mix.
Geddon, Boil, and a few other goodies are possibilities. It isnt easy.
I always feel about 47% with junk vs miracles (probably because having 4 dead Swords to Plowshares g1).
I still haven't been brining in spellhomb to fight snapcasters, but maybe it's worth?
It's not, Ooze is likely just better since at least it swings for 2.
I was running Sigarda as a 1-of, and it wasn't bad. Usually, I just feel like we get behind after they counter the first few spells, and that's why I played 3 Sylvan for so long. It's just so good.
-Matt
I'd play a 1st top before a 3rd library, but maybe that's just a personal thing...
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