http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLmVTr9hq8QOriginally Posted by lavafrogg
-Matt
Jeeze Matt... I was brainstorming...
I am now looking at voice of resurgence and the gw monstrous guy...
"eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"
And I was just juicing you, don't worry :P
I think the GW Monstrous guy definitely has potential. Considering sometimes we have nothing better to do on turn 5, making a Hexproof dude isn't a bad idea. Might be worth testing with/in place of Smiter.
-Matt
Wow... No I wanna build some terrible Nic Fit Variant with Faithless Looting to loot through basics and then uber ramp. God this sounds horrible. Thank you however for the amazing suggestion
Is hexproof and indestructible worth anything? He is only a 4/4 which is what smiter is worth...
"eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"
I played in a tournament on Sunday at Eudemonia in Berkeley, Ca. I will also note that I didn't do so hot and this time it's not me haha.
There was 18 of us, the meta had 2 Ant decks, 2 Tin Fins, Goblins, 2 Merfolk Nemesis, Jund, 2 RUG, 1 Sneak, 1 Home Brew, 1 Affinity, 2 Miracles, Burn, Grixis Pyromancer (wow i actually remember haha)
Interesting I would say because there was no BUG decks. I made some changes: -3 Smiters +3 Tarmogoyfs. In the side I cut a Thorn of Amethyst to add Pithing Needle.
round 1 against ANT, I lost this match bc he just suddenly came back from a topdeck then in Game 2 he just had God hand lol nothing i can do there. My note on this kind of match up is that 3 of Thorn or Thalia is necessary. I had an E. Tutor as my third thorn but i didn't like it. So now i'm back to 3 Thorn. Possibly other adjustments need to be made in the side.
round 2 against Jund, This match was fine except the fact that i literally drew 5 lands straight in game 3 which he caught up and proceeded to attack me out, shame, shame... This match-up makes me wish i didnt take out my thruns, so +2 Thrun in the Side. I also -1 Liliana in the main going to 2 and +1 Garruk Relentless bc I feel like he'll come in handy. I had sword of Feast and Famine in my side for these match ups but I don't feel like its relevant enough bc when i cast stoneforge i still end up getting batterskull 99% of the time haha.
round 3 against Goblins, um Toxic Deluge is very very very very.... if i didnt exaggerate enough... VERY! powerful.... I took out an whole army of goblins with 3 mana because if i had waited i would've died the next turn with a lethal swing (deed wouldve had to wait). Yes I took 4 life but that only put me to 8, and the next turn i went into stoneforge to batterskull.... Also to note, that i proved my point at how much more useful and aggressive goyf is, he provided better pressure and was much easier to cast.
round 4 against home brew zoo... i think this game was nothing but fun lol hes a cool dude.
Thoughts... I've stepped away from lingering souls. I think i will -3 extirpate from my side and +3 grafdiggers cage. It stops the match ups that extirpate was targeting anyways and is a good side in for matches like elves and such. Past in Flames dies to the card also. Reanimator and tinfins will surely have to deal with it.
Lets keep this going. I have plans to take down SCG Oakland with this deck and I honestly don't care if people know it. I just want Junk to show it's raw power.
Do you have a list?
"eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"
At that stage, wouldn't a Thrun just be better? *shrug*
That's what we're testing, what IS the better answer?
A friend suggesting cutting 3 slots for 3 of the white bounce spell from the Commander decks, Unexpectedly Absent.
Card seems great at dealing with Jace and other troublesome permanents, but WW is tough for sure. I'll give it a try in the Liliana or Smiter slot and see what happens. I'll also try a 2/1 Liliana/vindicate split, as well as running 3 Vindicate like back in the day. Liliana is great, but having a solid answer to Jace is also reasonable. This could also be Hero's Demise, true, but blowing up lands is also incredible.
I'm not doubting the power of Liliana, I'm just curious if we would like the Vindicate effect back in the deck. I don't know.
-Matt
I think with the rise of TNN (4 or5 Decks in the last SCG TOP 16) 2-3 Lilianas in the MB are really important because we have no other way to interact with it game 1. Vindicate is a solid card but I think a split between 3 AD and 1 Vindicate and maybe 1 Vindicate in the SB are better than cut the liliana slot's.
Greetings
Currently playingEldrazi
My current list:
4 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shamen
3 Tarmorgoyf
3 Knight of Reliquary
3 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Swords to Plowshare
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Thoughtseize
3 Inquistion of Kozilek
2 Liliana of The veil
1 Garruk Relentless
1 Batterskull
1 Jitte
2 Sylvan Library
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Marshflats
2 Windswept Heath
1 Forest/ 1 Swamp/ 1 Plains
3 Bayou
3 Scrubland
3 Wasteland
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
SB: 3 Extirpate, 2 Golgari Charm, 2 Toxic Deluge, 3 Thorn of Amethyst, 2 Pithing Needle, 1 Chains of Mephistopheles, 2 Thrun The Last troll.
So I was thinking about vindicate but if I was to do much it'd just be 3 Decays/ 1 Vindicate. And I'm gonna give Garruk Relentless a try for the grindy matchups and the control matchups to see how he fares. Then in the sideboard I was thinking to take out the 3 Extripates to make 3 Grafdiggers Cage. Also thinking about getting rid charms going to +3 Toxic Deluge, -1 Chains, +2 Krosan Grip....
so my sideboard would like...:
3 Grafdiggers Cage
3 Toxic Deluge
3 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Pithing Needle
2 Krosan Grip
2 Thrun the Last Troll
Since you're not running GSZ, you DEFINITELY run Grafdigger's in the board. It helps in the Storm, Reanimator, but more importantly, the Elves matchup, which you'll be seeing more of now that Julian won Bazaar.
-Matt
New here, but long time rock player/peruser of this forum
with all the YPM and TNN running around have we thought about using Marsh Casualties in the board instead of instead of Massacre? Even if the card goes unkicked it still might be better than using a deed, against D&T/goblins it should wrath most of their board especially if we kick it for 5cvc. I like Toxic Deluge but the life loss in our deck might be a little much with the fetches, Bob's and Thoughtseizes.
the lifeloss is not that bad, believe me
i can tell so far even if i do not use toxic deluge yet, simply because due to bugdet reasons i still play shocklands over the real duals and IMO the only matchups that ged worse are the obvious burn, goblins and RUG a bit. RUG allthough still stays favorable even with shocklands.
even with all the lifeloss i have got in my list, which is far more than other lists have i stabilize once the game goes to midgame, and my list does not run anything for lifegain outside of shaman and the ooze i still need to get (but is not necessarily needed, but the list would profit from it)
even i would try toxic deluge with all my lifeloss.... just give it a try
if you should be intrested in my list just say it i'll post it.... also my list should be about 2-4 pages back i think
SIDENOTE: lately i've been thinking of going to 4 cabal therapys, has anyone tried that?
I scrubbed out hard in the GP, but will note that Toxic Deluge was very powerful for me all weekend. It did get countered against Merfolk but I was dead on board if I didn't go for it anyway.
True-Name isn't the only thing it hits, pay 2 life to clear out Bobs, Tidehollows, and DRS, pay 4 life to clear out a small Goyf and a DRS...I thoroughly enjoyed Deluge.
I have actually tried therapy. I ran 3 + some mix Inquisition/Thoughtseize. Now I'm not a master of blind Cabaling, so I leaned on Inq/Ts to give me some help in the build I ran. In a deck like this where you can't hedge on blue spells to help disrupt them, I feel like if you're running discard, you should often run 6/7+ effects to up your chances of drawing one before them combo your face off.
Another thing to consider if you like Cabal is running Lingering Souls. Might seem obvious to some, but they work so well together. Sure, when you have to Therapy or die, you can sac Goyf/Bob/etc, but you do actually have to kill them some how, and if you can sac a soul rather than a win condition, it makes attacking them to death much easier and faster.
I’ve been a long time reader of this thread and it is a major reason I’ve played this deck with some reasonable success, including a 5th and 4th at two 30 man plus GPTs last month. So I wanted to contribute for once by sharing my experience at GP DC this weekend.
This was the first GP I’ve played in and I went 5-2-2. I felt the two draws could have been wins if I had played a little better.
Anyways my list:
Creatures:19
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Dark Confidant
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Tarmogoyf
4 Knight of the Reliquary
Spells:19
3 Cabal Therapy
1 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Thoughtseize
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Sylvan Library
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Liliana of the Veil
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Batterskull
Lands:22
2 Bayou
1 Forest
1 Karakas
1 Maze of Ith
1 Plains
2 Savannah
2 Scrubland
1 Swamp
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
Sideboard:15
1 Grafdigger’s Cage
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Duress
2 Pithing Needle
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Golgari Charm
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Toxic Deluge
I played against the following:
Death and Taxes 2-0
RUG 2-0
Esper Stoneblade 0-2
Death and Taxes 1-1
UWR Miracles 2-0
Esper Stoneblade 1-1
Thropter Factory 2-0
Dark Maverick 2-0
Shardless BUG 0-2
The only match up that I felt behind against was Shardless BUG and I think that was more on account of being tired at that point and playing poorly, plus much better draws for my opponent. Stoneblade only gave me a problem when True-Name Nemesis hit the board. In game one he is though to deal with outside Liliana. post-board I didn’t have much of an issue with him as the charms, explosives, deeds, and deluge did a lot of work. I made a huge mistake in my second Stoneblade matchup when I didn’t side in golgari charm since I didn’t see Nemesis game 1 and I could have used extra removal. With enough time I think I would have pulled game 3 out.
Hey guys,
After weeks of losing to Elves and now encountering TNN at my local shop, I have decided to try switching from Maverick to The Rock for hate purposes.
Here was my process for changing from Dark Maverick to The Rock:
-2 Noble Hierarch
-4 Mother Of Runes
-3 Thalia, Guardian Of Thraben
-1 Scryb Ranger
-2 Aven Mindcensor
-12
13
3 Deathrite Shaman
4 Knight Of The Reliquary
2 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Gaddock Teeg
+1 Deathrite Shaman
+2 Stoneforge Mystic
+3 Tarmogoyf
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Knight Of The Reliquary
2 Qasali Pridmeage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Gaddock Teeg
3 Tarmogoyf
19 Creatures
4 Swords To Plowshares
3 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Thoughtseize
2 Golgari Charm
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Sword Of Fire And Ice
1 Sylvan Library
19 Spells
1 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Karakas
3 Savannah
2 Scrubland
2 Bayou
4 Windswept Heath
2 Verdant Catacombs
1 Bloodstained Mire
4 Wasteland
22 Lands
15 SB Cards:
Combo Hatebears/Show n Tell Hate: 7
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Thalia, Guardian Of Thraben
2 Oblivion Ring
1 Gaddock Teeg
Grave Hate: 2
2 Surgical Extraction
Blue Hate: 2
2 Choke
Fair Stuff: 4
1 Golgari Charm
1 Thrun, The Last Troll
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
1 Garruk Relentless
15
This is my rough draft. I do not have Dark Confidant or Liliana of the Veil just yet, but I thought this might have what it takes to thrash X/1s. I also sort of validated my thinking by looking at 2rach's SCG LA list, because it was also very close to a hybrid-maverick list (less reliance on card advantage and more reliant on GSZ consistency etc).
Input would be appreciated!
Needs more Sylvan Library.
-Matt
What would you cut for it?
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