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Thread: Sisay of Ulamog

  1. #1
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    Sisay of Ulamog

    This deck really came about because of three previous decks that I had built using Aether Vial as the engine. It worked fairly well but was slow to the punch; although, I will say that once it got going, there was almost no stopping it.

    The first.
    The second.
    The third.

    The more that I looked at the deck, the more I realized how awesome it would be if I could somehow get out Emrakul; well, I found that way. Now, I'm not saying it's perfect; it's got some work to do on it, sure, but the idea is pretty solid -- not to say that it is really a sure thing. When it happens, it catches you entirely off guard, which is the whole purpose. Anyway, the deck:

    6 Swamp
    5 Forest
    4 Island
    4 Terramorphic Expanse
    2 Plains
    2 Seaside Citadel


    I chose to only go with 4 fetch lands because for all intents and purpose, I really need my lands to come into play ready to use, not tapped -- time is of the essence really in this deck.

    4 Enlightened Tutor
    4 Mystical Tutor
    3 Index
    2 Evolution Charm

    1 Blazing Archon

    4 Fierce Empath
    2 Iname as One
    2 Captain Sisay

    4 Unsummon
    1 Avatar of Woe

    3 Nirkana Revenant
    2 Patron of the Orochi
    2 Prismatic Omen
    2 Fist of Suns

    1 Spawnshire of Ulamog


    Sideboard:


    1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    1 All Is Dust
    1 It That Betrays


    What you're hoping for on the draw is at least one tutor, preferably an Enlightened Tutor; at least two lands, one being a forest; a prismatic omen; an unsummon; and Captain Sisay. Now, if you don't get this hand, most likely you will get something that will help you to eventually get these cards out. You do not necessarily need Captain Sisay, but it works. And has worked.

    Lay down prismatic omen on turn 2. From there on out, it's pretty much smooth sailing. Tutor your way into Fist of Suns, fetch some lands, lay down Captain Sisay and tap the following turn for Iname as One. Put it out next turn using Fist of Suns' effect, use Iname as One's effect to fetch out your Patron of the Orochi. Next turn, play Fierce Empath and fetch Nirkana. Play another Fierce Empath for Ulamog and that's game.

    All you really need is 5 lands for this to work. Tap out, that's 5; Nirkana adds 5; use Patron to untap all, tap out again and that's 20. Use Ulamog's effect and put out Emrakul, All Is Dust and It That Betrays.

    This deck is a work in progress as you can see. I will probably add in Show and Tell to get out Ulamog, or even any of the other cards.

    Thoughts? Do you think this deck has any chance in the Legacy format?

  2. #2
    Amen, brotha.
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    This deck is Casual beyond relief. Dunno why you posted it in N&D.
    This looks like a job for me.

    Most of my posts will be written from my phone, so please excuse the eventual lack of proper typing.

  3. #3
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    What do you mean by "casual?"

    I will re-think posting some things here once I know; I apologize for the inconvenience.

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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    First, it's not Legacy-legal - Mystical Tutor is banned.

    Second, it's just not on the usual power level. Top heavy, without anything to buy you time. Fast Legacy creature decks decks can usually kill around turn 4 through a single blocker or removal spell. Most combo decks are slightly faster and you have nothing relevant (the fastest one have a roughly 50% chance to kill on turn 1). Control decks will probably shut down your gameplan before it starts.

  5. #5
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Ah, didn't know that about Mystical Tutor.

    Any feedback then as to how I could better my style of play to be more of a Legacy-viable play-style? I've mentioned before that I'm still fairly new to MtG.

    I do appreciate the honesty, though -- I will swipe the deck and start from scratch with the same principal and make this a viable deck.

    I apologize for the inconvenience.

    EDIT: I keep hearing about how decks can win on turn one, two or three but no one gives me any examples. Those would be nice as well.

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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Here is some food for thought.
    For aggro, the decks to test against are usually Zoo or Goblins. These are the ones that kill turns 3-4
    For combo, the fastest ones are Spanish Inquisition and Belcher followed by TES and ANT.
    There are several control decks you could browse through as well (most are U based)
    Most decks in the format can function on 2-3 land.
    Spells that cost 4 or more typically are board warping and/or win the game.
    I would encourage you to look at the threads in Decks to beat and Established decks sections of the site to get an idea of the power level of most of the decks you would be facing in a competitive tournament.

    Once you've done this, you can start planning

    Questions you have to consider when you build the decks in Legacy
    How fast is your goldfish speed (your kill if your opponent does nothing)? This gives you an idea of the speed of your deck.
    If it is more than turns 3-4, what are you doing to slow your opponent down or stop them from implementing their game plan?

    What is your particular style of play? If you want to cheat the fatties out, there are strategies that allow you to do that.

  7. #7
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Right now I am testing decks against red/white. I've only really built two decks that came close to beating it and one was a blue counter deck and the other was just another red/white deck.

    I guess I'd better start rethinking how I play the game. Thank you.

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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    these are the most random cards i have ever seen
    I will make use of every tool that fate presents.

  9. #9
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Quote Originally Posted by perm View Post
    these are the most random cards i have ever seen
    The deck works if you give it time and it works pretty consistently, winning on about turn 7-9. The problem with it is that it is slow churning -- and also one of the cards is banned in Legacy that I only just learned.

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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    You can build a deck with a much higher mana curve and have it work. As I mentioned before, you just have to find a way to slow down or lock out your opponent. Cards such as Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere assist with this especially if you can drop them turn 1 (which some decks do).

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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Quote Originally Posted by MGC_player View Post
    You can build a deck with a much higher mana curve and have it work. As I mentioned before, you just have to find a way to slow down or lock out your opponent. Cards such as Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere assist with this especially if you can drop them turn 1 (which some decks do).
    Right now I'm building a W/U/B controllish deck. I'm going to have the finisher be Enlightened Tutor into Eldrazi Conscription and use Show and Tell to play it.

    Don't know how "Legacy-"like this combo is, but I'm sure it'll work with some consistence given the other cards I'm using; Aether Vial being one.

  12. #12
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Quote Originally Posted by arwall View Post
    Right now I'm building a W/U/B controllish deck. I'm going to have the finisher be Enlightened Tutor into Eldrazi Conscription and use Show and Tell to play it.

    Don't know how "Legacy-"like this combo is, but I'm sure it'll work with some consistence given the other cards I'm using; Aether Vial being one.
    If you use Show and Tell, I would just play Emrakul instead of Eldrazi Conscription. THis is definitely a viable strategy in legacy, but you must have something to support the combo. I would suggest countermagic. Force of Will is used in every blue-based deck in the format. Most enchant creatures are useless in legacy, because the creature can just be Swords to Plowshares or Path to Exiled (two very popular cards in legacy), so Conscription is not the best card in legacy.

    Like someone said before, one of the main things about legacy is if a card costs 4 or more, it should win the game or completely change the game in your favor (Natural Order/Progenitus, Goblin Ringleader, etc...)

    I would pick up an aggro elf deck or a white weenie deck to start legacy. Both of these decks will be really cheap to build, and will really help you get involved in the format. If you build them on a budget, they will not be the best decks, but they will be viable and provide you with the experience you need to learn the format in and out.

    Good Luck!

    PS- People need to stop making remarks like this deck is jank, random pile of cards, etc... Clearly the topic creator is new to the format and just needs some helpful tips on how to get started. If anyone knows of any links to articles that introduce the reader to legacy, it may be helpful

  13. #13
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Quote Originally Posted by TossUsToLions View Post
    If you use Show and Tell, I would just play Emrakul instead of Eldrazi Conscription. THis is definitely a viable strategy in legacy, but you must have something to support the combo. I would suggest countermagic. Force of Will is used in every blue-based deck in the format. Most enchant creatures are useless in legacy, because the creature can just be Swords to Plowshares or Path to Exiled (two very popular cards in legacy), so Conscription is not the best card in legacy.

    Like someone said before, one of the main things about legacy is if a card costs 4 or more, it should win the game or completely change the game in your favor (Natural Order/Progenitus, Goblin Ringleader, etc...)

    I would pick up an aggro elf deck or a white weenie deck to start legacy. Both of these decks will be really cheap to build, and will really help you get involved in the format. If you build them on a budget, they will not be the best decks, but they will be viable and provide you with the experience you need to learn the format in and out.

    Good Luck!

    PS- People need to stop making remarks like this deck is jank, random pile of cards, etc... Clearly the topic creator is new to the format and just needs some helpful tips on how to get started. If anyone knows of any links to articles that introduce the reader to legacy, it may be helpful
    I appreciate your kindness.

    I started out in Legacy making Elf decks, actually; I've yet to build a goblin deck, though I have played against one. I guess I could try and "restart" as it were to try and hone my actual skill at putting together a deck.

    And money isn't really an issue with me; I'm not currently employed, but I'm not above buying cards that will cost a pretty penny. Right now, as it stands, I'd like to somehow fit these cards into a viable Legacy deck, bar the Conscription as just advised to me. They've been my bread and butter to the last few decks that I've built, and I think they'd work well in a deck given the right counter magic and creatures.

  14. #14

    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Hey Bro, welcome to Magic and Legacy.

    Ok bare with me, i'm about to tell you some things that you already heard mixed with some new stuff.

    The deck you built may not be Legacy Viable, but if the play circle that you play with is not hardcore players it might be good enough. While this site is a wonderful place to hone your skills as a Legacy Player, it does not really allow the casual player to shine. But if you are looking to be the best of the best in your playgrouo this is a good place to start.

    There are other formats out there, where a slower deck could be used. The Conscription was used in a deck with Soverign of New Alara to some good sucsess, so it could still be used in a decent deck. (Just not Legacy Viable)

    The cards that you mentioned that you'd like to use are all not usable for Legacy. Show and Tell, Path to Exile, AEther Vial, Polluted Delta, Chalice of the Void are probably the ones that you'd use the most, and most of them are used in different decks. AEther Vial is a fun card to build around, i'd suggest building a Goblin or Merfolk deck. As they are pretty fun and easy to pilot decks.
    Get paid to talk about Magic Here

    Quote Originally Posted by sdematt View Post
    @ Mental Misstep

    I'm not going to stop running cards because they MIGHT get countered, otherwise I'd just run infinite Blurred Mongeese, Vexing Shushers, or some other garbage. Force of Will is more rampant than MM, yet I still play counterable cards. My word!

    -Matt

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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Yeah. I find that I am usually the one giving other people ideas who are around the same level of play that I am but I'm usually the one falling back because of the decks that I make.

    I guess it's just being lazy and not checking into stuff. I'm going to make a solid effort with the next deck that I build -- I'm reading the threads here that I have been recommending in doing so and I'm reading up on the actual format.

    I've still got a lot to learn and I appreciate the understanding attitude most of you have had with me thus far; I've gotten a lot of feedback, both good and bad and I'm using that feedback as best I can to further progress my abilities.

    So, again, thank you all.

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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Quote Originally Posted by arwall View Post
    EDIT: I keep hearing about how decks can win on turn one, two or three but no one gives me any examples. Those would be nice as well.
    MGC_player provided some very good information already, but here a few more details.

    Most obviously, the Storm Combo archetype. Decks that frequently killl outright on turn 1 are Spanish Inquisition (fast mana, big draw spells for a self-supporting chain, finish with Tendrils of Agony) and Belcher (even more fast mana, play and Activate Goblin Charbelcher. 10+ Empty the Warrens tokens on turn 1 is the 'slow' backup plan ). Slightly slower decks rely on finding and resolving a more powerful effect like Ad Nauseam to draw enough mana, small draw spells and Tendrils, allowing them to fit in setup spells and protection.

    And that's just the most straightforward option... 'true' combo decks like Cephalid Breakfast do something far more bizarre:
    Nomads En-Kor + Cephalid Illusionist can toss your entire library into the graveyard, including a Narcomoeba for a third creature so you can flashback Dread Return. This reanimates Karmic Guide which in turn reanimates Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker who copies the Guide to reanimate a Sky Hussar which Kiki can now copy an infinite number of times.
    This deck usually wins on turn 2-3 quite consistently and includes quite a bit of protection - Force of Will, Daze, Cabal Therapy and tutorable answers to problematic permanents. 2 cards, 3 mana for a kill is as efficient as it gets, but several other options are close and don't require you to run quite as much junk.

    Even killing with creatures can be quick. Affinity will have some way to kill you on turn 3 with Atog and Disciple of the Vault or accelerated Cranial Platings... and those are the slow and reliable builds. Glimpse of Nature and Retract as an engine can draw the entire deck, after which Storm Entity can kill on turn 1. If they can't get a combo chain started or fizzle, chances are you still have to deal with one early fatty or several mid-sized creatures that will kill a goldfish by turn 4.

    *

    That's not to say everything has to try as hard... in fact, most of the truly popular decks don't. Mid-sized creatures + a bit of discard/free countermagic can deal just fine with most of the above. That approach on the other hand is vulnerable to slow (by Legacy standards) decks that can make one backbreaking play every turn starting on turn 4-ish and never let up or to fast decks with a lot of redundancy.
    However, starting to set up something interesting on turn 4-ish is only viable if you are able to disrupt your opponents early game and if your own game plan is robust and has inevitability - if all you want to do is put some monstrosity into play there are decks that can do this on turn 1-2 with backup.
    Legacy is a harsh environment, and deck design needs to acknowledge that. Despite all the negativity... have fun with the format. A few people have managed to be successful with something big, impressive and terrible-looking so you don't HAVE to streamline all the joy out of it.

  17. #17
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Sideboards are 15 cards, no more no less. This is a great site to learn about Legacy decks by browsing through all the decks in them. You will find primers and tournament reports on playing the decks, Match up analysis, Card selection, sideboard strategy, and everything else.

    The primers are on the first page of each deck archetype and the reports, which are invaluable in seeing how other players approach and play out the decks in various match ups, are in the tournament reports thread.

    Hope you love dual lands, fetchlands that fetch into play untapped and Brainstorms.

    Great pplace to start;
    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...ead.php?13716-[DTW]-CounterTop
    Quote Originally Posted by Cavius The Great View Post
    Respect my shine bitch!

  18. #18
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    hahaha Oh, wow.

    I'm honestly shocked at how much positive feedback I've gotten. I'm going to take the advice given to me and look into all of these decks and primers and how they play -- my only problem is that I've got really no one to play against that plays competitively like I'd like to get into.

    I'm going to have a lot of fun the next few days reading up on all of this and then finally putting it to use in a deck. I'm sure it'll show improvement; I've already decided on making a G/U build similar to an aggro deck but featuring a good bit of control. I'd like to somehow fit Mind Funeral in there somewhere, but I'd really like to stick to a dual-colored deck for now and re-work my way back up properly -- not just willy nilly. I've got to actually get a bit of knowledge before thinking about building another Legacy deck.

    I think I'm fine with the circle that I play with, but I'd like to be better.

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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    Magic Work Station and Cockatrice are all free online ways to play MtG and practice the decks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cavius The Great View Post
    Respect my shine bitch!

  20. #20
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    Re: Sisay of Ulamog

    I use OCTGN.

    Are these other programs any better?

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