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Thread: [Deck] Goblins

  1. #7461
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Just to be exhaustive, let's also mention Ignition Team . Unfortunately he is not powerful enough to even consider playing him just for lackey/instigator shenanigans.... at 7 mana he should do something MUCH more powerful, but he is geared towards multiplayer games.

  2. #7462
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Del.

  3. #7463

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoCop 90 View Post
    Just to be exhaustive, let's also mention Ignition Team .
    Think I'd rather Koth of the Hammer or Domri Rade than the I-team.

  4. #7464
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Update notes


    June 17th 2014
    Re-structured the opening post. It should now be easier to read. I also wrote a whole new paragraph about the three subarchetypes of Goblins and added a lot of pictures.

    Feedback is appreciated.
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  5. #7465
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    @Gobolord:

    The link to suggested reading about Warchief and Chieftain links to a page without info on them.
    You state that Stifle can turn a Piledriver into a Squire; it has pro-blue, however.

    Small errors: The link is dead @Lackey part, 'cardadvantage' needs a space @Ringleader part, misspelled 'Show and Tell' @Stingscourger part, misspelled 'throw' @Krenko part, 'your' should be 'you' @Classic build part, a couple of errors @Sideboard part (mostly links and /cards).

    I might've missed some things, but this is what I found. The structure looks good, I really like the updated sideboard part and the Krenko-SGC discussion.

  6. #7466
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Yio View Post
    You state that Stifle can turn a Piledriver into a Squire; it has pro-blue, however.
    Stifle targets the Triggered Abilities, not Piledriver itself. That's why it turns him into a Squire for a turn.
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  7. #7467
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Well hot damn, I stand corrected. A bit weird that protection doesn't cover that, but on the other hand the definition of protection would've been even more complicated. (Maybe a thing to add to the Piledriver page, or am I the only one who has made that mistake?)

  8. #7468
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Yio View Post
    @Gobolord:

    The link to suggested reading about Warchief and Chieftain links to a page without info on them.

    Small errors: The link is dead @Lackey part, 'cardadvantage' needs a space @Ringleader part, misspelled 'Show and Tell' @Stingscourger part, misspelled 'throw' @Krenko part, 'your' should be 'you' @Classic build part, a couple of errors @Sideboard part (mostly links and /cards).

    I might've missed some things, but this is what I found. The structure looks good, I really like the updated sideboard part and the Krenko-SGC discussion.
    Fixed.
    Thank you for your conscientious proofreading.
    Mountain Caverns, Lackey, Go.

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  9. #7469

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    In my mono red winstigator list I am finding it essential to maindeck the following:-

    3 chrome mox
    3 pyrokenesis
    4 tarfire
    1 Tin Street Hooligan
    1 Tuk Tuk Scrapper

    Obviously the above give me acceleration, quick removal, and answers to problematic artifacts.
    If you want a full deck list I can provide it.

  10. #7470

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by GoboLord View Post
    Fixed.
    Thank you for your conscientious proofreading.
    In the subtype section blood moon is misspelled in section a aswell.

  11. #7471
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by 1337erhosen View Post
    3. The mana base continues to feel very vulnerable against Wasteland/Delver decks, and I see Rishadan Port as a liability most of the time. When I have it to follow up a turn 1 Vial it feels great, but having it Wasted/having it not produce red mana has been relevant in more of my games than the mana-denial ability. Have any of you guys been mana screwed/felt the same way about Port?
    Not a Goblins player, but this feels like a good line of thought. Goblins is pretty similar to Shardless BUG in many ways and that deck only runs two wastelands as an answer to troublesome lands instead of active disruption like D&T and Delver do. Being able to play your stuff and bury the opponent in raw CA is much more important to these decks' gameplan, I think. Surprisingly few Legacy decks actually have raw draw, so just drowning people in cards should work. It's what puts Shardless in DTB, anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemnear
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    Yeah, an insanely powerful block which put the "derp!" factor in Legacy completely over the top.

  12. #7472
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie View Post
    Not a Goblins player, but this feels like a good line of thought. Goblins is pretty similar to Shardless BUG in many ways and that deck only runs two wastelands as an answer to troublesome lands instead of active disruption like D&T and Delver do. Being able to play your stuff and bury the opponent in raw CA is much more important to these decks' gameplan, I think. Surprisingly few Legacy decks actually have raw draw, so just drowning people in cards should work. It's what puts Shardless in DTB, anyway.
    Shardless BUG has Force of Will and Abrupt Decay, which can deal with a lot of stuff. Goblins are prey to combo, and against every fair deck is a fair match (there are no cakewalks like in 2006 meta).

    Still, these guys are rocking WInstigator lists, which seem clearly better nowdays (unless you're Jim Davis). I love it.
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  13. #7473
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by GoboLord View Post
    Fixed.
    Thank you for your conscientious proofreading.
    Got some more.

    In the Goblin Lackey explanation:

    Quote Originally Posted by GoboLord View Post
    Caverns, Lackey, Go – the best T1-play our deck has. His threatening, triggered ability enables fast and aggressive starts, even turn-3-kills. On the other hand we does very often not “connect” because opponents will try everything to throw removal, counter or Stifle at him. Placing creatures in his way is oftentimes a plan-B, because the creature in question could be removed to make sure that Lackey get’s the party started.
    Perhaps the below wording is better? Also corrected the typo "we" to "he."

    Quote Originally Posted by GoboLord View Post
    Caverns, Lackey, Go – the best T1-play our deck has. His threatening, triggered ability enables fast and aggressive starts, even turn-3-kills. On the other hand he does not "connect" very often because opponents will try everything to stop him via removal, counter spells or even Stifle. Placing creatures in his way is oftentimes a plan-B, because the creature in question could be removed to make sure that Lackey get’s the party started.

    I tend to disagree with the following:

    Quote Originally Posted by GoboLord View Post
    BUG Delver
    Tier 1: Boartusk Liege
    Tier 2: Relic of Progenitus, Rest in Peace, Perish, Nature’s Ruin, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, Earwig Squad, Swang Song
    Cards you should NOT run instead: Goblin King, Tormod’s Crypt
    Am I alone in thinking Rest in Peace, not Relic of Progenitus, is tier 1 against BUG Delver? Literally shutting off 8-10 actual real problems in the deck. Deathrite Shaman, Tarmogoyf and if they are playing it Tombstalker? I would even argue that it makes their Abrupt Decay marginally worse as they have so many live and important targets. Stretches it's applications thin.

    Lastly, add Grenzo, Dungeon Warden to the to be tested section.

    If I edit a post without an explanation, I am just correcting typos and / or formatting.
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  14. #7474
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Went to a legacy event 3 towns over last night. Had some great match ups and went 3-1, but had to drop before round 5 due to work the next morning. The list is as follows:

    4x Goblin Lackey
    4x Goblin Matron
    4x Goblin Warchief
    4x Goblin Ringleader
    3x Gempalm Incinerator
    3x Goblin Piledriver
    3x Mogg War Marshall
    3x Tarfire
    1x Warren Wierding
    1x Siege-Gang Commander
    1x Goblin Sharpshooter
    1x Skirk Prospector
    1x Tuktuk Scrapper
    4x Aether Vial
    4x Wasteland
    4x Rishadan Port
    2x Badlands
    1x Auntie's Hovel
    2x Wooded Foothills
    2x Bloodstained Mire
    1x Arid Mesa
    3x Mountain
    4x Cavern of Souls

    2x Ashen Rider
    2x Perish
    3x Pyrokenesis
    1x Shattering Spree
    2x Earwig Squad
    3x Cabal Therapy
    2x Grafdigger's Cage

    Round 1: Shardless BUG 2-0

    Game 1 he kept a sketchy hand with a ton of counters double wasteland, but I got a lackey turn 1 off a cavern and he scooped after I dropped Siege-Gang turn 2.
    Game 2 he mulled to 5 and I hit a turn 1 vial, turn 2 vial and proceeded to out tempo him with 3 wastelands and 2 ports. (he told me he was new to the deck and sided out the FoW's due to my caverns)

    Round 2: Elves 1-2

    Game 1 he combo'd off with Craterhoof on turn 3
    Game 2 I turn 1 lackey. He does things... I go turn 2 lackey. He does more things and shows me a Craterhoof in his hand. I drop perish for his entire board including 2 dryad arbors and he is stuck with just the beast in hand. He scooped.
    Game 3 I played perish, perish, pyrokenesis and a grafdigger's cage this game and still lost. We both turtle for 5+ turns and I connect with a warchief to drop Earwig Squad grabbing his last 2 Glimpse of Nature's and his Craterhoof. He drops a Cradle and makes enough mana to cast the other Craterhoof he had in his hand. It was a grindy game and he earned it.

    Round 3: ANT 2-1

    Game 1 He combo'd off on turn 2.
    Game 2 I hit him on turn 3 with a goblin token to get Earwig Squad taking his only win cons from his deck.
    Game 3 is a repeat of game 1 play for play. He was pissed.

    Round 4: Miracles 2-1

    Game 1 I dont remember much about this one. He just got there miraculously.
    Game 2 was just a redo of the ANT match-up taking his planeswalkers and I grinded him out.
    Game 3 he mulled to 4 and scooped. I guess he wasn't in a good mood.

    I had to drop before round 5 for work the next morning. But I got some good testing done. I love the black splash now. Though I feel some of my wins were from sheer luck and only a small amount of skill.

  15. #7475
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombiesquisher View Post
    Went to a legacy event 3 towns over last night. Had some great match ups and went 3-1, but had to drop before round 5 due to work the next morning. The list is as follows:

    4x Goblin Lackey
    4x Goblin Matron
    4x Goblin Warchief
    4x Goblin Ringleader
    3x Gempalm Incinerator
    3x Goblin Piledriver
    3x Mogg War Marshall
    3x Tarfire
    1x Warren Wierding
    1x Siege-Gang Commander
    1x Goblin Sharpshooter
    1x Skirk Prospector
    1x Tuktuk Scrapper
    4x Aether Vial
    4x Wasteland
    4x Rishadan Port
    2x Badlands
    1x Auntie's Hovel
    2x Wooded Foothills
    2x Badlands
    1x Arid Mesa
    3x Mountain
    4x Cavern of Souls

    2x Ashen Rider
    2x Perish
    3x Pyrokenesis
    1x Shattering Spree
    2x Earwig Squad
    3x Cabal Therapy
    2x Grafdigger's Cage

    (...)
    Nice result, congrats! Question: 4 Badlands or 2? You mention them two times seperately

  16. #7476
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Oh sorry about that, only 2 Badlands. My girlfriend was using the other 2 in her deck that night. So I tried out the Auntie's Hovel. It's identical to Badlands, I never found myself unable to use it. Great budget card if anyone needs it.

  17. #7477
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Nice update Gobolord. My only suggestion would be to add a line about Kiki-Jiki in the WInstigator build.

  18. #7478
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Ok, so second try of the RWB build, with Grenzo, tomorrow. The list may seem a bit strange, but I'm trying things in smalls local tournaments before the big local tournament coming this august.

    Creatures
    1 Earwig Squad
    2 Gempalm Incinerator
    2 Goblin Chieftain
    4 Goblin Lackey
    4 Goblin Matron
    2 Goblin Piledriver
    4 Goblin Ringleader
    3 Goblin Warchief
    1 Grenzo, Dungeon Warden
    1 Krenko, Mob Boss
    3 Mogg War Marshal
    1 Siege-Gang Commander
    1 Stingscourger
    3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

    Spells
    1 Tarfire
    1 Warren Weirding

    4 AEther Vial

    Lands
    3 Arid Mesa
    3 Badlands
    2 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 Mountain
    3 Plateau
    1 Scalding Tarn
    2 Wasteland

    Sideboard
    1 Earwig Squad
    2 Pyroblast
    2 Tarfire
    1 Warren Weirding
    2 Wear
    3 Oblivion Ring
    2 Rest in Peace
    2 Pithing Needle


    Edit:: Well that was pathetic. I didn't get to really test the changes, since I lost 1-3. I won violently against Merfolks, but I lost against 3 Burn decks. Yup, three burn decks. It was a 12-men tournament (people were at the big tournament at Ottawa), and I got three burn decks against me...
    Any other deck would have been fine, or at lest a difficult but feasible matchup. There was a WUR delver, a Painterstone, an Affinity, two Dredges, one Sneak and Show, a Reanimator, a Merfolk, me, and the three burn decks. I've played against each one of the other decks, and prepared my side against them. But I got three burns.
    But I alpha-striked the Merfolk player for 54 in a turn, so I got that going for me...

    O-rings were useful, so they may stay there, Grenzo was absolutely useless (but to be fair, he couldn't be useful against Burn and merfolk was a race, so I couldn't afford casting him, I still need to see how he fares against control decks), I will maindeck all the tarfires and side the warrens weirdings, and Krenko was lackluster. Considering replacing him with SGC again. Gotta test it.
    Last edited by Raznaak; 06-21-2014 at 07:00 PM.

  19. #7479

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Has anyone tried out the Kiki-Jiki Goblin Settler combo in lieu of the Sharpshooter prosector combo?

  20. #7480
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Raznaak View Post
    Ok, so second try of the RWB build, with Grenzo, tomorrow. The list may seem a bit strange, but I'm trying things in smalls local tournaments before the big local tournament coming this august.

    ...

    Edit:: Well that was pathetic. I didn't get to really test the changes, since I lost 1-3. I won violently against Merfolks, but I lost against 3 Burn decks. Yup, three burn decks. It was a 12-men tournament (people were at the big tournament at Ottawa), and I got three burn decks against me...
    Any other deck would have been fine, or at lest a difficult but feasible matchup. There was a WUR delver, a Painterstone, an Affinity, two Dredges, one Sneak and Show, a Reanimator, a Merfolk, me, and the three burn decks. I've played against each one of the other decks, and prepared my side against them. But I got three burns.
    But I alpha-striked the Merfolk player for 54 in a turn, so I got that going for me...

    O-rings were useful, so they may stay there, Grenzo was absolutely useless (but to be fair, he couldn't be useful against Burn and merfolk was a race, so I couldn't afford casting him, I still need to see how he fares against control decks), I will maindeck all the tarfires and side the warrens weirdings, and Krenko was lackluster. Considering replacing him with SGC again. Gotta test it.
    I keep finding Chalice of the Void to be powerful. It would have been great against burn. Other than that I personally have found to be a slightly dis-favorable match-up, and possibly worse with the printing of Eidolon of the Great Revel.

    I personally found Grenzo, Dungeon Warden to be very powerful against merfolk with the exception of their excellent draw of more than 1 True-Name Nemesis. After a few very, very small tournaments though I found he was best against decks that rely on heavy counter-spell permission, not very good against straight tempo, and straight up bad against combo. Which hits the exact opposite of every axis we want. We are already great against counter-spells, reasonable against tempo, and straight up bad against combo.

    Quote Originally Posted by BoiledDenim View Post
    Has anyone tried out the Kiki-Jiki Goblin Settler combo in lieu of the Sharpshooter prosector combo?
    I have, but not extensively. My meta shifts to such a manner that we sometimes we end up with several Shardless BUG Lists with 0-1 Marit Lage deck. When this happens I put a Goblin Settler in the board and swap my win condition from Siege-Gang Commander to Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker. Unfortunately the situation of the two being in play has yet to happen or get close to happening. I have on the other hand drawn Goblin Settler and found him to be pretty bad alone with the two exceptions of blowing up Maze of Ith and fighting 12-post.

    Edit: Sorry you had to play against so many Burn decks. Sounds like that was terrible-- It'd be pretty hard not to go on tilt out of anger.

    If I edit a post without an explanation, I am just correcting typos and / or formatting.
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