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Thread: [Deck] Goblins

  1. #201
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Why did you board out Stingscourger? Although if they're hardcasting him, using Stingscourger via Vial kind of blows. Sting is only effective against Emmy when you can either A.) Ship back after a SnT, or B.) Ship back when they Sneak Attack with their last red mana.

    Here's a list I'm messing with, for the reference, it's Rb for Perish and a few Weirdings.
    Lands: 22
    1x Arid Mesa
    4x Bloodstained Mire
    4x Badlands
    5x Mountain
    1x Swamp
    3x Rishadan Port
    4 Wasteland
    Core: 26
    Other: 12
    3x Lightning Bolt
    2x Mogg War Marshall
    3x Gempalm Incinerator
    2x Warren Weirding
    1x Goblin Chieftain
    1x Stingscourger
    Sideboard:
    4x Pulverize
    4x Chalice of the Void
    3x Perish
    2x Tormod's Crypt
    1x Relic of Progenitus
    1x Nihil Spellbomb
    Quote Originally Posted by ktkenshinx View Post
    The Reserved List is a) not legally binding, b) antiquated, c) broken, and d) preventative of maximum game enjoyment. Wizards will remove as many cards from that list as possible to increase the fun of their game. Using market research, they can find a balance between printing enough cards to lower a price from $40 to $15-$20, and not utterly ruining their value. This will be both an economically feasible AND sensible move.
    -ktkenshinx-

  2. #202

    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by bakofried View Post
    Why did you board out Stingscourger? Although if they're hardcasting him, using Stingscourger via Vial kind of blows. Sting is only effective against Emmy when you can either A.) Ship back after a SnT, or B.) Ship back when they Sneak Attack with their last red mana.
    True. I've never considered Emrakul's "...take an extra turn after this one" trigger before because he's usually cheated onto the battlefield. No point bouncing when they already have another turn to untap. I guess the best we can hope for is to save our Wastelands for Serra's Sanctum. Vial Sting, bounce Emrakul, Waste the Sanctum, and pray they don't have another way to generate 15 mana when their turn begins again?

  3. #203
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Blowing up Sanctum seems to be one of the better points of attack.
    Quote Originally Posted by ktkenshinx View Post
    The Reserved List is a) not legally binding, b) antiquated, c) broken, and d) preventative of maximum game enjoyment. Wizards will remove as many cards from that list as possible to increase the fun of their game. Using market research, they can find a balance between printing enough cards to lower a price from $40 to $15-$20, and not utterly ruining their value. This will be both an economically feasible AND sensible move.
    -ktkenshinx-

  4. #204
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    @bakofried How good is Nihil Spellbomb in your deck? Wouldn't Ravenous Trap be a better choice for this slot?

    Hey, I've been testing sideboards for R/G Goblins and with this new Affinity/MUD meta, I've reached this:

    Lands [22]

    6 Mountain
    4 Wooded Foothills
    4 Wasteland
    4 Rishadan Port
    4 Taiga

    Core [26]

    ...

    Others [12]

    3 Gempalm Incinerator
    3 Mogg War Marshal
    3 Lightning Bolt
    2 Goblin Chieftain
    1 Tin Street Hooligan

    Sideboard [15]

    4 Pyrokinesis
    4 Chalice of the Void
    2 Krosan Grip
    2 Relic of Progenitus
    1 Back to Nature
    1 Shatterstorm
    1 Stingscourger

    I could finally remove Skirk Shooter stuff from my R/G build with a lot of sadness. They're pretty much fun to play. But bolts seem to be a better slot for a heavy aggro enviroment. And I couldn't fit them in sideboard, tho.

    Sometimes I want to up Shatterstorm to two pieces, but I can't find room for it. My only option is switching Tin Street Hooligan with Stingscourger and remove TSH for the second Shatterstorm, but then I wouldn't have a quick tutorable answer for artifacts.

  5. #205
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    You probably want a few more board wipes for Artifacts. Spot removal can be weak against decks like MUD, Affinity, etc.
    Quote Originally Posted by ktkenshinx View Post
    The Reserved List is a) not legally binding, b) antiquated, c) broken, and d) preventative of maximum game enjoyment. Wizards will remove as many cards from that list as possible to increase the fun of their game. Using market research, they can find a balance between printing enough cards to lower a price from $40 to $15-$20, and not utterly ruining their value. This will be both an economically feasible AND sensible move.
    -ktkenshinx-

  6. #206
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Vandalize View Post

    Sometimes I want to up Shatterstorm to two pieces, but I can't find room for it. My only option is switching Tin Street Hooligan with Stingscourger and remove TSH for the second Shatterstorm, but then I wouldn't have a quick tutorable answer for artifacts.
    Could you not take out a Pyrokinesis?
    Quit playing Legacy but could still play Goblins (Rgw, Rg, Rw, Rb)

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  7. #207
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Nelis View Post
    Could you not take out a Pyrokinesis?
    Or put the Sting in the place of Tin-Street MB, and SB 1 more S.Storm. I think it's enough atrifact removal to surpass the Tin-Street...
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  8. #208
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Ok, just dropped TSH and added Stingscourger MD and +1 Shatterstorm SB.

    My list looks like this now:

    Lands [22]

    4 Wasteland
    4 Rishadan Port
    4 Wooded Foothills
    1 Arid Mesa
    3 Taiga
    6 Mountain

    Core [26]

    ...

    Others [12]

    3 Gempalm Incinerator
    3 Mogg War Marshal
    3 Lightning Bolt
    2 Goblin Chieftain
    1 Stingscourger

    SB [15]

    4 Pyrokinesis
    4 Chalice of the Void
    2 Krosan Grip
    2 Relic of Progenitus
    2 Shatterstorm
    1 Back to Nature

    The deck performs very well against Zoo and Merfolks (it's essencially a mono-R build). I don't know if I should only put 2 GY-Hate cards in my sideboard, ti's a low number, indeed (I'll maybe drop a Pyrokinesis and add a Tormod's Crypt). But the sideboard is working for matches that it should work (MUD, Affinity, Zoo, Merfolks, Enchantress).

    Dropped 1 Taiga and added 1 Fetchland to make the manabase more solid than it already is, and my splash is light (KGrips and BtN only needs G to work).

    Some guys were talking about a Blue splash in goblins for FoW/Daze/Stifle. Blue also gives us Hurkyll's Recall in sideboard: Using it EOT means a clean path to an Alpha Strike against Affinity/MUD.

  9. #209
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    When your enchantress opponents get some smart and start running karmic justice think about harmonic convergance. Love that card in my extremely heavy enchantress meta.


    Fow requires like 18-20 blue cards minimum to be affective in a deck. Wayyy too many for goblins. Stifle and daze are bad cards but hey. I do like the idea of hurkylls sideboard but black and green are much stronger splashes.

  10. #210
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Hey guys,

    today I saw a goblin list on which my first reaction was: Oh boy, what a crap. Then I got curious, watched the vid and the player made some good points.
    I'll first post the list and then point out what I think:

    //Lands [22]
    4 Wasteland
    4 Badlands, 4 Auntie's Hovel
    8 Mountain
    2 Chrome Mox

    //Core [26]
    ...

    //Others [12]
    4 Warren Instigator
    4 Goblin Chieftain

    1 Gempalm Incinerator
    1 Stingscourger
    2 Warren Weirding

    //Sideboard [15]
    4 Mindbreak Trap
    4 Leyline of the Void
    4 Perish
    2 Boartusk Liege
    1 Pithing Needle

    My first thoughts:
    * very few removal + poorly splitted
    * I'd rather have mountains than Chrome Mox
    * 4 Perish, no Pyrokinesis - seems bad to me
    * 4 WI, 4 Chieftain, 2 Boartusk Liege - RARR!!! this deck is aggressive like hell

    On the second glance I find 4 Chieftain + 2 Lieges interesting. Plague doesn't request enchantment removal anymore. This makes Humility and MOat virtually the only enchantments to worry about (maybe a reason to drop enchantment hate completely, since Landstill isn't the most popular deck right now.
    Chrome Mox is very interesting. CM trades cardadvantage for speed. This is what what our deck needs: speed. We are very good in having cards in hand that we just don't need at a particular moments - cards that are better imprinted in Chrome Mox.
    Pithing Needle is a bit random. The black splash isn't needed IMO since the MD removal is better in Mono R and Pyrokinesis is more flexible than Perish (and doesn't clash with Boartusk Liege).
    Unfortunately the many RR-manacosts make Rishadan Port very questinable.
    Following this train of thought the updated list would look like this:

    //Lands [22]
    4 Wastelands
    16 Mountain
    2 Chrome Mox

    //Core [25]
    -1 Piledriver

    //Others [13]
    3 Gempalm Incinerator
    2 Stingscourger

    4 Warren Instigator
    4 Goblin Chieftain


    //Sideboard [15]
    4 Chalice of the Void
    2 Tormod's Crypt, 1 Relic of Progenitus
    3 Pyrokinesis, 1 Goblin Sharpshooter
    2 Boartusk Liege
    1 Goblin Tinkerer
    1 Pulverize


    This deck is totally aggressive while having only very few possibilities of dealing with threats in form of artifacts and enchantments. It seems like it's strategy is to win before any critical cards get online. My question: is it reasonable to go for the all-or-nothing aggro strategy or should we stick to reliable splashes, run more removal and thus be more more flexible?
    Mountain Caverns, Lackey, Go.

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  11. #211

    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by GoboLord View Post
    Hey guys,

    today I saw a goblin list on which my first reaction was: Oh boy, what a crap. Then I got curious, watched the vid and the player made some good points.
    I'll first post the list and then point out what I think:

    //Lands [22]
    4 Wasteland
    4 Badlands, 4 Auntie's Hovel
    8 Mountain
    2 Chrome Mox

    //Core [26]
    ...

    //Others [12]
    4 Warren Instigator
    4 Goblin Chieftain

    1 Gempalm Incinerator
    1 Stingscourger
    2 Warren Weirding

    //Sideboard [15]
    4 Mindbreak Trap
    4 Leyline of the Void
    4 Perish
    2 Boartusk Liege
    1 Pithing Needle

    My first thoughts:
    * very few removal + poorly splitted
    * I'd rather have mountains than Chrome Mox
    * 4 Perish, no Pyrokinesis - seems bad to me
    * 4 WI, 4 Chieftain, 2 Boartusk Liege - RARR!!! this deck is aggressive like hell

    On the second glance I find 4 Chieftain + 2 Lieges interesting. Plague doesn't request enchantment removal anymore. This makes Humility and MOat virtually the only enchantments to worry about (maybe a reason to drop enchantment hate completely, since Landstill isn't the most popular deck right now.
    Chrome Mox is very interesting. CM trades cardadvantage for speed. This is what what our deck needs: speed. We are very good in having cards in hand that we just don't need at a particular moments - cards that are better imprinted in Chrome Mox.
    Pithing Needle is a bit random. The black splash isn't needed IMO since the MD removal is better in Mono R and Pyrokinesis is more flexible than Perish (and doesn't clash with Boartusk Liege).
    Unfortunately the many RR-manacosts make Rishadan Port very questinable.
    Following this train of thought the updated list would look like this:

    //Lands [22]
    4 Wastelands
    16 Mountain
    2 Chrome Mox

    //Core [25]
    -1 Piledriver

    //Others [13]
    3 Gempalm Incinerator
    2 Stingscourger

    4 Warren Instigator
    4 Goblin Chieftain


    //Sideboard [15]
    4 Chalice of the Void
    2 Tormod's Crypt, 1 Relic of Progenitus
    3 Pyrokinesis, 1 Goblin Sharpshooter
    2 Boartusk Liege
    1 Goblin Tinkerer
    1 Pulverize


    This deck is totally aggressive while having only very few possibilities of dealing with threats in form of artifacts and enchantments. It seems like it's strategy is to win before any critical cards get online. My question: is it reasonable to go for the all-or-nothing aggro strategy or should we stick to reliable splashes, run more removal and thus be more more flexible?
    Hi i´m testing also an agressive list:


    //Lands
    4 Wasteland
    17 Mountain

    //Creatures
    4 Goblin Lackey
    4 Warren Instigator
    4 Goblin Piledriver
    4 Goblin Matron
    4 Goblin Warchief
    4 Goblin Chieftain
    4 Goblin Ringleader
    4 Goblin Wardriver
    1 Siege-Gang Commander
    1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
    1 Goblin Pyromancer

    //Other
    4 AEther Vial


    Pure aggro without any removel main.

    My question to your list is: Why Boartusk Liege and not Goblin King in Sb?
    King cost one less to play...

  12. #212
    Siege-Gang Commander
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    @GoboLord: A friend of mine placed top eight at a 39 man tournament (Eindhoven, The Netherlands) with a similar list (mono red).
    Because you are running four Lackeys and four Instigators you might as well add two Smoldering Spires main deck to maximize connections without adding more removal spells to the main deck. In the mono red version I would run the following removal package: 1 Gempalm Incinerator, 3 Stingscourgers.
    I would also replace the Chrome Moxes with Gemstone Caverns. With Chrome Mox you always have to imprint a goblin, which you don't want in some matches or when you have a hand with three or more lands. With GC you always have a choice to either remove land or something different. In the worse case you still have the option of playing it as a colourless land without removing anything else. Also note that GC helps a lot with splashes since it produces mana of any colour.
    Lastly I would replace one Siege-Gang with Kiki-Jiki in a list with four Instigators. Matron -> Kiki-Jiki with one connect is just sick.

    @necba: I like Wardriver in your list a lot. I would however try to fit in one Stingscourger... having a tutor-able spell that can remove just about any target is always useful.
    Boartusk Liege survives a lot of removal spells that King doesn't, because a 3/4 body is pretty big.
    Last edited by Avatara; 03-08-2011 at 09:33 AM.

  13. #213

    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by necba View Post
    My question to your list is: Why Boartusk Liege and not Goblin King in Sb?
    Boartusk Liege survives Firespout
    Boartusk Liege survives Lightning Bolt

    Boartusk Liege survives Wild Nacatl
    Goblin King is terrible against the Mirror
    Goblin King is terrible against the odd deck that plays a shapeshifter

  14. #214

    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Just a few notes on Chrome Mox

    T1 Chrome Mox + Instigator
    T2 Skirk Prospector + Kiki-Jiki + Lightning Crafter

    T1 Chrome Mox + Piledriver
    T2 Warchief
    T3 Matron + Piledriver

    T1 Chrome Mox + Piledriver
    T2 Chieftain
    T3 Matron + Lackey

    T1 Chrome Mox + Instigator
    T2 Matron + Matron + SGC
    T3 Chieftain

    T1 Chrome Mox + Lackey + Wasteland
    T2 Piledriver + SGC
    T3 swing & sac a token...

    T1 Chrome Mox + MWM
    T2 Chieftain
    T3 Piledriver

    T1 Chrome Mox + Chrome Mox + Warchief
    T2 SGC
    T3 Sac 2 tokens

    T1 Chrome Mox + Chrome Mox + Chieftain
    T2 Matron
    T3 Piledriver + Lackey

    T1 Lackey
    T2 Chrome Mox + Warchief + SGC
    T3 Matron + Piledriver

    T1 Vial
    T2 Chrome Mox + Warchief + Lackey + Matron
    T3 Matron + Matron + Piledriver

    T1 Chrome Mox + Vial + Lackey
    T2 Chieftain + Matron
    T3 Matron + Piledriver

    T1 Chrome Mox + Rishadan Port
    T2 Warchief
    T3 Gempalm Incinerator + Piledriver + Piledriver

    T1 Lackey
    T2 Piledriver + Matron
    T3 Chrome Mox + Warchief + Piledriver

    T1 Chrome Mox + MWM
    T2 MWM + Kuldotha Rebirth
    T3 Chieftain Yeah!

    T1 Chrome Mox + Instigator
    T2 SGC + SGC
    T3 Chieftain

    T1 Lackey
    T2 Chrome Mox + Chieftain + SGC
    T3 Sac 2 Tokens

    And there are probably loads more....

  15. #215
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Hmm, I think that an agressive list is pretty much nice in theory. But wouldn't be Fast Zoo a better option for this All-or-Nothing strategy?

  16. #216
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Vandalize View Post
    Hmm, I think that an agressive list is pretty much nice in theory. But wouldn't be Fast Zoo a better option for this All-or-Nothing strategy?
    It's not "all-or-nothing". You still have Vials, Matrons, Ringleaders, and everything that makes the deck good.
    I tested with 2 Caverns for a while waaaay back. It was nice. Could not remember why I ever took them out.
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  17. #217
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    GoblboLord: Could you please post the link to that video, I am really interested in seeing the vid as that list looks interesting.
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  18. #218
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Here it is: Found it on BeNeLegacy

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  19. #219
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    Isn't the ability to go between being a control deck and being an aggro deck the best part about goblins? Completely taking out the control aspect of the deck makes it too linear, i believe. If you do that, you might as well play 16 lord folk, 16 lord elves, affinity, sligh, or zoo

  20. #220
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    Re: [DTB] Vial Goblins 2.0

    "Uh, I'm gonna play a Perish for his Knight and Kitchen Finks... Oh, wait! My Boartusk Liege is green also! HAHAHAHAHA"

    That was silly.

    Hey, if I attack with a Warren Instigator and it connects, and on my first trigger I cheat a Goblin Chieftain into play, my opponent will take 1 damage from the first attack and 2 from the second? What if my WI receives a Stifle? Only one of the tirggers get stifled?
    Last edited by Vandalize; 03-08-2011 at 05:41 PM.

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