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Thread: [Deck] Goblins

  1. #5861
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    I have not seen the video, but is it possible he cracked the Relic to draw a card? If he was mana screwed he might have been looking for a mana.
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    Quote Originally Posted by goblinsplayer View Post
    4-1 in the open with goblins. Wish me luck.
    Did you finish in the money?

  3. #5863

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    I am sorry if this has already been brought up or asked, but has anyone tried a Stoneforge Mystic package? Sideboarding Manriki-Gusari for Batterskull and Basilisk Collar to pair with Sharpshooter to wipe the board against aggro matches alongside Jitte/Batterskull of our own mainboard. It seems possible since we are already splashing white for Thalia.

  4. #5864
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by DredgingLoam View Post
    I am sorry if this has already been brought up or asked, but has anyone tried a Stoneforge Mystic package? Sideboarding Manriki-Gusari for Batterskull and Basilisk Collar to pair with Sharpshooter to wipe the board against aggro matches alongside Jitte/Batterskull of our own mainboard. It seems possible since we are already splashing white for Thalia.
    Yup, it has been tried by some people (including me) about 2 years ago. As far as I can remember the idea was discarded quickly thereafter, mainly because SFM + Equipments didn't fit the aggressive strategy well, and ate up too much mana. I tested 3 SFMs paired with any combination of those equipments:
    Umezawa's Jitte
    Infiltration Lens
    Batterskulls
    Basilisk Collar

    I concluded that Basilisk Collar was the only card that did something impactful and that it should be tested in combination with Sparksmith rather than SFM.
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  5. #5865
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    I was watching the scg live and there was a guy playing goblins turn 7 , he was at a 4-2 score. I don't know if he was "goblinsplayer" but aniway he unfortunately lost to maverick. Game 1 the maverick player had a sword of fire and ice main deck and he cast armageddon after having it equipped. Game 2 turn 1 lackey, maverick zenith for dryad arbor, waste driad arbor lackey connects and cheats in siege-gang commander, but then the goblin guy missed land drops for about 7-8 turns and eventually lost.

    aniway his list was R/B with Wort,Boggart Auntie and goblin tinkerer as artifact hate. I think he also played warren weirding, i don't know the sideboard.

  6. #5866

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    My doubt was, why, why he wanted that much artifact hate ou enchantment hate?
    RUG dont play Eplage, Equipment, or anything that is really a problem to us in form of artifact or enchantment. So, you crack your relic, that probably can give you at least 2~3 turns of life, in order to draw a card, ok. But then you fetch for a taiga? When you are in need of lands? Agains RUG+wasteland?

    In that moment I would only went for my splash if it could win the game for me, and that is my problem, I can´t see it, and I prefer to imagine that I am blind rather than Max T is dumb.

    Anyway, was nice to see a gempalm hitting the table for an alpha strike =]

  7. #5867
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    I also don't get why he kept TSH postboard. Maybe he thinks it's better than Kinesis or ReB to increase the goblin count, but I disagree. Don't get why he searched the Taiga G3 too.
    Cracking the Relic, though questionable, I could back up. Don't think it was a bad play if he didn't had more plays. He was taking 3 a turn, so he needed to be able to race or find an answer. The extra card was needed for that.

    Edit: Andrew got quite unlucky on his 2nd game. Sad to see it.
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  8. #5868

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by ScatmanX View Post
    I also don't get why he kept TSH postboard. Maybe he thinks it's better than Kinesis or ReB to increase the goblin count, but I disagree. Don't get why he searched the Taiga G3 too.
    Cracking the Relic, though questionable, I could back up. Don't think it was a bad play if he didn't had more plays. He was taking 3 a turn, so he needed to be able to race or find an answer. The extra card was needed for that.

    Edit: Andrew got quite unlucky on his 2nd game. Sad to see it.
    Agreed on all counts. The Relic play wasn't obviously bad in the situation he was facing. But I was also perplexed about the Taiga fetch, not to mention keeping in TSH to begin with--Pithing Needle is the only thing I've seen RUG bring in and that's sort of an outside case. Seems to me like TSH is an auto-SB in that case in favor of REB, but then again, I have no idea what he did or didn't bring in from the board. And really, MaxT knows more about the deck than I ever will if I play it for another sixty years.

    That G2 really was brutal. Any land drops and the guy is in great position to win it. T2 SGC ought to be money in the bank when the opponent isn't holding an answer.

  9. #5869
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Well, if RUG is going to side in pithing needle is reasonable to keep 1 hooligan in. Needle shuts off your best cards against RUG, namely aether vial and Relic of progenitus.

    For sure I wouldn't side in krosan grips, but 1 hooligan is fine in my opinion.

  10. #5870

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by EluThingol View Post
    That G2 really was brutal. Any land drops and the guy is in great position to win it. T2 SGC ought to be money in the bank when the opponent isn't holding an answer.
    Or if he dropped a krenko instead of a SGC he would have won. The nice thing about connecting with lackey->krenko is that you can use your mana to play your hand and meanwhile krenko will lead to the win. SGC requires mana and if you are mana starved like he was you cannot neither get use of it nor play goblins in your hand. Not drawing a second land for so many turn is unfair anyway...

  11. #5871
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    I had the opportunity to watch a couple of the SCG matches with goblins involved this sunday, and one thing I noticed was how weak Wasteland always seemed to be on the goblin side. Most of the time it was a colorless producing nonbasic land, and the few times where its sac ability was used it didn't change much, such as when the Threshold player already had 3 lands in play.

  12. #5872
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Hello,
    Long time lurker here.

    Went to a local Legacy tournament for 3 round, only 9 players.

    My List (Basically Max Teitze list):

    //Lands (23)
    3 Mountain
    1 Taiga
    1 Plateau
    3 Scalding Tarn
    3 Arid Mesa
    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 Rishadan Port
    4 Wasteland

    //Core [26]
    4 Gempalm Incinerator
    3 Mogg War Marshal
    1 Goblin Sharpshooter
    1 Skirk Prospector
    1 Stingscourger
    1 Tin Street Hooligan

    //Sideboard
    1 Sulfur Elemental
    2 Krosan Grip
    3 Relic of Progenitus
    3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
    3 Confusion in the Ranks
    3 Pyrokinesis

    Round 1 - Shardless BUG Control
    Game 1 - He simply fell over. My first turn Goblin Lackey never connected as he put a Deathrite Shaman in the way but I dropped a second turn 2 with an Aether Vial. The connect on the following turn let Siege-Gang Commander do his job. A strong card alone. Better when you follow it up with Skirk Prospector and Goblin Sharpshooter amongst others.
    I side boarded in 3 Relic of Progenitus and took out 1 Piledriver, Stingscourger and Goblin Sharpshooter
    Game 2 - As always my turn 1 Goblin Lackey had a Deathrite Shaman in the way. It ground into a long game with him getting a Pernicious Deed out and 5 mana. I dropped a Siege-Gang Commander for the full 5 mana to entice his deed. After that worked I dropped a second Siege-Gang Commander from my hand.

    Round 2 - Storm
    Game 1 - I kept an opening of Mountain, Rishadan Port, Wasteland, Cavern of Souls, Aether Vial and a Goblin Piledriver. Against storm, I can live with that. I wasted his first land drop and he missed land drops for 2 turns. He attempted to go off and fizzled pretty badly on his Ad Nauseum and I got to hit him again.
    I sided in 3 Thalia and 3 Relic of Progenitus (as I saw a Cabal Ritual). I took out 4 Gempalm Incinerators, Stingscourger and Goblin Sharpshooter
    Game 2 - I mulled to 4 to find Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, 2 Rishadan Port, and Goblin Piledriver. I held down his land for 1 turn, found a Cavern of souls and snap named human. 4 turns passed of me porting and bashing for 2 till I found a Mountain. When he was at 12 life he stormed out and fizzled into 8 goblins. That actually stopped my attacks long enough for him to build a new hand and pull the sideboard Empty the Warrens with Burning Wish for 26 goblins this time. I had the matron, haste and mana, too bad I boarded out my Goblin Sharpshooter.
    Game 3 - Turn 1 Waste a Gemstone Mine, Turn 2 Mountain Vial, Turn 3 Rishadan Port, lackey off vial on End of Turn. It was all really good news for me. Apparently I'm pretty lucky.

    Round 3 - BUG Control (BUG Walkers wielded by Mike Kletz, a local player)
    We called it a draw as it was a 3 round tournament and we still got store credit this way. We played it out anyway.
    Game 1 - My turn 1 lackey was once again interrupted by a turn 1 Deathrite Shaman. After 2 turns of do nothing plays, involving a small Tarmogoyf (Wasn't mainboard in his original list) and a Mogg War Marshal he dropped a Garruk Relentless and started wolfing. The game continued to stall and he was beginning to get Life from the Loam online recurring Wastelands and Cabal Pit. I vialed in a Gobin Ringleader, and Gempalmed two wolves. I took this moment to bash Garruks face in. I lost a large portion of my army. Two turns later my vial dropped a Siege-Gang Commander, he was wasting my lands, only had my 3 basics. We were both at low life totals so the double sacrifice off Siege-Gang Commander was all I needed to close out the game.
    I boarded in 3 Relic of Progenitus. I took out 2 Goblin Piledriver and 1 Goblin Sharpshooter.
    Game 2 - This game was very similar to the last game except I didn't win it. Right at the end he dropped an unexpected [card]Engineered Plague[/card]. A new card in his list (He must have put it in because I stomped him last Monday).
    I boarded in 2 Krosan Grip. I took out 1 Skirk Prospector and 1 Goblin Piledriver
    Game 3 - I didn't have an aggressive start, but I figured it would be OK as he was playing a really slow deck. Around turn 3 he was board clogging with a Tarmogoyf and a Deathrite Shaman and I had 2 Mogg War Marshals, a Goblin Warchief and a Goblin Piledriver. It was quickly unclogged by an Engineered Plague. On my next turn I was holding the Krosan Grip and dropped a Fetch I had the luxury of being able to hold, brought out a Taiga and rid the world of that enchantment. Unfortunately the damage was done and I was not able to recover as fast as he was. A Jace, the Mind Sculptor caused my demise. I died with 6 cards in hand and my 3 mountains that he couldn't Wasteland.

    Record:
    2-0 Shardless BUG
    2-1 Storm (Homebrew)
    1-1-1 BUG Walkers (Though I lost it in 1-2)

    Thoughts:
    I think I'll keep Goblin Piledriver at lowest of 3 against Shardless BUG, most of their creatures are Blue in retrospect.
    I prefer playing against storm, its actually the match up I have the most practice with. Sometimes you win, sometimes you waste them out.
    BUG Walkers I was destroying a week ago (we played several games). With the addition of 2 Engineered Plague the game seems so much harder to beat. Especially since I don't have any lord effects.

    After talking to several Storm players, they seem to fear Chalice of the Void an equal amount as Thalia, Guardian of Thraben. With this knowledge I'm going to change out my Plateau for a Mountain (Which is nice against Wasteland) and my SB Thalia's for Chalice of the Void.


    @ Hof - I feel the same about Wasteland. You need to be really sure before you use it, goblins are incredibly mana hungry. I rarely use wasteland unless I can do it twice in a row, if I have surplus lands and its their first land drop, or if there is a utility land that needs to die. Mishra's Factory, Creeping Tar Pit, Maze of Ith etc. Also, against combo.

  13. #5873
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Olaf Forkbeard View Post
    Round 3 - BUG Control
    I boarded in 3 Relic of Progenitus. I took out 2 Goblin Piledriver and 1 Goblin Sharpshooter.
    ...
    I boarded in 2 Krosan Grip. I took out 1 Skirk Prospector and 1 Goblin Piledriver
    Taking out Piledriver against control is usually a bad thing. You want to kill them fast, and Piledriver is the easiest way to do it.
    Also, they are great against E.Plague too, since they can survive one, and sometimes bash for 4 or more. Keep them in against control decks, specially when thei're playing Plague.
    You could have taken out Shooter (as you did), TSH, 2 Gempalms, Sting, and maybe even a MWM.

    Another note: I know they play that manabase, but it just look so bad. Guess you agree now too.

    Thanks for the quick report.
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  14. #5874

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Olaf Forkbeard View Post
    Round 2 - Storm
    Game 1 - I kept an opening of Mountain, Rishadan Port, Wasteland, Cavern of Souls, Aether Vial and a Goblin Piledriver. Against storm, I can live with that. I wasted his first land drop and he missed land drops for 2 turns. He attempted to go off and fizzled pretty badly on his Ad Nauseum and I got to hit him again.
    I think you were pretty lucky to win this game here.


    Quote Originally Posted by Olaf Forkbeard View Post
    Round 3 - BUG Control (BUG Walkers wielded by Mike Kletz, a local player)
    We called it a draw as it was a 3 round tournament and we still got store credit this way. We played it out anyway.
    Game 1 - My turn 1 lackey was once again interrupted by a turn 1 Deathrite Shaman. After 2 turns of do nothing plays, involving a small Tarmogoyf (Wasn't mainboard in his original list) and a Mogg War Marshal he dropped a Garruk Relentless and started wolfing. The game continued to stall and he was beginning to get Life from the Loam online recurring Wastelands and Cabal Pit. I vialed in a Gobin Ringleader, and Gempalmed two wolves. I took this moment to bash Garruks face in. I lost a large portion of my army. Two turns later my vial dropped a Siege-Gang Commander, he was wasting my lands, only had my 3 basics. We were both at low life totals so the double sacrifice off Siege-Gang Commander was all I needed to close out the game.
    I boarded in 3 Relic of Progenitus. I took out 2 Goblin Piledriver and 1 Goblin Sharpshooter.
    Game 2 - This game was very similar to the last game except I didn't win it. Right at the end he dropped an unexpected [card]Engineered Plague[/card]. A new card in his list (He must have put it in because I stomped him last Monday).
    I boarded in 2 Krosan Grip. I took out 1 Skirk Prospector and 1 Goblin Piledriver
    Game 3 - I didn't have an aggressive start, but I figured it would be OK as he was playing a really slow deck. Around turn 3 he was board clogging with a Tarmogoyf and a Deathrite Shaman and I had 2 Mogg War Marshals, a Goblin Warchief and a Goblin Piledriver. It was quickly unclogged by an Engineered Plague. On my next turn I was holding the Krosan Grip and dropped a Fetch I had the luxury of being able to hold, brought out a Taiga and rid the world of that enchantment. Unfortunately the damage was done and I was not able to recover as fast as he was. A Jace, the Mind Sculptor caused my demise. I died with 6 cards in hand and my 3 mountains that he couldn't Wasteland.
    I think what you want to deal with Planeswalkers is haste creatures. Given the number of creatures he had to play with I wouldn't have taken out removal spells. Here's the order I dislike your MD cards in: Prospector, Stingscourger, TSH, Piledriver/MWM (in a mix). So if you are bringing in 3 Relic and 2 Grips, I'd have cut one of each of those cards.

    Quote Originally Posted by Olaf Forkbeard View Post
    I think I'll keep Goblin Piledriver at lowest of 3 against Shardless BUG, most of their creatures are Blue in retrospect.
    I prefer playing against storm, its actually the match up I have the most practice with. Sometimes you win, sometimes you waste them out.
    BUG Walkers I was destroying a week ago (we played several games). With the addition of 2 Engineered Plague the game seems so much harder to beat. Especially since I don't have any lord effects.
    You don't need lord effects. Haste creatures is enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by Olaf Forkbeard View Post
    After talking to several Storm players, they seem to fear Chalice of the Void an equal amount as Thalia, Guardian of Thraben. With this knowledge I'm going to change out my Plateau for a Mountain (Which is nice against Wasteland) and my SB Thalia's for Chalice of the Void.
    I think you want BOTH CotV and Thalia vs Storm. 4 Hate cards is just not enough. I would ditch the Sulfur Elemental and 3 Confusion in the Ranks for 4 CotV.

    Quote Originally Posted by Olaf Forkbeard View Post
    @ Hof - I feel the same about Wasteland. You need to be really sure before you use it, goblins are incredibly mana hungry. I rarely use wasteland unless I can do it twice in a row, if I have surplus lands and its their first land drop, or if there is a utility land that needs to die. Mishra's Factory, Creeping Tar Pit, Maze of Ith etc. Also, against combo.
    It depends on who wants their mana more in the matchup, and who currently has board position. If neither of those questions can be answered satisfactorially, then don't waste them.

  15. #5875
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Went 5-3 in the open to come in 40th place and collect my 50 dollars. Even got to be on feature match for about 6 minutes. Anyways, here's the list I played.

    4 lackey
    4 warchief
    4 matron
    4 ringleaer
    3 incenerator
    3 piledriver
    3 tarfire
    3 MWM
    1 prospector
    1 chieftain
    1 krenko
    1 sgc
    1 sharpshooter
    1 stingscourger
    4 vial

    11 mountain
    3 port
    4 wasteland
    4 cavern

    sb
    3 pyrokinesis
    4 cotv
    3 relic
    3 pyroblast
    1 scrapper
    1 stingscourger


    I also played in the standard open to a miserable 3-3 drop. I signed up for the legacy challenge afterwards and went 3-1 to collect six packs. eww.
    Anyways, onto the main event

    Round 1: U/R delver
    game 1: I kill all his creatures and beat face. He can't do anything.
    game 2: Same thing except that there was a chalice on 1 on the board the whole time. this matchup is pretty much a bye anyways.
    1-0

    Round 2: Dredge
    game 1: I show how good mogg war marshal is against his bridges from belows. I kill him shortly afterwards.
    game 2: Relic of progenitus and a chalice for one got on the board. He cannot do anything.
    2-0

    Round 3: Deathblade
    game 1: This is the only guy that beat me in the challenge. I kill stoneforge mystic and he can't do anything afterwards.
    game 2: Geist suits up with batterskull and the game is shortly over.
    game 3: This is a game where he has infinite swords to plowshares for my blocking of his geists. I'm on camera for the last 6 minutes and I lose horribly to a second geist when I killed the first one. gross.
    2-1

    Round 4: Shardless BUG
    game 1: I mull down to 5 and see no color sources for the rest of the game. Goyf cleans me from my misery.
    game 2: Krenko does some heavy lifting. Enough has been said
    game 3: I wasteland and port him out of the game. He casts a shardless agent into a baleful strix. I cast pyrokinesis. In other words, I win.
    3-1

    Round 5: Omnitell
    game 1: He turn 2s me. Apparently, release the ants is a playable card in legacy.
    game 2: I kill him faster than he gets his combo online.
    game 3: I port him out of 3 mana. I proceed to beat with piledriver and friends. He shows me a hand full of combo pieces afterwards.
    4-1

    Round 6: RUG delver
    game 1: He gets nimble mongoose and delver online while I never draw a third land for my warchiefs and matrons. Frustrating.
    game 2: Exactly like game one except throw a tarmogoyf in there.
    4-2

    Round 7: UWR miracles
    game 1: I somehow think this is american delver after seeing a game where he has volcanic, tundra, tundra, and a geist on board. I overextend to terminus. shit.
    game 2: I play around terminus and I deny his mana. I win afterwards.
    game 3: He RIP helm kills me out of nowhere. Fuck this.
    4-3

    Round 8: U/R delver
    game 1: Kill him with my adventure time tokens while I gempalm his delvers.
    game 2: Same thing except with a tarfire involved.
    5-3

    Good enough for 40th place and my entry fee back. Yay. Now time to go home and the list overall felt great. Mono red is the best goblins splash in my opinion. My losses were due to my opponents being extremely lucky and some misplay involved. The changes I would make is take out a Krenko for a Siege-gang commander. Krenko didn't exactly pull it's weight. Thanks for reading.

  16. #5876

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    game 2: Krenko does some heavy lifting. Enough has been said
    The changes I would make is take out a Krenko for a Siege-gang commander. Krenko didn't exactly pull it's weight.
    I don't want to rehash the krenko vs. sgc debate again, just pointing out that he shines against those midrangey decks when the board's at a stalemate. In talking to opponents, aside from t2 lackey connect into sgc, they're usually more scared of watching krenko activate and take a game over. The matchups you had I would think he would shine the most are deathblade (!), bug, and rug. just my $.02.

  17. #5877
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bichon_Blitz View Post

    I don't want to rehash the krenko vs. sgc debate again, just pointing out that he shines against those midrangey decks when the board's at a stalemate. In talking to opponents, aside from t2 lackey connect into sgc, they're usually more scared of watching krenko activate and take a game over. The matchups you had I would think he would shine the most are deathblade (!), bug, and rug. just my $.02.
    When the legends rule changes next month I want to start running a list with 2 Krenko, 1 Chieftain, 4 Warchief and 0 SGC. I already run 4 MWM so SGC's tokens aren't too needed, and I honestly don't recall using SGC's Shock ability much recently. Gempalm and stingscourger have been my main removal. We shall see, I guess.

  18. #5878

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by jrw1985 View Post
    When the legends rule changes next month I want to start running a list with 2 Krenko, 1 Chieftain, 4 Warchief and 0 SGC. I already run 4 MWM so SGC's tokens aren't too needed, and I honestly don't recall using SGC's Shock ability much recently. Gempalm and stingscourger have been my main removal. We shall see, I guess.
    I don t think that the change in legend rule will make krenko any better, it will be so random to play both krenkos that it will probably be irrelevant. 2 krenkos is a very acceptable option even now though. On the other hand I suggest you to push the number of chieftains up to 3. Seven haste lords with a list running 2 krenkos 4 MWM is pretty damn amazing. You can shave off piledrivers since piledriver' s damage output is very well compensated by the +1/+1 and haste effect of chieftains. Living the dream of curving out T2 MWM, T3 chieftain, T4 krenko.

  19. #5879

    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    Agreed. I think that the legend rule will have a pretty marginal effect on Krenko. I think Thalia and Karakas are more affected by us, both in a good way. Death and Taxes would rather be able to waste us and frag our blocker, so not being able to kill them makes us a little more resilient when we play the control role in a matchup.

    I still think that as a lackey target SGC gives you far more free wins than Krenko does.

  20. #5880
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    Re: [Deck] Goblins

    I agree on Thalia. With a Vial set to two you can watch one Thalia get hit with removal and while it is on the stack vial in the other never removing her effect from the stack.
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