[Deck] Hive Mind

[dearleader]

Cutting Brainstorm/Ponder to play Chalice is just bad. I can't imagine the type of confusion that would cause someone to try this.

Discard can help you check what answers your opponent has. Maybe they could replace Dispel in the side. Perhaps if you don't expect too much combo, you can cut some of the 7 anti-combo pieces from the side. It does have a drawback of forcing you to fetch dual lands in matchups where you want basics (Merfolk, Thresh, TA) and it also ties up cantrip/tutor mana, so it's probably not worth it.

The simple answer is this: against decks that pack a lot of answers to Pacts you need to find Emrakul and protect it. If you do have discard in the SB, then game 2 you can replace some Pact of Negation with discard, which helps the Hive Mind combo by getting rid of toublesome cards and is more live when you need to force through and protect an Emrakul. Putting discard in the SB instead of the main feels wrong for some reason, but I don't really know where they'd fit in the main. Maybe they can fit in over a few PoN, but PoN is really good against most other decks.

The other solution is to just gather up Pacts until you can punch through. Most of the time, you have more pacts and cantrips/tutors to find them than your opponent has answers, and if he is actually holding a lot of answers, chances are the clock will be pretty slow.

Is Canonist really that big of a threat? i mean, it delays your combo by one turn, but they'll still lose to a single Pact of the Titan, or even a summoner's pact. Trinisphere seems to be the same. I guess if they have Canonist + Daze it'll hurt, but i think that's true whenever your opponent has too many answers you can't deal with. If you're looking for answers, then Echoing Truth is better than Hurkyl's Recall against the field.

Extirpate is pretty narrow. It basically just counters Intuition. Your opponents probably won't even bring it in unless they saw Intuition game 1, and even then, your opponent probably has more relevant cards to board in.

[mrjumbo03]

@ Death, great work with the OP... Will you be expanding it to a full-on primer any time soon? Would love to read about the deck's matchups... Also, isn't 2 Slaughter Pacts-1 Summoner's Pact configuration better because Slaughter Pact at least has some utility? Oh another question, would running the deck without the 3 duals hit the deck hard? *Duals are crazy high right now* Thanks!

[Griselpuff]

I ended up going 4-2-1, losing to CounterTop and NO Rug. Should have been 5-2 since my ANT opponent played really slowly and I was one turn away from winning.

Anyways, I do feel like this deck might not be able to make it post New Phyrexia and with all the anti combo decks going around. Mental Misstep really hurts. I've tested Gitaxian Probe, and I decided that while on paper it sounds great, in practice it leaves something to be desired. I've been playing 4 probes and 2 ponders, cutting a land and a pact for the probes. we'll see how this goes.

[pandaman]

Nope :)
You cast your Slaughter Pact (or better yet Pact of the Titan...), let your opponent's trigger resolve BEFORE playing your Pact of Negation (but still in response to your initial Pact). That way your opponent can only PoN either of your Pacts (since a counter can't target itself). Now your opponent has 2 upkeep triggers requiring UU3 and B2 or some combination of all that mana and 1-2 Stifles :)

Thanks for your help chap, that's heaps better.

Also, to akatsuki, why does Mental Misstep hurt this deck? There's only 8 1 costing spells main, none of which if countered are fatal. Restrictive, yes, but fatal, no. Postboard you could bring in 5 spells, which again aren't fatal to you if countered. Is there something I'm not seeing?

[mrjumbo03]

I'm with Pandaman, I can't see how the release of NPH will weaken this deck. Actually it makes it even stronger by being immune to all of the Mental Missteps that will be floating around (something I can't say about my other combo deck, Spiral Tide T_T).

[Griselpuff]

Don't underestimate the power of Brainstorm/Ponder in a deck like this.

Although you guys are probably right, I was just tired and not thinking clearly when I was playing last night. What really hurts this deck are cheap counters (REB and Spell Pierce), and I just realized Mental Misstep counters both of them!#

Going to start testing Misstep in the side over the pierce. I never loved the Pierce because it meant I needed to have one extra mana to combo off and usually I ended up pitching it to fow to protect my combo since going off ASAP is ideal. When you have a fow and a pierce, but no other blue cards, you might as well go for it.

*edit*

Wow, I've just gone 6-0.



I even beat a Merfolk 2-1. To be fair, I got quite lucky the two games I won but still shows the raw power of the deck.

[ryO!]

btw anybody tried this Culling Scales
we play 0 permanent and can get it online turn 2
or is it too late already ?
i ll give it a try who knows ....

@akatsuki
would you prefer probe over thoughseize ?

grim monolith is a permanent.

i am playing the hivemind/dream halls list
so no permanent
but well it sucks hard anyway, test a bit ...

[mistercakes]

grim monolith is a permanent.

[addaro]

Hi,

Is the Grim Monolith crucial? That is the last card (3 cards) that I dont have. What would be the replacement if one can not get those before a tournament?

Thank you.

[death]

Lotus Petals.


GL

[mchainmail]

I'm testing this deck out, and the one thing I don't like at all is how much it cheats on land count. Is anyone playing more than just 18-19 lands? I'm playing Kylezj's list (I've lost to it in dailies far too much...) and am thinking about cutting the 2 Summoner's Pacts for 2 Islands or duals. I hate having to burn cantrips to find lands; I'd rather have lands and use them to find business spells.

[HAVE HEART]

I have been testing this deck a little bit. It is pretty ridiculous, especially because people are awful. I think if I was playing against LSV or PV every match with this deck, then I might have a different tune, but no one actually has to play that caliber of player at their local tournament (unless you suck at life and live in Northern Virginia).

With that out of the way, I was wondering what Intuition does that Lim-Dul's Vault does not? Intuition seems a little bit easier to cast, and gives the player a live draw off the top, but Lim-Dul's Vault costs less to cast, and allows much better manipulation with cantrips. They both seem pretty similar, and I cannot figure out why Intuition is preferred.

[death]

LDV is a poor top deck. It doesn't allow you to win on the spot with Hive Mind in play if you are in need of a pact to seal the game.

[HAVE HEART]

LDV is a poor top deck. It doesn't allow you to win on the spot with Hive Mind in play if you are in need of a pact to seal the game.

Are you supposed to drop Hive Mind before you have the win in hand? Seems a little greedy.

[Griselpuff]

Hey, so I've been playing this deck online and in real life, my record is currently 32-11-2. Definitely could be playing a bit tighter, this deck gets so many free wins that I just get careless sometimes.

My current list:

// Lands
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
2 [ON] Flooded Strand
1 [B] Underground Sea
2 [B] Volcanic Island
1 [ON] Polluted Delta
2 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
2 [EX] City of Traitors
3 [ZEN] Island (1a)
1 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn

// Creatures
3 [ROE] Emrakul, the Aeons Torn

// Spells
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [FUT] Pact of the Titan
2 [FUT] Slaughter Pact
3 [TE] Intuition
4 [US] Show and Tell
4 [M10] Hive Mind
3 [UL] Grim Monolith
4 [FUT] Pact of Negation
4 [CST] Brainstorm
4 [NPH] Gitaxian Probe
3 [M10] Ponder

// Sideboard
SB: 4 [M11] Leyline of Sanctity
SB: 3 [ZEN] Mindbreak Trap
SB: 2 [NPH] Mental Misstep
SB: 3 [SHM] Firespout
SB: 3 [ZEN] Ravenous Trap

Any opinions on the following cards?

Thoughtseize/Duress/Inquisition/Cabal Therapy

Therapy goes nice with Probe.

I just never loved discard in this deck (not having tested it a ton, mind you), since usually a counter is just better because your deck is so much more powerful than almost anything out there.

Firespout > Engineered Plague because it slows down Zoo and Maverick decks (Fireblast Zoo is actually not a great matchup, you need to mull to a turn 3 win), and is effective when Merfolk have a lord out.

Junk is also not that great, even when you have Leyline. Why? Qasali Pridemage + Vindicate.

IMO, this deck has so much raw power, but is also quite draw dependent. I think Landstill will get more popular with the printing of Misstep, and I don't see a deck having tons of counters + JTMS be a good matchup.

I went 5-1-2 (actually 6-1-1 since my opp scooped) during the BOM trial and got 6th place out of 170+ (if I remember correctly). During the actual BOM, I scrubbed and went 2-4 (losing to 2 Junk, 1 MUD, 1 Fireblast Zoo). Could have played better, all matchups were definitely winnable.

[Griselpuff]

Another card I'm considering is REB. Oh and the other problem with discard is it makes you fetch your Underground Seas, when I'm perfectly happy playing basic Islands. I tried playing 4 Islands, but if Merfolk wastes your only Volcanic, your firespouts become useless.

I'm also considering Top as a 1 of. The problem is this deck is so tight that I needed to cut a Ponder. I think probe is pretty sweet in theory and often in practice since it tells you what plan to go for, but I've often found the life cost to hurt, so I try to avoid it when possible.

[Griselpuff]

cool i just went 5-0 in a magic league trial. it is magic-league, but im still happy :D

ive probably played well over 100 matches with this deck now.

[Griselpuff]

Pretty much the only thing I'm not happy about right now is the SB.

I'm going to test some cards (ideas I got from BOM sneak and show sbs)

Notably:

Misdirection and Divert (instead of Leyline, these function as counterspells and are even sweeter with against discard).
REB and Pyroblast

Basically, mulling for Leylines against discard is never fun, and missing really hurts.

Ravenous trap is no good against reanimator, so maybe I'll test faerie macabre

firespout/engineered plague just never seemed spectacular, whereas REB seems quite solid.

Missteps are there to counter pierce and pesky one mana spells, but if you only care about their counters, perhaps REB is better.

Mindbreak trap i'm fine with, although my record against TES is still fairly mediocre. Don't feel like devoting more space though.

[Guy I Don't Know]

I feel like this deck has a ton of potential, but I haven't heard about it too much, why is that? Can Mental Misstep make it any better?

[nayon]

I feel like this deck has a ton of potential, but I haven't heard about it too much, why is that? Can Mental Misstep make it any better?

Defeating Hymn decks like Junk and TA was really difficult in my testing. Especially TA, since they can back their Hymns with pressure and counterspells.