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Thread: [Deck] Ascension

  1. #1

    [Deck] Ascension

    Ascension
    Deck Primer by Elleran and co-written by BattlefieldMedic

    Table of Contents
    1 - Introduction
    2 - Why play Ascension?
    3 - Decklist
    4 - Card Choices / Explanation
    5 - Cards that were considered but didn't make the list
    6 - Matchups / Analysis


    =====================================================================

    1 - Introduction

    This is my first big post that I will be posting on this forum!

    First of all, I am the kind of deck builder who likes to look at the fringe decks or unonrthodox strategies. I love decks that seem to use loopholes or strange combos to achieve victory.

    This, deck, Ascension, is inspired by the Standard deck “Soul Sisters” by Conley Woods, who has played it to a great success. Ascension’s strategy will use some mechanics found in Soul Sisters, but this deck also has other win cons not present in Soul Sisters, so do not dismiss this deck as a thing of Standard.

    I got into this deck because I played with my own variant of Soul Sisters in Extended. After playing with it for a while, I realized that it could defeat a Legacy deck quite easily, namely Goblin. With an urge from BattlefieldMedic that I should compete in Legacy, I developed new win conditions and improved the old ones to Soul Sister. This deck is the fruit of months of playtesting and has performed excellently in real life.

    So what is Ascension?


    2 - Why play Ascension?

    Ascension is a deck that takes advantage of a resource that most other legacy archetypes ignore: life. Cards that allow us to gain life is often underestimated or even ignored for logical reasons: No card advantage or tempo advantage and life does not affect the immediate battlefield. However, life gain in small quantities gives time. Life gain in large quantities gives near invulnerability.

    Some reasons why you should play this deck:
    -If you hate losing to Zoo but love aggro decks
    -If you hate getting mana screwed
    -If you want to build a highly competitive deck for a low price

    This deck has the power equal to, if not greater than, Zoo decks. It is different from Merfolk, from Countertop, and from Storm. This deck aims to add consistency and staying power throughout the mid to late game without losing steam. Sounds good?

    The deck has a ridiculously low mana curve of nearly/over 30 1-cmc costing creatures and spells. Despite opening up a few weaknesses (Countertop and chalice), this adds speed as well as consistency, even with low land count on the field. The deck is also mono-color and thus is completely immune to non-basic land hate.The deck also has an unique ability to shrug off most attacks and to render most aggro decks harmless, thanks to the life-gaining engine.



    3 - Decklist

    The more updated decklist is available later in the thread: [[ Post 290 - The Updated Decklist ]]

    What you guys have been waiting for. Here is the currently optimized decklist for Ascension [OUTDATED DECKLIST]:

    ASCENSION [as of April 13, 2011]
    by Elleran

    //Creatures (33)
    4x Martyr of Sands
    4x Mother of Runes
    4x Soul Warden
    4x Ranger of Eos
    4x Soul's Attendant
    4x Ajani's Pridemate
    4x Serra Ascendant
    3x Student of Warfare
    2x Knight of the White Orchid

    //Sorceries (3)
    3x Proclamation of Rebirth

    //Instants (3)
    3x Swords to Plowshares

    //Artifacts (2)
    2x Umezawa's Jitte

    //Lands (19)
    19x Plains

    ----

    //Sideboard:
    3x Relic of Progenitus
    3x AEther Vial
    3x Leyline of Sanctity
    1-3x Serenity
    3-4x Pithing Needle
    0-1x Runed Halo


    4 - Card Choices / Explanations

    First, the win cons.
    4x Serra Ascendant - The namesake of the deck. Serra Ascendant is one of the best creatures ever printed in the right deck. This card makes Tarmagoyf look like a joke. In this deck, Serra Ascendant is basically 1 for a 6/6 life-link flyer. Sounds fair, right? Combined with Martyr of Sands, Serra Ascendant will often put the opponent onto a 3 turn clock.

    4x Ajani Pridemate - The powerhouse of the deck. This card can be directly compared to a Goyf because of its 2 cmc. However, combined with Soul’s Attendant and Soul Warden, this card will often enter the battlefield immediately as a 3/3, if not a 4/4, then proceed to become 6/6 and then 10/10 in about 1 or 2 turns thanks to the huge number of 1 cmc creatures in this deck as well as the opponent’s creatures triggering the Soul triggers. At worst, Pridemate works as a lightning rod for removal.

    3x Student of Warfare - This card is often underestimated. Because of its expensive mana cost to level up, it is considered a good card in Standard but doesn’t see much play in Legacy. Against Merfolk and Countertop, this card will either get FoW’d or dazed on turn 1. Otherwise, the game can quickly become a threat that will go out of hand. Student of Warfare has the following advantages:
    -3/3 first striker on turn 2 with haste. This will kill Nacatl on turn 2, block most tribal creatures without dying, and basically deter the opponent from attacking.
    -Once it lands on the field, it can no longer be countered. Combined with Mother of Runes, this card is immune to instant spot removals and will be free to level up.
    -Against decks like Countertop or those that run Chalice, first turn Student will be able to pose an effective threat even if no other creature is played (or able to be played) for an extended time. Simply leveling up Student keeps it above-par in strength (3/3 first strike on turn 2, 4/4 double strike by turn 4).
    -Double strike will automatically pose a great threat to the opponent. Combine the double strike with either Jitte or Mother of Runes for maximum damage.
    -1 cmc. Thus, this card can be brought back with Proclamation of Rebirth.

    Because Ascension is very unlikely to die early (unless to Storm or similarly powerful combo decks), this deck will definitely have time to level up Student as the game goes on. This gives Ascension the strength of being able to play the mid-ranged game, if necessary. Once the 4th mana is paid, double strike can be achieved on the immediate next turn of playing Student of Warfare. Furthermore, its first/double strike ability allows Student to wield the Jitte with exceptional skill.

    Unfortunately, because this card does require so much mana to become powerful, only 3 is used.

    4x Mother of Runes - This card protects against Maelstrom Pulses, StPs, PtEs, red burns, combat damage, and miscellaneous harmful auras. This card also makes unblockable Ajani Pridemates and Students for the win. It’s the utility of Ascension that gives it the edge to fly to victory.

    The works:
    4x Soul Warden / 4x Soul’s Attendant - Basically 8 copies of “Soul” triggers. The sisters function as the workhorses for the deck. They enable Ascendant, power up Pridemate, and these give the deck staying power against Zoo, ANY red deck, and Affinity. These are also randomly good against Empty the Warrens and Dredge.

    4x Martyr of Sands - The best enabler in the deck. Martyr allows the “first turn Serra Ascendant, second turn Martyr combo”, which turns on Serra to be a 6/6 life link flyer swinging on turn 2, ending the game by turn 5 if not answered. Quantitatively, this deck will usually benefit from about 9 to 12 life from each Martyr. To put that into perspective, 9 life means two hits from a 4/5 Goyf, or 3 Lightning Bolts, or a Piledriver attacking with 3 Goblins and a Lord. This card is also randomly good against Dredge, because of it’s ability to go to the graveyard.

    Card Advantage:
    4x Ranger of Eos - Also known as the win con fetcher. This card can immediately hand over 2 Serra Ascendants if your life is over 30. This card can fetch 1 Martyr and 1 Serra otherwise. At worst, this card still gets you 2 chump blockers, as well as a 3/2 body. Almost always, this card will be the card that gets Cabal Therapied or Thoughtseized.

    2x Knight of White Orchid - Basically a 1 for a 2/2 first striker. Fetches a land most of the time. Because this deck has such a high 1-cmc density, that one extra land will make a significant improvement in tempo and the ability to put pressure. Unfortunately, the 'weakest' card slot as of now. However, still a promising aggro creature with CA.

    3x Proclamation of Rebirth - A tremendously powerful recovery card against mass removals. This card can deal with Pernicious Deed, Explosives, Chalice at 1, and WoG or Damnation. Its forecast ability is basically negligible.

    **This card allows a trick that gets this deck around Chalice at 1 by intentionally having 1 cmc creatures be countered, then using Proclamation to return them back onto the battlefield. Also, using level 7 Student or powered up Ascendant to block, then returning them from the dead is also a powerful use of Proclamation. Unfortunately, this card can flood one’s hand and should not be a 4-of because this card is useless if creatures are not drawn.

    Others:
    3x Swords to Plowshares - The classic white removal. Gets rid of creatures that actually threaten you (which is rare). Does what it does well. Enough said.

    3x Umezewa’s Jitte - This is actually in here to destroy the opponent’s Jitte in case the opponent plays theirs because this deck is weak against Jitte. However, this deck’s creatures can easily wield the Jitte better than can the opponent’s creatures thanks to this decks’ first and double strikers. Having a level 7 Student with a Jitte almost always results in gg from the opponent. Flying Serra with a Jitte is pretty handy too.

    The Sideboard:
    3x Relic of Progenitus - This is against graveyard based-decks, such as Seismic Assualt, Dredge, and Reanimator.

    3x Leyline of Sanctity - This is against mill/Belcher/Tendrils deck. Especially against mill (since Spiral Tide is beginning to become popular) because this deck has no mainboard answer to mill decks.

    3x AEther Vial - Against CounterTop and Chalice at 1. More on this during match analyses.

    1-3x Serenity - Against Affinity and Enchantress. With Affinity beginning to come back with Tezzeret and the Scars block, Serenity makes sure that Affinity dies. Hard. Enchantress will also cry when Serenity is used. Unfortunately, the side effect of Serenity is that it destroys AEther Vials if Serenity is used at the same time (as well as Leyline, but Serenity will probably not be used with Leyline). This also destroys Chalice, Stax, and Engineered Plague.

    2-3x Pithing Needle - Answer to Grim Lavamancer, Seismic Assault, Deed, and Explosives. Other activated ability dies against this.

    0-1x Runed Halo - Depending on your meta, this will give an answer to Progenitus, but not Emrakul, unfortunately. Show and Tell will just be a really bad matchup for this deck. :(



    5 - Cards that were considered but didn't make the list

    *Wasteland - The colorless mana basically does nothing in this deck. It doesn't provide any first turn drop and can be used only for Martyr of Sands trigger, Ajani Pridemate, Ranger of Ios, Proclamation of Rebirth, and Jitte. Not a good choice.

    *Auriok Champion - Not fast enough. A turn 2 for a Soul trigger is not effective. The Protection vs. Red and Black helps block Goblin and Zoo forever, Auriok Champion doesn't do anything beyond that. Also, its 2-cmc makes is so it is unreturnable from the graveyard with Proclamation.

    *Green Color in general - Again, using another color means that this deck needs to splash a color, i.e. fetches/duals. This is bad for two reasons: 1. The deck features immunity to wastelands and non-basic land effects. Duals will mess this up. 2. This deck is built with budget in mind. Yes, Duals are viable for many players on this site. However, I wish to keep this in theme, even in terms of budget. Also, the benefit that Green gives (Essence Warden, Leyline of Vitality, Ageless Entity, Tarmagoyf, etc) can all be replaced in White or simply overlap unnecssary effects, such as Essence Warden (we don't need 12 Soul triggers).

    *Fetchlands - They thin our decks. However, using fetches means that we are losing life early. Our goal is to hit 30 life as fast as we can, but losing 1 or 2 life within the first 2 turns mean that we just undid 1~2 Soul triggers, which may be critical when Martyr of Sands can give us 9 (rather than 12) life. No need to risk not reaching 30 life for a reason as simple as 'to thin the deck'. Also, fetches will power up the opponent's Terravore, which we don't want.

    *AEther Vial in the main - AEther Vials have proven to clog our deck more than they help it. I have tried putting 3 Vials in the main in previous versions, and they turned out to be less valuable than having drawn the alternatives. Drawing a Vial mid-late game proves to be useless because our deck is already more than capable of continuously putting down threats and dumping the hand relatively quickly. Vials are basically only conditionally good against control decks, and thus belong in the SB.

    *Path to Exile - An alternative to Swords to Plowshares. However, PtE did not make the list. Helping the opponent in the early game by giving them an extra land allows him/her to play threats faster. Because Ascension focuses on mid-late game, getting beat up early game will be detrimental to progress to victory. Giving them life can always be undone. Giving them a land cannot be.

    *Hero of Bladehold - Too slow. This card is basically a weaker version of Ranger of Ios in this deck. Hero can create 2 soldier tokens while Ranger can create 2 6/6 Life-link flyers, so Ranger wins. Yes, Hero can power up the 1/1 weenies in this deck. However, few 2/1 creatures is less threatening than a couple 6/6 flyers.

    *Stoneforge Mystic - Undoubtedly useful. Unfortunately, she has no synergy with the rest of the deck. The equipment Mystic can fetch is usually not as good as what the extra mana could be used for (ex. Play Stoneforge on t2, drop Sword of X and Y on turn 3, equip on t4. This takes too long.) Also, getting too many Stoneforge Mystics is bad because Stoneforge itself doesn't provide any aggro or synergy with anything else in the deck.

    *4th Swords to Plowshares - Removals in this deck is usually unnecessary. Creatures like Tarmagoyf can usually be ignored, and only creatures super big like Marit Lage (Dark Depth), Knight of the Reliquary, or Goblin Piledriver get targeted by StP anyway. Creatures that may be pesky (Dark Confidant, lords, land creatures, etc) may also be dealt with Swords. Using the 4th one tended to flood my hand occasionally where as 3 StP usually led to one being drawn and 2 somewhat rarely. Because Ascension rolls better when lots of creatures are drawn, 4th StP diluted the strategy more than it helped it.

    *Suture Priest - Another 2-cmc Soul trigger. Suture Priest's ability to deal damage to opponent is good, but not good enough. The beat sticks in this deck is much faster and efficient at dealing damage than Suture Priest. i.e. this card was not a big enough threat.




    6 - Matchups and Analysis

    Merfolk:
    POSITIVE

    This deck’s hitters are superior to their individual creatures. If they can create enough of a board presence using multiple lords, we start having problems. Luckily, Ascension runs the best spot removal in the game. Their counterspells are also less effective because of the density of threats that we play - play around them. Early Student and perhaps an uncountered Ajani will win the game. Overall, merfolk is a favorable matchup. If you want to, AEther Vial can be SB’ed in for few sisters to help work around their countermagic.

    Goblin:
    VERY POSITIVE

    The number of creatures they play goes to our advantage. Thanks to the Soul triggers, we will easily be able to take few direct hits from Piledrivers before it begins to matter. The density of 1 drops makes it impossible for Lackey to go through, and they have no answer to a quickly-enlarging Ajani Pridemate nor to a flying Ascendant. No need to SB anything. Based on my testing, almost a 100% win rate.

    Zoo:
    VERY POSITIVE

    Compared to the firepower of Ascension, Goyfs are feeble and Nacatls are jokes. Knights of the Reliquary go farming or are chump blocked or we just eat their damage. The power of Ascension is the power to gain so much life that standard aggro creatures are rendered useless. When we are able to take the 4/5 Goyfs or 7/7 Knights each turn while having a net-gain of life, Zoo cannot win. Again, Soul triggers shine as well as Mother of Runes. Almost 100% chance of victory based on my testing.

    T.E.S. / A.N.T.:
    NEUTRAL-NEGATIVE

    Surprisingly, if Martyr of Sands goes off within the first 2 turns for a net gain life of 9 or 12, the Storm deck will probably have to take few more turns to ensure that it can shoot for 29 or 32 life. This not only buys time to kill the Storm player, but it also gives us the chance to gain more life to extend the time even more. Although the deck has no REAL mainboard answers, Leyline in the SB will give this deck a chance against these Storm decks.

    Spiral Tide:
    VERY NEGATIVE

    Spiral Tide runs a mill strategy, which renders ALL life gain useless. Even with Leyline, the Spiral Tide can simply tap its Wishboard for a Wipe Away and then it’s over. The key is that Ascension focuses on rendering opponent’s actions insignificant, not on disrupting their strategies so much. Therefore, Ascension will expect extremely hard wins against most purely-combo decks. Terrible, terrible matchup.

    Team America:
    POSITIVE

    We can vomit our hand faster than TA can. Tarmagoyf is outclassed by Ajani Pridemate. Tombstalker is outclassed by Serra Ascendant. Proclamation of Rebirth directly counters mass removals. Ascension can do many things better than can TA. So apply quick early pressure and prevent TA from taking control with their Blue control aspect, and the game will be ours.

    Belcher:
    NEUTRAL-NEGATIVE

    Fortunately, if the opponent goes off with Empty the Warrens (for say.. about 8 goblins), we can usually stabilize quickly and win the game. Unfortunately, if Belcher goes off with a Charbelcher, we lose. We can use Leyline of Sanctity, Pithing Needle, and Runed Halo, so post-game-one won’t be too bad.

    Day of Disease / Pox:
    POSITIVE

    Play around the pox. Thanks to Martyr of Sands and high 1-cmc creature density, Pox will end up hurting them more than it’ll hurt us. As long as Mother of Runes, Student, or a Soul trigger with Ajani can stay on the board, the game will be ours.

    The Gate:
    POSITIVE

    The number of their removals will be annoying. However, our high number of threats will put them on high pressure to use removals rather than to play their threats which are more mana-heavy than our deck’s threats. By spewing out a constant rate of threats, the game can be won. Post-board, include Serenities because the opponent will most likely run Engineered Plague, which will be the death of this deck if it goes unanswered.

    Burn:
    VERY POSITIVE

    Burn relies on dealing exactly 20 damage as quickly as possible. Playing Soul triggers and sacrificing Martyrs will allow us to take the burn and survive even after Burn run completely out of steam. Then we continue to gain life and end the game.

    Post board, burn may include Leyline of Punishment which will be annoying. To counter this, run Leyline of Sanctity as well as Serenity. Because Burn will tend to sac their lands for more fuel, they will be less likely to be able to play another copy of Leyline of Punishment post-Serenity.

    Countertop:
    VERY NEGATIVE

    Countertop will ALWAYS have 1-cmc ready to counter thanks to the Top’s tap ability. The key is to put out so much threat before their combo goes online that we’ll be able to win with what’s on the field. Against an unexpecting opponent, the Proclamation trick will work just as it does against Chalice at 1. However, once the combo is online and we haven’t established a strong board presence, the game will most likely end in a loss. Sideboard in EITHER Serenity or AEther Vials. I have made the mistake of SBing both before... to end up destroying my own Vials. It is strongly advised that you do not repeat my mistake.

    Dredge:
    POSITIVE

    Surprisingly, Dredge's strategy is countered by our own. The recurring Ichorids trigger Soul triggers again and again. If 1 Soul trigger is out, each unblocked Ichorid will deal effectively 2 damage. With 2 Soul triggers out, Ichorids will deal only 1. Each of their zombies also trigger the Soul triggers, causing them to be less effective in general. Finally, Martyr of Sands is key in destroying dredge. Because of its ability to sac itself, Martyr can effectively rid the opponent's graveyard of Bridge from Below. After the 1st game, SB Relics in for further graveyard hate.

    =====

    I will welcome any constructive feedbacks, suggestions, and questions. They can be either posted on this thread or PM'ed to me. I will continue updating this post as time goes on and suggestions are proven successful. Thanks for reading this primer! :)
    Last edited by Elleran; 09-21-2011 at 08:22 AM. Reason: Update

  2. #2

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Seems fun :). I'll have to build this one.

    Now, what with not having vials in the main? They make things go smoothly, and means you can free up side board space, and dodge counters. No idea what to remove though.

    Also, did you consider boarding canonists(which kinda hurt the game plan), glow riders or Thorn of Amethyst. Out of all of I think toa would be the best.

    All in all, a awesome left field idea.:)

  3. #3
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    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    How does this match up against chalice aggro decks like dragon stompy? You are able to dodge moon effects, but chalice just destroys you
    I will make use of every tool that fate presents.

  4. #4

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Quote Originally Posted by TedElderhi View Post
    Seems fun :). I'll have to build this one.

    Now, what with not having vials in the main? They make things go smoothly, and means you can free up side board space, and dodge counters. No idea what to remove though.

    Also, did you consider boarding canonists(which kinda hurt the game plan), glow riders or Thorn of Amethyst. Out of all of I think toa would be the best.

    All in all, a awesome left field idea.:)
    Vials actually used to be in main. Testing proved that the benefit of uncounterability granted by the Vials was outweighed by the fact that the Vials took away valuable card space away from threats. I would often be flooded with vials or simply not draw enough creatures for the vial to actually do anything significant. The conditional benefit was also only applicable to blue-heavy or specific decks (like Countertop), so SB proved to be the best place for the Vials, rather than in main.

    Canonists will disrupt the deck's tempo horribly. I've considered them, but I chose Leyline over Canonist because:
    1. Leyline is 'free'.
    2. Leyline does not disrupt my tempo.
    3. Leyline has a greater flexibility (vs. Jace v.2, burns).
    Mainly the second reason. With a Canonist out, Ascension becomes too slow and thus the high threat-density becomes less meaningful.
    Last edited by Elleran; 04-16-2011 at 01:06 AM. Reason: Grammar

  5. #5

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Quote Originally Posted by perm View Post
    How does this match up against chalice aggro decks like dragon stompy? You are able to dodge moon effects, but chalice just destroys you
    It's true. I've hit Chalice decks before in other places. Thankfully, Dragon Stompy has no way to block Proclamation of Rebirth. Furthermore, SB-ing in Serenity will destroy both Chalice AND Trinisphere. I agree that Chalice is a main threat, but I have won handful of games against Chalice players before.

    Also, that will be a rare time that I'd recommend having both Vials AND Serenity. Since Vials allow Ascension to drop threats while ignoring Chalice and Trinisphere, we can sit with Vial alone.

  6. #6
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    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Have you tested Stoneforge Mystic? I'd assume you have, but it's mentioned nowhere in your post. Did it clash too much with the deck? I don't see how it would, tbh.
    Quote Originally Posted by ktkenshinx View Post
    The Reserved List is a) not legally binding, b) antiquated, c) broken, and d) preventative of maximum game enjoyment. Wizards will remove as many cards from that list as possible to increase the fun of their game. Using market research, they can find a balance between printing enough cards to lower a price from $40 to $15-$20, and not utterly ruining their value. This will be both an economically feasible AND sensible move.
    -ktkenshinx-

  7. #7
    Keep Calm and Brainstorm
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    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    How is this an established deck? Everyone can say that their deck is established but has it actually won a premier tournament?
    I am convinced that WotC is "dumbing" the game because of all the stupid posts they come across on MTG-related forums
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
    13NoVa plays Force of Will from his hand.
    Finglonger plays Spell Pierce from his hand.
    [10:22:43]  13NoVa: lol
    sure
    Finglonger points from his Dack Fayden to 13NoVa's Sol Ring.
    [10:23:04]  13NoVa: lol dumb ******; nice draws with retard.dec
    stupid cocksucker
    You have been kicked out of the game.

  8. #8

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    card tags please!!!!

    you can use this:
    http://manabase.com/autocard.php

    just make sure you change the tag it is using to include the S on cardS.

  9. #9

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    This deck should be called EDH because you start with 30 life LOL

    Seems like armored ascension, armadillo cloak, essence warden and Tarmogoyf could all be better than student of warfare. Just sayin.

  10. #10

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Linking to previous discussion of this deck in the New and Developmental forum for quick reference.

    Soul Sisters

  11. #11
    Legacy's Ronin

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    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Essence Warden and Tarmogoyf both add a second color to this deck. It already runs 8 wardens, #9-12 really don't appear to be needed.

    I do have a question though, why StP over Path to Exile? Ya are not running any mana denial, and giving them extra lands seems more beneficial for the deck than giving them extra life.

  12. #12

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Just two questions;

    1: Why no aether vial? The deck is chock full of low mana cost guys, so vial would let bring in guys at instant speed and uncounterable. All you would have to do is make a few cuts and it would easily fit in.

    2. Why is there no wasteland? It's a mono color deck, with an incredibly low average cmc. It would almost never keep you from casting spells, while putting your opponent back a turn often. From what I see the are zero reasons to not run wasteland in this deck
    You can't pull out the RUG from under me, CUZ I AM THE RUG!

  13. #13

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    @bakofried: I have tried Stoneforge Mystic before. It turned out yet again to be slower than I wanted. These are the reasons:
    1. For Stoneforge to work well, multiple kinds of equipments are needed, which takes away space for other threats.
    2. The equipment itself takes more mana to play and equip, yet again taking up the mana that could have been spent dropping more threats.
    3. The equipments prefer creatures with evasions. In this deck, the key evasion card is Serra Ascendant, but Stoneforge nor the equipments really help Ascendant reach the 30 life threshold. i.e. Stoneforge does not have synergy with the rest of the deck.

    @nameless one: Established Deck doesn't require that each deck posted to have won any major tournaments. I have played this deck against various decks that my team played with, tested it online against various decks, and have goldfished few times. I have played this at a local tourney, but the meta of my local tourney is very random, so no strong data could be pulled there. However, Ascension performed well in the tourney (3-2) with the two losses having been 1-turn or 1-life away from winning with many sad mis-plays on my part. The 3 wins were all very one-sided, imo. I believe this deck to have been playtested thoroughly enough and have performed well enough in real life for me to post it here.

    @LegacyDan: You bring up a good question. I actually haven't thoroughly tested PtE in this deck before. I have a personal preference to Swords to Plowshares for seemingly no good reason, so PtE definitely merits a thorough playtesting. Thank you for bringing this up.

    @chinese girl: I have explained why I chose not to put in Vials in my post above. To answer your question about Wastelands:
    This deck has a great demand for white mana. Putting in Wastelands will essentially no real mana in this deck (because wasteland's colorless mana can only help get out Ranger of Eos, Ajani's Pridemate, Martyr of Sands' sac cost, Proclamation of Rebirth, and Jitte). So Wasteland does indeed keep me from casting spells.

  14. #14

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Quote Originally Posted by LegacyDan View Post
    Essence Warden and Tarmogoyf both add a second color to this deck. It already runs 8 wardens, #9-12 really don't appear to be needed.

  15. #15
    Stomping blue decks with "dead" decks, as usual.
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    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    You can try some Retribution of the Meek as an answer to Emrakul/Progenitus in SnT/NO decks.

  16. #16
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    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Swords is still better, as it isn't card disadvantage like PtE. The only deck which should run PtE before StP is Zoo.
    Quote Originally Posted by ktkenshinx View Post
    The Reserved List is a) not legally binding, b) antiquated, c) broken, and d) preventative of maximum game enjoyment. Wizards will remove as many cards from that list as possible to increase the fun of their game. Using market research, they can find a balance between printing enough cards to lower a price from $40 to $15-$20, and not utterly ruining their value. This will be both an economically feasible AND sensible move.
    -ktkenshinx-

  17. #17

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Quote Originally Posted by Vandalize View Post
    You can try some Retribution of the Meek as an answer to Emrakul/Progenitus in SnT/NO decks.
    Yeah, that will work. But luckily, in my meta, there is no one who plays SnT/NO. For a meta with a greater abundance of SnT/NO decks, Retribution of the Meek will definitely help.

  18. #18

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Quote Originally Posted by bakofried View Post
    Swords is still better, as it isn't card disadvantage like PtE. The only deck which should run PtE before StP is Zoo.
    I was thinking more in the line of PtE one of my own Soul trigger for an extra land as an option. Those Soul triggers are really expendable.

  19. #19
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    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    I'm giggling, cuz I picked up most of this deck for 42 dollars. I'm only missing the students and the Swords.
    Quote Originally Posted by ktkenshinx View Post
    The Reserved List is a) not legally binding, b) antiquated, c) broken, and d) preventative of maximum game enjoyment. Wizards will remove as many cards from that list as possible to increase the fun of their game. Using market research, they can find a balance between printing enough cards to lower a price from $40 to $15-$20, and not utterly ruining their value. This will be both an economically feasible AND sensible move.
    -ktkenshinx-

  20. #20

    Re: [Deck] Ascension

    Quote Originally Posted by bakofried View Post
    I'm giggling, cuz I picked up most of this deck for 42 dollars. I'm only missing the students and the Swords.
    Yes, this deck is super cheap, and performs extremely well for its cost. For example, I've seen this deck destroy a Team America deck which ran 4 Goyfs, 4 Tombstalkers, 4 Wastelands, 4 Thoughtseizes, and duals and fetches, and probably more that I didn't see.. A deck easily $400 or more. I feel like Ascension uses lots of cards that don't see any play in Legacy format, and utilizes them to their full potential, which can blow many other decks right out the water.

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