Great find Barook and Tacosnape! Finally, we are able to exclude dead cards (Seething Song, Manamorphose to a less extent) from the combo. Here is a decklist I brewed. Testing will show if 17 creatures are enough.
4 Kor Duelist / Mother of Runes
4 Porcelain Legionnaire / Phyrexian Revoker
4 Puresteel Paladin
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Paradise Mantle
2 Bone Splitter
1 Cranial Plating
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sunforger
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Batterskull
4 Swords to Plowshares / Mental Misstep
1 Hide // Seek
1 Colossal Might
1 Double Cleave
3 Mox Opal
4 Ancient Den
3 Great Furnace
3 Ancient Tomb
2 Plateau
1 Savannah
2 Plains
2 Windswept Heath
2 Flooded Strand
With the combo reduced, I see less reason to make red the main splash, especially with Manamorphose being castable with green mana as well.
I'm leaning towards a green splash for at least Noble Hierarch and Pridemage. The deck is mana-hungy and Hierarch helps in that regard. Pridemage is an outlet against artifacts and enchantments. Both also greatly boost (equipped) single attackers, especially Mirran Crusader because Exalted doesn't target.
You are right this is almost a white weenie deck. However, unless the Sunforger combo is dropped, RRWW is still needed on the combo turn and Noble Hierarch does not help. Paradise Mantle, on the other hand, produces red and synergises for being an artifact and an equipment. That said, Mantle is a less reliable accelerant especially for my creature curve (4 1cc; 12 2cc). Qasali Priedemage, Knight of the Reliquary and Mirran Crusader are great GW Maverick dudes (how wonderful nobody mentioned Tarmogoyf in this thread), however, they don't fit the curve (Knight does not have good synergy either). Let's face it, we have 8 fixed 2cc creatures (Paladin and Mystic), leaving Qasali Priedemage competing with Porcelain Legionnaire / Phyrexian Revoker which are artifacts. 3cc is too costly for a creature as the 3rd turn is to deploy Equipments and I could barely find any reason why Crusader is better than Kor Duelist in Equipment-heavy builds.
I really love this deck idea with all the 1-offs and such.
Can you guys put up testing results, be it online or on paper when New Phyrexia is out?
I was thinking about something like this:
1 Plains
4 Ancient Den
4 Tree of Tales
4 Savannah
3 Flooded Strand
4 Windswept Heath
2 Plateau
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Qasali Pridemage
4 Puresteel Paladin
3 Mirran Crusader
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 AEther Vial
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Mox Opal
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Sunforger
1 Double Cleave
1 Colossal Might
1 Manamorphose
Main problem right now is squeezing in Mother of Runes somewhere.
@tsabo_tavoc: You only need one red mana, the other can be provided by Manamorphose at no further cost. Seems to be at least a more reasonsable solution than having available. Crusader is also better in this context because he doesn't require equipment to be good and has excellent synergy with the Exalted guys.
Is there right now another good compact combo with Sunforger? Cleave and Might seem so off for this deck
Are the artifact lands only for cranial plating or is it wrong to play a shrapnel blast?
-rob
What about volcanic geyser as a wincon. If you wanted to lower the number of seething songs and manamorphose you could run a singleton krosan reclamation
Epic necro time!
A quick research gave me Invigorated Rampage + Armed // Dangerous + reequip Sunforger as a way to get a 10/1 double strike trampler.
Not to mention that Armed/Dangerous are both sorceries, and Sunforger only grabs instants. This is often overlooked.
But fear not, Uncaged Fury fits the bill.
I thought Necropotence was banned
Champion is enough to make this deck consistent though.
//Creatures: 22
4 Fervent Champion
4 Mother of Runes
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Puresteel Paladin
3 Spellskite
3 Mirran Crusader
//Artifacts: 8
4 Aether Vial
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sunforger
1 Batterskull
//Instants: 10
3 Swords to Plowshares
1 Lightning Bolt
1 Lightning Helix
1 Unexpectedly Absent
1 Manamorphose
1 Invigorated Rampage
1 Uncaged Fury
1 Seething Song
//Mana: 20
3 Mox Opal
4 Great Furnace
4 Ancient Den
4 Arid Mesa
1 Prismatic Vista
2 Plateau
1 Mountain
1 Plains
Artifacts: 22. Is that enough for Metalcraft?
Curve:
0: 3
1: 16
2: 16
3: 7
4: 0
5: 1
Combo:
Tap for RWW -> Seething Song -> Manamorphose into WW -> Invigorated Rampage -> Uncaged Fury -> Attack for 10 double strike trample
Other card choices:
Spellskite - Protection. Increase artifact count.
Aether Vial - Cheat out creatures, saving mana for equip and abilities. Increases artifact count
Unexpectedly Absent - Spot removal for any type of permanent that could disrupt you
Lightning Helix - Burn + lifegain
Jitte, SoFaI, Batterskull - Other Stoneforge targets without the combo
Stoneforge - equipment tutor
Mother of Ruins - Protection
Mirran Crusader - Alternate win condition. Sunforger + Crusader is 12 double strike. Rampage + Crusader is 12 double strike trample. Protection from Goyfs and Anglers.
Last edited by FTW; 09-17-2019 at 10:15 AM.
Goblin Engineer is also a viable option next to Stoneforge Mystic. You might be able to run a transformational equipment storm deck.
Sounds like a good back-up plan, especially if your opponent manages to destroy Sunforger.
@FTW: Is Puresteel Paladin still worth the investment with the Metalcraft requirement, at least as a 4-of? Wouldn't Imperial Recruiter provide more flexibility?
Food for thought: With Goblin Engineer, running a single copy of Isochron Scepter as tutor target might be viable, depending on the instant count you can imprint. Mom + Spellkite can even protect it from removal spells.
True, the metalcraft requirement is hard and makes the manabase worse. You could have Imperial Recruiter or Recruiter of the Guard with some singleton targets like 1 Puresteel Paladin, 1 Goblin Engineer, maybe 1 Palace Jailer.
The only problem with that is tempo. Paladin curves out well with equipment. T2 Paladin. T3 equipment, draw a card, equip for 0, attack for value. Playing Recruiter into Champion/Paladin is 2 turns slower, even if it is more consistent. The deck needs something else at 2cc then. Or 3-4 Ancient Tomb to skip the curve.
Kazuul's Toll Collector seems like it's easier to set up, but the mana cost isn't great.
What if you also run 4x Boros Signet? Or you go really deep, skip the artifact lands, run Snow basics and Astrolab in addition to Signet instead.
The beauty about that is they fix your mana, count as artifacts if you need them for Puresteel and with one of those filter rocks in play, you only require RW to go off:
RW --> Seething Song --> (filter -> RRRRW) ---> Manamorphose (RRRWW) --> Invigorated Rampage --> Uncaged Fury
With enough Manamorphose copies, you could even become a Blood Moon deck in theory. How to fit all of that in one deck is a different question, though.
I do like the idea of Signet + Astrolab + Sol lands, though, as it might be a very synergistic approach. Best case scenario would probably be something like this:
T1: Sol land, Signet
T2: land, drop Fervent Champion and Sunforger, swing for 5.
T3: go off as long as you have a way to get an additional white aside from the Signet in play.
Fervent Champion with any early equipment seems pretty silly in general.
Edit: With a high enough human count, a bunch of Caverns might be a good idea, too, as long as filter rocks do their job.
Hmm what can we do with this.
//Lands: 20
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
4 Arid Mesa
4 Prismatic Vista
3 Snow-Covered Mountain
3 Snow-Covered Plains
//Artifacts: 13
4 Arcum's Astrolabe
4 Boros Signet
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Sunforger
//Creatures: 17
4 Fervent Champion
4 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Puresteel Paladin
2 Spellskite
3 Kazuul's Toll Collector
2 Mirran Crusader
//Spells: 10
3 Swords to Plowshares
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Lightning Helix
1 Unexpectedly Absent
1 Manamorphose
1 Invigorated Rampage
1 Uncaged Fury
1 Seething Song
//Sideboard:
3 Blood Moon
2 Isochron Scepter
1 Batterskull
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Pithing Needle
1 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Damping Sphere
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
This is more focused on the combo, with less plan B.
Toll Collector is easier to curve out with this manabase.
What about repeated reverberation and boros charm?
assuming a 1 power creature with sunforger and equip 0:
Tap for RWW -> Seething Song -> Manamorphose -> repeated reverberation -> boros charm is 12 direct damage, can be lethal
Tap for RWW -> Seething Song -> Manamorphose -> repeated reverberation -> invigorated rampage leads to a 17 power trampler
if we have multiple manamorphose and repeated reverberationsin the deck:
Tap for RWW -> Seething Song -> Manamorphose into WW -> repeated reverberation -> manamorphose -> lightning helix -> boros charm -> invigorated rampage -> attack for 9 trample double strike, 3 damage support to get rid of a creature or to secure lethal
Tap for RWW -> Seething Song -> Manamorphose into WW -> repeated reverberation -> manamorphose -> repeated reverberation -> boros charm -> invigorated rampage -> 12 direct damage, attack for 9 trample
Tap for RWW -> Seething Song -> Manamorphose into WW -> repeated reverberation -> manamorphose -> repeated reverberation -> invigorated rampage -> boros charm -> attack with 17 power trample double strike
Tap for RWW -> Seething Song -> Manamorphose into WW -> repeated reverberation -> manamorphose -> repeated reverberation -> repeated reverberation -> boros charm -> 24 direct damage
I think having a couple manamorphose and boros charm regardless secures a bit of redundancy in case we get in hand and really need to use it early or they get discarded by the opponent.
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