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Thread: [Deck] Painter-Stone

  1. #801

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by pettdan View Post
    I think the rules changed with Ixalan's release, like I indicated in my previous post. Edit: the much discussed example is how with Blood Moon in play a Dark Depths will enter with zero counters. I have no idea how Painter is affected, so just wanted to check if the first comment on Humility was considering this rules update.

    It's only work if you play painter first then humility.

  2. #802
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    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyanhur View Post
    It's only work if you play painter first then humility.
    ....This. Due to layering if painter is already in play then humility does not "turn off" painter's color-change effect. However, if Humility is already in play, painter's "enters the battlefield" effect does not trigger and there is no color-change effect. Thus, humility would be risky. Same is true of overwhelming splendor. I did try a Jeskai Painter list on MTGO over the week. I must say, I do like it. However, it has a very control feel to it and it feels a lot like playing miracles, just with a different finisher. So I guess it depends on your play style as to whether those colors would be for you. Interestingly, given how controlling it is, I had a couple games where I won by milling opponent out with grindstone naturally, without a painter in play. One thing white is very good at is creature removal/containment. So it would also probably also depend on your local meta. There is more of a slow crescendo compared to other lists so in a large tournament I would worry a little about game fatigue and time.

  3. #803

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1
    ....This. Due to layering if painter is already in play then humility does not "turn off" painter's color-change effect. However, if Humility is already in play, painter's "enters the battlefield" effect does not trigger and there is no color-change effect.
    Well put. However, Humility is mostly as a lock piece for fatty-based decks (SnT, Reanimator of various kinds, Eldrazi) where you don't really need to care about the combo if their dudes do nothing.

  4. #804
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    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by structuremole View Post
    Well put. However, Humility is mostly as a lock piece for fatty-based decks (SnT, Reanimator of various kinds, Eldrazi) where you don't really need to care about the combo if their dudes do nothing.
    Well, I can get behind having humility in the SB for these matchups. However, you had then better have an alternate win condition as even 1/1s can do damage. Also, of all the decks you just listed, the only deck that would arguably be worse off if a humility was on the table vs a bridge would be reanimator, due to tidespout. SnT just scoops to bridge unless they are playing omniscience/wish, then neither matters. Eldrazi has almost no answers to either. But they can make a lot of 1/1 dorks that still do damage. I think you are better off playing another containment priest or bridge in this deck. Interestingly, porphyr nodes is a good tool in these MUs as well as it can also be dropped with SnT and takes out emrakul and griselbrand. It's also cheap enough to come down early against reanimator.

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  5. #805

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    Well, I can get behind having humility in the SB for these matchups. However, you had then better have an alternate win condition as even 1/1s can do damage. Also, of all the decks you just listed, the only deck that would arguably be worse off if a humility was on the table vs a bridge would be reanimator, due to tidespout. SnT just scoops to bridge unless they are playing omniscience/wish, then neither matters. Eldrazi has almost no answers to either. But they can make a lot of 1/1 dorks that still do damage. I think you are better off playing another containment priest or bridge in this deck. Interestingly, porphyr nodes is a good tool in these MUs as well as it can also be dropped with SnT and takes out emrakul and griselbrand. It's also cheap enough to come down early against reanimator.
    I'm worried that SnT has artifact removal in their 75 because they don't want to just scoop to bridge (which is the big red answer of choice). Also Griselbrand is also gg vs you if you're just relying on bridge because they'll easily leverage 14 cards to strip your hand and then blow up your bridge. Not to really put on bridge that much, but it's just a way better card for other matchups (eldrazi, etc.) than the ones we're talking about. Humility also has the upside of interfering with creature based combo decks, but I'm just diversifying my answers because of the tutor package.

    Nodes I specifically cut because enough of our cards deal with TNN, the card it and Drop of Honey are generally used to beat, and just that it's non-permanent. You're not wrong about the mana efficiency, though. It's a card that can play the role of Supreme Verdict for 25% of the manacost.

  6. #806

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Drude1 what do you think about the new karn for grixis painter? I dont know if this planeswalker will be better in Stone painter or M Red or RW.

  7. #807
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    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by structuremole View Post
    I'm worried that SnT has artifact removal in their 75 because they don't want to just scoop to bridge (which is the big red answer of choice). Also Griselbrand is also gg vs you if you're just relying on bridge because they'll easily leverage 14 cards to strip your hand and then blow up your bridge. Not to really put on bridge that much, but it's just a way better card for other matchups (eldrazi, etc.) than the ones we're talking about. Humility also has the upside of interfering with creature based combo decks, but I'm just diversifying my answers because of the tutor package.

    Nodes I specifically cut because enough of our cards deal with TNN, the card it and Drop of Honey are generally used to beat, and just that it's non-permanent. You're not wrong about the mana efficiency, though. It's a card that can play the role of Supreme Verdict for 25% of the manacost.
    Show and tell deals with bridge via bounce (eg. echoing truth) so it really doesn't matter if it's bridge or humility. And again, don't get me wrong. Humility is a very good card against all of the decks you mentioned. The problem is that when you say you want to deal with creature based combo decks, well WE are a creature based combo deck and you are essentially shutting off the combo. So, if you really want to play humility, you have to have a strong alt. win con in your deck (planeswalkers or maybe RiP/Leyline/Helm combo or something similar) because you won't reliably be able to count on milling them with painter/grindstone if humility is on the table.
    I think nodes is a pretty good card. It's good against delver decks because they just lose a couple creatures and then they don't play anything until the nodes dies, which gives us multiple turns to set up more. It also is a 1 mana spell that deals with TNN, Leovold (without targeting it), emrakul, griselbrand and any other reanimation target. I think if you are playing white, that card deserves a consideration somewhere in the 75.

    @Cyanhur - I think Karn is going to be good for a lot of painter decks, but I don't know that I would play karn over Tezz in grixis. Tezz provides card advantage, 5/5 dudes and a complete alternate win con that can ultimate the turn after it comes into play. I would look at Karn as more of a Tezzeret for non-blue decks. which is pretty darn good. I would definitely play it in shortcake or mono red painter lists. The other question is whether we should play Karn over Jace or Dack in Jeskai or U/R painter lists? Jace is more powerful in general but Karn doesn't die to pyroblast, which for some reason is gaining in popularity again. I'm personally not a huge fan of Dack so I would probably lean towards Karn in that situation. Tough call.

  8. #808

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    Show and tell deals with bridge via bounce (eg. echoing truth) so it really doesn't matter if it's bridge or humility. And again, don't get me wrong. Humility is a very good card against all of the decks you mentioned. The problem is that when you say you want to deal with creature based combo decks, well WE are a creature based combo deck and you are essentially shutting off the combo. So, if you really want to play humility, you have to have a strong alt. win con in your deck (planeswalkers or maybe RiP/Leyline/Helm combo or something similar) because you won't reliably be able to count on milling them with painter/grindstone if humility is on the table.
    I think that painter’s servant works under humility. It becomes a 1/1 but cards are still of the color chosen. I’ve read a thread many years ago on this. Someone that can confirm?


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  9. #809
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    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by Nocioni88 View Post
    I think that painter’s servant works under humility. It becomes a 1/1 but cards are still of the color chosen. I’ve read a thread many years ago on this. Someone that can confirm?
    It was discussed further up on this page, see the first two posts.

  10. #810
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    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    So, I'm still primarily playing Grixis painter. I enjoy shortcake as well but this just feels more powerful. I was really hoping for a deathrite ban, as that card is just so oppressive against so many of our strategies. What I have come to now realize, is that the best way to fight deathrite is to play deathrite. If all the grixis and 4-color delver and control decks can do it, why can't I? So I've been playing the following list for the last week or so, and it is performing extremely well...

    // Lands
    1 [UNH] Island
    1 [B] Volcanic Island
    1 [UNH] Swamp
    2 [B] Underground Sea
    1 [MR] Seat of the Synod
    1 [B] Badlands
    4 [KTK] Polluted Delta
    3 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
    1 [UNH] Mountain
    1 [KLD] Inventors' Fair
    2 [KTK] Bloodstained Mire
    1 [R] Tropical Island

    // Creatures
    4 [SHM] Painter's Servant
    3 [UL] Goblin Welder
    3 [C16] Baleful Strix
    3 [RTR] Deathrite Shaman

    // Spells
    4 [TE] Grindstone
    3 [IA] Pyroblast
    1 [SH] Ensnaring Bridge
    1 [SOM] Mox Opal
    4 [C15] Brainstorm
    2 [MBS] Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
    4 [AL] Force of Will
    1 [AQ] Transmute Artifact
    1 [CN2] Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
    1 [XLN] Search for Azcanta/Azcanta, the Sunken Ruin
    4 [M10] Ponder
    2 [DTK] Kolaghan's Command

    // Sideboard
    SB: 1 [SH] Ensnaring Bridge
    SB: 2 [CH] Blood Moon
    SB: 1 [DS] Trinisphere
    SB: 4 [M11] Leyline of the Void
    SB: 1 [AL] Helm of Obedience
    SB: 1 [XLN] Sorcerous Spyglass
    SB: 1 [US] Arcane Laboratory
    SB: 1 [TE] Cursed Scroll
    SB: 1 [AL] Pyrokinesis
    SB: 1 [DGM] Far/Away
    SB: 1 [KLI] Engineered Explosives

    I feel kinda dirty playing deathrite myself, but the card is just ridiculous. It is main-deck turn 2 mana acceleration, grave hate, and alternate win con (particularly behind a bridge) all wrapped up in one. It also effectively answers opponents' deathrites. It also really let's you set up effective blood moons out of the SB. Overall, it's been very good. Right now I am playing a 3/1 split with 1 opal still in, but that is likely to change.
    Also of note, my creature removal package has also changed. I have 2 k.command main which answer both small creatures and troublesome artifacts, along with a daretti main and pyrokinesis, far/away, cursed scroll, e.e and a second bridge in the board. I really like fiery confluence, but it really expensive and I wanted to get away from mass sweepers a little more since I am playing deathrite myself. Gonna see how pyrokinesis plays for a while (used to love this card in old shortcake lists). Playing far/away to answer things like dark depths, TNN, etc. I thought about just playing edict but I actually like the targeted bounce effect as well, as it can sometimes even save a painter, etc.
    Other SB changes may include a damping sphere for 3-sphere, although I don't know if I like damping sphere as much now. It kinda acts like a third blood moon in some MUs and is probably better than 3sphere in the elves MU and obviously in post MUs, but it doesn't slow down storm much until the turn the want to go off, and by then they have an answer. So, I may just be sticking with 3-sphere for now. I also switched back to e.e. over ratchet bomb due to it's speed, but I don't know that is for sure right either. I still am also playing 1 arcane lab just to help more with storm and other combo.

    Anyway, haven't seen much activity on here lately so just thought I would liven it up a little.

  11. #811

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    The pile shell for grixis painter seems like a cool idea, though I'd also look at Clashed's list (he's been playing for months now, but topped a recent legacy challenge here). I don't think we need to mess around trying to squeeze in the punishing Dack engine, but I would see if Rise//Fall or Chandra, Torch would fit.

    The main reason I bring the decklist up was more on the topic of removal choices and sweepers. Notably deluge works here despite the elements you pointed out that work against it. If you really don't want to kill your own creatures, maybe look into Fire Covenant as well.

    Overall, good modernization, though. I've been having lots of fun and success with the UWR list above, but I'll try something like this one out next time and let you know if there's anything I found from having played it.

  12. #812
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    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by structuremole View Post
    The pile shell for grixis painter seems like a cool idea, though I'd also look at Clashed's list (he's been playing for months now, but topped a recent legacy challenge here). I don't think we need to mess around trying to squeeze in the punishing Dack engine, but I would see if Rise//Fall or Chandra, Torch would fit.

    The main reason I bring the decklist up was more on the topic of removal choices and sweepers. Notably deluge works here despite the elements you pointed out that work against it. If you really don't want to kill your own creatures, maybe look into Fire Covenant as well.

    Overall, good modernization, though. I've been having lots of fun and success with the UWR list above, but I'll try something like this one out next time and let you know if there's anything I found from having played it.
    Rise/fall is a very good card and I did consider it. You could consider a couple copies in the board as it is particularly good in certain matchups. It's better if you are playing Snapcaster though and I like k.command over rise/fall in the main for artifact hate. I like the instant speed as well. As for Chandra, again great card but I think tezz is just better in this deck as it only takes 1 activation to ultimate and looks at more cards. It also pitches to FoW.
    I do like the idea of fire covenant and will definitely consider that. I'm a little worried about the D& T matchup. If thalia is out 4 Mana is a lot to come up with. Obviously the card disadvantage of pyrokinesis kinda sick butts it's not so bad if you are taking out 2-3 creatures.

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  13. #813

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    Rise/fall is a very good card and I did consider it. You could consider a couple copies in the board as it is particularly good in certain matchups. It's better if you are playing Snapcaster though and I like k.command over rise/fall in the main for artifact hate. I like the instant speed as well. As for Chandra, again great card but I think tezz is just better in this deck as it only takes 1 activation to ultimate and looks at more cards. It also pitches to FoW.
    I do like the idea of fire covenant and will definitely consider that. I'm a little worried about the D& T matchup. If thalia is out 4 Mana is a lot to come up with. Obviously the card disadvantage of pyrokinesis kinda sick butts it's not so bad if you are taking out 2-3 creatures.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
    You're right that pyrokinesis can definitely make up the card disadvantage. Do you think there are enough red cards to pitch? I guess you could also name red with painter in a pinch which is funny. I might try the card out in other decks if it really works out.

    I'm also wondering if welder wouldn't just appreciate dack as a part of the deck as a way to generate some value, though I guess Daretti gives artifacts to use, but having artifacts to get back when you wanna trade in artifact lands for actual cards might not be easy. Plus the artifact steal has really funny uses with welder, and Dack also pitches to force in matchups where Daretti would be super dead.

  14. #814

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post

    // Lands
    1 [UNH] Island
    1 [B] Volcanic Island
    1 [UNH] Swamp
    2 [B] Underground Sea
    1 [MR] Seat of the Synod
    1 [B] Badlands
    4 [KTK] Polluted Delta
    3 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
    1 [UNH] Mountain
    1 [KLD] Inventors' Fair
    2 [KTK] Bloodstained Mire
    1 [R] Tropical Island

    // Creatures
    4 [SHM] Painter's Servant
    3 [UL] Goblin Welder
    3 [C16] Baleful Strix
    3 [RTR] Deathrite Shaman

    // Spells
    4 [TE] Grindstone
    3 [IA] Pyroblast
    1 [SH] Ensnaring Bridge
    1 [SOM] Mox Opal
    4 [C15] Brainstorm
    2 [MBS] Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
    4 [AL] Force of Will
    1 [AQ] Transmute Artifact
    1 [CN2] Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
    1 [XLN] Search for Azcanta/Azcanta, the Sunken Ruin
    4 [M10] Ponder
    2 [DTK] Kolaghan's Command

    // Sideboard
    SB: 1 [SH] Ensnaring Bridge
    SB: 2 [CH] Blood Moon
    SB: 1 [DS] Trinisphere
    SB: 4 [M11] Leyline of the Void
    SB: 1 [AL] Helm of Obedience
    SB: 1 [XLN] Sorcerous Spyglass
    SB: 1 [US] Arcane Laboratory
    SB: 1 [TE] Cursed Scroll
    SB: 1 [AL] Pyrokinesis
    SB: 1 [DGM] Far/Away
    SB: 1 [KLI] Engineered Explosives
    If you do a stream with this list tell me i am really curious to see what you do.

  15. #815
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    Noughty Painter

    Hi there - it's my first time posting in a Painter-related thread (I've been playing Imperial Painter/Strawberry Shortcake before the Sensei's Divining Top ban) and I'm not entirely sure if this one's the one I'm supposed to be ending up in... but since I've head a number of encouraging results over the last few (small) tournaments I played, I decided to come out of the woods with my (to my knowledge) somewhat nonstandard approach. It's a UR Painter variant which I've chosen to call "Noughty Painter" (sic), and here's my list:


    1 Apostle's Blessing
    2 Misdirection
    3 Force of Will
    3 Vision Charm
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder
    4 Pyroblast

    1 Engineered Explosives
    1 Lotus Petal
    1 Pyrite Spellbomb
    4 Grindstone

    1 Goblin Welder
    1 Magus of the Moon
    1 Phyrexian Dreadnought
    1 Trinket Mage
    3 Imperial Recruiter
    4 Painter's Servant


    1 Flooded Strand
    1 Great Furnace
    1 Island
    1 Misty Rainforest
    1 Mountain
    1 Polluted Delta
    1 Seat of the Synod
    3 City of Traitors
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Scalding Tarn
    4 Volcanic Island


    Current SB:


    1 Faerie Macabre
    1 Force of Will
    1 Grafdigger's Cage
    1 Grim Lavamancer
    1 Manic Vandal
    1 Meekstone
    1 Misdirection
    1 Phyrexian Dreadnought
    1 Phyrexian Metamorph
    1 Surgical Extraction
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Sudden Demise


    Some of the card choices probably demand a bit of explanation/justification:

    Vision Charm
    This is a surprisingly versatile little bugger - I've used all three modes with succes so far. Mill-mode can get Goblin Welder going or stuff away known bad cards from the top if you don't have a fetch open. Phasing protects both combo pieces, enables Phyrexian Dreadnought for a surprise 2-turn-clock, and can mess with opposing equipment (esp. Batterskull). Even the 1-turn-pseudo Blood Moon effect has won me enough time against Tin Fins once to secure that particular game.

    Misdirection
    This might be the second-best counterspell in the game. Have you ever misdirected an Abrupt Decay towards the opponent's own Leovold, Emissary of Trest or True-Name Nemesis? I like that even more than messing with Hymn to Tourach and friends, or winning counter wars on its back. If you've never played Misdirection, you *need* to try it.

    Apostle's Blessing
    A very versatile protection piece that can do lots of work for as little as one mana and two life. Notice that it says both creature or artifact in both clauses of its effect, so it can protect Grindstone, or give your Painter's Servant protection from a charged-up Umezawa's Jitte.

    Phyrexian Dreadnought
    Really good at smashing face =) Can be tutored up via Trinket Mage and serves as an alternative, proven win condition against nasty lists with Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, or even Burn.



    So far, the most troublesome matchups I have faced were Whatever Stompy (when having resolved a Chalice at one - but I've been very happy with Engineered Explosives I've added since then as a flexible mainboard countermeasure) and Show and Tell-based strategies where the Painter/Grindstone combo is useless. Apart from that, even though I'm rather inexperienced with the deck and the cantrip cartel in general, the list feels great, and I'd encourage you to look into some of the card choices I presented :)

  16. #816
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    Re: Noughty Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by colo View Post
    Hi there - it's my first time posting in a Painter-related thread (I've been playing Imperial Painter/Strawberry Shortcake before the Sensei's Divining Top ban) and I'm not entirely sure if this one's the one I'm supposed to be ending up in... but since I've head a number of encouraging results over the last few (small) tournaments I played, I decided to come out of the woods with my (to my knowledge) somewhat nonstandard approach. It's a UR Painter variant which I've chosen to call "Noughty Painter" (sic), and here's my list:


    1 Apostle's Blessing
    2 Misdirection
    3 Force of Will
    3 Vision Charm
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder
    4 Pyroblast

    1 Engineered Explosives
    1 Lotus Petal
    1 Pyrite Spellbomb
    4 Grindstone

    1 Goblin Welder
    1 Magus of the Moon
    1 Phyrexian Dreadnought
    1 Trinket Mage
    3 Imperial Recruiter
    4 Painter's Servant


    1 Flooded Strand
    1 Great Furnace
    1 Island
    1 Misty Rainforest
    1 Mountain
    1 Polluted Delta
    1 Seat of the Synod
    3 City of Traitors
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Scalding Tarn
    4 Volcanic Island


    Current SB:


    1 Faerie Macabre
    1 Force of Will
    1 Grafdigger's Cage
    1 Grim Lavamancer
    1 Manic Vandal
    1 Meekstone
    1 Misdirection
    1 Phyrexian Dreadnought
    1 Phyrexian Metamorph
    1 Surgical Extraction
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Sudden Demise


    Some of the card choices probably demand a bit of explanation/justification:

    Vision Charm
    This is a surprisingly versatile little bugger - I've used all three modes with succes so far. Mill-mode can get Goblin Welder going or stuff away known bad cards from the top if you don't have a fetch open. Phasing protects both combo pieces, enables Phyrexian Dreadnought for a surprise 2-turn-clock, and can mess with opposing equipment (esp. Batterskull). Even the 1-turn-pseudo Blood Moon effect has won me enough time against Tin Fins once to secure that particular game.

    Misdirection
    This might be the second-best counterspell in the game. Have you ever misdirected an Abrupt Decay towards the opponent's own Leovold, Emissary of Trest or True-Name Nemesis? I like that even more than messing with Hymn to Tourach and friends, or winning counter wars on its back. If you've never played Misdirection, you *need* to try it.

    Apostle's Blessing
    A very versatile protection piece that can do lots of work for as little as one mana and two life. Notice that it says both creature or artifact in both clauses of its effect, so it can protect Grindstone, or give your Painter's Servant protection from a charged-up Umezawa's Jitte.

    Phyrexian Dreadnought
    Really good at smashing face =) Can be tutored up via Trinket Mage and serves as an alternative, proven win condition against nasty lists with Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, or even Burn.



    So far, the most troublesome matchups I have faced were Whatever Stompy (when having resolved a Chalice at one - but I've been very happy with Engineered Explosives I've added since then as a flexible mainboard countermeasure) and Show and Tell-based strategies where the Painter/Grindstone combo is useless. Apart from that, even though I'm rather inexperienced with the deck and the cantrip cartel in general, the list feels great, and I'd encourage you to look into some of the card choices I presented :)
    Interesting list. Definitely can approach the game from different angles. My thoughts would be...

    1. Do you really think a misdirection is better than the fourth force? I understand that it's probably am underplayed card, but force is really there for supper fast combo decks and cards like chalice. I'm not saying you are absolutely wrong but it just feels like force has more overall value.

    2. Similarly, vision charm vs. stifle... This is probably more of a personal preference thing and you make a pretty good case for the charm.

    3. No blood moon?!? In a 2 color deck playing sol lands this just doesn't seem right. I do see the Magus but against eldrazi stompy, 12 post decks, lands, and even 3 color tempo decks sooner amount of blood Monday in the board just seems like where you would want to be.

    Anyway, list is otherwise pretty interesting. Vision charm is actually kind of an interesting card in general. And yes, if nothing else, misdirection is at least a fun card to play.

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  17. #817
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    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Also, speaking of lists, this is what I've transitioned to now:

    // Lands
    2 [UNH] Island
    1 [B] Volcanic Island
    2 [UNH] Swamp
    2 [B] Underground Sea
    1 [B] Badlands
    4 [KTK] Polluted Delta
    3 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
    1 [UNH] Mountain
    2 [KTK] Bloodstained Mire
    1 [R] Tropical Island

    // Creatures
    4 [SHM] Painter's Servant
    2 [UL] Goblin Welder
    3 [C16] Baleful Strix
    4 [RTR] Deathrite Shaman

    // Spells
    4 [TE] Grindstone
    4 [IA] Pyroblast
    2 [SH] Ensnaring Bridge
    4 [C15] Brainstorm
    4 [AL] Force of Will
    1 [XLN] Search for Azcanta/Azcanta, the Sunken Ruin
    4 [M10] Ponder
    2 [DTK] Kolaghan's Command
    1 [WWK] Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    2 [EMN] Liliana, the Last Hope

    // Sideboard
    SB: 3 [CH] Blood Moon
    SB: 1 [DS] Trinisphere
    SB: 1 [XLN] Sorcerous Spyglass
    SB: 1 [US] Arcane Laboratory
    SB: 1 [AL] Pyrokinesis
    SB: 2 [DGM] Far/Away
    SB: 1 [KLI] Engineered Explosives
    SB: 1 [KLD] Chandra, Torch of Defiance
    SB: 1 [DKA] Grafdigger's Cage
    SB: 2 [NPH] Surgical Extraction
    SB: 1 [EMA] Toxic Deluge

    This list takes advantage of switching from a combo list to more of a "Superfriends" control list. You can pull the combo completely and just take over games with utility cards and planeswalkers. Every walker has a "win the game" ultimate and taking out the combo often nullifies the opponent's post-sideboard game plan. It's been performing extremely well for me. I did also get rid of the leyline+helm combo from the board because I cut the transmutes. We'll see how that goes. The far/away's are mostly for turbo-depths, show and tell decks, reanimator, etc. Although a little clunky, they serve their purpose well. Anyway, I think I'm finally at a place with this deck that I'll start streaming it more.

  18. #818
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    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Thanks for your feedback, drude1 :)

    I definitely appreciate the value of Force of Will, which is why I keep the 4th copy in the board. There are a few matchups where misdirection will do close-to-nil (Elves pre-board, for instance), but I think the upsides the card provides over FoW warrant its inclusion. Removal that "can't be countered"? Fuck that, honey badg... Misdirection doesn't care. I've also come to love the card advantage (compared to FoW) it incurs: Sure, it costs two cards to misdirect a spell, but often times, it's gonna be a (rather unexpected) 2-for-2-trade - for which my opponent paid mana twice. It's the most powerful (and in my experience so far, important) counter to have ready when the Painter-Stone game plan is about to come together.

    On Stifle: It's been a while since I last played Stifle myself, but I have a feeling that it's not that strong in the current, overall metagame (with Deathrite Shaman soaking up stifled fetchlands), and probably a tad weaker in Painter still. I find myself rarely having U open during my opponent's turn to try to mana-screw them out of the game, and frankly, I don't care much about that plan any more (which is also why I don't play Blood Moon at this time, while I had at least 5 moons effects in wR Imperial). With the counter and protection package I run, I feel can push the combo through with a fair amount of inevitability, and would rather develop my own mana instead of trying to hamstring my opponent's.

    My opinion on the boon/necessity of also having Blood Moon available might change during the coming weeks, probably depending on how I fare against Eldrazi in the future - I only played the matchup once so far as got butchered, but given the opp's god-hands in both games there wasn't much I could have done anyway. I think that Painter's Servant alone (nullifying Eye of Ugin's cost reduction) can pull some weight already. (Ceterum censeo Boseiju, Who Shelters All esse delendam!)

  19. #819

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by colo View Post
    Thanks for your feedback, drude1 :)

    I definitely appreciate the value of Force of Will, which is why I keep the 4th copy in the board. There are a few matchups where misdirection will do close-to-nil (Elves pre-board, for instance), but I think the upsides the card provides over FoW warrant its inclusion. Removal that "can't be countered"? Fuck that, honey badg... Misdirection doesn't care. I've also come to love the card advantage (compared to FoW) it incurs: Sure, it costs two cards to misdirect a spell, but often times, it's gonna be a (rather unexpected) 2-for-2-trade - for which my opponent paid mana twice. It's the most powerful (and in my experience so far, important) counter to have ready when the Painter-Stone game plan is about to come together.

    On Stifle: It's been a while since I last played Stifle myself, but I have a feeling that it's not that strong in the current, overall metagame (with Deathrite Shaman soaking up stifled fetchlands), and probably a tad weaker in Painter still. I find myself rarely having U open during my opponent's turn to try to mana-screw them out of the game, and frankly, I don't care much about that plan any more (which is also why I don't play Blood Moon at this time, while I had at least 5 moons effects in wR Imperial). With the counter and protection package I run, I feel can push the combo through with a fair amount of inevitability, and would rather develop my own mana instead of trying to hamstring my opponent's.

    My opinion on the boon/necessity of also having Blood Moon available might change during the coming weeks, probably depending on how I fare against Eldrazi in the future - I only played the matchup once so far as got butchered, but given the opp's god-hands in both games there wasn't much I could have done anyway. I think that Painter's Servant alone (nullifying Eye of Ugin's cost reduction) can pull some weight already. (Ceterum censeo Boseiju, Who Shelters All esse delendam!)
    Strange idea your list, a friend did Day 2 with UR painter at Birmingham.

    Can you explain me the mecanic with 12/12 trample? Because when he come in play we have to sacrifice some creature and in painter our creature haven't got higher strengh.

  20. #820

    Re: [Deck] Painter-Stone

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyanhur View Post
    Strange idea your list, a friend did Day 2 with UR painter at Birmingham.

    Can you explain me the mecanic with 12/12 trample? Because when he come in play we have to sacrifice some creature and in painter our creature haven't got higher strengh.
    Simply, you can stifle dreadnought's ability and get it to stick
    "You either die a Onesto-Player, or live long enough to see yourself become a Dredger"

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