[Deck] GW/x Maverick

[angel882]

Hi, what do you board out against Reanimator? I'm playing this GWr-list

1 Birds of Paradise
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Mother of Runes
3 Noble Hierarch
2 Qasali Pridemage
2 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
3 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Tarmogoyf
1 Gaddock Teeg

3 Punishing Fire
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
4 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Life from the Loam
1 Sylvan Library

1 Forest
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Plateau
4 Savannah
2 Taiga
3 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
2 Wooded Foothills
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Karakas

and I'm bringing in 8 cards

1 Phyrexian Metamorph
3 Enlightened Tutor
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Maze of Ith
1 Worship

I have also Thrun, the Last Troll in my SB. Do we need to board Thrun in? Last tournament I sided out all my PFires, but missed those because the game stalled a long time because opp had Archon and I had Scryp Ranger feat Mom.

[CookedChestnuts]

I would board out a Birds, Life from the Loam, a Noble Hierarch, 3 Punishing Fires, 1 Pridemage, and potentially a fetchland and/or a Taiga.

[angel882]

I would board out a Birds, Life from the Loam, a Noble Hierarch, 3 Punishing Fires, 1 Pridemage, and potentially a fetchland and/or a Taiga.

Why Loam? It's good cause if they destroy Karakas or Maze of Ith you can Loam those back. Is it better to take out PFires than Mystic package?

[Philipp2293]

Loam is slow. Also Reanimator doesn't have that many means to destroy your lands anyway. (Angel of Despair afaik) Punishing Fire should be taken out, and IMO parts of the Mystic Package, probably 2 Mystic and SoFaF, leaving 1 Mystic and Jitte in, which could be important in close races or on rare occasions as removal with enough tokens.

[angel882]

Ok, thanks for your advices :) how about UW blade or UB decks like UB Tempo. What do you board out against them?

[Philipp2293]

Against UW: Depends on what you board in ;) If you're running a Fires build I think it's ok to take out some numbers of StP if you have REBs to bring in. Also the Goyf (all he'll do is going to eat a sword/path most of the times) and maybe the third Mystic.

As far as UB tempo is concerned, it depends on the build as I'm not exactly sure what you have in mind ;)

[angel882]

Against UW: Depends on what you board in ;) If you're running a Fires build I think it's ok to take out some numbers of StP if you have REBs to bring in. Also the Goyf (all he'll do is going to eat a sword/path most of the times) and maybe the third Mystic.

As far as UB tempo is concerned, it depends on the build as I'm not exactly sure what you have in mind ;)

Oh, I didn't post my list cause it was there few post ago :) but yeah I'm playing PFires Maverick and my SB looks like this

1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
2 Choke
3 Enlightened Tutor
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Batterskull
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Stony Silence
1 Garruk 3.0/Elspeth
1 Worship
1 Maze of Ith

[Hanni]

Needs more Lionheart Maverick.

[Philipp2293]

In: 2 Choke, Thrun, Walker
Out: 1 StP, Goyf, 1 Mystic. I somehow hesistate to recommend cutting the 2nd StP since you have no REBs as backup removal. Maybe it's still the right call.

While I loved the Choke's in my straight GW SB, I feel in Punishing Maverick Blast effects are better, since they are better against Delvers, Jins and Show and Tell decks in general.

[angel882]

In: 2 Choke, Thrun, Walker
Out: 1 StP, Goyf, 1 Mystic. I somehow hesistate to recommend cutting the 2nd StP since you have no REBs as backup removal. Maybe it's still the right call.

While I loved the Choke's in my straight GW SB, I feel in Punishing Maverick Blast effects are better, since they are better against Delvers, Jins and Show and Tell decks in general.

Yeah I think that too. Blast is also better lategame draw and you can bring it in against Reanimator when they side in Show and Tells.

[Koby]

Yeah I think that too. Blast is also better lategame draw and you can bring it in against Reanimator when they side in Show and Tells.

The red splash is still viable in GW stock lists:
Maindeck:
-1 Savannah
+1 Taiga

Sideboard:
+3 REB

It's not any stronger than the blue splash for Spell Pierce/Flusterstorm however. Blue gives you Geist of Saint Traft and/or Rhox War Monk however.

[Koby]

So... I've been thinking.

We're usually soft to Burn and definitely to Combo decks. What do they have very much in common? Targeting players.

Has any had testing experience with Leyline of Sanctity? It may be good for the Grand Prix metagame. I'm thinking as a 3 of.

I don't see it being a part of an E-tutor sideboard, so that's going to be an all-in style Sideboard plan. Right now I'm playing with the blue splash to pack Spell Pierce, which helps yet against against both Combo and Burn (sort of a combo deck). It helps vs UW control's planeswalkers too, and random wierd stuff that isn't normally covered by the Etutor plan.

[Lejay]

Wow that's a genious idea ! Great ! It can also be good against hymn to tourach decks or cut hivemind's intuitions. I'll definitely play some of these in my sideboard !

[lordofthepit]

So... I've been thinking.

We're usually soft to Burn and definitely to Combo decks. What do they have very much in common? Targeting players.

Has any had testing experience with Leyline of Sanctity? It may be good for the Grand Prix metagame. I'm thinking as a 3 of.

I had experience with Leyline of Sanctity as a 4-of in my sideboard back when I was playing Big Zoo, which is as similar to Maverick as I guess you can realistically get.

Ran into the same burn deck twice in an Underground Seas tournament (Swiss and Top 4), which I ended up winning. Ironically, I think I lost both Game 2s, where I got a Leyline, but kept weak hands (didn't have a white source). This was right before Survival of the Fittest got banned.

I think I went 3-0 against Storm decks during that same timeframe, although I was pretty lucky in each case. I also ran Faerie Macabre as my other source of hate to shut down IGG loops, but that was never relevant. Empty the Warrens was still a beating though.

In my opinion, Maverick has a softer matchup against burn and combo than Zoo does, at least preboard, due to its slower clock. Zoo was slightly favored against Burn to begin with, because of its clock. However, Maverick probably needs and benefits from the Leylines more than Zoo would, especially since it buys the time necessary to get a Jitte, SoLS, or Batterskull online. Leyline still probably doesn't get there against Storm by itself, since Maverick's clock is pretty slow, but with the ability to grab Jitte, Maverick is much better equipped to deal with Empty the Warrens. Plus, it gets you enough time to drop a Ethersworn Canonist, which I didn't run in Big Zoo.

I eventually stopped running Leyline of Sanctity because the banning of Survival brought Counterbalance back in the meta, which shut down combo decks (and burn never really was a significant presence). When New Phyrexia hit, I began to use Mental Misstep maindeck as a better, more versatile anti-combo card that doesn't suck against the rest of the format, plus Surgical Extraction could shut down graveyard-based decks while still being pretty solid against Storm combo. Obviously, Surgical Extraction is the nut low against burn, so it wouldn't shore up your weakness there.

Edit: I never tried Leyline of Sanctity against Intuition-based decks, since it seemed pretty narrow (Hive Mind, Painted Stone, etc. weren't real decks then). If you're worried about those decks, Surgical Extraction is obviously much better. I wouldn't bring in Leyline against a deck with just a couple of Jaces either, just like I wouldn't bring it in against a black-based aggro deck with a couple of discard spells.

Another thing I forgot to address is that you lose a lot of the benefit of the Enlightened Tutor package if you run Leylines. I'm not sure it's the best idea in G/W Maverick, unless you're willing to cut out some important sideboard space to accommodate all that anti-combo hate.

Edit #2: I just remembered I also ran Null Rod as an Affinity/Counterthopters hate deck that had collateral damage against Storm, usually as a three- or four-of. In retrospect, I'm not sure I would have won any of my Storm matchups with Leyline alone, since Leyline usually bought me just enough time while protecting my other hate pieces. Moreover, since I had a faster clock than Maverick decks can reasonably put up, I was able to dissuade my opponents from going the Ad Nauseam route early; Leyline by itself without a way to quickly reduce your opponent to around 8-10 (against TES) or 13-15 (against normal ANT) probably isn't good enough in Maverick.

[Koby]

That's some really good info, thanks lordofthepit!

The way I see it right now, the SB slots against RUG Delver and UW StoneBlade are so minimal cuz the deck generally crushes blue decisively that it gives us many options to answer the tough matchups. This includes the fringe Linears like Affinity, Burn, and Combo. Of those 3 main Linears, Leyline shuts them down enough to get our game going. Affinity I'm willing to accept as a loss, but still have the necessary tools in the maindeck to answer a mediocre Affinity draw, barring a nut turn 2 Cranial Plating win.

Any other thoughts?

[Water_Wizard]

@ Ruckus - the only problem I see with Leyline is that it fits into the Storm players sideboard plan. A storm player is going to cut discard and chant effects to add bounce, so it really doesn't matter to them if they are bouncing LoS/Ethersworn/Teeg. Also, Leyline doesn't prevent them from comboing, imo, a good storm player is going to see Leyline and laugh, thinking, "Okay, I can still cast Ad Nas, I will draw 20 cards and a bounce spell, drop my cheap artifact mana, bounce your leyline and storm you out."
Also, if you are serious about drawing a Leyline in your opener, I would run 4. I know with 4, it's about 40% to find one in your opening 7, 35% in your next 6 and you really need leyline in your opener, because if you wait to cast it, even with hierarch, turn 3 might not be quick enough.
With our current build, Teeg and Ethersworn is the best bet.
Thalia merits discussion. Against Storm, she is a Mom-protectable, thorn-of-amethyst, 2-power beater - may be worth a 3-of in the sideboard.
Also, chant effects are very solid against Storm. Most likely, discard is the first thing they are going to drop (the Epic lists all run duress, although lists that run thoughseize might keep it in), and chant effects are unexpected, although probably not worth the sideboard slot (they don't do much against most of the meta).
Finally, we could always go back to Mindbreak Trap, which has the added benefit of being nuts against High Tide (if you expect to see any of that).

Regarding burn, I think ET package with COP:Red or Aegis is still the best bet. However, Thalia looks very solid against this match-up as well. She stops Goblin Guide, Hellspark and a mini-Figure of Destiny and punishes a list that is notoriously tight on mana.

Conclusion, if you are not running ET Tutor package, I think Thalia is the best use of 3 slots (as opposed to LoS).

If you are running ET package, I like the Canonist/Thorn/Stony Silence package against Storm and Aegis/COP against Burn. Since MUD just won Memphis, who knows how much that will pop up and rumor has it, stony silence and/or silence just wrecks MUD.

EDIT: Ruckus, just read your post above, and Stony Silence also is nuts against Affinity. I think it may be best to keep the ET package, with 3 Thalia slots, 2 PTE and 2 Choke + 2 ET and ~6 ET targets (+/- an equipment or Maze).

REEDIT: Not sure if Thalia and the ET package necessarily comport. May be best to drop Thalia for more ET slots (seems like the matches we would bring Thalia in against would also be the matches we would bring ET in against, and there is no need for both).

As an aside, is anyone worried about Dredge? I didn't watch the SCG coverage from today, was it well represented? I'm curious how much of people's sideboards they are dedicating to dredge hate. If so, what are people running? Surgical, Wheel of Sun and Moon, Tormod's Crypt? We already have Ooze md, but it can be slow.

[BlackStarDeceiver]

Played Pun Mav yesterday to 4-1-1 (draw against Thopters, 4 more Turns and he'd be dead) and lost the last round against Reanimator with him having the perfect hands both games:
G1 T1 Study binning Elesh/Jin --> dual reanimation in two turns with double Fow backup.
G2 T2 Jin with triple Fow Backup.

Played against
2-0 Reanimator
2-0 NicFit Punishing
1-1-1 Thopters (time)
2-0 Nic Fit GWB
2-1 Dredge
0-2 Reanimator

My sideboard yesterday was:

3x REB
3x Surgical Extraction
2x Choke
1x Garruk Relentless
2x Wheel of Sun and Moon
1x Path to Exile
3x Ethersworn Canonist

Wheels were great, a bit slow against those Reanimator hands but strong against Thopter, Dredge und especially Nic Fit, shutting off the Explorers. The only cards i did not board were the Canonists because i did not meet Storm/Enchantress.

I played without Stoneforge/Mindscensor using the slots for Finks, Witness, Thrun and another Sylvan, played 2x Jitte 1x SoLaS and it was perfectly fine.


I dont want to explicitly talk about the maindeck, as that was just a spontaneous decision to cut SFM but the Sideboard seemed strong.

@rukcus:

How about:

3x Leyline of Sanctity
3x Spell Pierce
3x Surgical Extraction
2x Enlightened Tutor
1x Wheel of Sun and Moon
1x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Sundial of Infinite
1x Phyrexian Metamorph

Combined with Teeg/Thalia main it seems like a solid choice, if you are splashing blue for Geist and Spell Pierce only.


Edit: MUD is already a very good matchup for us, just Zenith Teeg and you are good to go. Even the Chalice version is more 65% in our favour preboard and doesn't change a lot postboard.

I'd expect to see the usual suspects --> Stormcombo/UR Delver/Maverick (GW/x) and probably lots of dredge.

[maurobad2k4]

So... I've been thinking.

We're usually soft to Burn and definitely to Combo decks. What do they have very much in common? Targeting players.

Has any had testing experience with Leyline of Sanctity? It may be good for the Grand Prix metagame. I'm thinking as a 3 of.

I don't see it being a part of an E-tutor sideboard, so that's going to be an all-in style Sideboard plan. Right now I'm playing with the blue splash to pack Spell Pierce, which helps yet against against both Combo and Burn (sort of a combo deck). It helps vs UW control's planeswalkers too, and random wierd stuff that isn't normally covered by the Etutor plan.

I tried a playset of Leylines a few months ago. Against Burn it worked as expected, but against TES I lost the g2 to EtW tokens, but managed to win the g3 because I had MoR, Canonist and Gaddock. So, in the end, I dont think the Leylines helped me that much. If you're having trouble against Burn just run Finks, since it helps in others matches as well.

[arcannys]

Leyline is terrible, it forces you to keep loose hands or mulligan strong hands...
agaisnt burn I run 2 finks and 1 rhox war monk. Jitte is not very reliable against them because of smash to smitherins, thats why I run rhox.
And finks and Rhox arel also very good against Zoo and canadian threshold.

[zulander]

Why are you running sundial in your board for? Pact decks?