Damnit! It's another goyf, but at uncommon. This is going to Turn into a Misstep Tempo-> Attrition Deck-> Chalice deck-> Misstep Tempo Wheel! Damn you wizards! this is starting to look like Vintage! I mean seriously, legacy price rises + a predictable meta wheel? This is vintage!!!
(Tempo Misstep/Force-Brainstorm-Gush decks)-> (Attrition deck/Oath-Jace decks) ->(Chalice + Sol lands/ Vintage Trini-Shop Stax)-> Tempo
Uh oh... Legacy has just been vintage-ified. Crap.
Damn, now every deck can answer to my D&T's turn 1 gamebreaking Vial... Untill I pack this shit myself.
Like, the best answer to Survival was Aven Mindcensor... fetched by Survival.
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It stops all of Zoo's threats that Merfs really give a damn about. Knight is pretty slow, as is Goyf, when you really get down to it. The big swing in Zoo comes from Nacatl, Lavamancer, and all of the 1cc removal. Having a hard answer to those plays seems very strong in 'Folk.
Originally Posted by ktkenshinx
It will be nuts in the sideboard of 4-colored Supreme Blue/Intuition Countertop builds, basically the shore up their Vial matchups by a mile.
I think it's the card recent Countertop decks have been waiting for in a long time, as it's finally a real answer to Vial (+ Lackey, Stifle, Hierarch); some of their most problematic cards to deal with.
I don't think it makes any sense to play the card in just about any deck, only to counter random stuff like an STP or Top; it would be too conditional.
Seriously, especially recent Countertop decks BEG for this card.
Supreme Blue/Intuition Countertop now suddenly have 8 answers to Vial, Lackey, Stifle or Hierarch instead of 4 (FoW).
I don't think the format will warp the average number of 1cc spells towards 2cc and 3cc because of one card, but if that would be the case, then Countertop will probably have an edge setting up a very early Top and CB and it would be still important to counter Vial, no matter what. Supreme Blue would most likely play more more Counterspells (2cc) and Vendilion Cliques maindecked (3cc).
Countertop /Eva Green
The way I see it, here's what I think:
Goblins- Big loser, everyone gains from being able to Misstep Vials and Lackeys. Gobbos can't play it because it lowers the Gobbo count.
Zoo- Big Gainer, GSZ + This gives it a fighting Chance against combo.
Merfolk- Big Gainer, can Misstep removal and damaging 1 drops vs zoo, unless you get Misstepped back...
Tempo (Team America/Can Threshold/ NLT)- Big Loser as Stifles/Brainstorms/Removal can be answered and Tempo is also forced to run Missteps to survive against Aggro decks with Missteps, or die.
Countertop- Big Gainer, more answers to Vial and can actually pitch Misstep to Force if there are no targets for it late game. Misstep can help countertop survive the Aggro onslaught.
Combo- Big loser, everyone can run Misstep MD. Combo also forced to play Misstep or die.
Chalice of the Void Stompy- MASSIVE GAIN, Chalice is officially the best card in the format. The deck is built to have no 1 drops, blanking opponent's missteps. The new set gave stompy INFINITE goodies to choose from as threats.
Basically, interactive decks: Benefit! Combo and Goblins- Uh oh!
In general, though we will be seeing alot of missteps countering missteps, I believe this is Wizard's attempt at "replacing Force of Will" or making non-blue able to compete without FOW. Misstep really shafts combo and now alot of new non-blue decks have room to breath! What Wizards should have done was make it 0 mana, pay 2 life, making it more narrow and extremely playable still to aggro. This is to avoid missteps countering missteps and missteps being able to pitch to FOW. As it is, Misstep is way too playable and everyone will be playing 4. I'd buy up all those stompy lands and Chalice. Stompy is back.
If the only thing you can think of with the card is, "Oh, now I have an answer to Vial," you should just be running Pithing Needle instead, since it can also hose Planeswalkers and Equipment and Tops. Seriously, I think people need to get over the fact that the card is nominally blue when its biggest strength is being actually colorless. Like, it's not going to make Zoo suddenly a favorable matchup for Merfolk because a) Every card in Zoo is bad for Merfolk and being able to counter Nacatls for two life doesn't fix this, and b) Zoo is probably the deck that stands the most to gain by adding this card.
Mental Misstep is an absolutely terrible card if all you can do with it is counter Vials so you can counter other stuff later. Where it shines is in an aggro deck that wants to nerf combo and the most common removal spell in the format at the same time, with most other considerations being secondary.
Seriously. Knock off the, "Oh, now we have an answer to Vial" posts. There's already lots of answers to Vial.
Plenty of Goblins lists have been demonstrated to be viable with 29-30 Goblins over the years.
Also I don't see how Chalice Stompy can gain from combo taking a hit and the rest of the format raising their cost curve even slightly.
For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
And found I was for endurance made
I'm sorry, what? Do you see how much a tempo strategy benefits from this card? This card is tempo per definition, because 1 mana is being traded for 0. Tempo may be forced to run Misstep, but that's because the card could be completely nuts against the rest of the format, especially in it's strategy where it can just run out turn 2 Goyfs/Confidants now.
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@ IBA, I really hope you are right. I would hate for the format to be based around Misstepping Misteps.This may actually make the format slouch even more towards 2-3cc cards in order to dodge missteps which is also healthy.
@ Bahamuth, Time will only tell, but being forced to play Misstep is not an ideal scenario. What if you draw it late? It is not as good against say a good deck with threats at different CCs. As for Tempo, tempo decks are mostly 1cc spells so opponent's missteps are never dead. Take Can Threshold for example:
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Stifle
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Spell Snare
Looks bad to me.
I agree with all the excitement on the card, and wont comment further on its potential. What I was thinking is, doesn't it seem that this card is tailor made for Legacy? Two of the major complaints on the format lastly have been:
- Combo smashes every non-blue deck
- FoW is too expensive
So we have a pseudo-force for (also) non blue decks, that is also a great card overall (whereas Mindbreak Trap was basically only a worse FoW).
IMHO this is a first step from wizards to try and fix Legacy's major issues without breaking the reserve list, reprinting overpowered cards, banning everything remotely playable or creating a new extremely boring format. I hope it's not the last.
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Also, if people could stop just saying, "Tempo" as if that defines anything meaningful here, that would be great. Tempo that wins isn't just paying one less mana than the opponent; it's plays that shift the entire game in your favor. Like, in Zoo Mental Misstep can swing lots of games in its favor by neutering removal or stalling a combo deck long enough to finish the opponent. If you're mainly just trying to stop Vial, then every Misstep off the top is dead where a Pithing Needle would not be.
I mean, Lotus Petal is tempo, but Lotus Petal isn't good in every deck or even many decks. If people could stop just parroting cliches and mention where they think the card is good and why that'd raise the level of the discourse thanks.
Yes. It does seem very tailor made. More than I would have ever expected, really.
I think the format has to strike some sort of equilibrium; people can't just stop playing cheap spells, so the card should remain good perpetually; I would expect it to be played in about 25% of decks, either main or side, at the saturation point. But there's also going to be pressure, as combo weakens, to move the cost curve upwards overall for more powerful effects.
For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
And found I was for endurance made
Negating all the powerful turn 1 plays to drop a 2nd turn standstill or Torpor orb into a threatless field is no good news for Dreadstill to return to the metagame?
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Not when anyone can play the card, all its major plays cost 1, and others could abuse Standstill more effectively while not being vulnerable to Misstep, no.
For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
And found I was for endurance made
Yeah, except that all those are very narrow and don't hit over 50% relevant cards out there, unlike Mental Misstep. It hits stuff when you're on draw and pitches on FoW later on, and can be hard counter late game for something like Swords to Plowshares or Lightning Bolt.
Card is insane and much more than answer to Swords for aggro decks, it's format warping in my opinion.
With all these free hate spells, Misstep Aggro is going to be a Force, whether it be Misstep Affinity, Misstep Infect, Misstep Zoo, Misstep White Weenie, etc. Why? Same reason as why Merfolk is so popular, price. Being non-blue and able to beat combo and having misstep protect you from STP for FREE is the ideal card for any aggro deck. Blue does not gain from this. Blue is traditionally slower and with no combo to beat on, it gets less popular. Giving aggro a free counter against STP/Bolt is also a nightmare for control. By shifting towards 2-3cc cards like go for the throat or firespout, you open yourself up to being raped in the first few turns. I've play legacy for long enough to know that removal spells that cost more than 1 are not very effective vs fast aggro. They also are able to mess with your brainstorms and tops!
The solution to Misstep aggro? Bypass 1 drops totally and play 1 drop hate: Stompy. Just start your curve @ 2 and play a great hoser in Chalice. Seems good. No combo to stomp on? That's fine, I'll just stomp on all the Misstep aggro that's about to surface.
The only deck I can think of where Misstep hits 50% of the deck is Elves, and it certainly doesn't hit 50% of the relevant stuff there. Against most decks Pithing Needle hits quite as large a section of the relevant cards, if not more.
Pithing Needle also deals with Vial on the draw.It hits stuff when you're on draw
"It's blue" is a pretty weak argument for a card's strength.and pitches on FoW later on
The card wouldn't see play at all if it cost just a single blue, honestly., and can be hard counter late game for something like Swords to Plowshares or Lightning Bolt.
Card is insane and much more than answer to Swords for aggro decks, it's format warping in my opinion.
Blue decks have always had ways to deal with Vial; that hasn't been the problem. Sussing out the right mix of answers to different threats is a problem. Misstep is not a major splash in the blue-based control pond in and of itself.
What it does do that is radical and new is give Zoo and Goblins and other aggro decks a card that's both quite good in the main and quite good against pretty much every combo deck.
For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
And found I was for endurance made
IBA has a point. Control's problem is "Threat Variety". You have to be able to deal with Artifacts (Vial, Equipment), Creatures, Walkers (Tez in affinity/Jace/Elspeth), Spells (Natural Order/Show and Tell/Adn) and everything else. Mental Misstep is just another narrow answer that is absolutely necessary to have any chance vs aggro yet lacking against decks that gravitate towards the 2-3 mana range like Junk or decks with bombs at 3-4cc like Jace/NO/Show and Tell.
IMO control is pretty much in a shitload of trouble as it is already. This makes it worse as there is no longer any combo to bully! I'm gonna stick to stompy (especially Dragon Stompy as it's the most consistent and it got the most new toys) for now, since Chalice @ 1 screws the format over even more right now. Dragon stompy's problem was substandard threats in the face of Goyfs/Kotrs etc. Right now, It's got Moltensteel and Metamorph to go toe to toe with opposing bigs, as well as The Red Priest of Gix which replaces seething song (Traditionally used to fix mana and get double red), increasing the threat count and turning it more into an equipment deck. You can't deny the attractiveness of this strategy, and also Trinis in the board, yummy!
Control will probably be helped in the long run; it can deal with threat diversity assuming it has time to implement more expensive answers. I wouldn't run Misstep itself in Landstill, but the card's existence in slowing the format down and weakening combo could give Landstill and other control decks room to breathe and go after creature-based aggro with more dedication.
For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
And found I was for endurance made
This card will see some play but I don't really want to play it in anything Blue. I'd much rather play Spell Pierce. In non-Blue decks I think it is probably better than Mindbreak Trap. I'm certainly not busting in my pants. It's OK.
MM makes me want to try to revive Miracle-Gro
(very rough list of the top of my head)
4 Goyf
4 Quirion Dryad
1 Green Sun Zenith
3 Daze
3 Snare
3 Pierce
3 MM
4 FoW
4 Brain
4 Preordain
2 Ponder
3 Fire//Ice or 3 Winter Orb?
4 Waste
4 Trop
1 Island
9 Fetch
Free Hard counters for paths, swords, and tops might be enough to make Gro a contender again
in before wizards implies this was an R&D mistake in a year...
I will make use of every tool that fate presents.
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