Is there any room for Kokusho here? He'd be great with High Market/Phyrexian Tower and Reya Dawnbringer for recursion. High Market and Phyrexian Tower are also decent for protecting Kaalia from being tucked.
Edit: It would also allow you to play things like Dragon Mage and Yosei to recur with Reya. I know this kinda takes the deck in a different direction, but I think it would still be feasible. Crucible of Worlds might be necessary for the reliance on lands that can sac creatures though.
Kokusho, the Evening Star isn't strong enough to make the cut. He doesn't do anything but attack for five while he's on the battlefield, and while his death trigger is nice, it isn't strong enough to justify running cards to trigger it.
I think I've had Kaalia of the Vast tucked about twice. It sucks, but not significantly more than if she dies. This deck is all about speed, and the turn or two you have to spend re-casting Kaalia of the Vast is usually a death sentence if your opponents are strong.
I tried running a three-card soft lock with Reya Dawnbringer, Xathrid Demon, and Yosei, the Morning Star, but I never assembled it. I've realized that three-card combos don't have a place in this deck, especially when they don't immediately end the game.
Dragon Mage? You must be thinking of some other card.
You could build the deck around three-card, graveyard dependant, combos that don't immediately end the game if you think that'll be fun for you, but it's significantly worse than the aggro-geddon strategy I'm using.
Speaking of not running three card combos...
Return to Ravnica changes:
+ Angel of Serenity
+ Rakdos, Lord of Riots
+ Utvara Hellkite
- Oni of Wild Places
- Hoard-Smelter Dragon
- Twilight Shepherd
Angel of Serenity is an amazing creature. Not only do we get to take out up to three creatures for free, they go to their owner's hands if Angel of Serenity leaves the battlefield instead of back to the battlefield.
I'm a little unsure about Rakdos, Lord of Riots, but I think he's strong enough to try. Being able to cast creatures for one to three mana post-combat seems strong.
I love creatures that grow exponentially, which makes Utvara Hellkite an easy include. Note that if you put him on the battlefield tapped and attacking with Kaalia of the Vast, his attack trigger doesn't trigger. You must declare him as an attacker to get the dragon token. With no other dragons out, Utvara Hellkite hits for 6, 6, 12, 24, 48 in successive turns. Add one other dragon and those numbers double.
Oni of Wild Places was better in theory than in practice. It was too difficult and too slow to assemble the Kaalia of the Vast, Rakdos the Defiler, Oni of Wild Places combo. The only other red creature I'd actually want to bounce with Oni of Wild Places was Bogardan Hellkite.
Twilight Shepherd has done nothing for me but be a 5/5 flyer for years. It had been on the shit-list and it's time for it to go.
I think I activated Hoard-Smelter Dragon twice since I built the deck. It doesn't play well with the Armageddon strategy anyway.
Updated first post.
Gatecrash and other major changes:
- Lotus Petal
- Chrome Mox
- Pentad Prism
- Sphere of the Suns
- Gold Myr
- Iron Myr
- Leaden Myr
- Charcoal Diamond
- Fire Diamond
+ Gilded Lotus
+ Thran Dynamo
+ Worn Powerstone
My Kaalia of the Vast deck was fundamentally flawed. Running all those garbage acceleration pieces so I could get my Kaalia of the Vast killed or stolen a turn earlier was a terrible idea. They also led to terrible topdecks when I was behind and needed to catch up. The deck also needed to be less hopeless without Kaalia of the Vast, so I've added some stronger acceleration pieces to help cast the creatures if I can't use Kaalia of the Vast.
- Rakdos, Lord of Riots
- Oros, the Avenger
- Steel Hellkite
- Moonveil Dragon
- Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
Every one of these creatures was poor. Rakdos, Lord of Riots was always just a 6/6 flying, trample. His second ability wasn't relevant and he was very difficult to cast without an active Kaalia of the Vast. I don't know that I ever used Oros, the Avenger's triggered ability. Steel Hellkite can pretty much only destroy permanents when you're already ahead at which point you don't need to. I rarely used the ability anyway. Moonveil Dragon usually only pumped the army by one or two if that. The attack one player with Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon and another player with everything else plan didn't work out.
- Sulfurous Springs
+ Plains
The deck really needed a basic land to take advantage of Path to Exile on Kaalia of the Vast. There are more white mana symbols than any other, so it's a Plains.
+ Whispersilk Cloak
I've been critical of this card in the past, but I think I'm going to give it a shot. Kaalia of the Vast has been getting blocked a lot more and I think this could be an answer.
+ Angelic Skirmisher
+ Aurelia, the Warleader
+ Lord of the Void
I've toyed with a lifelink slot in the past and decided I didn't need it, but Angelic Skirmisher can do that and more. Vigilance is amazing when you're trying to kill multiple players as no one will want to attack into your army. Angelic Skirmisher can also be used immediately if you cast her, which is quite possible at . Aurelia, the Warleader doesn't trigger when she enters the battlefield tapped and attacking, but she's not uncastable, and she's incredible every turn thereafter, especially when you're trying to kill multiple players. Lord of the Void needs no explanation. He's simply amazing.
+ Stranglehold
+ Chaos Warp
+ Oblation
+ Austere Command
+ Catastrophe
+ Merciless Eviction
+ Aven Mindcensor
I wanted some spot removal that wasn't dependent on having an active Kaalia of the Vast. I also wanted the deck to have a few board sweepers for when it falls behind. Aven Mindcensor and Stranglehold belong in every white and red EDH deck.
Updated first post.
It's cool how this deck gets new toys like every set
What are your thoughts on Urza's Incubator, Heartless Summoning, Quicksilver Amulet, Maze of Ith, and Nether Void?
I'm thinking the first three will be good if Kaalia is out of action, and Nether Void makes a pretty good lock once she's in play. With all the mana generating artifacts and Nether Void, you could probably pay the 3 for the spells you need to cast anyway.
Maze of Ith will let you attack with Kaalia and prevent it from dying if they have a flying blocker and still get the Angel/Demon/Dragon out into play.
I've seen Maze of Ith and Quicksilver Amulet in a few builds. In particular, Mazing Kaalia is a fun and funny trick, theoretically (haven't done it myself). I think it's a 'combo' that probably can carry itself on the basis that Maze of Ith doesn't suck, and Kaalia is the general, so the fact that they interact with each other is cool in addition to the fact that neither card sucks.
I don't think Incubator or Heartless Summoning are worth the trouble, and Nether Void is a little redundant when the plan is to eat all the lands. Really at that point, there's not much difference between playing Nether Void and like... controlling Chancellor of the Annex. Ideally you win fast enough to make the difference between +1cmc and +3cmc irrelevant, the ultimate effect is they couldn't cast anything anyway, and Nether Void does not attack. Also, Incubator seems suboptimal in a deck with multiple creature types and Heartless Summoning makes your guys smaller :/ If Rakdos Lord of Riots got cut from Kuma's build for not making spells cheap enough often enough, I feel like Heartless Summoning is probably just as unreliable, less gain for more pain.
Given that we're dealing with three creature types, Urza's Incubator seems impractical. Heartless Summoning is intriguing, as it speeds up the deck by a turn or two. However, it gives a little back with the -1/-1. It seems really strong for when Kaalia of the Vast gets killed too many times. Quicksilver Amulet is a little expensive, but seems like it might be better than some of the other ramp. Maze of Ith does good work protecting Kaalia of the Vast and your life total, but it doesn't tap for mana and the stated goal of the deck is to blow up all the lands. Nether Void just seems like a worse Armageddon.
What is your opinion on Blind Obedience in this deck? I think it could fit very nicely with the "destroy all lands" idea because it puts your opponents a turn firther behind when trying to catch up and stops them from flashing in a blocker on Kaalia (such as Aven Mindcensor). I'm not sure the Extort is super relevant but it could come in handy when racing an opponent near the end of the game.
EDIT: I forgot to mention that it brings Artifacts in tapped as well. That's also an advantage as it can slow down Armillary Spheres, Gilded Lotuses, Journeyer's Kites, etc.
Blind Obedience doesn't do enough to justify a spot. If I've blown up all lands with an active board presence, I don't need Blind Obedience. If I haven't blown up all lands, it's not a particularly useful card. I can't see myself doing a lot of extorting in this deck.
I think given the nature of politics in EDH, dropping this character with Kaalia will be regarded as a great way to kill two players - an opponent and yourself. You will jib one clown with this and then everyone will probably decide you need to leave the game, but it is probably worth talking about for a minute.
At least for my part I do not much care for Kaalia in multiplayer anymore, she just has so little game on everyone at the table that is just working towards a more oppressive Voltron. So in a 1v1 situation there is probably no reason not to rock this because you could lucksack an early Kaalia and draw/tutor up numb-nuts here FTW. But in multiplayer this is a super one-trick pony that will put you on watch for every game proceeding the first one that it actually works; in my experience it's way worse to one-shot one player than it is to threaten the whole board with Mike-and-Trike or anything similar.
The new "Everybody gets wit's ended each endstep" is prooooobably playable
I think it's time to stop putting it off and go pick up a bloody kaalia :/
Edit for people who haven't seen it yet:
'Sire of Insanity' 4BR
Creature - Demon
At the beginning of each end step, each player discards his or her hand.
6/4
It feels redundant next to the Geddon effects in terms of the outcome (get a little ahead and prevent interactivity while still dropping threats).
So I misread it on the first couple of passes, I now see that it makes ALL players discard at the end of EVERY turn. I may need to see it in action to be satisfied, but I also feel like there are a lot of decks that are just way better at topdecking than Kaalia because to be honest, she is pretty much just drawing dagrons all day. I'm wrong a lot though.
Between this card and Master of Cruelties and a couple other random fat with too many abilities, it's starting to just feel like a Goblin deck. Play your 'Lackey', tutor for your answer for the board state, try and lock suckers out.
I was thinking that if you can ramp Kaalia out fast enough then you would have this and maybe another large creature in play before your opponents can set up anything relevant. A lot of the stronger decks are more stack-based than this is (Oona etc) and they lose a lot more from having their hands nuked than you will. Drawing dragons all day is fine when you can just dump them into play and your opponents are drawing like Counterspells and Power Artifacts and other junk that they can't even use. Kaalia is also better at emptying its hand quickly with all of the fast mana so your opponents will probably be discarding more cards than you anyway.
I hate the anti-Kaalia clause in master of cruelties' text. I guess they didn't want it to read "whenever ~ deals combat damage to a player that player's life total becomes 1" because they want you to be unable to actually kill anyone with this card alone but it still sucks that you can't drop someone to 1 in the turn that you put it into play with Kaalia.
I think it's fine that it feels like a goblin deck, goblins are fun. I'd rather have a bunch of unique creatures that all do interesting things than go back to the days of like Ancient Hellkite + Mordant Dragon + Balefire Dragon +Flameblast Dragon herpderp
Oh don't get me wrong, I'm perfectly content playing a Goblin-esque deck.
I don't believe that Master of Cruelties has an "anti-Kaalia" clause, except if you mean that it limits it to being a one-shot effect. Even if Kaalia puts him into play, MoC's ability should trigger after blockers are announced; if there are none then the ability should work as expected - and then Kaalia ideally hits for 2, FTW.
- Scourge of Kher Ridges
- Mordant Dragon
+ Master of Cruelties
+ Sire of Insanity
Scourge of Kher Ridges was easily the weakest creature remaining. It was a tough call between Mordant Dragon and Adarkar Valkyrie, but the deciding factor was Adarkar Valkyrie's ability to protect Kaalia of the Vast.
Master of Cruelties is insane with Kaalia of the Vast. You attack with Kaalia of the Vast and put in Master of Cruelties. Master of Cruelties takes your opponent to one life and Kaalia of the Vast's combat damage finishes them off. He almost makes me want to re-add Oni of Wild Places. While Sire of Insanity slows us down, it slows down our opponents and helps ensure that Kaalia of the Vast stays around.
I want to fit Legion's Initiative in here, but I'm not sure where.
Updated first post.
I am a newbie, but would change some letters, such as:
- Worn Powerstone + Coalition Relic
- Thran Dynamo + Chromatic Lantern
- Gilded Lotus + Mimic Vat
- Scroll Rack + Sensei's Divining Top
- Stoneforge Mystic + Praetor's Grasp
- Admonition Angel + Twilight Shepherd
- Rakdos the Defiler + Dragon Mage
- Sire of Insanity + Yosei, the Morning Star
- Reaper from the Abyss + Hellkite Tyrant
- Adarkar Valkyrie + Rakdos, Lord of Riots
- Aegis Angel + Phyrexian Reclamation
- Whispersilk Cloak + Swiftfoot Boots
- Archangel of Strife +Phyrexian Arena
- Angelic Skirmisher + Mind Twist
- Platinum Angel + Quicksilver amulet
- Linvala, Keeper of Silence + Oblivion Ring
- Blinding Angel + Reanimate
- Catastrophe + Wrath of God
- Merciless Eviction + Damnation
I wonder about your opinion of these cards with these changes?
The fact that it makes colored mana isn't enough to make up for the fact that it can't make you two mana every turn.
Thran Dynamo is in there to help you cast your creatures when Kaalia of the Vast is inevitably prevented from attacking. Chromatic Lantern doesn't do that nearly as well/
Mimic Vat is an interesting suggestion. This change is probably fine.
Scroll Rack gives you so much more digging power, especially when combined with fetchlands.
I guess Praetor's Grasp is fine if you can reliably bet Lightning Greaves with it, but it costs more mana than Stoneforge Mystic, so why make the switch?
I wholeheartedly disagree with all these changes. Every creature you want to put in I've tried and found lacking. Admonition Angel especially is way too good to cut.
I don't think this deck needs graveyard recursion as much as it needs to protect Kaalia.
I tried Whispersilk Cloak as an experiment and it wasn't great. Swiftfoot Boots is awful though. That extra mana makes it hard for you to get any acceleration out of it.
Phyrexian Arena is pretty slow for a deck that wants to be this fast. Archangel of Strife is one of, if not the best card at straight up dealing damage.
Angelic Skirmisher isn't the greatest creature or anything, but when are you going to have the time/mana to cast an effective Mind Twist?
There are certain liabilities and advantages to running Platinum Angel. I've considered Quicksilver Amulet over some of the more expensive mana rocks and it's probably worth trying.
Linvala, Keeper of Silence is a concession to my metagame. You could possibly do without it and this is a fine switch.
When you're trying to race multiple players, Blinding Angel can be invaluable. Reanimate is a decent addition though.
Blowing up lands >> blowing up creatures.
This one is probably fine. Could be Wrath of God instead, you'd have to count mana symbols.
I can't imagine cutting Merciless Eviction, but I'm such a dickhead about throwing away tempo and attacking walkers to deal with them that I am probably overprotective of anything that says "deal with target planeswalker/all the planeswalkers". Plus it's modal! Modal modal modal. I love modal things. Catastrophe and Merciless Eviction, sitting in a tree, m-o-d-a-l-i-t. Y. ugh :/
Anyway I cannot believe I didn't think of Legion's Initiative. I feel like Legion's Initiative would be a lot of good in this deck, especially considering the kinds of removal that need to be addressed from other players. It's a one-trick pony so it might not be as strong here as, say, in a 4-of format, but if nothing else it's nice to put a little meat on Kaalia's bones.
I haven't had a chance to play with Master of Cruelties or Sire of Insanity, but Sire looks on paper like a bigger obstacle for Kaalia to overcome than the opponents. It can't be something you just drop with impunity, right - like it's gotta be alongside something like Chancellor of the Annex or Utvara Hellkite right? Or else it's just a free-for-all under someone answers it and they reset much faster than Kaalia does b/c your blue spells are in another castle.
Also I just do not know about Rakdos the Defiler anymore. Seems like he's seeing less and less play from me. Especially with Oni of Wild Places out of the deck. Just not worth the backfire, and as a one-shot effect it's less impressive.
I wonder what cards would be good against deck control in type 1x1 Grand Arbiter Augustin IV. And you take?
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