[EDH] Arcum Dagsson - Prison Tinkerer

[fuga]

Thank you for your answer :)

[kombatkiwi]

notbad.jpg

Although for the cost i reckon it should work with mana abilities
Maybe it's a templating/rules issue

[mrjumbo03]

Another uneventful set for Arcum. Only possible addition I could think of is Thespian's Stage.

[kombatkiwi]

Another uneventful set for Arcum. Only possible addition I could think of is Thespian's Stage.

Do you not think Bracers is playable?

[Offler]

Absolutely YES.

Dont forget it works with untapping abilities like Aphetto alchemist has. Infinite combo with alchemist and bracers can be re-used with Arcum when you have no artifact to produce infinite mana, or whatever. Question is how much it fits in your deck. In my Teferi it fits perfectly.

[kombatkiwi]

"Hey guys I know u missed me but now I'm back to spice up your Power Artifact / Rings of Brighthearth / Basalt Monolith love triangle"

[Jivanmukta]

"Hey guys I know u missed me but now I'm back to spice up your Power Artifact / Rings of Brighthearth / Basalt Monolith love triangle"

Oh hi you sexy sexy card.

[mrjumbo03]

Do we even need it? During the combo turn, SDT will allow us to do the same thing, and it's not bad on it's own.

[kombatkiwi]

Do we even need it? During the combo turn, SDT will allow us to do the same thing, and it's not bad on it's own.

I still think it's worth making space for because:
-If you make infi mana another way (Power Artifact) it lets you win while tutoring for fewer cards
-The '3: Untap dude' mode is fine if you naturally draw this card

There are a bunch of cards the deck doesn't 'need'
I'm still leaning towards cutting the Disk/Forge/Lattice package
But I think it's worth making a slot to put staff back in

[mrjumbo03]

Hmm. After looking at my list, I'd probably put the Staff over Time Spiral as I have only used that card once profitably or Artificer's Intuition. Hope they unban Metalworker soon to go along the Staff!

[Jessenator]

Does anyone have an updated list for this general after Staff's unbanning?

[kombatkiwi]

// Deck file for Magic Workstation

// Lands
1 Mishra's Workshop
1 Wasteland
1 Misty Rainforest
13 Snow-Covered Island
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Darksteel Citadel
1 Seat of the Synod
1 City of Traitors
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Flooded Strand
1 Polluted Delta
1 Strip Mine
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Buried Ruin
1 Academy Ruins
1 Rishadan Port
1 Tolaria West
1 Minamo, School at Water's Edge
1 Inkmoth Nexus
1 Blinkmoth Nexus
1 Mishra's Factory
1 Scorched Ruins

// Creatures
1 Myr Moonvessel
1 Arcum Dagsson
1 Dross Scorpion
1 Kuldotha Forgemaster
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Manakin
1 Plague Myr
1 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Trinket Mage
1 Junk Diver
1 Silver Myr
1 Palladium Myr
1 Millikin
1 Myr Retriever
1 Etherium Sculptor

// Spells
1 Power Artifact
1 Skullclamp
1 Semblance Anvil
1 Mental Misstep
1 Transmute Artifact
1 Grim Monolith
1 Lion's Eye Diamond
1 Darksteel Forge
1 Possessed Portal
1 Spine of Ish Sah
1 Mindslaver
1 Mycosynth Lattice
1 Mind Over Matter
1 Planar Portal
1 Myr Turbine
1 Memory Jar
1 Pact of Negation
1 Mana Vault
1 Artificer's Intuition
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Mind Stone
1 Guardian Idol
1 Reshape
1 Sol Ring
1 Gitaxian Probe
1 Expedition Map
1 Pithing Needle
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Voltaic Key
1 Mox Diamond
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mox Opal
1 Everflowing Chalice
1 Lotus Petal
1 Gilded Lotus
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Tezzeret the Seeker
1 Nevinyrral's Disk
1 Thran Dynamo
1 Clock of Omens
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Cloud Key
1 Sculpting Steel
1 Intuition
1 Rings of Brighthearth
1 Basalt Monolith
1 Fabricate
1 Scroll Rack

// Sideboard
SB: 1 Arcum Dagsson

Semblance Anvil is just a random idea I had
You can cut it for Staff now that it's unbanned
I have no idea why I wasn't playing skullclamp before
Edit: Oops I apparently have a random Arcum listed in the maindeck I guess cut that for staff then

[FTW]

I'm confused about the lack of

Lightning Greaves
Thousand-Year Elixir
Swiftfoot Boots


How on earth does Arcum survive to tap?

Here's what I'm running. Any recommendations?


//Commander: 1
Arcum Dagsson

//Artifact Creatures: 17
Blinkmoth Nexus
Inkmoth Nexus
Mishra's Factory
Myr Moonvessel
Manakin
Plague Myr
Guardian Idol
Silver Myr
Spellskite
Phyrexian Revoker
Etherium Sculptor
Myr Retriever
Perilous Myr
Junk Diver
Palladium Myr
Solemn Simulacrum
Lodestone Golem
Kuldotha Forgemaster

//Mana Sources: 10
Mox Diamond
Mox Opal
Mana Crypt
Lion's Eye Diamond
Sol Ring
Mana Vault
Grim Monolith
Basalt Monolith
Thran Dynamo
Gilded Lotus

//Haste: 4
Thousand-Year Elixir
Lightning Greaves
Swiftfoot Boots
Hall of the Bandit Lord

//Lands: 33 (plus others)
Mishra's Workshop
Seat of the Synod
Darksteel Citadel
Ancient Tomb
Crystal Vein
City of Traitors
Cavern of Souls
Phyrexia's Core
Academy Ruins
Buried Ruin
Tolaria West
Thespian's Stage
Wasteland
Strip Mine
Minamo, School at Water's Edge
18 Island

//Search/Draw: 14
Sensei's Divining Top
Scroll Rack
Expedition Map
Muddle the Mixture
Transmute Artifact
Reshape
Artificer's Intuition
Trinket Mage
Fabricate
Intuition
Thirst for Knowledge
Thoughtcast
Tezzeret the Seeker
Memory Jar

//Spells: 21
Defense Grid
Myr Turbine
Darksteel Forge
Mycosynth Lattice
Nevinyrall's Disk
Oblivion Stone
All is Dust
Mindslaver
Spine of Ish Sash
Staff of Domination
Power Artifact
Rings of Brighthearth
Planar Portal
Crucible of Worlds
Clock of Omens
Sculpting Steel
Phyrexian Metamorph
Argivian Restoration
Voltaic Key
Skullclamp
Mind Over Matter


Thoughts?

[kombatkiwi]

My list did have Greaves, but I do admit that compared to you my deck is built almost full glass-cannon mode (even though overall there is only about 10 cards difference) because my deck is mostly for trolling the really soft meta at my store and I don't need so many anti-hate cards.

I also realise that my list was based mostly on the deck that I actually own and therefore I forgot to put Mana Drain in it

If I were to include more resilience to spot removal it would be more in the form of cards like Spell Pierce or Mizzium Skin instead of additional boots: Elixir is maybe okay but 3 mana earlygame is a lot so by spending a turn casting the elixir you're missing the turn that you could have used to cast Arcum making the haste semi-irrelevant (you obviously still get the chance to throw arcum into play then hastily activate it before it gets bolted or whatever but this hardly ever happens to me, YMMV)

I disagree completely with Lodestone Golem, the card just makes no sense in this deck. It's not that the ability is bad for us (in fact it's the opposite, it's almost one-sided in our favour) it's just that you want all the artifact creatures to provide some sort of lasting value before/when they die. Cards like Spellskite and Revoker don't mesh with this argument but they only cost 2 mana. When you're on a very proactive gameplan, as you always want to be, Alpha Myr is a lot better than Millenial Gargoyle.

I like the idea of Perilous Myr but I feel like it's a bit of a meta call as it's situationally a do-nothing (also depends on how many players are in your average game).

I don't know if muddle is good enough: I really hated Mystical Tutor every time I drew it, muddle is just a straight up protection spell which is often what mystical tutor was used for and it can also find boots, but it just seems waaaay too slow.

All is Dust seems like overkill when you're already playing Disk and Stone, Argivian Restoration was always too situational and expensive for me

Defense Grid is interesting but in games where you need it as an anti-counterpell card you want to have it in play early, before your arcum, which is difficult to do. Cards like Spellskite and Revoker are also situationally bad in this sense but you can at least tinker them away in matchups where they don't do anything.

I used to play TFK and Thoughtcast they are solid cards - what you see is what you get basically. I cut them for some more spicy artifacts just to see how they go but I would consider adding the blue spells back in if it doesn't pan out.

With your more defensive bent I'm surprised to see that you aren't playing pact of negation. I'd like to know what are the decks you normally play against, how consistently you manage to win, etc. I've definitely started to lean toward the philosopy of "Play enough fast mana and just blast through the hate" so maybe I need a reality check.

[FTW]

Hmm. I like my decks to function when my commander is not around, which is why there are cards like Lodestone Golem, Defense Grid and All is Dust to slow things down while I can't just tinker through my whole deck. That slows down opponents and gives me time to recast him or get out more creatures to sacrifice. I don't know what other peoples' EDH metas are like. Everyone playing "danger of cool things" and playing solitaire trying to assemble their own awesomeness first? That could be pretty fun too. But our format is very interactive. Stuff dies. People play a lot of interactive cards and abilities. Mass removal, 2-for-1 spot removal, engines that interact with boardstates, etc.

This means that on T0, when everyone sees you are playing a broken combo-engine general (Arcum, Jhoira, etc.) instead of a slower incremental general, someone is probably saving some way to stop your linear gameplan from going off.

In particular there's a huge difference between T4: Elixir/Greaves/Boots, T5: Arcum+activate and T4: Arcum, T5: Activate. Not just the random Lightning Bolts. Letting Arcum sit around leaves him wide open to Wraths, Flametongue Kavu-type creatures and other sorcery speed removal. Or worse. Arcum eating Oblation is seriously bad news, since you have pretty much no ways to ever find him again.... So IMO I'd rather wait the turn and have him go off immediately.

Mana Drain, Mizzium Skin and Pact are sweet. I left them out due to anti synergy with Defense Grid, but Defense Grid can probably go. Restoration can probably go too. It's mostly there if someone kills a combo piece before Forge is out.

Muddle the Mixture is amazing... it Transmutes into either Grim Monolith or Power Artifact.

[kombatkiwi]

But it shouldn't even be turn 4 arcum turn 5 activate
With the amount large amount of acceleration I can reliably have arcum on turn 3 or even 2, which is so fast that it blanks a lot of removal anyway (especially the mass and 2-for-1 kind, which is usually fairly expensive)

Yeah I agree with you on Argivian (Thats why you have backup combos and Diver/Retriever/Ruin/Ruins) but I didn't see the dis-synergy between your own counterspells and defense grid.
The defense grid plan also gets a lot better when you're maxing on haste enablers
I'll have to give that card a try I guess

EDIT
Planar portal might be on the chopping block:

Ring of Three Wishes (5) (M14)
Comes into play with 3 Wish counters
{5}{T}, Remove a wish counter: search your deck for a card and add it to hand

But I'm not sure I want to play this card either

I think planar portal should probably just be cut. I basically never hardcast it from hand because 6 is really expensive on its own, not to mention 6 mana for every search. It's useful in the sense that if your top somehow gets removed or if you assemble infinite mana with power artifact instead of rings it lets you chain-tutor into a win but this doesn't seem to come up much. This might be because I still don't have a power artifact IRL yet but they just unbanned staff of domination which serves a very similar purpose to planar portal in this regard anyway. Thoughts?

[jake556]

I didn't see this in the OP but Etherium Sculptor + SDT + Magus of the Future/Future Sight, is also Infinite draw.

[FTW]

I didn't see this in the OP but Etherium Sculptor + SDT + Magus of the Future/Future Sight, is also Infinite draw.

True. I opted not to run Futures because I find UUU very difficult to get with this deck, compared to other blue-artifact decks like Azami or Sharuum. There are also no ways to find it, since IT would be your draw engine to dig through your deck, and its redundant if you already assemble another engine. Staff just does a similar thing only its easier to set up. If I spend UUU I want to win the game, not durdle around. Mind Over Matter does that (you immediately get to discard and reuse Arcum). So not even USZ in here (to win with infinite mana) because it's hard to find and the triple blue to cast. Staff being unbanned solves a lot of that IMO.

@kombatkiwi
I should mention I play this more like a Prison deck with combo finish than a straight combo deck, not at all like a Glass Cannon, which may explain some of our different card preferences. I typically cast Arcum with protection and then don't activate him until the last EOT so I get better information about what tools I need to respond to the board. This allows me to tutor Darksteel Forge in response to removal, or O-Stone if the board gets out of hand, Myr Turbine if my other creatures get killed and I need fodder, etc. I typically play control-style until I can Forge+Lattice+Disk away everyone's permanents,and then, if people don't quit, I can tutor out the infinite combo to win the game quickly. Depending on the starting hand I might just go straight fast combo, but a lot of the time I'll opt to play reactive.

Ring of Three Wishes looks decent

Planar Portal is essentially my way to convert an Arcum activation into Power Artifact so I don't have to durdle around drawing cards and can just get my infinite mana now. Sometimes it gets protection or an answer too. It's basically both my "Hail Mary" button and my "I combo out now" button but isn't cast/tutored for regularly.


Re: 2-for-1 removal not being online before turn 4... the 3-color control decks can run as much ramp as we do... (for different reasons... because they're mana hungry in general, not to go off early). Wrath/Chain Reaction/Barter in Blood/etc is all possible on turn 2-3 just as easily as we can cheat out Arcum early. And Oblation/Chaos Warp/Hinder can be online turn 2. Maybe you can just blast through a soft/slow meta over there? I usually need to be careful. I think it just fits my play style better too.

[mrjumbo03]

Necro! This dude might be playable.

[kombatkiwi]

Necro! This dude might be playable.

I don't know if I would.

As a general it's just a worse Arcum and as a card to put in Arcum I don't think it's worth a slot. It might be okay as a sort of backup Arcum if your meta is really slow with a lot of removal.
I took my Arcum deck apart though. I found it was too good for 'fun' games but in an environment with other people that are really trying to win it just isn't quite good enough.