Yawn. Sharuum. Again

[Sims]

I figure I'd throw this up here to see what people think or what ideas they have for this.

General:
Sharuum the Hegemon

Lands//

4x Plains
5x Swamp
6x Island
Hallowed Fountain
Godless Shrine
Watery Grave
Drowned Catacomb
Glacial Fortress
Dimir Aqueduct
Azorious Chancery
Orzhov Basilica
Mishra's Factory
Academy Ruins
Temple of the False God
Seachrome Coast
Darkslick Shores
Reflecting Pool
Strip Mine
Bojuka Bog
Reliquary Tower
Vault of Whispers
Seat of the Synod
Ancient Den
Darksteel Citadel
Tolaria West
Command Tower
Arcane Sanctum


Mana Rocks:

Mox Opal
Mana Crypt
Everflowing Chalice
Sol Ring
Mana Vault
Mind Stone
Prismatic Lens
Basalt Monolith
Gilded Lotus


Mini-Toolbox

Artificer's Intuition
Aether Spellbomb
Voltaic Key
Pithing Needle
Sensei's Divining Top
Elixir of Immortality
Nihil Spellbomb
Hex Parasite
Engineered Explosives
Executioner's Capsule


Tutors and Draw:

Vampiric tutor
Enlightened tutor
Demonic Tutor
Transmute Artifact
Fabricate
Compulsive Research
Thirst for Knowledge
Trinket Mage
Dimir House Guard
Memory Jar
Tezzeret the Seeker
Kuldotha Forgemaster


Sweepers and removal

Oblivion Stone
Nevinyrral's Disk
Damnation
Wrath of God
Duplicant
Spine of Ish Shah


Stupid Beaters

Wurmcoil Engine
Sundering Titan
Inkwell Leviathan
Steel Hellkite
Sphinx of the Steel Wind
Myr Battlesphere


Utility and Other

Disciple of the Vault
Karn, Silver Golem
Crucible of Worlds
Sculpting Steel
Phyrexian Metamorph
Leyline of the Void
Helm of Obedience
Solemn Simulacrum
Sword of the Meek
Thopter Foundry
Time Sieve
Rings of Brighthearth
Ethersworn Canonist
Mycosynth Lattice
Sanctum Gargoyle
Master Transmuter
Darksteel Forge

So, notable exceptions due to having already sold sets before I decided to build the deck (and subsequently not wanting to repurchase them):

Wasteland
Grim Monolith
Ancient Tomb
City of Traitors
Mox Diamond
Real Duals
Fetchlands

You can mention these, but for the reason stated above I probably won't be able to get my hands on them but I know that they'd be useful.

Obvious Combos:
Leyline + Helm = Deck one player, recur helm to do it again.
Sharuum + Disciple + Sculpting Steel or Metamorph = Winning vs. Board
Basalt Monolith + Rings of Brighthearth = infinite colorless (+Top draws the deck)
Disk + Forge + Lattice = Reset everyones board but yours.
Sieve + Forge + Sword = You should know this.

General play
We play a mix of 1v1 and multiplayer so I'd like to stay somewhat balanced for both- Plays as typically as you'd imagine- drop mana rocks, evaluate what's going on, and tutor up the pieces you need. Some games you beat down with dumb fatties, some games you combo out with Sharuum, Helm/line, or infinite colorless -> play your deck out via Lattice.

The group I usually play this deck with consists of a player that runs Memnarch/Arcum, Sakashima the Imposter/Jhoira of the Ghitu, and usually a random 4th if we have one. The only deck with much in the way of Countermagic is the Sakashima deck, so I've eschewed it as generally I can recover from a few counterspells, and realistically if they're countering all my shit the game is going to end from someone else anyways.

Thoughts/Opinons? I want to get the new academy ruins guy from M12, just haven't been able to get a hold of one yet. Any other blatently obvious cards that I'm missing?

Thanks guys.

[(nameless one)]

Though I've only pulled it once, you might wanna try the cheese combo.

Here's how it works:

Get Karn Liberated online. Somehow exile Barren Glory via Karn and protect him at all costs until he ultimates (make sure you don't exile anything other non-aura permanents). Once Karn has enough loyalty counters for his ultimate, restart the game. On that new game, mulligan to zero. Once the game starts, you start it with The Cheese Stands Alone on the field. At the beginning of your upkeep, Cheese triggers and you win the game.

It also works with Felidar Sovereign.

[Sims]

Though I've only pulled it once, you might wanna try the cheese combo.

Here's how it works:

Get Karn Liberated online. Somehow exile Barren Glory via Karn and protect him at all costs until he ultimates (make sure you don't exile anything other non-aura permanents). Once Karn has enough loyalty counters for his ultimate, restart the game. On that new game, mulligan to zero. Once the game starts, you start it with The Cheese Stands Alone on the field. At the beginning of your upkeep, Cheese triggers and you win the game.

It also works with Felidar Sovereign.

lololol

That's hilarious.

edit: Sorry that made me sound like a dick. It is really funny, and amazing to pull off, but our playgroup doesn't use the unglued and unhinged cards, so it wouldn't be feasible with this deck. Maybe if I make a hilarious casual pile of win combos that all take the stars and planets aligning around a blue moon, that will assuredly be one of the combos.

[Kuma]

Basalt Monolith + Rings of Brighthearth = infinite colorless (+Top draws the deck)

Am I missing something here? How do you draw your deck with the Sensei's Divining Top. Rings of Brighthearth lets you draw two cards with it, because you can only copy its draw a card ability once.

[GGoober]

Am I missing something here? How do you draw your deck with the Sensei's Divining Top. Rings of Brighthearth lets you draw two cards with it, because you can only copy its draw a card ability once.

Get infinite coloress with Rings + Basalt monolith first.

Play your SDT, tap SDT and put that ability on the stack, pay copy that ability with Rings. Let the copied ability resolve, you draw a card put SDT on top of your library. Then the original ability resolves, you draw a card (the SDT) and you put SDT on top of your library (but SDT is no longer in play). Use from your infinite colorless mana pool, play SDT again and rinse repeat to draw your deck.

[Sims]

Correct. That line of play usually involves drawing the deck, playing mycosynth lattice (which allows you to play anything in your deck with colorless) and then using Elixir to recur things from your yard so you don't deck yourself should you be unable to win on the spot, but typically once you go infinite unless they know there is a counter up at the table, it's time to pick them up.

I know there is probably issues with the deck that I haven't noticed during playing (the cards on the "i don't have list" for instance would help the deck greatly), but has anyone noticed anything glaring that i'm missing?

[dsck]

Magister Sphinx?

[Sims]

Magister Sphinx?

I've thought long and hard about that one (Ive got a foil one, which makes it even more tempting) but Im really hesitant to add it in for 2 reasons:

1) It's a dumb beater, and which dumb beater is it superior to? This could be a tough question as i think those are the only slots it could go in

2) Bribery suuuuuuuucks. This was the reason I ended up cutting Blightsteel Colossus from my list, I had no way of dealing with it myself shy of tutoring up Duplicant or Just Winning. In this case I've got removal for it, but at that point the damage is already done and almost any of the players at the table could probably sneeze at me and I'd die.

I'll do some testing with it, and see how often that ends up biting me in the ass, but right now it seems like it could be more dangerous than it's actually worth.

[raye]

How about some blink? Works great with your general. I prefer Tawnos's Coffin but there are other good options.

The Abyss goes great with your deck but is costly.

You can get infinite mana but I didn't notice a card that let you win using the mana. Goblin Cannon perhaps?

There are a few tutors that would work well and a few card draw spells too. Fact or Fiction and Intuition are excellent. Given how combo oriented your deck is, Frantic Search might be worth adding. Tainted Pact is great for grabing that last combo piece.

Salvaging Station might be good. Reuse your spellbombs. Might not get full value unless you add some of the capsules.

There's always Mindslaver.

[Sims]

How about some blink? Works great with your general. I prefer Tawnos's Coffin but there are other good options.

The Abyss goes great with your deck but is costly.

You can get infinite mana but I didn't notice a card that let you win using the mana. Goblin Cannon perhaps?

There are a few tutors that would work well and a few card draw spells too. Fact or Fiction and Intuition are excellent. Given how combo oriented your deck is, Frantic Search might be worth adding. Tainted Pact is great for grabing that last combo piece.

Salvaging Station might be good. Reuse your spellbombs. Might not get full value unless you add some of the capsules.

There's always Mindslaver.

Mindslaver I want to stay away from. I used that to lock the game out in my Arcum long ago before they banned Academy and Staff, and i twas truly a lame way to win a game. And, I feel, that's saying something coming from a player who typically does kill the board all in one turn.

Abyss, while really good, is costly and slow. The current sweeper suite at least has an immediate (or near immediate) impact on the board. It's on my watch list though, because I love casting the card.

I like the other ideas, especially the blink effects, but i'm at a loss of where to put them. The meta I play in has started to bloom and I believe we're going to start (possibly) doing league games with reserved generals, and a points system... In that situation I think since some of the newer players are gonig to have the precons with changes and cheaper to build aggro style decks the sweepers and beaters (the weakest spots in a combo deck) are going to be more necessary than ever. Any ideas on what I could sub out for some Blink effects and a Salvaging Station?

If I can get ahold of one I'll definitely shoe-horn in Intuition somewhere, probably over one of the draw spells. I like to draw cards, but lets face it, tutoring is usually much more effective and powerful. Resolving Demonic, Vampiric, Intuition, or Enlightened and getting the card you need to win is typically better than resolving a Draw spell.

Edit: Yeah, mana sink for infy colorless. You're right I don't have a direct wincon like Magma Mine or Goblin Cannon, but if I can draw my deck or find and resolve Mycosynth Lattice then i can cast everything i draw for colorless so it doesn't matter. On that note, I think Planar Portal needs to find a way in the deck. Any ideas on what to cut for one?

[raye]

I feel these are your weakest cards currently.

Dimir House Guard
Elixir of Immortality
Hex Parasite
Engineered Explosives
Sanctum Gargoyle

Also, you don't seem to have many ways of destroying enchantments. There is a capsule that works. There is also Ethersworn Adjudicator. I play Dismantling Blow for extra draw.

You also don't have that many ways to kill lands other than Strip Mine. Wasteland is costly now but Dust Bowl is very versitile. There's always Tech Edge.

Some other cards to consider. Future Sight. Braingeyser or Stroke. Not just for draw but as a infinite mana wincon. Phyrexian Arena. Acrum Dagsson. You can also consider some of the better sweepers in white. The ones that exile or tuck or give you choices about what else to kill off.

[Sims]

I feel these are your weakest cards currently.

Dimir House Guard
Elixir of Immortality
Hex Parasite
Engineered Explosives
Sanctum Gargoyle

Also, you don't seem to have many ways of destroying enchantments. There is a capsule that works. There is also Ethersworn Adjudicator. I play Dismantling Blow for extra draw.

You also don't have that many ways to kill lands other than Strip Mine. Wasteland is costly now but Dust Bowl is very versitile. There's always Tech Edge.

Some other cards to consider. Future Sight. Braingeyser or Stroke. Not just for draw but as a infinite mana wincon. Phyrexian Arena. Acrum Dagsson. You can also consider some of the better sweepers in white. The ones that exile or tuck or give you choices about what else to kill off.

Houseguard and Gargoyle I can agree with being weak and easy cuts. DHG does tutor up almost any of my sweepers without risk of being countered but it is weak, I'll grant you that. The other 3 are a bit more borderline, here's my reasoning:

Elixir- the gain life is usually moot, but it's shuffling itself + graveyard into the library has been key in being able to reuse cards Sharuum can't recur or prevent decking while looping. Agreed it is a bit weak but I feel like if I cut it I should find some other form of recursion.. Maybe the Salvaging station could go here?

Hex Parasite kills planeswalkers... that's huge. I don't ahve anything else in the deck that can really do that without having Mycosynth lattice in play so it'd get hit by disk or stone. This might seem like not a huge deal, but having a cheap tutorable card that can shut down my opponents mindsculptor or Tezzeret the seeker is huge. I'll cut it and see how much I miss it when I sit down to play.

EE is a tough sell, just because the card is so damn versatile. I might only be able to put 3 counters on it, but it can answer enchantments, token swarms, opposing players who like playing lock components in their decks... I'll try it, but I can easily see this as being the first card of the list that i'd miss.

i think if i were to cut those 5, plus say wrath, i'd probably put in their place:

Tawnos' Coffin/Momentary Blink/Something to abuse sharuum
Planar Portal
Hallowed Burial (for wrath)
dispeller's capsule
Future Sight
then probably Stroke or BSZ, something like that.

Good suggestions, keep em comin!

[Sims]

Double post for great justice and playing games.

Okay so after this weekend, I've decided that i didn't enjoy being stuck in a 2 hour 4 way game with 2 cards in my hand doing nothing because I couldn't draw tutors. Need more draw spells. To that end I believe Future Sight, Fact or Fiction, and possibly Frantic Search (or something that digs deeper, but i don't want it to cost more than 4, preferably less) are going in the deck over House Guard, Gargoyle, and Ethersworn.

It sucks, because I like my shiny Cannonist, but in a group game situation it does nothing but make me a huge target and doesn't really make me any allies except the other guy playing artifact combo who doesn't care and is still going to try and race me.

Still looking to see if i can get ahold of a Tawnos' Coffin but i might have to make due with just momentary blink for now.

[Zach Tartell]

Ancient Craving, Ambition's Cost, Dregs of Sorrow, Overwhelming Forces, Tidings, Opportunity, BSZ, Concentrate, Mystical Teachings

[Sims]

Ancient Craving, Ambition's Cost, Dregs of Sorrow, Overwhelming Forces, Tidings, Opportunity, BSZ, Concentrate, Mystical Teachings

<3 Zach, lol.

[Malchar]

When I played Sharuum, I used filigree angel to refill my life, and then eternity vessel to keep it that way. Both of these cards are great to bring back after they hit the yard, or just to bounce with master transmuter.

Also, I frequently used buried alive to get my pieces. I would frequently search for magister sphinx, recur it with sharuum, then swing for 10 in the air next turn. As for bribery, you have the filigree angel to refill your life, and you can always block the magister with your general. Also, I would almost always want to tutor or buried alive for the magister asap, which usually happened before bribery was possible.

[raye]

I've been considering how wise it would be to try the Tainted lands from Torment. Tainted Isle and Tainted Field. I have the Duals and fetches and 2 Swamps (one snow) and Urborg but I don't have shocklands. I think if I had the shocklands, I'd run the tainted lands for sure. But I think I need to test it with just 7 ways to get a Swamp.

I'm glad you have decided on running more card advantage. A few other suggestions for that. Mind's Eye. I figured it must have been on your list before. Windfall. You will probably get more out of a turn 2 or turn 3 Windfall than anyone else at the table since you can dump your hand pretty quickly. Shame Twister has no synergy with the general.

I know you don't run counterspells but if you can throw one in, Mana Drain can set up some amazing turns. Just use it for the mana bonus. Probably not worth seeking one out though.

Glimmervoid. I'm surprised to not see that on your list too.

You don't run a ton of Black but an Urborg could ensure you always have it. If you wind up deciding you want Arcum Dagsson, Minamo, School at Water's Edge would be pretty blowout.

[psu42]

I just wanted to post my Sharuum list. I just recently got into EDH and this is the list I currently use. We do 4 player pods where I play, so this is designed for multiplayer EDH, not 1v1 (not a points system either). I'm currently 4-0 with this list and its previous versions.

This list is very defensive as I play with Propaganda, Ghostly Prison, and Norn's Annex. Besides the obvious combos of: 1. Sharuum + Disciple + Scultping/Metamorph and 2. Thopter Foundry + Sword of the Meek + Time Sieve and I don't really run any other combos per say. Getting Wurmcoil equipped with multiple swords however is really strong.

Any comments or suggestions? I have some ideas for cards I would like to cut that I don't feel are pulling their weight at the end.

// Commander
1x Sharuum, the Hegemon

// Lands
1x Polluted Delta
1x Verdant Catacombs
1x Bloodstained Mire
1x Marsh Flats
1x Misty Rainforest
1x Scalding Tarn
1x Flooded Strand
1x Windswept Heath
1x Arid Mesa

1x Underground Sea
1x Tundra
1x Scrubland
1x Watery Grave
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Godless Shrine
1x Swamp
1x Island
1x Snow-Covered Island
1x Plains

1x Drowned Catacomb
1x Glacial Fortress

1x Vault of Whispers
1x Seat of the Synod
1x Ancient Den

1x Arcane Sanctum
1x Command Tower
1x Glimmervoid

1x Minamo, School at Water's Edge

1x Academy Ruins
1x Ancient Tomb
1x Strip Mine
1x Wasteland

// Planeswalkers
1x Jace Beleren
1x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1x Tezzeret the Seeker
1x Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

// Creatures
1x Disciple of the Vault
1x Etched Champion
1x Etherium Sculptor
1x Ethersworn Adjudicator
1x Master of Etherium
1x Master Transmuter
1x Phyrexian Metamorph
1x Platinum Angel
1x Sen Triplets
1x Sower of Temptation
1x Sphinx of the Steel Wind
1x Stoneforge Mystic
1x Trinket Mage
1x Wurmcoil Engine

// Spells:
// Tutors, Manipulation, and Counters
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Enlightened
1x Intuition
1x Merchant Scroll
1x Mystical Tutor
1x Transmute Artifact
1x Vampiric Tutor

1x Brainstorm
1x Fact or Fiction
1x Ponder
1x Preordain
1x Skeletal Scrying
1x Thirst for Knowledge

1x Counterspell
1x Force of Will
1x Mana Drain

// Removal
1x Barter in Blood
1x Black Sun's Zenith
1x Damnation
1x Day of Judgment
1x Path to Exile
1x Swords to Plowshares
1x Wrath of God

// Mana Acceleration
1x Coalition Relic
1x Darksteel Ingot
1x Gilded Lotus
1x Mana Crypt
1x Mana Vault
1x Sol Ring

// Equipment
1x Swiftfoot Boots
1x Sword of Feast and Famine
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Sword of the Meek
1x Sword of War and Peace

// Utility
1x Courier's Capsule
1x Crucible of Worlds
1x Darksteel Forge
1x Executioner's Capsule
1x Ghostly Prison
1x Norn's Annex
1x Oblivion Ring
1x Propaganda
1x Rhystic Study
1x Sculpting Steel
1x Sensei's Divining Top
1x Thopter Foundry
1x Time Sieve
1x Voltaic Key
1x Yawgmoth's Will

Cards considering cutting:

Master of Etherium - can get big quickly and helps boost my army size, but doesn't provide any real threat or hard to deal with effect

Black Sun's Zenith - good removal, but I'm not sure it is necessary

Courier's Capsule - does provide card advantage, but is pretty slow and not amazing by any means

Cards considering adding:

Blightsteel Colossus - can easily get into play via Master Transmuter and combined with Swords is instant death to target opponent...downside is it does cost 12 and I don't have many ways to cheat into play

Mind's Eye - direct replacement of Capsule for card advantage

Nev.'s Disk or Oblivion Stone - direct replacement of Black Sun's Zenith

Mox Opal - different mana acceleration

Hex Parasite - amazing versus Planeswalkers and creatures with counters

Karn, Silver Golem - animate my huge non-creature artifacts

Fabricate - another great tutor

Ethersworn Canonist - slows down other players while it doesn't really affect me