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Thread: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

  1. #1

    BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    This is a strategy i've been toying with for the last two years, testing endlessly on Cockatrice how i could make this combo be functional. Basically, the idea was to center a combo strategy around one of the best sleeper combo engines i've seen come to light in the last few years: Priest of Forgotten Gods.

    It's a cheap creature whose effect basically: is a realiable sac outlet that gives you two LTB triggers "for free" and a potential third at the cost of 2 life; clears the opponent's board; damages them; add colored mana; and draws cards. It felt like a LOT of combo potential.

    So i've seen two possible roads to take: either go UB, using Intruder Alarm + Nether Traitor/Gravecrawler + Genesis Chamber; or go BG, using Whisperwood Elemental + any number of 0 CMC creatures. The latter felt a lot more reliable for the lower number of cards on the battlefield it took for the combo to work out (how wrong i was :P), and as i ended up losing the UB list when i formated my old computer, here's the BGuw version it ended up being:


    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Mox Diamond
    4 Lotus Bloom
    4 Priest of Forgotten Gods
    1 Whisperwood Elemental
    2 Protean Hulk
    1 Coral Trickster
    1 Blood Celebrant
    1 Academy Rector
    4 Squandered Resources
    1 Mortuary
    4 Dark Ritual
    2 Dream's Grip
    4 Bayou
    3 Snow-Covered Forest
    4 Snow-Covered Swamp
    4 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Polluted Delta
    4 Scheming Symmetry
    2 Grim Tutor
    4 Tooth and Nail


    So, how is this combo executed? Well, this is the part where it comes really clear how janky this whole list is :P

    Between turns 1 and 2, you want to put a Priest of Forgotten Gods on the table. Simple as that.

    Between turns 2 and 4, you want to have 9 mana available and 2 cards in hand: Tooth and Nail and Dream Grip. The order of the effects, then, is:
    > Cast Tooth and Nail entwined searching for the 2 Protean Hulks;
    > Activate Priest's ability targeting yourself (very important to always target yourself only at this very first cycle) and the opponent, and saccing both Hulks to its cost.
    > With Priest's ability on the stack, both Hulks' triggers will go to the stack on top of it. When they resolve, with one of them you'll pull Whisperwood Elemental and Blood Celebrant, and with the other you'll pull Academy Rector and Coral Trickster. (Exactly 6 CMC at both cases, which is why it must be followed exactly like that or it won't be possible to set up the combo.);
    > Priest's ability resolves. Opp's gonna lose 2 life and sac any creatures he or she may have. You'll lose 2 life, sac Rector and exile it to pull Mortuary from your deck to the battlefield, add BB and draw a card;
    > With Blood Celebrant, you'll pay 1 life to 'filter' one of those B into a blue mana and cast Dream Grip from your hand, untapping Priest of Forgotten Gods;
    > Finally, you'll sac Whisperwood Elemental to its own ability, and you have the combo set to win this very turn.

    (It is VERY important that you ONLY sac Whisperwood when you have the certainty you'll be able to go off, because it's essential to be able to do so. Otherwise, you'll lose it - and the game.)

    >> The combo loop:
    >> Tap Priest of Forgotten Gods saccing Coral Trickster and Blood Celebrant, targeting your opponent;
    >> Mortuary and Whisperwood's triggers will go to the stack; you order them always as Whisperwood's first, and Mortuary's last, in a way that always when those two creatures die, essentially, they manifest themselves;
    >> After both triggers resolve and both creatures return to the battlefield manifested, opp's gonna lose 2 life and sacrifice any creatures he or she may still have. You'll add BB and draw a card;
    >> With one of the B mana you just added, you'll turn over Blood Celebrant, and then, pay the other B mana plus 1 life to turn it into U mana, and then use that to pay Trickster's Morph cost to turn it over as well;
    >> When Trickster is turned over, it will trigger and untap Priest of Forgotten Gods;
    >> We've returned to the same point as we began. Repeat this process as many times as it takes to have opponent dead. You should finish this loop with something around 5-8 life.

    Is it janky? Unreliable? Hard to set? Uncompetitive? Probably all of the above. But it shows the kind of value this card generates and the potential it has, due to how well it fuels each step of this combo, and how it sets it almost alone. Should anyone have any kind of tips on how to play/build it and/or would like to play it just to test and see how it would work out, feel free to do so.

  2. #2

    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    This is why I like Magic.

    Also, congratulations on completing even a single game with this deck on a platform like Cockatrice. (No disrespect to Cockatrice --- it's a great platform, but a sandbox gaming platform where both players can take any action at any time is ideal for simple decks or for opponents who can communicate well, not for explaining your trigger stacking to random strangers.)

  3. #3

    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    Quote Originally Posted by BirdsOfParadise View Post
    This is why I like Magic.

    Also, congratulations on completing even a single game with this deck on a platform like Cockatrice. (No disrespect to Cockatrice --- it's a great platform, but a sandbox gaming platform where both players can take any action at any time is ideal for simple decks or for opponents who can communicate well, not for explaining your trigger stacking to random strangers.)
    <3 <3 <3

  4. #4
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    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    You know this will be lolz when it starts with 8x Lotus, 4xTooth and Nail

    Enjoy!

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    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    This deck looks hilarious. Don't have the time now to look into it in detail, but the biggest 'flaw' of the combo seems to me that you need a 2-off in your hand when trying to combo, without reliable card selection. The scheming symmetry also helps your opponent, so I don't call that a great way to find the Dream's Grip. My first thought was whether it'd be possible to use one of the creatures you can find with the Tooth and Nail to untap the priest and only combo using a single Hulk (at first). Like I said, I don't know if that can be viable, but would be a significant improvement I think.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dice_Box View Post
    Non games are not only a common sight in Legacy, they are every decks plan. [...] Playing a deck like DnT and then complaining about "Non games" is hypocritical, because non games are your plan, you just disapprove of the way someone else is trying to achieve that same goal.

  6. #6

    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    Quote Originally Posted by UseLess View Post
    This deck looks hilarious. Don't have the time now to look into it in detail, but the biggest 'flaw' of the combo seems to me that you need a 2-off in your hand when trying to combo, without reliable card selection. The scheming symmetry also helps your opponent, so I don't call that a great way to find the Dream's Grip. My first thought was whether it'd be possible to use one of the creatures you can find with the Tooth and Nail to untap the priest and only combo using a single Hulk (at first). Like I said, I don't know if that can be viable, but would be a significant improvement I think.
    Unfortunately, as far as i have managed to go on my research for this build, it isn't possible. And I TRIED. I ran a search over all possible effects that untapped a permanent, and unfortunately the Hulks are only necessary because the combo runs too many pieces to go off. Plus, if you happen to not have Dream Grip in hand, you can just not sac Whisperwood and pass the turn.

    ...and pray.

    Maybe it's something that hasn't occurred to me yet, and that's one of the reasons i brought this list here - to see if there was anything i could do to make this more reliable and consistent that i hadn't noticed. The other was to bring awareness that at any moment some new crd might come out and take advantage of this wonderful card. Maybe it won't be on a combo strategy like i just did, but it has a lot of potential.

  7. #7

    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    You know this will be lolz when it starts with 8x Lotus, 4xTooth and Nail

    Enjoy!
    If there was anyway i could run less TaN's and swap those extra copies for something that would make the combo more reliable, i definetely would.

  8. #8

    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    So just to make sure I understand, the combo needs:

    A non-summoning sick creature that dies to bolt and can be stifled
    9 mana
    tooth & nail & dream grip in your hand
    No gy hate or plague engineer effects
    Neither of your protean hulks, nor rector, nor trickster, nor wisperwood elemental, nor mortuary in your hand.

    This is the type of jank I live for.

  9. #9

    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    Quote Originally Posted by pedropohren View Post
    Unfortunately, as far as i have managed to go on my research for this build, it isn't possible. And I TRIED. I ran a search over all possible effects that untapped a permanent, and unfortunately the Hulks are only necessary because the combo runs too many pieces to go off. Plus, if you happen to not have Dream Grip in hand, you can just not sac Whisperwood and pass the turn.

    ...and pray.

    Maybe it's something that hasn't occurred to me yet, and that's one of the reasons i brought this list here - to see if there was anything i could do to make this more reliable and consistent that i hadn't noticed. The other was to bring awareness that at any moment some new crd might come out and take advantage of this wonderful card. Maybe it won't be on a combo strategy like i just did, but it has a lot of potential.
    You can easily get the combo down to 1 protean hulk + 1 any other creature; I assume any combo that involves untapping the priest a bunch is on theme.

    T2 priest
    T3 orinthopter, S&T protean hulk, sac thopter + hulk (2x B), get Academy Rector & 2 Teardrop Kami & a bunch of 0 cost dudes, sac a kami to untap priest, sac rector + 0 cost dude to get Diabolic Servitude returning hulk, sac kami #2 to untap priest, and now you are back where you started but are up BBBBBB, a diabolic servitude in hand, and a rector in your gy.

    There are many ways to win at this point but easiest is probably get another rector + 2x kami sac 1 rector for enter the infinite and the other for omniscience.

    There are probably better hulk piles but this is the easiest and silliest I could come up with.

    Protean hulk is sort of cheating though; almost any sac outlet can win with a hulk. Priest is probably the worst due to the tap condition. I would rather see a more unique combo that takes advantage of the card draw or mana, which is why I used diabolic servitude.

  10. #10
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    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    I agree that Protean Hulk is kind of cheating and a combo built around Priest is better.

    Nadir Kraken lets you pay 1 to create a 1/1 token every time you draw a card.
    With 2 Krakens in play, you can pay BB to make 2 1/1s, then sacrifice them to make BB and draw again, triggering both Krakens again. As long as you have a way to untap Priest (e.g. Intruder Alarm), you get to draw your deck and drain opponent to death.

    The Locust God is another way to create tokens from each draw, without paying mana, allowing you to store up black mana.

    Umbral Mantle is another way to untap Priest, but requires some way to generate a 3rd mana to create a loop.

    Multiple Nether Traitors/Gravecrawler might just be a cleaner solution though. You can play a deck with those and Priests to play a value game, and then if you get Intruder Alarm you can just win in one turn.


    Edit: Mono Black Aristocombo


    //Creatures: 22
    4 Gravecrawler
    4 Stitcher's Supplier
    2 Carrion Feeder
    4 Priest of Forgotten Gods
    4 Nether Traitor
    4 Relentless Dead

    //Spells: 18
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Dark Ritual
    4 Cabal Therapy
    3 Thoughtseize
    3 Diabolic Intent

    //Enchantment: 4
    4 Intruder Alarm

    //Lands: 16
    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Marsh Flats
    3 Underground Sea
    2 Snow-Covered Swamp
    1 Snow-Covered Island
    2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth

  11. #11

    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    Adding fiend artisan and an anger as a very similar effect that is also a tutor seems interesting.

    Buried Alive seems to be a better tutor than diabolic intent.

  12. #12
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    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    Quote Originally Posted by Reeplcheep View Post
    Adding fiend artisan and an anger as a very similar effect that is also a tutor seems interesting.

    Buried Alive seems to be a better tutor than diabolic intent.
    Fiend Artisan looks strong. I wish it was a Zombie.

    Buried Alive can't find Intruder Alarm or Priest, the main 2 pieces. Anything (Gravecrawler, Traitor, Dead, Kraken, Genesis) works as fodder. Stitcher's Supplier/Brainstorm can help dig into 2.

    But this may be getting too streamlined and not enough of a crazy combo.

  13. #13

    Re: BG PoFG Combo (or How to create an unnecessarily complex and extenuating combo)

    buried alive would make relentless dead + fatesticher work if fatesticher was not so expensive. Making a 3 card package that wins the game with buried alive seems to make this deck almost good. Renegade rallier + corridor monitor is almost there. Graveshifter allows you to use relentless dead to get anything back but incurs a 4 cmc tax.

    Nothing quite works

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