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Thread: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

  1. #61

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by ivanpei View Post
    I can understand deleting a thread when there's slandering without proof. But when videos and screen caps of obvious cheating appears, something definitely has to be done. This evidence seems pretty conclusive IMO.
    I'm the one who started the old thread, and I asked Di to delete it because I had spoken directly with Drew who originally wanted me to put it up, but he had second thoughts because he was going to write an article or something to that effect about it.

    There are plenty of videos regarding his shady antics, coercive/misleading tactics, and blatant cheating, as I'm right there front-running this absurdity right out the door for the world to see. What an absolute fucking disgrace to the game.

    And for the record, that is four cards with that Brainstorm. It's pretty obvious as he was completely taking his opponent's lax attitude towards game-play in account and subliminally acting as if there was no thought behind his cheating, because of how blatantly obvious it is. His opponent is probably not even thinking twice at that moment because in the off-chance he even would think Alex was cheating, he's dismissing it as probably, "Well, who would be that dumb to cheat on a live feed anyway with judges right next to him?" He fanned out those four aces for the world to see and completely eradicated - in my mind - any credibility he has, had, or will have in any event in the future. I have no doubt he is talented, but he ruined a lot of peoples' days and cost a lot of people travel expenses at the urge to win at any cost.

    It almost makes me want to vomit looking at that picture of him holding up a set of Power and a check for ten large.

    Bertoncini is incredibly persuasive. I have played against him before (in the Top Four of a Jupiter Games event) and the kid is always looking for an edge any way he can get it. Unfortunately for him, it didn't work out so well.

  2. #62
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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    I do understand that most players are pissed (including me) but tearing SCG's head off instantly is not the way to go.
    I do have a healthy criticism for them though.
    There is a major difference between them letting DCI decide which action have to be taken, which is correct in general, or downgrading rules violation because of the star-character that magnetize other players towards their tourneys.
    That whole dream of beeing able to make it big in MtG, mostly not in front of a computer, is represented through SCG besides the official GP's/PT's and it would be the most sad thing if they were trying to let famous players get advantages in any form for business purpose.
    My hope hasn't fall down yet, but not thinking about that possibility would be pretty naive.


    Really looking forward to Bertoncini running away with his gigantic paycheck while Yakety Sax music plays off, followed by a dozen judges.
    Last edited by I am the brainwasher; 12-12-2011 at 07:56 AM. Reason: Unsure about the link included in my post.
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  3. #63
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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by sdematt View Post
    That's sad that he needs to cheat to win. Ban his ass.

    -Matt
    Everyone knows that's not grounds for banning. You have to threaten a WotC employee to get banned. Cheating and the de facto theft that accompanies it is perfectly legit. Ask Mike Long.
    Quote Originally Posted by Draener View Post
    You know who thinks it's sweet to play against 8 different decks in an 8 round tournament? People who don't like to win, or people that play combo. This is not EDH; Legacy is a competitive environment, and it should reward skill - more so than it does.
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  4. #64

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by LOurs View Post
    The real question is : were these plays intentional or not ?
    You can be pretty sure that every single play was intentional because he is neither stupid nor generally a bad player. I do not care much about him but I got to admit that he got to have some pretty big balls to constantly cheat people on this level of organized tournament play.

  5. #65

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    You can also all shoot me P.M.'s and I'll hook you up with *some* of his cheats. Drew Levin was kind enough to send me a nice supply of "Bertoncheaty's Greatest Dupes: Volume I." I'll hook you up after work. (Video-wise, there are currently four that I can recall, most of which you have all seen.)

    EDIT: There are also a great deal of corroborated stories about judge warnings and game-losses I have, too.

  6. #66

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Drew Levin's article. Pretty damning evidence.
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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Thanks, this article is great.
    Very embarrassing for SCG on the long road, regardless of the judgement on Bertoncini.
    In response...Hypothek!

  8. #68

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by puppektion View Post
    Drew Levin's article. Pretty damning evidence.
    Easily the best article I have ever read. The issue is beyond Bertoncini at this point; anyone turning a blind-eye to cheaters in this game are the ones who will ultimately be cheated - no matter how 'nice' your opponent may be.

  9. #69

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    oh so stupid or so confident to do this on camera...

    sidequestion - how is it with audience and judges? - I mean is interference in terms of game rules ok? like two-explores question? can they call judge on you-can you call judge on them (/have to?)?

    I've seen things like Phantasmal image with Jitte or less obvious like Intuition with Leyline of Sanctity.. what is "right" to do?

  10. #70
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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Just by the fact that in the Explore cheat video he put the last/extra land into play tapped proves to me this guy is a cheating piece of shit.

  11. #71

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jak View Post
    Just by the fact that in the Explore cheat video he put the last/extra land into play tapped proves to me this guy is a cheating piece of shit.
    You know what really damns the kid? The coercion.

    [gesturing] "...Two Explores."

    "...He's good."

    Sickening.

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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sloshthedark View Post
    oh so stupid or so confident to do this on camera...

    sidequestion - how is it with audience and judges? - I mean is interference in terms of game rules ok? like two-explores question? can they call judge on you-can you call judge on them (/have to?)?

    I've seen things like Phantasmal image with Jitte or less obvious like Intuition with Leyline of Sanctity.. what is "right" to do?
    If you witness a mistake/cheating like that, it is your responsibility to report it. That was Wescoe's argument with the whole Drew Levin "bet" thing. It didn't really hold a lot of water there, but as a general rule, if you see something that's wrong, game rules wrong, not, "you made the wrong play" wrong, say something.
    Quote Originally Posted by Draener View Post
    You know who thinks it's sweet to play against 8 different decks in an 8 round tournament? People who don't like to win, or people that play combo. This is not EDH; Legacy is a competitive environment, and it should reward skill - more so than it does.
    Quote Originally Posted by Borealis View Post
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  13. #73

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stevethedoer View Post
    http://imageshack.us/f/249/only3cards.jpg/

    Crappy link i know... but it still only shows 3 cards.... in the other pictures the sleeves are just wrinkled from him bending them making them look like its 4 cards....

    Now im not defending him or anything... I still think he should "incert pissed off comment here." I'd honestly punch him so hard in the face that he would have to use all the money he's cheated to win to fix it, if I ever saw him in person.
    Or that he clumped his top two cards and the second one slid very slightly.

    That being said, he was completely dominating that game, so it would take some serious nuttiness to cheat there... unless he was sure that he wouldn't get caught.

  14. #74
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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    It is somewhat ironic that someone used 'sleights of hand' and other card-based 'magic tricks' to help win tournaments of Magic. A lot of this guy's technique seems to be based around entry-level parlor tricks like using distraction and attention-diversion to gain an unfair advantage.

    In the Wild West, having an 'ace up your sleeve' would likely get you shot dead if your cheating was exposed.

    Obviously, we aren't so barbaric these days, but for everyone that wants to help maintain the integrity of this game, I think it is important that cheaters are publicly exposed and shamed.

    I think there is clear evidence here that it isn't just sloppy play, but actual repeated and blatant cheating.

    Even if it *was* just sloppy play, it doesn't mean it should go unpunished. I recall facing an opponent at GP Providence who got a game loss after we got deckchecked and he had forgotten to swap back a few sideboard cards. The cards he SBed would have been completely dead against my deck, and yet he still had to face the consequences -- I felt bad for him because I truly believe it was an honest mistake. In Bertoncini's case, it sounds like he made a habit of pre-emptively sideboarding to gain an advantage (or even pull out wins that would otherwise be impossible). At the very least, this should have been a game loss and a warning, and any further infractions should have been upgraded to harsher judgments.

    As it relates to us, I think we need to be vigilant of dubious players. In a format as huge as Legacy, remembering how every card works can be difficult, especially given factors such as old non-oracle wordings, foreign language cards, or general complexity. Cards like Brainstorm and Sylvan Library *do* have a huge potential for cheating, and if there was some reason for their consideration of banning, I think it should be for consideration of tournament disruption/potential for cheating (intentional or otherwise) moreso than tournament dominance/top 8 appearances -- but perhaps that is playing a significant factor?

    Not only does Bertoncini's cheating call into question the integrity of the SCG Open Series, but it negatively affects everyone's approach to sanctioned tournaments in general. Rather than sitting down against a new opponent and sharing some pleasantries/introductions and enjoying the game, people may be more paranoid about their opponent's potential cheating and the tournament atmosphere may become more hostile. He has done a huge disservice to Magic.

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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    I get nervous when I misclick on MWS, let alone doing something serious like not putting 2 back with BStorm or playing an extra land.

    When I play sloppy (and it happens, trust me) I don't usually get too worked up. The most prominant mistake I have made is forgetting if I've played a land in a turn. I ask my opponent 'have I played a land yet?' I go with whatever they say. If my opponent doesn't remember, I don't play a land...I'd rather lose to a dumb mistake than win by cheating (intentional or not.)

    How rewarding can winning be when you know it was accomplished through cheating?
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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    How rewarding can winning be when you know it was accomplished through cheating?
    Well, in this case 10,000$ at least
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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cthuloo View Post
    Well, in this case 10,000$ at least
    And a set of Unlimited Power 9

  18. #78

    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Look at who he hangs out with.


    Oscar Flores has allegedly admitted to cheating off the record, Nate Pease got banned from Vintage (for cheating), and didn't either Max Tietze or Mike Posgay get DQed from Nationals or something?
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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    I'm not blaming SCG one bit for Alex Bertoncini's muiltiple evidence of him cheating. They are only tourny organizer's. It sucks he won the inventational and I heard he is thinking about quiting, but he is a stain on the community. I hope DCI looks into it and gives him a lifetime ban, bc there is videofootage of him cheating multiple times, just the way he lays 4 cards down from a brainstorm is a enough for me.

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    Re: Alex Bertoncini's serial cheating.

    Quote Originally Posted by honestabe View Post
    Look at who he hangs out with.


    Oscar Flores has allegedly admitted to cheating off the record, Nate Pease got banned from Vintage (for cheating), and didn't either Max Tietze or Mike Posgay get DQed from Nationals or something?
    Posgay had like a 9 month suspension or so for attempting to bribe an opponent.

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