[Deck] T.E.S. - The EPIC Storm

[Bryant Cook]

Having a combination of RoF/IT or DR/BW in your hand but only Island+x as your initial mana for a turn 1/2/3 combo is awkward. Not necessarily having a Wish/IT and the appropiate acceleration is a problem which ANT has not

Edit 2: this means that if you decide to start with the Island you likely need two more IMS in a reasonable timeframe against opposing disruption like Stifle.

If this is the case, then don't fetch for it. The odds of naturally drawing it in your opening hand and this scenario happening are very slim. Not to mention, people in this thread give Stifle way too much credit - it's in one MAYBE two decks.

[Lemnear]

If this is the case, then don't fetch for it. The odds of naturally drawing it in your opening hand and this scenario happening are very slim. Not to mention, people in this thread give Stifle way too much credit - it's in one MAYBE two decks.

We will see how RUG Delver, Lands and Team America perform in the upcoming weeks. We played around Wasteland a year ago with 12 lands, so I'm positive that the Sky isn't falling now.

I agree on Stifle, that's why I don't buy it as a reason to run less fetches but Gematones

[Bryant Cook]

We will see how RUG Delver, Lands and Team America perform in the upcoming weeks. We played around Wasteland a year ago with 12 lands, so I'm positive that the Sky isn't falling now.

I agree on Stifle, that's why I don't buy it as a reason to run less fetches but Gematones

We did play around Wasteland with 12 lands a year ago, but if there's room for improvement we're going to find it.

[Togores]

Yeaterday another legacy event
3-2 was my record with no empty main -1 mox +2 cabal. I never missed the empty but 1 time the extra mox.

0-2 mono black hymns, seiZes, leylines, sinkholes, smallpox, trinisphere and 4 wastelands game 2 and 3 game 1 where quite good

0-2 miracles
G1 mulligans
G2 i went for a turn 1 and he had force. After my t1 even if he has force i had land, petal, led. To his mull to 6.


2-1
Affinity with md chalice
G1 gitaxian therapy chalice
G2 thorn t1
G3 t1 kill

2-0
Goblins
G1 turn 3
G2 turn 1

2-0 bug planeswalkers
Both ganes won because nauseam is an instant.

[PartyMonster]

Just qualified for scg Indianapolis day two. Saw waste land all day, everywhere. Everyone is playing waste land. Basics were great. I made some stupid decisions with my list but the one thing I registered right was the basics. Legit, can not express how valuable they were.


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[That0neD00d]

I just got back from my local weekly legacy event. I was running the list with a swamp being my only basic and I can't believe how much I was missing the island. Wasteland was very prevalent even in my smallish playgroup and I really needed a consistent way to cast cantrips. I immediately put it back in as soon as I got home and I have no plans to take it out anytime soon.

[Togores]

Just qualified for scg Indianapolis day two. Saw waste land all day, everywhere. Everyone is playing waste land. Basics were great. I made some stupid decisions with my list but the one thing I registered right was the basics. Legit, can not express how valuable they were.


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Congrats!
Just reading elver post saw this:

Rnd 8: TEPS (0-2) I "think" I could have won the first game but fail to see the line. Die to 16 gobos g1, and board wipe + tendrills for 17 storm g2. (Rode the Adnaus from 8 -> 1 to great success! with the assist from the recently acquired brainstorm for the needed kill card (burning wish)
Rnd 9: Dredge (1-2) Is lotus petals in dredge the new norm? Guy is turbo dredging on me!


Seema like you? May be? Quite funny how ppl think that nauseam fromless than 10 is dangerous. In Tes in all day good. Also won last week from 7 a game.

[Bryant Cook]

Hey everyone,

After watching the coverage of Indy this past weekend, I think it's worth it to be playing Surgicals. I've always used to view them as Reanimator (one of our worst match-ups) hate more than combo hate, but they really break the combo mirror wide open (Plus, there's been a lot of storm combo in the past few months). Because of this, I've had to become a little creative finding room in the sideboard. I initially tried to move the Bayou into the main, but there just isn't a lot for it unless you run it over a Chrome Mox which can lead to awkward mana - so I decided to jam the Infernal Tutor back into the main. It has nothing to do with 9 mana being a lot, because it isn't, but I think it's better than a fourteenth land. The slots in consideration were the third Duress or the third Chrome Mox, we sideboard out Chrome Mox so frequently where it often won't be missed. Now we just side out the forth Infernal. That leaves me with this:

4 Polluted Delta
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Bloodstained Mire
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Island
1 Swamp

2 Chrome Mox
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Dark Ritual
4 Rite of Flame

4 Infernal Tutor
4 Burning Wish
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Duress
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Ad Nauseam

Sideboard
1 Bayou
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Xantid Swarm
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Pyroclasm
1 Void Snare
1 Massacre
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Past in Flames

I really wish there was a way to cut green, I'm sick of playing Abrupt Decay. In those six slots, I wish I could just run another Surgical, 3 Pyroblasts and 2 Chain of Vapor/Wipeaway. The problem with this is a resolved Counterbalance.

[Izor]

I really wish there was a way to cut green, I'm sick of playing Abrupt Decay. In those six slots, I wish I could just run another Surgical, 3 Pyroblasts and 2 Chain of Vapor/Wipeaway. The problem with this is a resolved Counterbalance.

Miracles seems to be going down in usage, at least at the Indy Open. Maybe it's viable to drop green and try to combat CB with Discard and/or Pyroblasts in the future.

Surgical seems strong for the pseudo mirror vs ANT and against Reanimator/Dredge. This is one reason why I like TES over ANT; ANT's main win condition is very susceptible to graveyard hate, while TES' two main win routes don't really care about the graveyard at all. ANT gets splash-hated a lot these days. I'll give Surgical a try as well.

[Lemnear]

Miracles seems to be going down in usage, at least at the Indy Open. Maybe it's viable to drop green and try to combat CB with Discard and/or Pyroblasts in the future.

Surgical seems strong for the pseudo mirror vs ANT and against Reanimator/Dredge. This is one reason why I like TES over ANT; ANT's main win condition is very susceptible to graveyard hate, while TES' two main win routes don't really care about the graveyard at all. ANT gets splash-hated a lot these days. I'll give Surgical a try as well.

I can only speculate why Miracles is so unpopular in the Staates and their SCG Open grinders other than the time-investment it requires to learn piloting it at an acceptable level. I wait for the breakout every open tbh and in Europe it's completely unthinkable that you can dodge the matchup. You can't win a tournament if you can't beat Miracles. It's Euro-Legacy's bitch-test.

Surgical is fine in the storm-Mirror, I guess. Dredge/Reanimator are somewhat rare decks compared to SneakShow's & OmniTell's numbers and Extracting passive disruption like FoWs leaves you with carddisadvantage against the later decks. I'm not sure TES is the storm deck which needs dedicated boarding in the storm-mirror, especially if it's a one-trick-pony like Silence was in the matchup years ago before Probe enabled your opponents to Check for such tricks for free. If I consider yard-hate to be required, I'd pick Planar Void to fuck with Dredge/Reanimator/ANT/Lands/Mongoose/Tarmogoyf/KotR/DRS/etc. instead

With Fatty.dec marking ~16% at the last opens day 2, Bribery is back on my Radar as a tool.

[ManCharm]

In testing of the basics, I found that I was indeed more resilient to wasteland, but the games go slower, making me a lot more susceptible to discard and permanent based hate like Thalia. I haven't tested it enough for hard numbers, but I feel like with all the reanimator and BUG delver, it's better to just get 'em dead since their clock is so fast. It's likely due to my lack of experience/misplays, but BUG feels like a 70-30 matchup if I let it go past 2. It seems if we're willing to move in basics then high power mana sources like cabal ritual seem more valuable. Perhaps I'm assessing the matchup incorrectly though.

We have 2 legacy events weekly where I am, and its only between 12-15 regulars so there's a small amount of inbreeding, making testing hard to derive accurate results.

[Bryant Cook]

I can only speculate why Miracles is so unpopular in the Staates and their SCG Open grinders other than the time-investment it requires to learn piloting it at an acceptable level. I wait for the breakout every open tbh and in Europe it's completely unthinkable that you can dodge the matchup. You can't win a tournament if you can't beat Miracles. It's Euro-Legacy's bitch-test.

Surgical is fine in the storm-Mirror, I guess. Dredge/Reanimator are somewhat rare decks compared to SneakShow's & OmniTell's numbers and Extracting passive disruption like FoWs leaves you with carddisadvantage against the later decks. I'm not sure TES is the storm deck which needs dedicated boarding in the storm-mirror, especially if it's a one-trick-pony like Silence was in the matchup years ago before Probe enabled your opponents to Check for such tricks for free. If I consider yard-hate to be required, I'd pick Planar Void to fuck with Dredge/Reanimator/ANT/Lands/Mongoose/Tarmogoyf/KotR/DRS/etc. instead

With Fatty.dec marking ~16% at the last opens day 2, Bribery is back on my Radar as a tool.

If you opt to run the pair of Wipeaway, it's effectively the same as Decay in the miracles match-up. Ben Weinburg only ran two Decay in his side this past weekend and took second.

[PartyMonster]

I think everyone needs to chill on the hard debate and calling people out on ideas. Frankly, when it comes down to storm playing the list you are comfortable with is what is important. More games are won with skill than the number perfect list to begin with. Honestly, I have been playing a two decay, two blast split off and on for a few months and that has seemed fine. I'm not sure if I'm on board with wipe away but I haven't tested it. Cutting green does provide an additional sideboard slot and I think it merits testing. I played miracles in dc and in indy with a two blast two decay split to board in, It was fine. I won both matches. Xantid swarm has even been feeling risky in the match up because pilots seem to be on the tech, leaving in swords to plowshares as an answer for bug. Blast is solid against them, it kills meddling Mage. Unfortunately it's it's a bust against cannonist. Surgical is solid, call me dumb but I have even brought boarded it in addition to pyroclasm against elves to rip their cabal therapy a out of their deck. Pyroblast and surgicals are both extremely flexible cards.


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[Bryant Cook]

It's just a concept, but:

3 Pyroblast
3 Surgical Extraction
2 Wipeaway // Pithing Needle // Chain of Vapor
2 Pyroclasm
1 Void Snare
1 Massacre
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Past in Flames

1.) Wipeaway would be for the Miracles match-up and likely Sphere/Chalice Based decks (Not as good here, but you no longer run the risk of losing spells to your green source being wastelanded). It much easier to cast off basics and then fetching on an end step.
2.) Chain of Vapor would be more ideal in a Death & Taxes/MUD/Permanent based hate metagame as it's easier to cast and wouldn't be sided against Counterbalance based decks.
3.) Pithing Needle would be for a higher Miracles / Sneak & Show / Reanimator based metagame.

[wonderPreaux]

Just an idea, but if you want something for Storm/Reanimator, why not run Flusterstorm? It's harder to FoW/Daze, and it can be played off our basic Island in hymn+wasteland or stifle+daze+wasteland matchups.

[PartyMonster]

Is it a terrible idea to test

2 blast
2 surgical
2 needle
2 wipe away
2 pyroclasm
1 snare
1 massacre
1 tendrils
1 empty
1 pif




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[Bryant Cook]

Just an idea, but if you want something for Storm/Reanimator, why not run Flusterstorm? It's harder to FoW/Daze, and it can be played off our basic Island in hymn+wasteland or stifle+daze+wasteland matchups.

Doesn't deal with Counterbalance (Pyroblast) and would be sort of redundant next to it.

I just finished 7 postboard games against Miracles with the SB above, I never missed Decay (went 4-3 total, one of the losses was just going for it in the fourth game after opening the previous 3 with Probes and not seeing a Force in any of the openers. No justice.). Wipeaway was just as effective, Pyroblast really shined against the 3 clique version he was running.

[wonderPreaux]

Doesn't deal with Counterbalance (Pyroblast) and would be sort of redundant next to it.

I just finished 7 postboard games against Miracles with the SB above, I never missed Decay. Wipeaway was just as effective, Pyroblast really shined against the 3 clique version he was running.

I was thinking in the Extraction spots, actually. I like that Flusterstorm covers those bases and also gives you some help against Stifle/Hymn. I do like the idea of no green, though, since that opens up some slots. I've got midterms this week, but if I find some time I could give a 3c build with Flusters a try.

[Bryant Cook]

I was thinking in the Extraction spots, actually. I like that Flusterstorm covers those bases and also gives you some help against Stifle/Hymn. I do like the idea of no green, though, since that opens up some slots. I've got midterms this week, but if I find some time I could give a 3c build with Flusters a try.

I like Surgical more against Storm (ANT in particular) because you can cripple them very easily by removing all 4 Infernal Tutors, between the discard spells and Probes, I doubt they're going to run head first into it.

[wonderPreaux]

I like Surgical more against Storm (ANT in particular) because you can cripple them very easily by removing all 4 Infernal Tutors, between the discard spells and Probes, I doubt they're going to run head first into it.

Given how known Extraction is in ANT mirrors, I'm not sure how consistently you can get people with it, there are also odd cases like Grim Tutor in addition to a general cognizance that should exist around it. What I like about Flusterstorm is that you don't need the opponent to run into it, Flusterstorm stopping a cantrip or discard spell so you can followup with a "protected from their protection" turn 2 is a pretty real deal. And even if the opponent goes t1 Duress, I'd rather have the lightning rod of Flusterstorm to protect my LEDs or other important cards, whereas an opponent can simply contort to play around Extraction.

Still, what pushes Flusterstorm over the edge for me is that, with the inclusion of Basics, it becomes very feasible to beat up on Daze/Stifle decks that would ordinarily plague my manabase of all duals and fetches.