[Deck] T.E.S. - The EPIC Storm

[Bryant Cook]

In other news, I played T.E.S. at a local last night. Some key notes/highlights:

Won my round two vs. Death and Taxes with 12 main deck hatebears (Thalia, Revoker, then the can't search unless you play 2 bro). Abrupt Decay + Karakas were both crucial.

During my round three Decay killed two Canonists against UW Rest in Peace combo. He played a third Canonist, I played Burning Wish for Hull Breach. Breach killed a Canonist AND a Rest in Peace! Situational? Maybe. Was it awesome? Yes.

During the same match I played Reforge the Soul (I've yet to miracle this in tournament play, still waiting), it was relevant that it wasn't a shuffle considering that there were two Force of Will already in the opponents' graveyard.

[r3dd09]

In other news, I played T.E.S. at a local last night. Some key notes/highlights:

Won my round two vs. Death and Taxes with 12 main deck hatebears (Thalia, Revoker, then the can't search unless you play 2 bro). Abrupt Decay + Karakas were both crucial.

During my round three Decay killed two Canonists against UW Rest in Peace combo. He played a third Canonist, I played Burning Wish for Hull Breach. Breach killed a Canonist AND a Rest in Peace! Situational? Maybe. Was it awesome? Yes.

During the same match I played Reforge the Soul (I've yet to miracle this in tournament play, still waiting), it was relevant that it wasn't a shuffle considering that there were two Force of Will already in the opponents' graveyard.

Good job, Cook. I'm building TES again. DDFT I feel is too slow for the format right now. I like the newer build. Just need to pick up a few cards before the event.

I'll probably be playing TES for the GPT in two weeks as well. On this note, who all is attending Denver?

[Bryant Cook]

Thanks to Mindi Rogers at Jupiter Games, we now have separate videos of Ning's feature matches. They're on the opening post! Although, we only have part of his round five.

[Frid]

Hello, i am a returning player. First of all excuse my poor english, i am an european player.

I think that since mystical tutor was banned, The E.P.I.C Storm is the best combo deck becouse of its more versatile and has more "i win" cards so im going to play it. The problem is that seeing Bryan's and some other player list i dont understand some choices so please help me with these.

1- Why arent you runing a maindeck Tendrils?
2- Why is OP playing 3 fetches, 1 of each instead of more polluted deltas or more city of brasses?
3 Why arent you running a Maindeck Past in flames?
4 Why are you playing silence over Orim's chant or 2 and 2 instead of 4 orims? Im curious about this one, ive read the cards very carefully and i dont see where is silence better than Orims. is it becouse Silence doesnt Target the oponent? To avoid what?
5 If i wanted to play Maindeck discard -wich i dont know yet- should i play duress or inquisition?
6 Whats the plan on playing the miracle wheel of fortune? Wish for it then brainstorm and draw it next turn? I asume that the red color is more confortable to cast then going off becouse of the red rituals also.
7 Two xantid on the side seems a bit random to me, you cant tutor them and only 2. Can you explain versus wich decks you play it and how? Same question with Karakas.

keep in mind i stoped playing like 2 or 3 years ago, when the new yawg will didnt exist and miracle control maverick etc didnt exist.

And congratulations to everyone, this is the most sexy deck ive ever seen in legacy. It has power, it has speed, its versatile, what a bomb!

[Vandalize]

Hello, i am a returning player. First of all excuse my poor english, i am an european player.

I think that since mystical tutor was banned, The E.P.I.C Storm is the best combo deck becouse of its more versatile and has more "i win" cards so im going to play it. The problem is that seeing Bryan's and some other player list i dont understand some choices so please help me with these.

1- Why arent you runing a maindeck Tendrils?
2- Why is OP playing 3 fetches, 1 of each instead of more polluted deltas or more city of brasses?
3 Why arent you running a Maindeck Past in flames?
4 Why are you playing silence over Orim's chant or 2 and 2 instead of 4 orims? Im curious about this one, ive read the cards very carefully and i dont see where is silence better than Orims. is it becouse Silence doesnt Target the oponent? To avoid what?
5 If i wanted to play Maindeck discard -wich i dont know yet- should i play duress or inquisition?
6 Whats the plan on playing the miracle wheel of fortune? Wish for it then brainstorm and draw it next turn? I asume that the red color is more confortable to cast then going off becouse of the red rituals also.
7 Two xantid on the side seems a bit random to me, you cant tutor them and only 2. Can you explain versus wich decks you play it and how? Same question with Karakas.

keep in mind i stoped playing like 2 or 3 years ago, when the new yawg will didnt exist and miracle control maverick etc didnt exist.

And congratulations to everyone, this is the most sexy deck ive ever seen in legacy. It has power, it has speed, its versatile, what a bomb!

I'm not Byrant, but I might answer those questions:

1) Empty the Warrens is better paired with Gitaxian Probe, and you can storm 4~6 and still win game 1, opposed to Tendrils, which sould have at least 9 storm.

2) This is mainly to beuaty pruposes. Byrant has a really shiny pimp deck. And all fetches can grab Volcanic Island and Underground Sea, anyways.

3) Past in Flames hurts flipping on Ad Nauseam, and we don't play Cabal Ritual to take full advantage of it maindeck. It's on the sideboard for Burning Wish.

4) Silence doesn't target your opponent. This might be a corner case, but people actually bring Leyline of Sanctity against Storm.

5) Depends on your metagame. Duress is better against permission and Inquisition is better against Hatebears (like Gaddock Teeg, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and Ethersworn Canonist).

6) Actually, it is usually cast in the same turn that you grab it with Burning Wish. It's replacing Diminishing Returns, which is CMC4 but requires UU to work, which isn't a really good mana without Lion's Eye Diamond. Reforge the Soul is red, and we can take advantage of getting a lot of red mana through Rite of Flame.

7) Karakas is very versatile, it can bounce some pesky Legends, like Thalia, Teeg, Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, Griselbrand, Emrakul, the Aeon Torn etc. Xantid Swarm is good against decks that has few removal, like Show and Tell and Merfolks. But you can also bring it against UW Control, because they usually side out Swords to Plowshares. Xantid works pretty much like Silence, but it's better against taxing counters, like Spell Pierce and Daze.

Hope it helped.

[Frid]

I'm not Byrant, but I might answer those questions:

1) Empty the Warrens is better paired with Gitaxian Probe, and you can storm 4~6 and still win game 1, opposed to Tendrils, which sould have at least 9 storm.

2) This is mainly to beuaty pruposes. Byrant has a really shiny pimp deck. And all fetches can grab Volcanic Island and Underground Sea, anyways.

3) Past in Flames hurts flipping on Ad Nauseam, and we don't play Cabal Ritual to take full advantage of it maindeck. It's on the sideboard for Burning Wish.

4) Silence doesn't target your opponent. This might be a corner case, but people actually bring Leyline of Sanctity against Storm.

5) Depends on your metagame. Duress is better against permission and Inquisition is better against Hatebears (like Gaddock Teeg, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and Ethersworn Canonist).

6) Actually, it is usually cast in the same turn that you grab it with Burning Wish. It's replacing Diminishing Returns, which is CMC4 but requires UU to work, which isn't a really good mana without Lion's Eye Diamond. Reforge the Soul is red, and we can take advantage of getting a lot of red mana through Rite of Flame.

7) Karakas is very versatile, it can bounce some pesky Legends, like Thalia, Teeg, Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, Griselbrand, Emrakul, the Aeon Torn etc. Xantid Swarm is good against decks that has few removal, like Show and Tell and Merfolks. But you can also bring it against UW Control, because they usually side out Swords to Plowshares. Xantid works pretty much like Silence, but it's better against taxing counters, like Spell Pierce and Daze.

Hope it helped.

It's been a ton of help, thank you very much.

1- I think at the beggining ill feel uncomfortable without a maindeck tendrils but ill test it.

4- Is it worth to loose the kicker effect agains aggro just to be able to chant your opponent when he has a leyline on the field? You have to bounce it anyway -or kill him with Empty the warrens.

[Holly]

The Silence allows you to play your game and draw your etw/bounce to kill them. It's for the decks which play Leyline & have counter backup.
Most aggro decks you don't really need the kicker of chant, simply race them.

[.dk]

One other reason for Silence vs. Chant: because Chant targets, it can be Misdirected. Doesn't happen that often, but can be a blowout when it does.

[Bryant Cook]

I'm not Byrant, but I might answer those questions:

1) Empty the Warrens is better paired with Gitaxian Probe, and you can storm 4~6 and still win game 1, opposed to Tendrils, which sould have at least 9 storm.

2) This is mainly to beuaty pruposes. Byrant has a really shiny pimp deck. And all fetches can grab Volcanic Island and Underground Sea, anyways.

3) Past in Flames hurts flipping on Ad Nauseam, and we don't play Cabal Ritual to take full advantage of it maindeck. It's on the sideboard for Burning Wish.

4) Silence doesn't target your opponent. This might be a corner case, but people actually bring Leyline of Sanctity against Storm.

5) Depends on your metagame. Duress is better against permission and Inquisition is better against Hatebears (like Gaddock Teeg, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and Ethersworn Canonist).

6) Actually, it is usually cast in the same turn that you grab it with Burning Wish. It's replacing Diminishing Returns, which is CMC4 but requires UU to work, which isn't a really good mana without Lion's Eye Diamond. Reforge the Soul is red, and we can take advantage of getting a lot of red mana through Rite of Flame.

7) Karakas is very versatile, it can bounce some pesky Legends, like Thalia, Teeg, Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, Griselbrand, Emrakul, the Aeon Torn etc. Xantid Swarm is good against decks that has few removal, like Show and Tell and Merfolks. But you can also bring it against UW Control, because they usually side out Swords to Plowshares. Xantid works pretty much like Silence, but it's better against taxing counters, like Spell Pierce and Daze.

Hope it helped.

The name is Bryant. But you're right for the most part, besides point two. Aside from having them all pimped out, it's to avoid Pithing Needle/Surgical Extration. Which has happened to me before. Although, I'm considering doing two Scalding Tarn and a Misty Rainforest to look like RUG.

[RaNDoMxGeSTuReS]

The name is Bryant. But you're right for the most part, besides point two. Aside from having them all pimped out, it's to avoid Pithing Needle/Surgical Extration. Which has happened to me before. Although, I'm considering doing two Scalding Tarn and a Misty Rainforest to look like RUG.

I'm playing 2 Scalding and a Misty.

Currently running a main deck Past in Flames.

[Pelikanudo]

Bahamuth, now do you see why I gave up on helping him? He asks for advice, doesn't listen, then does what he wants anyway. Repeat.

I had to answer this,

I do not ask for suggestion or advice I ask for your opinions mainly , sometimes I ask for advice but these are few, very few times, I think in here we are all able to reach our own conclusions, I'd like all in here would reach the same conclusions but simply the way one thinks is different from the way another person thinks.
I'm not used to listen and I'm used to be listened by others, so please don't deal with me as I'm a child as I'm not, so please and again do not deal with me in such a way.

I already said thanks to Bahamut for his comments and opinions.

When I win a Tournament with my 1 GrimTutor No Gitaxian TES List I'll post in here and get back to you for sure.

[RaNDoMxGeSTuReS]

I do not ask for suggestion or advice I ask for your opinions mainly...

To clarify:

o·pin·ion [uh-pin-yuhn]
noun
1. a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.
2. a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.
3. the formal expression of a professional judgment: to ask for a second medical opinion.
4. Law . the formal statement by a judge or court of the reasoning and the principles of law used in reaching a decision of a case.
5. a judgment or estimate of a person or thing with respect to character, merit, etc.: to forfeit someone's good opinion.

sug·ges·tion [suhg-jes-chuhn, suh-]
noun
1. the act of suggesting.
2. the state of being suggested.
3. something suggested, as a piece of advice: We made the suggestion that she resign.
4. a slight trace: He speaks with a suggestion of a foreign accent.
5. the calling up in the mind of one idea by another by virtue of some association or of some natural connection between the ideas.

ad·vice [ad-vahys]
noun
1. an opinion or recommendation offered as a guide to action, conduct, etc.: I shall act on your advice.
2. a communication, especially from a distance, containing information: Advice from abroad informs us that the government has fallen. Recent diplomatic advices have been ominous.
3. an official notification, especially one pertaining to a business agreement: an overdue advice.

tldr; So you ask people to comment about your lists and/or answer your questions to simply ignore them?

/end rant

Here's where I'm at for T.E.S.

12 Land
4 Gemstone Mine
2 City of Brass
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire

48 Spells
3 Chrome Mox
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion’s Eye Diamond
4 Dark Ritual
4 Rite of Flame
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Silence
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Burning Wish
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Ad Nauseam

15 Sideboard
3 Defense Grid
2 Karakas
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Hull Breach
1 Duress
1 Past in Flames
1 Reforge the Soul
1 Diminishing Returns
1 Grapeshot
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Tendrils of Agony

Hammer away...

[Pelikanudo]

To clarify:

o·pin·ion [uh-pin-yuhn]
noun
1. a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.
2. a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.
3. the formal expression of a professional judgment: to ask for a second medical opinion.
4. Law . the formal statement by a judge or court of the reasoning and the principles of law used in reaching a decision of a case.
5. a judgment or estimate of a person or thing with respect to character, merit, etc.: to forfeit someone's good opinion.

sug·ges·tion [suhg-jes-chuhn, suh-]
noun
1. the act of suggesting.
2. the state of being suggested.
3. something suggested, as a piece of advice: We made the suggestion that she resign.
4. a slight trace: He speaks with a suggestion of a foreign accent.
5. the calling up in the mind of one idea by another by virtue of some association or of some natural connection between the ideas.

ad·vice [ad-vahys]
noun
1. an opinion or recommendation offered as a guide to action, conduct, etc.: I shall act on your advice.
2. a communication, especially from a distance, containing information: Advice from abroad informs us that the government has fallen. Recent diplomatic advices have been ominous.
3. an official notification, especially one pertaining to a business agreement: an overdue advice.

tldr; So you ask people to comment about your lists and/or answer your questions to simply ignore them?

/end rant

Here's where I'm at for T.E.S.

12 Land
4 Gemstone Mine
2 City of Brass
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire

48 Spells
3 Chrome Mox
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion’s Eye Diamond
4 Dark Ritual
4 Rite of Flame
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Silence
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Burning Wish
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Ad Nauseam

15 Sideboard
3 Defense Grid
2 Karakas
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Hull Breach
1 Duress
1 Past in Flames
1 Reforge the Soul
1 Diminishing Returns
1 Grapeshot
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Tendrils of Agony

Hammer away...

Please let's stop this:

I mainly ask for opinions , and sometimes (very few times) ask for advice.
When I ask for opinions I do not ignore them I just:
1. Simply read them
2. Simply have in mind
3. I contrast with other opinions
4. I reach to a conclusion

When I ask for advice, I use the humility god gave me. and of course Some of them I will ignore absolutly (once I reach to a conclusion) and Some of them I'll have in mind, Simple.

Regarding to your list, it is a beatiful list, but it has nonsense to me. Thanks anyway for posting your list to whom may be interested.

[Clown of Tresserhorn]

To clarify:

o·pin·ion [uh-pin-yuhn]
noun
1. a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.
2. a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.
3. the formal expression of a professional judgment: to ask for a second medical opinion.
4. Law . the formal statement by a judge or court of the reasoning and the principles of law used in reaching a decision of a case.
5. a judgment or estimate of a person or thing with respect to character, merit, etc.: to forfeit someone's good opinion.

sug·ges·tion [suhg-jes-chuhn, suh-]
noun
1. the act of suggesting.
2. the state of being suggested.
3. something suggested, as a piece of advice: We made the suggestion that she resign.
4. a slight trace: He speaks with a suggestion of a foreign accent.
5. the calling up in the mind of one idea by another by virtue of some association or of some natural connection between the ideas.

ad·vice [ad-vahys]
noun
1. an opinion or recommendation offered as a guide to action, conduct, etc.: I shall act on your advice.
2. a communication, especially from a distance, containing information: Advice from abroad informs us that the government has fallen. Recent diplomatic advices have been ominous.
3. an official notification, especially one pertaining to a business agreement: an overdue advice.

tldr; So you ask people to comment about your lists and/or answer your questions to simply ignore them?

/end rant

Here's where I'm at for T.E.S.

12 Land
4 Gemstone Mine
2 City of Brass
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire

48 Spells
3 Chrome Mox
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion’s Eye Diamond
4 Dark Ritual
4 Rite of Flame
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Silence
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Burning Wish
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Ad Nauseam

15 Sideboard
3 Defense Grid
2 Karakas
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Hull Breach
1 Duress
1 Past in Flames
1 Reforge the Soul
1 Diminishing Returns
1 Grapeshot
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Tendrils of Agony

Hammer away...

IGG Main? For Reals? Reforge the soul and diminishing returns?

Also, man am I glad somebody else is playing MD Therapies. Maybe it's because the meta here is small and predictable, but that card has been sause. I'm basically playing the list you have posted except +1 therapy - 1 silence, and also, -1 IGG, + 1 fetchland.

[RaNDoMxGeSTuReS]

IGG Main? For Reals? Reforge the soul and diminishing returns?

Also, man am I glad somebody else is playing MD Therapies. Maybe it's because the meta here is small and predictable, but that card has been sause. I'm basically playing the list you have posted except +1 therapy - 1 silence, and also, -1 IGG, + 1 fetchland.

Reforge the Soul is what I'm playing right now. Couldn't decided on a 15th slot so I shoved Diminishing Returns in there.

Iggy is main because -- well I just love that card. You never want to draw it, but I figured it's an easier win versus fast aggro, where you can't always Ad Nauseam from a reasonable life total.

MD Cabal Therapies are amazing cause if you miss, you're probably still winning. DR, therapy etc., also beats double FOW hands like Silence and unlike Duress.

I really want to play the third City of Brass.

@3 Burning Wish: I compare it to Chrome Mox. I ALWAYS hate drawing the second one.

[Dark Ritual]

Good luck with 1 grim tutor maindeck or anywhere in your 75 for that matter...the card is a steaming pile of shit in TES. I'd rather run 4 wish and 4 infernal before I even considered running grim, and guess what? Burning wish isn't a 4 of in TES anymore because the card is a pile in multiples sans the rare corner case where you can successfully go wish -> PiF/IGG probably discarding the second wish to LED in the process, resolving PiF/IGG, and proceeding to kill them with tendrils. But that rarely happens and is what is known as a corner case.

So you switched to IGG Kirby? Was PiF not pulling its weight? I'm genuinely interested, as PiF is a really solid card in my eyes with the capability to flash it back for 4R + (R/B) floating as well as being good against blue decks if you haven't resolved a chant effect.

Also, good luck winning with no probes and a super clunky grim tutor. You might mise a few wins, but if you win a tournament I will be amazed and something will be proven that day. That something being that shitty suboptimal decks can win a tournament.

[RaNDoMxGeSTuReS]

PiF vs Iggy

Played around with both, I'd rather give my LED pseudo flashback opposed to rituals/tutors.

Most cases you're just trading 6 mana + Tutor for easier kills with Grapeshot. PiF is back in the board. Too many times where LED was all I had for mana.

Beating the dead horse, but PiF wants Cabal Ritual to be good. Not enough stuff to flashback. I usually died before I could set it up.

[Bryant Cook]

The main deck Therapies are interesting, I'll have to try it before I come to a conclusion. My fear is that now you only have Probe for information, where before you had Probe/Duress. You're relying a lot more on luck.

Ill-Gotten Gains just simply isn't worth the slot in my opinion, but if your metagame is mega-heavy aggro I guess it could be fine. But even then, you should just be crushing anyway.

Why Defense Grid? Are you really that unhappy with Xantid Swarm? D-Grid is a lot more susceptible to Daze/Spell Pierce.

Reforge + Returns should change. Probably another Decay.

[End3r000]

It seems to me ANT and TES keep evolving closer and closer to the same final end, especially now that both lists are trying the Abrupt Decay and Xantid Swarm SB plan. I recently moved away from the chant effects and to the therapy plan because it seemed so much stronger. I just won a small local tourny with the following list:
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 LED
4 Lotus Petal
2 Chrome Mox
3 Burning Wish
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Ponder
4 Brainstorm
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Gitaxian Probe
2 Duress
1 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Empty the Warrens
4 Polluted Delta
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Badlands
1 Swamp
1 Island

SB:1 EtW
1 IGG
1 ToA
1 DR
1 Pyroclasm
4 Dread of Night
2 Chain of Vapor
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Duress
1 Shattering Spree

Rd 1 I played against goblins which was an easy 2-0 going AdN into ToA both games turn 2.

Rd2 I played against UW Miracles which my friend was playing. Tore his hand apart with discard and calmly Tendriled him out game 1. Game 2 he goes T1 top pass, I play underground into therapy, he lets it resolve, naming CB and hit seeing another top, some land, and Force with CB as his only other blue card. We play land pass for a turn or 2, I've probed and know he's about to drop jace, but I'm 1 storm count from killing him with tendrils, but I decide to hit him anyway bringing him down to 1 and turning off his fetches. He can't do anything and I eventually kill him with some goblins.

Rd 3 I play against Belcher, game 1 I wish for pyroclasm after EtW, and game 2 I wish for Spree after he drops Belcher. Game 1 I mulled to 5 and game 2 he mulled to 6.

Rd 4 I play against goblins again with the same outcome.

Rd 5 I split with UW Miracles player, but play to see who gets the points. Both games I rip his hand apart and Ad Nauseam Tendrils him.

After playing in that tournament and some other testing I've done I think I'm going to move the third wish to the board and play one Grim Tutor in the main. I also want to try Reforge the Soul and Past in Flames.

[RaNDoMxGeSTuReS]

The main deck Therapies are interesting, I'll have to try it before I come to a conclusion. My fear is that now you only have Probe for information, where before you had Probe/Duress. You're relying a lot more on luck.

Ill-Gotten Gains just simply isn't worth the slot in my opinion, but if your metagame is mega-heavy aggro I guess it could be fine. But even then, you should just be crushing anyway.

Why Defense Grid? Are you really that unhappy with Xantid Swarm? D-Grid is a lot more susceptible to Daze/Spell Pierce.

Reforge + Returns should change. Probably another Decay.

I prefer Iggy because more often it's easier to get kills with it than PiF. The latter cares too much about what tutors are in the yard, and sometimes the mana gets awkward.

But like you said, it's pretty much uneccessary. Mostly a preference. Love the card. Sacred Cow.

I wasn't happy with 2 Xantid Swarms, I wanted more but decided I'd rather just have something more rewarding against RUG. Daze and Spell Pierce are real things, but when I played with Defense Grid, I was more worried they'd Spell Snare it, which most lists no longer play.

The third Abrupt Decay will probably replace Diminishing Returns or Reforge the Soul. I'm leaning with staying on DR because I've been more happy with exiling 10 cards (the chaff/unwanted cards) than most draws with Reforge. Casting Reforge is almost too hard for my liking. Would rather cast a Time Spiral or something 6cc. Haven't screwed with miracling it though.