[Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

[Michael Keller]

Joining the dark side.

[Zirath]

Joining the dark side.

Oh are you? I'm thinking of returning to the electronic age.

[honz]

Based on what? ... Serrated Arrows is much better costed and takes out 3 guys over turns (Dryad Arbor, Delver, Pyromancer, etc, etc). Contagion Engine is a totally different type of card. Its effect is stronger than serrated arrows but completely subpar as a tinker target. If you can get up to 6 mana (or 5+summoning sickness) against elves, they have already lost to themselves. I'd love to know how you intend to interact with a turn 2 elves combo player with your build.

If forked bolt had a big brother that cost 4 mana and divvied up 3 damage instead, that would be a terrible card. Serrated arrows does that, except it takes 3 turns to do it. Even if forked bolt was colorless and didn't clash with chalice, MUD wouldn't run that either. This is not a control deck, nor a value deck looking to trade 1 for 1 or 2 for 1.

In the matchups where contagion engine gets boarded in (mostly elves / young pyro / death & taxes), it is a 1 sided wrath of god for 6 mana (or for sac 3 artifacts). Admittedly, not amazing, but serves more as a panic button than anything else. Generally you will grab blightsteel with kuldotha, but when facing down lethal damage (or swords to plowshares), contagion engine can steal some games you may not otherwise win.

Lastly, against an elves deck looking to combo turn 2, serrated arrows and contagion engine are both terrible. If you don't know how my deck interacts with elves, then you clearly don't understand how MUD works, and I direct you to look at the following cards, all capable of being cast on turn 1 or 2: chalice of the void at 1, trinisphere, lodestone golem, torpor orb (against visionary and craterhoof), phyrexian revoker, pyroclasm and metalworker -> kuldotha/emperion/contagion/staff/trinisphere/chalice/lodestone...etc. Most of these will stall the game long enough to get a kuldotha activation for blightsteel to win, or contagion engine to wipe his board.

What do you guys think of Staff of Domination being cut for something that makes the deck more consistent? I really hate drawing it in a game without Metalworker. Sometimes it's useless if I don't have more than 5 mana to draw cards. Sometimes it can be used to stop creatures from attacking, but this happens only rarely. I want to cut it for something else. Any suggestions or do you guys not advise to cut it?

I don't run any removal/permission in the maindeck, so I want an answer for a random peacekeeper or moat or whatever other insanity might happen. Basically that means spine of ish sah or staff of domination. While the staff isn't a removal card, gain 90000 life, and wait until your opponent decks himself (on the back of drawing/discarding blightsteel forever) is almost unbeatable. I find the staff to be much less clunky than the spine, and has all the extra flexibility/random wins.

Also, like any card, it has good/bad matchups. Don't be afraid to board it out where you see fit. I like to keep it in against combo decks since using kuldotha to grab the missing half of the worker/staff combo can win a turn faster than grabbing blightsteel, or you can randomly draw both worker and staff. I keep it against miracles too, mostly for the draw ability. I tend to board it out against most delver/young pyro/aggro decks where I don't expect metalworker to stick on the board, and where staff is bad by itself. I think it has some use against stoneforge mystic decks, to tap down their equipment, but I usually have SB cards I want more than the staff.

[dcosiem]

If forked bolt had a big brother that cost 4 mana and divvied up 3 damage instead, that would be a terrible card. Serrated arrows does that, except it takes 3 turns to do it. Even if forked bolt was colorless and didn't clash with chalice, MUD wouldn't run that either. This is not a control deck, nor a value deck looking to trade 1 for 1 or 2 for 1.

In the matchups where contagion engine gets boarded in (mostly elves / young pyro / death & taxes), it is a 1 sided wrath of god for 6 mana (or for sac 3 artifacts). Admittedly, not amazing, but serves more as a panic button than anything else. Generally you will grab blightsteel with kuldotha, but when facing down lethal damage (or swords to plowshares), contagion engine can steal some games you may not otherwise win.

Lastly, against an elves deck looking to combo turn 2, serrated arrows and contagion engine are both terrible. If you don't know how my deck interacts with elves, then you clearly don't understand how MUD works, and I direct you to look at the following cards, all capable of being cast on turn 1 or 2: chalice of the void at 1, trinisphere, lodestone golem, torpor orb (against visionary and craterhoof), phyrexian revoker, pyroclasm and metalworker -> kuldotha/emperion/contagion/staff/trinisphere/chalice/lodestone...etc. Most of these will stall the game long enough to get a kuldotha activation for blightsteel to win, or contagion engine to wipe his board.



I don't run any removal/permission in the maindeck, so I want an answer for a random peacekeeper or moat or whatever other insanity might happen. Basically that means spine of ish sah or staff of domination. While the staff isn't a removal card, gain 90000 life, and wait until your opponent decks himself (on the back of drawing/discarding blightsteel forever) is almost unbeatable. I find the staff to be much less clunky than the spine, and has all the extra flexibility/random wins.

Also, like any card, it has good/bad matchups. Don't be afraid to board it out where you see fit. I like to keep it in against combo decks since using kuldotha to grab the missing half of the worker/staff combo can win a turn faster than grabbing blightsteel, or you can randomly draw both worker and staff. I keep it against miracles too, mostly for the draw ability. I tend to board it out against most delver/young pyro/aggro decks where I don't expect metalworker to stick on the board, and where staff is bad by itself. I think it has some use against stoneforge mystic decks, to tap down their equipment, but I usually have SB cards I want more than the staff.

Yea for now, I'm sticking with it in my main because it sometimes win games out of the sky, but I've taken Spine out and moved it to the board. I may put it back in. I might have to take out a Wurmcoil Engine for it.

[Zirath]

Greetings all. I come back from making day 2 of the SCG with my results. First my list:

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=78494

As you can see, I didn't end up doing that well on day 2. My major differences from most lists is that I cut staves completely in exchange with Skull. I have never felt that staves did much honestly and I prefer being face. Batterskull is also a monstrous card.

As for my games, I lost to nutty hands from Lands and Dredge day 1 and lost to Miracles (my fault 100%; forgot that Lightning Greaves = win), UWR Delver (6 Wastes over 2 games is rough), RUG (Daryl, who won the event; game 3 was characterized with him having all creatures and me having all Ancient Tombs), UR Delver (he had a super strong hand games 2 and 3 involving Force my Chalice + multiple Young Pyromancers so there wasn't much for me to do).

Going forward, I would make the following changes:

-2 Trinisphere, +2 Don't know yet
-1 Phyrexian Revoker, +1 Don't know about this one either

Trinisphere was underwhelming. I got some free wins from it here and there but overall it wasn't that impressive. I want some but not the full 4. I have always felt this way and I think this is the right choice for this deck since having multiple Spheres sometimes sucks a lot.

While I love Revoker, I didn't have that many match ups where it was insane and warranted a 4. 3 is plenty. I would like a card that addresses the Delver deck better since I don't feel the best in it. It's not a bad match up but blind Delver flips are really good against us. I was also overwhelmed by Young Pyromancer. A banning of Treasure Cruise would probably solve this since the UR deck would reduce in number so I am going to wait until an announcement to decide what to do.

Also I wasn't the only player rocking Uba Mask.

[potatodavid]

Ran a Stock Cloudpost List Yesterday at a local place running an SCG tournament. Managed to go 2-3 Drop. But had a blast regardless.

Round 1. Burn with way more artifact hate than I've ever seen. (he explained to me after that he expected to see a TON of MUD at this tournament)
Game 1 I get a bunch of Grim Monoliths in a Row and his Turn 1 goblin guide is good enough to get him there.
Game 2. I go Tomb, Chalice for one. He smash to smithereens it. I go turn 2 Chalice for 1. Which he again Smash To Smithereens. I play a monolith into welder. A 3rd FUCKING SMASH TO SMITHEREENS! 2 rift bolts later, I lost to an easy match up.
0-1.
Round 2. Hex Depths. ( I found out later this guy was 3 cards short of 60 but... whatever that's magic)
Game 1, he plays urborg, depths into hexmage for a turn 3 Marit Lage.
Game 2, I play a cloudpost followed by glimmerpost, gain 2 life, He again gets a turn 2 Marit Lage, He swings, I live (forgot I gained 2 life) I cast Platinum angel, he concedes.
Game 3, Much like game 2 only I waste his dark depths, which he crop rotates for another one, 2 swings of marit lage and I'm dead.
0-2.
Round 3. Burn
Game 1. Chalice for one, followed by a turn 3 blightsteel. He scoops.
Game 2. he opts to be on the draw... Turn 1 Chalice, into a turn 4 blightsteel he scoops.
1-2
Round 4. UR Delver.
Game 1. He gets a swiftspear, but i trinisphere followed by forgemaster. he gets a young pyro down but I wurmcoil to stabilize and that's the game.
Game 2. Turn 1 chalice, Smash to smithereens. I follow up with Metalworker which drops sundering titan. I forgemaster a sundering titan into a sundering titan. To clear his board (blightsteel in hand which is why I don't forgmaster it instead) He scoops.
2-2
Round 5. Lands
Round 1. I get wasteland locked, he assembles grove combo. I scoops.
Round 2. I manage to get Platinum Angel Out turn 2, he wasteland locks me out, casts tabernacle. No lands to pay for the angel. He drops Marit Lage. I shake his hand.
2-3

Ran into some bad match ups, but had fun.

[Mockingbird]

Ugin, the Spirit Dragon is now available on Cockatrice.

I just pulled off it's ultimate in MUD-Post... it's great.

[sun tzu]

Ugin, the Spirit Dragon is now available on Cockatrice.

I just pulled off it's ultimate in MUD-Post... it's great.

share your list please :D

[Bobmans]

Ugin, the Spirit Dragon is now available on Cockatrice.

I just pulled off it's ultimate in MUD-Post... it's great.

As expected, but how often and how fast where you able to put him on the board?

[Michael Keller]

Greetings all. I come back from making day 2 of the SCG with my results. First my list:

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=78494

As you can see, I didn't end up doing that well on day 2. My major differences from most lists is that I cut staves completely in exchange with Skull. I have never felt that staves did much honestly and I prefer being face. Batterskull is also a monstrous card.

As for my games, I lost to nutty hands from Lands and Dredge day 1 and lost to Miracles (my fault 100%; forgot that Lightning Greaves = win), UWR Delver (6 Wastes over 2 games is rough), RUG (Daryl, who won the event; game 3 was characterized with him having all creatures and me having all Ancient Tombs), UR Delver (he had a super strong hand games 2 and 3 involving Force my Chalice + multiple Young Pyromancers so there wasn't much for me to do).

Going forward, I would make the following changes:

-2 Trinisphere, +2 Don't know yet
-1 Phyrexian Revoker, +1 Don't know about this one either

Trinisphere was underwhelming. I got some free wins from it here and there but overall it wasn't that impressive. I want some but not the full 4. I have always felt this way and I think this is the right choice for this deck since having multiple Spheres sometimes sucks a lot.

While I love Revoker, I didn't have that many match ups where it was insane and warranted a 4. 3 is plenty. I would like a card that addresses the Delver deck better since I don't feel the best in it. It's not a bad match up but blind Delver flips are really good against us. I was also overwhelmed by Young Pyromancer. A banning of Treasure Cruise would probably solve this since the UR deck would reduce in number so I am going to wait until an announcement to decide what to do.

Also I wasn't the only player rocking Uba Mask.

I am running Darksteel Citadel in my build. I feel the card's benefits are huge in regards to sequencing plays, generating mana with Metalworker, sacrifice for Forgemaster and avoiding hands/strategies predicated on Wasteland. I think its utility is underestimated, which is why I would consider running a set.

I also feel as though Wasteland in Post builds is incorrect. The versions that run Post tend to want to ramp mana faster into the big play, and Wasteland feels at times underwhelming and like a double-Time Walk for opponents on the play dropping a turn-one Delver. Chalice and 3Sphere should be plenty in that regard.

Lodestone Golem is a card I also am not liking in MUD Post decks. Lightning Bolt is the most prevalent form of removal right now, and generating four mana and possibly two damage to drop a creature that dies to cheap spot removal - especially on the draw - isn't all that great. Unless you can sequence a Chalice before dropping it, it's actually kind of bad. It's a beater, but a creature with a butt of four or more makes me happier in this archetype to nullify burn against our creatures.

Metalworker eats it too, but the effect it provides is far more game-ending than that of a Golem. You tap a Worker, and that's usually game.

[potatodavid]

Lodestone Golem is a card I also am not liking in MUD Post decks. Lightning Bolt is the most prevalent form of removal right now, and generating four mana and possibly two damage to drop a creature that dies to cheap spot removal - especially on the draw - isn't all that great. Unless you can sequence a Chalice before dropping it, it's actually kind of bad. It's a beater, but a creature with a butt of four or more makes me happier in this archetype to nullify burn against our creatures.

I run the Golem in my Post builds and, most people sandbag their bolts for your metalworker. Even if it does eat a bolt, it's way better that it takes a dive than our metalworkers.

[Michael Keller]

I run the Golem in my Post builds and, most people sandbag their bolts for your metalworker. Even if it does eat a bolt, it's way better that it takes a dive than our metalworkers.

I don't know, I guess I just feel cheated when I invest in a creature that costs four mana and dies to something cheap like Bolt. I can Metalworker eating it, but it's the most powerful card in the deck if left untouched. Lodestone Golem, while still good, seems meh.

[dcosiem]

Ugin, the Spirit Dragon is now available on Cockatrice.

I just pulled off it's ultimate in MUD-Post... it's great.

I still like Karn though because he can stop Null rod in which the Ugin can't. In terms of -x ability on ugin, I can still rely on All is Dust. But, the bolt thing is super nice. I can only have Razormane Masticore to substitute but he's not nearly as good.

[Bobmans]

I don't know, I guess I just feel cheated when I invest in a creature that costs four mana and dies to something cheap like Bolt. I can Metalworker eating it, but it's the most powerful card in the deck if left untouched. Lodestone Golem, while still good, seems meh.

I had trouble beating UWR Delver/pyro/blade decks anyhow. Lodestone Golem shines in other matchup's like Storm or Miracles. It is amazing to see a Miracles player struggle once you resolve a Chalice @ 1 and drop a Golem. Even on it's own it can sometimes steal games. But the good news is they come in multiples and they carry Lightning Greaves like a champ.

[Zirath]

I am running Darksteel Citadel in my build. I feel the card's benefits are huge in regards to sequencing plays, generating mana with Metalworker, sacrifice for Forgemaster and avoiding hands/strategies predicated on Wasteland. I think its utility is underestimated, which is why I would consider running a set.

I also feel as though Wasteland in Post builds is incorrect. The versions that run Post tend to want to ramp mana faster into the big play, and Wasteland feels at times underwhelming and like a double-Time Walk for opponents on the play dropping a turn-one Delver. Chalice and 3Sphere should be plenty in that regard.

Lodestone Golem is a card I also am not liking in MUD Post decks. Lightning Bolt is the most prevalent form of removal right now, and generating four mana and possibly two damage to drop a creature that dies to cheap spot removal - especially on the draw - isn't all that great. Unless you can sequence a Chalice before dropping it, it's actually kind of bad. It's a beater, but a creature with a butt of four or more makes me happier in this archetype to nullify burn against our creatures.

Metalworker eats it too, but the effect it provides is far more game-ending than that of a Golem. You tap a Worker, and that's usually game.

The 2 Wastelands were fine. I definitely won a number of games due to wasting out an opponent. The main difference is you just don't aggressively waste your opponent. 2 was correct for me. It is possible 0 is correct but I wasn't unhappy with Wastes.

I actually didn't face Delver much (3 times total) so that issue didn't come up. Golem was definitely very good for me. I think Golem is necessary for a number of combo decks and mid range decks. I have always found Golem to be a big deal against DnT, Jund/Shardless and Miracles, even so this weekend.

[Mr. Froggy]

I love my Golems, maybe it has to do with the meta at my LGS though.

[dcosiem]

Ok after testing Ugin so far in my deck on Cockatrice. I also agree he's totally nuts in this deck. The ultimate straight up wins games. Here's my list.

4 Grim Monolith
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Lodestone Golem
4 Metalworker
4 Kuldotha Forgemaster
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Staff of Domination
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Trinisphere
1 Blightsteel Colossus
1 Sundering Titan
1 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Vesuva
4 Cloudpost
4 Glimmerpost
1 Staff of Nin
4 Wasteland
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
1 Platinum Emperion
1 Platinum Angel
1 Spine of Ish Sah
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Steel Hellkite
SB: 1 Winter Orb
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 1 Witchbane Orb
SB: 1 Bottled Cloister
SB: 1 Tormod's Crypt
SB: 1 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 1 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Relic of Progenitus
SB: 1 Silent Arbiter
SB: 1 Trinisphere
SB: 1 Razormane Masticore
SB: 1 Batterskull
SB: 1 Phyrexian Revoker
SB: 1 Duplicant
SB: 1 Defense Grid

[Bobmans]

Ok after testing Ugin so far in my deck on Cockatrice. I also agree he's totally nuts in this deck. The ultimate straight up wins games.

How often and how fast where you able to put him on the board?
How did the other ability's perform?
Against what did you test it?

[dcosiem]

How often and how fast where you able to put him on the board?
How did the other ability's perform?
Against what did you test it?

Out of 8 games I guess, I saw him twice or three times. I was able to put him out the earliest on turn 3, but that was against DnT without much hate. The other games I believe I got him out way late in the match against Miracles. The plus 1 ability was good. It speeds up the game. The -x helps remove annoying aggro creatures and other permanents. Definitely, pick up at least 2. Don't play 1 cause you'll never draw him. He definitely gives the extra edge to this deck. I mean this deck already has a huge edge due to his mana base and pool of spells. But, I guess Wizards of the Coast just needs to make things more crazier I guess. LOL.

The ultimate pulled me from behind against Miracles, it was so nice. I ultied Ugin, and he responded created 5 angels. I was able to put like Blightsteel, Spine, Staff of Dom, and other lands out. The draw 7 didn't hit much, but I was at 2 life and gain 7. I was able to swing with blightsteel on that turn to kill an angel because I had greeves out. Spine took out another. And then i had so much mana out from the ulti, I was able to tap the 2 angels from attacking.

Against Dnt, I resolved him and manage to -3 him immediately and killed like Thalia, and Flickerwisp and basically reset game. He's awesome.

[nerv2004]

My issue with Ugin is its directly competing with sundering titan. do we want to attack there land or their permanents.