Page 103 of 243 FirstFirst ... 3539399100101102103104105106107113153203 ... LastLast
Results 2,041 to 2,060 of 4851

Thread: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

  1. #2041
    Member
    Gaudy's Avatar
    Join Date

    Aug 2013
    Location

    Valparaiso, Chile
    Posts

    24

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Hi every one, i'm a Burn Player, but last weekend i played MUD and won my local tournament on saturday and it was a great feeling the deck. i used a welder list, i will post it later today

  2. #2042
    Member

    Join Date

    Sep 2009
    Location

    Michigan, US
    Posts

    373

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)


    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 City of Traitors
    4 Glimmerpost
    4 Cloudpost
    4 Vesuva
    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 Chalice of the Void
    4 Metalworker
    4 Kuldotha Forgemaster
    4 Lodestone Golem
    4 Batterskull
    1 Staff of Domination
    2 Staff of Nin
    2 Spellskite
    1 Blightsteel Colossus
    1 Sundering Titan
    1 Spine of Ish Sha
    2 Wurmcoil Engine
    2 Steel Hellkite
    2 Lightning Greaves
    1 Karn Liberated
    1 Ratchet Bomb


    I found that my Trinispheres and Grim Monoliths were often dead cards, even if I drew them early. As such, I cut them (moving the Trinispheres to the board), and endeavored to replace them with more threats.

    Batterskull is my threat of choice here, as I wanted something that is good against Delver decks. Karn picks up the slot previously occupied by the second Sundering Titan. It also ensures that I'll have something to do with the absolutely ludicrous amount of mana that I'll produce in the late game.

    I also don't like Spine of Ish Sha, but I feel like you need that effect.

  3. #2043

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Picked this deck up after a long pause.

    Nuthing changed People still have love for cloudpost/vesuva! I can't imagine anything more worse then your lands entering the battlefield tapped. Its so relevant to have your mana early game.

    I messed about a bit. Tried staff of Nin. Horrible card. 6 mana should ride you to victory right? Something that a hellkite or wurmcoil can do. Or a kuldotha at 5. Staff of nin gets you extra draws but it just so slooow. I did regained love for goblin welder so i included him in my deck. And of course many ratchet bombs! Best removal to dont lose the game before you are ready to play. This what it looks like:


    4 Chalice of the Void
    4 Trinisphere
    4 Grim Monolith
    1 Staff of Domination
    3 Ratchet Bomb
    2 Lightning Greaves

    1 Platinum Emperion
    3 Steel Hellkite
    4 Lodestone Golem
    3 Wurmcoil Engine
    1 Blightsteel Colossus
    4 Kuldotha Forgemaster
    3 Goblin Welder

    4 City of Traitors
    4 Ancient Tomb
    3 Great Furnace
    4 Wasteland
    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 Mishra's Factory

    SB: 3 Duplicant
    SB: 3 Tormod's Crypt
    SB: 4 Faerie Macabre
    SB: 1 Platinum Angel
    SB: 2 All Is Dust
    SB: 2 Karn Liberated

  4. #2044
    Freedom is just as essential as air
    Mockingbird's Avatar
    Join Date

    Jan 2013
    Posts

    282

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Holland View Post
    Picked this deck up after a long pause.

    Nuthing changed People still have love for cloudpost/vesuva! I can't imagine anything more worse then your lands entering the battlefield tapped. Its so relevant to have your mana early game.
    Cloudpost gets results.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Holland View Post
    I messed about a bit. Tried staff of Nin. Horrible card. 6 mana should ride you to victory right? Something that a hellkite or wurmcoil can do. Or a kuldotha at 5. Staff of nin gets you extra draws but it just so slooow.
    Staff of Nin is more suited for MUD built for a longer control game because it's nature of attrition and refueling. I've played it, and I like it enough, but honestly, it's strength comes when you control 2 or more because they can knock out most legacy bears. Personally, it's one of my current favorite cards in my deck.
    "Let go your earthly tether. Enter the void, empty, and become wind."

  5. #2045

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    "Cloudpost gets results"

    So? Even a MUD deck with forests next to sol lands will get a occasional result. That's MUD.

    Just think about 2 vesuvas in hand. Or a t1 sol land and then being stuck with a cloudpost being unable to get to 3 mana t2 WHILE this is vital in legacy. A MUD deck cant sit inactive for a turn because you will get a combo in the face or worse they just drop things to play around your trinisphere. Dropping a tapped land followed by another tapped land is just horrible. Like a timewalk suicide on yourself.

    "staff of nin attrition/refuelling"

    I dont feel that. Can you tell me against what decks you wil need that? Its such a fast format i feel that your 6 drop should be subtantial and not a card that sets you up for a long game. MUD is slow if it cant drop lock pieces, if you cant drop cards to overpower them youll get further behind. But thats my philosophy.

    / And i forgot to mention: hellkite with greaves/ best thing since the tv invention.

  6. #2046

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Holland View Post
    "Cloudpost gets results"

    So? Even a MUD deck with forests next to sol lands will get a occasional result. That's MUD.

    Just think about 2 vesuvas in hand. Or a t1 sol land and then being stuck with a cloudpost being unable to get to 3 mana t2 WHILE this is vital in legacy. A MUD deck cant sit inactive for a turn because you will get a combo in the face or worse they just drop things to play around your trinisphere. Dropping a tapped land followed by another tapped land is just horrible. Like a timewalk suicide on yourself.

    "staff of nin attrition/refuelling"

    I dont feel that. Can you tell me against what decks you wil need that? Its such a fast format i feel that your 6 drop should be subtantial and not a card that sets you up for a long game. MUD is slow if it cant drop lock pieces, if you cant drop cards to overpower them youll get further behind. But thats my philosophy.

    / And i forgot to mention: hellkite with greaves/ best thing since the tv invention.
    Where have you been? Miracles is one of the best decks in the format right now which is more reason for cloudpost. Staff of Nin is great against miracles as drawing cards is huge when you are out of gas and it can realistically kill a jace since most of the time they have to play it and bounce something. Since a lot of the plays in MUD can just overpower other decks slowing yourself down isn't as huge of a cost as you might think. Baiting counters with lock pieces is fine if you just slam a wurmcoil when they are out to stabilize against something like delver. The fact the miracles and the new UR delver deck don't run wasteland make cloudpost much more appealing. The mana is great against miracles and the life gain is critical against delver and it allows you to easily play stabilizing cards like wurmcoil, steel hellkite or batterskull while being able to play around soft counters.

  7. #2047
    Member
    Airwave's Avatar
    Join Date

    Oct 2013
    Location

    Netherlands
    Posts

    213

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    I found that my Trinispheres and Grim Monoliths were often dead cards, even if I drew them early. As such, I cut them (moving the Trinispheres to the board), and endeavored to replace them with more threats.

    Batterskull is my threat of choice here, as I wanted something that is good against Delver decks. Karn picks up the slot previously occupied by the second Sundering Titan. It also ensures that I'll have something to do with the absolutely ludicrous amount of mana that I'll produce in the late game.

    I also don't like Spine of Ish Sha, but I feel like you need that effect.
    I often felt the same. Why the hell am I playing these monoliths? I have tons of mana! Or: Why play Trinisphere, the opponent has no problems with it. It's a dead card!

    And then you run into Delver (e.g.) wasting your second land in a row.... oops!
    My point is: I think your mana-curve is too high. This will very likely cost you games.

  8. #2048
    Member
    Airwave's Avatar
    Join Date

    Oct 2013
    Location

    Netherlands
    Posts

    213

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Holland View Post
    Picked this deck up after a long pause.

    Nuthing changed People still have love for cloudpost/vesuva! I can't imagine anything more worse then your lands entering the battlefield tapped. Its so relevant to have your mana early game.

    I messed about a bit. Tried staff of Nin. Horrible card. 6 mana should ride you to victory right? Something that a hellkite or wurmcoil can do. Or a kuldotha at 5. Staff of nin gets you extra draws but it just so slooow. I did regained love for goblin welder so i included him in my deck. And of course many ratchet bombs! Best removal to dont lose the game before you are ready to play. This what it looks like:
    Entering the battlefield tapped = bad, but all of your lands producing 2+ mana = sweet. At the cost of speed, of course. It's a control deck in my opinion this way. Dropping post mana increases speed -> combo/aggro. Two types of MUD.

    I think control is better against all delver variants, miracles, ANT/TES, POX, etc.
    Aggro/combo is better against the aggrodecks (elves, merfolk, goblins, burn, maverick, dredge, etc.)

    It all depends on exact decklists of course but this is what I found in general. In my meta, the control (cloud) version is better at the moment because total Delver/miracle/ANT count reaches more than 50% often.


    I'm with you on Staff of Nin by the way. It don't like it at all!
    If you need extra cards (which control version does I think) use Cloister of Coercive Portal at 4 mana. The 6 slot is quite full already with all these juicy bots that win you the game!

    Ratchet Bomb is very nice indeed, but I found it hard to combine with Welder since I blow up at 1 often, killing my own welder I use it in control version though.

    Just think about 2 vesuvas in hand. Or a t1 sol land and then being stuck with a cloudpost being unable to get to 3 mana t2 WHILE this is vital in legacy. A MUD deck cant sit inactive for a turn because you will get a combo in the face or worse they just drop things to play around your trinisphere. Dropping a tapped land followed by another tapped land is just horrible. Like a timewalk suicide on yourself.
    2 vesuva's only? Mulligan!
    SOL land + post? T1 post, unless I have Chalice at hand which will seriously harm my opponent. Otherwise T2 sol, T2 3-drop (worker,trini,bridge, etc.)

    Next to that, playing 24 lands gives you a fair chance at having 3 lands in opener, especially on the draw


    By the way, welcome back

  9. #2049

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    I just won my local GPT with this list.

    1x Blightsteel Colossus
    4x Kuldotha Forgemaster
    4x Lodestone Golem
    4x metal worker
    1x platinum angel
    1x steel hellkite
    1x sundering titan
    3x wurmcoil engine
    4x chalice of the void
    4x grim monolith
    2x lightning greaves
    1x spine of ish sah
    1x staff of domination
    1x staff of nin
    4x trinisphere
    4x ancient tomb
    2x cavern of souls
    4x city of traitors
    4x cloudpost
    4x glimerpost
    3x vesuva
    3x wasteland

    Board:
    1x All is dust
    1x ensnaring bridge
    2x ratchet bomb
    1x spellskite
    1x spine of ish sah
    1x sundering titan
    1x thorn of amethyst
    2x tormod's crypt
    2x torpor orb
    1x trading post
    1x witchbane orb
    1x wurmcoil engine

    My only loss was to BUG delver round 1, then i beat that same BUG delver for top 2.

    As far as the debate on whether trinisphere should be run and not run, I feel that it has amazing potential to keep the game in your favor with them playing 1 maybe 2 spells a turn with their lighter mana bases, while i bait their force with a lodestone golem and then drop sundering titan and wurmcoil engine back to back with all the mana from my locust lands.

    Plus, with the post lands i can't tell you how many turns i would use the locust land mana to abuse staff of domination to tap down 2 creatures and draw 2 cards for consecutive turns.

  10. #2050

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    As of right now I think post base might be good enough.
    My current list I built when wastelands saw more play. Which made double post hands super dangerous. Going a few turns with out landing anything relevant generally has already put you out of the race apart from a great top deck.

  11. #2051
    bruizar
    Guest

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Congratulations Black Hawk.


    Here's some more progress on one of my builds (Working on Red mud, Blue mud and exploring the viability of prototype portal at the moment). If anyone could contribute thoughts or play testing to further develop the deck, it would be much appreciated.

    Prototype Portal

    4 CC [8]
    4 Prototype Portal
    4 Lodestone Golem

    3 CC [16]
    4 Phyrexian Metamorph
    4 Tangle Wire
    4 Etched Champion
    4 Metalworker

    2 CC [6]
    2 Whipflare / All is Dust
    4 Grim Monolith
    2 Spellskite

    1 CC [10]
    4 Sensei’s Divining Top
    4 Voltaic Key
    2 Relic of Progenitus

    Land [20]
    4 Seat of the Synod
    4 Darksteel Citadel
    4 Mox Opal
    1 Academy Ruins
    3 Ancient Tomb
    4 City of Traitors


    Brief explanation:
    Prototype Portal
    ★ Ramps with artifact land, Mox Opal, Voltaic Key, Metalworker, Grim Monolith
    ★ Draws with Sensei's Divining Top or Voltaic Key or Relic of Progenitus
    ★ Disrupts with Lodestone Golem and Tangle Wire
    ★ Protects with Spellskite, Etched Champion and Phyrexian Metamorph
    ★ Baits counters since you need only imprint after the spell is resolved
    Prototype Portal imprinting Prototype Portal or Phyrexian Metamorph eliminates all counters. though unlikely due to mana requirements

    Etched Champion
    ★ Low curve, artifact lands and token artifacts enable metalcraft consistently
    ★ Acts as an Ensnaring Bridge that can win the game
    ★ Ignores Abrupt Decay

    Issues
    ★ Perhaps too ramp-heavy and too little gas
    Whipflare is off-color
    Metalworker might not be necessary given the low curve
    Entreat the Angels and Delver of Secrets ignore Etched Champion
    ★ Considering replacing Sensei's Divining Top with more Relic of Progenitus to combat delve cards and Tarmogoyf while still drawing cards
    ★ Number of Voltaic Keys is off

    Considered Cards
    Brittle Effigy
    Welding Jar
    Nihil Spellbomb and Relic of Progenitus
    Wizard Replica
    Sphere of Resistance and Thorn of Amethyst
    Smokestack

  12. #2052
    Member

    Join Date

    Sep 2010
    Location

    France
    Posts

    31

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    I did try a prototype portal list back in the day. My list is on page 14 on this very thread. It was very fun, and sometimes very efficient. I actually followed some of your advices on that matter and sometimes tried some silly things like Lotus bloom on portal (cute but not competitive).

    People don't expect the portal, and you can steal a few win with it. I like your list. But I prefer my MUD "staxxy" so I often play with Chalice and Sphere of resistance. I suppose sphere and portal could be quite strong.

    You need to have a plan against Pithing Needle effects, I faced that card on game 2 almost every time.

  13. #2053
    Pancake
    Bobmans's Avatar
    Join Date

    Oct 2012
    Location

    Netherlands
    Posts

    845

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    I have considered Pyroclasm as a sideboard card in my Welder list, but Whipflare would be a lot better. Great find, i will try it soon.

    Also Coercive Portal is on my radar, especially with Cloudpost lists it might be a strong card that has application for multiple purposes. Build up mana, sculpt a hand, blow up the field and then drop bombs. Or as a "reset" button. And even as a one sided Howling Mine it is strong in grindy matchups. 4 mana is a nice cost.

    Edit: as i read it (again), it seems that Carnage has to get a vote from the opponent or it won't trigger the Carnage ability!? What a shame..

  14. #2054
    bruizar
    Guest

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bobmans View Post
    I have considered Pyroclasm as a sideboard card in my Welder list, but Whipflare would be a lot better. Great find, i will try it soon.
    Pyroclasm is to Rolling Earthquake what Whipflare is to Bonfire of the Damned. The one sided sweep is really nice, especially if you're running Relic of Progenitus. Relic shrinks both Nimble Mongoose, Tarmogoyf, trashes Deathrite Shaman's utility and dashes the dreams for Treasure Cruise. Whipflare can take out Delver of Secrets, Tarmogoyf, Nimble Mongoose, Elves.dec, Young Pyromancer and his buddies and sometimes takes out a Swiftspear. All while leaving Metalworkers and Phyrexian Revokers in play.

  15. #2055

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Was thinking about a Blue MUD build today. TfK, Cruise, Transmute Artifact all came to mind. I guess I'm thinking mostly of a more aggressive Tez list.

  16. #2056

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zirath View Post
    Was thinking about a Blue MUD build today. TfK, Cruise, Transmute Artifact all came to mind. I guess I'm thinking mostly of a more aggressive Tez list.
    Tez/dreadnought affinity is fun..

    I have been thinking about MUD these days and im convinced. Cloudpost is ok- with the right cards. With cloudpost i wouldnt use monoliths anymore- maybe not even metalworkers, they are redundant if not for bad hands or a possible staff of domination win, wich i think is great fun to do. So i was wrong! I will miss those caverns, and those artifact-manlands wich made forgemaster online quicker.

    I am split between two cores,

    First i tried a more stax core:

    4 lodestone
    4 phyrexian metamorph
    4 thorn of amethyst / 4 sphere of resistance
    3 tangle wire

    That gives you about 12-19(!) possible cards to slow down anything the opponent does. Tangle wire especially shines in post- buys time for your tapped lands. And your land is more valuable than theirs. Also BRIEFLY tought about prototype portal for this- would be awesome to make a lodestone every turn- but thats magic christmas land.

    Sphere of resistance is awesome! I didnt even played chalice or trinisphere in this build because i figured what the h is delver gonna do when i am on the play dropping t1 sphere, t2 another or copying t3 tangle wire.
    Im not sure about amethyst because i played death and taxes and they didnt seem to care! However its a good combo with big mana, big robots, sort of like a tangle wire with makes their counters useless. It also feels a bit like trolling spamming all kind of obstructions to playing the game- i liked it Sometimes it did fireback- karn became uncastable wich sucked.

    Also if you dont play chalice this enables pithing needle- a very important card against wasteland and a little stronger then revoker against some decks.

    The other build i tried is more aggro. Everbody loves big robots right? This is my standard package:

    3 steel hellkite
    4 wurmcoil engine

    A hellkite equipped with greaves killing everything in front of him is beautiful. Wurmcoil is better and better with less swords in the format it seems? Everything else fluctuates. I think forgemaster is still mandatory- you need tutoring against certain matchups. I like metalworker still very much, it can safe you when your mana comes slow so it actually adds stability. Plus people still love to throw counters and stuff at it instead of targetting your win spells. But on the other hand: copper gnomes sort of does this role to. Its only 2 mana so you can always play it- and get something trough uncounterd.

    Chalice is a must still i think. Mostly i go with 3 trinisphere. And now sometimes with 3 thorn of amethyst. Aggro is a easy matchup, non-aggro harder. So amethyst deserves some attention.

    I dont feel sundering titan. I never felt like getting it instead of blightsteel with kuldotha. It feels a bit situational. Also why is Myr battlesphere never run anymore? Hardcast is fairly easy with post mana base.

    Current ideal mana base (24)

    4 ancient tomb
    4 city of traitors
    12 post
    4 wasteland

    PS: I am still waiting for someone to build the ultimate red MUD with Godo, bandit warlord, rolling earthquake and goblin welder. Maybe even the new spoiled FELDON!

  17. #2057

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    You still have to run metalworker because of the fact that wasteland is a card. Redundancy is necessary because the best way to disrupt the plan to out mana people with lands is a auto include in a lot of non combo decks. Decks like 12 post can get away with the post mana base being good enough is because of built in protection with crop rotations and pithing needles or other land tutoring effects but we don't have that luxury so you need the redundancy to compete and actually cast your spells.

  18. #2058

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Went to scg Minneapolis yesterday. Lost first round to U/R delver. Pretty sure he went to top 8. Ended the day 5-4 (would have dropped but my ride had potential for top 16 so I played it out)
    Had wins against Reanimator, Death and Taxes, High Tide (barely made this one. Had the nicest opponent. I felt for him when he fizzled giving me 3 extra meditate turns.), Elves, and pox. Got burned out of cash last round.

    I can write a report later tonight after work. I think I'm going to want to move my revokers to the side and add ratchet bombs to main.
    Last edited by Sleight; 10-27-2014 at 06:29 PM.

  19. #2059

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    This is my list currently btw:

    4# chalice of the void
    3# trinisphere
    3# thorn of amethyst

    3# lightning greaves
    3# ratchet bomb
    1# staff of domination
    2# karn liberated

    4#wurmcoil engine
    3# steel hellkite
    3#metalworker
    4#kuldotha forgemaster
    1# blightsteel colossus
    1# platinum emperion

    3# mishras factory
    3# vesuva
    3# city of traitors
    3# wasteland
    4# cloudpost
    4# glimmerpost
    4# ancient tomb

  20. #2060
    Freedom is just as essential as air
    Mockingbird's Avatar
    Join Date

    Jan 2013
    Posts

    282

    Re: [Deck] MUD (Metalworker)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Holland View Post
    This is my list currently btw:

    4# chalice of the void
    3# trinisphere
    3# thorn of amethyst

    3# lightning greaves
    3# ratchet bomb
    1# staff of domination
    2# karn liberated

    4#wurmcoil engine
    3# steel hellkite
    3#metalworker
    4#kuldotha forgemaster
    1# blightsteel colossus
    1# platinum emperion

    3# mishras factory
    3# vesuva
    3# city of traitors
    3# wasteland
    4# cloudpost
    4# glimmerpost
    4# ancient tomb
    Why no Lodestone Golem? He's the deck's most efficient beater and a tax card rolled into one.
    "Let go your earthly tether. Enter the void, empty, and become wind."

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)