Which cards do you think will make a splash in legacy at all?Originally Posted by Airwave
I still think warping wail has a use somewhere...maybe goblins can use it to counter show and tell or something (they run 4 waste 4 port afterall).
Theres also the Blue red flying/prowess/haste 1/3 guy that i think is very good in UR delver as monastery swiftspear #5+.
Back on topic, i actually just read your PM after like a million years and replied :)
Saw your control list with the bottled cloister + bridge. I don't really understand this build. what are you trying to achieve here and what is the game plan? What decks do you have a good MU against and which ones are poor?
Honestly, I think there metagame instances where Warping Wail shines. Spatial Contortion isn't as relevant.
Warping Wail seems like the best weapon against BUG decks...
- It exiles deathrite shaman and baleful strix. IE the things that slowly kill you and prevent you from attacking
- It counters Hymn to Tourach, Ancestral Vision and Toxic Deluge. IE both things they use to get avantage over you.
- It makes a token that protect any decepticon that you have on the field from Lilliana.
And Elves...
- It exiles basically any critter in the deck, assuming they get past the chalice.
- It counters both Glimpse and Natural Order.
- It's a surprise combat trick if they are trying to go wide and attack with their best creatures.
And Delver...
- It kills unflipped delvers, young pyromancer, dark confidant.
- It a surprise combat trick against nimble mongoose
- Sorcery mode is a little less relevant, but sometimes countering a ponder gets them!
Personally I'm planning to try out 2-3 in my ratchet bomb / whipflare spots.
Actually vs BUG this a great one. If theres one thing BUG hates is Trinisphere and no way to get mana for AD. Having WW on DRS and holding them down with 3sphere + Wasteland is very strong vs them. Also if you can protect key creatures against Liliana is big here. It offers lot of options to fight BUG and since BUG is one of the most difficult MU's i vote yes.
Kagu-Tsuchi カグツチ (Jund NicFit)
Rhino's Abbondanza (Junk NicFit)
4c Aggro Loam
thank you for your responses. I honestly am still sitting on the fence, but since its an uncommon i'll pick a playset up and start testing it.
It's a grindy control build that shines against other control (big card advantage) and profits from decks that rely on big creatures (bridge is great against sneak & show for instance). It can be somewhat tough against aggro (which isn't so prevalent in my meta) although bridge can often buy enough time to bring Ugin on the board
Have you brought it to an event yet? I am interested to hear more about it. I really think the bottled cloister - ensnaring bridge combo is really cute (though I hope they don't blow the cloister haha).
It also exiles Bridge from Below, prevents Ichorid from recurring by exiling it and ramps into bomb by EOT wailing for an Eldrazi Petal in a pinch. Both Wail and Contortion are up on my wishlist.
Contortion is great against Monastery Mentor, Young Pyromancer and Delver, among others.
I think I played four with this list. Three times played around even and won one (with around 60 players)
Bottled Cloister has been blow up a few times but sometimes it didn't even matter. Losing your hand with Bridge in play is tough for the opponent as well. Sometimes opponents choose to blow up the bridge instead. But, especially after boarding, you need to be careful when to play it.
why is this so?
Cus your opponent will try to snipe the cloister at the time it will hurt you.
Kagu-Tsuchi カグツチ (Jund NicFit)
Rhino's Abbondanza (Junk NicFit)
4c Aggro Loam
Oh yeah, thought knot seer aka colorless Thoughtseize just doubled in price. I was looking at it and I was wondering if we could use it as well?
At this point Eldrazi Stompy is a better MUD than MUD, imho.
If you already own the pieces to build MUD, you can build Eldrazi Stompy too. All you need to do is swap out the artifact creatures for Eldrazi, basically. I think this deck will be the Tier 1 contender that MUD always tried to be.
I already have the MUD pieces, but I'm keen to give it a spin. Do you have a "stock" list of some sort that I could use as a starting point?
So your saying Metalworker.dec is dead?
Kagu-Tsuchi カグツチ (Jund NicFit)
Rhino's Abbondanza (Junk NicFit)
4c Aggro Loam
I disagree. Show me a list that outraces MUD then. Or puts up a stronger fight in control-build.
Next to that, I highly doubt the Eldazi will bring the colorless field to Tier 1. Not with the stuff that is out now, maybe in the future it could be different..
I think out of all the new eldrazi I only like the colorless thoughtseize guy to sort of complement MUD. I haven't seen a full eldrazi list yet so I can't judge, but I'm open to giving eldrazi a spin, although I won't forsake MUD because there is no eldrazi metalworker.
I got 4 thought-knot seer, because it will never be a dead card. It's colorless. Fits in every EDH deck, good in standard, modern and legacy stompy style decks or just anything with tomb/traitors. I also like Reality Smasher. I might be biased because my brother ripped 2 smashers during the prerelease and did very well.
That said, I don't believe you need to go all-out Eldrazi. You can mix and match, and although Metalworker may not ramp into a gazillion mana, perhaps you don't need a gazillion mana when you are lowering your curve with these Eldrazi's anyway.
The bigger problem is that Lodestone Golem conflicts directly with these Eldrazis (I'd still play golem even though its symmetric with eldrazis).
I think we can all agree that we're in a state of flux now, until we get some testing done we don't know whether MUD, eldrazi MUD or a hybrid of both will be the way to go.
Hi everyone! I'm new on this thread and I want to share my impressions on the last 75 I'm running and the new eldrazi cards:
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Cloudpost
4 Glimmerpost
2 Vesuva
4 Cavern of Souls
3 Mishra's Factory
3 City of Traitors
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Grim Monolith
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Tousand-Year Elixir
3 Trinisphere
1 Staff of Domination
1 Spine of Ish Sah
3 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Metalworker
4 Lodestone Golem
3 Kuldotha Forgemaster
1 Stell Hellkite
4 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Sundering Titan
1 Blightsteel Colossus
1 Warping Wail
SB
4 Maze of Ith
1 Grafdigger's cage
3 Faerie Macabre
2 Warping Wail
1 Duplicant
2 All is Dust
2 Sundering Titan
I tested a lot this deck since I started in September (doing 6-3 on a 400 player event in Italy and two 5-2 on a 70 and 50 player event), beginning from a stompy version to the actual kuldotha list.
In my opinion kuldotha version has the advantage to win games which would end into a lose just by topdecking it.
I hate running fatties like blightsteel colossus because you may almost never cast them when they are in your hand, still I ended many game just putting it on the board because my opponent couldn'j just answer it.
The hardest MUs I ever faced are the decks based on wasteland, tarmogoyf and delver. Due to Jund, Shardless Bug, Bug Delver, Grixis Delver, Canadian, D&T all together are a large part of the metagame i put myself into the research of something that could resolves the creatures-threat (I gave up myself fighting wasteland because I'll never play pithing needle in a deck with chalice of the void). The best solution MD is wurmcoil engine: most of the time BG decks can't respond him or can't without using a large quantity of cards and time and against a deck with swords to plowshares still gains us 6 lifes, which means time to push robots into play.
Another great card to fight aggros is warping wail: it's perfect for this deck because evades chalice, removes all the most played creatures exept for tarmogyfs and flipped delver, ramps mana if necessary or sacs the token and counters sorcery, which means you have a way to interact against terminus, entreat the angels, show and tell, glimpse of nature, natural order, infernal tutor ecc. I still haven't thought of a t1/t1.5/t.2 deck where it could be a dead card and that's why I would play more of one MD; surely if I cut something, warping wail will be one of the my first option.
Anyway I'm evading the super-secret-tech: maze of ith! No one card in my eternal struggle against tarmogoyf and delver shined well as this one. Being a land it's immune to counters, if you're opponent wants to wasteland it, it will saves a land to cast spells, tricks with wurmcoil letting you to beating for six and still having a blocking creature, gaininig a huge amount of life.
It would be great if someone could test it to have more info about its potential, or try to find out a better solution for what I consider the worst MUs of this deck.
All others choices are quite traditional, I cut a chalice and a trinisphere because I don't like to draw multiple copies of a card which doesn't make a race, I play revoker MD because shuts up a lot of cards, is very good against combo and in the worst case is a easy drop artifact to sac for kuldotha.
About the new Eldrazi cards they don't looks able to stand up a chance in a format like legacy to me.
Reality smasher dies from tarmogoyf (unless you want to play without artifact at all)
Matter reshaper doesn't trigger with swords to plowshares and terminus and it's useless against combo.
Though-knot seer could be interesting, but the idea of playing it against miracle, seeing two land and giving my opponent a card when it will go away scares me too much. Furthermore it's difficult to cast with lodestone in play and if I have to choice between thought-knot and lodestone I still rather lodestone.
Endbringer is a good creature, too, but the 6 drop curve is already full and wurmcoil wins over endbringer imho.
Hoping you read all my opinions without feeling them boring or obvious!
Like everyone else, I would like to hear your thoughts on this. Other than Thought-Knot sphere, none of the Eldrazi add new capabilities to the deck. Are you predicting it's gonna overtake us simply because of the bigger creatures, or because of the different mana (via Eye of Ugin, Eldrazi Temple, etc)? And why do you think that will be better positioned in the current meta than MUD is?
As I've already said, I disagree that most of the new cards have a home in MUD. However, they might fit well in the Legends MUD build (which I know you love
Nice list! I was surprised to only see 3 Chalice, as it's one of our strongest cards. I don't mind drawing multiples: you can obviously use them to shut off other CMC cards, and multiples makes it harder for your opponent to Abrupt Decay his way out of them.Hoping you read all my opinions without feeling them boring or obvious!
How have the 4x Cavern of Souls worked for you? I used to play 3, and hated drawing multiples, so I cut to 2.
I like the idea of 4x Wurmcoil, especially if your meta is Delver-heavy.
Do you ever play Ugin? It's an amazing card.
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