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Thread: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

  1. #121
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Ok, so I played a 5-colour list with 4 Vial 5 Dorks 3 Mother 3 Opposition 1 TNN 1 Rider in a 6-round tournament yesterday.
    I had some unusual matchups and faced a Black deck in every round. It's sad because I want serious testing for Eternal Weekend Paris. I'm either going to play my usual RG Lands or this fun one!

    BR Reanimator 0-2. He killed me T1 on the play. Game2 I mulled to 5, he revealed Chancellor, Thoughtseized me and killed me T2. Fun. Kind of unlucky since I built my list mainly to beat this. SB had 2 Surgery 2 Trap 3 Faerie Macabre and other stuff next to Prelate/Mages.

    Mono B Pox 2-1. This guy was weird, played sloppy and obviously Pox isn't a real deck in 2017.

    BG Zombies (Zombardment style without Bombardment) 0-2. This was super frustrating but on the other hand, this guy was new to Legacy and super nice to me. I mulliganed to 5 Game1 and he had mono removal + 2-3 Geralf's Messengers. Game2 he destroyed my hand with Thoughtseize, Hymn, Cabal Therapy and then had 2-3 Messengers and Deathrite Shaman. I tried to defend with Mother of Runes and Izzet Staticaster, but a Fatal Push sealed the deal. Is this a deck? :D

    Aggro Loam 2-0. I feel this is a good matchup, especially with Opposition. Prelate and Meddling Mage stopped his removal and Meren/Tradewind ground him out. Keranos was MVP. Game2 I Vialed him in on 5 counters and basically sealed the game alongside True-Name Nemesis. Izzet Staticaster also helped to ping Dark Confidants.

    BUG Threshold 1-2. I think this is a good matchup but I lost because he got 3 Deathrite Shamans fast and I couldn't really stop him from draining me out quickly. Double Staticaster wasn't possible because he always double decayed my Vials and Wasted me. Once he even blew me out with Golgari Charm which I named with Meddling Mage G2, but didn't help.

    BUG Delver 1-2. Kind of the same as above, but instead of 3 DRS, he played 3 Goyfs in the decisive game. I had Opposition and Keranos to shoot his DRS, but obviously he Ponders into Toxic Deluge, Maelstrom Pulse, X. I had an Ooze, but could not exile both Vials to let his Goyfs die to Deluge X=4. This was really close and after thinking about the match and lines, I didn't do anything wrong really, it was a missing mana here and there and so many creatures entering the battlefield at once for the opponent that lost me the game.

    > I was wrong. Vial was the best card, at least in these matches. I think I misunderstood the card in this deck. It's still good if you draw Vials in the next turns or later on.
    > Keranos was so strong, especially in these BGx matches.
    > Sanctum Prelate was way better than Meddling Mage. I might change the split to 3-2 or 2-3.
    > Green Sun's Zenith was really disappointing yesterday. I guess because most of my opponents played Wasteland and lots of removal so I was never in a good spot for GSZ. I mostly searched a Bird or Quirion to develop my mana. X=2 for Fauna or Scryb Ranger did cost too much mana in several spots, lol.
    > This is where my friend suggested to cut GSZ for Force of Will/Brainstorm and I might test this out. Without GSZ you probably need Quirion Ranger #2.
    > I'm curious about the Dork split. I played 4 BOP 1 DRS because I think that you generally untap a lot with Ranger, especially if you want to ramp out Opposition. But then, opposing DRS were a huge pain in the ass and the best way to combat this might be by playing 4 DRS on your own. Thoughts?
    > Glen Elendra Archmage was non-present. Needs more testing.
    > Meren was great.
    > Tradewind Rider great.
    > Izzet Staticaster great!
    > True-Name Nemesis really great. Maybe I want a 2nd TNN. This + Keranos can basically do everything.

  2. #122
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Tough luck, Alex! Did you feel like you weren't playing the deck optimally at some point? I feel that often, always so many options, and I'm wondering what part suboptimal plays and deck building choices may have influenced. Not that I'm shocked you had a bad run, it can happen for sure.

    When it comes to BR Reanimator that G2 loss illustrates one of the reasons why Leyline of the Void is better than Faerie Macabre - it can't be Thoughtseized (when it works well). On the other hand Leyline can be removed by Reverent Silence which they may be playing. I'd suggest changing 1-2 Faerie Macabres into Leylines in the future. They are actually potentially very good vs BUG Threshold too, invalidating Mongoose, to some extent Deathrite and making sure any potential Goyfs are less of an issue too - without their combination of Stifle + Wasteland + Daze/FoW being able to stop your answer. I've been meaning to figure out a plan vs the BUG Threshold lists which beat me 4-0 when I was playing another deck (enchantment based Nic Fit, first time ever playing and may have made loads of mistakes) last week. Vial seems great, at the very least.

    Your matchups seem like they don't care much about Opposition, except for the Aggro Loam deck I guess. So you could have had better luck with your matchups in relation to your current build.

    BG Zombies - this seems like a matchup where Scavenging Ooze shines, which you were considering skipping. Did you actually skip it for this tournament?

    BUG Threshold - Deathrite is one reason I play Izzet Staticaster, I haven't found many other good answers to it. Unfortunately kills our Deathrites too (I play 2 only currently). Merieke is another answer.

    BUG Delver - Goyf + Toxic Deluge is one very difficult strategy for this deck, I believe. In my impression we'v always tended to die to either an opponent connecting with Jitte or an opponent managing to disrupt our creatures and outgoyf us. So for this reason I've built my versions to try to maximize chances of dealing with Jitte and Goyf. Here are a few strategies for dealing with Goyf that I currently play.

    Different ways to deal with Goyf:
    Destroying: Shriekmaw, Meren + Shriekmaw, Decay
    Stealing: Merieke (preferably with backup from Mother or at least vialled in EOT)
    Graveyard-mgmt: Ooze, Deathrite
    Blocking: TNN, Ranger + Dryad, Jitte, Mother, Atraxa
    Racing: Shaman of the Great Hunt, Selfless Squire, Atraxa, Jitte (attack+defense)

    So if you find you're playing very few of above cards you may need to look into what alternative answers you have.

    Sweepers:
    - Active Fauna Shaman and Vial @ 4: get Glen Elendra to counter or Meren to rebuild. Deathrite potentially interferes with both these strategies so we want a maindeck answer to it, being Izzet Staticaster. Grenzo is another possible answer.
    - Vendilion Clique proactively or Spell Queller reactively
    - Avoid playing x/1's or playing cards adding strength (Shaman of the Great Hunt)

    Regarding your comments:
    - Vial: good to hear. :)
    - Keranos: I removed him due to being quite expensive and working very slowly at that, still in consideration though.
    - Sanctum Prelate: we all agree then.
    - GSZ: it sounds to me like it was the perfect card in the deck if your opponent exerts mana denial and you get to GSZ for BoP/Deathrite. Also regarding your problems vs both Deathrite and Goyf, GSZ for Scavenging Ooze is a perfect way to fight a board of Deathrites and Goyfs with one single card.
    - Dork split: I play 2 Deathrites only because he's not a reliable mana source, but he usually does provide some mana while being able to fight graveyard shenanigans and having the valuable 2 toughness (Golgari Charm protection). Actually we have access to the Rangers so I think we can usually end up on top in a Deathrite war even when playing less (thanks to GSZ + Ranger). Also with Izzet Staticaster destroying opposing Deathrites we don't want to many in play ourselves. Well these are my thoughts anyway, there's no right or wrong here.
    - Tradewind Rider: I'm curious, what did he do for you during this tournament?

  3. #123
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    I think I definitely made bad calls/decisions in the BUG Threshold match, but other than that and thinking back about the matches, not really so. Some of my friends watched me play and I asked them about lines, what I could have done wrong or different etc. but I think it was just very close matches. I am definitely going to test this further and try to get faster and better. The BUG matches were the hardest ones.

    Ooze: Yes I still played Ooze and it was really good, I just didn't always have the mana to make use of it. I should have considered Ooze more often and more aggressively!! But now I know :) thanks for the comments on Ooze and Goyf wars.

    GSZ: I know it's good for ramp or Ooze, but it was hard to utilize. I'm just going to see how it goes next tournament. I might be disillusioned because now that I think about it, my opps always discarded or countered it when they could.

    Spell Queller seems good against these Toxic Deluge-esque cards. Going to get one!
    Shaman of the Great Hunt would've been great for racing indeed. Need to get one. I just don't know how to fit in Grenzo then :)

    Shriekmaw: Yes it's good vs Goyf decks. I destroyed Delvers and Knights. I just always wanted to kill their DRS but that's not possible unfortunately. I think I should get more aggressive in these DRS scenarios. I think I played too conservative sometimes because I'm a Lands player :D

    Tradewind Rider: he is just very hard to kill. Like, they can STP him or Fatal Push(revolt) him, but only if you have no protection! He was a good blocker vs Delver and 3/4 Goyf and very good in pressuring the opponent when they saw it in play or in the hand. For example, the Aggro Loam player knew that if I get the active Tradewind + 2 creatures, they can't keep Knight or Marit Lage on the battlefield. This was exactly how they lost Game1. Gilded Drakes taking Knights and bouncing it back to my hand was very sweet. I think Tradewind is a very good defensive and grindy card and might be handy vs Miracles or Marit Lage matchups.

    I really like that this deck can easily grind out these decks. They have to Decay your Vial asap, they have to kill your Mothers asap etc. It just becomes really rough for them in the later turns (unless they land-lock you or something like that. My 3 SB Needles were really good to fight Wasteland and Planeswalkers)

  4. #124
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Here is a short report with not too much writing effort from this weekís local legacy event; 44 players participated which was really nice. I didnít take any notes (will try to do that from now on) but thought Iíd write anyway, hoping to encourage Alexeezay and Memories to do further experimenting, also itís nice to be able to go back and read. I also think it would be a good idea to sum up for each game any game-winning cards in my deck or in the opponentís deck.

    An updated list is available below. Here are some comments on my updates this week:

    1. Based on our recent discussion a green out to Blood Moon would be good, also I felt that a second maindeck Leovold is, very good indeed, but not in any way required. Thus I changed Leovold no 2 into Reclamation Sage in the maindeck.

    2. I wanted to play a card that is good vs BUG decks, seeming very popular, so I added one Mirran Crusader to the sideboard. With four creatures with the exalted ability and one Jitte there is perhaps enough synergy to make him a very good and cost efficient threat. I would prefer to avoid the WW casting cost but not sure what else could be played. I think I removed Kambal to make room for the Crusader. Kambal was added to battle UR decks and Burn, and to some extent helpful vs Storm and I believe BUG decks. May change this back. I never needed Mirran Crusader yesterday so no conclusions yet.

    3. I like the mix of cards that are good vs fast decks in the sideboard, that are also mostly good vs control decks, and the Mindbreaks should be good vs both Alluren and Food Chain that are otherwise hard to board against: 2 Invasive Surgery, 2 Mindbreak Trap (pretty useful with Vials in the deck), 1 Leyline of the Void, 1 Leyline of Sanctity.

    4. Last, I felt that the potential to destroy True Names and other small creatures using Pontiff and Staticaster is a very strong aspect of this deck that helps in winning a lot of matchups. Playing one of each in the 75 is enough to provide it in the strategic arsenal of the deck, and with Fauna Shaman + GSZ for tutoring it you will often be able to assemble them. However, I think that perhaps they are so good, in so many machups, that itís worth doubling up on them (in the sideboard). This is also a meta call.

    Maindeck:
    Alternative mana sources:
    3 Aether Vial
    2 Birds of Paradise
    2 Deathrite Shaman
    1 Noble Hierarch
    1 Dryad Arbor

    Creatures:
    3 Mother of Runes
    4 Fauna Shaman
    2 Qasali Pridemage
    2 Scryb Ranger
    1 Scavenging Ooze
    1 Stoneforge Mystic
    1 Leovold, Emissary of Trest (-1)
    1 Merieke Ri Berit
    1 Izzet Staticaster
    1 Orzhov Pontiff
    1 Reclamation Sage (+1)
    2 Sanctum Prelate
    1 True-Name Nemesis
    1 Vendilion Clique
    1 Atraxa, Praetors' Voice
    1 Glen Elendra, Archmage
    1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
    1 Shaman of the Great Hunt
    1 Shriekmaw

    Non-Creatures
    3 Green Sun's Zenith
    3 Abrupt Decay
    1 Sylvan Library
    1 Umezawa's Jitte

    Lands:
    8 green fetchlands
    2 Tropical Island
    2 Savannah
    2 Bayou
    1 Taiga
    1 Forest

    Sideboard:

    2 Invasive Surgery
    2 Pithing Needle
    1 Gaddock Teeg
    1 Gilded Drake
    1 Magus of the Moon
    1 Mirran Crusader(+1)
    1 Izzet Staticaster
    1 Orzhov Pontiff(+1)
    1 Leyline of the Void
    1 Leyline of Sanctity
    2 Mindbreak Trap(+1)
    1 Selfless Squire


    R1: Elves
    Iím glad to be playing against elves, I won last time I played against them and now with four relevant counterspells (+1 or maybe even 2 Mindbreak Trap) and 4 mass removal creatures (+1 Orzhov Pontiff and maybe an Izzet Staticaster) this should be at least an ok matchup.

    G1: I win the die roll but get a clunky start hand with 3-4 lands, a 3-drop and a 4-drop), I mulligan to a no-land hand and keep five cards (not sure which). I think I decay something early, he goes off with Glimpse and GSZís for Craterhoof.

    G2: I think I mulligan again and settle for a start with t2 Scryb Ranger + Fauna Shaman into a potential t3 tutor for and play Pontiff. He Natural Orders for Craterhoof on t2 I think [or t3], would have needed one of the counterspells or naturally drawing one of the removal creatures (Pontiff/Staticaster). [I also would have had the option to play Jitte, equip and attack with Scryb Ranger the next turn)

    Result: 0-2 in this round, 0-1 in matches in total, 0-2 in games in total.
    MVP in my list: Pontif and Jitte would have been great in G2 if I had managed to prolong the game 1 turn.
    MVP for the opponent: Glimpse, GSZ, Craterhoof, Natural Order (nothing new here, basically the elf deck when working)



    R2: ANT (this guy has previously played an ANT-TES hybrid, not sure if thatís still the case)

    G1: I win the die roll, and knowing the player is usually on storm I mulligan away an otherwise nice hand with Stoneforge, Fauna Shaman and maybe a Decay. He opens with Gitaxian Probe into Duress, taking my GSZ so no tutoring for Leovold. I draw into a Sanctum Prelate and play it turn two naming 4; he scoops.

    G2: What I remember from this game is that he searched for a tutor and never found one, he had Echoing Truths to bounce something, a few cantrips and mana. According to my evening notes I GSZ for Leovold on t3, beat him down.

    Result: 2-0 in this round. 1-1 in matches in total, 2-2 in games in total.
    MVP in my list: GSZ, Sanctum Prelate
    MVP for the opponent: -



    R3: Sneak n Show w Omniscience
    Well this is usually an ok-ish matchup, I won last time at least.

    G1: I play t1 BoP, t2 Scryb Ranger and Fauna Shaman I think. Then pass the turn t3 with everything untapped (except Ranger who attacked), he EOT Cunning Wishes, I let it resolve and then tutor for and play Vendilion Clique, putting his Kozilek's Return on the bottom of his library, he had a Griselbrand too I think but not much else. Think I get a Leovold into play too and manage to win from there.

    G2: donít remember what I had drawn, I think I mulliganed low and started with a few lands, a Deathrite, Vial and Invasive Surgery. He played lands for a few turns and then hardcasted Inferno Titan with the help of a Lotus Petal, which destroyed my board consisting of a Deathrite Shaman, maybe a Gaddock Teeg (along with maybe a Pithing Needle on Griselbrand). This felt a bit unlucky, I will usually have some interaction for large creatures but boarding into combo interaction does leave me vulnerable to hardcast Inferno Titans. An active Fauna Shaman might have solved it.

    G3: I think I mulligan to 4 due to double no-land hands. I think I end up with 1 BoP, 1 Taiga, 1 Scryb Ranger and 1 Fauna Shaman so I play it and hope he wonít find a sweeper, with one land only and no counterspells chances are slim. Turns out he had double Cunning Wishes, I get swept.

    Results: 1-2 this round. 1-2 in matches in total, 3-4 in games in total.
    MVP in my list: Vendilion Clique
    MVP in the opponentís list: Cunning Wish, Kozilekís Return, Inferno Titan



    R4: BU Pox
    I know this guy played BU Pox the last times I played him, and I have won some amount of those games thanks to Vial + Fauna Shaman + Meren. Havenít lost vs it yet.

    G1: Not sure about the order here but he wastes a Tropical and then Surgicals it. I play an early Deathrite and maybe Vial so I have access to blue mana anyway. He plays an Ashiok and his lone Mishraís factory can protect it for several turns as I play Merieke and some other really small creatures with Shriekmaw stuck in hand, making Mishra a huge wall and smashing my 1/1ís into it just isnít enough, especially with Merieke not able to untap and attack a second time. The first Ashiok uptick reveals three non-creatures (phew!) and the second reveals a Qasali and BoP I think. In the meanwhile I played a Prelate naming 2, he has a lot of CMC 2 spells. He gets a second Mishra and uses Ashiok to play the Qasali, giving me a target for the Shriekmaw which I play having decided to put five counters on Vial which is rewarded since I draw into GSZ, getting Ranger with it which allows me to Vial in Shriekmaw and destroy the Qasali and use the Merieke to control his Mishraís.

    G2: I mulligan to 4 or 5 I think , he plays loads of attrition (Smallpox, Toxic Deluge, Hymn, Sinkhole) and Pithing Needles my Vials. We do lots of topdecking and due to the Needle I canít play my topdeck, I actually draw a lot of lands and cheap creatures but he just destroys everything. He manages to play a few creatures and is about to win as time is called. Since neither of us would benefit from a 1-2-1 result I donít offer him the draw..

    Results: 1-0-1 this round. 2-2 in matches in total, 4-4-1 in games in total.
    MVP in my list: Scryb Ranger, Merieke
    MVP in the opponentís list: Pithing Needle, Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver, Toxic Deluge

    Final thoughts:
    All matchups were pretty even and I had loads of mulligans today. The large flexibility of the deck means there is room for improvement. Also I tend to do some mistakes every now and then, I'm by no means a perfect player. Which is easy to do when you have access to 50% of your deck every turn and as many interactions as an Elves deck.
    I want some discard. Maybe try to add 1 Thoughtseize, 1 Tidehollow Sculler and 1 Spell Queller (not really discard but similar interaction) and see how it goes.
    If I've counted correctly, with the last so-so results I'm now 24-9-1 in matches with this deck since October I think.

    Brewing:
    Also regarding Grand Architect, I like how it not only helps power out Walking Ballista but also keep pumping it up. Also with Trinket Mage you can both use Trinket Mage to tutor for the Ballista and with Architect around it's a 3/3 and helps cast and boost Ballista every turn. Since Architect ignores summuning sickness it means if you have an Architect in play you can use Vial @3 to create tempo by vialling in Trinket Mage and tapping it the same turn to cast the Ballista, effectively generating 2 mana by tapping the Vial.
    Edit: Master of Waves is pretty sweet with Grand Architect and random, expensive artifacts. Yes, all those tokens are now 3/2 thanks to architect and each tap for 2 mana. Absurd. Maybe Walking Ballista is enough to make this synergy good enough. Wurmcoil Engine and Batterskull are also both very playable and these have good synergy with the Goblin Welder that I would also like to play (but that is more for fun, powerful but fun).
    A genius friend suggested that Pili-pala gives infinite mana with Grand Architect. So that gives as a combo with Walking Ballista for example.
    Last edited by pettdan; 03-06-2017 at 09:58 AM.

  5. #125

    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Nice discussion as always: anyway, i've read many suggested ideas, and it's great because it's one of the best part of this deck =) but i think that we should look at 3 points to evaluate them:
    -Ease of building combo/synergy
    -Intrinsic force of the single cards (by themselves)
    -Impact when assembled

    For example, is going toward Architect and so on really strong? I mean, we don't have so many small cc blue creatures (only meddling mage, i think?) that you don't want to use for attacking or other abilities. But Trinket Mage could bring Basilisk Collar, which is a nice card by itself and become awesome with Staticaster or Balista, at a very low price. Or Nightshade Paddler in a heavy-gsz build, even more fast and cheaper.

    I think that we need to have a solid plan when we don't hit Fauna Shaman: years ago it was built around Tradewind Rider, now?
    Something like Nissa, voice + Opposition+ Gaea's Craddle+Equip+Mirror Entity: every card is synergic with the rest of the deck and pretty ok by itself, while having a massive impact on board when together (Craddle+Entity, Entity+ Nissa, Nissa+Oppo/Equip).

  6. #126
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    - I agree with Memories, Architect requires too much build-around, too many slots not worth the low power level.
    - Cradle+Entity are great to close out a game, especially the BGx games which board stall etc. or to finish a Miracle player without instant Terminus.
    - Nissa VOZ is interesting. I like how you can curve Nissa into Opposition and have 2 Plant Tokens. Sure, Garruk Relentless is a stronger card but both Garruk and Opposition at 4 Mana might make Nissa more attractive.
    I think it's definitely worth testing because it also works with TNN and stuff like Grenzo
    - with the strong presence of BGx especially BUG (thanks to Leovold and Fatal Push) and still Eldrazi, I will never play less than 2 Opposition.
    - problem is: you can't really fit in both Aether Vial AND Cradle/Entity/Nissa. I really really like the Vial version so I don't want to change a running system. Though Mirror Entity should work well in a Vial list,too.
    - Grenzo, Dungeon Warden is really good. If it lives, you don't NEED to commit any hand cards and try to build up the board by itself. Outside of combo matchups this should be fine.

  7. #127

    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Grenzo is one of my greatest regret about this deck: if only it hadn't been double linked to R and B, two "splash" color for us, it would have been a fu**ing beast and a great power up for us.
    I've tried many builds with him, but builds relying on him have to be almost all-creatures or cards that you want in the grave: a Nice build could be with Veteran Explorer, Recruiter, Cabal Therapy, Gaea's craddle and so on. Something we can probably work, i mean, recruiter is the perfect card with Grenzo.

    Obviously, Vial and cradle(and zenith, in some ways) are incompatible. I think that Nissa/Opposition/SFM is a good road to explore, but at this point you want Recruiter and not Fauna Shaman.

  8. #128
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Very nice to read your comments, thanks to you both for posting! I hope these comments are readable and coherent, it's a (wonderful) mess trying to discuss cards as there are so many aspects of everything but I need some sleep now so this will have to do. And I may have just used up a year's supplies of cards-tags..

    Memories, your criteria for evaluating combos are very relevant and I tend to carefully evaluate any combo like this. Unfortunately there are no combos that I'm aware of that are unquestionably strong in all aspects (creature based, each creature strong by itself etc), still I think having an unfair element in the list would be good - having a low power card in the deck may be worth it - or that is for experiments to validate.

    Is Grand Architect strong? This is what I'm also asking myself. Or rather, I think it is very strong, but how much do we need to build the deck around him? I prefer not changing more than 3-4 slots or I think we'll lose too much of other strengths and I don't want to change the whole deck right now. I think one of the strongest things about Grand Architect is that he can provide 6 extra mana around turn 3-4. Every blue creature becomes a Sol Ring, without summoning sickness and Scryb Ranger provides an extra. A boost of only 4 mana around turn 3-4 means you can play and equip an equipment - which is usually a back-breaking move. It also makes Batterskull playable, I believe, and in many situations you will be able to both play and equip Batterskull in the same turn. [edit: you have a good point in the need for cheaper blue creatures, however I would consider this as beneficial rather than necessary; just having a Scryb Ranger and GA gives 4 mana already, enough for casting or equiping Batterskull easily or any other equipment or using Ballista. Another approach could be playing a list with 2-3 Prelates and 2-3 Meddling Mages]

    As a side effect you get an (arguably) better Lord of Atlantis. I'm not saying the card is broken and I know how to play it, instead I want to say that this card has some potential and we can use it innovatively. It seems to me that the above two effects are good enough to motivate GA by itself. If you add the 2 mana 1/1 flier (Pili-pala) to that you get infinite mana of any colour. This is very easy to tutor up with Fauna Shaman and put into play with Vial (uncounterably). Having a 2 mana 1/1 creature in the deck is less of a dead card, especially with Fauna Shaman often around, than most combo elements in other combo decks. And a 2 mana creature representing potential infinite mana means your opponent may feel pressured to deal with it or play conservatively, this can work towards your advantage. The next question would be what we can do with this mana? Playing all creatures in your hand is already pretty good. In addition to that Walking Ballista wins on the spot while Shaman of the Great Hunt lets you draw and play any number of cards in your deck. And to repeat, all of these cards are seemingly good enough on their own, except for the 2 mana flying 1/1 creature..

    Trinket Mage with Basilisk Collar is interesting, it's analogous to Stoneforge Mystic with Umezawa's Jitte but enables tutoring for walking Ballista and Pithing Needle. It's hard for me to let go of the Jitte, but maybe it's worth playing both of them. That would mean replacing probably Shriekmaw and Pontiff. Thanks I'll consider it.

    About Opposition, it is a very strong card and if you're convinced it's what you want by all means play it. However, I think it's a bad move in a metagame defined(?) by Terminus and True-Name Nemesis; it's ignored by one of them and interacts negatively with the other. The meta evolves quickly but right now, and considering that I feel that fast decks are a weak spot, I would try other things. Also it's not tutorable in the deck so if you're building the deck on it you need several copies.

    I've also thought about Cradle and Nissa VOZ. They have some problems. Cradle can't be tutored for, so I would add KotR if I would play it. Once KotR is in I would also add Karakas. That however means watering the deck down, Cradle takes a creature slot and Karakas puts in a non-forest which weakens the mana base or replaces another creature. It can be done but it has a cost and I'm not sure it's worth it. I was thinking of perhaps playing Cradle, Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary and Grand Architect to have many different ways of providing lots of mana in a list, but I think it will be hard to build a list like that because you just have to take good, flexible, tutorable cards and change them into weaker non-tutorable cards. Karakas + Vial + Clique is really good though...

    Mirror Entity is very interesting, I just don't know what I would bring out for it. I didn't put a lot of thought into it but I feel like it does not provide enough control over the game. It's good if you have a lot of creatures in play, but if you have few creatures it does very little [edit: making it a little bit of a win-more card]. I can see how it can result in some blow-outs though so perhaps I should just try it once. I've been trying to find a way to make use of the ability to turn all your creatures into all creatures types, that could be what makes the difference.
    Last edited by pettdan; 03-08-2017 at 07:08 AM.

  9. #129
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    It appears someone else started revisiting Grand Architect based builds recently, and there are a lot of interesting ideas in that (modern) thread:

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...rand-Architect

    Edit: I'm going to test without red again. The first test games were vs Cloudpost and with Walking Ballista around (in the opponent's deck) I think that can be a tough matchup, so Magus of the Moon is probably going to stay in the sideboard. Edit again: On the other hand, Ballista answers Magus disturbingly well so something else is needed.
    Last edited by pettdan; 03-13-2017 at 03:54 PM.

  10. #130

    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    I think that the new Vizier of the Menagerie is one of the biggest additions of the recent years to this deck, probably. We have to create something that uses him heavily

  11. #131
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    I also have my eyes on him. He's similar to Grenzo and Meren in that he generates a lot of card advantage, but preferable over Grenzo since he's green. The disadvantage is that you'll be playing random creatures (similar to Grenzo while Meren lets you reuse certain bullets like Qasali), but that's still pretty good. Works well with Vial, using Vial to put him into play means you will have mana available to put a couple of other creatures into play during the same turn.

    He also helps with avoiding bad topdecks is nice (activate Fauna Shaman, play GSZ or fetch to shuffle) and the mana fixing can be useful. The mana fixing effect actually helps us playing around Blood Moon and we had problems with that before, both me and Alexeeezay.

  12. #132
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    This card looks very promising, I can't wait to play with it once Amonkhet's out and MKM Series Frankfurt is done!
    It obviously motivates a mana-dork/Cradle approach instead of Vials. With flash creatures and your usual fetchlands, it seems to be especially powerful.

  13. #133

    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Yep, it seems good with both Cradle and Vial. The more i try to make lists without Vial, the more i miss them, for the flexibility and the better management of your resources that vials give you.

  14. #134
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    https://www.channelfireball.com/vide...egacy-m-o-s-t/

    Look what we got here! Andrea Mengucci gave this deck a spin. Let's see how it goes.

  15. #135

    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alexeezay View Post
    https://www.channelfireball.com/vide...egacy-m-o-s-t/

    Look what we got here! Andrea Mengucci gave this deck a spin. Let's see how it goes.
    I'll talk to him if i can, i'm italian too =)
    Plus, this new girl too seems interesting

  16. #136

    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alexeezay View Post
    https://www.channelfireball.com/vide...egacy-m-o-s-t/

    Look what we got here! Andrea Mengucci gave this deck a spin. Let's see how it goes.
    Holy shit this deck actually looks more amazing when you're actually looking at all the cards at once.

  17. #137
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alexeezay View Post
    https://www.channelfireball.com/vide...egacy-m-o-s-t/

    Look what we got here! Andrea Mengucci gave this deck a spin. Let's see how it goes.
    Hello Guys, I'm new to the forum (and I discovered this tread only a few days ago) in the link on channelfireball you can see the list I passed to Mengucci to make the video. (to be precise I play 61 cards with +1 opposition)
    I'm an Italian guy and I play this deck from about 6/7 years.
    Unfortunately when I play I'm really a bad player, so I never made important results due to some mistakes...
    anyway nice to meet you all!

  18. #138
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    @Shaden: Great to have you here, Shaden, most welcome! I think I recognize your name from Tipo1.it too, I hope you'll share your thoughts and tournament results with us! :)

    @Alexeezay: Sweet find, now we can finally let curious people have a look at the deck in action. I'm very curious to watch it myself. Hopefully we'll get around to streaming games locally soon and then I'll try to get on camera too..

    @Memories: Samut seems nice, yes, he (she?) has a lot of relevant abilities. I think I still prefer Shaman of the Great hunt, since it both draws cards and generates +1/+1 counters, it's not legendary and it lets us keep Vial at 4 counters, but Samut packs a lot of utility in one card for sure.

    Another interesting card, perhaps not good enough, is Champion of Rhonas:



    Edit: I really hope there will be better exert creatures, since we can ignore the drawback (thanks to Scryb Ranger).
    Last edited by pettdan; 04-13-2017 at 06:26 AM.

  19. #139

    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    @Champion: it's almost Elvish Piper, that otherwise can be used every turn. Long time ago i tried Piper+Emrakul, but the second one was always in my open hand ^^" i don't think it's the better two card combo we can have.

    @Shaman of the great hunt: i don't think is enough good for us: spreading +1/+1 counters is good, but it's important especially in the first turn (when a Golgari charm can destroy you) and for creatures like mothers and dorks that can attack and deal damage to player almost never.

    @Shaden list: i think that this list is ok, probably i would play at least 1 Eladamri's Call that is perfect with Vial. Then i dunno, i think that Vizier is also very good with vial and i want to try it =)

  20. #140
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    Re: Trade Pod (Tradewind Rider Birthing Pod)

    I watched Andrea's games and it was nice. There were a number of play mistakes, which can also be expected when trying such an unconventional deck, but I wanted to mention it to anyone curious about the deck that it's perhaps not given full justice. Like not boarding in Rhox War Monk vs Delver decks and not using an active Tradewind Rider at eot. Still we're not spoiled with recorded action so that's great. Also 4 Meddling Mages is a controversial deck building decision with the advent of Sanctum Prelate, probably due to the FoW's, right Shaden?

    @Samut, Voice of Dissent vs Shaman of the Great Hunt: there are lots of things to consider in this comparison. Like I said I'm interested in Samut too, but the important things making Shaman seem better at first glance are that it isn't legendary (huge disadvantage for any card) + it's a card drawing engine all by itself (huge advantage) + it costs one mana less which means we can leave Vial at 4 where there are lots of other cards too. I'll get a copy to put in my MOST binder and for evaluating.

    Samut's advantages are giving haste to other creatures, which is a great ability but at 5 mana it's a bit late in the game, it would be much more useful on a card with CMC 3, or so I imagine; being able to untap other creatures is great, especially on a vigilance creature, but how often will you want to tap it down rather than use it for blocking? Also we already have the rangers for untapping things, paying 5 mana for a large Ranger is relevant but doesn't strike me as the greatest way to utilize a 5 drop. 5 drops should be more powerful, I only use 4 drops myself since they are powerful enough. An advantage is the double strike, with a sword attached or some exalted triggers he has great hitting power with haste. Samut is green and can be GSZ-ed for, which is really nice. Lacking evasion is an issue though, a single goblin token can potentially invalidate him. Shaman will still let fliers grow every turn (while drawing extra cards), so in that way Shaman has a kind of limited evasion.

    You mention that Shaman doesn't give counters in the first turns when it's crucial for protection vs Golgari Charm and also doesn't help protect Mothers. I have a couple of responses to that: 1) Samut doesn't give any counters at all right, and comparing Shaman to cards that are played mostly for the token generation need to take into account that it's only a nice side bonus for the Shaman who has other merits; 2) you can play Shaman turn 3 and attack with a Mother to put a counter on it, I wouldn't find that entirely bad, especially if there is a Scryb Ranger around for untapping the Mother if needed; 3) If you keep a Mother untapped and put counters on 4-5 other creatures you quickly enter the situation where you don't need the Mother any more, if it's answered you still have an army of growing beaters that quickly finish the opponent off. In such a situation it may even potentially be to your advantage that the opponent draws the charm, rather than a card that could have dealt with your growing army.

    @Champion of Rhonas: I think it may be slightly better than Elvish Piper, I realize that may be wrong but having a 3/3 body is an advantage and having a 1/1 body is more like a liability. Also once you've attacked with the Champion once, then you have already got what you wanted out of it, and your opponent will now need to take care of the attacking creature especially since an attack the next turn can potentially cause some more damage in terms of putting creatures into play. It lets the card interact with the opponent in two ways while the Piper only works in 1 way. With that said I still think it's perhaps not good enough to be played.

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