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Thread: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

  1. #2601
    shallow
    .dk's Avatar
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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Quote Originally Posted by DNSolver View Post
    I am building a BR list to save a little money on blue lands. My deck is probably a bit inferior right out of the gates, but please let me know what y'all think:

    4 Entomb
    4 Faithless Looting
    4 Shallow Grave
    4 Goryo's Vengeance
    2 Reanimate
    4 Thoughtseize
    4 Cabal Therapy
    4 Gitaxian Probe
    4 Griselbrand
    1 Emrakul
    1 Children of Korlis
    4 Badlands
    4 Polluted Delta
    2 Swamp
    3 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Dark Ritual
    4 Lotus Petal
    1 Simian Spirit Guide
    2 Chrome Mox

    SB: work in progress, definitely including 3 Pithing Needle, 2 Lightning Bolt (for containment priest),
    considering 2 Duress, 2 Pyroblast, 2 Massacre, 2 Tormod's Crypt, 2 Young Pyromancer as the rest of the slots
    If you're in red, why not run Burning Wish?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    His graveyard was a fucking encyclopedia of countermagic.

  2. #2602

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    I imagine if I was running Burning Wish I would trim:

    -2 Goryo's Vengeance
    -1 Simian Spirit Guide
    -1 Reanimate

    or something to that effect? Or would I cut more mana / less action or what? And then in my sideboard I would have:

    1 Tendrils
    1 Empty the Warrens
    1 Reanimate
    1 Exhume
    2 Duress
    1 Meltdown
    1 Massacre
    1 Pyroclasm
    1 Stronghold Gambit
    1 Raven's Crime (to discard Griz in a pinch, already running 4 Looting and don't have blue for Careful Study)

    all as wish targets? That leaves 4 slots for 2 Tormod's Crypt and 2 Pithing Needle?

    Edit: or even 1 Firebolt as another wish target for only an active DRS to deal with. Does our deck want Blood Moon out of the sidebaord to deal with the annoying 4-color Delver deck with DRS and Surgical? That gives us inevitability because eventually we draw our swamp, make him discard all his counters, then play fast mana into hardcast Griz when the coast is clear?

  3. #2603
    shallow
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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    You may consider running LEDs maindeck if you're on Burning Wish as well, similar to Pomegrant's build.

    For your wish targets - why not Thoughtseize of Duress? That can act as your discard outlet as well and you can cut Raven's Crime. Other than that, seems just fine. Run some Needles and Chain of Vapor or the like. Blood Moon seems to not go very well with the rest of the deck, but try it and see?
    Find me on Twitter: @beanaman

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    His graveyard was a fucking encyclopedia of countermagic.

  4. #2604

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    What do you guys think of this list?

    http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=96050

    The 2 Children, 2 Chrome Mox, and 13 lands is a bit different, but I'm inclined to agree with it, for there are so many times I can't get that extra bit to keep the onions bursting.

  5. #2605
    shallow
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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    That was a config a few of us ran a couple years ago - 2 Chrome Mox and 2 Children. Given the goldfishing data a few of us put together recently, I actually don't see a good case for a 6th non-land IMS nor a 2nd Children. The amount of times the deck fizzled doesn't justify those slots - the few cases where you do fizzle, you can almost always at least rip their hand apart with discard and win on the following turn.
    Find me on Twitter: @beanaman

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    His graveyard was a fucking encyclopedia of countermagic.

  6. #2606
    Sir Phobos
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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Quote Originally Posted by TTX View Post
    What do you guys think of this list?

    http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=96050

    The 2 Children, 2 Chrome Mox, and 13 lands is a bit different, but I'm inclined to agree with it, for there are so many times I can't get that extra bit to keep the onions bursting.
    It's effectively the older list from 2013, if you go back and look at Koby's top 8 list from that year you'll see a lot of similarities. It's not BAD, but 2 Children didn't play super well, so by the time you get to my list from later that year, you'll see that we dropped the Mox and Children for LDV.

    He also dropped Tendrils and 1 Probe for the 2 Jace.


    Deck still performs very well, but when you get to the marginal rates, those small differences do count.
    Tinfins & Bizarro Stormy & Belcher & DDFT
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    Quote Originally Posted by .dk View Post
    Acclimation has solved the deck. Thread CLOSED.

  7. #2607

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Thanks guys for clarifying. I'm planning on running a list very similar to .dks in the upcoming Cincinnati SCG.
    However I'm considering sideboarding a creature I can bring in that is not Legendary due to the large
    field of Karakas and such, something like Worldspine Wurm or Ashen Rider, when I'm not going full Mentor,
    such as matchups against Death and Taxes or Maverick, cause sometimes Pithing Needle isn't found for Karakas in time.

    4 Monastery Mentor
    3 Dark Confidant
    2 Serenity
    2 Pithing Needle
    2 Chain of Vapor
    1 Cavern of Souls
    1 Worldspine Wurm/Ashen Rider

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by TTX; 12-10-2015 at 03:09 PM.

  8. #2608

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Originally I wanted to play RUG Lands this Saturday for the weekly legacy event but I can't find my crop rotations anywhere so that was put on the sidelines. I looked for some uncommon decks and saw that I had enough cards to build Tin Fins. I was looking through my cards, I saw I had some of the Doomsday cards but no shelldock isle, so I decided to go with...some bootleg transformational sideboard. I'm sure you guys here would rip this deck apart.

    Deck: Barf out Spells or Spaghetti and Hopefully Win.dec

    Counts : 60 main / 15 sideboard

    Creatures:5
    1 Children of Korlis
    3 Griselbrand
    1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn

    Spells:41
    1 Chrome Mox
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Cabal Therapy
    4 Dark Ritual
    4 Entomb
    4 Gitaxian Probe
    1 Orim's Chant
    2 Ponder
    1 Reanimate
    2 Thoughtseize
    3 Goryo's Vengeance
    2 Lim-Dul's Vault
    4 Shallow Grave
    1 Tendrils of Agony

    Lands:14
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Polluted Delta
    1 Scrubland
    1 Swamp
    1 Tundra
    3 Underground Sea

    Sideboard:15
    4 Vampire Hexmage
    2 Show and Tell
    1 Massacre
    1 Dark Petition
    2 Dark Depths
    2 Thespian's Stage
    3 Tolaria West

    I had no Beseech the Queens for tutor effects so I yanked out the Tolaria Wests from Lands to tutor up the dark depths combo. Dark Petition serves as an alternative way to do that. Vampire Hexmage is a 4 of so I can either Entomb for it or Naturually Draw. Show and Tell just because I expect them to go hard on grave hate, and has served me well in Reanimator.

  9. #2609

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Been working on this Archtype for the past week, it looked sweet and super powerful. I started with Pomegrant's list and played about 30 games before I started tweaking. I realized the games I lost where because I tried to sit back, ponder and sculpt which this deck does not seem to do well. We gun it in the 1st 2 turns and make them have the force. For these games ponder is trash, the only time we want it is AFTER we go off and fail which at that point we might as well concede. I have been playing TES for awhile so this gameplan of gun it felt familiar and then I thought, what if we mesh them. Infernal tutor is another 3 shallow graves/Wishes, we get to beat a deathrite game 1 with empty AND we can adopt the decay plan postboard. Decay is even more insane for us than TES because we are weak to cage and relic. There are a few other things I am trying like Unmask to make us even faster and grudge to turn Entombs into answers for Null rod/relic. 7-2 with this build currently and it has been feeling really smooth, still have the issue of not finding griseldaddy but thats just part of the deck. LMK what you think.

    Tinsel Fins (Its Christmas Eve and the deck is splashing green sooooo...)

    Creatures [5]
    1 Children of Korlis
    1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    3 Griselbrand

    Spells [42]
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Burning Wish
    3 Cabal Therapy
    1 Chrome Mox
    4 Dark Ritual
    1 Empty the Warrens
    4 Entomb
    4 Gitaxian Probe
    3 Infernal Tutor
    4 Lion's Eye Diamond
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Shallow Grave
    2 Unmask

    Lands [13]
    1 Badlands
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Polluted Delta
    1 Swamp
    2 Underground Sea
    1 Volcanic Island

    SIDEBOARD
    3 Abrupt Decay
    1 Ancient Grudge
    1 Bayou
    1 Day's Undoing
    1 Duress
    1 Empty the Warrens
    1 Exhume
    1 Massacre
    1 Meltdown
    1 Pyroclasm
    1 Reanimate
    1 Tendrils of Agony
    1 Void Snare

  10. #2610

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Your list is interesting. I understand what you mean about Ponder but I think it's not necessarily correct. Yes, Ponder is bad when you're trying to put multiple cards together when winning on turn one, but it's crucial for sculpting into turn two. Ponder helps a ton when you're looking for your second land or trying to find just one piece of the puzzle. It's also nice as a shuffle effect with Brainstorm if you don't have a fetchland. It's not as good as Brainstorm for sure but I think removing it completely from the deck is probably incorrect. This is a fast combo deck for sure, but I think it's not in the vein of Belcher style in which you just jam and pray. Sure, sometimes you go for it, but I think the way the deck works is that you have more options afforded to you to play around counter magic/hate cards. Winning on turn three isn't "too slow" against the majority of the format.

    Infernal Tutor is a card that I haven't played with but thought about a lot. It's obviously very strong with LED just as Burning Wish is. However, it's much worse if you don't have an LED (which makes sense that you're playing four) and if you need to just cast it, it probably isn't doing what you want. I don't like how inflexible it is as compared to Burning Wish, because with Wish you can set something up over two turns. One of the bigger lines being Burning Wish into Show and Tell. I also don't like Infernal Tutor because of how it makes you want to build the storm cards back into the maindeck. I think some of the power level of the Burning Wish is moving cards into your sideboard so you can have a lot more copies of it.

    I stopped playing with Abrupt Decay a long time ago mostly because it was really hard to cast and you had to fetch for terrible lands to enable it. The color requirements of this deck are way harder than just the UB version because in the same turn it's possible to need u, r, and b to combo. I think Abrupt Decay just makes it somewhat card to figure that all out in the equation and the reason I switched to just playing with Chain of Vapors. Only being one mana is a huge upside and you can just bounce something end step then untap and combo. Abrupt Decay obviously helps a ton against Miracles, but I think that match up is abysmal regardless of having access to Abrupt Decay.

    In general though, I think if you're doing well with whatever version or build then it's positive. The core of the deck is so powerful that you can build things around it anyway you want. I like Unmask even though I think the black card count is a bit low, but it's really nice to pluck something on turn one for no mana and then combo off. I think Infernal Tutor has merits and is something I'll have to work with to figure out if it's good or not.

  11. #2611

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Quote Originally Posted by TTX View Post
    What do you guys think of this list?

    http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=96050

    The 2 Children, 2 Chrome Mox, and 13 lands is a bit different, but I'm inclined to agree with it, for there are so many times I can't get that extra bit to keep the onions bursting.
    2 Mox + 13 land isn't very remarkable at all; 2 children isn't that unusual either (although I do think just having the one is more common, and better).

    I really, really don't like Jace in this deck at all - and I'm a big fan of the new Jace in legacy. All you have to do to figure out how useful he is is answer these two questions and think about how poorly the answers match up to one another - What turn do you want to win the game on? What turns is Jace useful on?

    Finally, whilst I do like the Show and Tell sideboard package, I think it's utterly ridiculous to just run 3 Show and 3 bombs and expect to actually get there. Like, ever. If you're going to do it, do it properly - 4 Show, and at least 7 things to drop in (if not more). You should possibly even have either Ancient Tomb and/or Boseiju to power it out.

  12. #2612

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    I decided to upgrade my Griselbrands to make them Tin Fins worthy. This is the first one.....



  13. #2613

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Spectacular


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  14. #2614
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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Quote Originally Posted by TTX View Post
    Thanks guys for clarifying. I'm planning on running a list very similar to .dks in the upcoming Cincinnati SCG.
    However I'm considering sideboarding a creature I can bring in that is not Legendary due to the large
    field of Karakas and such, something like Worldspine Wurm or Ashen Rider, when I'm not going full Mentor,
    such as matchups against Death and Taxes or Maverick, cause sometimes Pithing Needle isn't found for Karakas in time.

    4 Monastery Mentor
    3 Dark Confidant
    2 Serenity
    2 Pithing Needle
    2 Chain of Vapor
    1 Cavern of Souls
    1 Worldspine Wurm/Ashen Rider

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    how did worldspine wurm / ashen rider work out for you in testing?

  15. #2615

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    The Big Wurmie is really good against decks like Death and Taxes and Miracles, got to have the Cabal Therapy to go along with it. Ashen Rider I really like for its removal of pesky permanents like needles, revokers, and bridges, but it doesn't have the same firepower as the Wurm. I did not end up playing TinFins at the larger tournament, though I should have...I played Bg ChalicePox and went 3-4.


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  16. #2616
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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Would you have had better matchups with tinfins in the tournament? what matchups were you up against.

    The wurm is hilarious. You sold me. I'm gonna give it a run.

  17. #2617

    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    For non-transformational sideboards, what gets cut to bring in bounce or removal?

  18. #2618
    shallow
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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Typically you'll board out some Gitaxian Probes and/or Ponders depending on the matchup. I don't like to take out LDV in these cases as it will help you find your sideboard pieces when you need them sometimes. Could also potentially take out the singleton Reanimate depending on the matchup as well.
    Find me on Twitter: @beanaman

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    His graveyard was a fucking encyclopedia of countermagic.

  19. #2619
    Vintage

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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Nothing new to report, except the Bob / Mentor SB has been working great. Went 3-0-1 in a weekly Legacy event, dropping zero games then drawing with my ride in the last round. I defeated Miracles (Stoneblade variant), MUD, and Enchantress along the way. Every game 1 we go nuts. Against the first two decks (heavy lock), I bring in the creatures and take out the combo. Against Enchantress, I elected just for Bounce / Serenity & Needle, taking out 1 Goryo's Vengeance, 2 Probes, and 1 Ponder. Guess I didn't need too much since I had turn 1 Reanimate Griselbrand vs Enchantress however.

    Mentor is pretty damn good. Really impressed with it lately, in most of Legacy decks too.
    West side
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  20. #2620
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    Re: [Deck] TinFins 3: Return of the Onion Burst

    Hi Koby, do you have a decklist for what you played?

    Can you explain why you took out goryo vengeance against enchantress? I would think we want all our combo parts in there.

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