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    [Deck] 12 Post

    Turbo Eldrazi


    Turbo Eldrazi, or 12post as most folks will name it, is a ramp deck with a very narrow core card list. Because of this the potential cards are large and because of the inordinate amount of mana you can generate the cardpool is increasingly magnified.

    The core:
    4 [TSP] Vesuva
    1 [WWK] Eye of Ugin
    4 [SOM] Glimmerpost
    4 [FNM] Cloudpost
    1 [ROE] Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    1 [ROE] Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
    1 [ROE] Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre

    Because this core constitutes a good chunk of your manabase it leaves the remainder of the deck up for considerable variation. The weakness of a deck where you are strongly encouraged to plant one of 4 cards into play, Cloudpost, is when your mana and selection are pressured. Thus increasing land tutors and hand improvement is paramount. That leaves us with an addition of some fixing.

    Supplemental spells:
    [M11] Primeval Titan
    [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
    [5E] Brainstorm
    [UL] Crop Rotation
    [ZEN] Expedition Map

    Finally there is a need for acceleration

    [AQ] Candelabra of Tawnos
    [US] Show and Tell

    and removal/protection

    [GP] Repeal
    [M10] Pithing Needle
    [IA] Glacial Chasm
    [LG] Karakas
    [CMD] Bojuka Bog

    It is in this last portion that the most variation is introduced and often the modifications to this will adapt the deck to your particular meta.

    Since combo will give you the hardest time and the core of your deck is your mana base, you can afford to side in heavy amounts of cards without diluting your deck's potency, merely its kill's consistency. Since against combo you rarely care about winning before them, this is not a problem.


    The concept of the deck is simple enough. You sacrifice early tempo and board control for late game overwhelming advantage through uncounterable win conditions, removal, and damage.

    The difficulty of the deck is that your average archetype in legacy involves 2-3 decisions per turn with diminishing choices after the first three turns. Turbo Eldrazi is the exact opposite. You often have 1-2 decisions in the first two turns, and every turn thereafter the number of choices increases exponentially. By your turn 4-5 you often have to make more decisions than a normal deck makes in 3 games of magic. Compounded on this increase in number of choices, your first few choices have incredibly large impact for the remainder of the game. As a teammate Scott Hughes aptly stated, "With this deck you can play the wrong land on turn 1 and lose the game for yourself."

    That being said, the most successful variant of the deck is as a Control deck that has the ability to combo finish.

    Combo, especially random combo, is Eldrazi's hardest matchup. The reason is that restricting both the timeframe to build up mana and the avenue to interrupt their combo is the best way to counteract the holistic and inevitable defeat that Turbo Eldrazi brings to a matchup. Waiting will always result in a loss against Turbo Eldrazi, there is no competitive deck with a greater endgame.


    Hand Keeping and starting concepts
    Hand keeping is the most important skill with this deck. I have often said that if you aren't blown out by turn 3, you should win that game, and hand keeping is paramount to achieving that. Manafixing/preserving and a constant flow of land drops are your major early concerns so your starting hand will influence how you enable this flow. It is for this reason that I suggest heavy playtesting for anyone who wants to have success with the deck at competitive events. My best simple guide to hand keeping would best be put as a priority of axioms and some general rules.

    Don't keep hands without turn 1-2 plays.
    - The deck runs 21 cmc 1 spells on turn 1. Often you are clearing the counter-wall path for a crop rotation to resolve later, so don't be afraid of throwing spells into dazes and pierces early on if you have more relevant spells after them. My priority of willingness-to-get-countered in the early game is from lowest importance to greatest: Candelabra -> Pithing Needle -> Map -> Brainstorm -> Sensei's Divining Top -> Crop Rotation. As the game progresses those priorities shift, but for the purpose of opening hands I keep the more I have of cards on the higher importance group, with a caveat of multiple crop rotations not being strong.

    Don't keep hands that require you to be unmolested for several turns in regards to discard/destruction.
    - Have faith in the deck. I will often keep hands of 5-6 lands if there are Cloudposts in them or if the remaining 1-2 cards are strong cmc 1 spells like Brainstorm, SDT, or Crop rotation.

    Keeping hands with Eldrazis in them are essentially mulligans to X-y, where X is your hand size, and y is the number of Eldrazis in your hand.
    - This is not true of Primeval titans, since they are castable on turn 3 with candelabras and normal conditions, or on turn 5-6 under duress.

    Don't keep hands on Show & Tell.
    - Show & Tell is your plan B, not plan A. Plan A is sit around, not be pressured due to repeal/bog/karakas/Hatecards doing their jobs, and then casting your stuff. Show and Tell can be a supplement to your hand, but it should never be its primary goal and only avenue.

    Don't be afraid of having Cloudposts get Wastelanded early.
    - I will often play Cloudpost on the blind my first turn if possible if I don't have a needle or crop rotation, since it means that they MUST wasteland it that turn or fear me drawing into more answers. Most importantly, it means they cannot develop delvers/heirarchs/vials/lackeys. Hesitating with this deck can easily cause you to lose matches you would otherwise crush.
    - Keep in mind that this logic is turned on itself when on the draw, where they can play their Turn 1 board advancement, and then wasteland your tapped Cloudpost while maintaining pressure.

    Keep hands entirely differently based off playing or drawing.
    - One of your best cards on the play is Repeal, but it becomes one of the worst on the draw.
    - Against a blind opponent Pithing needle is weak on the play, but strong on the draw. The opposite is true against a known opponent.
    - SDT is amazing on the play, but weaker on the draw. Despite it being weaker on the draw, it is still one of your strongest turn 1 plays.
    - Hate lands, such as Tabernacle, Bog, Karakas, are stronger on the draw after they commit. Obviously Glacial chasm is weaker on the draw due to needing two land drops.

    Dangerous and Risky keeps
    - Low mana hands are your most dangerous keeps. they MUST have either multiple SDT's and/or brainstorms, with a clear path to additional mana and/or shuffle effects for increasing your odds of drawing mana should you see none.
    - All colorless mana source (this includes bog/karakas) hands are dangerous if you have brainstorms and repeals as your only cantrips. Despite this, Vesuva, Expedition Map, SDT, and actual colored sources as outs are an extensive list of outs, so I list this hand as not dangerous.
    - All colored mana source hands are not risky at all. Crop rotations can easily convert 4 colored mana sources into a Primeval titan, or 7 mana for eye of Ugin.
    - Keeping complex hands are ok. Keeping a hand of Trop, Brainstorm, Brainstorm, Crop Rotation, Crop rotation, X, X is ok if you are on the play, and riskier on the draw, but not the end of the world thalia/Chalice-withstanding. In this situation you brainstorm their eot, keeping Crop rotation up at all times for a response to wasteland, brainstorm eot, if you see nothing you crop rotate in upkeep to shuffle, draw and hope, if you see nothing brainstorm in your turn and now you've looked at 7 additional cards for a land and can still shuffle in your next upkeep should the worst happen.



    Matchup Analysis and linchpin suggestions:

    RUG:
    This matchup is entirely dependant on your build, but comes down to what removal spells you are running and what sideboard options you have against them. Chalice is not a strong choice against them since despite them running massive numbers of 1 CmC spells, you do as well and their threats come down first. Better answered involve hindering their mana, which is often streamlined to be spent every turn. Wasteland hugely hurts them, sphere-type effects are ok, but best are propaganda type effects, which force them to choose between damage or board advancement. Elephant Grass is the best answer at the moment. Repeal hits transformed Delvers for 1 mana and draws a card. Candelabra is a liability since they lose to Show & Tell -> anything, which normally is not the case. If they do not have threats then just play land drops and pass. Never walk into counters with crop rotations if possible.

    Maverick:
    Show & Tell for Primeval Titan should be your main goal in this matchup. Pithing Needle as usual always names wasteland. Don't try to get cute and name things that aren't wasteland like Knight of the Reliquary or Qasali Pridemage. Wasteland for all needles all day long. In comes
    The Tabernacle. If they run Armageddon then put in counters, namely Flusterstorm.

    SneakyShow/Omnishow:
    This is a brutal matchup as you run Show & Tell as well and can't afford to go for it against them. Game one is horrendously against your favor and comes down to absurd situations like repealing Omnishow or hoping they go for infinite-mana kill and glacial chasm'ing in response. Game two Venser comes in with all your counters. The goal should just become put Venser in your hand, and put karakas in play to bounce it indefinitely. Obviously side out Show & Tells. Be prepared for Blood Moon, Rebs and Overmaster. If they are running Sneak attack always name Sneak Attack first with Pithing needle, Sneak attack Second, Sneak attack third. If omnishow name Griselbrand. You go positive match percentage if you include three games, if two games then you are slightly lower than favorable.

    U/W Miracles:
    This matchup is vastly in your favor. While counterbalance hits many of your spells, the lack of threats allows you to simply wait and win against any number of counterspells. The only way they can beat you is early clique with counterbalance & top, or counterbalance top and an early Entreat. Humility doesn't stop you, only hinders your Primeval Titan plan.

    Goblins/Affinity/Merfolk:
    After your life total is in the 10-14 range, you should prioritize glacial chasm. Stabilizing for 3 turns should be plenty to Show & Tell a Titan or achieve Eldrazi love. Post side Tabernacle comes in, Elephant Grass is great. Revoker can come in if you feel you need the blockers, but pithing needle is often the superior choice.

    TES/Storm:
    Game 1 your only real avenue of play is Bojuka bog to throw off cabal therapy math, gain massive life from a Show & Tell'd Titan, or repeal a chrome mox in response to infernal tutor'ing. Game Two you bring in massive counters, Tabernacle, and an often-changing sideboard hate array. needle is no good, I side out maps often, 2 eldrazis, 1-2 titans. Keep in your brainstorms as on-top counters win games. If you're playing against 5c, realize you will need multiple counters, one for silence and one for their kill.

    High Tide:
    Your "best" combo matchup. They can't Brain freeze you without incredibly large effort. Still, game one is a nightmare. Needle or stop their candelabras, but Really just go to game 2. Side in Venser (on island), Traps, Chalices, Flusters, the whole shabang. You can safely side out chasm and bog, needles, Show & tell, all is dust. I alternate between if I like Show & Tell in this matchup or not. Still not sure after 100s of tested games.

    New Matchups added for recent meta:

    Death and Taxes:
    This is a taxing control deck so treat it as such. Show & Tell Titan often blows them out, and you very rarely get to Eldrazi-casting mana levels. Titan is your plan 90% of the time. Never ever ever keep low mana hands against these guys. A 7 land hand is a snap-keep hand against anything taxing. Needle naming usually go in this order: AEther Vial, Wasteland, Rishadan Port. If Mangara is lingering about you name it of course, and the same for unequipped equipment. There are only two real threats in the deck, Aven Mindcensor and Cataclysm. You can be prepared for both by siding in Force of will or Swan Song.

    Merfolk:
    The true remnant of the aggro decks, this deck will lord-kill you on turn 4-5. Again you name AEther Vial first, then Wasteland. Glacial Chasm is often an easy win aveune against them. Don't be afraid to seemingly set yourself back on lands if you know you can vesuva later or have crop rotates. Do the math on how many turns you're saving with cumulative upkeep versus their attacks when you're deciding the turn to chasm. Show & Tell Titan is your main plan here again. Sweepers are awkwardly weak against this archetype, but cards like moment's peace are incredible.

    Belcher:
    Pithing Needle or chasm are your only plans game 1. This is winnable but mostly requires scouting or luck with their deck pittering out. Very rarely they'll go for a past in flames plan, which lets you crop-bog them. Game two your whole sideboard comes in and at that point the only enemy is the clock.

    Nic Fit:
    Easiest matchup ever. They don't interact with you. Just plow them over. I think you could roll dice for what card to play each turn and still bulldoze them.

    Painter:
    So long as you don't get greedy with your land searching this matchup is quite easy. Having innate protection against grindstone combo is great. Needle mucks them up, and they just become a 2/2 aggro deck game 1. Don't fetch out one basic only to get the land reb'd. Vesuva copies supertypes so vesuva'd basics are basic lands under blood moon. Important to remember that you can't use Eye of Ugin with Painter out since the creature isn't colorless. Just play for a slow-grindy match and you'll win. Jaya is the only real threat. Game two you bring in Revokers/Grips/Forces/Planeswalkers and just roll them.

    BuG:
    One of your harder matchups at the moment, but by no means hard. Needle on Lilly is often the plan, but sometimes you have repeals to infinity and wasteland is the better play. Don't not-name wasteland with a crop rotate in hand because BuG specializes in making your play off the top. One of the reasons why SDT is your best card in this matchup. Ensnaring Bridge, Planeswalkers, Show & Tell Titan are all incredible plays. Assume every Titan is going to be liliana'd.

    URW Delver:
    Easiest of all the delver decks. THey run STP and Bolt main, and their counters rely on taxed mana which you blast by, but they lack the cantrips or stifles of RuG. Similar to rug they rarely run artifact removal on the main so Needle will stick all of G1 and thus cementing Glacial Chasm. Game two you bring in bridge and grips.

    Sneak And Show:
    Game 1 you're hoping for them to blind Show & Tell a monster, and you put in a monster that attacks first or that tutors up karakas. Your only name on Pithing needle is Sneak Attack. Revoker comes in and you should expect blood moon. Game 2-3 can go very long so watch your timely play. Expect Jace and Through the Breach.

    Reanimator:
    Crop Rotation is your go-to responsive answer either for bojuka bog or Karakas. Don't be afraid to Show & Tell a titan against them even though that seems suicidal. Game two you side out titans though and the match becomes truly grindy. Side in counters. The only creatures you have to actually deal with are ashen rider and tidespout tyrant.

    Elves:
    Main deck you win by getting Glacial Chasm versus their Craterhoof Behemoth plan. Game two you can go a counter plan or chasm+needle and hope they don't get their removal before you win. My preferred method is a mix of both. Moment's Peace is great versus these guys. Pithing needle should name Deathrite Shaman, then Wirewood symbiote. Get two out for the viridian shaman.

    3rd Set of new matchups
    Food Chain:
    This matchup entirely depends on where/if you run Phyrexian Revoker. If you do, your plan is windmill it asap. Dig and windmill. Remember that Ugin can tutor Revokers. so 9 mana is your beakpoint of 7 mana to tutor, 2 to cast. Their secondary plan of aggro with 3/3 flyers doesn't work against Turbo Eldrazi because we have such absurd life gain and chasm.

    Big Red:
    This deck is blood moon, Chalice @ 1, Storage Counter Red Lands, 2 Tapping Lands, Seething song, Sneak Attack, Through the Breech, and Pyromancy with enormous bricks. Sadly this is easily your worst matchup in all of Legacy. Their explosiveness is extremely difficult to interact with, Show and Tell is dead versus them (unlike every other blood moon deck), they don't slow down with their hate cards, and their speed is impressive. Ensnaring bridge is your best bet versus them, but you need to survive until turn 3-4. Still then Pyromancy can end you. Revokers, needles, Engineered Explosives and all your counterspells should come in. Essentially 15 cards.

    Ichorid:
    This isn't new but apparently I didn't have the deck listed as matchups. This matchup comes down to show & tells and crop rotates. Crop rotate is your supreme silver bullet. Wait for them to dig deep and then respond to narcomoeba trigger(s) with a crop rotate for bojuka bog. Pithing needle can slow them down on Putrid Imp, or Cephalid Coliseum. And if they are going slowly, Phyrexian revoker on LED is strong. Remember you can also Phyrexian Revoke "Street Wraith." Game 1, pre Ashen Riders, they often have zero outs to Glacial Chasm. Be prepared for them to bring in Leyline of Singularity to stop Bojuka bog. Show & Tell Titan is again your trump play.

    Lands:
    You would think that recurring wasteland.deck is a bad matchup, but that couldn't be further from the truth. The key to this matchup is tactfully playing your bojuka bog. Not letting them waste your bojuka bog before you're vesuva'ing it. And not forgetting that you need to keep up bounce for their marit liege. If you do 2 of these actions once in one game, they lose all their steam. Pithing needle stops them cold. Simply play safe and passive.

    GIANT WARNING!
    While the core of this deck is set in stone, the entire sideboard and 5-7 slots main are flex slots. They are adaptable based on meta shifts and/or exploratory builds. I often change my deck weekly and sometimes daily within these shifting slots. I will post my newest lists that are successful, but if you dislike oft-changing lists, this may not be the best deck for you.




    Ask for More Matchup breakdowns and I will include them


    Current list as of Sept 16:
    // Lands
    2 [10E] Island (3)
    4 [FNM] Cloudpost
    1 [LG] Karakas
    4 [SOM] Glimmerpost
    1 [TSP] Vesuva
    4 [A] Tropical Island
    4 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
    1 [WWK] Eye of Ugin
    2 [AVR] Cavern of Souls
    1 [WWK] Bojuka Bog
    1 [M15] Forest (3)
    1 [IA] Glacial Chasm

    // Creatures
    1 [PRE] Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    4 [M12] Primeval Titan
    2 [SOM] Platinum Emperion

    // Spells
    4 [TSP] Trickbind
    3 [ZEN] Expedition Map
    4 [US] Show and Tell
    4 [MM] Brainstorm
    2 [TSP] Wipe Away
    1 [AQ] Candelabra of Tawnos
    2 [ALA] Relic of Progenitus
    4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
    3 [UL] Crop Rotation

    // Sideboard
    SB: 3 [CMD] Flusterstorm
    SB: 2 [NPH] Surgical Extraction
    SB: 3 [FNM] Krosan Grip
    SB: 3 [WWK] Nature's Claim
    SB: 2 [FD] Engineered Explosives
    SB: 2 [NPH] Dismember


    Card Availability and Choices:

    **SPACE RESERVED**
    **SPACE RESERVED**
    **SPACE RESERVED**
    **SPACE RESERVED**
    **SPACE RESERVED**
    Last edited by Rock Lee; 09-16-2015 at 10:40 AM.

  2. #2
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Space Reserved

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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Finally. This deserved a proper thread here.

    Any thoughts on the GW and mono Green 12-Post lists that have been showing up recently? I'd cite some lists but it may not be necessary.

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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Quote Originally Posted by Zirath View Post
    Finally. This deserved a proper thread here.

    Any thoughts on the GW and mono Green 12-Post lists that have been showing up recently? I'd cite some lists but it may not be necessary.
    the GW Euro lists are honestly more Maverick than they are Turbo Eldrazi. Turbo Eldrazi is a control deck through and through. It is defined by its manabase, but not inclusive of other decks because of it. For Example the MUD list that relatively recently top 32'd a SCG with Cloudpost as its manabase isn't Turbo Eldrazi. The Euro lists are often GSZ based and mostly focused on board supremacy over card advantage and late game dominance. I have tested every list of GW that has done well, and while they are ok in their own lights, I feel like Maverick was simply stronger than them.

    The mono Green lists I mention several times in the Development thread, but to simplify it, If combo becomes less prevalent and Glacial chasm stops a larger portion of the meta, without Abrupt decay seeing play, then Mono Green could become the wiser play. Running Forest's only real benefit is that it gets around Magus of the Moon, which in an abrupt-decay Deathrite-Shaman enabled meta, seems foolhardy.

  5. #5
    Don't Tell Stacy
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    You should ironically use the artwork for Lay Bare as the cover picture in the OP.
    Quote Originally Posted by Koby View Post
    My love for Valakut knows no bounds. It mise well read:
    Land - Super Duper Mountain
    When you play a land, LIGHTNING BOLT!
    Quote Originally Posted by EpicLevelCommoner View Post
    Strange as it may seem, this deck seems like the best place for Ruhan of the Fomori. A 7/7 with the right equipment will end games nightmarishly quick, and it comes with the perk of being blue to pitch to Force of Will if you draw into extra copies. And it wouldn't be too hard to protect him in counter-heavy build.
    Follow me on Twitter @RaNDoMxGeSTuReS

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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Quote Originally Posted by RaNDoMxGeSTuReS View Post
    You should ironically use the artwork for Lay Bare as the cover picture in the OP.
    I love that image of Kozilek. The sheer power and aura of doom they are imbuing to those paltry soldiers is exactly what Turbo Eldrazi does to players. I used to play Control Slaver in Vintage simply because I sadistically loved seeing people want to gouge their own eyes out. Turbo Eldrazi has the same effect.

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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Just to clarify, I'm not offended, I just want to have discussion about actual game situations. I set up the jund clip this morning, but I'd like to rematch it before replying with my thought process. That said, I do remember the brainstorm vs, show and tell discard. My goal with that decision was to set up the bonfire in my hand with the brainstorm, which is the line of play I followed. I did not value the show and tell at the time since Lilliana was already in play.


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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Twitch automatically records the stream, afterwards you can make highlights from the channel's dashboard.



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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Quote Originally Posted by zahori View Post
    Twitch automatically records the stream, afterwards you can make highlights from the channel's dashboard.



    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Actually I remember getting an email from Twitch that they were turning the automatic recording off and that you have to turn it on.
    Edit: Go to settings and then down to "Archive Broadcasts" and then turn "Automatically archive my broadcasts" on :)

    Also, been following this thread for a few weeks...went back and slowly read it from page 1 to the current page on my lunches/after work. Currently assembling the deck, just need a few more pieces and I've got Rock Lee's latest list (I'll pick up the commander card at my LGS this FNM hopefully). Looking forward to starting to jam this deck to learn the nuances...I know it will take a while to master...so I'm considering grabbing the cards on Modo too so I can get some easier/more broad practice in.

    Rock, I presume you cut a Trinket Mage to move the 4th S&T into the main? Were you also suggesting moving Bane into the main? Curious what you would cut from there.

    I can't remember if there was discussion over the numbers on Bonfire, so forgive me if there was - but how does the 3 feel? Have you ever felt like you would draw it enough at 2? I assume you've tested the different configurations on the #s and came to the conclusion that 3 was optimal...just asking because it might be a slot to cut 1 to make room for another pithing needle in a Wasteland heavier meta.

    Cheers! Really appreciate all the work in this thread :)

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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    In response, to the 70 man event that you just did.
    You said you lost all of the matches you should have won, and lost all the hard ones.
    I find this due to you're list
    I HATE the breeding pool, I tested it in my early days of tooling with the deck, and the 2life/tap land was killer. Cut it, would rather a vesuva, that card is the same thing, and more. You get to copy trops (from your deck)
    Or duels from you're opp, hopefully green or blue.
    one up green sun, I find useless.
    It's another card that spell pierce eats, (as it is, we need to play around/into it) and it basically will time walk you if it gets countered
    If you plan on keeping it, I would make that pool a dryad
    Dyad can block lackey, fetch it up to save a titan or big man from a edict/lily. And ramp u a mana on turn one if need.
    Tusk is sweet for the tempo matches, and it showed in you're results
    I would make that green sun a show, if you are a fan of it.
    not sure what matches you would want to sb in more repeal. that is why I tried the c.rift, and was unimpressed
    you're sb is very anti combo, so I see how you can win those matches.
    I prefer 4 swan and 2 fluster now
    Swan does everything the deck wants, and fluster acts as the "mindbreak" and "spell pierce" in combo matches
    Swan hits natural order, glimpse, sneak, bloodmoon, show, ad nausea, tutors, omni, dream halls: AS A HARD COUNTER
    fluster hits, counters, discard, storm cards, and some of the others. games tend to go late (if u plan on winning/are working on it) and they can usually pay for fluster in the late game.
    if elves and rwu delver are hard match UPS for you, consider tweaking your sb. You don't need to sacrifice other combo matches to do that.
    MD has some very dead cards, and sb should replace dead, for gold.
    shows ( I find I can't commit to them on turn 3 vrs elves, without losing on back swing, or die before t3. Obv chasm off prime helps. But we can't always live the dream)
    They are prob going to sb controlling, so abrupt, shaman, needles, discard, maybe n.o. number 4 in.
    The best chance they have to win, is NO in a big Guy and beat face, be it hoof or ruric.
    They sacrifice lots of combo kill speed (glimpse power), to be able to decay chalice/needle/w.e.. So I don't see them killing me t2 with the nutters hand
    -maze / +chasm
    -dust / +cage
    -1prime / +chalice
    -1 show
    -1 bog / +4swan
    -1 repeal
    -1 map
    I now have game vrs the deck, with game 2 (relevant cards)
    2 EE (deck of 1cost dorks)
    3 needle (Q.dryad, insect, DRS)
    1 cage (NO/GSZ)
    4 song (NO/GSZ/glimpse)
    Chasm (most run in MD, oops)
    1chalice (situational)
    It should be enough to hold you till late game
    Trinket helps me find one of the artifacts I would want for that moment. Some times is ee to eat the board, or cage, so they don't NO me next turn, a map, for chasm, candel so I can "go off", needle to stop the draw engine or DRS clock, or chalice on those rare occasions where I think I can play it at one.

    If rwu delver is a problem, meakstone EATS THAT DECK. Ever since they cut geist for true name, they now get locked by meek.
    I find they like to sb meddling mage, and name show with it. So I don't usually go for the show plan in that match. I go for a more grindy match, it seems to work for me. But it's all about the read you get on your opp, and what they are going to sb.
    Usually they take out, true name for clique, grim for mage, plow for wear°tear and counters, jitte for sword of something
    +2 meekstone
    +1 chasm
    +1 grip
    -1 show
    -1 bog
    -1 prime
    -1 crop
    I don't slam show in that match, I use it the turn before I wanna cast prime, and use it as a way to bait the force out, cuz I should be able to pay the 2 if tax it. Other wise they need to fow or double tax it. I should be open to cast prime next turn.
    Also, ee helps this match A LOT. Ee on 0, takes out insect 3/2 and germs


    Sb tweaks for you, cut repeal for G.cage, show slot make meekstone
    Make fluster a 2 count, and swan a 4. Or at least split them 3n3.
    And I would go to 2 chalice and add another cage/meek/surgical/or ee
    EE is VERY GOOD right now

    PS. I HATE BRAINSTORM IN THIS DECK!
    unless you have miracles in the deck. If that is the case, 4 brainstorm and 1 scroll rack. That card is the nut in the deck, acts as a 5th top and 5th brainstorm

    till next time
    "wile the mighty sleep, the lowly prowl"

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  11. #11
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Quote Originally Posted by sublime love View Post
    In response, to the 70 man event that you just did.
    I HATE the breeding pool, I tested it in my early days of tooling with the deck, and the 2life/tap land was killer. Cut it, would rather a vesuva, that card is the same thing, and more. You get to copy trops (from your deck)
    Or duels from you're opp, hopefully green or blue.
    one up green sun, I find useless.
    It's another card that spell pierce eats, (as it is, we need to play around/into it) and it basically will time walk you if it gets countered
    First, thank you for giving constructive advices. About Breeding Pool, i dislike it too, but found that having an additional colored land is much more useful in combo matchups than a vesuva, expecially if you are on the draw. I don't mind paying 2 lifes to have it untapped and ready to be used to cast a swan song or a flusterstorm if needed. That's why i cut a vesuva to make room for it.
    About green zenith, i have to admit it doesn't often shine, but i considered it a "little toolbox" to grab oracle of mul-daya or a titan when you're in short of. Frankly, grabbing a titan with zenith almost always has the same cost of playing your all is dust, and effect should be quite similar. Anyway, i thought about cutting it for an additional show and tell, but i'm recently playing an inbred version between yours and mine, adding 2 e.e. maindeck and moving both the thragtusk to sb, leaving titan as the only zenith target maindeck, and have to say i'm quite happy with it atm. I'll have to test more anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by sublime love View Post
    not sure what matches you would want to sb in more repeal. that is why I tried the c.rift, and was unimpressed
    you're sb is very anti combo, so I see how you can win those matches.
    I prefer 4 swan and 2 fluster now
    Repeal is there against delver/blade decks, but with e.e. will be cut for sure from sb. I can see your point about the counterspell package, but i sb them in against combo decks only and sometimes you're forced to drop a chalice @1, that will totally cripple your counterspells plan if you're relying mostly on songs. But again, i'll consider to bring both to an equal number (3-3).

    Quote Originally Posted by sublime love View Post
    If rwu delver is a problem, meakstone EATS THAT DECK. Ever since they cut geist for true name, they now get locked by meek.
    I like the idea, it also beats RUG.

    Quote Originally Posted by sublime love View Post
    PS. I HATE BRAINSTORM IN THIS DECK!
    unless you have miracles in the deck. If that is the case, 4 brainstorm and 1 scroll rack. That card is the nut in the deck, acts as a 5th top and 5th brainstorm.
    I like it, it's a nice a nice way go deep into your deck looking for vital cards when you're missing top, and also protects your vital spells from discard. While i think the full package isn't necessary since we have 4 tops anyway, i can't say i'm not happy of drawing one in almost every game-state.

    About the Candelabras issue that came up lately, i played with 2 of them times ago, but now i'm down to 1 and happy with it. It's a really good card, don't get me wrong, but only when you have a decent amount of cloudposts already available in play, and topdecking it while you're being pressurized is awful. It can be tutored with trinket and that's fine for me.

  12. #12
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Wasteland has, and always will be a huge factor in legacy. I am not fully sure why you would want more candel, when candel relies on you "resolving" nonbasic lands. The deck plays needle and crop rotation for that reason. Just to be able to fight waste and push the decks speed, resistance, and consistency.
    decay is only in a few decks (cascade bug, Jund, junk, team America). Every other deck with waste land, and many other decks without it, if a needle resolves it will be there till the end game.
    Rug has always been a deck, and only recently it has become, rug delver. tempo is a major archetype, and if you find you're self losing to that deck with post. Reevaluate what you are "trying" to do. I have, and most of the vets have not had a problem beating tempo decks. Glimmer post is insane! when u play a land, and can gain life, lots of life, it can end up being a time walk vrs tempo decks. That is usually my game plan vrs them.
    If you are afraid of wasteland still, then welcome to legacy. You can always play another deck. I hear ru delver with price of progress eats most wasteland decks.
    candel is by far the power house card in the deck. Before I discovered show and tell, and added it to the deck, I was on 3 candel, always. I am basically saying you don't need show and tell to win. I cut it a lot when I sb.
    Not sure why u need a soap box to tell every one you don't like wasteland decks. if it's not a combo deck, or a deck not running waste, post eats it! Other wise, welcome to grinding out a win.
    That's legacy man, there is no such thing as the ultimate deck. We all need to work for the wins.
    Good luck testing

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  13. #13

    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Maybe I'm not very good at expressing my ideas.

    My opinion is that the current versions of Turbo Eldrazi are quite vurnerable to the current metagame, and that the deck should be reviewed and perhaps we should revisit the older versions, since we seem to be moving towards traditional Show and Tell decks and away from the original idea of hard casting Eldrazi creatures.

    I think Rock Lee has explained why Pithing Needle is not very effective nowadays: if they have wastelands/decay needle is pretty bad; if they have wastelands but not decay, then you can rely on fetching basic lands and resolving show and tell, which is more reliable than needle.

    And I'm not coming to this conclusion from a theoretical perspective, I draw it from my winning % against the field lately, which has rapidly decreased. Which is also why this is my opinion and not a general conclusion.

    At the end was wondering if my thoughts echoed with other people piloting this deck, and wanted to know what other ideas are out there to tackle the current meta.

  14. #14
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Quote Originally Posted by MtgVector View Post
    Maybe I'm not very good at expressing my ideas.

    My opinion is that the current versions of Turbo Eldrazi are quite vurnerable to the current metagame, and that the deck should be reviewed and perhaps we should revisit the older versions, since we seem to be moving towards traditional Show and Tell decks and away from the original idea of hard casting Eldrazi creatures.

    I think Rock Lee has explained why Pithing Needle is not very effective nowadays: if they have wastelands/decay needle is pretty bad; if they have wastelands but not decay, then you can rely on fetching basic lands and resolving show and tell, which is more reliable than needle.

    And I'm not coming to this conclusion from a theoretical perspective, I draw it from my winning % against the field lately, which has rapidly decreased. Which is also why this is my opinion and not a general conclusion.

    At the end was wondering if my thoughts echoed with other people piloting this deck, and wanted to know what other ideas are out there to tackle the current meta.
    Granted, I play a cheaper version of the deck, but I'm not sure I agree with much of this.

    If this week is any indication to me, Pithing Needle has plenty of use. Maybe it's because my meta features just about every deck currently played in Legacy, but I found some way to use it in every single one of my games: almost always to great effect. Not running Needle just because several decks happen to run Abrupt Decay seems pretty dumb to me. They still have to have it in order to take out your Needle, and those decks would almost certainly be running Decay anyway: if it's not hitting Needle, then it's probably going to hit Candelabra of Tawnos or Oblivion Stone if you're running either. If you boarded in Chalice of the Void, Decay takes care of that, too. Especially if you can tutor for it with Trinket Mage, but even if you can't, I feel reasonably certain that Pithing Needle warrants some number of slots in the deck, where that number is greater than zero. I find that Pithing Needle is also a reasonably high priority target when it comes to my opponent counterspelling or destroying things, and if it means I can then resolve a clutch Crop Rotation or Sensei's Divining Top, then I'm not going to bitch.

  15. #15
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    If breeding pool is for combo decks. Used mostly to make sure you hit color, run another island. Infinitely better.
    Rather have a island then a pool vrs delver.
    Can't play combo all day. Legacy is no place for shock lands (death shadow exception)
    not on the wagon for green sun.
    But to each their own.
    I see why u don't run more song, due to fluster working better with chalice.
    I seem to play delver every other round, so I go with a more, anti tempo sb.
    :thumbup:

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  16. #16
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Quote Originally Posted by sublime love View Post
    If breeding pool is for combo decks. Used mostly to make sure you hit color, run another island. Infinitely better.
    Rather have a island then a pool vrs delver.
    Can't play combo all day. Legacy is no place for shock lands (death shadow exception)
    not on the wagon for green sun.
    But to each their own.
    I see why u don't run more song, due to fluster working better with chalice.
    I seem to play delver every other round, so I go with a more, anti tempo sb.
    :thumbup:
    Well, it's not that breeding pool is just for combo, it's an additional clunky dual land that i'm usually happier to have in my starting hand than a vesuva, and it's the titan's dual land target for excellence. Since i've lately cut a bit of green cards (no more tusk and oracle mainboard) i'm considering to cut it too, but I don't want to swap it for a basic island because there's nothing i hate more than having a titan in my hand and 2 basic islands in play looking at me helplessy.
    I'm not a big fan of krosan grip in sb, which are its uses for you? I usually never had problems with batterskulls and i think ulamog is our cure for any pesky permanent

  17. #17
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Krosan is for
    Any equipment deck
    sulfuric vortex
    Blood moon
    Top
    Sneak
    Omni
    Dream halls
    Defense grid
    Needle
    Vial
    It kills a lot and can usually time walk their turn, they spend lots of man to use them and I just kill it
    Seems to work for me

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  18. #18
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Ponder has been tested, I would suggest going back and reading the forms. It has been talked about before.
    instant discard is always sweet. Can't knock that.
    As far as the red version goes. I figured you had the most knowledge of the deck. So if any one would be able to play it, would it not be you?

  19. #19

    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    I can't help but think Venarian Glimmer is too slow and mana intensive (I know this sounds strange for a 12-post deck). By the time you can cast this spell, usually it will be too late and it doesn't even cantrip.

    For example, if you're playing vs. Storm the ideal card to take would be Infernal Tutor or Burning Wish. This card would come out turn 3 at its earliest and you have to go first. Since the opponent is likely going to combo off turn 2, this card is too slow. If you do cast this spell, you're already winning.

    If you're playing vs. Show and Tell variants, they usually cast their spell faster than you can land Venarian Glimmer. If they are Sneak and Tell they probably sided Show and Tell out but they are still faster.

    Is there something I am missing about this card that makes it good? I'm sticking with the RUG version but this just doesn't seem as good as it should be.

  20. #20
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    Re: [Deck] Turbo Eldrazi

    Quote Originally Posted by 203995014 View Post
    I can't help but think Venarian Glimmer is too slow and mana intensive (I know this sounds strange for a 12-post deck). By the time you can cast this spell, usually it will be too late and it doesn't even cantrip.

    For example, if you're playing vs. Storm the ideal card to take would be Infernal Tutor or Burning Wish. This card would come out turn 3 at its earliest and you have to go first. Since the opponent is likely going to combo off turn 2, this card is too slow. If you do cast this spell, you're already winning.

    If you're playing vs. Show and Tell variants, they usually cast their spell faster than you can land Venarian Glimmer. If they are Sneak and Tell they probably sided Show and Tell out but they are still faster.

    Is there something I am missing about this card that makes it good? I'm sticking with the RUG version but this just doesn't seem as good as it should be.
    I think you're missing the point of Glimmer. You are going for LED/petal, and this is mostly if pressured by a xantid swarm you don't have a repeal/fow for. Against other decks, I often can show in a titan and ramp into incredible mana with my glimmerpost trigger on the stack to snag their Enter the infinite, and worse case is a peek sans cantrip.

    Also if you have played my versions of the deck, you know that sometimes you are simply limited on how many counters/cards you can hold in hand since you side out most of your grindy/fixing cards. Glimmer not only lets you plan, but lets you burn your hand EoT for them. I would glimmer @ 1 all day every day against storm or sneak/omni if they aren't pressuring me and giving me the turn back.

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