[SCD] Domri Rade

[trivial_matters]

As already mentioned, you need Top or Library in order to use the +1 ability reliably. But do you want to play Top in a probably aggressive RGx deck? It's a bit of a mana sink if your goal is to rush out creatures.

Library is better in that regard and already sees play in decks like Jund (also Zoo before everyone stopped playing it).

[lyracian]

He is one mana cheaper but I struggle to see why I would want him rather than Garruk Relentless?
Conditional card draw vs generating tokens and his ultimate, while giving a better bonus, is a lot slower to activate.
That only leaves his fight ability which requires you to have another creature. Unlike Garruk it can be used again but seems very slow.

[Vacrix]

Is this really a fair comparison? Domri Rade can remove creatures. You arent going to run him in a creature light deck, so fight shouldnt be hard to pull off. A sylvan library/dark confidant that can also remove creatures and doesnt cost extra life for card advantage sounds like a good deal to me. Especially after using up your discard and both players are in topdeck mode.

Its not that its a bad card. Its all about the opportunity cost. What do you give up to play this guy? Dark Confidant can remove creatures as well. So can Sylvan Library and Sensei's Divining Top. How? They provide library manipulation and/or CA so that you can find the cards you need to deal with creatures. Its 3 mana.. it doesn't have nearly as much board presence as you want it to have, and frankly its -2 is terrible because it makes creatures fight. You'd have to optimize the deck in such a way that you are not just trading with your opponents creatures or else you are just trading one for one on card advantage. The problem here is that if your creatures are bigger, then you outsize the opponents creatures, so you're already ahead. If your creatures are smaller or even, then you are at best trading one for one, or unable to actually turn his -2 into removal. Compare his -2 to Liliana's -2.. Lili will almost surely kill a creature. But Lili is actually relevant against combo decks like SnT and Reanimator. Domri is completely useless in that matchup. He only has a good application IMO against Lord based aggro where you can pick off Lords with the -2. Even then, you're going to want to be able to beat decks like Goblins and Merfolk or else why are you in RG playing heavy creatures to interact with Domri Rade?

The fact that he creates card advantage is awesome, but he's slow. What kind of deck would play him and also play heavy creatures? RG Beatdown? Well, how does that compare to Zoo's niche in the metagame? How does it compare to Goblins? You can't just look at the card in a vacuum. The build you play and niche in the metagame are just as important. What will this deck do that others don't already? This question is ESPECIALLY important if you want to build around Domri Rade. I don't see a reason to. Goblins gets mad card advantage if it wants it. Zoo is a powerhouse that will just burn your creature on the spot if you try to -2 to kill something. If you're playing a midrange sort of build, it doesn't make too much sense to get creature heavy.. and BUG already plays midrange much better with Deathrite Shaman. Say you go into RGb for Shaman and some other guys, perhaps even Dark Confidant.. and even some discard so you have some semblance of disruption.. Perhaps that could work. Still.. I don't see Domri Rade giving you greater board presence than Sylvan Library would. Library is harder to remove, can potentially draw you an extra card or two in clutch situations, interacts with fetchlands to create card quality, something Domri Rade cannot.

Further, the -7 is purely win more. If Domri Rade actually does what its supposed to do with its +1 for long enough, then you should be getting enough card advantage with creatures to steam roll an opponent before -7 is even relevant. If the +1 doesn't do what its supposed to do, then do you have enough creatures for the -7 to even be relevant by the time its online? If its even still alive because you didn't have to use the -2?

I'd say it would be playable if the first ability were +2, and the second -1. Otherwise, its not Legacy material IMO.

[bruizar]

Liliana and Domri Rade are not as comparable as you think. In the case of Liliana, if I +1 hands to 0, I still get to top deck and cast a card which means the +1 actually does nothing. Lingering Souls counters Liliana pretty hard (or any planeswalker for that matter).The +1 does not always guarantee card advantage. A top decked Jace or Entreat the Angels also beat Liliana's +1 and -2 pretty well. That doesn't mean the +1 is bad, it just means that, like Domri Rade, the +1 doesn't always provide C/A or disruption.

Domri Rade draws a creature every turn provided you run enough Sylvan Library/SDT's/Mirri's Guile effects and enough creatures to support him. That's better in a lot of situations (not all situations, particularly against combo lili is better). Being able to draw into Bloodbraid Elves and Tarmogoyfs is good because you establish a board presence more quickly. You should not forget that Sylvan Library costs 4 life, and Dark Confidant also costs a lot of life unless you are setting up your library. Domri Rade never costs any life. Also, even if you one-for-one with Domri Rade, his +1 should draw you into a replacement threat so you should come out ahead. I wouldn't advocate running 4 Domri Rades, but I can see 2 of them making there way into a list with tops and confidants. I can see a 'fight club' type of deck in legacy. An aggro control deck that beats every other aggro matchup.

[FieryBalrog]

Liliana and Domri Rade are not as comparable as you think. In the case of Liliana, if I +1 hands to 0, I still get to top deck and cast a card which means the +1 actually does nothing. Lingering Souls counters Liliana pretty hard (or any planeswalker for that matter).The +1 does not always guarantee card advantage. A top decked Jace or Entreat the Angels also beat Liliana's +1 and -2 pretty well. That doesn't mean the +1 is bad, it just means that, like Domri Rade, the +1 doesn't always provide C/A or disruption.

Domri Rade draws a creature every turn provided you run enough Sylvan Library/SDT's/Mirri's Guile effects and enough creatures to support him. That's better in a lot of situations (not all situations, particularly against combo lili is better). Being able to draw into Bloodbraid Elves and Tarmogoyfs is good because you establish a board presence more quickly. You should not forget that Sylvan Library costs 4 life, and Dark Confidant also costs a lot of life unless you are setting up your library. Domri Rade never costs any life. Also, even if you one-for-one with Domri Rade, his +1 should draw you into a replacement threat so you should come out ahead. I wouldn't advocate running 4 Domri Rades, but I can see 2 of them making there way into a list with tops and confidants. I can see a 'fight club' type of deck in legacy. An aggro control deck that beats every other aggro matchup.

The kind of mid-range Jund-ish deck you would theoretically want to run Domri Rade in, only runs about 12-15 creatures (at most).

That's probably the biggest issue. Maybe some Naya Zoo variant could run it. Maybe not.