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Thread: [Deck] Jund

  1. #2201
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by Wakkz View Post
    I put Delirium in my sideboard for my Grixis control deck as anti Marit Lage tech. I thought it'd be good against Reanimator too, but the lifelink on Griselbrand makes them just gain back the 7 damage they took.

  2. #2202
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by Claymore View Post
    Also interested, as I picked up a set of foil Destructive Flows when I saw some interesting lists awhile back. Don't have the Chrome moxes, but I'm sure Mox Diamond would work about the same with Loam.
    Creatures(13)
    2 Abyssal Persecutor
    2 Tombstalker
    3 Blazing Specter
    3 Prowling Serpopard
    3 Harsh Mentor

    Enchantments(5)
    3 Destructive Flow
    2 Sylvan Library

    Planeswalkers(4)
    2 Liliana of the Veil
    2 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

    Artifact(7)
    3 Chrome Mox
    4 Chalice of the Void

    Instants(8)
    3 Abrupt Decay
    3 Terminate
    2 Reroute

    Sorceries(2)
    2 Maelstrom Pulse

    Lands (21)
    3 Swamp
    3 Mountain
    2 Forest
    3 Bloodstained Mire
    2 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Wooded Foothills
    3 Wasteland
    1 Volrath's Stronghold
    1 Badlands
    1 Bayou

    Sideboard (15)
    2 Ashen Rider
    3 Leyline of the Void
    2 Leyline of Sanctity
    2 Anger of the Gods
    3 Seal of Doom
    3 Golgari Charm

    I double checked my board last night, I could not seem to remember moving Pyroblast for some reason.
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  3. #2203
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by RobNC View Post
    I put Delirium in my sideboard for my Grixis control deck as anti Marit Lage tech. I thought it'd be good against Reanimator too, but the lifelink on Griselbrand makes them just gain back the 7 damage they took.
    As far as the list, the spice is basically a sprinkle of paprika in the form of Chandra, Tarfire is just a Shock. As far as those two....I'd run Backlash, it has Darigaaz on the picture and thematically fits better with the rest of the Invasion block cards I run. *chuckle*
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  4. #2204
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Not stuck on any of these numbers yet, but I was tossing around the idea of playing this at our weekly next week:

    4 Deathrite Shaman
    3 Grim Flayer
    4 Tarmogoyf
    4 Bloodbraid Elf

    4 Liliana of the Veil

    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Thoughtseize
    3 Abrupt Decay
    4 Hymn to Tourach
    1 Toxic Deluge

    1 Sylvan Library
    4 Destructive Flow

    1 Badlands
    1 Bayou
    2 Bloodstained Mire
    2 Forest
    1 Mountain
    3 Swamp
    1 Taiga
    4 Verdant Catacombs
    3 Wasteland
    2 Wooded Foothills

    Manabase isn't 100% set; I want to lean heavily on basics for obvious reasons but realize I need fetches to not get color screwed. One of each dual so any fetch can get any color if required. Considering Ghost Quarter instead of Wasteland to snipe whatever basics opponent may have (or help me fetch out my own in the face of Flow) but that could backfire.

    Also: Grim Flayer or Dark Confidant? Running 4 BBE with Bob seems risky, but I'm not sure how reliably I would be able to turn on Delirium for Flayer.

  5. #2205

    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Hello all,
    I first time poster in the site. I am going to SCG Dallas and I'm planing on taking Jund with me to play as the Legacy player for our team.

    I wanted to talk about side boards in the new meta, what we should really have or not have. And also, Blood Sun something we could use vs. Lands?

  6. #2206

    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by MrDude View Post
    Hello all,
    I first time poster in the site. I am going to SCG Dallas and I'm planing on taking Jund with me to play as the Legacy player for our team.

    I wanted to talk about side boards in the new meta, what we should really have or not have. And also, Blood Sun something we could use vs. Lands?
    Imho, jund needs combo hates, a mix of duress, surgical and pithing needle is good. Regarding lands hate, I prefer gaveyard hate vs lands and edict vs marit lage. And we have wasteland serving the primary defense.

  7. #2207
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Combo hate. Lots of it. You can never have enough combo hate. Especially for BS like Show And Tell. It's our worst matchup, period.

    And as far as Lands goes.....well, Destructive Flow can be a house against Lands, all you have to do is keep the Explorations off the table. Flow will pretty much handle the whole show.

    Also, I'm running a slightly different list. Hopefully tonight's testing fares well.

    Maindeck changes:
    -2 Tombstalker, +2 Dark Confidant
    -3 Blazing Specter, +3 Scab-Clan Berserker
    -2 Maelstrom Pulse, +2 Hymn to Tourach
    -1 Prowling Serpopard, +1 Harsh Mentor
    -2 Reroute, +2 Kolaghan's Command
    -1 Volrath's Stronghold, +1 Wooded Foothills

    Sideboard:
    -1 Golgari Charm
    -3 Seal of Doom
    +2 Rakdos Charm
    +2 Maelstrom Pulse
    Last edited by KærvekTheMerciless; 01-12-2018 at 07:24 AM.
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  8. #2208
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Very standard list, very small sample size. Lost in the Top 4 of a 4 Round event with a final record of 3-2-1.
    10 Fetch, 2 Bayou, 2 Badland, 2 Swamp, 1 Mountain, 1 Forest, 4 Wasteland
    4x DRS, BBE, Bob, Goyf, Hymn, TSeiz, LoTV
    3x Bolt, Decay
    2x K Command
    1x Toxic Deluge, LtLH

    SB:
    3x Surgical
    2x Golgari Charm, DEdict, CBrutality
    1x Sylvan, Maelstrom Pulse, REB, Loam, EE, Choke

    Lowest point of the day is pulling a deck box out of my backpack round one, shuffling, not bothering to verify the deck past the basic land I saw, and then presenting. When I drew 7 I realized I had pulled my modern deck from the previous event I was in. Judge call, game loss, on to game two. My opponent is on greedy three color delver and I proceed to Waste, DRS, Hymn, Bolt him out of game 'two'. Game 'three' with SB it becomes much easier and he fetches basic Island. I kill everything else, GCharm away Elemental tokens off a BBE Cascade, and then Choke him out.
    SB+ Choke, GCharm x2, Maelstrom Pulse, REB, EE
    SB- Trim discard, K Command

    Round two is BUG Value with Leovold, Liliana, Jace, Strix, all the hits. I steamroll him game one, then he returns the favor game two and three with active Jace+Lili and Sylvan.
    SB+ Choke, REB, EE, GCharm, DEdict, Loam
    SB- trim BBE, cut 4x Hymn on the draw, 2x on the play, K Command

    Round 3 another 3 or maybe 4 color control pile. The game is very similar to round one (without the Judge call) except in game 3 my opponent locks himself out with Blood Moon trying to cut me off Black spells. I BBE into Maelstrom Pulse to blow up multiple Strix and beat him for 3 a turn.
    SB+ Choke, REB, Brutality, Loam
    SB- Trim Lili, Hymn on the draw (trim on the play),

    Round 4 is an ID into top 8, and top 8 is BUG Value from Round 2. The games go very opposite the way they did the first time. G1 I blow out multiple TNN with the MD Deluge and get Liliana ticking up with her ladyfriend BBE serving damage. Game 2 there is a lot of back and forth and we both have active Liliana of the Veil, but I resolve Sylvan, pay four, lead a Thoughtseize into a Choke and lock him down to just one tropical island for mana. He has active Jace,but Sylvan gets me to MPulse eventually and I take the game while he's drawing Hymns and I've sides all mine out.
    SB--Same as round 2.

    T4 is Zoo, Naya with Steppe Lynx, Goyf, Bolt, Chain Lightning, Hooting Mandrills, Narnam Renegade, Ghor Clan Rampager, Nacatl. Basically a Who's Who is cheap beats.
    I get game one with an insane amount of removal for his creatures ending in active Liliana. Games two and three he absolutely crushed me with too many threats I didn't have answers to.
    SB+DEdict, Pulse, EE
    SB-Trimmed discard, KCommand, BBE

    I'm still not 100% sold on BBE and half of the day wanted to go back to the Grim Flayer list I've run previously. Flipping it off Bob feels even more miserable than Chandra or some other long term value card despite the ability to cascade into better things. I'm likely going to end up putting more work on it though, because I have to eventually settle on something for Worcester in March.

  9. #2209

    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by zebhillard View Post
    Very standard list, very small sample size. Lost in the Top 4 of a 4 Round event with a final record of 3-2-1.
    10 Fetch, 2 Bayou, 2 Badland, 2 Swamp, 1 Mountain, 1 Forest, 4 Wasteland
    4x DRS, BBE, Bob, Goyf, Hymn, TSeiz, LoTV
    3x Bolt, Decay
    2x K Command
    1x Toxic Deluge, LtLH

    SB:
    3x Surgical
    2x Golgari Charm, DEdict, CBrutality
    1x Sylvan, Maelstrom Pulse, REB, Loam, EE, Choke

    ....
    A nice read, thank you for the report.

    Re Grim Flayer v BBE, much as not stellar as BBE looks, it is better than Grim Flayer imho. Grim is too weak as a legacy card. It does not gain you any card advantage which is important to build up a winning situation for a midrange deck.

    Observed there is no Punishing fire suite in your deck. Had you had it, you may find the zoo matchup more manageable. And I think it is the very reason why Jund would out-grind pile and miracle.

  10. #2210
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by Jsang View Post
    A nice read, thank you for the report.

    Re Grim Flayer v BBE, much as not stellar as BBE looks, it is better than Grim Flayer imho. Grim is too weak as a legacy card. It does not gain you any card advantage which is important to build up a winning situation for a midrange deck. Observed there is no Punishing fire suite in your deck. Had you had it, you may find the zoo matchup more manageable. And I think it is the very reason why Jund would out-grind pile and miracle.
    Not a problem. I'm still settling in on what to play in Worcester, but it's looking like Good ole Jund will be the call.

    I've played Grim Flayer before in a no-BBE, 2 Painful Truths, 2 Bob 2 Flayer list that operated with MD Sylvan, Punishing Fire, and a miser's Tarfire. Trample is an underrated ability in the world of TNN we currently live in, and the ability to set up Bobs for the following turn as to not take damage off the reveals is an upside.

    But. Sometimes, it's just a 2/2 with selection, and other times it just dies to Fatal Push.

    Punishing Fire wouldn't have really helped against the Zoo match, though I can see the point. All of the threats were X/3 at any point in time, and the biggest one would have taken two Fire hits to kill (Mandrills). I think that's just too slow to work as a plan for Zoo, but I've been proven wrong before. Long games can definitely be trumped by Grove/Fire, but the skewing you have to do with your lands to support Grove never sat well with me after round three or four.

  11. #2211

    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by zebhillard View Post
    Not a problem. I'm still settling in on what to play in Worcester, but it's looking like Good ole Jund will be the call.

    I've played Grim Flayer before in a no-BBE, 2 Painful Truths, 2 Bob 2 Flayer list that operated with MD Sylvan, Punishing Fire, and a miser's Tarfire. Trample is an underrated ability in the world of TNN we currently live in, and the ability to set up Bobs for the following turn as to not take damage off the reveals is an upside.

    But. Sometimes, it's just a 2/2 with selection, and other times it just dies to Fatal Push.

    Punishing Fire wouldn't have really helped against the Zoo match, though I can see the point. All of the threats were X/3 at any point in time, and the biggest one would have taken two Fire hits to kill (Mandrills). I think that's just too slow to work as a plan for Zoo, but I've been proven wrong before. Long games can definitely be trumped by Grove/Fire, but the skewing you have to do with your lands to support Grove never sat well with me after round three or four.
    My experience with grim flayer was really bad. I find this underwhelming because 1. it is a 2cc 2/2 most of the time and provides selection only after it can deal combat damage to the opponent and 2. when you are behind, you may rather have a stronger blocker, which means the selection only work when you are ahead.

    You spotted on that the inclusion of punishing package renders the mana base even more fragile. My reason to play jund, over other brainstorm midrange decks, apart from personal perference, is the ability to out-grind, out-value your opponents. I feel difficult to convince myself to play jund over decks like pile if the package being excluded.

    My current list,

    4 DRS
    4 Dark Confidant
    4 Tarmogoyf
    2 BBE

    3 LotV
    1 LoLH

    2 Sylvan Library

    3 Decay, Bolt, P.Fire
    1 K. Command
    1 Diabolic Edict
    3 TS, Hymn

    3 Wasteland
    4 Grove
    1 Swamp Forest
    4 Badlands
    2 Bayou
    8 fetches

    SB
    1 Needle, Golgari Charm, Pulse, Edict, Chandra ToD, Choke, Toxic
    3 Duress, Surgical
    2 pyroblast

    My meta filled with delver, DNT, combos and chalice decks.

  12. #2212
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Finally got to play with the changes I made. Took bloody long enough.

    Harsh Mentor is a god damned landmine. Seriously think he is completely underappreciated.

    Scab-Clan Berserker is just silly as hell. Double R can be an owwie, but our deck specializes in plowing blockers flat. So renown has basically always been on. But the psuedo-Chalice his trigger provides is just plain bonkers. He renowned in 7 of the 14 games I played (the other 7 he didn't show), and within 2 turns they scoop em up.

    Prowling Serpopard has some potential, but I feel it may not be in this deck. But uncounterable Bobs and Percys are just unforgivably nasty.

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  13. #2213
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Dabbling around with Jund instead of Junk lately, hoping to get some good feedback.

    1) What's the plan against Sneak/Show? Needle/Duress/Surgical out of the board?
    2) What's the plan for storm? This seems like a weak matchup if we don't curve Thoughtseize into Hymn.

    Thanks in advance. Long-time Junk player, and I'm always looking for janky shit to add to BGx midrange decks. I really like PFire right now, and I'm trying a weird hybrid with 4x Hexmage/Crop Rotation + 1x Depths/Stage. It subs in for Tarmogoyf, 2x Wasteland, and shaves off slots on some of the other cards like Hymn and Bolt.
    Brainstorm Realist

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  14. #2214

    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    Dabbling around with Jund instead of Junk lately, hoping to get some good feedback.

    1) What's the plan against Sneak/Show? Needle/Duress/Surgical out of the board?
    2) What's the plan for storm? This seems like a weak matchup if we don't curve Thoughtseize into Hymn.

    Thanks in advance. Long-time Junk player, and I'm always looking for janky shit to add to BGx midrange decks. I really like PFire right now, and I'm trying a weird hybrid with 4x Hexmage/Crop Rotation + 1x Depths/Stage. It subs in for Tarmogoyf, 2x Wasteland, and shaves off slots on some of the other cards like Hymn and Bolt.
    1) I would side-in 3 duress, 2 pyroblast, 1 Needle and 1 golgari charm (2 if having 2 otherwise 1 surgical) for 2 tarmo, 2 BBE, 3 punish, 1 decay

    2) Depends on ANT or TES
    ANT: duress, pyroblast and surgical for combination of tarmo, punish, decay
    TES: duress, pyroblast, and golgari charm

    Both SnS and Storm are bad matahups even 15 slots devoted to these matchups. This deck is good at grinding but bad in close out the game quick while disrupting your opponents.

    Regarding the hybrid, I cannot comment since I have no experience, but I expect it won't do the job better than Turbo Depth but would undoubtedly weaken our (already) fragile mana base.

  15. #2215
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by Jsang View Post
    1) I would side-in 3 duress, 2 pyroblast, 1 Needle and 1 golgari charm (2 if having 2 otherwise 1 surgical) for 2 tarmo, 2 BBE, 3 punish, 1 decay

    2) Depends on ANT or TES
    ANT: duress, pyroblast and surgical for combination of tarmo, punish, decay
    TES: duress, pyroblast, and golgari charm

    Both SnS and Storm are bad matahups even 15 slots devoted to these matchups. This deck is good at grinding but bad in close out the game quick while disrupting your opponents.

    Regarding the hybrid, I cannot comment since I have no experience, but I expect it won't do the job better than Turbo Depth but would undoubtedly weaken our (already) fragile mana base.
    The only concession I make on the mana-base is to cut 2x Wasteland for 1x Depths/1x Stage. The mana would be essentially the same, albeit slightly different because I include 2 Urborgs so Grove of the Burnwillows isn't so lackluster.
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  16. #2216
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Another month, another small event Top 4. 5 Rounds with some interesting matches.

    This month I went to Punishing Jund using the following:
    4x DRS, Goyf, Bob, Lili, TSeize
    3x BBE, Bolt, PFire, Hymn
    2x KCommand, ADecay
    1x LtLH

    4x BSMire, VCata, Grove, Wasteland
    2xBadland, Bayou, Swamp
    1xForest

    SB:
    4x Leyline of Void
    2x CBrutality, EPlague,
    1x Edict, Choke, Loam, Library, REB, Deluge, MPulse

    Overall: 4-2-Split Top 4

    Round 1: Turbo Depths (2-1)
    Round 2: Turbo Mill (2-0)
    Round 3: Stoneblade (2-0)
    Round 4: Sneak and Show (2-1)
    Round 5: Czech Pile (1-2)

    Top 8: Czech Pile (2-1)
    Redemption.

    Top 4: Intentional Draw
    The Top 4 was Manaless Dredge, Belcher, a deck with Force of Will, and me. My buddy was playing my Belcher 75 and we were paired in the Top 4, so we agreed to split and Force of Will guy was happy to split against Manaless. If the pairing went the other direction I'm sure we would have played it out and had Belcher vs Jund to split in the finals.

    Sideboarding was fairly standard but I wish I had gone with 3 Surgical and +1 Library instead of 4 Layline, but there was a huge amount of Dredge for the monthly so I called into a more solid solution against it. The only time Punishing Fire came into play was against Stoneblade where it became "+1 Liliana, Opponent Discards a Card and Gains 1 Life."

  17. #2217

    Re: [Deck] Jund

    have you guys tryed out the list that made top4 in the mkm series in rome?
    http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=27011&iddeck=214034
    I've, it's a punishing fire less list, and I liked it a lot:
    When it curves out like TA: t1 deathrite t2 waste + hymn T3 whaterver clock, it's pretty powerful (and nope, it does it more consistently than the grove list)
    when you double hymn them without mana issues feels good too!
    I've only swapped one surgical in the board for a second cage and a pulse maindeck over the terminate (need more powerful spell in my opinion, in order to answer PW better)
    Overall I've liked the list, not saying It's the best, but for sure it's not as awfull as I thought it would be.

  18. #2218

    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by NegatorITA View Post
    have you guys tryed out the list that made top4 in the mkm series in rome?
    http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=27011&iddeck=214034
    I've, it's a punishing fire less list, and I liked it a lot:
    When it curves out like TA: t1 deathrite t2 waste + hymn T3 whaterver clock, it's pretty powerful (and nope, it does it more consistently than the grove list)
    when you double hymn them without mana issues feels good too!
    I've only swapped one surgical in the board for a second cage and a pulse maindeck over the terminate (need more powerful spell in my opinion, in order to answer PW better)
    Overall I've liked the list, not saying It's the best, but for sure it's not as awfull as I thought it would be.
    Hey all! Thanks for the kind words, appreciate!
    I will be piloting the deck in GP Birmingham and I was trying to figure out the best sideboard plan for what I expect the field will look like.
    Do you guys have any IN/OUT sideboard plan I can look at so to compare it with mine?
    Thanks in advance :)

  19. #2219

    Re: [Deck] Jund

    I liked Raffaele's list a lot!
    Do you guys can give me a hint, what to replace Chains of Mephistopheles with? I was thinking about Dampening Sphere or Choke since miracles and storm are a thing in my meta.
    On the other hand, OminSneak also gives us a lot of trouble.

  20. #2220
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    Re: [Deck] Jund

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryoclasm View Post
    I liked Raffaele's list a lot!
    Do you guys can give me a hint, what to replace Chains of Mephistopheles with? I was thinking about Dampening Sphere or Choke since miracles and storm are a thing in my meta.
    On the other hand, OminSneak also gives us a lot of trouble.
    Choke is never really a dead card in the SB. If you're having trouble with a large number of Show and Tell, maybe Ashen Riders. You'll never actually cast them, but they're there as a hope and dream.

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