[Deck] Jund

[WeatherseedMage]

My current list:
Sideboard

2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Destructive Revelry
2 Golgari Charm
3 Hymn to Tourach
1 Krosan Grip
1 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Pernicious Deed

I run a ton of lands because I've noticed that most of my losses with this deck came from mana-screw, difficult combo matchups excepted. Hymn to Tourach is in the board because I really only want it against combo and perhaps Miracles. Inquisition is much better against the Delver decks that dominate my meta. The Revelry has been pretty solid although I have difficulty justifying it over another Krosan Grip or perhaps a Pithing Needle. I used to run more copies of Grudge but the card is narrow and you don't want to draw multiples usually. I highly recommend Pernicious Deed in the board for three reasons: it's a versatile sweeper against swarms (just don't bring it in against RUG, Stifle is a blowout), it kills TNN, and it sweeps away all the lock pieces ever from the many fringe prison decks you might run into (MUD, Enchantress, Chalice Aggro, Imperial Painter, even some Miracles variants will have lots of targets for this). In that way Deed serves as my insurance against randomness, being a one-sided blowout against many of these T2-3 decks while having utility against most of the decks to beat as well.

Your graveyard combo match ups are terrible, aren't they? It doesn't sound look like you have much game against them, but your board is better vs fair decks which seems odd to me because the main deck is normally pretty strong against fair decks and the board is what I use to shore up the generally weak combo decks? And besides Liliana, what is your out to big gigantic monsters?

[Admiral_Arzar]

Your graveyard combo match ups are terrible, aren't they? It doesn't sound look like you have much game against them, but your board is better vs fair decks which seems odd to me because the main deck is normally pretty strong against fair decks and the board is what I use to shore up the generally weak combo decks? And besides Liliana, what is your out to big gigantic monsters?

I beat Dredge at the last SCG I attended without actually drawing any hate at all. Tight play and a bit of luck can get you there. Honestly though, there is very little graveyard combo in my meta (or combo at all currently, part of why the Hymns are in the board). I'm more likely to see creature-based combo like Elves or Aluren - there is an occasional High Tide although that is a matchup that I don't worry too much about as it is very unfavorable without the nuts on our part. Thus, sweepers actually double as combo hate - Deed is pretty strong vs. Elves.

On another note, I took my most recent list (I think the sideboard was -1 Revelry +1 Grip or something like that) to another local Power 9 tournament. I ended up at 3-2 finishing 12th. Rounds went like this:

Round 1: Shardless BUG 2-0 (opponent game loss for deckreg error, just ground out game 2 including a Red Blast on Ancestral Visions).

Round 2: RUG Delver 0-2 (mulled for lands in game one, had to keep a two lander and didn't draw out of his LD, game two kept a two lander with Bob and Double Goyf, got blown out by Submerge + Wasteland on turn 2 and then didn't see more lands for 3-4 turns)

Round 3: Affinity 2-0 (this deck is insane against weenie rush strategies like this, especially with postboard Deed)

Round 4: Death and Taxes 1-2 (game 1 I drew 9 extra cards off Bob but they were all lands, lack of business allowed him to stabilize, game 2 I ground him out with massive card advantage, game 3 I lacked removal for an early Mom and stumbled on lands before being overwhelmed with fliers)

Round 5: Jund 2-0 (ground out the mirror with better draws and sideboarding)

My RUG opponent is a buddy of mine who lost the last time we played, so I think I was owed this defeat. Death and Taxes is usually favorable, but sometimes they just build an army too quickly for you to do anything about it/draw sweepers.

[WeatherseedMage]

I beat Dredge at the last SCG I attended without actually drawing any hate at all. Tight play and a bit of luck can get you there. Honestly though, there is very little graveyard combo in my meta (or combo at all currently, part of why the Hymns are in the board). I'm more likely to see creature-based combo like Elves or Aluren - there is an occasional High Tide although that is a matchup that I don't worry too much about as it is very unfavorable without the nuts on our part. Thus, sweepers actually double as combo hate - Deed is pretty strong vs. Elves.

So if you were to make a sideboard for an SCG Open, trying to account for the combo decks, would you move some number of Hymns back to the main and have graveyard hate in the sideboard or what? Or because you dislike it vs DnT and Delver decks, would you keep it in the board and then make some kind of other cuts and put in graveyard hate?

As far as Graveyard Hate, has anyone played Scavenging Ooze main vs the 4th Tarmogoyf? I don't really like the idea that much, but I am curious about it. It seems very mana intensive, especially on a fairly weak part of our color base.

Is it agreed that some number of Cage and Surgical/Extripate is probably the better configuration than Leylines and Cages? Especially since Surgical/Extripate can grab pieces of Storm combo decks and Cage can stop a Past in Flames kill (though this is an area where I really think that Leyline shines).

[aluisiocsantos]

I used to run Scavenging Ooze AND 4 tarmos when i started playing jund. Ive seen some guys doing it on tcdecks too, recebtly.. But honestly im not sure if its that helpful in most g1s. That said, it adds up what you said already: mana intensive.

Perhaps if you expect a lot of bugs and rugs, you can disable those enemy tarmogoyfs. I honestly prefer to recurr to it as gy hate only


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[Admiral_Arzar]

So if you were to make a sideboard for an SCG Open, trying to account for the combo decks, would you move some number of Hymns back to the main and have graveyard hate in the sideboard or what? Or because you dislike it vs DnT and Delver decks, would you keep it in the board and then make some kind of other cuts and put in graveyard hate?

As far as Graveyard Hate, has anyone played Scavenging Ooze main vs the 4th Tarmogoyf? I don't really like the idea that much, but I am curious about it. It seems very mana intensive, especially on a fairly weak part of our color base.

Is it agreed that some number of Cage and Surgical/Extripate is probably the better configuration than Leylines and Cages? Especially since Surgical/Extripate can grab pieces of Storm combo decks and Cage can stop a Past in Flames kill (though this is an area where I really think that Leyline shines).

Nah I played basically the same sideboard at the SCG, but that is my preference. Graveyard combo is not a common matchup. My only combo loss was Spiral Tide which is a brutally bad matchup for this deck regardless. Leylines are bad because they dome you for 4 when flipped off of Bob.

[ironclad8690]

Death and Taxes is usually favorable, but sometimes they just build an army too quickly for you to do anything about it/draw sweepers.

I have found this matchup got much tougher with the printing of TNN and the re-addition of cards like Serra Avenger & Brimaz.

Jund can definitely feel clunky mana-wise as well, and I can see why you would run so many basics. In the Semifinals of SCG Seattle, there is a great match between Rob Hunsaker (Jund) and David Bauman (Death and Taxes), and it is a great example of how Death and Taxes can beat our deck on the mana denial route.

[Dice_Box]

To beat Hatebears in Modern we run Anger of the Gods. I think if DNT became an almighty hell to deal with, Massacre might become more common as a sideboard item to stop them. Other than that, just play smart and remove there problem cards. We have to have some of the highest concentration of removal of any deck in the format.

[aluisiocsantos]

Yeha, I faced some Serra Avengers this weekend. Tough.

In fact, here's a report!
I played a side-event at GP São Paulo (trio sealed was the main event), with 148 players. Ended in 39. Not bad, not good either haha!

The list. I loved the approach with IoK in the main and Hymn in the side Admiral Arzar posted so here it it

4 Tarmogoyf
4 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Bloodbraid Elf

4 Thoughtseize
4 Liliana of the Veil
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Punishing Fire
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Lightning Bolt
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Sylvan Library

4 Wasteland
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
3 Bayou
2 Badlands
1 Taiga
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Forest
1 Swamp

Sideboard

2 Hymn to Tourach
2 Golgari Charm
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Pyroblast
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Diabolic Edict
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Pernicious Deed

To the matches!

Round 1: Silva - Punishing Jund - Mirror!
G1: He starts, I think, and plays Shaman. I thoughtseize him and find I think 3 more lands, BBE and Bob. I take out BBE, and have a hand filled with removals, so i keep killing his things and eventually win.
Sideboard: +1 Chains of Mephistopheles (this never showed up in my hand in the entire tourney, while they showed up EVERYTIME the other day I played Loam), +1 Jitte, +1 Ooze. -Sylvan Library, -1 Thoughtseize. I go with 61 (I did this a lot through the tourney) cards.
G2 is the opposite, I keep a hand with Bob, Shaman and Goyf and he has answers for all those and beat me down.
G3 was a supe rboring game in which nobody got to have things on the board due to both of us having PFire and Grove online but he has Sylvan Library which was tough. To my luck, he took 4 damage for extra draws twice, which along with my EOT 1 dmg point, let me deal 6 damage in a turn after i do double punishing fire + bolt and win. 1-0-0

Round 2: Tiago - Death and Taxes
G1: My opponent keeps a poor hand for a deck with so many removals such as jund, but I don't blame him for being a G1. I thoughseize and find Mother, SotLabyrinth, SFM and 4 other lands, I take out Mother and proceed to remove everything else after they are played. Goyfing without looking back.
Sideboard: +Jitte, +2 Hymn to Tourach, +2 Ancient Grudge, -2 Thoughtseize -1 IOK, -1 Punishing Fire. I cant rememebr if it was it but i rmeember it was around 5 cards. Maybe it was 1 TS and -1 Grove.
G2: It's a very fair match until I'm like down to 7 HP and have 2 goyfs at 5/6 and he has 10 hp..and Thalia + Karakas and Flickerwisp. Thalia has pretty much hold my game for most part this match. But yeah, he topdecks Rest in Peace and my goyfs go from heroes to zeroes.
I go back to sideboard and trade the Hymns for Golgari Charms.
G3: I can't remember much except that he basically opens up again with Thalia + Karakas, but this time it was quick enought that I was able to save the opening hand Wasteland for it, and then I prompt to kill her, so my game went smooth afterwards. 2-0-0

Round 3: Jean - Death and Taxes again.
G1: it was a pretty fair game, but after he gets to turn 4 he starts playing Serra Avengers and I get no outs.
I sideboard pretty much like I did in g3 last game.
G2: Okay, I open with a hand with just a wasteland and a fetch, Deathrite, two Lilianas, Maelstrom Pulse, Ancient Grudge. Not bad, except for the frail mana - If I don't draw any other lands I'm screwed. I play Fetch into Swamp, DRS. His turn he doesnt STP and I'm like YAY! i promptly remove my fetchland, play Wasteland and Liliana. Discard plz. he goes "okay" and discards Wilt Leaf Liege and I'm like O_O. Felt so much like I was playing agains Sneak Show, haha. His turn he kills Lily AND plays revoker naming guess what, Liliana. I never draw the extra land to kill Wilt Leaf with Pulse and I die.
2-1-0

Round 4: Renan - Reanimator
G1: I'm on the draw and I try discarding, he hides stuff with brainstorm and gives me a hand with Ponder I think, and three FOW. He quickly combos into that flying thing in which whenever he plays a speel, he returns a permanent to my hand. I have 3 mana on the battlefield, PFire, Lightning Bolt and liliana in my hand, so first I try killing it with burn, to which he spends two of his fow. The next turn he Brainstorms and returns one of my lands. I play land and Liliana the next turn and he can't counter it. From then on I just finish him.
Sideboard: +1 Diabolic Edict, Grafdiggers Cage, Ooze, Chains of Mephistopheles, Surgical Extraction. -2 Punishing Fire, -2 Grove of Burnwillows, Sylvan Library.
G2: He very quickly combos into Sphinx of Steel Wind, but I quickly answers into Diabolic Edict and he goes sad face not for long. Next turn I Thoughtseize him to find a hand filled with creatures and a reanimating spell, which becomes the target. However the following turn he topdraws Show and Tell and plays Griselbrand. From then on I can never land a Lily and its game.
G3: I open a hand with a couple lands, beaters, Deathrite Shaman, Grafdigger's Cage and Thoughtseize. At first I'm in doubt as to what to play, and he bluffs into "ok, ok, just play deathrite and go" which leads me to play Thoughtseize and find in his hand City of Traitors, Petal, Show and Tell and Griselbrand, and I simply laugh ha. He gets no outs for the rest of the game. I play my gravehate next turn and he goes Engineered Explosives to One and detonates it straight away, but i draw a Scavenging Ooze and he gives up. 3-1-0

Round 5: Guilherme - Burn. From here on things get sticky.
G1: I just get BBQed.
Sideboard: -4 Bob. +2 Hymn to Tourach, +Ooze, +Jitte
G2: I manage play a goyf wall for his guides, and discard diruption takes a Price and lands form his hand, and I eventually win.
G3 introduced me to Burns newest friend, the Eidolon. The match goes fairly good with him on 8 Hp with an Eidolon, and me with a 5/6 goyf (due to another killed eidolon) and 5 HP. I'm stuck between waiting for a BBE to beat him or killing his eidolon with a Maelstrom Pulse and praying for the best.. which I do and go to 3 hp. He drawns a rift bolt and I'm burnt. 3-2-0

Since it's 8 rounds and the prize is up to top 32, I keep on.

Round 6: Talles - Show and Tell, yay!
G1: I open with IoK and open his hand with 2 Sneak Attacks, 1 Show and tell, 2 Griselbrands and 2 lands. I take Show and Tell out but I know i have the clock ticking for me. I manage to beat him down to 8 HP and when i get the second goyf to do the job he gets another Show and Tell and it's game.
Sideboard: +2 Hymn to Tourach, +2 Golgari Charm, +Surgical Extraction, +2 Rebs, +Chains +Diabolic Edict. -3 BBE (the logic for it was that I first must focus the amount of hate in my hand instead of believing I'm going to live 4 turns to play BBE), -3 Punishing Fire, -3 Grove.
G2: I can't remember my turn one play, but I remmeber I have surgical extraction in my hand, and he combos into emrakul with Sneak Attack quick enough to just destroy a single land i have in game.. But when Emrakul lands in the GY, I SExtraction him, and that leaves me to 3 hp and him to just 4 cards in the library that can kill me. It never happens and I win the game eventually.
G3: he goes land, Sensei top and go. I go Thoughtseize on him, and he hides stuff with brainstorm before lending me a hand with 2 Echoing truth, Gitaxian Probe and 2 Lands. I take Probe out. he draws, play land and pass. I play IoK and take out a Show and Tell out of his hand. He passes again, and I play a seocnd ioK for a second Show and tell! Dang! he passes again, and I draw and play Surgical Extraction targetting Show and tell and guess what? One in his hand and one on the top!! I actually burst out a laugh and he becomes a sad sad bear. However, my deck didn't help enough that no beaters ever came except for a Bob, which later on got Echoed back to my hand twice and we ended up on a draw. Sigh! 3-2-1

Round 7: Daniel - UW Miracles.
G1 was pretty straight up. He played rest in peace and then tutored for a Helm of Obedience. gg
Sideboard: +2 Rebs, 2 Golgari Charm, Chains of Mephistopheles (GAH why don't you even show up??), Pernicious Deed, Ancient Grudge, 2 Hymn to Tourach. -Punishing Fire suite, -1 Goyf, -Sylvan Library.
G2 let me effectivelly discard counterbalances and even Entreat the Angels thanks for hymn to tourach. He had several removals but not enough for 3 consecutive bobs. He does play Humility, but I Golgari Charm it the following turn. i manage to win.
G3 was a sad piece of story in which nobody ever had anything on board. He gets Countertop engine online, then doesn't due to A.Decay, I can't beat him with goyfs because he plays Rest in Peace. I get Liliana but I can't make an ultimate due to him playing Leyline of Sanctity, and etc. Miracles Shenaningans. The true star is BBE, which gets countered by a second Counterbalance with another Leyline on the top.. however it cascades into Golgari Charm, which destroys the one he has in play, and I manage to ultimate Liliana into a pile with CB and 3 plains, or a pile with 3 islands and RIP. He choses the latter. The game goes meh and eh.. I manage to destroy his RIP, and I keep draining his HP with a lucky Shaman that ends up alive and beating 2 hp per turn, until round time's up. He's 7 HP and we're in the 5 turns. I draw a tarmogoyf in the first turn of it, which WOULD give me the victory but he uses a fetch land, and topdecks Terminus. SIGH. 3-2-2

At this point I just play the last round because I'm there. However my opponent had dropped and didn't warn anyone, so I win by W.O. lol and end up 4-2-2 at 39th place. Fun times! Even though the result was subpar, I loved the deck with IoK, and shall continue to test on it.

[razvan]

I am not sure why you brought in Chains of Mephistopheles against Jund? To stop the one-of Sylvan Library?

[aluisiocsantos]

Haha, maybe it was silly of me but yes. I mean, I've done it before with a BG at another time, but I know it's just so random, even though if it DID had come to me G3 it would make my life less miserable, while if it was Sylvan Library instead both of us would be topdecking.

[WeatherseedMage]

In the mirror, as excited as I am to own and play my copy of Chains, I think that Library is the strictly better card. If they don't have their own Library, then you are up on cards. If they do have a Library then you are at parity.

Why did you kill the Eidolon in that situation? Just to attack later? Being at 4 or less is very dangerous vs burn as it makes most of their spells very live. Nonetheless, I think there are certainly lots of reasons to take that line, so it's too bad that it didn't work out.

[aluisiocsantos]

Yeah, basically. The other option would be waiting for BBE to show up, or Ooze, while he just wait for two more burn spells, so I tried gambling instead at him drawig nothing for two turns.

[WeatherseedMage]

I played an event tonight

Rd 1 vs Elves
g1: I get turn 3ed after Wastelanding a Dryad Arbor, next turn he plays another one and a Birchlore Ranger and goes hard mode.
g2: Play Bob on t2, he abrupt decays it and is sad on t3 when I play engineered plague
g3: opponent mulls to 5 and is on the play, but a thoughtseize on t1 gets something, he plays a non cradle land and then hymn to tourach gets the other two cards. That's pretty much it and no nature spirits live long that game.

Rd 2 vs Dredge
g1: I get turn 3ed, it happens
g2: I get a DRS/Thoughtseize/IoK hand. I lead with IoK and he kept a shaky hand so I take the only enabler. Next turn I play DRS, get around to Thoughtseizing after a few more turns and take an Ichorid and remove it with DRS. He scoops it up after a few more creatures come down.
g3: opponent mulls to 4 IRC, i t1 a cage and t2 a DRS, creature beats incoming. he is done

Rd 3 vs Shardless Bug
g1: out card advantaged. not sure if i made any real errors, but he drew many more and much better cards than i did.
g2: i lost because I played a Bob vs holding up mana to pay for a spell pierce on pyroblast targeting a ticking down ancestral visions (when it was on the stack). Silly mistake, but that's what happens. Then he had enough cards and got there.

I find the Shardless matchup really tough. How does it go for others? And how do you guys approach the match up and try to fight them?

[aluisiocsantos]

Pretty nice, good job beating Elves!

I dunno, I think the biggest secret for beating Shardless is not letting them cast Ancestral Visions. It's really terrible for us even if we can consistently build up card advantage with Punishing Fire (Most of their things die to it, except for Tarmogoyf) and Hymn to Tourach. So I guess try getting ahold of Pyroblasts ready when the spell comes down, and hold it in your hand when they hit 3 manas too since they can cast Shardless Agent and cascade into it, which is even worse. I like mass removals in this matchup too, such as Deeds, even if they play Toxic Deluge, if they manage to buy 3 cards that means theyll flood the board with Strix and everything else, so it's a nice little last resort which has saved my ass a few times.

[Neffy]

I find the Shardless matchup really tough. How does it go for others? And how do you guys approach the match up and try to fight them?

This is where Chains of Meph. becomes really good. Choke and blood moon also screws them over. I play 1 of each in the board (3 basics myself) and should do the trick. Moon also stops potential Creeping Tar Pits!

[Nuke is Good]

I played an event tonight
Rd 3 vs Shardless Bug
g1: out card advantaged. not sure if i made any real errors, but he drew many more and much better cards than i did.
g2: i lost because I played a Bob vs holding up mana to pay for a spell pierce on pyroblast targeting a ticking down ancestral visions (when it was on the stack). Silly mistake, but that's what happens. Then he had enough cards and got there.

I find the Shardless matchup really tough. How does it go for others? And how do you guys approach the match up and try to fight them?

I practiced against my friend that played shardless before. It's a pretty even matchup. Choke helps but it is subject to abrupt decay so it stalls a turn or two especially if they have a DRS in play, get rid of the deathrite shaman and you're golden. I side out like 2 of my BBE's in favor of pyroblasts and try to play more aggressively than them and that works a good amount for me.

Also, I love the punishing fire package for this.

[dsck]

g2: i lost because I played a Bob vs holding up mana to pay for a spell pierce on pyroblast targeting a ticking down ancestral visions (when it was on the stack). Silly mistake, but that's what happens. Then he had enough cards and got there.

I would not expect spell pierce from shardless bug (its horrible to cascade into) so I dont think that was a misplay.

[aluisiocsantos]

Yeah, if you have access to Chain of mephisto, I board them against every single blue deck. And Elves. And in shardless bug it totally breaks their biggest trumph: Ancestral Visions.

[WeatherseedMage]

This is where Chains of Meph. becomes really good. Choke and blood moon also screws them over. I play 1 of each in the board (3 basics myself) and should do the trick. Moon also stops potential Creeping Tar Pits!

Blood Moon seems really sketchy because it's so good AGAINST us, you must have warped your mana base to be able to include it, right? Choke does seem pretty good, I might have to relook at it as I think it helps out other combo matches as well.

I would not expect Spell Pierce from shardless bug (its horrible to cascade into) so I dont think that was a misplay.

Thanks man.

aluisiocsantos, Chains is good against most blue decks but vs Miracles, you should keep in Sylvan Library. They don't dig as much with actual cantrips but more with just rearranging the top. Elves, it seems fine to board it in against as well.

After playing more games with Surgical Extraction, I really like it. I played another weekly,

rd1: Pox Loam
g1 I lose to depths+stage
g2 I actually am able to grind him out with a critical thoughtseize into double goyf two turn sequence.
g3 He faithless lootings and pitches two life from the loam. I have surgical and I slam it when he passes the turn, tapped out still. I win from there, really.

rd2: OmniTell
g1: He wins fast, like t2 or t3
g2: I resolve Chains and we play for another few turns and he gives up
g3: I surgically extracted something I think, but I forget what it was and I get there.

rd3: RUG Delver
this whole match up was really sweet, very intricate and something I actually don't get to play very often
g1 I won through attrition. I was able to play around stifle at first, he had to reveal it, so then I was able to get through other removal.
g2: i mulled a hand I probably shouldn't have (it was one nonbasic and 2 drs and some other stuff, to be fair) and kept a 2 land, 1 drs and other things hand. Didn't get rewarded and got land locked out.
g3: Super close, but it was a few days ago so I have forgotten most things. I REBed a Brainstorm though and made him use a daze to let it resolve, that felt good. He was obviously digging, so that seemed right to me.

and that was it, 3-0 a weekly.

[Dice_Box]

Question, would it be worth running two Chains of Mephistopheles in the side? I am going to be grabbing one next week, but spending so much on a one off that I may never see feels silly. Maybe I am over thinking it buy would not two be more impactful?