Feelings about show and tell being banned

[Tammit67]

Any deck that doesn't put pressure on Sneak Show will lose to inevitability. RUG and BUG Tempo can beat this Sneak Attack versions by dropping a fast Delver/Goyf and riding soft counters to victory. Thalia + KotR also beat this deck on a regular basis.

BUG tempo is nice because of the discard, but I've found RUG to not have the disruption package to adequately face them. Pierce/daze never seem do much against show when I'm the one casting the daze. It pretty much comes down to do I have force and can they beat it if I do. And often preboard it is yes. Postboard REB is nice, but I really dislike playing as RUG preboard in the amtchup

[walker]

Why isn't anyone talking about banning Brainstorm? Can we have that conversation again too? Please? /endtroll

[Megadeus]

Brainstorm is so broken. We should just ban every one drop. They are just too good for only one mana.

[Shawon]

Brainstorm is so broken. We should just ban every one drop. They are just too good for only one mana.

Now that you mention it, fucking Healing Salve. There's just something about that card that makes my blood boil...

[Koby]

Now that you mention it, fucking Healing Salve. There's just something about that card that makes my blood boil...

I agree. In the format's best deck (Nourishing Lich), it better than Ancestral Recall. Clearly b0rken!

[nedleeds]

Show and Tell decks wouldn't work without 4 x Brainstorm ... I'm just saying ...

[Lejay]

Apparently 32% of the votes register would be happy to see it gone, putting them in the clear minority.

Being happy about show and tell being banned doesn't mean you where crying about the card. You can have a very good match-up against show and tell decks and yet still hate the way the games play out because it's so uninteresting.

[menace13]

If they're going to ban SnT, then they might as well just implement Ari Lax's Legacy ban list.


LetMeKnowIfIAmDoingThisRight:

Personally I think Storm has more of a negative impact on what can be played in Legacy.

Most decks can't beat storm, and some archetypes simply can't exist with the deck around. I hate when my opponent resolves a bunch of mana and tutors into the nuts because their deck is all mana and tutors. Deck is actually like playing with 4x Black Lotus and Demonic Tutor most of the time, and almost everyone agrees that those are busted in half.


Also, Brainstorm

[lavafrogg]

There is no "show and tell" hate card that can be side boarded in against it to better your matchup. General cards work like thoughtseize, wasteland, Thalia, but they are all super situational. One round you can play a Show and Tell player that shows in a griselbrand you bring in an O ring, they draw 7 and blow you out. Sometimes you have the O-ring and they land the sneak and sneak in an Emrakul...and blow you out.

Wasteland can slow them down but some hands do not give a fuck about wasteland. Every deck has certain cards that it does not want to see played against it. Show and tell cannot be stopped by a single card and the many decks it spawns even require different hate cards to fight...hive mind, omniscience, sneak attack, emrakul, reanimator, dream halls...the only commonality is getting to 3 mana and winning the game with counter magic back up.

Graveyard decks have the most ridiculous forms of hate imaginable. Storm not only has to fight through discard and counters but super effective hate bears/artifacts/lock pieces. Green midrange decks suck it to a perish, while goblins/weenies hate sweepers/pyroclasms in general. Print efficient hate cards for show and tell and I will not hate it, for now...fuck that stupid card.

[menace13]

There is no "show and tell" hate card that can be side boarded in against it to better your matchup. General cards work like thoughtseize, wasteland, Thalia, but they are all super situational. One round you can play a Show and Tell player that shows in a griselbrand you bring in an O ring, they draw 7 and blow you out. Sometimes you have the O-ring and they land the sneak and sneak in an Emrakul...and blow you out.

Wasteland can slow them down but some hands do not give a fuck about wasteland. Every deck has certain cards that it does not want to see played against it. Show and tell cannot be stopped by a single card and the many decks it spawns even require different hate cards to fight...hive mind, omniscience, sneak attack, emrakul, reanimator, dream halls...the only commonality is getting to 3 mana and winning the game with counter magic back up.

Graveyard decks have the most ridiculous forms of hate imaginable. Storm not only has to fight through discard and counters but super effective hate bears/artifacts/lock pieces. Green midrange decks suck it to a perish, while goblins/weenies hate sweepers/pyroclasms in general. Print efficient hate cards for show and tell and I will not hate it, for now...fuck that stupid card.

It is true that there is not a single one card that can beat Show And Tell decks. There are a lot of cards that beat it half of the time. Karakas, Humility, Venser, O-Rings, AoDespair. Commonly played cards interact with it as well. The deck isn't winning enough, so clearly some cards beat it. Seems obvious.

The Show and Tell personal hate is making people say any old stupid shit to justify them feeling bad about the card.

How the fuk is Thoughtseize super situational against Show and Tell?...... Because, They don't need cards in hand?(trollollface)

And, somehow Thoughtseize, to you, is not situational against other decks, only Show And Tell? Righhhttt. Seems logical, brah.

Discard is big game against Show decks.

Hint: Wasteland works the way you described it against, wait.. for.. it... .. every deck with non basic lands.

Storm players saying the deck is not fun, uninteresting to play against

For the record, I love the damned card, and every deck it goes into. I guess I can understand people hating certain cards. I hate creatures under 8 mana, and Red cards. Discuss.

[xfxf]

As much as the hate against S&T is narrow (kind of a hit and miss thing) their attack vectors are also a hit and miss against a wide range of narrow hate cards. When they go for Omniscience route they don't know whether they'll be hit with Angel of Despair or when they go Sneak Attack they don't know they won't be hit by Humility. The variance goes both ways, I think that's what keeps S&T decks in check.

The longer S&T stays in the format the harder it will be for them to ban the card and the harder the backlash will be when/if they do. I think if they are going to eventually do it they should do it at the next cycle because more and more people are getting into S&T decks, lots and lots of different decks are being built around the card or just standing on its shoulders as a sideboard backup plan so it will be quite a shitstorm if they do it when more people are on board.

[Purgatory]

I'd be sad. I just love aiming my 50 cent Spell Pierces at people's $60+ sorceries.

[Jayman]

Please let's not turn legacy into a turn guys sideways format. I left standard for that very reason. It's just board control vs aggro decks so boring. The great thing about legacy is knowing people can do broken stuff but usually things like show and tell are very all in so it's not a problem. In all honesty I think adrupt decay is more oppressive then show since show you can you actually interact with. Speaking of which show and tell matchups are more interactive and interesting I rather play against show then let's something like goblins any day. Just to let you guys know I'm not a combo player.

[Nihil Credo]

It's not meant to be a discussion about the banning.

"How would you feel if this card were to be banned?" isn't a discussion about the banning? Oh please.