Ya. Not sure what your getting at. Trigger on the stack, crypt you.
Ah - finally... crypt still in your deck not on your hand!
Nice move! Didn't think of that before your comment. Thanks!
Haven't done that one yet. Looking forward to it. I love it when people's jaw drops when welder does very very broken things.
Am goblins player.Originally Posted by mcbain
Can confirm my jaw did drop first time i saw the old activate grindstone, weld in painter. I can't even be mad.
Last edited by Stevestamopz; 04-15-2015 at 12:04 PM.
See, that's not even broken things. Just a good ol' interaction that'll gib some people
Welder gets filthy when welding in a revoker naming the thing they're attempting, or pretending to stall out on mana but bring that one lotus petal out for the final mana after the opp shifted their play
it's good times
I'm a big fan of the deck. One day when I finally put down my pathetic deck, (death and taxes is far too boring for me to move to) I'll start playing painter.
What are people doing for grixis pyromancer besides the obvious of blood moon and fast combo god hand.
I haven't played much against it but it's been unfavorable so far. Could just be lack of luck with t1 fow and misboarding by shaving mana and tutors since they have better late game. I've been thinking that I can probably drop the sphere of law and go back to praying against burn. 8th blast? Shard phoenix? Leaning the blast since miracles is still at large but will listen to opinions on the matchup
Strawberry Shortcake
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake
What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
#FreeNedleeds
Grixis Pyro is a lot less scary than u/r delver in my opinion. I played a bit against it last weekend, and found that Sudden Shock/Firebolt is enough to contain pyromancers if you kill them off immediately. I also think keeping opening hands that are less susceptible to Cabal Therapy helped me a lot. In 2 games, I kept 4-5 landers with a top, and won pretty easily since they don't have a ton in the way of mana denial. Goblin Welder is also super strong as the usual insurance/removal sponge role.
Maybe a sweeper/EE would be helpful, or sphere of law if you have it, but without swiftspears and treasure cruise, the matchup feels pretty beatable to me at least.
First we have two decks which play somewhat differently, one more aggressive and one more controlling (i.e., delver or not). My experience is more centered around the pyromancer control version which I lost in the finals to at a recent legacy tourney. I was playing something similar to your deck you won the SCG with and boarded the Sphere in among other things.
For the most part my opponents will play a very conservative game, electing to develop their basics, hold up counters, etc. Pyromancer is often a turn 3-4 play. To make things more difficult the deck plays 4 lightning bolts as well as other cards to disrupt your combo (force, therapy, pyroblast, counterspell) not to mention things like surgical extraction and blue blast out of the sideboard which can be snapcastered. Even worse are one of's like Dack and Null Rod.
Overall I would say this is a challenging matchup assuming the opponent knows their deck and knows their role. Jack, you mentioned a fast blood moon or combo which I would agree are both somewhat reasonable plays. I would be tempted to shave some blood moon effects on the draw as your opponent will likely fetch their basic, have discard, or have a counter. Thorn, 3sphere, canoist, rest in peace, sphere of law, and firebolts are all cards against them. Having played Grixis I can attest that anything which slows your game plan down and makes your digs harder to cast is a good thing. Because Grixis is scared of your combo they will typically not fight over firebolts which kill their few threats and elect to let them resolve in fear of the combo kill. Further to that point I found red blasting the Dig through time very strong.
I would tend to play the match up more as a death and taxes control role. Take the velocity out of their deck, play like your going to kill them at any point (which you can), not over extend. Cards like sphere are quite strong against them because it makes them actually commit to something, not just incidentally win with a bunch of tokens made over the course of five turns.
Yeah, I pretty much agree with all of the above. Fast moons slow them down. Obviously bringing in creature removal (I have moved to 3 sudden shocks in board) and the sphere are good. I am still playing leylines which I tend to bring in against them so they can't therapy or bolt me. This is also one match-up where, if I were playing Assemble the legion over processor, I would consider bringing it in as well, as they have very few answers to it if it sticks. Otherwise, sphere is obviously really good if you can get it to stick. And given the popularity of this deck recently, I think sphere has successfully avoided the chopping block for me. Now I'm still just wavering between Assemble and Processor in the board and Magus vs Revoker getting the nod in the main.
Should I lean on E. Bridge in this matchup? They might not have enough removal to stop welders and painters, it would be a long game but it might have a shot.
You're reasoning your question with speculation. Maybe that says something already, or maybe you're asking the wrong questions
And am I doing something wrong by running pyroclasm over Firebolt/sudden shock? Haven't played for months, going to a local this weekend, thus blind.
I ran sudden Demise to some effect last weekend. Similar role but can be used with painter to great effect.
Been thinkin of building this deck as my second one, but have a couple of questions.
Are the white really necessary? I quite dislike enlightment tutor :S but I like the sideboard cards.
Is any other color been tried before? Pure curiosity
Is Jaya really situatuional? Never seen someone play it although is always in every deck. Maybe just been unlucky in the games I watched.
And why Firebolt instead of swords? Is it the lack of access to white?
Thanks for the help :)
White necessary? Short answer is no. It simply is a variant that changes certain MU and speed.
Splashes from front page
White – Enlightened Tutor, Stoneforge Mystic, Ethersworn Canonist, others
Black – Perish, Nature’s Ruin, Dark Confidant, others
Blue – Trinket Mage, Laboratory Maniac, others
No record of Green splash (with imperial painter)
Jaya? She's great value and games have been won with her when no other card could've.
STP/ firebolt? Correct the white mana isn't very consistent to allow mainboarded STP in most shortcake lists.
Last edited by Uroborian; 04-17-2015 at 12:40 PM. Reason: Typos
I would just build a standard mono red deck to start, perhaps one johnothan Suarez or leejay has played. The mono red deck can be more robust and teaches you the fundamentals of painter before you start getting fancy with splashes.
I also think starting with mono red is a good idea. Though the decks are very very similar, it's less punishing of mistakes, and gives you the foundation of knowledge to make the call on the white splash for yourself and the metagame.
Generally speaking, r/w is less "overkill" in good matchups, but stronger against bad ones.
I think the most popular alternate secondary color is blue, as you can intuition for key pieces and use welder to bounce things in and out of play as necessary. You can also then play brainstorm and/or transmute artifact as well to help find combo pieces. The most frustrating thing about the mono red version is that it feels like you tend to get into top deck mode more often and when you are looking for combo pieces, that can be very frustrating.
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Says the player under a blood moon effect waiting to top deck their one or two basic lands while being beaten down by a Grey ogre.
From GP kyoto:
OmniTell and Delver decks are among the most popular at the top tables, but mixed in are many others including Miracles, Infect, Death and Taxes, and Elves. Even 9-0 player Ryuichi Shirakihara ran the tables with Charbelcher today.
Looks like we need to ensure our UR delver matchup and omni matchup is better if we want to bring down a big tourney.
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