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Thread: [Deck] Imperial Painter

  1. #5001
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by finksfinksfinks View Post
    It sounds like shortcake is having a lot of success with canonist. Thoughts on putting dampening sphere in the side? It shuts down Sol lands a bit, but then so does moon
    I assume you mean primarily for the storm matchup? I don't know how much better it is than something like Thorn, if at all. They're going to need to answer either before they can combo off, and Thorn does a better job of disrupting their cantrips.

  2. #5002

    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by jasper View Post
    I assume you mean primarily for the storm matchup? I don't know how much better it is than something like Thorn, if at all. They're going to need to answer either before they can combo off, and Thorn does a better job of disrupting their cantrips.
    Recruiter tutors for Canonist... Guessing that's the reason for the inclusion over Thorn.

  3. #5003
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by vieko View Post
    Recruiter tutors for Canonist... Guessing that's the reason for the inclusion over Thorn.
    Canonist is a great card, and being tutorable by Recruiter is definitely relevant. But the person I was responding to was asking about Damping Sphere for Imperial Painter, and I was asking why you would play it over Thorn. (They are both worse than Canonist.)

  4. #5004

    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by jasper View Post
    Canonist is a great card, and being tutorable by Recruiter is definitely relevant. But the person I was responding to was asking about Damping Sphere for Imperial Painter, and I was asking why you would play it over Thorn. (They are both worse than Canonist.)
    Ah yes! That makes more sense @jasper.

  5. #5005

    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by jasper View Post
    I would say that the baseline for Imperial Painter (mono-red) looks something like this:

    4 Grindstone
    4 Painter's Servant
    4 Imperial Recruiter

    4 Blood Moon
    1-2 Magus of the Moon

    3-4 Simian Spirit Guide
    2-3 Lotus Petal
    0-1 Chrome Mox

    1-3 Goblin Welder
    0-2 Phyrexian Revoker
    0-1 Spellskite
    0-1 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
    0-1 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
    0-1 Manic Vandal

    0-2 Abrade
    2-3 Ensnaring Bridge

    4 Pyroblast
    1-3 Red Elemental Blast

    2-4 Chandra, Torch of Defiance

    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 City of Traitors
    9-11 Mountain
    0-2 Great Furnace

    //Sideboard [note that any of the maindeck recruitable creatures are often found split between main and side depending on meta, and sometimes additional copies of cards like Bridge and Chandra are also boarded]

    0-4 Thorn of Amethyst
    0-3 Pyroclasm
    0-2 Sudden Demise
    0-2 Sudden Shock
    0-2 Faerie Macabre
    0-3 Tormod's Crypt
    0-2 Surgical Extraction
    0-2 Fiery Confluence


    See posts #4991 and #4938 for some recent examples.

    Recently, mono-red seems to have moved a little more towards a Dragon Stompy-esque strategy (although this is arguable, and has been argued on this very thread haha). This means, in short, more fast mana, more moons, and more 4-mana haymakers in Chandra/Pia and Kiran.

    The Strawberry Shortcake (red-white) lists are aiming to use Enlightened Tutor to find combo (and sometimes lock) pieces, where the moon plan is incidentally. Recently, Ethersworn Canonist has been adopted as another maindeck tool and people are experimenting with fewer Moons. The predominant development in Shortcake lately has been leveraging Smuggler's Copter for card selection and as an additional threat in the wake of the Sensei's Divining Top banning. This has driven the deck to play more creatures in order to be able to reliably crew it, placing constraints on deck construction that don't exist in the same way in mono-red.
    Is the new Karn going to see play here as well? Been following the dragon stompy list recently, but more incline to play painter deck haha

  6. #5006
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    I was judging GP Birmingham this weekend and noticed some Painter decks running the new Karn. Anyone with the feedback of how good the cards is for us?
    Quote Originally Posted by Skeggi View Post
    Game 3: turn 1: Chalice@1, turn 2: Sea Drake, turn 3: equip Sea Drake with SoFI. Drakes from the sea with flaming swords which are also frozen at the same time cause destruction of Biblical proportions. Just the way God intended.

  7. #5007

    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Been dying to play this deck for a long time and finally was able to put a list together.

    It's some number of whatever is quoted a couple of posts up.

    Not being able to win because I couldn't draw into a Grindstone felt pretty lousy. Do we just mull until we have Grindstone in our opening hand? Played two rounds only (got a bye the first time I brought the deck out :-( ). 2 Welders.
    I don't want to go into White or Blue. What about Gamble?


    Thanks.
    "I made a Redguard that looks like Kimbo Slice. He wrecks peoples' shit. And dragons." - Bignasty197

  8. #5008
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by Octopusman View Post
    Been dying to play this deck for a long time and finally was able to put a list together.

    It's some number of whatever is quoted a couple of posts up.

    Not being able to win because I couldn't draw into a Grindstone felt pretty lousy. Do we just mull until we have Grindstone in our opening hand? Played two rounds only (got a bye the first time I brought the deck out :-( ). 2 Welders.
    I don't want to go into White or Blue. What about Gamble?


    Thanks.
    I think there is scope to explore running more Welders again now that Deathrite is gone, with the caveat that the increase in sideboaeded graveyard hate necessary to fight graveyard decks will affect how you sideboard.

    Not drawing combo pieces can happen. Gamble is definitely an option, particularly if you run more Welders. The other options we have for increasing consistency are planeswalkers (Chandra and Karn) and Smuggler's Copter, which incidentally also gets better with more Welders.

    The other thing to note is that variance is a thing, don't worry too much or lose hope because you've had a few bad games. The deck is surprisingly skill intensive to play correctly with the tutors and blasts; deploying them correctly is challenging and part of what makes the deck fun to play.
    Last edited by jasper; 07-16-2018 at 07:35 AM.

  9. #5009

    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by jasper View Post
    I think there is scope to explore running more Welders again now that Deathrite is gone, with the caveat that the increase in sideboaeded graveyard hate necessary to fight graveyard decks will affect how you sideboard.

    Not drawing combo pieces can happen. Gamble is definitely an option, particularly if you run more Welders. The other options we have for increasing consistency are planeswalkers (Chandra and Karn) and Smuggler's Copter, which incidentally also gets better with more Welders.

    The other thing to note is that variance is a thing, don't worry too much lose hope because you've had a few bad games. The deck is surprisingly skill intensive to play correctly with the tutors and blasts; deploying them correctly is challenging and part of what makes the deck fun to play.
    Thank you for your repl, Jasper. I think I’ll try copters... give something recruiter to do... :)
    I may try gambles too. I think I like these better than Chandra Torch +1 to dig.
    "I made a Redguard that looks like Kimbo Slice. He wrecks peoples' shit. And dragons." - Bignasty197

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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    I think I want to try the deck out. I really have been itching to play welder and this deck has always intrigued me. Now that I can get plebeian recruiters for cheap I think I'm in. I see a "stock" sort of list. Should I just start with a minor tutor target list at first or what?
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  11. #5011
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
    I think I want to try the deck out. I really have been itching to play welder and this deck has always intrigued me. Now that I can get plebeian recruiters for cheap I think I'm in. I see a "stock" sort of list. Should I just start with a minor tutor target list at first or what?
    As far as 'stock lists' go, check out my post on the last page #4999. It's a sort of template for imperial painter and has a couple of links on it to pre-ban lists.

    In terms of your tutor target list, I would start with just the basics and figure out your playstyle and what would work in whatever meta you're playing the deck in. What are you thinking of putting in?

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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by jasper View Post
    As far as 'stock lists' go, check out my post on the last page #4999. It's a sort of template for imperial painter and has a couple of links on it to pre-ban lists.

    In terms of your tutor target list, I would start with just the basics and figure out your playstyle and what would work in whatever meta you're playing the deck in. What are you thinking of putting in?
    Nothing crazy really. Just wanted to see what everyone is thinking in the new meta. I have been thinking between this and shortcake and I feel like this is a bit better suited for the meta even though Kapn Cook has been putting up results. I think there are many decks (like in modern) that are pretty cold to mainboard ensnaring bridge right now and I want to play multiple especially if sneak is gonna be back.
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  13. #5013
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Kap, your inbox is full!

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  14. #5014
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
    Nothing crazy really. Just wanted to see what everyone is thinking in the new meta. I have been thinking between this and shortcake and I feel like this is a bit better suited for the meta even though Kapn Cook has been putting up results. I think there are many decks (like in modern) that are pretty cold to mainboard ensnaring bridge right now and I want to play multiple especially if sneak is gonna be back.
    If you're running Ensnaring Bridge and intending to run multiples, which I agree is good in this meta, I prefer a build with Chandra rather than Karn + Copters.

  15. #5015
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by jasper View Post
    If you're running Ensnaring Bridge and intending to run multiples, which I agree is good in this meta, I prefer a build with Chandra rather than Karn + Copters.
    I agree. And although I'm more likely to run shortcake as well (tutors and canonists? Yes please), I am also struggling with the decision of lots of Bridges and main deck blood moon with Chandras or copters. Its amazing how often you win with copter beatdown but with show and tell and eldrazi really on the up tick I would want multiple Bridges as well. I guess it depends on what you plan to run up against.

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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    I agree. And although I'm more likely to run shortcake as well (tutors and canonists? Yes please), I am also struggling with the decision of lots of Bridges and main deck blood moon with Chandras or copters. Its amazing how often you win with copter beatdown but with show and tell and eldrazi really on the up tick I would want multiple Bridges as well. I guess it depends on what you plan to run up against.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
    I mean, Bridge isn't terrible even with Copters if you are patient and careful about not playing extra lands. Also, not playing bridges until you're sure you want them, and so on. The other option is to have a flexible way (that doesn't mean a lot of card disadvantage) to deal with your own bridge in a pinch, like Transmute Artifact in blue lists.

  17. #5017
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    Went 3-1 tonight at my local with my first run of the deck. Only have 1 City of Traitors unfortunately right now so had to do with ghetto painter, but it was fine.

    List I believe:
    3 Goblin Welder
    4 Painter's Servant
    4 Imperial Recruiter
    1 Phyrexian Revoker
    1 Walking Ballista
    2 Magus of the Moon
    3 Simian Spirit Guide
    2 Smuggler's Copter

    4 Grindstone
    2 Abrade
    2 Lotus Petal
    3 Blood Moon
    2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
    4 Pyroblast
    3 Ensnaring Bridge

    4 Ancient Tomb
    1 City of Traitors
    2 Great Furnace
    13 Mountain


    Sideboard:
    2 Phyrexian Revoker
    2 Tormod's Crypt
    2 Surgical Extraction
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    2 Grim Lavamancer
    1 Viashino Heretic
    1 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
    2 Sulfer Elemental
    1 Pyroclasm
    1 Sudden Demise

    Clasm should be a second Demise probably. Surgicals maybe should be just more Crypt. The main board felt pretty great the whole time. Viashino Heretic was powerful but kind of slow, maybe Vandal is better.

    Round 1: BG Depths
    Game 1 I have a slow beat down hand and never find a moon or bridge. I go to attack with smugglers copter and he blows me out with eot crop rotation off of ESG with a Hexmage in play.
    Game 2 I have a turn 2 Moon hand with not much else going on. He has Duress and I never draw anything else besides lands.
    We play a few more games and I win all 3 of them which conforms my suspicion that it's probably a good match up, but bad luck happens.

    Round 2: Grixis
    Game 1 I am on the draw. Turn 1 Welder, Turn 2 Smugglers Copter, turn 3 he taps down for true name, I play a sol land, cast painter, crew copter, attack and loot away grindstone, welder away copter for grindstone exile SSG and activate. This deck is so fucking sick.
    Game 2 he plays USea and passes. I go Petal into Magus of the Moon. He drops a swamp and passes. I simply attack for 2. I know he's on KCommands so I'm not gonna play my painter yet. He plays another USea. I cast Painter with a mana open, go to attack, he casts command on shatter and shock mode. I Pyroblast for the blowout. He draws for turn and concedes to my grindstone next turn.

    Round 3: Mono Red Sneak
    Game 1 He has mountain + Petal. I know what he's on so I play Revoker. I name Sneak attack instead of Petal. He plays a turn 2 Chandra and makes a Chalice on 1 with the mana ability of her. I attack chandra and cast a painter. He seething songs into Through the Breach and Emrakuls me. Ruff
    Game 2 I get welder going and drop an ensnaring bridge. He makes a chalice and makes a combustible gearhulk which I let dome me. I get painter. I abrade chalice and pyroblast his Through the Breach. I attack him with Smugglers Copter to death.
    Game 3 I get welder going again and revoke Sneak Attack. He wipes the board. I play Bridge. Get a second bridge and welder. At some point he casts Chandra and I weld one of my bridges for Revoker in response naming chandra. He didn't see it coming. I attack Chandra and he gets chalice for 2. I recruit for Viashino and next turn hit the chalice. He kills heretc but has no follow up and after he does another board wipe I Drop Chandra and +1 her to victory while he has no outs to Bridge left in his deck.
    I think game 2 and 3 maybe got mixed up a bit, but Bridges were MVP

    Round 4: Eldrazi Post
    Game 1 I open with a weak hand. Turn 1 Ballista into turn 2 Painter and just attack. I pump ballista and he spyglasses me off of grindstone (which ended up not mattering because he has big eldrazi to shuffle back in). I find a moon right on time to keep him off of big mana and I beat him to death while pumping Ballista every turn.
    Game 2 He plays a turn 2 Expedition Map. I turn 1 Grindstone into I turn 2 Revoker for map. He misses a land drop with just 2 Glimmerpost in play so I suspect Warping Wail. I play Tormods Crypt and painter with mana to activate, but I want to hold up blast. He spyglasses and names Stone and drew tomb to keep up wail. He wails, I have to blast. I Play a blood moon. He then monoliths into Thought Knot and takes my 2nd Grindstone over a 2nd Moon. I have a blast in hand but he has 2 spyglass now. I blast a second Thought Knot. He gets a 3rd and it takes my excess Moon. I recruit for Viashino but my life is getting low. Instead of Electing to double block a Thought Knot I just chump figuring I have all the tools to win on board I just need to Heretic his Spyglasses rather than trying to draw cards since I'm choked at 3 mana anyway. I have just enough Chump blocks to survive the Thought Knot Onslaught and heretic the last Spyglass and grind him and then Crypt with the Eldrazi Triggers on the stack.

    I really liked the deck overall. It was wicked fun, felt powerful, and it was nice to see my opponents on the backfoot. I think being patient was really key, trying to pick my spots rather than just going for it and getting blown out.
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  18. #5018
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    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    2-2 tonight. Lost to DnT because I kept having to keep one landers and couldn't draw more to save my life. Lost a close one to infect. I thought ballista for 2 was gonna lock it up, but he had all the pump spellsand top decked berserk just in time despite him countering all the wrong spells and even blowing a berserk on a non attacking painter thinking it would kill it. Magic sucks sometimes
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  19. #5019

  20. #5020

    Re: [Deck] Imperial Painter

    That is freaking spicy. Has it seemed competitive? I'd love to hear the thinking behind it if you get a chance.

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