[Deck] Imperial Painter

[NormalGuy]

With Bomb + welder you'll still need to trade some artifact to get the bomb back into play right? Or am I missing an interaction somewhere.

[jandax]

Yes, because otherwise when the Welder activation goes on the stack, if there is no exchange of artifacts (whether the targetted artifact was destroyed in response, the GY removed, etc) then the ability fizzles. Legal targets and all.

For what it's worth, Cage also stops Elves from fetching up Dryad Arbor.

[GoblinZ]

So do you side out your moon against goblin? top deck moon is bad, maybe leave 1-3 moon effect in depending on what your sb is like. I did not say koth is useless, it is not that good. It is hard to cast with thalia on the field.

[jandax]

I don't side out Magus because he can still block. But yes, generally Moons go out to make room for sweepers and Revokers

[Parax]

@Jandax: How'd you do at the GPT?

[jandax]

Didn't go, weather was too nice. Gonna go in a couple weeks.

[mcbain]

I ran jandax's list at my weekly tourney recently. I switched from playing the lightning bolt/Chandra builds which have been doing well on the SCG circuit, myself going 7-3 with it at SCG Seattle recently.

10 Mountain
3 Red Fetchlands
3 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb

4 Recruiter
4 Painter
4 SSG
4 Grindstone
4 Blood Moon
6 Blasts (2 REB/4 Pyro)
3 Top
3 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Koth of the Hammer
1 Goblin Welder
1 Jaya Ballard
2 Magus of the Moon
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Lotus Petal


SB:

1 Grafdigger's Cage
4 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Sudden Demise
2 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Manic Vandal
2 ratchet bomb
1 goblin welder

The sideboard will be -2 bomb and +2 cage in the future when I get two more. Maybe another with the welder out. Well see though.

Matchups :

R1: Punishing Jund, 2-0.

These games were both won on the back of an early blood moon. The guy was somewhat newer to legacy, so that might have accounted for some of it. Key plays, waiting for tap out at eot to blow up his basic land when he can't kill your painter.

R2: UR omni tell, 2-0.

These were tight games were I was in the right place at the right time.
Game 1, I had an early grindstone with some counters. I played jaya turn 4 he then played show and tell in to emarakul... I show and telled painter... gg.
Game 2, mull to 6 and lay down an turn two thorn, followed by painter, then magus. I proceed to beat down well countering the show and tells.

Thorn is very strong in this matchup, we played more games after. I feel this is a 40-60 for them, thorn and moon makes them play fair. I almost never cast bridge in the early game instead letting them play around/into it when they want to show and tell their dude early. Try to bluff having a blast up at all times.

R3: Dredge, 2-1.

Game one was feature match worthy with me winning a very close and long game under a bridge. Almost died stuck on two koth's in hand and 3 land in play. I turn one'd LED to prevent a blow out.

Game two I boarded 12 cards played a turn 1 bridge over a turn one blood moon, again to prevent a blow out (holding 3 monkeys for the begin combat discard). He proceeds to eot natures claim and explode.... I die shortly there after.

Game three I get out a thorn and moon to slow him then get the painter kill by turn four or five.

R4: ANT, ID.

We play a few games preboard back and forth for fun. Preboard is hard because there are quite a few dead cards in the deck. Stop their draw if you can't get an early painter out. Vindicating their lands is a good option to strengthen a soft lock if you have dudes on the board.

I really liked the lotus petal over city of traitors and will continue testing it in the future.



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[jandax]

That's what's up. Last weekend I played against ANT three rounds in a row and luck was on my side. Three times they fizzled from 15 life on an AdN. But to be fair I lost all game one's as per tradition.

[Imperial]

I ran jandax's list at my weekly tourney recently. I switched from playing the lightning bolt/Chandra builds which have been doing well on the SCG circuit, myself going 7-3 with it at SCG Seattle recently.

10 Mountain
3 Red Fetchlands
3 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb

4 Recruiter
4 Painter
4 SSG
4 Grindstone
4 Blood Moon
6 Blasts (2 REB/4 Pyro)
3 Top
3 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Koth of the Hammer
1 Goblin Welder
1 Jaya Ballard
2 Magus of the Moon
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Lotus Petal


SB:

1 Grafdigger's Cage
4 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Sudden Demise
2 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Manic Vandal
2 ratchet bomb
1 goblin welder

The sideboard will be -2 bomb and +2 cage in the future when I get two more. Maybe another with the welder out. Well see though.

Matchups :

R1: Punishing Jund, 2-0.

These games were both won on the back of an early blood moon. The guy was somewhat newer to legacy, so that might have accounted for some of it. Key plays, waiting for tap out at eot to blow up his basic land when he can't kill your painter.

R2: UR omni tell, 2-0.

These were tight games were I was in the right place at the right time.
Game 1, I had an early grindstone with some counters. I played jaya turn 4 he then played show and tell in to emarakul... I show and telled painter... gg.
Game 2, mull to 6 and lay down an turn two thorn, followed by painter, then magus. I proceed to beat down well countering the show and tells.

Thorn is very strong in this matchup, we played more games after. I feel this is a 40-60 for them, thorn and moon makes them play fair. I almost never cast bridge in the early game instead letting them play around/into it when they want to show and tell their dude early. Try to bluff having a blast up at all times.

R3: Dredge, 2-1.

Game one was feature match worthy with me winning a very close and long game under a bridge. Almost died stuck on two koth's in hand and 3 land in play. I turn one'd LED to prevent a blow out.

Game two I boarded 12 cards played a turn 1 bridge over a turn one blood moon, again to prevent a blow out (holding 3 monkeys for the begin combat discard). He proceeds to eot natures claim and explode.... I die shortly there after.

Game three I get out a thorn and moon to slow him then get the painter kill by turn four or five.

R4: ANT, ID.

We play a few games preboard back and forth for fun. Preboard is hard because there are quite a few dead cards in the deck. Stop their draw if you can't get an early painter out. Vindicating their lands is a good option to strengthen a soft lock if you have dudes on the board.

I really liked the lotus petal over city of traitors and will continue testing it in the future.



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Nice job man! Damn, I think it's time for me to hop onto the main bridge plan...

[jandax]

MD Bridge is not winmoar it's necessary nowadays. I like where my list is at now, main deck at least. I'm glad others enjoy it too!

[lambert101]

@jandax

What are your common side boarding principles with this new list? I am still working on the same main deck principles that you have. Thank you.

[mcbain]

Having read your sideboard recommendations over the last few pages I would generally agree with you. I feel the most important thing I've learned from playing this deck is knowing what your specific game plan in each game of each match is. How you mulligan your hands, what wins and what loses.

This is key in close games like show and tell decks, elves, death and taxes, and even affinity.

I learned very very quickly we are almost always the control deck. I remember feeling like jamming things like blood moon or bridge were important, more importantly its resolving and protecting our game winning spells. Often its correct to wait to play that moon just because it will win regardless of when its cast. Once your soft lock is established our X6 vindicates clean things up.

For a while I ran two spellsikes in the main deck and people just lost their shit over it. Often times decks will have a very narrow out to our locks and the skite does a very good job at this.

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[jandax]

@jandax

What are your common side boarding principles with this new list? I am still working on the same main deck principles that you have. Thank you.

mcbain covered the most important point, knowing what wins and what loses. We are definitely the control in almost every matchup, so we should never chose to play the combo or aggro matchup when we're more dedicated to controling the board before winning the game. I take it upon myself to know what spells have priority in any given matchup and then run the others out to bait their removal/counters/etc. before resolving the ones that matter. In general, with this list, you wind up shaving cards more than cutting cards. Going down to one Koth, or cut a mountain, or shave a Magus, and so on. The main deck is pretty much pre-sideboarded. You just need to supplement it in most matchups. Some you cut cards entirely, it'll happen. The deck is concentrated with must counter/deal with cards for most opposing strategies, so while iPainter is mostly the control, it's proactively controlling the game, and often the tempo of the match.

[Nitrospira]

One minor tip that I haven't seen anybody mention:
REB is better than Pyroblast in a few fringe situations. While their oracles are very similar, Pyroblast can be forced by Divert/Misdirection to target a non-blue permanent or spell, then will fizzle. REB, on the other hand, can only target blue permanents or spells, so even if its target gets changed it will still blow up something.
So I would run the full set of REBs before adding in Pyroblasts, instead of the 3/3 split I usually see

[Kap'n Cook]

One minor tip that I haven't seen anybody mention:
REB is better than Pyroblast in a few fringe situations. While their oracles are very similar, Pyroblast can be forced by Divert/Misdirection to target a non-blue permanent or spell, then will fizzle. REB, on the other hand, can only target blue permanents or spells, so even if its target gets changed it will still blow up something.
So I would run the full set of REBs before adding in Pyroblasts, instead of the 3/3 split I usually see

Sorry, but this is wrong. Not the rules part, but the logic part. Every list is (or should be) running ensnaring bridges. You want to be able to cast a blast without having a painter in play if need be. So the full set of pyros is better than the first reb. It is better to hedge against cards that are guaranteed to be in the match (bridge) than it is against cards you might barely ever see (misdirection)

[Ish]

Sorry, but this is wrong. Not the rules part, but the logic part. Every list is (or should be) running ensnaring bridges. You want to be able to cast a blast without having a painter in play if need be. So the full set of pyros is better than the first reb. It is better to hedge against cards that are guaranteed to be in the match (bridge) than it is against cards you might barely ever see (misdirection)

100% Agree. 4/2 split favoring Pyroblast. You do not want to get stuck with REBs in hand with a bridge lock.


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[jandax]

3rd

Case closed, Pyroblast is better because you can target legally where reb can't under bridge

[Nitrospira]

Sorry, but this is wrong. Not the rules part, but the logic part. Every list is (or should be) running ensnaring bridges. You want to be able to cast a blast without having a painter in play if need be. So the full set of pyros is better than the first reb. It is better to hedge against cards that are guaranteed to be in the match (bridge) than it is against cards you might barely ever see (misdirection)

It took me a while to get this but it makes sense. The list I've been working with is older and doesn't run bridges except in the side, so I haven't run into this before

[jake556]

Is it too much added damage to add a few more fetchlands? Maybe go up to 5 instead of 3? I don't know how many times I have top in play with a dead top of deck. I do understand IR shuffles as well. And with Blood Moon out extra fetches become useless. Anyone else have this problem?

Here is my recently changed list reflecting the fetch land issue, equipment has been giving me trouble as well that is why I added the extra Revokers, Pithing Needle in the SB. Is Manic Vandal our best artifact hate? I understand it tutorable but so many times I wish I had Shattering Spree.

9 Mountain
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Scalding Tarn

4 Painter's Servant
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Imperial Recruiter
2 Magus of the Moon
2 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Goblin Welder
1 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast

4 Grindstone
3 Sensei's Divining Top

4 Blood Moon

SB: 1 Manic Vandal
SB: 4 Thorn of Amethyst
SB: 2 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 4 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Vexing Shusher
SB: 2 Phyrexian Revoker
SB: 1 Pithing Needle

[Ish]

Is it too much added damage to add a few more fetchlands? Maybe go up to 5 instead of 3? I don't know how many times I have top in play with a dead top of deck. I do understand IR shuffles as well. And with Blood Moon out extra fetches become useless. Anyone else have this problem?

I run 4. I don't really have an issue with damage usually because they become mountains with the moon effects anyway. But the advantage of top fetch is just too good. And there's no worse feeling with this deck than being too locked and knowing you have dead draws.


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